these are your bare necessities, folks, this is what happens. [laughter] >> wait for it. wait for it. man, he's a big boy. have a great weekend, everybody, we have to run. >> "outnumbered" starts right now. >> president trump swiftly taking a victory lap moments after learning the u.s. economy has accelerated to an impressive 4.1% annual growth rate in second quarter of this year, that's huge. the commander-in-chief calling the nation "the economic envy of the entire world," and saying even bigger numbers are yet to come. this is "outnumbered" on fine friday. i'm harris faulkner host of. democrat strategist jessica tarlov, former analyst morgan ortagus and joining us first time in the center seat, daniel

hoffman, retired senior c.i.a. officer and fox news contributor. "outnumbered." we have a lot of world-stage stuff to talk about today. >> harris: good, looking forward to it. >> harris: welcome. get the party started. big win for president trump. u.s. economy surged to annual growth rate, say it again, 4.1%, the fastest pace since 2014. the president praising those numbers earlier today. watch it. >> president trump: i am thrilled to announce that in the second quarter of this year, the united states economy grew at the amazing rate of 4.1%. we're on track to hit the highest annual average growth rate in over 13 years, we're going to go a lot higher than these numbers and these are great numbers. >> harris: the president gave credit to international trade.

>> president trump: perhaps one of the biggest wins in the report and it is indeed a big one, is that the trade deficit, very dear to my heart, because we've been ripped off by the world, has dropped by more than $50 billion. the leaders of countries say invariably is mr. president, so nice to meet you, congratulations on your economy. you're leading the entire world. they say it almost each and every time. america is being respected again and america is winning again because we are finally putting america first. >> harris: daniel, i come to you first on your reaction. >> dana: i will give you a little dark cloud in the silver lining, it is about espiannage. under siege and much growth is resulting from our advances in intellectual property and high-tech, nefairuous enemies

like china trying to steal. look at silicon valley, it is under siege from spies. this highlights how strong our economy is, it means we are stronger and can do more with our defense budget and other things. we have to be very careful about protecting what makes us strong from our enemies. >> harris: wow, fascinating. morgan. >> morgan: this is clear vindication of president trump's policies, tax cut with regulatory reform, delivered what he promised to the american people. we have had, some top growth we've had in a decade. i think what we saw and trisha knows this, during the obama years, annual growth rate around 2%, which is not great. what this president is trying to get is over 3% average annual growth. this is a huge win for the american people, politically a huge win for him and the republicans. >> harris: what you are saying contextually, question is, is

this sustainable and he spoke to that today. he was anticipating, he said, look, i've talked with my advisors, it can be sustainable and we're working to make that happen. if you get a year out, you're saying it is unstoppable at that point politically for anybody to fight. brings me to jessica, the numbers, undeniable this kind of growth, what did democrats do with this? >> jessica: if they are smart, they embrace it and say they are happy americans have extra money back in their pockets. we need to make sure it is sustainable. no doubt obama did have a few big quarters there. this is a win. look at president trump's personal approval rating 41%, versus how he's rated on the economy, upward of 50%, it's a winning issue for him. i think democrats will talk about the deficit, his plan added a trillion there. we are at a 75-year low in terms of tax revenue brought to the federal government. things we need to fund, taxes do

serve a purpose, democrats will do that. >> harris: interesting. you said if they are smart, we'll see what happens. ii i of political and intelligent property, great opener. i want to go to the woman on the couch who can teach us all. >> trish: big debate, three, four, five? how great we're having that conversation, right? it was really nice to see this come in at 4.1%. the approximate president did mention the trade deficit, something near and dear to his heart. one thing i liked in there was export number 9.3%. exports grew 9.3%. >> harris: why do you think that is? how is that possible with the tariffs? >> trish: we're selling, selling around the world. flip side, imports were half a percent. typically it's the other way around, importing all this

stuff, that was reversed. i think it has a lot to do with sort of this sense of america first. thing about the political environment we're in, made in the usa, there is kind of ceiling, i would say, which is important. when you talk about economic sentiment, consumer confidence, these things matter, there is a feeling among consumers and among business leaders things will be better. that is what he said today, it is sustainable, that is what peoplement to hear. >> harris: i will get more to what you talked about, daniel, if we can. it wasn't necessarily a dark cloud inside of a silver lining, it was a heavy dose of reality. you know, as we study what is vulnerable about our systems, sometimes we're doing well, that in itself is vulnerability, that is what i heard you saying. >> dana: yeah, i think our enemies look at the united states and see this extra ordinary growth and want to tear it down, same as what else makes

us strong, democracy and freedom we enjoy in this country. that is what vladamir putin is trying to do. >> harris: the president called it envy around the world. >> daniel: he is right about that. mounting onslot against intellectual property and stealing high-technology to suit their own economic growth. >> harris: you were high up in the c.i.a., what needs to be happening right now? legislators are looking at election meddling and that sort of thing, this is a different ball of wax here. >> daniel: it is, what we need to be doing, developing better relationship between private sector and our government. we do a really good job, i was a part in c.i.a., sharing counter terrorism thoughts with those at risk to help them avoid disastrous results if they are in the wrong place at the wrong time, particularly companies in the united states with overseas s subsidiaries. we need the same partnership on cyber security and intellectual

properties so we can share information and warning with private sector to defend themselves from china and others. >> harris: that is seen as running counter to libertielibe. >> i want to ask a question, you think about american c.e.o.s and companies, they are so oriented to the bottom line and american companies are very international. you know, with operations all over the world. so many companies want that, right? they want access to different markets, it makes quarterly earnings look terrific and shareholders are happy. what do you do when a company is not putting its loyalty to the u.s. first? the company's technology and secrets are at risk or if you, as member of the government, are sharing information that is vital to them, do you run the risk it gets transferred to the china operation, which then the chinese government can seize to its advantage? >> harris: interesting. we'll talk more as we go on. i want to get to this. president trump gearing up to

meet with high-level national security officials at the white house today. they're expected to talk about u.s. election security ahead of the elections, we touched on that broadly. this is, we're learning, russian president vladamir putin invited our president to moscow. but only under certain terms and conditions. now the white house is saying the president is open to the idea. our commander-in-chief was planning on hosting putin in washington this fall, but national security advisor john bolton announced the president wants to postpone that meeting until the russian witch hunt is over, referring to the mueller investigation. people go abroad off american soil to meet with dictators and people not necessarily considered in the inner-circle of allies. >> daniel: yeah, i would be happier if there were a summit with vladamir putin to do it here in the united states on our home turf, rather than russia.

>> harris: why were democrats pushing back on this, the idea, why are you bringing them into the white house? you are saying it should be here in america? >> daniel: i would push back on the idea we shouldn't be talking to vladamir putin. we should hold him accountable for all he's doing to target our country, whether in cyber space or driving wedge between united states and allies or -- >> harris: what did you see at the c.i.a. that informs you of pushing back and really wanting this to happen? >> daniel: i mean, i think there is value to meeting the russians at that level to talk about the things where we have issues in common like counter terrorism, arms control, which i think is of most importance to us. there are areas we have to be careful of, like syria. if president travels to russia, optics make its appear he's going to putin and elevates putin's status. for putin it is about regime security and what scares him

most is democracy and he doesn't want the populous uprising we saw in the middle east. >> jessica: helsinki is neighborly to russia, took vladamir putin 30 minutes to get there and we went a long way. i don't think democrats were pushing back against the idea of meeting with him full stop, i think doing it after litany of embarrassing moments that went on for the united states in helsinki, which democrats and republicans agree on, that he was not forceful, is problematic. if you look at how the russians have taken this narrative and brought it back home, we cancelled from our side, no, we'll hold off until the russia witchhunt is over, after russians said we're not sure we will come. now they are saying you can come to moscow, maybe we'll go to moscow. they are winning on all cylinders. >> let me disagree with that, from a policy perspective, we get caught up in what trump or putin says. i think what secretary mike pompeo said from policy

perspective, two most important things i was watching, he testified on capitol hill yesterday, u.s. will keep sanctions in place, that is what vladamir putin wants out of. he said that we are not going to recognize or condone what the russians have done necessary -- done in crimea and ukraine. forget who is going to grandma's house for dinner or white house or wherever they are going and look from a policy perspective, staying tough on russia on sanctions and crimea and ukraine important things we are doing. >> harris: talk about russia's economy, that is making headlines right now. they don't talk about it much, but they can't hide it. >> trish: they are not doing great, they would like to be doing better. oil was around $120 a barrel, they were happy, those days are gone for now. and, they are more challenged, of course, this is in part, i think why putin himself and

daniel, you know about this, reverted to nationalism, this national pride and the -- daniel, he was able to sort of, i think, strike a cord with the russian people thinking about back in the day when the u.s.s.r., soviet union was so great. now they don't have the economy to back them up, but they want to remember the glory days of when they were powerful and on the world stage. >> daniel: that's it, kgb operative there. it is smoke in the mirror, nostalgia, greatest disaster of the 20th century, that is what he's getting by on right now. >> harris: all right. great conversation, getting deep. long journey home for fallen heroes. u.s. military plane are carrying what are believed to be the remains of 55 service members killed during the korean war. a live report as we roll on here

on "outnumbered." plus, a growing battle between president trump and his former attorney michael cohen amid new reports that cohen is willing to tell robert mueller the president knew of a 2016 trump tower meeting with russia promising dirt on hillary clinton. new rudy giuliani is going after cohen as pathological liar. will cohen's claims become an issue? we'll talk about it. take a look. >> i expected something like this from cohen, he's been lying all week, well, for years. high protein to help get us moving. and help you feel more strength & energy in just 2 weeks.

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i want all of it. great to have epix? open this. you'd laugh. you'd cry. don't you think i had dreams and hopes. what about my life? what about me? maybe even laugh while crying. so you know, even if you're a psychopath, it touches your heart. sounds pretty great, right?" we're on to something. come on.

and the best part is it's easy to upgrade. just say, "add epix." epix has a whole lot more. whoa! >> harris: president trump now firing back at his former attorney michael cohen. after reports that cohen is claiming then candidate trump knew in advance of a june 2016 trump tower meeting involving his son don junior, members of his campaign and a russian attorney who promised dirt on hillary clinton. those reports claim cohen is willing to make that assertion to special counsel robert mueller, no evidence to corroborate the claim. the president tweeting "arrived back in washington last night from a very emotional reopening granite city, illinois, to be greeted with ridiculous news

robert mueller and his gang of 13 angry democrats obviously cannot find collusion, the only collusion with russia was with the democrats. now they are looking at my tweets along with 53 million other people, the rigged witch hunt continues, how stupid and unfair to our country." he goes on, the fake news doesn't waste my time with dumb questions, i did not know of the meeting with don junior. sounds like someone is making up stories to get himself out of unrelated jam, taxicabs, maybe? he retains bill and crooked hillary's lawyer, gee, i wonder if they helped him make the choice. the president's attorney, rudy giuliani unleashing on michael cohen on cnn last night, watch it. >> the tapes we have demonstrate any number of serious lies by him, back a year and a half ago, including his fooling people, hiding, tape recordings, telling them they were not recorded,

lying to their face, breaking faith with them, taping his client, which is disbarable offense. i don't see how he has credibility. people in your profession told me, this guy will flip because he is inherent, pathological liar. >> harris: daniel, what do you think actually happened? >> daniel: my assessment of the meeting in june 2016, there was nothing meant to be clandestine about it. you don't go to trump tower with the security and three loony tunes russians, a former soviet military lawyer and son of an oligarch, preceding by e-mail. it was trail of breadcrumbs leading back to the kremlin with the design to soil the campaign and our democratic process. >> harris: in other words, could putin have been trying to use our greatest strength, freedom and freedom of speech and our

ability to decent against us, morgan, in way it didn't necessarily matter who won the election because had hillary won, there would have been trump supporters, if you riled them up enough that would have said, it was rigd and now vice versa, since he won, people are saying it was russians colludeing and they stole the election, could that have been putin's goal? >> morgan: his goal continues to be his goal. he offered for the president to come to moscow to stay in our news and stay in our head, that is his goal and what he's doing. we keep allowing it to happen. dan and i have talked a lot about the fact that as dan said earlier, our number one geo political foe is china. administration is focusing on iran and north korea, as they should. i think that there is no one that delights more about news media coverage of russian than vladamir putin. he's inside all our heads, it is unfortunate, there is enough strategic things we need to

focus on in the country and around the world to give russian too much outside significance. not that we don't need to go hard against them when they meddle in the election and what they did in syria. important to keep sanctions on and let them know they are not going to get away with -- crimea and the obama administration. >> harris: the frustrating thing, he is kind of winning, getting what he wanted, chaos we're in right now. you know what, we have ourselves to blame, although jessica, you think you think the administration shares some of that, too. walk us through your thoughts on this story. >> jessica: two issues on the couch now. there is the russia issue and then the trump administration issue here and i'm wholeheartedly agree with you on this. i do find it interesting, when barack obama made fun of the russian threat when mitt romney said they were our number one geo-political threat, everyone w adamant about that. and morgan and daniel are not

trump -- shifting attention to china to get away with the egregious and capitulation to russia. the michael cohen issue, he's not a reputable guy. we know that. rudy giuliani said pathological liar, i don't know about that, i know why he's doing it. there is tape of him praising michael cohen, it ebbs and flows with who is upsetting his client or putting his client in danger. michael cohen says, as well, other people knew about this in the meeting, i think that is where the key is. if you have him testify, i don't know how credible he is, if you name other people that were there and who knew and remember the issue when the story came out, that apparently president trump dictated the letter on air force one and there is a lot surrounding this, it is hard to believe he was in the building just a few floors away and don junior had the people in the building and didn't say anything to the candidate. >> harris: could don junior be

in serious trouble if he lied -- >> i'm not majority, but it has been said for quite sometime anybody in the meeting might be in trouble based on who they met with, you are the only person i met recently who can spit out the names and the titles, as well as you did. so you know, what you're asking me is based on whether or not the president knew is don junior basically in more trouble than he already was and i'm not -- >> i want to go back to something jessica walked past. she said it and kind of kept going, the idea we can't hold two competing thought necessary our heads. we can focus on russia and china at the same time. they are both geo-political stressors and aggressors and we can hold those two thoughts simultaneously without you accusing the president of trying to turn away from whatever you thought was happening with russia, there is yet to be shown evidence of with collusion and also focusing on the fact of

something trisha and i talk about all the time, which is where we are trade wise and also in our intellectual property wise with china. we can do all that at once. i will yield the rest of my time to you, daniel. >> daniel: i would close by saying vladamir putin has to be loving this conversation. if his cronies are watching this show now and all the discussion we have about the june 2016 meeting, that means he succeeded, he's injected a virus to political discourse. we've so wide open to everything in this country, vladamir putin is black belt in judo, knows how to use strength against him, that is what he's doing. >> harris: our greatest strength he's managed to weaponize against us. do you speak russian? >> dana: little bit. >> harris: kim jong-un making good on the promise to return u.s. soldiers killed in the korean war. will it lead to denuclearization north korea? we'll talk about that, plus white house national security advisor john bolton holding a

high-level meeting about iran, what should the president do now and what should we be making of iran's threat? we'll debate it all. there's little rest for a single dad,

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call the hartford to request your free quote at... or go to... >> harris: signs of progress with north korea. what are believed to be the remains of u.s. servicemen killed during the korean war, now being returned. 55 cases of remains already flown out of north korea and into an air base near the south korean capital of seoul. bringing the war dead home are succeeding, 65 years after armistice ended hostility in the korean war, the president thanked kim jong-un earlier. >> president trump: i want to thank chairman kim, in front of the media, for fulfilling a promise he made to me and i'm sure he will continue to fulfill that promise as they search and

search and search. these incredible american heroes will soon lay at rest on sacred american soil. >> harris: important and emotional and greg palkot is in london covering it all. greg. >> hi, harris, important and very timely move by north korea, the return of the remains of what is thought to be 55 u.s. service members, who were killed and missing in the korean war many decades ago. the transit case with remains picked up by air force cargo plane deep inside north korea and brought back to a u.s. air base in south korea. draped with the u.n. flag, commanding force during the war. a u.n. honor guard and u.s. military there to receive the remains, will be examined at the base and transferred next wednesday to hawaii for further

d.n.a. identification and then finally to be returned to the families after all of these long years. this as ceremonies took place today in dmz. this is the 65th anniversary of the armistice, which ended the fighting during the korean war. president trump tweeted, after so many years, this will be a great moment for so many families, the white house, however, noting something like 5300 americans still missing in the north from the war. north korean leader kim jong-un was out today, too, up north they call this day victory day. white house also said that we are encouraged by north korea's action and momentum for positive change, the trump administration, harris is under pressure now to deliver something from the summit last month in singapore involving president trump and kim jong-un. there haven't been too many deliverables, this was promised, hoping more to come. >> harris: greg palkot, thank you very much.

daniel, the president promised there could be more to come. this is a huge boost, as well, to those who served, who were still among us in the korean war. i mean, the military moral gets boosted by what people who have legacy most put into the bloodstream. this is big. >> daniel: this means something to all of us. i've lost friends and colleague necessary war zones, nothing more solemn and poignant and meaningful than to bring them home to their families and loved ones, that touches all of us for sure. >> harris: puts military right back into the center of our thoughts, which sometimes, civilian communities can take it for granted. ving grownup military. morgan. >> morgan: look at the way we treat american life and the way in which the north koreans treat their own people. look how important and special and precious it is to all of us that we are getting our american men home after decades of still being there?

we value the lives lost in the korean war just as much as we value someone who lost their life in afghanistan or iraq a week ago. speaks to fundament thing that is beautiful about america, look what north korea, kim jong-un does to his people, starves, tortures. he has no -- does not carry, no quality of life, no value of life for his citizens. but the way we treat our people whenever we lose them overseas, whether decades ago or last week, i think is one of the most beautiful and fundamentally important things about american life. >> harris: you know, jessica, as we look at this, there has been pressure politically on the president. show us what you got when you went to north korea and much the same thing with russia now. but the president is doing things that we may not have known about, sentence for sentence in the meetings that the public did not see. >> jessica: that is absolutely true. this is something he had mentioned and i echo daniel and morgan's sentiments about this, it's a victory for the

president, but more a victory for us as a country, it's a wonderful thing to see and something that we can every once in a while come together on from both sides of the aisle and say this is unequivocally a win for america. >> i got chills as you were talking, morgan, it is something that defines us as americans and that is our respect for human life and that is not something you see all around the world, that is what distinguishs us, that is part of what makes us as great as we are, so this is a very special day, a special moment and the president should be proud of this moment because he had a hand in bringing these people back. but, it is tremendous to see. >> harris: morgan. >> morgan: white house is weighing necessary move with iran, john bolton reportedly is meeting with top officials yesterday, he's looking at whether to reimpose tough economic sanctions and what the

u.s. might be willing to offer in return for a new agreement with tehran. bolton is looking into whether washington is prepared to use military force, along with economic pressure, to help rollback iran's assertive posture in the middle east. >> harris: so you spent a lot of time in the middle east, you and i both have in iraq. i spent a lot of time pressuring iran, pushing sanctions in the middle east, what are our real options? looking at potentially another war in the middle east? >> daniel: no, i don't -- you could look to secretary pompeo eloquent speech, outlined policy, called out iran for the hypocrisy it is, we are out to win the war of ideas, we have foreign broadcasting we will direct into iran. i think focus is on pressuring them economically. just yesterday, india, the number two purchaser of iranian oil, had to turn back iranian

cargo because they couldn't get insurance from the petroleum company, that is putting pressure on iran. we need to pressure them in other places, proxy militants. remember, they are going to counter with symmetric war fare of their own. >> harris: world's largest state sponsor of terror. jessica, nothing more in this administration and trump administration juxtaposition than their position on iran. how do you think democrats feel about this current pressure campaign when it looks like the iranian regime is vulnerable? >> jessica: we will find out as election season heats up, i'm sure you will hear about it, iranians were not violating terms of the deal and there will be a lot of people who held high-level positions will echo that sentiment and hear from the international community that the deal was working and what is the alternative. i brought that up last week on the couch, there are games made here and the tough talk is accomplishing something, but

where do we go next, i think it is 120 days or 150 days sunset clause here. what is next step? how do we work to ensure iran does not end up with nuclear weapon? we protect our allies in the region. >> can i make a suggestion, we stop trade withing allies trading with iran, very simple. we want sanctions enforced we say germany, if you continue to buy oil from iran and trade with them, we're not going to do it with you. we have learned most recently that we have a lot of power on the world stage, economically speaking, other ways, as well. we are the world's biggest economy, let's use it. let's use it -- >> what about the trading that is above board that we know about, we know what germany is doing. we know russia is propping them up. they are trying to be propping them up. whole network as they are with north korea, network of underbelly going on here. they can get around closing the strait and things like that. what do we do then?

>> you cut off the bigger sources of funding. i don't like it, we saw russians still sending things to north korea and same thing with the chinese -- >> venezuela and syria, everywhere. >> their economic power collectively is nothing like ours. i think if we say we stopped and we expect everyone who wants to do business with us to stop and we're going to hold you bltable, we will have some weight. >> you are right, trish this is what i did in the intelligence community during the obama administration, this is what we did to american and european businesses. we said, you do business with us or the iranians and it worked. moving on. nancy pelosi raising eyebrows with her latest remarks on immigration. the house minority leader suggesting that democrats have been stronger on border security than republicans. that's funny. and referring to the attacks of 9/11 as "an incident," does this

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>> harris: nancy pelosi making some surprising comments on immigration yesterday, just as the trump administration faced a deadline to reunite undocumented families who had been separated at our southern border. house majority leader suggesting republicans are actually weaker on border security than democrats. then, referring to the 9/11 terror attacks as "an incident," listen to this. >> we have a responsibility to protect our borders, make no mistake about that. democrats have been strong on that point, all of our borders. in fact, i said to somebody

before, that when we had the 9/11 incident and the commission was formed and they made their recommendation, they made recommendations to protect america. would never take them up and some of it was about our borders. opponents would never take them up. >> i realize that she's talking extemporaneously and she probably didn't mean to call 9/11 an incident, in such an off-hand way, but she did. she has had basically a succession of these faux pas one after another, between the crump comment, in many ways this is disrespectful to everyone who lost their life that day and all of the families. i mean, at what point do democrats, jessica, say, we need to move on, we need fresh blood, we need somebody really talking to the people in way that is relatable, which she clearly

cannot do? >> jessica: that was a mistake. nancy pelosi certainly doesn't think 9/11 was just an incident, this is not loretta lynch matter or investigation, she misspoke there. she's been clear about the sacrifices that we made during 9/11 and that it was an attack and that is just misspeaking. a separate thing, a decision that had been repeated. what you are talking about, battle for leadership, that conversation is going on amongst democrats, certainly new candidates getting pushed on this and a number saying yes, we need new leadership, i will not be voting for nancy pelosi or chuck schumer. that conversation is happening, i don't think we can generalize, that is clearly a mistake. no one accuses nancy pelosi are not thinking 9/11 was the most egregious attack on american soil. >> i began by saying she was talking and gosh, i hope she didn't, i can't imagine she meant to call it that,

nonetheless, it comes across, as i said before, let them eat cake kind of attitude. morgan, you think about who they could have gone with, they went with hillary clinton. nancy pelosi now in the position she's got, you look at elizabeth warren, being talked about potential nominee. i just wonder, have they lost their way? you think about the sort of traditional blue-collar, hard-working democrat union member and it seems as though they have lost those voters to none other than donald trump. is the democrats wanted to win, why aren't they striving for them? >> morgan: interesting to me, nancy pelosi's comments yesterday were completely out of touch with her own party. when you look at main candidates, the leading female candidates for president for the democratic nomination, calling for abolishing ice and they are vocal about this, this is not misspeaking, this is something gillibrand says on daily basis, calling for getting rid of ice.

i believe the deputy at the d.n.c. wore "open border" shirt, the energy and enthusiasm with the woman running for congress, in new york, with open borders, with abolishing ice, with very radical immigration policies, so i just saw that yesterday as not only being totally inaccurate how she characterized republican position, but out of touch, trish, with her own party and where the energy in her party is. >> trish: thoughts real quick? >> daniel: cringe worthy and this issue is wildly partisan. i come from a place which is nonpartisan, i wish we could solve this one without the comments that are not helpful to framing the challenge and finding solutions. >> trish: president trump giving "outnumbered" to dallas cowboys owner jerry jones after he says the teams players must stand for the national anthem, they got to do it before games. whether other teams will follow his lead, we will talk about it.

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coming out about the anthem policy. that policy would let teams discipline players who take a knee during the anthem and let players stay in the locker room during the anthem if they wish. jones saying his players must stand for the star-spangled banner and will not be allowed to stay in the locker room. continuing to hold talks with the player's union. president trump getting in on the action, way to go, jerry, this is what the league should do. >> i don't agree with the president on this, i don't agree with jerry jones on this. daniel, we have not heard your stance on the standing for the anthem controversy. what say you? >> daniel: the players certainly have a right to do it, exercise free speech to take a knee if they wish. the question i ask, can you take a stand for social justice without taking a knee? are there other ways to do it? know your audience, know who you want to address on the issue. is that the best way to do it?

i say that as a fan and somebody who spent 30 years serving our country. >> absolutely. jerry jones always had this policy and players were fine with it. two players put a fist up in the air last year, he did not penalize them for, i'm curious to see if that is what more do. would you that be okay with you, trish? >> trish: jerry jones is a business owner, you don't agree, you wouldn't do what you did, you don't own an n.f.l. team? >> jessica: not yet. >> trish: not watching ratings tank. as much as -- look, you know i'm a former singer and recently same the "national anthem," and my kids wanted me to do it. because of this controversy, think about every time i sing that song, every time i hear that song, it just -- i feel tremendous sense of pride to be an american, to have had the opportunities i've had and look, when you sit down to watch a game of football, i don't know, it's kind of american.

like one of those american things you do, it is an american sport. i get it bothers people, you don't want to associate politics with entertainment in that way and such an american force in entertainment. from a patriotic perspective, i don't like it, from a business perspective, i really don't like it and totally empathize with jerry jones and he did the right thing. >> trish: we know this is not just about disrespecting military office members, this began with social justice protect by kaepernick and talking about police brutality in this country and systemic racism in the system. what do you think if somebody like jerry jones could do to speak to the issues? >> that is a great point, jessic ayou are bringing up. instead of focusing on devisive part, focus on where you can be brought together. president trump tweeted, he said, after kim kim kardashian came into the office and he pardoned the woman she brought

in, players could bring to his attention other areas of social justice. as a country, let's move on, let's watch football and let's focus on how we can -- >> brought that issue to his attention, we'll be right back, more "outnumbered" in a moment. ...to give you the protein you need with less of the sugar you don't. i'll take that. [cheers] 30 grams of protein and 1 gram of sugar. new ensure max protein. in two great flavors. new ensure max protein. we carry flowers that signifyn why we want to end the disease. and we walk so that one day, there will be a white flower for alzheimer's first survivor. join the fight at alz.org/walk.

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>> thanks so much. that was a really interesting discussion today. putin got the upper hand now in terms where we are. >> i don't know he's got the upper hand. he's shown his card.

>> discoverable influence operations are things that the media can find? >> he wanted to do things that would be different. >> thank you so much. we're back monday at noon. here's harris. >> president trump firing back at his former personal attorney michael cohen as he comes out with a new allegation against the president. we go "the story with martha maccallum." i'm harri-- "the story with ma g he has no hard evidence of that. his ready to give robert mueller his personal account. the president tweeted this. i did not know of the meeting with my son don junior. sound like someone trying to make up stories to get himself out of a jam. he even retained bill and crooked