>> that 2:00 o'clock conference, out and "outnumbered" starts right now. >> google is following us everywhere. >> melissa: the fox news alert, the mueller investigation sharing new scrutiny today. this is "outnumbered" and i melissa francis. here today fox news contributor today fox news contributor lisa boothe, leah gabriel and democratic strategist and fox news contributor jessica tarlov. and joining us on the couch today former federal prosecutor andrew mccarthy and he is outnumbered. we are leaning on you a lot today. lots of legal going on. >> no day off.

>> we will get you a cup of coffee. laugh laugh [laughs] >> the fbi releases peter strzok months after it was revealed that he is sent blistering text messages to his liver. while being lead investigator on the alert clinton email program. now g.o.p. congressman jim jordan during an interview with neil cavuto, stepping up criticism of the russia kroger. watch. >> you know a lot of your colleagues are saying it's reason enough for the bob mueller investigation to be disbanded. >> this is what i know. a year and a half into this investigation or 13 or 14 months into this investigation there is still not one bit of evidence about any type of coordination, collusion or conspiracy between the truck campaign or in russia to impact the election. >> melissa: president trump tweeted today "be 15 started the legal rigged witch hunt. why wasn't the so-called probe

and it immediately, why are those angry and conflicted democrats instead looking at cricket hillary? in the meantime, peter strzok is defiant setting up a twitter account critical of president trump as supporters launch a gofundme page raising money to apparently cover his legal costs and lost income. in the meantime, strzok's lawyer painting his client as a victim after he was fired. watch this. >> i don't think that you can rationally reach any conclusion other than it was political. it's difficult to believe given the steady drumbeat of tax demonizing feed from the president and all the calls on capitol hill by republicans for pete to be fired, but that didn't play a role in the ultimate decision. >> melissa: trey gowdy dismisses that saying that it was strzok's own conduct that got him fired. >> of course his lawyer says it was a railroad job as other option is to say, my client

prejudged two major investigations i made up his mind that hillary clinton was innocent before the interview her. he made up his mind that donald trump should be impeached before you bother to interview him and by the way, he did a lot of this on the government phone and violated other fbi policies. if you pay someone enough they will pay near anything. and he got a lawyer to say it's political. >> melissa: andy, what do you think about this? >> andy: a lot of what gaudi said that you could lay at the feet of strzok is true. the problem they have is i don't think the fbi and the justice department did a great job of laying out the rationale for firing him. i think we could think of probably ten good reasons to fire him. i think the big problem they have is when the ig report came out, and he said that despite the fact that he was incensed by

the bias that was shown in the tweet or the text, he couldn't make a conclusion that any particular investigative decision that they made was driven by the bias. now i didn't agree with that but that is their fighting. i think the problem is, fbi director went out and embrace the report and said this basically clears the fbi, our investigation is legitimate and nothing here is biased. so it's hard for them to come out and articulate a reason why they are firing this guy. so they have things like he forwarded on his private email an affidavit that he had to work on over the weekend. if they will start to fire people over that then they will fire a lot of people. >> they did say that they couldn't say that it would influence his decision to shift the investigation from the hillary clinton email probe to the russia probe. they couldn't say that wasn't

politically influenced or biased, influenced, which is double negative. also that he lied to investigators. >> that strzok lied to investigators? they certainly said that with mccabe. the comparison they have here is when they fired mccabe, leah articulated four counts of what they call lack of candor which is the bureaus lying to investigation standards. and they laid out elaborate evidence for each one of those counts. on this one i don't see that and i'm not saying it's not there, but they need to lay it out. >> what do you make of the inspector general report where he was talking about anthony weiner's laptop and a way that was dealt with, and willingness to take action? do you think we will learn more with the inspector general's report of the russia investigation? >> if they had laid that conclusion out the way you just articulated it, it would be one

thing. what i understood him to say is that he exhibited a willingness to act. >> it was definitely that it was in full monty. i think it was even more critical of jim comey when he explained that. >> melissa: do you think they shouldn't have fired peter strzok? >> i would have fired him in a moment but, it's a legal process. >> it goes beyond that. when i served in the navy, if the ship gets run around the commanding officer was in charge. he was a leader in the fbi and he betrayed the core principles of the fbi, things like integrity and leadership. there was no way that he could continue at the fbi without having discredited the fbi at this point and, so at this point at the leadership issue at the

fbi and there is absolutely a necessity for the american people to be able to trust the fbi and what they do, encountering intelligence and encountering crimes in the united states. and if you can't trust the leadership and it looks tainted then the entire fbi is tainted. >> christopher wray is taking that on directly, so that in his testimony and he has promised to all protocol there. but this guy could have been fired months ago. the timing does seem suspicious. >> it's a process to do this. >> they had in so many people living in the rubber room. >> but there were questions about if he could do his job. he was taken off of the russia investigation, there were questions of whether he could do his job with objectivity and now he has brought shame on the fbi. people are donating $150,000 to this guy and it shows you that

people hate trump so much that they are willing to make people martyrs. >> is a lack of understanding of the bigger picture of the fbi and what it should be doing. >> let's get to the breaking news. the defense resting on day 11 of the paul manafort trial. the former trump campaign chairman's attorney calling no witnesses in his tax evasion and bank fraud case. the closing arguments could begin as early as today. catherine herridge is live at the federal courthouse in alexandria, virginia, with the latest. some have wondered if this would happen, catherine and now it has. tell us what the implications are. >> in the last couple minutes the defense has rested in the manner for case and they have made the decision not to call their own witnesses and also not to reveal their own evidence. this is typically done when the defense feels that the government, the prosecution, is

not met the standard for a conviction in this particular case. a couple of key moments from the courtroom, the lead attorney kevin downing told the judge, ts ellis the third, that his client, paul manafort, has chosen not to testify as part of his defense. then there was a series of exchanges between the judge in mr. manna for it. it was really the first time that we have seen him stand in court and to go to the podium and interact with the judge. the judge asked him a series of questions, whether he had been counseled by his attorneys and whether he really understood what it meant not to testify as part of his defense. metaphor it said he had been counseled and he had chosen not to answer questions in order to defend himself. now we have some good housekeeping issues with the court, to deal with the procedural steps leading up to the closing arguments. the closing arguments the judge has dictated must be two hours or less on each side so that

could happen later today. we had two hours this morning when the court proceeded in private. no one from the public and that no one from the press, there was no indication in the courts about what that was about. they spent significant speculation since friday last week that there may have been a problem with one or more of the jurors but at least for now that seems to have been resolved, melissa, and they are moving ahead. >> catherine herridge, thank you for bringing this as soon as it happened. let me bring it back out to andy. so they are basically not putting a case on the defense side that that tells you they feel pretty confident about what has gone so far, right? >> andy: i think it's consistent with the defense that they adopted at the beginning of the trial which was to try to turn rick gates, who was the alleged accomplice of manafort,

into the billing. if manafort got on the standard they'd be able to run to their entire proof using him as a witness and it could very well undercut whatever good effect they got out of the cross-examination of gates. the other thing is, if manafort think there's any chance he will get convicted, defendants who take the stand and don't do well, particularly if there is an indication that they haven't been truthful, they can get an exacerbated high sentence on the basis of the way they testify. so he's probably better off leaving at this point. >> melissa: and what about the path back to that they didn't want to put on any other witnesses though? >> this has always been the big problem that they have had in this case. they want to make gates into the big event of the case but what people need to remember is, mueller indicted this case

before he had gates as a cooperator and these tend to be provable on the records which is very hard to cross examine. it's hard to blow the case up with a witness that mueller didn't really need in the first case and it's hard to attack black-and-white financial records. >> melissa: was at stake for mueller with this trial? >> manafort was presented as the big fish when he was charged because he was the chairman of trump's campaign. if there was any collusion, he would be at the center of it, presumably. if he loses the case it would be a big blow but i think the steaks for him, because this case has nothing to do with the rationale for molars investigation which is this allegation of collusion or coordination between the trump campaign and the kremlin. point of the case has always been to squeeze me in a fort into cooperating with the

investigation. so that's the state. if he gets convicted then he has cards to play. >> do you think you will? >> i thought it was a very powerful presentation. with gates, they didn't need gates to prove their case. what they needed gates for was to tighten up the proof of intent, and to show the extent that there was tax fraud, it wasn't a mistake and it was done quite intentionally. it's always hard to evaluate it when you are not on the room but it seemed to me they got that out of the testimony. >> this isn't the only legal hot water that manna manafort is in. he also has charges conspiring against the u.s. government, do you expect more to come out of it? >> if he gets convicted, the heaviest counts are the bank fraud count. bank fraud is a 30-year account.

>> and he 68. >> andy: there's a bank fraud conspiracy and a number of individuals of and substantive bank fraud counts. if he gets convicted and it looks like it's bulletproof, will you even have a second trial? >> you guys talk about the age, that second trial is, there's more juice to squeeze out of it in terms of the mueller investigation. >> andy: i think the second trial has the same situation as the first trial in that neither of them have to do with collusion with russia. the reason he has two trials is because he, manafort, was entitled to have the tax counts prosecuted against him in the venue in which he committed the actual cases. >> melissa: do you think if

manafort had any goods regarding the investigation, with the path of least resistance have been him trying to cut a deal along time ago? >> everyone has to try to make a strategic decision about that on their own. i think he may have felt like the best thing for him to do was to try to play this out and see if he could blow up the case on the theory that these were charges that the government thought about bringing years before. and then mueller came along. >> this was politically motivated and it's just showing up. >> i think those never do well with the jury. >> let's pause for a second, excuse me for looking down at my phone but we have more breaking news. catherine herridge is live outside the courthouse right now with more information. >> reporter: thanks for coming back to us. we have more details about the

tick tock this afternoon. and 75 minutes they will bring back the jury including the alternates and we will be able to see and hear with our own eyes and ears the defense rest the case and also indicate that they are not calling paul manafort as a witness in his own defense. they will then move into what's termed an instructional phase and the judge will talk through with the specifics of the tax and bank fraud charges, and then we will get closing arguments starting first thing tomorrow morning. the jury is coming back and we'll see and hear for themselves that the defense has arrested, chosen not to present evidence, and manna fort will not testify in his own defense. they will get specific instructions with kind of a refresher again about the bank and tax fraud charges. then they will get a nice sleep

and first thing tomorrow morning they will get to the closing arguments. the judge has stipulated it must be two hours or less for each side. >> thank you so much. let me ask you again. bring back the jury and to care for themselves that he's not going to testify or put on a defense. what kind of impact does not have? if i was sitting in the jury box, they might conclude, they don't think they need to if it's gone well. >> andy: while there is a legal presumption and reality on planet earth. the legal assumption is they don't tell them that the defendant opted not to testify, you are supposed to presume nothing from it. >> melissa: so the defense says they are not going to -- >> andy: the defense rests, that's all they say. the reality is, i've often thought that jurors and normal people want the defendant to look them in the eye and say, i didn't do it. and when he doesn't, it has an

effect. >> but that's about bank fraud. it's very black and white when you have the financials of it. that's something they didn't probably want to be sharing. it is a black-and-white issue, for that matter if not? >> they may not matter as much as it did in say a murder case where it's dependent on one witness, but it's still a situation where, they have sat for a couple of weeks now and heard all about paul manafort. they probably want to hear from paul manafort. >> what do you think is going to be the closing argument for the defense side? what will the crux be? >> gates. gates. gates, gates, gates. >> melissa: so rick gates, then. [laughs] it's really hard to get people to focus on numbers. they are bored by the papers

that you put out there and you have to put the face to it and personality to it. as much as people want to, you want to believe that they are going to look at the records black-and-white and see what's there. i can tell you from a career, it's hard to get them to focus on it without illustrations and people and that sort of thing. isn't that a challenge? >> i think the biggest challenge, in my mind the biggest mistake that he's made is the plea deal that he gave to gates is shameful. they basically charge him with over 100 years of felony charges, and the next day they pled him out to two minor charges where the captives exposure at no more than ten years and created the possibility that he walks out the door with no time. so the jury is going to hear that these two guys, gates and manafort, one guy is walking out the door.

>> an escalating battle between the white house and omarosa who now says she has plenty of tapes, all mine. and she has been contacted by robert mueller's team. what that is happening and whether the media is fanning the flames. and not on any ballots but he's making endorsements in today's primaries. and, what today's races could tell us about the midterm. you can get a new taste of your heritage. only $59- our site's lowest price ever. no mathere are over 10,000 allstate agents riding sweep. call one today. are you in good hands? ...to give you the protein you need with less of the sugar you don't.

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visit your local xfinity store today. a comeback. the trump campaign is now taking legal action against omarosa. as she continues plugging her new book, she is now saying she has plenty of tapes and others have recorded using a racial slur. she also said she's been approached by robert mueller's team about the tapes and she will cooperate. counselor to the president kelly on costs way is blasting her for being ungrateful and for creating a security risk. >> it does seem ungrateful to go and record people in a situation room. i see a lot of democrats out there and a national security experts who are not exactly pro-trump work bro

kellyanne conway saying, hold on. you had a device in the situation room? people are very concerned about that. >> the president is also firing back to save mark burnett called to say there were no tapes of the apprentice, i don't have that word in my vocabulary and never had it. she made it up. omarosa has zero credibility with the media but now that she said that about me they will talk to her. andy, what do you make of the civil suit that's been filed by the trump campaign. >> it's trouble troublesome to me that there are nondisclosure arrangements. and, all the agreements and contracts that you want not to talk about things, you get a grand jury subpoena.

those are sunshine laws that apply to the government information act and the like, with the idea that we want the government to be transparent and of course those need to be privileged and protected. the presumption in government should be transparency. i don't think this transparency should be that you will clam up. >> is there a legal liability for her? we had james clapper bring up national security concerns with bringing recording devices into the west wing. is there a legal liability for her on that front? >> i think of her security clearance were, if she had one, and i don't even know if she had one, if that weren't continuing to her clearly that would be yanked.

this kind of violation, you would lose your claimants. whether you would be prosecuted or not would depend i think on whether there was actually some kind of a transmission of classified information that got out there. that doesn't seem to me to have happen to, but that would be the concern. >> it seems normal to have a nondisclosure. coming from entertainment that something a lot of people do especially if she's doing a show and she was on the show, that sort of thing that you can go write a book afterwards where you are going to say whatever to sell the book. but at the same time -- and i think that's the problem, she's out there doing this thing where she apparently signed a nondisclosure doing it. >> what a terrible idea and this is something that might just go away based on her lack of credibility. but why use that kind of language? >> that's my question for you,

is omarosa credible? >> it's because it's clickbait. and it's going to get people to tune in and they will watch it because it's fallacious and dirty and people who don't want to like trump love to hear that he used that word. then the tape got leaked and you have katrina person spending in another direction saying, i was just pacifying her. it's a sideshow without a doubt. the security issues are rail, and it dana perino wrote a wonderful piece about how something like this happen when she was in the bush white house. no one will renumber this in three weeks, but what you have done to the office of the presidency and is too important american institutions that will live on forever. she should have thought of that when she went in there and was recording people.

the use of the n-word or whatever it is is baked in. once people heard that access hollywood tape they made their decision about this person and i don't like a recording of him using a racial slur post charlottesville for instance moves the needle at all come election day. >> if there is a recording, let's hear the recording. if there is one, play the darn thing. >> i'm sure she needs more time in the spotlight. >> the fact that if she signed a nondisclosure agreement and then broke it also goes to her credibility and goes to the level of trust. you are absolutely right, she's about selling books right now and she wants to get attention in the media. it makes for great ratings. if only he didn't tweet and call her a dog. >> docs will start barking at you if you ignore long enough.

>> i want to get andy back in here. >> andy: melissa, your point about the tweets is bigger than this person. president decided at a certain point to have a strategy of attack rather than, as a prosecutor i must say, if i sat there for six or eight months and every day read that i had no honor, that i was running a hoax or running a witch hunt, that would be -- there's going to come a day, where mueller is going to write a report. if it were me, it would be to report to end all reports. it would be exacting and every single thing i could come up with to corroborate whatever bad stuff i put in the report. >> melissa: you mean using the

tweets. >> i would hope he would go and russian meddling is where it all started. >> voters going to the polls and some key primaries, president trump fulfilling his pledge to campaign for republicans across country. we will debate the impact the president is having as he blasted the democrats again last night. >> president trump: they don't want to take care of our military for our events. other than that, they are fantastic. gar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. oh! under seven? (vo) and you may lose weight. in the same one-year study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. oh! up to 12 pounds?

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>> melissa: meanwhile, voters are heading to the polls for primaries in key states including connecticut, vermont, minnesota and wisconsin. wisconsin and minnesota getting the most attention. we will find out who will be on the ballot in november to replace speaker paul ryan and his wisconsin district as

democrats nominate a challenger to governor scott walker and trump backed republican pete stauber looks to win the nomination for a house eat in minnesota that is expected to be a close contest in november. president trump is definitely making his presence felt. take a listen. >> president trump: they don't mind crime with an open border. they hate i.c.e. because i.c.e. is rough and tough and that's what we need. they don't take care of our law enforcement, military or our vets. other than that, they are fantastic. >> melissa: we are fantastic. now listen to this. >> i think the president going out campaigning for members is a good thing. i think he's the reason troy balderston was able to win last tuesday. he was losing, when the

president came in for the big rally the president has had an amazing year and a half and i think he helps us. >> melissa: besides the fact that the democrats hate the police, i.c.e., all law enforcement -- is there any particular race that you are focused in on, the scott walker race i think is interesting and connecticut could have a republican governor which would be a huge deal. >> it's not my side of the street normally, but keith ellison's minnesota is very intriguing. it seems like from what i understand, he's still in front. but that seems to be a really fishy case. >> you mention connecticut and that's an interesting one because you are looking at a state that in my time in the northeast has been transformed. connecticut used to be a place where people went and lived it

has a tax policy was better and it was easier to live in because new york was sort of hostile to income as it was. the tax situation was appalling and connecticut has kind of squandered all that away, they've lost so many companies that were there before and the economics have very much turned around. that's one place where it's going to be interesting to see if economics really ruled the day. wisconsin is also really interesting because they have had a much improved economy. and he is in part responsible for that and the president won by a various slim margin there. that can be very telling for things going forward. >> i'm interested in looking at minnesota 1 and minnesota 8. the candidates there are fine and then pete stogner is the guy in minnesota 8. he really needs to when that primary otherwise they are in a

little bit of trouble and it would be embarrassing given the time and money that they have invested in trying to get past the finish line. >> andy: what are you looking for in the blue wave stuff, turn out? >> it's actually what scott walker has been rubbing on, democrats are fired up and he has said, he's asked for help and said, they are coming. >> republicans have demonstrated that they can still win and they can turn it on and drive voters out to the polls. a lot of voters are trying to glean a lot, but take into account the special election. now it's a blip on the radar and nobody is even talking about it being competitive for november. there's a special election when there's a microscope on them and people are talking about them and there's lots of money invested is very different.

>> you really see how much things can change so quickly. you look at the primary, and i agree with you on wisconsin that it's really going to give us a chance where things are going in the midterms and in and in the next presidential election as well. president trump has won wisconsin with that narrow margin and it was critical to him. i think democrats are really kind of wanting to fight and make it not indicate that there's been an overall shift in the state. but when i think when it comes down to mid term, it all comes down to the last three weeks of the midterm so these primaries give us that initial indication about how excited people are but i think it really comes down to that final stretch. >> i wanted to give another trump tweet, the very unpopular governor of ohio, john kasich is what we call him, giving john

kasich kasich, lieutenant governor lost the race because of his lack of popularity. that solidly one of his signature move is there. do you think that it -- it was an 11-point margin for trump there, so what's your read on that? >> i mean, they are getting so far down in the weeds with this kind of stuff and with the back and forth, that's a few that will never die. that john kasich-trump beauty. john kasich is sort of irrelevant here, he had an embarrassing display in the republican primary. it's kind of like, go away. >> it's not good for our country for them to be tweeting a picture -- >> not at all. coming up, the latest on the terror investigation in london. a driver arrested after pedestrians are mowed down near the british parliament. what police are saying about the

suspect in custody and a possible motive. let's take a look at some numbers:

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>> fox news alert on an apparent terror attack in the heart of london with one suspect in custody after several pedestrians and cyclists were mowed down by a car just outside of the house of parliament. benjamin hall is live in london with the latest details. >> good evening from london. we saw an attack just like this in march and now we see another one. using that method again, a car to mow down pedestrians in a very public place and aiming at security officials. one of them remains in serious condition. just in the shadow of big ben, it then veered off the pavement and into some cyclists to knock them over before continuing to one of the barriers that police immediately swarmed all over the car.

they pulled the man out and handcuffed him and he made no attempt to escape as we've seen in the past. no secondary attack seems to have been planned, no weapons, no knives and no explosives in a car. president trump tweeting from white house thing another terrorist attack in london, these animals are crazy and must be dealt with through toughness and strength. police say they don't know much about them and arrested him he's in his late 20s and is not cooperating with police. interestingly enough he was not known to security services and there will be questions asked about that. he has now been charged on suspicion of a terrorist attack. just a few hours ago, they held an emergency session and decided not to raise the terror level and keep it at severe which believes they means they may bn attack may be a minute but not planned. >> melissa: new polls show the majority of democrats view socialism more positively than capitalism. why this shows a significant shift in the party and the impact it could have in novembe

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>> melissa: new polling may show that an increasing percentage of democrats are telling left. a new gallup poll shows that democrats view socialism more positively than capitalism by a significant margin. 57% see socialism in a positive light, just 47% feeling that way about capitalism. this is in sharp contrast with the g.o.p. voters. 7 out of 10 republicans say they have positive views of capitalism so, lisette, let's start with you. what do you see is the reason behind this increased popularit popularity? there's obviously a connection between socialism and democratic socialism but why did they see it this way? >> they have been trying to push like bernie sanders and alexandria ocasio-cortez to the side and say, we don't have anything to do with them but i

think is increasingly difficult when you look at the numbers and the majority of your party subscribes to the belief system. this is representative of the democratic party but i think it's fair to criticize this belief system because it has failed and that even the venezuelan president has admitted this policy has led to the demise of this country economically, but republicans should put up or shut up, and we have not done much better in terms of controlling budgets and controlling spending. we need to be smarter, address entitlements and get our spending under control and republicans have not done that. they haven't done that under president trump, either which disappoints me. >> i want to turn to you on this one, why are democrats down on capitalism? capitalism has caused innovation in this country. >> absolutely. it's been the greatest driver of growth the world over and they are so down on it because they want something to blame for her feeling left out of the economy.

they hear a lot about income in the quality and how the richer are getting richer, things aren't improving and those are getting lumped into the category of socialism which isn't really socialism in the venezuelan sense. there is a difference also between european socialism and south american socialism. >> spending money you don't have a spending money you don't have. >> both parties are spending money they don't have. >> it's not apples to apples though. >> you can't be just a little bit socialist, just like you can't be a little bit pregnant, you are either one or the other. >> in terms of -- the trend line is actually, and you pointed part of this out when you asked me what was going on with capitalism.

it's not -- it's the dislike of capitalism. >> that's always in there, embedded in there. when you talk about the abstract capitalism and socialism, socialism sounds great. it's in the realm of, wouldn't it be great if we could all sit down and share our toys, try to teach kids that. but in the real world it's not -- , you think, people are - companies like google, amazon and how consumer products are better. >> people take things for granted but i always think these are more reflective of tribalism than any conceptual thought. i would be much more impressed if the first question was, what

do you understand socialism to be, and what do you understand capitalism to be. and tell me where you are on that continuum. but i just think -- they are talking about words, we don't define where the words are. >> it used to be that mutualism is a path to communism and people are understanding that that's not necessarily what it means anymore. >> melissa: okay, more "outnumbered" in just a moment. to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition... for strength and energy! whoo-hoo! great-tasting ensure. with nine grams of protein and twenty-six vitamins and minerals. ensure. now up to 30 grams of protein for strength and energy!

>> melissa: thank you to andy

mccarthy. it would scare you off? >> six now, i loved it, thanks for having me. >> melissa: we are back tomorrow at noon eastern and here is melissa francis in for harris. >> melissa: fox news alert, former campaign chairman paul manafort telling the judge she will not testify. and now the defense team resting its case in his tax and bank fraud trial. this is "outnumbered over time." manafort's calling no witnesses. prosecutors on robert mueller's team resting their case yesterday after calling more than two dozen witnesses including manafort's former right-hand man, rick gates. chief intelligence correspondent catherine herridge is live at the courthouse in alexandria, virginia come up with the latest. >> reporter: as we reported earlier, they got the defense resting the case earlier today.

they indic