millions of americans are under heat advisories or warnings this week. new york city, a high of 94 degrees today. >> that is beautiful, but it's nuts. >> thanks for joining us everybody, "outnumbered" starts now. >> justice department official bruce ohr right now facing accusations on capitol hill and in numerous contacts with the author of the numerous trump dossier. fox news contributor lease of booths, and director of strategic, christian elrod, and former state advisor for president donald trump and george w. bush, and senior fellow at the center for national interest. you are "outnumbered" for the first time. we are very happy to have your expertise in the state department for

george w. bush and president trump here today. >> a couple things at your level of experience on the show today. here's a video of doj official, much of that interview is expected to focus on the anti-trump dossier, which is being funded by the dnc and hillary clinton with the 2016 campaign. fox's chief correspondent catherine herridge catching up with them in the hallways of capitol hill. >> mr. c ohr, we have a series of questions from fox news. who authorized her contact with the fbi? did anyone within the justice department know you are contacting the fbi as a back channel for christopher steele, the british spy? >> not much interest in answering any questions. he has links to fusion gps behind the dossier. they hired d14 and ohr's wife,

nellie. mark meadows took part in the interview today saying that he believes 99% of the doj workers are patriots but the actions of some officials would raise alarm bells. watch. >> i think really our republic in the integrity of the fbi and doj is at stake. we have several that took things into their own hands and so with the credibility of legal justice that should have a blindfold and yet we are seeing that they were peaking and trying to tilt justice one way or the other based on their own political bias. >> so christian, we will go to your first and get your take on this as an employee of the government. it's probably not a good thing that he's getting hauled up from his perspective to answer the questions. and we will find out what happened with the congressman answering questions about what's your perspective? >> christian: it's never good if you are a bureaucrat to be on the front of newspapers.

this is part of the 99% of the fbi being patriots i think is a great statistic because of this type of phony evidence were to arrive at an fbi field office out in real america, it would have been discounted. this dossier would have never seen the light of day. fbi agents have to meet a very high level of standards. and yet, it's a politicized headquarters of the fbi and not just one that was they are under president obama, one that has continued under jeff sessions who has sort of not ever gotten control of the department. >> so lisa, bruce ohr is there today voluntarily but there could've been a question of a subpoena if he wasn't willing to testify behind closed doors about his involvement with the dossier and christopher steele. before lawmakers have been trying to get him to talk for about nine months now and the reason bruce ohr is of such interest is because of its connection to the unverified dossier that was used to obtain a fight is out of warranty on

carter page. it's serving as an intermediary between christopher steele, the author of the dossier, and the fbi even after he was fired for violating fbi rules, by looking to the press, and also his wife, nellie ohr come up that work. what i'm interested in are the documents turned over to congress or the written that christopher steele said that comey's firing made him nervous that would expose them. what are you worried about being exposed? you can look at nellie ohr or that he was fired is still being used as a source. troublingly, he failed to write that his wife worked for fusion gps and ethics forms. there were a lot of things here that i think congress are going to try to get to the bottom up. and there is some things in connection to the clinton campaign. is it appropriate for someone working in the department of justice to be in contact with a

raw opposition research firm that was being paid by the clinton campaign? >> lisa: 's wife worked there. washington, d.c., has a small place. >> >> but directly tied to the clinton campaign. >> lisa: again, we talked about that so many times, it was opposition research. you are using fact-based evidence, it was fact by citation which was in the dossier. >> are using the dossier is true? a >> lisa: there are things in the dossier that are true. absolutely. >> like what? >> lisa: we are talking about bruce ohr right now. >> yes and he's connected to his wife that helped fund the research. there's questions about the campaign and their involvement to go after an opposition party. >> lisa: here's the point i think we need to look at. why are republicans holding this hearing today in a closed door format? if they really think that bruce ohr has a lot to say, then open

it up. let's be transparent, let's have an open hearing as opposed to a closed-door hearing. we will see what happens today and if republicans leave anything out or if they give a public statement post hearing. >> is indeed a conflict of interest if his wife worked for fusion gps and he is still serving as an intermediary after christopher steele was fired? >> lisa: i don't like it's a conflict of interest at all. i think a lot of spouses -- there is a lot of information that we need to know but i think it's completely unfair to tie him to something just because of his wife was involved in something. >> it does seem to be the beginning of the fact-finding behind closed doors. >> we have an interview coming up and he is asking a lot of questions about conflict of interest, about potential biases. and it just kind of the fact-finding, i know that christopher steele got the boot in 2016 in november and yet information was still being

funneled from bruce ohr. i know from text messages that catherine herridge from her exceptional reporting has brought to light and shown there is still communications going on. >> i want to get to congressman mark meadows and what he wants to ask bruce ohr and then i will get christian's reaction. >> i think that later reporting today would suggest that perhaps the involvement, who authorized bruce ohr to get involved, if it was someone i did that, those are the critical questions that have to be answered. >> christian, reaction? >> christian: who did what, when? that's how this was set in motion. the dossier had fake information that that donald trump was compromised, that people were in places that they weren't, that was used to send spies into the trump campaign. to circle back, all of this activity at the justice department should be known by mail. we are a year and a half into the trump administration's and again, jeff sessions, not just about something, but he's been fundamentally disappointing on a

number of things. antitrust against these big guys in silicon valley, and it's really just sort of a mess over there at the justice department. >> to adrian's earlier point, we don't know if conversations began behind the scenes. i don't think we know if he would have even accepted speaking into an open forum, and an open hearing. so that could also be part of it. >> wright, classified information which is may be why congressman wanted to have an open conversation behind closed doors, also without the media fanfare that comes with these open hearings. as we saw, with peter strzok testifying -- >> exactly. >> we know republicans have held a lot of these closed-door hearings and information has selectively leaked out. biko adam schiff never leaks anything out. >> christian, i think you want to respond to her and then we will move onto the next topic.

>> christian: this may have actually been -- he's supposedly playing ball to an extent with the investigators but we will see after today. we need to get all the facts on this out in the public can understand why the obama administration decided to spy on the trump campaign based on tha that. >> okay. the public is interested as well so hopefully we will get more details out after today. lenny davis is backing off of two bombshell claims that he made an interview with "the washington post." he's now admitting he was the anonymous source in a july cnn story that reported that cohen had privately claimed that president trump knew in advance about that meeting between trump and some russians. here is davis making those claims last week. watch. >> i can only say that he was present during a discussion with jr. and data. mr. speed 16 has knowledge on

certain subjects that should be of interest to the special counsel. i believe that mr. cohen has direct knowledge that would be of interest to mr. mueller that suggests, i'm not sure it proves, that mr. trump was aware of russian government agents hacking illegally. >> davis is now expressing regret for his role in all of this thing, "i should have been more clear that i could not independently confirm what happened. i regret my error." davis also saying he can't corroborate his claim that cohen has more information suggesting he knew in advance, saying i'm not sure there's a possibility that this is the case but i'm not sure. so to get things off, we said, i'm going to start with you. is he just using and abusing the press? should he have seen this coming?

he's a longtime partisan. >> lisa: i think he's full of it, honestly, if we are being honest. i think he understands that the press hates trump so much that they will pretty much report whatever is given to them. but i think a big thing here is that we keep seeing these bombshell stories that would dramatically change the way that the entire russia investigation is viewed. it ends up being wrong and you go back with abc's brian ross indicating that president trump is a candidate told flynn to talk to the russians, when he was president-elect, and it wasn't even standard operating procedure, or with donald trump jr., seeing that somehow he had access to the wikileaks dump when it was released, and everyone in the world had access to that. we see these big stories that potentially change the way all this is viewed and they end up being wrong. i think when president trump says, fake news, these stories solidify that and bring people into his camp that are like, you

are right, there is fake news out there. >> lisa, to your point, these were the stories that a lot of democrats were waiting for. i knew it, trump knew about the meeting, we knew all along. and then, no, not the case, and it's walked back. >> christian: fundamentally you had the hope that there was this collusion between trump and the rest of gone by the wayside. then there was hope that trump's personal lawyer would have all these goods and alleys under pressure and would spill them to the press, then you see the reality. it's so weird in the first place, michael cohen, very interesting guy. if you were writing and wrote this guy in the editor would say, that's too over-the-top. he charged at&t 600 grand for insight on the client. i hate to think of what lawyer i have used would do that. and then hiring lenny davis as a political operative who worked

for the clintons, who sort of an attack dog at times for the clintons. it's really -- and of course to plead guilty for something that is actually not a crime, the campaign finance violations that he pled guilty of, not a crime. really what he decided is to play to the left. if he's going to become a poster child for the left and that will get him a lighter sentence somehow from mueller for the prosecutors up here. it doesn't seem to be working. >> president trump did warn people against using michael cohen as a lawyer. >> yes he did. my favorite thing about this is lenny davis trying to say he made a mistake based on the fact that he's a clinton operative and has been for 20 years. the idea that this is a mistake is bogus. the accusation that was made as a very serious one. lenny davis as an anonymous source accuse the president when he was a candidate of knowing about the meeting, then walked back inside, actually my client

didn't know anything about that meeting, and saying that the president of course didn't know about the meeting. he made this huge accusation, made it look like he was lying about it and now there are certain people in the media that won't retract a story as they should. >> while the cnn operative says they have multiple anonymous sources. >> anonymous sources like lenny davis -- then they should really think about who their sources are. >> but they can't trust any of them. >> christian: the other source was lenny davis just using a different voice. >> i just want to add to your little screenplay here, it's kind of insane that you have lenny davis representing michael: and you have rudy giuliani representing donald trump. this just adds to that whole

screenplay. >> the media is using these anonymous sources and believing things too quickly, particularly when you know people's background. >> lenny davis is not a whistle-blower who needs protection whose working deep inside a government agency and is fearing retribution for speaking out anonymously. that's when you use anonymous sources, when you have people who look at corruption and no corruption is going on and they need people in the press because they are trying to get their story out. lenny davis is a political operative and he shouldn't be able to operate anonymously as a source because he has nothing to lose. he's not needing protection under the whistle-blower protection act. he is a legal operative trying to get his word out to an anonymous piece, to accuse the president of lying. at >> i'm very interested in seeing how lanny davis, now moving forward and some these interviews, what lens that to work for people. >> i also think it's important

to remember that rudy giuliani has also made a lot of discrepancies to the media to. he's had to walk back some comments as well. >> there's a difference between rudy giuliani walking up back in the media not correcting it. many davis has walked it back but there are certain people and reporters who refuse to correct the record and they said if they maintain any kind of credibility that they wrote. >> we are about to get a read on you high-stakes midterms. the big races we are watching and a potential impact for both parties. and for president trump's agenda. plus the white house touting the president's trade agreement with mexico. will canada also jump on board? what it all means for workers and businesses here at home. >> it opens up a lot of markets, it protects intellectual property, it actually extend some patents and copyrights for new drugs. all of this is very helpful. it protects workers. ♪ alright, i brought in new max protein

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facing off against a against rocky day-lewis went away and rob desantis over the state's commission of agriculture. and in arizona, three g.o.p. candidates are competing in a fierce senate primary. congresswoman markham valley, kelly ward and former miracle maricopa county sheriff joe arpaio. the rice also being watched closely following the death of arizona senator john mccain. arizona governor doug ducey will select the late senator 's replacement. so christian, president has been pretty successful in his preprimary endorsement so far. where do you see that going? >> christian: i think she will prevail -- she will have of course the full term of the seat vacated by flake. of course she didn't want to face voters again because boaters especially in the primary would have fired him. corker from tennessee in that same boat and we will see about

these primary critics of trump. very popular in republican circles. of course the governor has the challenge in deciding who to fill the seat vacated by late senator john mccain. choice is between perhaps one of the runners-up's, probably kelly ward, in today's primary or someone who's already been in congress like john kyle. >> and his chief of staff is also i think in the running for that position. lee said the president has been successful in this all but 2:30 seven races and he has successfully endorsed the primary candidate for republicans and senate house and governor races all across the country. how do you think you will fare today? do you think ron desantis will pull it out or will pam bondi when the day? >> i think ron desantis pulls it off, which would be a good test of meant to president trump's power. he was behind putnam and now he's in made up that lead and my

understandings are that they are both pulling the same in the general election. also president trump's approval rating florida is around 50% now so democrats will try to make this and if electron thing. but i don't think that will be super effective for them there. obviously in arizona, i think martha mcsally will pull it off which is a positive thing, it's a good thing because it will be a tough general election there and she will most generally fare better there than ward or arpaio would. >> there is concern about democratic nominee, what's your inside information on how they think that race is going to go for the general election? >> i think the sec is certainly looking at this race is a potential pickup for democrats. kristin kristin seminar is veryr estate so we will see how these three duke it out today. i think going back to another factor to keep in mind about today is that governer ducey of course is also in a cycle but he

has a responsibility of picking john mccain's replacement. he made it clear that he is going to wait until after the services of senator mccain but he's also going to have the pressure of picking somebody who is either in the donald trump part of the g.o.p. vein or somebody who is more moderate in line. >> do you think you will use it to read tea leaves? >> i think -- however he picks, that will and potentially affect him. >> i think that's overblown. he will be reelected, and whoever he picks to fill late senator mccain's seat is somewhat irrelevant. i just think there's so much being made over it with trump phenomenon, it's not that big of a deal. >> i do think there is some risk to do see who is to "moderate. john mccain face reelection multiple times and had challengers but each of those times from the right. so doug ducey has to make this decision.

>> he always ran. >> yes he always ran but he had this machine behind him and now there's an open playing field. i think there's a risk of doug ducey not picking someone who is to the writing off and on the other side of trump, rather than in the middle. >> i'm not buying that. i get the reporting on it but i don't buy it. >> shifting gears to florida, the democrats are trying to reclaim the governor's seat there in that state. do you think that's a possibility depending on which candidate they end up with in florida? >> i think that's a potential possibility. >> held that for a decade. >> florida is such a challenging state, if you are a campaign operative that can win florida for your candidate, that's a big, big deal. that's basically three separate states in one state. you have northern florida which is very southern, very much like alabama. you have the middle of the state and you have the southern part of the state which is very heavily cuban, strong human

population >> were you worried about nelson? he's proven to be a pretty horrible candidate. >> there are democrats that are worried about bill nelson, i believe that the bill nelson machine will prevail. >> is there one though? >> he got reelected quite a few times. i think it will be a tough race. >> christian: this could be a big change, a big pickup for republicans in a number of states. but in others, specifically missouri, montana and west virginia, it's really a big change. there's a change in this whole blue wave dynamic. and with florida i think likely retaining a republican governor, it illuminates the ability of the democratic party to generate stars outside of the left-wing progressive atmosphere. >> we will be watching and covering it here. in the meantime, the secretary of defense makes a new announcement.

attention on the rise after president trump suddenly canceled mike pompeo's trip to pyongyang. now future military exercises on the peninsula will go forward. what does this mean for efforts to denuclearize north korea? we are glad to have former state department advisor manafort here to weigh in on that. stay tuned. >> we took the step to suspend a several of the largest exercise as is a good faith means are coming out of the singapore summit. we at this time to suspend any more exercises. mom: okay we need to get all your school supplies today... school... grade... done. done. hit the snooze button and get low prices on school supplies

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>> fox news alert, defense secretary james madison announcing the u.s. is not considering plans to suspend additional military exercises on the gran peninsula, and amid renewed tension between the united states and north korea. here is secretary mattis. >> we took the step to suspend

several of the exercises as a good faith major coming out of the singapore summit. what he needs done we will certainly do to reinforce his effort, but at this time there is no discussion about further suspensions. >> this check comes just days after president trump called off the trip to pyongyang. "the washington post" reports, the president halted the trip due to a reportedly belligerent letter that pompeo received from the north korean official. in response, north korean state media criticizing the trump administration, writing, the u.s. attaching a criminal plot to unleash war against north korea and commit a crime which deserved a merciless divine punishment. pretty strong words there from north korea. how seriously do we take these

words, they seem to have some pretty creative writers over there and north korea. >> christian: yes, they do. >> at the same time we received the message is here in the united states as well. so what does this mean going forward? are we stuck at an impasse? were things may be back to business as usual as we move towards denuclearization? >> we are nearing sort of the end of phase potentially of our patients. they have to stop sending messages like that, they are important, but the singapore summit was originally on and then they came out with the statement, the north koreans threatening vice president pence and trump said, thanks but no thanks, we are canceling it. and then previous digression came after kim jong un came with the chinese leader.

that the president has identified as basically the factor causing north korea to go from, maybe they are coming in from the cold and going back to bad behavior. he also understands china's leverage over north korea, he is not the first president to do that. that's what he did in a tweet saying basically, this is why they are misbehaving. >> and that was particularly fascinating. >> as he said it, they were taking away, but also at the time suspending a legal action, in exchange for the stopping of a legal belligerent behavior which is threatening the united states with a nuclear war. now that we haven't seen any progress, i'm happy to see that those things are back on despite as the president said, the cost of them. i'm curious to know if the belligerent letter was as big as

a letter sent to president trump in the oval office. i don't know if that has anything to do with it but, it would be funny to see if it they sent the same type of letters. >> i think, remember that kim jong un came to the negotiating table because of president trump's maximum pressure campaign, ramping up sanctions aggressively against north korea and also with the military threats as well. remember back in the day, kim jong un was rocket man and fire and fury and you better be afraid of us, and some ramped up rhetoric. so i think that still retaining that pressure, that is important because president trump has repeatedly said i'm not afraid to walk away from the table. one of the big problems with president obama in the iran deal was the fact that he was his legacy.

and it's a deal. i think it's important that north korea knows that we are not willing to sign a bad deal and we won't get something that is okay with us. >> i think it's also important to remember that in june of last year, they stood together with the united states flag and the north korean flag and donald trump said north korea is no longer a threat. and that has set the record straight with the american people and put in place a diplomatic process that will actually yield the results that we want to. >> they are certainly trying things that are new, and that comes less predictable than perhaps they could have been in prior years and prior administrations. does that mean there is a broad spectrum of possibilities? >> christian: i don't think we

are worse off for the president has tried to do, we got about a year longer and that's their rocket assembly facility and nuclear test sites. these are good signs. we also change the flip the script where china was a facilitator of all the diplomacy in both the clinton and bush administration which i first served to one where we are dealing directly into our leverage. it's very easy to go back to maximum pressure because we never really stopped doing that, except for that minor military drill that now rescheduled for back on. >> yes it was a small step forward. also there's a lot that was sanctioned as well. north korea's illicit funds from abroad is how the regime survived. in 2006, the bank was in macau. >> coming up, liberal groups

fighting against the supreme court nominee brett kavanaugh. now going after senate democrats who have not committed to opposing him. whether their resistance will work or whether it will damage certain democrats. >> as we challenge the capital nomination to understand that we have to knock on doors and take back the house and i got this nomination. ♪

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>> fox news alert, progressive groups launching a campaign this week to block supreme court justice nominee brett kavanaugh. the vote is aimed at 24/7 democrats who have not yet vowed to oppose cavanaugh. three of those democratic senators are the usual suspects,

joe donnelly, heidi heitkamp and joe manchin. they face reelection in november. neil gorsuch and they are most likely to vote for judge kavanaugh. >> you both hold the fate of approximately 93 93 million won of of childbearing age in your hands. with this vote on brett kavanaugh you will be defining the future of these 93 million woman with one vote. >> stop it! stop it now and make sure we have a democratic house to have a break on the president after the 2018 election. >> really, the lives of 93 million child childbearing e women?

>> donald trump during the campaign made it clear that any support nominee that he had the opportunity to nominate where he president, he would run a litmus test on whether or not they would overturn roe v. wade. so that is what is at stake here. there is a lot at stake here and that's why you are seeing all these progressive organizations from demanded justice to -- you name them, they are all aligned, the resistance is aligned here to put pressure pressure on senate democrats to oppose the nation. it's a smart tactic and it shows that democrats are energized and enthusiastic. but at the same time, -- it's false. >> made it very interesting that democrats are still claiming to speak for 93 million women. it is this another delay tactics by democrats that's futile considering there are some democrats that probably would vote for cavanaugh?

>> i love everything about the story and the effort. as a trump republican i think we should do more exactly of what they are advising here, and on a kamikaze mission. brett kavanaugh will be confirmed and the big democrat complaint against him, and i think he was vetted for that position, too. and i think it just shows how politicized and absurd this has become. if you look back, elena kagan confirmed, there were 60 votes, in favor of her. you go back to ruth bader ginsburg, 97 yes votes in the senate and now expecting that all democrats would vote against him. he has told people that roe vs. wade has settled law and the focus of conservatism hasn't changed. >> the problem with the argument that adrian is making is when you drill in these red states

like donnelly, and heitkamp, the majority of the states want them confirmed. i guarantee you that joe manchin carries more about what they care about versus a bunch of progressive packs. so the point is, these arguments that they are making has taken a toll on brett kavanaugh nationally speaking, but what is more important is what the red states care about, they care more about what trump supporters and people in their state voted for that a bunch of crazy progressives. >> these crazy progressives that you speak of are actually representing the views of a lot of america. >> i -- but i will -- if there are a lot of democrats in the states. >> i'm talking about voters, the senators that are running for reelection in the red states, and what they care about. >> i will concede that if you are joe donnelly, if you are joe manchin, or heidi heitkamp and

you are in cycle, this is a tough vote. the democrats have to show that we are fighting, and we are. we are putting the pressure on these senators to at least give a very -- >> i think it will be tough, particularly in west virginia as you brought up because this is a state that president trump has come back to several times, as far as coal country is concerned. there are a lot of voters that are way behind them. it would still be very challenging for senator manchin to come out and be the one that draws the wall on cavanaugh. he would need to make that. >> denomination hearings for brett kavanaugh start on tuesday and we will be covering that here as well. in the meantime, president trump announcing a tentative new trade deal for mexico to replace nafta. but for now, canada is not part of it.

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fair trade, and get it going. nobody thought we could do it. i think to the president's credit, to bob light houser's credit, to jared kushner's credit, we did it. it will promote economic order to both sides. >> larry kudlow praising a potentially landmark trade deal with mexico. the tentative new agreement, the president announced yesterday it stands to benefit the auto industry which could be a sticking point in negotiations. canada has not signed onto any deal so far and its trade minister travels to washington today for negotiation. "the wall street journal" editorial board is not impressed, writing, this is half of nafta that contain some improvements but is notably worse in many ways. the president responded, i smile at senators and others talking about how good free-trade is for the u.s., but what they don't say is we lose jobs and over $800 million per year on the lake trade deals.

the lawmakers are just fine with us. so christian, he wrote an op-ed for foxnews.com and it wasn't titled that this was a huge win. >> i can't take credit for that title five, i like it. it was a big win, "the wall street journal" has been a bunch of negative nancy throughout this entire process. they said tariffs don't work and it will make everything worse but in fact it's about people to the negotiating table. why is it a big win? mexico has taken jobs from the u.s., in particular underpricing jobs by having environmental and other standards that are way below what towers are. so, this requires a $16 minimum wage for 40-45% of the manufacturing that goes into the auto sector. that will raise wages and especially northern mexico so that will help some workers there. it also allows us to compete fairly with them. there are other big changes in

way that frankly, companies could step outside of our judicial system and the mexico judicial system which could be more restricted under the new u.s.-mexico agreement. more importantly, it's just a template that cannot be followed if they want to follow by canada and china. >> i want to get into the politics of this for him. a lot of voters who felt left behind by the obama administration, working class voters, they frankly didn't make much of an effort. so looking ahead at 2,020, are you worried that democrats will be left further behind with these working-class voters if he's able to chalk up some wins for them? >> absolutely. he's done nothing for these working-class voters. >> and the deal has to be passed

by congress. still talking to the canadian prime minister. there still a lot of unknowns, and we want to see a trade deal that works. there's a lot of concerns that people have with nafta, a lot of improvements that need to be made here. so we will see what happens to insinuate that that deal getting past is magically going to put working class voters back to work in parts of the country where the manufacturing base has been significantly lost. >> at least the president isn't saying -- >> unemployment lows are as low as they've ever been. and now -- they need to be rising. >> we've also seen hundreds of thousands of jobs added. >> well and, this is -- is there

a long way to go, yes. democrats for years, nancy pelosi and chuck schumer assumer have called for nafta reform. >> more "outnumbered" and just a moment, stay tuned.

>> thank you very much to christian whiton for coming to the couch. we hope you come back. >> christian: thanks, it's been great to be here. >> what are your predictions?

>> in mexico it will get signed in november, past and the house early next year and canada will fold. >> we are back tomorrow at noon eastern. molly line is in for harris. >> >> molly: bruce ohr facing questions on capitol hill over allegations of anti-trump bias. let's go "outnumbered overtime." on molly line and for harris faulkner. doj official bruce ohr at the closed-door session of the house oversight and an end judiciary committees, lawmakers facing new revelations of his contact with the ex-british spy behind that anti-trump dossier. ohr's wife worked for fusion gp fusion gps, contracted to produce opposition research on donald trump. we caught up with him shortly before the interview started.