happened evidence. >> sean: boom! great job, rush. let not your heart be troubled. the news continues. ingraham. she does radio. she does everything. >> laura: hi! am i on?in oh, sorry. >> sean: [ laughs ] why would i watch hannity's show?au >> laura: i'm getting ready for college football. >> sean: big time, me, too. >> laura: can you zoom on this? >> sean: gotta tell you one thing. what does it say? >> laura: alabama. rolltide! >> sean: wow. rolltide. >> laura: only ranked number one in the country. >> sean: i'm not a saturday football guy. the nfl can fight over the ethanol they want. i'm done.

i'm watching saturday college football. >> laura: i love my redskins. i am one of those redskin hopefuls. we will win one day again. >> sean: one day again. i know. i thought they had the best quarterback ever and sadly injuries got to him. >> laura: when you bring up football you are so right. when alabama came to the white house, nick saban shows up -- >> sean: greatest coach ever. >> laura: the players were there, i'm sure a lot of people don't like trump, but they were respectful, they showed up, a great event, beautiful day. that is the way it should -- just respect the office. >> sean: i agree with you. get the politics out of sports, period. i agree. >> laura: hannity, fantastic show tonight. great job on the cnn issue. we'll continue with more of that. welcome to washington. i'm laura ingraham, this is "the ingraham angle" on a very busy wednesday night. another black eye for cnn. do they have any other eyes than black eyes? it's not just those stories they are getting wrong, now they are defending one of the most violent groups in the country. a former cnn contributor is here to tell us what the heck is going on. plus some interesting excuses

from catholic leadership as the sexual abuse scandal widens. and what former trump official is unveiling a new musical off-broadway? i will give you a hint: it will have a short run.f- raymond arroyo joins us with that and more in "seen and unseen" and some exclusive details from inside that bruce a ohr hearing yesterday. former prosecutor andy macarthur is here. but first, far left billionaires uniting to remake america. that is the focus of tonight's "angle." remember when the democratic party had a shred of a belief in freedom and democracy? the far left bernie sanders contingent used to be existing kind of only on the fringes, while more establishment figures, like hillary clinton and so forth, they ran the show. but no more. big democratic donors have begun to support some of the hard left socialist candidates that have

emerged on the scene recently. last night's election told us a lot. top democratic billionaires tom steyer and george soros put their money behind far left tallahassee mayor andrew gillum before florida governor. defying expectations, he pulled off a primary victory last night against six other candidates. he is african-american male version of alexandria ocasio-cortez. he's young, dynamic, and he's running on a platform of universal medicare, legalize marijuana, and abolishing i.c.e. exciting. and he is viewed by hard left democrats is kind of a savior from the stranglehold that the party's establishment had had on their desires, hopes, and dreams. they picked the perfect guy. his city hall under investigation, fbi, corruption, and tallahassee boasting florida's highest crime rate three years running.

good going, guys. that is something to run on. but let's look at who his supporters are. of course, many of you will be familiar with george soros, the billionaire who has funded the liberal center for american progress, moveon.org, and his open society foundation, which spreads money all over the place, globally by the way. in the 2016 campaign cycle, "the new york times" magazine reports that soros spent $25 million while not lose their campaign of hillary clinton and other leftist candidates' causes. this year, he's already blown $15 million to support democratic candidates and other causes. now gillum knew a good deal when he saw it. so last year, he courted soros' organization and spoke at a number of their gatherings. then when they met at san francisco, soros promised to back his gubernatorial run. he was impressed with gillum.

billionaire san francisco financier and philanthropist tom steyer also bankrolled gillum's campaigning and he saw him as basically a new and almost improved version of obama because he was more left wing. now remember, steyer is the activist who just finished up a 30 city town hall tour. he is contemplating his own 202n run for president. that's part of what he's doing here. and he's not letting the grass grow underneath him. steyer is running as encouraging people to sign a trump impeachment petition. steyer himself is kind of the impeachment pitch man. he's openly urging the president's removal from office. >> how much more does congress need to see? donald trump has not been implicated in two felony crimes, and he's all but confessed to them on fox news. no one is above the law. so we have to make sure thisbo president doesn't use pardons to cover up crime.

if you agree that a president should not be allowed to pardon himself or his associates, join us at needtoimpeach.com. the washington establishment doesn't have the courage to act, but the american people can. >> laura: i should add that funneled $800,000 to the get out the vote initiative prior to the gillum run. so he was critical in that gillum race as well. but listening to that impeachment commercial for a second, you think about the democratic establishment, they tried to keep the impeachment talk at arm's length. well, what they are really doing is letting the billionaires boys club do their dirty work for them..y because they know that this mobilizes the far left base, keeps them kind of happy. it gives nancy pelosi, maybe even schumer, swalwell, those types, plausible deniability. that's not us, that's tom steyer.

and steyer has promised to spend at least $30 million to elect progressives this campaign season. this means, by the way, he -- not soros -- is the most important democratic donor in the united states. but like soros, steyer is not content to support just any democratic candidate who commas long. ---- who comes along. he's bankrolling far left radicals who will upend the political system. that is where his mind is. he was at that -- i like to call it the nutroots convention -- all of those far lefties -- i got to crack that. we have to crash that someday, matt. they were in new orleans earlier this summer. check it out. >> how many people in this room think that the democratic establishment in washington is listening to you and doing what you want? seriously.

they are message to me and the five and half million americans who are demanding donald trump's impeachment is bad politics. it is off message and it will galvanize the republicans. to you and to me and to millions of americans, this is all pretty obvious. >> laura: he should have worn a hoodie instead of no tie. he is trying to be a really cool blue-collar guy, no tie, going to unbutton the shirt. b if you will have it open, just button the next button down -- that's weird. i'm sorry. i have a question, was maxine waters out of town monday?y?i' "no one is talking but impeachment." some of them are. steyer is using his billions to ensure the candidacy of these newly minted socialists who he hopes will swamp america. the whole electoral landscape for the democrats. and florida is a great place to

start because if you can flip florida, keep it blue, or get it back to where they think it should be blue, they think theyr can take the presidency as well. that is what this is really all about. it's about 2020. here's the irony: both steyer and soros made all of their dough being aggressive capitalists, global capitalists. remember, soros spent all that money in eastern europe where the soviet union fell, big money, these guys have an inside deal on the hard-core capitalism. but now that they have their billions, they want to spread the gospel of socialism, that's devastating countries like t venezuela, 2 million people have left venezuela, huge crisis, and also in nicaragua, 2,000 people fled nicaragua. i will tell you more about that story as the weeks go on. even europe is beginning to reject the old socialist way. in fact -- this is kind of

funny -- george soros' former protege, viktor orban, was just reelected prime minister of hungary earlier this year and he ran against soros' old buddy. so this is, like, anti-soros mania, they had big billboards up and he won big in hungary. the soros-backed open society foundation in fact had to close its budapest offices less than a month after viktor orban, his former protege, got reelected. i love that story. back here in the united states, it would be so foolish for us, the republican party, among conservatives, to just dismiss this as a bunch of billionaires wasting their money. sometimes they have wasted their money, like on hillary.r but this is not a passing fad.av this is a direction the democrats are going in. they got all these young people, they think socialism is just kind of a social club.

they don't know the history of socialism. i so conservatives better redouble their efforts to educate these young about the false promises and the dangers of socialism. we know they are not being properly talked about the perils of socialism in the public schools, private schools either for that matter, or the universities. so we have to do it. and we have to commit realiv dollars to social media campaigns, exposing what socialism is doing, make them cool, make them sexy looking, make them educational. we have to plaster social media. we have to support conservative candidates who are great in front of the camera to repel the leftist advance. if we don't act now, you can expect tom steyer's impeachment petition to grow, grow longer and longer. and that's "the angle." joining me now for reaction is

matt schlapp, chairman of the american conservative union. victor davis hanson, senior fellow at the hoover institution and eric johnson, attorney and democratic strategist.vi all right, matt schlapp, let's start with you. i've heard conservatives say -- oh, i do they helped us just -- i hope they do really just waste their money.ye but when you see that steyer, it's really steyer, lesser extent soros, steyer has picked this guy out as the person most likely to push forward the socialist agenda in the state of florida. that is not an exaggeration. and by golly, he won the primary. >> it worked, yeah.er >> laura: how serious should republicans take this lurch to the left funded by some of the richest people on the left in america?ic >> very serious. one of the things about our campaign laws, laura, we don't know how much money he spends. you threw some numbers out there, that is what we have to account for with record-keeping. we don't know what they are spending and they are dead serious, they want to spend

their billions to really retakei these seats. you are right, it's not just about winning the governor's races or the senate races or house races. it's about taking back the white house, stopping the trump agenda. one final thing, the republican party's platform is actually pretty popular. but sometimes our leaders are worried to embrace it. the democrat, when the american people really know the democratic party is, it is frightening. it is left wing, it is radical. to a certain extent, i would like to see this completely exposed. >> laura: well, the media are saying that this is -- this is, like, mainstream, this is where the country is, and victor davis hanson, i want to go to you. soros and steyer, they made all their money on betting the markets, shorting the markets, going long in the markets, playing all these games in europe, and now it is -- oh, no, we got to bring america back to the failed policies of europe that are being rejected by the europeans that have devastated places like venezuela and now we are seeing what's happening in nicaragua.

your reaction to all of this? h >> steyer got his wealth in part to invest in coal plants abroadt and george soros, who was indicted and ejected in france, -- and convicted in france, responsible for the crisis of the bank of england, so they don't have sterling, ethical records. the point is, the democratic party of humphrey, jfk, or bill clinton, no longer exists.. it's a pyramid with a few grandees on top that have enough money they can be immune from the consequences of their own ideology and a group on the bottom who depend on subsidies and they to the middle class. -- they alienated the middle-class. a lot of this passion comes from misreading the two elections of barack obama.beer they felt like that was the trajectory that was going to be permanent and create a progressive future and really it was unique to obama and hillary clinton inherited allmi the downsides of losing the middle class under obama, who,us after all, lost the house and senate and local races.

but she got none of the upside, that is record minority turnout and bloc voting. finally, they've so delegitimized trump, or attempted to, that socialism is sort of portrayed as a legitimate opposition to an abnormal situation. we normally don't like socialists but if we create enough chaos, analogous to theo 2008 election, or the watergate, then socialism looks sober and judicious as a foil. >> laura: it's ignorance so -- victor, it's what you've written about for years. matt, you've talked about it. this is a level of ignorance about basic historical facts subverted in universities, subverted in our high schools, or not taught at all.ve eric, you are proud democrat, and i admire that. if i were democrat today, while it's exciting to have all this money funneling in, just like the republicans need suburban women voters, democrats need the american middle class to return to the democrat party, as

sympathetic to their cause.ur how does socialism answer the concerns of blue-collar america? >> the question is, if you label it as socialism -- >> laura: no, no, eric, they're calling it social limp! what are you talking about? >> they are not necessarily calling it socialism -- not really. the thing is, if you want to label it --g- >> laura: yes, she is! >> many people can label things on the right as being sort of corporatocracy, or oligarchy and not for the american people. so the way you want to choose and put down these labels of the political system determines the political -- determines the public opinion on thesee particular subjects. now if you look at the donations, what soros and what the other individual is doing is nothing different than what the koch brothers have been doing for years for the republican party. >> laura: i agree with you.

i'm not disagreeing. let's take on the issues where we want -- advance the narrative. you are right. koch brothers spent a lot of money on local races. i'm not saying they can't spend their money. what i'm talking about -- >> the question is, you are labeling it as socialism. >> laura: it's because -- to know what your own prime saying. ocasio-cortez says socialism is part of me. part of what i represent. bernie sanders did not run away from the socialist label. this andrew gillum in florida is for medicare, free medicare, free health care for all, as most socialist countries have that, abolish i.c.e., no border -- we will have no enforcement mechanisms to return people to their home countries -- >> i would say that is different than the way it's being implemented right now. >> laura: yeah, effective. so we won't have an effective -- ok. >> right now it's not necessarily as effective, it can be done in such a way that it's protecting the borders but also protecting those individuals whn are here and proper citizens in this country and those who are taking the proper steps to become citizens in this country. >> laura: all i can say for

all you guys, we got to go to our next block but barack obama was called a disappointment by george soros, the big g "new york times" magazine piece. he said obama disappointed him. he didn't consult him enough. he wasn't socialist enough for soros. soros wants to -- open society is really about open borders. that is what it is, no borders, no restriction on movement, sovereignty is out the window, all these principles we hold dear as americans, they are supported in that world. -- subverted in that world. i don't see how is great for the democrat party, i don't think it's great for the country, that's where it's going. >> hasn't been so good for venezuela either. >> laura: thank you for raising that! thank you for the incredible panel. we had a somewhat related topic here. giancarlo sopo, democrat, theem son of parents who fled cuba, and in a "usa today" op-ed, he's boarding the party against embracing what we just discussed. democratic socialism.

he wrote, "given the horrific record of human suffering, to be a moral disgrace to embrace socialism just win elections as some suggest." giancarlo joined us now. we are happy to have him. giancarlo, you heard the conversation, matt sharp and victor davis hanson think, warning, history tells us, like a flashing warning sign, do not go down this path. they were embracing democratic socialism. i don't care what the are tryinh to call it but they are embracing it. your reaction? >> socialists love poor people so much that they duplicate them by the millions. that's a philosophy of failure and it's a moral disgrace, like i said in my op-ed. what has happened in countries like cuba and countries like venezuela, our human disasters. thousands and thousands of cubans have died at sea trying to flee socialism, trying to get up united states of america. you have venezuelans, 2 million have left their country in the last three years alone.yo what you are seeing is a mass exodus away from socialism, yet they are some -- i want to be

clear, i think most democrats are honorable, good people. but i think there are some within the party that are trying to infiltrate democratic socialism and they are trying to confuse people by making them think it's what the system they have in denmark. it is not what they have in denmark. denmark is a free-market capitalist country. what groups like the democratic socialists of america are proposing are -- is likely ideological counterparts of what you see in havana and in caracas. >> laura: how long are you going to stay a democrat, though? honestly. will you stay a democrat if this is where the party ends up? if this is where it ends up, and the democratic socialist movement, i mean, we want you to become a republican. we want to -- you are a common sense guy. your party is going crazy. crazy left.n. wrap it up. >> what i got to tell you is that the party of john f. kennedy cannot become the party of karl marx.f right? what we are seeing, what's happening now because of some people -- not all -- but because of some, a few years ago -- >> laura: they should denounce

it. >> they should denounce it. >> t laura: i want to have you on an extended conversation on radio about this. it's fascinating. republicans have their own challenges. this is a critical conversation and we'll have you back. up next, cnn embarrassing itself once again. stay there. e

>> laura: it wasn't enough for cnn to quadruple the number of dubious trump tower story, the one that lanny davis as >> laura: it wasn't enough for cnn to quadruple the number of dubious trump tower story, the one that used lanny davis as a primary source, they are nowst defending antifa. cnn's senior legal analyst, jeffrey toobin, i thought he was a lot smarter than this, reacting to the presidents warning that liberals will violently turn back his agenda if republicans lose in november. he specifically mentions antifay >> let's be clear also about what is going on here. the theme here is, i am donald trump and i will protect you from the scary black people. antifa is widely perceived of as an african-american organization. this is about black versus white, that is about donald trump's appeal to racism, and it just happens all the time and we never say it, we don't say it enough for what it is. but that is what is going on. >> laura: i've got say, these are the faces of antifa, ok? here are some of the lovelies that were arrested recently --

the berkeley deal. does this look like an oppressed black organization to you? mostly liberal white kids in scarves. headscarves. [laughs] jeffrey toobin's ham-handed attack on the president wasn't h bad enough, though, anchor don lemon chose to defend them altogether. >> listen, there is no organization perfect, there is an violence, no one condones the violence but there are different reasons for antifa and for these neo-nazis to be there, one, racists, fascists, the other group fighting racists, fascists. there is a difference there. >> laura: did he say no organization is perfect? [laughs] there's a lot of moments where you just can't believe this is happening in our country.e' joining me now to their reaction to what is going on at cnn, jeffrey lord, former reagan official who once worked as a cnn contributor and chip franklin, national talk show host and media commentator.

jeffrey lord, you worked at cnn. i got to say, i played thatme toobin bite on the radio this morning, how to have my guys play that again. i never in my life thought of antifa as a black organization. it is mostly the anti-wto crowd, the occupy wall street crowd, overwhelmingly white, probably most of them privileged liberals. >> correct. i know most of these people over there and i like them enormously. i heard that this morning, and i almost fell out of my chair. a sitting in the living room. i mean, what are they smoking? i mean, this is just unbelievable to me. all you have to do is do -- what i assume you just noticed show some pictures here. pay attention to these folks. not to mention these folks areic out and out fascists. i mean, they should drop the anti and just call it fa.

this is a bad group of people. they are into violence, they are into hurting people, they have no business of the american dialogue, period. for cnn to be supporting them is mind-boggling. >> laura: chip, the president today expanded on the comments about violence and he said this. >> i just hope there won't be violence. i can tell you that because that's the way i guess if you look at what happens, there's a lot of unnecessary violence all over the world. but also in this country. and i don't want to see it. >> laura: he doesn't want to see violence, but when you see those pictures, the video from berkeley of trump supporters getting bashed in the head, smashing windows every time i conservative speaks on college campus or if they are upset about -- taking over i.c.e., it's craziness. how is this a racial issue on the part of cnn? >> it is really selective, laura, for starters. by the way, lemmon said -- he didn't have this in the quote --

he said there are racists and fascists and one-sided and there are good people on the other, like in charlottesville. cornel west told me if it weren't for antifa, if they hadn't been there, if antifa had not protected them, they would have been crushed like cockroaches. this country is built on violence in the spread didn't, -- and the president you just played, he's the guyli that set the climate. he's a guy that hold the nra they could shoot hillary. he is a guy that told cops, why do you put the prisoners and cars and not bang their heads, why do you lower their heads? he also said this is a nation that if you protest, we'll take care of the protests. he said the climate. >> laura: you get you. i get you. you recited which is very r familiar, the liberals -- >> i didn't recite anything. >> laura: you recited talking points and deflected my point. my point is a very simple one, don lemon made a distinction and made the distinction by saying that antifa was, in fact, an organizationrg that was in its n

way standing found what is right. -- standing up for what is right. there is no difference there. whether --ro what? >> there is a grassroots organization by a lot of people. this country is built on violence. 300 million guns in this country, they go, show up, charlottesville is a classic example. they show up to stop racists, this president says, oh, there is good and bad on both sides. >> laura: we played video, jeffrey lord, antifa chasing down a car after the latest protest in washington when 24 white nationalists showed up in d.c.li you got people menacing regular people driving down the road. don't talk about how great the antifa people were -- >> i'm not saying there great! >> laura: they're not. they are thug and domestic terrorists. jeffrey? >> charlottesville, bannon --

no, you wait. trump was the one encouraging that -- >> laura: bannon wasn't in charlottesville, chip! don't sell this garbage on this show. >> the one-sided approach you have, the people on the right that are calling for violence, trump said, the better terms for --tr if the midterms go the democrats' way, there's going to be violence. you don't find a problem with that? p >> laura: you go back to charlottesville -- we have antifa all across the country. charlottesville has been condemned, including by the president. >> these are people standing up against the kind of violence that you are propagating. >> laura: they're advocating for chaos and anarchy. jeffrey? >> laura, in 1968, donald trump was, what, about 18 years old or something like that? where was he when the democrats were under siege that their own democratic convention by leftist protesters. donald trump was nowhere near these wto protests. he was nowhere near when they were smashing windows -- p pn >> you are going back to '68? mayor daley is dead. >> you're telling me this is

donald trump's fault? you're telling me this is donald trump's fault? violence is in the dna of the american left and always has been. >> you're high! >> look -- >> this president comes out every day and calls for violence against people who disagree -- >> laura: what? baloney! he comes out every day. he just said, we have to clamp down on the violence. it's notow good in this country and we can't stand for it. we just literally played the sound bite, chip and then you come out -- youla should work fr cnn.ha god bless you, but we just played the sound bite where trump says no violence and you said the president comes out and says he's for violence. >> this guy has lied so many times in the past. you're going to take one sound bite and say that exemplifies the president? come on. be honest with yourself. >> laura: if democrats want to appeal to people in the middle -- whom they need -- and t

republicans have their own set ofof challenges, you have to be very careful who is running the show on the protest front. that applies to charlottesville andlo antifa. great conversation. mounting calls for the pope to resign? we'll tell you about it next. here? we're voya. we stay with you to and through retirement. so you'll still be here to help me make smart choices? well, with your finances that is. we had nothing to do with that tie. voya. helping you to and through retirement.

>> laura: time for a "seen and unseen" segment where we unravel some of the big cultural stories of the day. tonight we have me too comeback, a trump musical, and a cardinal dismissing the sex abuse scandal in the catholic church. i'm joined by raymond arroyo, fox news contributor,is "new york times" best-sellingol author of the fantastic "will wilder" series. raymond, the me too movement claimed a lot of careers but now it seems like comedian louis c.k., he was out, a big trump basher, by the way, and now he's in.ba >> fx, hbo, netflix, they all canned him. he exposed himself to women, sexual, inappropriate actions. he left, he apologized, though, now he is staging a comeback onn in new york the other day, he did a 15 minute set at a little

comedy club on the east side and people are complaining, particularly victims, saying it's too early, you shouldn't have come back. this is a little taste of his comedy. e >> i'm the guy that women see and they go, eh -- >> and they are still doing that. matt lauer, "the today show" fame, he talked to some fans at a restaurant, it was reported in page six this week, he said, it will back on tv, too. matt lauer had a list as long as my arm off accusations against him. the question is how long do you have to stay in me too purgatory? my sense is, you have to have a public contrition. you need to be called out and shamed publicly i think but then test the audience, these guys can put their toes in the water and see if the audience will accept them. my guess is, they want. the scandalous beggar. >> laura: matt lauer, a lot of the blue hairs were going up to him -- matt, i love you and willard

scott! you were great with willard! the glory days. >> where's bryant? looking for bryant gumbel and katie. got to tell you about a new off-broadway musical that was unveiled the other day by a former, but very brief, white house official. he introduced cast of a new trump musical at a white house press conference. i wish i were making this up. here's anthony scaramucci.s >> just great fun. my stock answer is, i always wanted a second white house press conference, and i couldn't get one, i only lasted 11 days. >> he introduced to this cast, who are playing members of the trump family. i will set this up very quickly. this is kind of like an osmondtr special, trump family is gathering but daddy trump doesn't show up. so ivanka has to assume the role as hostess and what does the family do when dad is detained? they sing. [ music ]

>> laura: oh, my god! did anthony scaramucci, who'sy been very nasty, by the way, to me, even though he sat where you set a couple of times, not anytime soon, but does he have some creative -- was he better at producing or being involved than this than he was as five seconds as press secretary? >> i think they just hired him to promote this. it's so embarrassing. >> laura: first of all, why is ivana fat? >> i will only go see this win the mooch and omarosa are for looms. when they come into the cast.

>>he laura: this weekend, a former vatican diplomat charged that the pope and several -- they told a local nbc affiliate of the pope -- he's just too busy. >> the pope is a bigger agenda.p he's gone on to other things, -- he's got to get on with other things, talking about the environment, and protecting migrants, carrying on the work of the church. we are not going to go down through a rabbit hole on this. >> wait a minute, charges that there are corruption and a culture of silence at the very upper echelon of the church, that is a rabbit hole? that affects victims today and victims to come -- >> laura: that -- let me just tell you, that stupid comment was disgusting, dismissive and revealing of how far left the catholic church has gone! >> i can top it, he said here is the real reason we're seeing this resistance to pope francis and these accusations, watch. >> quite frankly, they also

don't like him because he's a latino. >> laura: what? >> they don't like him becausese he's latino. he's full-blooded italian, who grew up in argentina. so i am more latino than him.al i don't know if we will have time. there was a papal event, the wednesday audience in rome, and some people thought they were yelling "vigano," the archbishop -- >> laura: accusations the pope knewhe about mccarrick's sleepig with the seminarians deal. let's watch the audience. >> [crowd chanting] >> there is some dispute as to whether this is actually vigano. there was a bishop on the stage with the pope. his name is italio. they say it is a crowd of kids yelling out. some friends knew all might

-- some friends i knew was there, they claim it was a blend of things. >> laura: it's like that viral thing. what was it? >> yanni or laurel? vigano or italia. you be the judge. >> laura: we won't come. i listened to it, sounds like vigano to me. what does that tell to the pope -- where does it tell to him?m? >> he is, according to reports, embittered by this. he hasn't said anything. people are -- >> laura: guess what vigano said? he said i am completely serene and at peace because i said the truth. as president trump launches a new offensive against the doj's bruce ohr, we have new info tonight about what mr. ohr revealed during his closed-door testimony next. what mr. ohr what mr. ohr revealed during

(♪light musical cords) >> laura: president trump took another shot earlier today at bruce ohr, that doj official thought to be behind the politically charged steele dossier, tweeting, "how the hell is bruce ohr still employed at the justice department? disgraceful. witch hunt." i happen to agree. we have now learned some inside details of what happened to mr. ohr when he testified behind closed doors. joining me now to explain is former fellow prosecutor in prosecutor and fox news contributor andrew mccarthy. with me in the studio, former doj attorney james trusty. andy, let's start with you. what can we conclude about ohr? then we'll move onto sessions

and the donald mcgahn issue. >> apparently, laura, ohr is cooperating with the congressional committees and i think the most intriguing thing we heard was that he provided the names of a number of people who were in the loop with in terms of what he was doing in communications with steele.. he was in communication with christopher steele, who is the author of the dossier, throughout the period of time that the dossier was beingsi written and compiled by steele, and it seems that ohr is an important person because he's really at the nexus of the fusion gps and the justice department fbi side of what i think is actually the most interesting collusion we have seen so far. >> laura: yeah, i mean, you've written great stuff aboutut what the real collusion is here. james, it is wild that -- we don't have any indication that

bruce ohr was -- either he wasn't revealing that his wife was a fusion gps person to any of his superiors or they didn't care. meanwhile, meeting with christopher steele and now apparently seeing a widening circle of people involved in this. what is your initial take on this? >> the whole thing is amazing. at some point, the disclosure about where his wife is working obviously should have made its way through the channel. but i think of the whole circumstance of sitting down from his position with christopher steele a dozen times, with the fbi taking notes and creating a report, it is just unheard of. i have to think, we'll find out eventually may be, i have to think it is freelancing. he's on his own frolicking to b -- frolicking detour with the f.b.i., with nobody supervising, nobody looking at it and we all find out -- >> laura: we don't know.

dow we? this went into 2017, having these conversations. this was proceeding past the election and we know about the insurance policy that they needed, that was discussed by stzrok. they are freaking out that trump is president.icic this is all they got, they got this dossier, got to keep this thing going, keep this thing going, in order to get the surveillance to continue, the fisa warrants to continueo against poor old carter page, the affable carter page, a sweet guy but it's a whole thing. we got a hold onto something. christopher steele, we are not supposed to talk to him because he's already talking to the media, but i can still have these back channel conversations with him. that can't be ethical, is it? >> you can't, no. >> laura: crazy! how is he working in the justice department still, by the way? >> when you are the department of justice, i was there for a long time and andy was there for a long time, and in main justice, although there are a lot of wonderful people that work there, there is no bigger sign of purgatory than being sent there against your will. so the fact that bruce ohr is an

international affairs means he is not an favored status. he's hanging by a thread. the cumbersome process of discharging a federal employee is very long but that's a clear sign that he is not in cahoots or in step with the leadership there. they are not looking to keep them there. >> laura: andy, let's talk about where we are with the jeff sessions in and jeff sessions out of favor at the white house. democrats are now kind of rushing -- sometimes, with jeff sessions, they don't like him on any policy but you get the sense that if trump is mad at jeff sessions, democrats want to embrace sessions. what is happening there? >> it's hard to know, laura, because in terms of what we are talking about tonight, we haven't seen anything happening. you know, sometime ago, the attorney general -- this is months ago -- said that he was referring this sort ofmo investigation of the investigators to both the inspector general at the justice department, horwitz, and also to

john huber, the united states attorney for the district of utah, who is supposed to be taking an independent look at this, as if he were a special counsel but one who is in house and the justice department rather than brought in from outside, like robert mueller. that all sounds great, in fact, it is along the lines of what i and a number of other people recommended. the bizarre thing is, we haven't heard anything about it and i'm all for investigative integrity and investigative secrecy but at a certain point, i think we are entitled to know what are they up to, can we get some sort of interim report. we haven't heard a word. >> laura: ben sasse, quickly, james, said, he won't push to confirm any replacement for jeff sessions. the never trump people, they are creating a narrative, "we got to protect mueller, rosenstein, sessions," never heard these people are willing to protect republicans in my life.

>> it is unusual stretch. how often have we seen a president basically publicly ridiculing the attorney general and the deputy attorney general? we are pretty far removed from john and robert kennedy at this point.ne but the bottom line if it is, the president is entitled to a -- to have faith with the people that he put in those positions. he clearly has problems with them. when i think it's kind of interesting, you're starting to see little bits of backlash in very subtle ways from either the attorney general, where they are getting very fatalistic. the deputy attorney general. being very fatalistic. if you will fire them, you fire me. that is the time they are taking. they are chugging along doing their business. a lot of politics but in terms of the day-to-day operations of the department, i think it will continue.. >> laura: andy, does don mcgahn continue his apparent departure after the confirmation of kavanaugh? anything big we should knowel there?

>> i don't think so. for myself, i've heard this was going to happen for months and i have much less good sources than y'all down in washington have.e. >> laura: people were freaking about this all day long. stay there. o i had no idea the amount of damage that water could do. we called usaa. and they greeted me as they always do. sergeant baker, how are you? they were on it. it was unbelievable. having insurance is something everyone needs, but having usaa- now that's a privilege. we're the baker's and we're usaa members for life. usaa. get your insurance quote today.

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>> laura: now we have some horrifying revelations out of

rural new mexico in that horrible case there that the media is not showing you. according to the most recent evidence, the family has been using their compound is a terrorist training camp for the 11 children they were holding. agents found these handwritten letters titled "phases of a terrorist attack," which detail the steps to a successful suicide attack in the name of allah. in the united states of america. despite all of that, a judge in new mexico today decided to release three of the five defendants. ruling authorities violated the state's ten day rule. how do you botch that? andy mccarthy is back with us. i'm so glad you stayed, andy. this also is an interesting connection to the case that you worked on, the '93 world trade bombing. we'll get to that involvement. -- in a moment. explain how we could get to this place, where three of the five defendants are released. >> well, laura, they made these

arrests a couple of weeks ago, and i guess they have been investigating since, and they got to the point where they either have to charge them in an indictment or go through what they call a probable cause or preliminary hearing, and what i sense happens was they decided that two of these characters were the ringleaders and theyns appear to have ratcheted up the charges on the two of them and then decided perhaps that they couldn't make the case and the other three so they didn't go forward on those.. that doesn't mean that they can't at some future time indict them but that seems unlikely to me. >> laura: well, and are they -- i guess -- it doesn't matter if they're a flight risk, because they're not charged with anything. that's the concern, obviously, right? >> right. they had already been strong on bail to begin with, which i guess, in some ways, more outrageous than what happened today because if what happened today they didn't have enough evidence to go forward as one

-- forward is one thing, but letting any of them out is insane! >> laura: can you explain -- the whole thing drives me -- this whole case is so hideous, what is done to their children, one dead -- explain your connection -- one minute left after this case in the '93 world trade center bombing. >> the father of the ringleader runs a fairly notorious mosque in brooklyn. his name is the same and not -- and that mosque posted the blind sheikh, who i prosecuted in the early 1990s, and connections with the world trade center bombing, in a plot to bomb the new york city landmark. he actually appeared, the eldest, as a character witness for the defendants in the trial. so we are seeing a guy who was enmeshed in this ideology back when and where you have the results of it. -- and here you have the results of it. >> laura: we're welcoming this

into the united states apparently and then releasing people back into the system. i don't have a good feeling about this at all. andy mccarthy, thank you for your insights as always. so appreciated. we'll be right back.

.. >> raymond and i are going back and forth. is it figaro or italian no?

>> now i hear dragonoh. >> is the archbishop accusing the pope? >> et al. yo was standing next to the pope. >> i bet the vatican is saying it is italiano. they don't want -- causing trouble all over the vatican. enough trouble is here. shannon bream does not cause trouble, they just do a great show every night that i watch every night before i go to sleep. shannon: definitely some tomfoolery tonight. this is a fox news alert is one report