thank you very much. congratulations on the book. "the big game." check it out, good read as we get ready for the big thursday night game. that "the story" on labor day, september 3rd. we will see you back here tomorrow for the confirmation hearings of brett kavanaugh. ♪ >> tucker: good evening and welcome to a special and we think pretty fun addition of "tucker carlson tonight." we will feature some of our favorite debates from the past year. it we don't know if democrats will take congress in the fall or for the democratic nominee is going to be in 2020, but we do have some idea of what they are planning to run on. impeaching drum, throwing over the gates to the prison, those are two obvious ones. many democrats are also proposing to eliminate ice, the government agency tasked with enforcing our immigration laws. we spoke to several people the summer who support that plan. here's part of the conversation. >> people are calling for eliminating the agency. so let's say that happens tomorrow.

if the democratic left, you, get your wish and ice is gone and there is an illegal alien busted for drunk driving, should he be deported to mexico question. should they be deported? >> i think what we have to do is think about abolishing ice and creating something else. >> tucker: how about answering the question? >> what was the question again? >> tucker: should an illegal alien busted for drunk driving be deported? >> that's too big of a question. the criminal justice system deals with crime. >> tucker: is a very specific question. >> the criminal justice system -- >> tucker: immigration for a living, i'm asking what do you think we should do? we are remaking -- it's a revolution. let's get rid of ice, okay. so what are the new rules? i'm here illegally, i get busted for dui. should i be deported? very simple. >> immigration law is very complicated, talker. that person could have an asylum claim.

they can have many different types of reasons why they might be able to stay in the united states. beyond their dui. the criminal justice system can handle crimes. american citizens commit crimes and they go to jail. >> tucker: but no one should deport illegal aliens who commit crimes. >> i think of ms-13 or any gang member violently commits a crime, kills someone, they should spend the rest of their life in prison. >> [inaudible] >> tucker: if you think he's a member of ms-13 and you think he's are here illegally, that's not enough to deport them? >> we will exacerbate the problem. they come over there and then people come back. if the logic that we need to see. we can exacerbate a problem. >> tucker: it's america's fault, we created it. >> i am for abolishing ice because it's been undermining american values. it's been tearing apart families. this is not who we are. but while i say that we need to abolish ice, i am still for

strong borders and we still have customs and border patrol. we still have limited and humane immigration enforcement in this country. let's remember, i said something that is only been here -- if i might, talker. ice has been here for 15 years, talker. it's a 15 year experiment. prior to that we were able to enforce our immigration laws humanely and in a limited way. we need to get back. >> tucker: the ice question little more deeply, is there something immoral about the ice employees? a lot of democrats have compared them to nazis marc >> that's absurd. >> tucker: ice carries out the laws passed by the congress. if you want to serve in the congress but you are not calling, i notice, for different laws. if you are saying you want to get rid of this one specific agency but keep other agencies to patrol the border and some limited way.

what is specifically wrong with ice? there something wrong with the people there. >> ice going on buses and asking for papers. ice going to schools and churches in taking people off the street. the other day -- >> tucker: why do you think they are doing that? >> that's the point. we created the stand-alone agency. >> tucker: i'm here to learn from you. you want to get rid of them, but why do you think they are doing this stuff? >> ice is out of hand in its approach in terms of how before when we had enforcement -- we had an agency -- >> tucker: if i'm white. you may not, because you already have. i want you to answer this question, which is, why do you think they are that way? you think they are doing horrible things, why you think they're doing those horrible things? >> it's been an agency set up solely around enforcement rather than set up in 2003 rather than

agency set up both to govern and enforce immigration rules in this country. we are a country of immigrants. now we are at this moment -- >> tucker: maybe it's my fault for wanting specific answers, what does that mean? it's a law enforcement agency that shouldn't just enforce laws. >> take for example what we had before. it's been what you want to abolish ice. help me here. help me understand your position great >> i do want to apologize. >> tucker: other than enforce the law, which of those things be? >> talker, the way we had it before under inf, something like that. we can enforce their immigration laws through another mechanism, not ice. out of hands. >> tucker: what's wrong with ice? i'm trying. i'm trying! if you are ever in washington, call me. thank you for coming on, i appreciate that. >> tucker: the incoming president of mexico is a left-wing populist who repeatedly said on the campaign

trail that the population of the world has an absolute right to move to america and america has an obligation to let all of them in. we spoke to univision anchor jorge ramose just before the mexican election. >> tucker: tell me a little more about this right of all the people in the world to come to the united states. where is that right come from? >> let me just say right at the beginning, i don't speak for the mexican government or any other presidential candidates. but ahead of the pulse right no now. he's reaching almost 50%. he's a leftist candidate. and what he has said is that he's bowing to be a president for the 130 million seconds in mexico and for about the 12 million mexicans here in the united states. don't expect them to be spineless and weak president. it will be a completely different relationship between him if he wins and president

donald trump. >> tucker: it sounds that way but unlike you, i'm an american. i only vote in this country, i only can. i'm only a citizen of this country. it why would i or any of the other american citizens watching tonight think that it's a good thing that a president of another country is declaring that the world has a right to move your? that's a hostile act aimed at others. why would we be for that? >> i don't know why he said that. but what i can tell you is he wants to protect the 12 million mexicans living here and 35 million people in this country from mexican origins. it's going to be different. you remember with the current president, he invited then candidate donald trump to the mexican white house and mexicans were outraged by doing that. lopez is going to be completely different. recently he said that this policy of family separation is racist.

so in other words if he becomes president and he would be december 1st, it would be completely different with donald trump. >> tucker: so we are getting another racism lecture from a rich white mexican ruling class member. okay, just want to clarify that. let me just ask you this. racism lectures from any mexican officials who preside over one of the most racist countries in the world, most americans don't understand that. >> it's racism. it is racism what has happened. let me just say why. what other number of american kids in cages right now? it's zero. and what's the number of central american and mexican kids in cages or detention centers? 2300. >> tucker: nobody is being detained because of the color of his skin. this is mexico. in mexico people of indian background can't rise to levels of prominence because it's too racist. as you know.

mexican citizens are in no position to lecture americans about racism. >> but it is racism what is happening in this country. >> tucker: of course is not racism. it's called democracy. and we are told, including by people like you -- that's absur absurd. >> it is not absurd. >> tucker: if mexicans come here to assimilate and become americans, which is what we are always being told, they want a part of the american dream, then why is the guy running for president of mexico campaigning among them? it doesn't sound like they are assimilating, it sounds like they are just mexican citizens extracting what they can from our country. >> there are two things here. first of all, under mexican law, mexicans living abroad, many including me were going to be doing that on july 1st. >> tucker: if they believe in america and they are assimilated into america why would they still be voting? >> you can assimilate and be part of the united states and still believe that you can

participate politically in mexico. those are the laws. they can do it. >> tucker: but you wouldn't participate in an election unless you felt that that politician was representing you. but if you were an american and you really identify with the united states than what they do in mexico doesn't really concern you. so i'm confused. you can't be assimilated in america and still be voting in a foreign election. doesn't make sense. >> but it does because you would expect in this case the president of mexico to defend mexican immigrants or central american or latin american immigrants if something happens to them. we just have the questions right now at the border. so you would expect the mexican president to defend you if something happens to you in the united states, of course. >> tucker: those are his people. i'm even more confused. if those are his people, his citizens, he is representing them. soliciting their votes, which he is doing, why doesn't he want them to live in mexico?

>> many of them left for many different reasons and as you know immigration has to do with supply and demand. if there are jobs for them here in the united states and there are not enough jobs for them in mexico. >> tucker: oh, i get it. just outsource your poor people to america. >> immigrants contribute billions of dollars to the economy, the mexican immigrants. >> tucker: right. >> you know that. >> tucker: the left has moved away over the line on the question of immigration, but that's not the only topic that they've gone crazy over. now some prominent liberals say we ought to institute socialism, that works well, and empty the prisons. see what they are saying next. ♪ ♪

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professor cornell west is maybe the most prominent democratic socialist in america. he joined us recently to define the term. >> tucker: so to give us some sense of what democratic socialism is, can you point to one example that works? venezuela seems like an example of democratic socialism, would you say that it is, and if so, does it work? >> i don't think that democratic socialism as an ideal has been able to be embodied in the larger social context. if there's different forms of it, some are bad, some are medium, some are better. but the fundamental commitment is to the dignity of ordinary people and to make sure they can live lives of decency. so it's not a "ism" ." it's about decent sniffs, the workplace, women dealing with the household.

indigenous peoples, immigrants, how do we ensure that they are treated decently and at the powerful don't in any way manipulate, subjugate and exploit them? >> tucker: if that's what democratic socialism is that i'm basically on board. i do think that ordinary people, middle-class people ought to have dignity and i think that our current systems made it hard for them to have dignity. so i agree with all of that. but the details matter. >> that's why albert einstein, helen keller, norman thomas, martin luther king jr., we can go on and on. they are all democratic socialist. one of the great founders. >> tucker: but has it struck you as interesting that it's never actually worked anywhere? the question is not what are our goals, our goals of the same. how do we get there is the question. so what happened in venezuela, they call that democratic socialism but they don't have toilet paper and is less equal than ever. >> but part of the problem is that any time there has been

attempts of ordinary people to engage in self-determination they can get crushed by external nation. look at u.s. policies towards venezuela, very, very ugly. at nicaragua the same way. we saw that in so many other instances where countries try to engage in self-determination and they either get crushed, they get coerced and they end up oftentimes responding to the authoritarian treatment. it's only been a movement so fa far. attempt to resist a third grade at the top, the racism, sexism, homophobia, the various ways in which human humanity is violatd rather than affirmed. >> tucker: if the government's obligation is to its own citizens and you drop the borders and have no border enforcement at all, what would happen to this country? what would happen to the poor people in this country? with their lives get better? where they become more

prosperous? no, this country would become poorer, dirtier, impossible to manage. it would be flooded with the poor of the world and it would destroy our country instantly, so why would you say no borders? >> you got a variety of voices in the democratic socialists of america. would like the jazz orchestra. different perspectives and orientation. we don't agree on one particular policy all the time. this is true with the israeli occupation of palestine. some are in the middle, some are more extreme. how do you keep track of those coming from latin america? those coming from africa, those coming from haiti and those coming from europe and asia? that's the important thing. we know the history of america but indigenous peoples and africans who have been in enslaved was to open the borders come to bring folks in. it's not a matter of no borders at all. it's a matter of how do you ensure that their dignity is affirmed when they arrive so that you don't end up having the

kind of neo-fascist policies of the administration. he >> tucker: that silly, as you well know. >> what silly? >> tucker: how do you think the descendants of the american slaves benefit when you bring in 25 million illegal immigrants from the third world? does that elevate poor americans? i don't see any evidence that they get richer or happier when you bring in more poor people. if you ignore their problems. >> if we were having this discussion years ago and you had irish-hating britain, all of the folks who came into the making of this nation, did it not allow for the kind of coming together with poor and working people would be able to straighten their backs up and speak with dignity and decency about issues that affect all of us? that's the history of the nation

with the exception of the african slaves and the indigenous peoples. so the idea that somehow now the immigrants are here and a lot of the immigrants have only been here one or two generations now become the definitive authority defining what it is to be an american, how hypocritical can you get? i've been here nine generations coming out of enslaved people and i can still embrace my mexican brothers, i can embrace a whole host of others. but it's not just a matter of no borders. i don't believe in just no borders. it's a question of making sure their dignity is affirmed when they get here. >> tucker: cornell west, ladies and gentlemen. "the new york times" has a question for you. is it okay for your kids to be friends with white people? they actually ask for that. we will tell you why coming up. ♪ ling with insurance. which is why esurance hired me, dennis quaid, as their spokesperson because apparently, i'm highly likable.

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>> live from america's news headquarters i'm alecia cuneo. tropical storm gordon gaining strength. it's now expected to be a hurricane by the time it makes landfall in the central u.s. gulf coast late tuesday. a hurricane warning is in effect stretching from the mouth of the pearl river in mississippi to the alabama-florida border. president trump criticizing attorney general jeff sessions over the recent indictments of two g.o.p. congressman tweeting two long-running obama era investigations of two very popular republican congressman were brought to a well-publicized charge just ahead of the midterms by the jeff sessions justice department. if two easy wins now in doubt because there's not enough time. good job, jeff. the indicted congressman r chris college of new york. i'm alicia acuna, now back to our special edition of "tucker carlson tonight" ." ♪

>> tucker: welcome back to a special edition of "tucker carlson tonight." can your children be friends with white people? that's an actual question posed by an actual person in an actual newspaper, "the new york times." the author wasn't optimistic about the answer. "i will teach my boys the lessons generations old" he wrote. "i will teach them caution, i will teach them suspicion. i will teach them distrust. i will teach my boys to have profound doubts that friendship with white people is possible." those doubts, of course, mirrored the writer's own, as he put it. "history is provided little reason for people of color to trust white people." the piece remains one of the most popular on the website for days after it ran. while the professor wrote the piece and we spoke to him. >> tucker: you are making generalizations across racial groups. so you say for example i will have to discuss with my boys whether they can truly be friends with white people. history has provided little

reason for people of color to trust white people. i have profound doubts that friendship with white people as possible. >> that's absolutely right. >> tucker: if i were to write i was mugged as a pizza delivery boy and i told my children that they should never trust anybody who looks like the people who mugged me, i would never do that, i think that would be immoral, but it would be the definition of racism because i would be equating the people who mugged me with everyone else who looks like them. >> i think if that's the only part of the article you read it might sound like that, but of course the article has a much richer argument. the argument i make is, look, in a country where it turns out that when the most vulnerable people of color are under threat, those who they count on are nowhere to be seen or at least for some group of people, and i speak explicitly about the environment we are in today. so if we have a president who marshall's forces of hatred and anger and divisiveness and frankly just danger, quite aside

from who he is. i'm not particularly interested in who he is. if the people who call themselves or friends are not going to push back against that, then maybe you can tell me why it is i should trust those people? >> tucker: i guess what you're saying is people who don't agree with your politics can't be your friends which i think it's an unfortunate conclusion to reach, but is different from the one you articulate here. if you're making again, for the third time, generalizations based on race. this is not a defense of donald trump, merely an acknowledgment of the fact that he received more african-american boats than any republican since 2004. i think he had 8% of african-american men. that's not a huge number but that's tens of thousands of people. are they in the same category too? if you're saying you can't trust from voters, fine. but white people? that's a grotesque generalization and a divisive one. >> i'm a little worried that you keep reading the same parts. he would make it seem as though the entire piece was just that paragraph. so the piece goes on to say -- >> tucker: it's the title of the piece. >> that's right.

i have no problem standing on the title of the piece but it's worth pointing out as i have again and again, with the piece says is when those who count themselves as your friend see that others put you in danger, it is their opportunity to prove they are your friend and let's just speak plainly about this. you have children like i do, right? >> tucker: i do. >> and if your daughters work, i don't know, friendly with a group of people and it just turned out that repeatedly when they went out and her daughters were in danger, those group of young men just disappeared, i take it at some point you would tell your daughters it's going to be friendly with them, but these are not your friends. you can't count on them. >> tucker: but because i'm not a racist what i wouldn't say is anybody of a certain race falls into that category. i would never do that. if one of my daughters was mugged by someone of a certain color i would never say to my daughter that's more evidence you can never trust anyone who

looks like that. i would be in culture reading race hatred in my children as you are. >> obviously i deny that. what i said over and over was we live in a country where we oughtn't pretend that these divides have not consistently been on racial grounds and we see that over and over and over. when black people are in danger -- when black people are in danger from, say, addiction, we get policing. when white people are in danger they get rehabilitation. when black people don't have jobs, we get stories about why we are making the wrong choices. when white people don't have jobs we get a presidential campaign about the forgotten class. so to be fair -- just to conclude -- i'm going to go ahead and i will finish and then i'm happy to hear your point of view. if it's the case that we live in a country where these divides have always consistently been racial, then i think it's not only delusional, but it would be dangerous of me not to teach my

boys that when they walk out of the world it will be a world that treats them differently. >> tucker: should i say the same thing to my children? if there are african-american law professors who dislike you because you're, you should dislike him back and all african-american law professors? i would never say that because that's grotesque. >> if i don't teach my boys how to be cautious, how to be careful, how to be perceived in the right way i'm not just risking their feelings being hurt, i'm risking their bodies being broken. >> tucker: should i teach my kids that? >> you don't teach her daughters to be cautious until they can be sure that the men around them are trustworthy? >> tucker: that's not what the conversation is about. it's not about sex, it's about race. i don't teach them that there are dramatic differences between the races because i'm not a bigot. >> so to be sure, it's fine for you to care for your daughters and make sure that they are healthy and well but if i care for my sons in the same way -- >> tucker: we are out of time. thank you, professor. i appreciate your coming on and explaining that. thank you. >> tucker: a prominent

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of our viewers know that what you are saying is pure lunacy and you do too. but let's just sort of refund reverse engineer this for a second. so who is taking away the right to have an abortion? i think the law -- i don't think, i know, the proposed regulation change would just make it less likely that taxpayers have to pay for abortion. is that the same as banning abortion? >> let's be very clear. it's really the reason i wanted to come in your show tonight because i needed to dispel this myth. people need to understand -- i want all the viewers to understand your taxpayers do not pay for abortions in this country. if taxpayers do pay for abortion! >> tucker: they don't. they don't. they do give a half a billion dollars to the largest abortionists on the continent. >> in the case of rape and if a woman is dying. those of the two situations since 1977. the amendment in which --

>> tucker: we pay, taxpayers at gunpoint half a billion to planned parenthood which commits more abortions than any thing in the country. >> you just talked about on point. >> tucker: it is at gunpoint. if you don't pay her taxes, they come and arrest you. the cops arrest you. if you don't pay her taxes voluntarily, you do it because the government backs it up with the threat of force. >> if you give me a moment to speak. what everybody should understand also is planned parenthood works just like any other medical provider. they get reimbursed for the procedures they perform that are approved by the government. so they get a reimbursement for an std testing. they get reimbursed for all those other things, but not for abortion. but i want to take a moment to talk about what is happening. >> we've got 4 minutes. >> tucker: you are for abortion.

if you think abortion is a constitutional right. i think the right to bear arms is because i read the bill of rights. why shouldn't taxpayers be forced to subsidize the nra or buy my guns? >> now who was talking lunacy and who is being dishonest? you invited me here -- >> tucker: you are giving you the more electric but just answer my question. i think it's an interesting question. >> i want viewers to know that one in four women in this country have an abortion. all kinds of women -- i'm not answering your question because it's a stupid question. >> tucker: i think it's a really interesting question. >> i don't care about your question, i have an opportunity to speak to your viewers. one in four women in this country have abortions. it's going down from one in three. the reason why it's gone down, teen pregnancy prevention programs that have been successful and right now the trump administration wants to divert $250 million of teen

pregnancy programs. they want to divert that to abstinence only education. >> tucker: that was a good faith effort. i really tried. i hate cutting people off. but you were just too obnoxious, i'm sorry. the left wants to ban straws. you can be jailed for using them. not making that up, by the way. we will explain next. ♪ that's why there's otezla. otezla is not a cream. it's a pill that treats moderate to severe plaque psoriasis differently. with otezla, 75% clearer skin is achievable. don't use if you're allergic to otezla . it may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. otezla is associated with... ...an increased risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have  a history of depression or suicidal thoughts,... ...or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. upper respiratory tract infection

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♪ >> tucker: welcome back to a special edition of "tucker carlson tonight." first they came for your winston's, then your big gulps, then your incandescent light bulbs. no liberals want to take your straws. here's what straw ban advocate had to tell us about it.

>> tucker: i don't think it's crazy to worry about what plastic does to see animals an end really bothered by what it does to turtles. it sounds may be dumb to some of our viewers. i don't like that. i guess what bothers me is the solution. the overwhelming majority of plastic waste in the ocean does not come from the united states. it comes from asia, as you know. so why not put pressure on the asian countries that are dumping this into the oceans and leave american restaurant diners alon alone. >> first, it's really a pleasure to be on the show to talk with you. if you are right, america is in the top 20 of polluters of plastic when it compared to the other countries around the world. we should be focusing everywhere the same time. our campaign when we started it just two years ago, it wasn't an anti-straw campaign. it was really intended to save awareness about the state of pollution, not just in the

united states, but elsewhere. and since we launched it with had request from folks in india, indonesia, even in china. even in china to say what can i do about the plastic solution crisis. not necessarily the straw but really the crisis overall. >> tucker: i think i'm kind of for that. i guess what bothers me is the emphasis. jail time when they give out straws, probably less effective than saying to china, you are just spoiling the earth, which they are, and nobody ever says anything about it because they are a third world country and we feel super guilty and we can tell them what to do. you guys never say anything about it. actually he pollution. i hate littering. i hate filth and i don't think you should hurt animals if you don't have to. i really believe that. i conceded that. but let's just be real for a second. of all the problems that we

face, 50,000 people died of opioid ods last year. our straws really in the top 100 problems? why aren't we focusing on things that matter most? >> i think focusing on the plastic out is what we should do. still not an increase globally over the next ten to 15 years. it's only going to get worse. you know the last thing you want to do is you want to see plastic pollution in the waters where you fish. >> tucker: the law of unintended consequences cannot be repealed. if you ban straws, companies start making plastic sippy tops which use more plastic than the straws did. >> it does. >> tucker: short of like banning drinking except out of your hands, what's the solution there? >> [laughs] well, then we would all need plastic bibs to be able to protect our close and that wouldn't be part of the solution either, what it? what i'm really excited for if there are companies like dell corporation, humanscale

interface, others that actually are working with countries like indonesia and chile and even in the philippines to say how do we take all of that plastic waste that's on your beaches, on your riverbeds and shorelines and how do we help you build infrastructure and take that waste product and actually turn it into chairs? >> tucker: is meat murder? our next gas says yes, it is, and we should be required to give it up for good. that's next. ♪ after walking six miles at an amusement park, bill's back needed a vacation from his vacation. so he stepped on the dr. scholl's kiosk. it recommends our best custom fit orthotic to relieve foot, knee, or lower back pain so you can move more. dr. scholl's. born to move.

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♪ >> tucker: welcome back to a special edition of "tucker carlson tonight." if you are a regular viewer of the show you know we covered the horsemeat question pretty thoroughly. it not exactly sure why, nobody else's i guess. we had proponents and opponents of horsemeat-eating on the show. one of our viewers was outraged by the whole thing. it not just because they believe horse eating is wrong but because he believes eating any meat is wrong.

jean bauer is the author of living the foreign farm sanctuary life. vegan activist, he thinks we need to quit eating meat entirely and he joins us tonight. thanks for coming on. >> thank you, talker. really appreciate it. >> tucker: so you got your views about what we ought to be eating, i do too. but i'm not trying to force anybody else to eat it. it seems like taking a large step to assume you have the right to tell other people what to eat. why are you doing that? >> i'm actually not telling people what they must or must not eat i just want people to think more about what their food choices are and recognize the consequences. it recognize that not eating animals is actually an option we have. we grew up believing we need meat for protein but in fact we can live well without it so it's a choice we each need to make but we should make informed choices. >> tucker: i don't think it's a crazy idea. i love animals and i don't like the way factory farms treat animals. i'm so pathetic to what you are saying and then i meet people who are vegan and there's a

super high level of fussiness, which i find a major turnoff. and two, they all looked pretty easy to push over, so you can't tell me it's that good for you if they all look like they fall over in the wind. >> we are certainly a passionate group of vegans but not all vegans are that skinny. in fact the only u.s. mail weight lifter who qualified for the olympics in rio is a vegan. there are amazing vegan body builders and athletes. a legendary ultra runner, vegan. so vegans can be very healthy as well. >> tucker: interesting. you make a compelling case. so get to the fussiness point. i've never met a vegan who didn't spend at least 70% of the day thinking about food. you don't want to spend your whole life thinking about food, right? >> i don't. and i think maybe the vegans were meeting arm may be talking about it or the ones that say they are vegan are the ones that are talking about it. but there are many vegans that you wouldn't know are vegan and as a vegan, for me it's really about living as compassionately as possible, not participating in unnecessary suffering.

and if we can live well without causing harm to other animals, why wouldn't we? >> tucker: i agree with you. i'm going to say i agree with you completely there. but since most people are not going to start stopped eating d meat is delicious, why not make an effort to push the companies that are causing undue suffering, unnecessary suffering among animals, really mistreating them actually to clear up their act a little bit. instead of giving up meat entirely why not push these big factory farms to knock it off? >> i think that's important as well and we do support campaigns to limit the suffering on factory farms. we've been involved in legislative efforts to give animals more space, for example, so they are not confined so tightly they can't even turn around. we do that as well as work to encourage people to recognize we can live well eating plants instead of animals. >> tucker: that's the other question i have that i actually don't understand it. i love cheese. i like meat too but i really love cheese. i'm not giving it up, period, or

chatter, period. why is that harming animals to eat dairy? i don't understand that. >> in order for a cow to produce milk she has to have a baby and the babies are taken away at birth and in some cases they are raised to become veal. a male calf born on the dairy farm, they are useless so they are actually raised to become veal calves. so they have it pretty rough and when they are no longer profitable on the dairy they are sent to slaughter and usually killed about three or four years old. >> tucker: veal is a separate question. you could humanely milk a cow. it's not abuse to milk the cow. but also with an emphasis thing. so china has an entire festival dedicated to murdering dogs. i think a reason to institute sanctions against china at very least but no one ever says anything about it because they are hassling tyson chicken. let's start with the chinese, no? >> i agree that what happens to dogs in china is horrible. but a chinese company now owns

the huge pork industry -- i think kindness is important across the board, across the world. and in the u.s. we have a lot of work to do but i agree we also need to be working on other countries and encouraging humane policies be enacted there too. >> tucker: let me just end with this question, because i think it opens up an interesting topic. if you are saying that we shouldn't be cruel to animals and i agree with you completely and i hope other conservatives would pause and think about it because i think a lot of them would agree. we've been trained in some way to defend tyson. we shouldn't defend tyson, but that's different from saying we have no moral right to eat animals. and i think most people believe that we have dominion over the the animals. if you were starving on a minute and the goat was all you had, would you kill the goat and eat it or would you starve? >> that is a good fundamental question to think through. we have plenty of food and it is not an issue to worry about. but if it were, i think most people would try to survive.

we have a devire to survive. in some cases if you kill and eat the goat, you have no meet. but if the goat is a companion, you have more. >> sean: but do we have dominion over the animals? infrastructure -- are they the same as people? >> we can kill them but whether we should kill them is a bigger question. >> tucker: i started this segment thinking you were probably crazy but i think you are reasonable and thoughtful. i don't agree with everything but i appreciate you coming on. >> i appreciate your open-minded to the issues. >> tucker: i love animals. thank you. that is it for us tonight. tune in every night at 8:00 p.m. eastern, earlier on the other coast to the show that is the sworn enemy of lying, pomposity, smugness and group

think. you can d.v.r. if you can figure it out. if you can, text me. have a great night. we'll see you tomorrow. good night from washington. ♪ >> sean: welcome to the special edition of "hannity." a few weeks ago comedian rosanne barr sat down with us after being fired over a controversial tweet. tonight for the hour we will air the exclusive interview. we must warn some of you, some part of the sit down are controversial. take a look. after starting your career as a andup comedian roseanne barr became a household name and she starred in her own sitcom, a huge hit on abc. she won an emmy, golden globe and multiple awards before she wrapped up after nine iconic seasons. but, well, year after