unequally and it is unfair. those are rare instances and very difficult to find in an actual case. >> check out the french tube or and oboe. that's our story on this monday night. the untold story podcast is now live and you can subscribe at fox podcast.com or wherever you listen to podcasts. general at the trail is now. ♪ >> tucker: good evening and welcome to "tucker carlson tonight." the left would very much like you to stop talking and thinking about bad decisions i've made over the years that they have been to be profiting from. shut up, they are screaming. including to the show. obviously we want to, and you shouldn't either. but first, the trump administration is trying one last time to get funding for the promised border wall on the southern border. the president said he's willing to shut down the government in order to get the first 5 billion

in construction money. over the weekend, chuck schumer promised that will never happen under any circumstances. >> president trump should understand there are not the votes for the wall, in the house or the senate he's not going to get the wall in any form. >> tucker: he is not going to get the wall. notice the pronoun that schumer used. donald trump cannot have his wall said the senate minority leader. but what about the rest of us? the other 325 million people that live here? turns out we can't have a wall, either. in fact, and brace yourself for an icy blast of comedy here, the democratic party. >> what would it cost to have scanners to scan all the vehicles coming in? they said $300 million which is a far cry from 5 billion and a much more effective way to have a secure border. >> most of us speaking for

myself consider the world immoral, ineffective, and expensive. >> to spend billions of dollars on an immoral, ineffective and expensive wall. >> don't waste billions of dollars of taxpayer money in order to build something that will not make our border more secure. >> border security is enormously important but i think building the wall is a very costly and inefficient way to do that. >> tucker: so mr. math guy, bernie sanders, says the border wall is "a very costly. how costly is it precisely? get your calculator out. the estimated cost of a border wall is about $25 billion, estimated. so let's say it's twice that. that would still be a tiny fraction of the price of the pointless stalemate that we are now waging in afghanistan which costs about 45 billion per year not even including the vast human costs. compare that to the 25 billion

needed to restore national sovereignty with the wall. and this is strange, nobody in washington seems to be upset about the price of the afghanistan debacle. many people are getting rich from it and that's the difference. you also hear endlessly and usually from people in gated communities that the walls don't work. so why is congressman happy to pay for border barriers in jordan, tunisia and israel? nancy pelosi says walls are immoral and yet for some reason she's not flying to jerusalem to lecture the israelis on how they are building the usa. the israelis know how effective walls are which is why they have them. they almost completely halted immigration. it turns out that there is a limit to the height of ladders. the truth as you know and as usual is precisely the opposite of what they are telling you. the left fears the border were

all wall precisely because it could keep working long after trump leaves office and that is why when pressed, invariably they fall back on their signature argumen argument. racism. the walls are racist. >> the president went to what i call the brown menace theory. these migrants are dirty people and they bring disease. >> the border wall is about controlling the browning of america. >> donald trump is fixated on the southern border as he was the day he announced the campaign. it's not about securing the borders, it's about xenophobic, racist, bigoted belief. >> he believes and maybe the facts will bear this out but he's scared of anyone who is not visibly white. >> base is scared. they always say that. they cling to things for comfort. it's just projection, look

around. who is angry? who's yelling? who is hysterical? the left. they don't want an honest debate about immigration or a lot of other mindless policies that they've been benefiting from for many years. they hate trump for forcing a debate on any of this and they hate you for agreeing with him. so i can't get past this. anything -- and a conversation trump enters becomes about trump and because the media are so dumb, all the smart kids go into finance and the dumb ones go into media, they are mesmerized by that. it's too expensive, how does that work? >> the democrats in 2013 in the senate put $40 billion into border security and got not only every single vote of democrats in the senate but 14 republicans

including lefties like lindsey graham, marco rubio and orrin hatch. as to the israel analogy, these people who are migrants, who are seeking asylum, they are coming from honduras because they have seen their kids' throat slashed. people are getting into israel to slash the throats of kids. >> tucker: noel, you are talking about the wrong wall. there is the border wall that we debated a lot in the country and we used to call the occupied territories and israel proper. there's also the southern part of the country that separates israel from egypt and over that border were tens of thousands of immigrants from africa. the people didn't like it, and they built a huge wall. nobody in the democratic congress has a problem with that. it was an immigration wall to keep out africans. but that's not immoral, because why? >> i think like every country

including democrats, we have to protect sovereignty. but we also have -- >> tucker: can i also be clear because i don't want my words to be taken out of context. how can you criticize our immigration wall but not israel's immigration wall? >> i'm not saying it's immoral, and saying that they serve different purposes. the fact of the matter is the africans that came into israel saw themselves as part of the 12 tribes. >> tucker: these are from mr. dan. people in pure poor countries o move to rich countries, and i would too. i would do exactly the same as everybody in that caravan at i mean it. but i'm not in a caravan, i'm an american and i want the best for my country. so i'm honestly confused? >> israel besieged in a way that americans are not.

donald trump, to the point, he will have another. if he gets the wall, it will be something else. that will be through election day of 2,020. >> you know what it's about? all this border security hasn't worked and, they are using fake ids and living in our country which is a disaster, so let's do something that works. >> since i talked about this with you last week, they said that ice deportations were lower under donald trump than under barack obama. >> the walls work, and it's because i don't get it. >> why would december 17th -- >> you got me on that one.

you know what, you are like. we shouldn't be debating this one week before new year's, it is your fault, i agree. the resistance in defending our order isn't -- a faction of republicans won't do anything to defend our southern border, watch. >> even the house which is a majority republican doesn't have the votes for the $5 billion wall plan. they just have to have the guts to tell president trump that he's off on the deep end and all he's going to get with his temper tantrum is a shut down, he won't get a wall. >> tucker: he won't get a wall. and the truth is, nobody in washington, literally, nobody is for the wall. and that includes everyone in the federal bureaucracy. taxpayer-funded broadcaster, it's a news outlet. you would think at least they would be willing to support border security, but no.

instead a recent piece attacks the government's claim that criminals and terrorists can enter the u.s. through a border wall and in that same piece they described it through the center for immigration studies as a hard-line immigration group. the only thing that makes a hard line is they support decreasing immigration. by the way so do citizens of most countries polled. stephen cameron is the director of research and he joins us tonight. is there any hope for movement when every person in the whole city, from paul ryan to chuck schumer to voice of america, they are all -- >> it was one of the things that made him win and yet when you look at it relative to other things it isn't that big of a deal to spend the money on the wall. now there are other things we need to do, and yet, elite opinion is just dead set against them. >> tucker: i noticed that no activist group on the left has

called a hard-line. they are always moderate and you are i hard-line? >> i think that's done to be derogatory. to be honest with you, i've been called worse. it's pretty mild but the bottom line is, most americans want our law enforced and they want as you pointed out a lower level of legal immigration and that's all we basically argue for, not know immigration but some law and reforms in our legal immigration system. that certainly doesn't make us hard line but people use that label in an effort to delegitimize what's being held by the majority of americans. >> tucker: we've been running into this process for a hard time. have you noticed that -- , sentt and emotion, and you are right, trying to use name-calling to suppress debate rather than

engage debate. there are a few on the right that do that, we argue that people who would argue a more moderate pace of information, they just say they are motivated by racial animus. it's very unfortunate but that is what happened. >> tucker: how do you get closer to the solution if you can't have an honest conversation about it? >> if that's a fair point. we basically crunched the numbers. we mostly provide data and we just provide basic information. i think that's the best way to go. >> i think it is, too. and by the way i have no idea what your politics are. we talked a lot up on the show about the threat to free speech. it turns out it's very real. last week we interviewed a man named hon aro lopez.

he is exactly the kind of person that you would think a lot of american journalists would want to talk to. for months, they have demanded that the migrant caravan from honduras must be admitted into the united states. once it gets here it will be greatly improved by its presence. that's how immigration works. it turns out, the one we've been telling you about has been encamped in tijuana for weeks. simple question. has a caravan made tijuana better? lopez would know the answer, as his job is to represent the citizens of that city. we've invited him twice to ask about the caravan and here is some of what he told us. >> it seems that somebody is cleaning up garbage. is there a lot of trash there? >> there is a lot of trash. it grew to 6200, and so we got

another, it's a big concert hal hall. >> that was on december 3rd. ten days later, we invited lopez back onto the show to see how tijuana was doing. nobody else in the media seemed interested, and that couldn't really be used to attack donald trump. and here is what lopez told us. >> things aren't getting any better there. that weekend we had an ultimatum that are camping out here on the street, that are blocking the street. problems are going on and there has been like 280 arrests. before it was only for drug possession and being drunk in the streets and now it's

breaking and entering two homes. >> trashing the street, doing drugs in public, breaking into homes. that's not at all what cnn promised us. was that one of our white nationalists that "the new york times" was warning us about? and maybe, and this is our conclusion, there could be a lesson for the united states. it's obvious that we need more scientists and skilled engineer engineers. but that's not what we are getting, instead we are getting waves of people with high school education or less. nice people, no one doubts that but as an economic matter, this is insane. instead, our leaders demand that you shut up and accept this. even if it makes our own country poor and dirtier and more

divided. in the economy it could be preferable to import more engineers and fewer people with the lowest skills. that's what we said, that was our claim. nobody on the left date argue with it, they ignored it. instead they zeroed in on the last line. the left said we have a moral obligation to admit the world's poor. that's what we said. thanks to the efforts of the american left, the immigration policy exists for the profit and comfort of a relatively tiny number of people. everybody else gets shafted including hon aro lopez and an awful lot of people just like him. a lot of people profiting from

the don't want people to think about it too much. those who won't shut up get silenced. you have seen it a million times, it happens all the time. the enforcers scream, racist, on twitter, until everyone gets intimidated and changes the description. it won't work for the show, we are not intimidated. we plan to say what's true until the last day. the truth is, unregulated mass immigration has badly hurt this country's natural landscape. take it for the southwestern deserts if you don't believe it. thanks to immigration, huge swaths of the region are covered with garbage and waste. and each illegal border cross or leave 6-8 pounds of trash during the journey into our country. if you are interested in more detail, look at the website

they've created called arizona border trash dedicated to cleaning up the thousands of tons of garbage strewn across by illegal immigrants. the government accountability office put it this way. "illegal border activity on federal lands not only threatens people but endangered species and the land itself. illegal aliens and smugglers have destroyed cactus and other sensitive as vegetation that can take decades to recover. one land management official described in other property on arizona's border as so unsafe with resources so destroyed that it is primarily used for illegal activity and no longer visited by the general public. it's not a press release from donald trump's campaign team, it's a federal study from 2002 which was back when people could do science without getting fired for it.

the land, the water, the animals, they understand that america is beautiful because it's open and uncrowded. not so long ago, environmentalists opposed to mass immigration and they knew what the costs were. they still know, but they don't care. we do care and we will continue to tell you about it because we think you have a right to know no matter what they say. at the same time the press box about russia, more and more american companies are biting themselves. we will have details after the break. got directions to the nightclub here.

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>> tucker: there is a new side of leah mueller investigation, russia, jim comey and trace gallagher joins us tonight to wrap up all of it. >> tucker, this marks the second time in eight days that former fbi director james comey has publicly slammed president trump after testifying before a house panel concerning the 2016 investigation into hillary clinton's private email server. comey said he felt compelled to talk to journalists about the rule of law and president trump tweeting that his former lawyer michael cohen is a rat. >> the president of the united states calls a witness who is corroborating with his own justice department a wreck. say that to yourself at home and remind yourself where we have ended up. >> comey also lashed out at g.o.p. lawmakers saying they shouldn't be cowed by their base

and speak the truth, although he did not lay out what truth they should speak. that comes after rudy giuliani lambasted comey for his handling of the 2017 interview of then national security advisor michael flynn. comey admitted last week that he broke protocol because he could "get away with it." when he sent to fbi agents to the white house in january 2017 to interview flynn without going to the process. flynn did not have a lawyer and was not told that false statements in that setting could constitute a crime. watch. >> i would not be surprised a bit that the conviction of flynn is overturned because of the justice department and fbi's misconduct. >> what they did to general flynn should result in discipline. they are the ones violating the law. >> michael flynn will be sentenced tomorrow, unlikely you'll get jail time. >> as you noted many times, the

louder a ruling class huffs and puffs about russia, the greater the threat we face from china. but china the fascist of no state that it is, is really the object of great love from our ruling class. he is the latest, mckinsey and company. if you know what a consultant g firm does, call me. a recent "new york times" piece notes that mckenzie advises 22 of the largest state owned companies. get this, just this year, mckenzie held a huge corporate retreat miles away from a chinese internment camp. that's perfect. mark stein is an author and he joins us tonight. can i just point out something no one ever says?

china is -- it's a racial category and that's how they see it, it's inherently racist. how can our top company so exquisitely sensitive cozy up to a racist ethnohistory eight? it's bewildering to me. >> as you said, there are consultants and the consultant class is a race apart. stein consultancy will be willing to take your retainer to consult with you and in this case, we have a geostrategic arrival in china. russia's gdp is about an eighth of that of china, russia is no threat to us. it's a declining power and can cause mischief on its way down. china is determined to be the

dominant power of the 21st century and like germany and britain and america were competing for that position at the end of the 19th century, where they grew rich on developing products, developing products that appear l2 german people and american people and then selling them around the world, china has grown rich because western companies have made china its manufacturing plan and made it a totalitarian f no state, as you put it. there is no precedence for this in human history and the likelihood of it ending well for the west is pretty remote. that's why we are talking about russia which doesn't matter in the least, not talking about china, which does. >> tucker: it's funny because the same people who lecture us for being a moral are in business with china. mark stein, we will see you

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>> tucker: no country in the western hemisphere has failed more completely, venezuela has a lot going for it. it has a huge middle-class, and

today it can't even feed itself. you know what happened, they were obvious and predictable and disastrous consequences but that's not the whole story of what happened. six years ago the government of venezuela passed a gun band specifically designed to disarm the public. the point was to make the people powerless and it definitely did that. as one terrified venezuela and put it, people never would have believed they need is to defend themselves against the government. but of course, they did. in the past two years almost 200 protesters have been murdered by the security forces of dictator nicolas maduro. the government still has the guns of course, authoritative, authorities are not stupid. and that principle applies just as well to the united states as it does to failing socialist

states. lawmakers there have change the law to ensure that it doesn't apply to police. they know larger magazines could be helpful for defense which is why their bodyguards still have them. regular citizens have to fend for themselves. this is on nypd commissioner. there are two parts, the state of new jersey for a time made it a crime for its own officers off-duty, included off-duty, to have magazines that i think hold more than ten rounds. what was the thinking behind that? >> honestly it was worse than that. they basically did it for the entire state of new jersey, ten round capacity or less, and anything above that is a crime. when they did that -- and basically it was a cunning way to attack the legal gun owners

because, you have 8 million handguns in new york and new jersey. you have 2 million anti-assault weapons. not assault weapons but semiautomatic weapons, rifles. they have capacities of more than ten rounds, and the government took that away and they have to alter them and make those guns useless. when they do this, they also added off-duty police officers, which is completely bizarre. and it's another assault on the second amendment. more importantly you have off-duty cops and many of them carry their on-duty weapon, off-duty. if it's a 9-millimeter and it has an magazine, 13 or 14, then

it becomes illegal. if he is held criminally liable, you could be held civilly liabl liable. it's a major, major problem. >> tucker: i want to go back to something you just said a minute ago. and, you go after the small number of people who are committing it. you wouldn't intentionally target illegal gun owners who are likely to be law-abiding and in fact statistically are law abiding. >> that's about taking the guns. that's the only thing i could think of. these are legal law-abiding citizens have been vetted and the background checked, and the

government decided we are going to take every magazine in excess of ten rounds, and that's a lot of magazines. >> tucker: so if that is your goal, you take the resources from going after, and go to legal gun owners. it's not really about reducing the crime rate, is it? >> absolutely not. the bad guys don't care about your gun law. and they will have magazines that have double the capacity, it doesn't make any difference to them. and i don't know what the purpose was, and this broke on thursday or friday when the bergen county prosecutor put out a memo to the cop saying, be careful, because of this rule of

this law. they revised a revision to the law but the governor hasn't signed it. in excess of ten rounds and they are violating the state law. a teacher lost his job for refusing to submit to the pronoun police. literally lost his job. he joins us next to tell us what happened. ♪ that's not a mirage. with 60 months financing at 0%, say "happy holidays" to money well spent. if additional offers are what you desire, visit your john deere dealer before they expire. now, start up your engines and drive out of sight. new john deere equipment for all and to all a good night. see your john deere dealer today to discover more great deals and special financing offers.

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>> tucker: it's almost impossible to fire a public school teacher for incompetence. go ahead and try, and you will find out. it turns out it's very easy to get one fired for thought crimes. until recently, peter fleming taught in virginia but he was recently fired because he

refused to use male pronouns to refer to a biologically female student. he didn't use female pronouns but use the student's name and avoided the subject entirely. thank you both very much for coming on. the first question i think in many people's minds will be, did you in some way to insult the student or were you cruel to the student? was there something that you said to the student? >> not at all. i love and respect all of my students including the student in question. i did everything i could to accommodate the students new identity. i used the new name, i avoided feminine pronouns, but male pronouns were a bridge too far. but i did everything in my power to accommodate and show respect for this student in the students choices. >> tucker: so you never attacked the student or said i disagree with what the student

is doing or belittled the student or anything like that? >> not at all and it's not my place as a public school teacher to give my view on that subject. i'm a french teacher, i teach french. >> have you ever seen a case like this? >> to our understanding, this is the first time in the country. we should make clear, all we are asking for is that tolerance be two-way street. he respected the student and all he has asked for is that the respect be extended to him and his rights. pete was actually fired for what he would not say. >> so what's interesting is, and i'm taking what you are saying on faith, but i've called around and, we used a female name, and

what did they say to you and what was the response? >> the student is biologically female. >> tucker: i'm sorry, i converted it. and when the school administration understood that i wasn't willing to pronounce male pronouns when referring to the student, i was told i have to use pronouns even when the student wasn't present. so say i'm praising the student about, you know this student? , and i couldn't agree to that ultimatum. >> did at any point the question of biology arise? could you stand on science and say, i'm not attacking but i'm

using the name this person wants me to use. did you try that? >> ivory >> i reiterated my respect for the student and the students choices, but male pronouns were a bridge too far. >> tucker, we should point out that the school took a position contrary to biology. peter was given an ultimatum by the superintendent that he would need to use male pronouns. >> tucker: very quickly, is that as hard as the rest of us think it is to get a public school teacher fired for incompetence? >> good question. it was in my case obviously. i have a good record at my high school and i enjoyed teaching, i enjoyed the school

district. so this has nothing to do with incompetence, it has to do with not adopting a very specific ideology about human nature. speaking of course. you should have just been incompetent. this is a really sad and yet important story but i'm grateful that you came and told it to us. democrats gearing up for 2020, also upping their attacks based on ethnicity. mark stein will attack that of course, after the break. to your goals and needs. some only call when they have something to sell. fisher calls regularly so you stay informed. and while some advisors are happy to earn commissions whether you do well or not. fisher investments fees are structured so we do better when you do better. maybe that's why most of our clients come from other money managers.

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>> tucker: at the democratic primary race is about to begin an increasingly that party has divided the world into two groups. really the people who look in a

way that makes them virtuous and others who work in a way that makes them look sinful. a new poll of iowa democrats finds that the three favorite candidates are all of the white men. joe biden leads that race followed by bernie sanders and beto o'rourke is in third place. kristen fisher has been following and she joins us tonight. >> we are not even out of 2013 and already talking -- 2018, and already talking about 2,020. this is the pole for a caucus that is still 14 months away but it does give us a taste of what the democratic field might look like. at the top of the list, former vice president joe biden. he hasn't announced he's running but he plans to make a decision in the next two months. two weeks ago he called himself the most qualified person in the country to be president. bernie sanders also has an announced if he is running and he came in second. so that shows you at least right

now that i would democrats seem to favor these familiar faces with lots of political experience. then there's beto o'rourke, o'rourke finished third in this poll meeting out far more season candidates like elizabeth warre warren, and a senator kirsten gillibrand. she admitted she's worried that those top three candidates are all white men. she wants more diversity among the top potential candidates heading into 2020, but what seems to matter most of these i would democrats as experience. 49% say it will take a seasoned politician, not a newcomer, to win. president trump said it would be a dream to run against a biden 2020. i think he would like to run against any one on that list. >> i love that jell-o brand is

concerned. elizabeth warren is not the only one who is very concerned about the diversity of the lineup. joy reed said having the wrong and skin color is a disqualifier potentially. watch this. >> they can't run to white guys. the fact that you have joe biden talking to o'rourke, i personally find it hard to understand how you get the requisite turnout for voters of color. voters of color will say, why are we participating? >> the diversity politics cul-de-sac. this is how you know god has a sense of humor when he makes joe biden number one in the hearts of the diversity party. it's hilarious. mark stein, laugh along. [laughs] >> i know. i loved what elizabeth warren said in her speech the other

night. she said -- she told this black audience, i'm not a person of color and i haven't lived your life. in fact, she did live their life. she allowed herself to be presented at harbor harvard law school's first woman of color year after year and presumably, there is a real woman of color who could have been harvard law school's first woman. that's what's beautiful about it. i would say elizabeth warren is the whitest white since frosty the snowman fell in a vat of white out. and if she can be the first woman of color, joe biden is enough of a woman of color and, joe biden is the first woman of color. does that qualify as white man? >> seriously, i thought the idea

was, not really, he's so cutting edge that he's not. >> and he has adopted a groovy name. joe biden could easily change his name to documented biden and be running as the first muslim vice president. i mean, the elizabeth warren standard is the diversity standard. this is not identity politics, it's self identity politics. and god bless her, i love her for that. only in america can elizabeth warren be the first woman of color. the american dream in a nutshell. >> tucker: all the dreams come true in this country. mark stein, great to see you as well. as always. >> thank you, tucker. >> tucker: we will be right back

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little things can be a big deal. that's why there's otezla. otezla is not a cream. it's a pill that treats moderate to severe plaque psoriasis differently. with otezla,75% clearer skin is achievable. don't use if you're allergic to otezla. it may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. otezla is associated with an increased risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts, or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. upper respiratory tract infection and headache may occur. tell your doctor about your medicines and if you're pregnant or planning to be. otezla. show more of you. >> tucker: the hour is over, like sand through an hourglass. like all good things, it ends

before you think it will but the upside is you enjoyed it happening. we will be back tomorrow at 8:00 p.m., the show that is the sworn enemy of lying, pomposity, smugness and especially groupthink, which is a direct that to you and your family and your right to make your own decisions. we will be back in support of the free speech. good night from washington, "hannity" is next and sitting in for him tonight we are proud to report as judge jeanine pirro. >> judge pirro: good evening and welcome to the "hannity." breaking just moments ago, robert mueller has released a preflynn interview document, the official note from peter strzok and an unnamed age of surrounding their january 2017 interrogation of lieutenant general flynn. we will break this down, this development, coming