the pbr tour begins. jedediah: [laughter] rick: it begins this weekend. jedediah: but he gave it a good try. rick: we will be back. we'll see if ed is down for the rest of the weekend are you all right? we'll see you tomorrow. neil: it's a bull and a bear market. not really, but really crazy, and these wild wins in stocks, take this past week, please, the dow up nearly 750 points on friday, after falling 660 points on thursday, after starting the week up more than 200 points on monday and all of this, after soaring the record 1,086 points the day after christmas. holy christmas! will this ever end? let's just say the swing is the thing, but man oh, man enough is enough. all right well it's time to calm down, everyone and our markets have just the ideas that they think will get you feeling up,

and did president trump just pull a clint eastwood and dare congress to make my day? now, contemplating building that wall with or without congress. democrats might not like the idea but these border guys sure do. why brandon jud who just stood next to the president is standing by the president on this one, because this border enforcer is here and only here, and get used to special counsel robert mueller being here for a while. try the summer, yeah, an investigation that lurks into the summer. yeah it's getting hotter all right, and former u.s. attorney andrew mccarthy is hot on what could be next, and ripping romney. >> when romney wants to tear down the president's character he's sort of puffing himself. in the end i think there's going to be a backlash to this. neil: republican senator rand paul storming over that op-ed attacking the president. what does louisiana republican senator john kennedy make of it we'll ask because he's here too,

and did you hear how these democratic congressman want wait to impeach the president? what democrat mark penn can't wait to tell why she's making a huge mistake, and forget 2019 the race for 2020 is already here, my friends, because look where democratic senator elizabeth warren already is on the campaign trail. in iowa. so much news to get to, so let's get to it. you know, the only thing i'm bummed about is we only have two hours to do this with a lot of ground to cover so everyone pay attention. happy weekend everybody i am neil cavuto. well you think this was a wide ride on wall street, brace yourself for what could happen on monday when these chinese trade talks resume. let's get a sense of the craziness in these markets. where we stand on this young new year, lauren simonetti. lauren: i only have 90 seconds to do this so these crazy markets let's show you the wild

week that we had on wall street so the dow was up on monday and wednesday, and it then dropped 660 points on thursday that was the second trading day of 2019 only to swing back up 746 points on friday. are you dizzy yet? investors watching the ongoing tensions with china, now bleeding on to corporate balance sheets, apple big story gets a fifth of its revenue from china, ceo tim cook sending a bombshell warning to investors saying we did not foresee the magnitude of the economic deceleration particularly in greater china adding that we believe the economic environment in china has been further impacted by rising trade tensions with the united states. well that prompted apple to make a rare cut to its revenue guidance, sending its shares down the most in six years. well, apple has been mostly spared from the tariffs thus far auto maker ford has not. ceo jim hackett said tax penalt ies on steel and aluminum cost ford $1 billion last year and that pain only exacerbated

by a double-digit slow down in car sales in china. there's also a concern of a growing backlash against american brands as this 90 day trade truce between washington and beijing agreed to at the g20 summit, that expires march 1. news that both sides will hold talks on monday and tuesday listing markets on friday and then this. the jobs report, 312,000 jobs added in december, that was the most in 10 months with big gains in some recently softening sectors like manufacturing, plus more americans feeling confident that they could find work, that sent the unemployment rate to 3.9%. this data is viewed as a sign that the u.s. economy is not slowing, as much as feared. now, the report also showed wages rising, that's great for workers but it's something the federal reserve is certainly watching so all in bottom line, neil we have conflicting signals we have a china slow down bleeding on to our corporate

balance sheets and we have 312,000 jobs being added in the month of december, neil. neil: and the federal reserve that's going to at least hold back for a while while it sort of weighs all of this thank you, lauren very very much. just when you think you weather ed enough news of the markets to digest now of course besides the china talks that are back on, we have word that that mueller investigation, triading another six months to it. yeah, another six months. fox news correspondent ellison barber on that. reporter: so the white house president trump and his allies talk about the need for the special counsel's probe to wrap up they say it has gone on for far too long but a federal judge's latest move suggest it's likely to continue for the next several months. the federal grand jury being used by special counsel robert mueller's team has been extended sources close to the chief federal judge in washington's u.s. district court tellings fox news that the judge extended the grand jury's term the original term was 18 months and it was set to expire friday, sources in

the courthouse are not confirm ing exactly how long this extension is, whether it's for another six months but typically the grand jury's term caps out around 24 months, president trump of course has criticized the special counsel and since it began he denies any sort of collusion between russia and his campaign and he reiterated that this week in the rose garden. president trump: there was no collusion. i didn't need russians to help me win iowa. i didn't need russians to help me win the great state of wisconsin and michigan and pennsylvania. i won them because i went there and i campaigned hard. reporter: democrats and some republicans say there needs to be legislation to protect mueller and the work he is doing here is senator elizabeth warren in iowa. >> i think it is absolutely essential that we protect the mueller investigation. the special prosecutor has already produced more than two

dozen indictments or guilty pleas. our job right now in congress is to protect that investigation and we need bipartisan legislation to do that. reporter: neil? neil: all right, ellison thank you very very much. well, you have all of these wild swings on all of these developments and more developments to come so more wild swings to come after that so you can't blame investors for saying i don't know whether it's a good time to get in or get out or just run far far as far away. and we have the market analyst and we've also got fox news contributor jonas max ferris and susan li. begin with you on the craziness of the week and what you're hearing from individual investor s and those who serve them who are probably a little anxious. >> yeah, well that's true, but i think the bar has been set so low for the first quarter, given that no one thinks there is a trade deal between the u.s. and china, and of course the apple news sentiment as well but a

huge stock rally on friday told me something a little bit different i was talking to investors on the floor at the new york stock exchange taking a look at what i call the internal market dynamics when you look at the up ratio of stocks traded 30 :1 to decliners on that day, and that's to send the stock markets into positive territory in the first week of 2019. i think that's encouraging for the rest of this year. >> you know, susan i'm not buying into the fact that we're not going to have a deal with china. i think and i've been saying we are going to have a deal with china and not necessarily because president trump needs it or the united states needs it. china needs it, so there's enormous pressure on china's leaders to get a deal done with the united states, which ultimately is going to benefit china and going to benefit the global economy. >> i said other people thought there wasn't going to be a deal. i think there's going to be a deal as well with that meeting with president trump later on this month. neil: but you know, friday was a great day. thursday was not so great a day on the fears that china was

slowing down and of course the apple warning, and everything else, so wouldn't it be a kick if i repeated on this show and others that, you know, we score a trade deal but china is too weak to make good on it. >> well i guess that remains to be seen. they're going to continue to try to pump up their own economy which gives signs that maybe they're nod ready to make a deal yet and that could prolong the market making new highs again and if it runs into the summer of this year, until we make a deal or even the fall of this year until we get a deal done i don't think it's going to be good for the market. i'm very bullish on the market long term but it remains to be seen because if there is a stall an indefinite stalin the trade talks it definitely will effect the market but right now we're holding the uptrend. we're not and let me explain why 2017 was such a big rally and such an anomaly year that you cannot say that a 20% pullback means that it's in a down trend because of 2017, so the fact is we are still holding the market

so people are still in, i don't think that they should panic. neil: all right, we're also monitoring another development watch closely. this government shutdown that now enters its third week. there has been a sighting of the vice president outside the eisenhower office building used to be called the old executive office building next to the white house where he will be meeting with we're told some congressional leaders we just don't know who they are. is this having any effect? >> these political things are not as big as what's with china. the point was just raised 99 was a big year in the stock market and didn't stop the first 20% in 2000 from becoming a 50% slide so that in itself won't cause a problem but i think the bigger question is how weak can china get without dragging us into a recession and i think it is a global recession it's going to be hard to dodge that but i also think china can go down to say without taking us down. first of all we're going into this trade war with a stimulus package in the form of tax cuts and spending. the last big economy to go down so to say was actually japan. trump used to talk about that in

the 80s. their markets still down half from 89 and their economy has never really recovered. we had a mild recession when they went down, but we had a tax increase and no new taxes read my lips and also the snl crisis. we don't have a bank crisis or a tax increase. that means we can handle one major country because again japan was a big deal back then. >> we had a lot more debt. >> yeah, well china has a lot of debt too as long as the chinese economy slows down and doesn't spread if apple starts talking about every country there's no sales then we can start talking about that. >> i thought the apple news was really concerning because arguably the most successful u.s. company operating in china that build most of their smartphones in the country and this is something that tim cook, you know, was one of his merits stepping into the job for steve jobs, when he took over at apple , because they couldn't get into china until cook took over, so i'm really concerned as to what that says about the underlying chinese economy. neil: even the council of the economic advisors he smiles a

lot so i don't get too alarm when he says dire things because he's smiling as he says it but one of the things he said, mostly was there are going to be a lot of companies reporting exposure to china and it's going to impact their earnings. now, they might a good man it of them i use it as an excuse but it's palpable. what are we likely to see? >> i think when first quarter earnings start in the next couple weeks we'll see what happens but remember apple didn't have good earnings before they came out with this last week. the last quarter of 2018 they got down and never recovered since then. they've been selling off. neil: this is about revenues right? most companies would love to have the revenues that apple does. >> but apple is still a strong company, apple isn't going anywhere they could turnaround like that. neil: would you recommend apple? >> not to buy right now. neil: dan would you? >> actually i would. i do think there's runway with apple. i think part of this is a little bit of hedging on apple's part because they want to hedge against what's going to happen with china which the outcome is, a little uncertain right now but

i still believe that there is going to be a deal and i think, neil that we have to give president trump some credit here that he is not a president that's kicked the can down the road like all the other presidents before him have. everybody has complained about china's tariffs and their tactics and stealing intellectual property. i think it is going to work out. i truly believe that. >> he's motivated to get it to work out because he wants to run for re-election and get re-elected in 2020 so he's motivated to get it done by then and it's going to be hard to see that anyone in the country even the democrats that hate his guts would say anything negative because it would be the one thing if he stands his ground, which he's trying to do, if he stands his ground, he will go down in modern history as one of the greatest presidents for having done this, because it will -- neil: but depends on the deal. >> well he's trying to make a good deal. if he was going to cave he would have by now i think. neil: we'll take a quick break because i know you'll be back, minus susan, thank you susan.

in the meantime we do know by the way the vice president has arrived at the eisenhower executive office building next to the white house that looks like the homeland security secretary is with him of course she's in charge of that wall, whatever will come to be, and whatever funding the president wants to see in excess of $5 billion here, congressional leaders are going to be gathering as well at that building. we don't know what and who is going to be there or what they're going to be pushing in this latest. we do know that they're working on a saturday and joining us to do it. we're also getting the view from a border patrol expert on what's at stake for the nations safety. he too, not getting paid through this, but he says it's worth it for the cause, after this. [cell phone rings] where are you? well the squirrels are back in the attic.

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president trump: it's i.c.e. and border patrol and a man whose really become a friend in a sense, brandon, i will say this,

brandon judd has been in terms of justice for people, in terms of fairness, and in terms of the toughness that you need. neil: all right that comes from the president of the united states for brandon judd, the national border council patrol president, unlike some of the others effected by this government shutdown isn't getting paid through this process and he says it's fine with him because of the greater cause at stake. he joins us right now brandon very good to have you thank you for coming in. thank you for having me. neil: where do you think the shutdown first of all goes and how long it goes, because it could mean, you know, your paychecks are held back for quite a while. >> it's going to mean that, but let's, neil, we first have to understand that the american public has spoken. they want border security, and for my standpoint from a 21-year veteran border patrol agent, my standpoint is that if we can have a shutdown for long lasting border security that secures the

american public's future, i'm all for it. i'm going to give in, i'm going to sacrifice for that because that's what the american public wants. that's what my children want that's what my family wants and that's what the vast majority of people in this country want. they want border security and we're willing to give that to them. neil: but do you think that whatever the president is envisioning is going to be enough? if you think about it brandon, the fight over the $5 billion, is actually a fight over a continuing down payment on something that will eventually cost in excess of $25 billion, right? >> well, if we saw that the democrats actually had a plan to physically keep people from crossing the border illegally, we're not talking about legal immigration, it's illegal immigration, if they had a plan to physically keep people out, we could get behind that. they don't. what this president is talking about, he's talking about the proper mixture of infrastructure which is the wall, he's talking ability the proper mixture of personnel, our agents, and he's

giving that to us, he's working to get that for us, which will ensure long lasting border security which is again what we're working for and what we want. neil: now the president has said if he doesn't succeed in trying to get this impasse resolved, he might just go ahead and claim financial emergency and start building it himself. how do you feel about that? >> you know i was with him in the oval office for about 45 minutes, our meeting lasted about 45 minutes and when we were talking to him, he said that's what the american public needs to hear. let's go tell the american public exactly what you just said. what we're seeing is we're see ing that this president is willing to think outside the box he's willing to say this is what i need to do and this is how i'm going to do it. you were just talking about china. some of your guests were saying he's going to hold this down and do the right thing and that's exactly what he's doing on border security. if he's not going to get it

through kong congress he's looking for other ways to do it. neil: so you would support his claiming the national emergency to get this thing done? >> absolutely if again, if it's going to give us border security , we're going to support that. we're going to support the shutdown. we're going to support national emergency. in 2014 the democrats said that we had a crisis at the border. well we're right back at that same point, so why aren't they saying that we have this crisis? why aren't they saying this is what we need? we need more personnel. we need a wall. we need physical barriers. they were for it before but all of a sudden they're not for it and frankly i think it's because they refuse to give him what they would consider a win going into 2020 but frankly, if i was a democratic strategist, i would be the first one to say we got to secure the border because the republicans continue to use that as a talking point in the democrats are always behind the 8 ball on it. neil: brandon thank you very much. brandon judd, national border

patrol council president. there's a new senator in town in washington d.c., his name is mitt romney you might have heard of him why even fellow republicans are saying i'm criticizing the president you just blew it and actually you look like a phony little worm, louisiana republican senator john kennedy on that, after this when i say, "drivers who switched from geico to esurance saved an average of $412," you probably won't believe me. but you can believe this, real esurance employee nancy abraham. look her up online. esurance, it's surprisingly painless.

i am a techie dad.n. i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. >> senator romney to come into the senate and even before he's sworn into call the president dishonest is not productive and i think that it's going to back fire on him. neil: you said worst things senator when you were running against mr. trump for president, politics is politics i understand that but you said i

think there is a sophomore quality about mr. trump about his response to attack people, and their appearance, short, tall, fat, ugly this is back in september 2015 now i know that was when you were running against him, but is that fair game? >> that was coming from a short guy running against him in the republican primary. no, i think things are different and the tenor is different when you're competing for the same office in the same election. i don't say that it's not so i had some choice words and i still have some choice disagreements with the president on occasion but since he's been elected president, i try not to have personal character assassination or attacks on him. neil: and that's something different according to rand paul , mitt romney blew it and failed to acknowledge he's now the president of the united states and there's a way to handle that and a way not to handle that and he didn't like the way that mitt romney handled that. wonder what the republican senator of louisiana john kennedy thinks of that. he's with us right now senator good to have you. what do you think of what rand

paul was saying? >> well, one of the things i like about rand paul is he doesn't bubble wrap anything. look, mitt romney is whip smart. he's a good guy. he's enormously talented but for the millions and millions of americans who are better off today than they were two years ago, his op-ed piece, his behavior was about as popular as head lice. >> [laughter] >> i mean, i get it. neil: right. >> he finds the president abrasive and maybe he doesn't even like him. i don't know, but -- neil: well he liked him enough to entertain being his secretary of state, maybe he was still chasing at not getting chosen for that, rex tillerson was, he's since left but it just strikes me as romney being all over the map on this, and appearing very phony. >> well, i just don't understand and i haven't had a

chance to talk to him at length about it yet but i will. what senator romney expects us to do about it. i mean, we've only got one president and by the way, he was elected by the american people and it just seems to me it would behoove all of us to try to help him succeed. i mean, you can disagree with somebody without basically calling them an ignorant slut. neil: but you know what he did though? i think this backfired on him, senator i don't know the degree to which you agree to that but he thought maybe he could carve out a lot of political analysts have been telling me sort of of the former ohio governor, john kasich ic taking on the president, speaking for those in the party the establishment whatever you want to call it, it's still not too happy with donald trump in the white house but he is in the white house. he enjoys overwhelming support from republicans that he is in the white house, and leave it at that and he is still chasing at that.

>> i mean, well trump also has a great story to tell. look, look what's happened in two years. we've cut taxes, we've deregulated the economy, wages are up 3.2%, we strengthened our military, we're standing up to russia and china and north korea and iran. neil: well to be fair, mitt romney did commend him, you're right it was a very short and to the point comendation but i'm wondering how mitt romney is going to be received now among fellow republicans or given your 52-48 engine the senate not a lot of wiggle room anyway. >> well i can tell you how i'm going to receive it. look i'm happy senator romney is in the senate. i mean it. i think he's enormously talented guy. i want to work with him. i just disagree with him on this and i think that he will not be as productive for our country and for our state of utah if he

continually goes around and makes personal comments about the president. look, i disagree with the president on some things, and i'll agree on occasion, his style is not exactly my style, but i'm less interested in process than i am results, and i'm pretty happy with the results. neil: and you also speak your mind very clearly, i commend you for that. senator we're just learning now that sarah sanders is passing on the following information on these meetings going on next door at the eisenhower executive office building to the white house, quoting here the acting chief of staff, mick mulvaney has invited the white house senior staff to camp david to lay out the administration's 2019 priorities. the president will apparently join the team and lead meetings on sunday. is any of this a side sign that this government shutdown and his

impasse can be addressed or are they just moving on to other things because they're not confident they will? >> neil, i'm not at all saying they will be able to work this out any time soon i wish i could be but here is why. speaker pelosi is negotiating for the democrats, obviously president trump for the republicans. speaker pelosi hates trump more than she likes border security. president trump likes border security a lot more than he dislikes ms. pelosi and i just think as long as speaker pelosi 's running the show, we're not going to get it worked out. i think to get this worked out, chuck schumer who has supported a wall consistently until recently and mitch mcconnell are going to have to get involved. i know that my good friend senator graham is trying to work a deal to exchange border wall for daca amnesty. i need to study on that one. i mean, we've had six amnesties

since 1986 and every time the american people will tell look if you'll just support amnesty one more time we'll seal the border. well we haven't sealed the border, and if we're going to talk amnesty i want to also talk merit-based immigration, and mandatory e-verify and getting rid of the visa lottery and a border wall, and a lot of other things too. i mean, i wish i'd could be more optimistic but i look at speaker pelosi, she's gone from border walls don't work to border walls are immoral and in effect she's saying border walls represent a human rights abuse. well, they do work, they're working in el paso and in san diego, they're working on the west bank in israel, they're working between north korea and south korea so i just don't see any common ground here. neil: all right, thank you very much, senator i always

appreciate your frankness whether people agree or disagree they're never in doubt of where you're coming from, happy new year. in the meantime here we do want to let you know that the 2020 presidential race is on. you're looking at iowa where guess whose campaigning? elizabeth warren. more after this. (rooster morning call) this is your wake-up call. if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. humira can help stop the clock. prescribed for 15 years, humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. humira can lower your ability to fight infections. serious and sometimes fatal infections including tuberculosis, and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions and new or worsening heart failure. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to

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the new sleep number 360 smart bed. it senses your movement and automatically adjusts to keep you both comfortable. it's the final days of the lowest prices of the season. the queen sleep number 360 c4 smart bed is only $1299. ends sunday. neil: you know, we were just talking about sioux city, during the break i don't want to repeat but it's a beautiful city and it is a hot bed of political

activity right now with elizabeth warren there part of a multi-state stop or multi-town stop in that state. of course the iowa caucuses kickoff there, jimmy carter made them famous in 1976 he actually was second i believe, right, at the time and that was good enough to launch his presidential campaign move on to new hampshire and ultimately the democratic nomination and the white house, so elizabeth warren may be hoping to reignite that. and we have the wall street journal with us. jillian and ed i'll begin with you on the importance of iowa and the importance of the message of a very progressive populous message at the same time, elizabeth warren, how is she likely to be received there. she's going to have lots of company soon. >> yeah, i think it's an up hill battle the controversy of

her releasing the dna test really did hurt her with the constituency that i think she really needs and again we're looking at the 2020 field this is extraordinarily crowded and part of the disadvantage for her at this time is she's become an establishment in candidate and you've got a lot of up and comer s. races like this where it is so crowded always, offer an opportunity for a wildcard candidate so i would say she's got a challenge. neil: what do you think? >> well no disrespect to the people of iowa, i love them, i spent time there, but the road to that temporary public housing unit at 1600 pennsylvania avenue runs through south carolina. let me tell you why. nearly 60% of the people who cast their vote in the democratic primary in south carolina will be african americans. african american voters are the gay way to the democratic nomination and the states that follow south carolina from a map perspective those numbers, those demographics are very reflective

of those states so while iowa is important and bernie sanders did well in iowa if you look at what happened in south carolina it saved hillary clinton's nomination and launched her to the white house and if you look at barack obama in 2008 primary it was battleground south carolina. neil: but he won iowa. it might be real. >> he did not runaway. neil: no you're right. >> and if you look at the possibility of two maybe three african american candidates in the race, that makes it there. neil: so you think it's south carolina but neil let me ask you one thing that's clear no matter who runs and we're going to see a lot of people running, what will be consistent is the very progressive medicare for all. >> go ahead. neil: not with everyone, but it is a popular theme within the party. >> absolutely. neil: do you think that is going to be the call of the eventual nominee? >> i do think it's going to be. it's going to be hard for them to get their winning coalition

together, i mean, you're shaking your head no, but clearly, the energy on the democratic side is towards these very costly ever- more intrusive policies, and unfortunately, there's never been a realistic argument that these things make sense. in $22 trillion debt that's where we are now, right? medicare has been and medicare is the biggest future obligation we have. neil: but healthcare was an issue and to his credit, he did see the republican issue 2018. >> absolutely. neil: do you argue that us could emerge from this field without advocating medicare for all? >> let me tell you what's going to dominate the day. the same thing that dominates the 2018 cycle for democrats, bread and butter issue, barber shop beauty salon issues. neil: that's not what i asked. do you think medicare for all will be deemed to the the nominee? >> it's going to be a thing

that some are going to beat their drum on but it will not be the deciding factor. neil: you don't think the nominee that emerges who does not support medicare for all is going to have a chance? >> and they decide on the factors how do you address the issue that 79% of the american people care about and that's cost and 55% care about access. those are going to be the things and strengthening in the aca and making sure in seven states where the nominee will likely be decided how do you get around the issue expanding medicaid because in the south where states do not expand medicaid you have hundreds of thousands of people who do not access to affordable quality health care because the republicans -- neil: but bottom line healthcare will be at issue do you think that will be it? >> but i think it's going to be a dominant issue and also there's a really interesting dynamic happening right now so the democratic party is the anti-trump party that's what's defining them and i think that as they do that, they're being pushed further and further left. we're seeing resurge enter socialistic far left wing of the party, and i think that the risk here for democrats is that

they're going to stake out fairly extreme positions to appeal to that very active base, and in the meantime, are going to end up isolating a lot of the more moderate voters so that's something they keep an eye on. >> you all made that argument during the mid-terms democrats aren't for anything, only anti-trump and the voters spoke loud and clear. because we staked out probably -- >> but i do think that -- >> the governor's race is 300 legislative seats i can go on and on and on about our successes but the point was we put together a policy agenda that spoke to what the american voters wanted. neil: but neither you nor republicans have ever come up with a way of how to pay for any of this. >> we don't need to necessarily pay for medicare for all. what we need to do -- neil: but you do. you do need to come up with a plan to pay for something. >> but then house democrats do next week and that's strengthen the things that republicans want to rip apart. >> but they're doing it in a way that will add trillions of

dollars more to our debt. >> you all ran the debt clock up so much over the past two years and that is enough. neil: by the way, you know, republicans too but they're rich to talk about how much things cost when in fact the deficit is going to exceed $1 trillion this year, so no one seems to be coming up with ways to reign that in. >> but neil, i would, if senate republicans had relinquished the filibuster on passing legislation, they would not have had to accommodate senate democrats excessive request for domestic spending to match the military build up that the president made. neil: we'll follow-up on that just a reminder, carl icon the world famous investor was famous for saying neil, if i ran a business the way washington runs ours, i'd fire everybody and start from scratch. and he doesn't have the power to do that but this man who rarely talks to the media is talking to us in an exclusive interview, arguably one of the most successful investors in

investment history and a good friend of the president, although he has been known now and then to rip the president, has some criticisms of his own, he will be joining me on fox business network at noon on monday. be there. more after this.

neil: paying respects to the slain police officer as he is laid to rest today, and now on the latest from modesto, california. claudia? reporter: good to see you, good morning neil. the body has just arrived at the church, the bagpipes played and mourners have started to gather for a memorial service and a seven mile funeral that will include thousands of law enforcement officers from around the country and even from canada for a second day, they are paying their last respects to corporal sing who was gunned down during a traffic stop a day after christmas. he was just 33 and a seven-year veteran of the police department and a small force outside

modesto with just 12 officers. yesterday, a procession carried singh's body to newman for an honor guard visitation and vigil thousands remembered the native of fiji, who got hooked on the tv show cops and wanted nothing more than to become a police officer in the united states. ron cloward helped train him as a canine officer. >> he was really proud of being a police officer and he was proud of wearing his red, white and blue flag on his uniform and he was proud to be an american. reporter: the surveillances in the case was arrested on december 28 and has not entered a plea. a judge has ordered an evaluation to determine whether he's confident competent to stand trial. seven others are also accused of trying to help him evade police. he was in the u.s. illegally and police believe he was trying to flee to his native mexico. everyone is back in court on february 7 but today is about corporate singh, and the wife

and five month old son he leaves behind for thousands of police officers it is as though they have lost a brother in fact most of these officers here are wearing the black mourning stripe over their badge, but with corporal singh's badge number 282. back to you. neil: thank you very very much. switching over to washington d.c., that relates to this incident here the president uses this as a reminder why we need a wall and better border security and the vice president is meeting with a number of leaders or leaderrer's aids we're told to try to make sure that the funding arrives for that wall, no matter how long this partial government shutdown, whatever you want to call it, goes, right now it is entering its 15th day, we'll have more after this. how much horse power does this thing got? doing great dad! looking good babe! are you filming? at booking.com, we can't guarantee you'll be any good at that water jet thingy...

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neil: all right you're looking live at elizabeth warren one of the earliest democrats in the presidential race she's campaign ing as we speak in iowa and she's getting a lot of attention in her party it's going to be a crowded field we're told maybe two dozen or more prominent candidates quite a few senators, representatives at the very least, some governor s you name it they're all in the mix former reagan economic advisor art laffer with me right now and we know him and the attach to the republican policies with art but the little secret is he did like a lot of what bill clinton did but he doesn't like these far left big progressive-type prescriptions for the economy am i right about that? >> that is right. basically, neil government spending is taxation, and when you get a very much bigger government as many of these people want to do, it's the government that's big enough to give you everything you ever wanted is also big enough to take everything you ever had and that's the real fear of big government, it hurts the economy and it doesn't improve the

people's lots who they try to do now with elizabeth warren she's a very very accomplished person with a wonderful resume, great history, and she's very articulate but i think she's wrong on these issues and i'd love to sit down with her some time in private by the way and without any strings attached or anything and just talk about these with her, because i'm sure if she went through this stuff carefully she'd realize that a lot of the things she's aspous ing, aren't really what the nation needs it would actually hurt the country. neil: there is a suspicion among the prominent presidential entrants on the left and those who just come to power in washington who are very leary of business interest elizabeth warren, very leary of financial institutions, gouging consumers she of course is behind this consumer protection bureau. sure. neil: and there is a suspicion that business guys left to their own devices gouge the little guy and that seems to be the populous theme that they will be

pounding, and again, congresswoman cortez's view, they have to pay up more, and the rich have to pay up more, and that will be their central theme. what do you make of that? >> well there are two things on that thesis, neil if i may. number one, there's no question that greed sometimes leads to exploitation and leads to taking advantage of consumers and that does happen from time to time. i don't believe that's the big issue. now i believe far greater issue now is government control and stopping the progressive movement of businesses to create better products more distribution et cetera. i mean that i think is by far the most important fear coming about on that side. now when you look at some of these progressives, they want to raise taxes to get more money from the rich. i don't disagree with their objective at all, neil, but i want to get more money from the rich by lowering taxes. the one thing we know from the u.s. history for the last century is every time we've

lowered tax rates on the highest 1% of income earners we've collected more revenues from them directly, not counting all the additional revenues that have come in. if you look at the 2017 tax bill , that took effect on january 1, 2018, federal government revenues are not down now corporate tax revenues are down but all the other revenues are substantially up and more than compensate for the corporate tax revenues being down. that's what we've always argued. if you want more revenues, you can't collect money on the backs of those people who are unemployed or leave your jurisdiction, so while she's right in wanting more money from the rich and i agree with her you've got to do it by lowering tax rates and letting them produce more rather than raising tax rates and discouraging them from reporting income and causing unemployment and despair neil: all right, art laffer thank you very much, as art was speaking we popped up these images coming from paris. there they're having complaints about whether it's a fair economic system that the rich

are getting all of the goodies and everyone else is getting screwed. they don't like it, ninth weekend in a row we've seen these protests they don't like the government, they don't like how they've been hosed and they feel the government isn't listen ing to them or anyone else more after this. ♪ there goes our first big order. ♪ 44, 45, 46... how many of these did they order? ooh, that's hot. ♪ you know, we could sell these. nah. ♪ ...

>> all right. welcome back, everybody. this government shutdown is now entering its third week. the vice-president, we know, is going to be meeting with congressional leader aides. i want to stress not congressional leaders, but their aides. kevin is at the white house with the latest on where all of this is going. hey, kevin. >> hey, buddy. i'm just checking my phone because we're getting lots of different information as the day goes on, but i can just tell you this, the white house has really been pretty straightforward on this. they say the focus is getting down to business this weekend. the vice-president is here, as you pointed out, neil. in fact, as i arrived a couple of hours ago, they had the streets blocked off, as you would, for the motorcade.

and you're right it's the aides, working group over in the eeob. and let me tell you what the president is talking about, we need democrats to do their job as well. he says the democrats can solve the shutdown problem in a very short period of time. all they have to do is approve real border security, including a wall, something which everyone, other than drug dealers, human traffickers, and criminals, want very badly. this would be so easy to do. and so, as we enter day 15 of the partial shutdown, the vice-president, as mentioned, heading up that working group over the eeob. that's the eisenhower executive office building for the uninitiated, adjacent to the white house. yesterday in the situation room, neil. the president and key stake holders from both parties sought common ground, but little progress towards the impasse. the white house says the focus of the collaboration, manifestly clear. fix a burgeoning crisis along

the border and to do that, they say, we must build a wall. >> our aim will be to find a solution, not just simply to end the government shutdown, to provide funding, to end the crisis at our southern border, to achieve real border security and to build a wall. >> and build a wall. you're going to hear that a lot. not just today and not just for the political angle that you might imagine, but because ice, border patrol and dhs says that's the only way to secure the southern border. one quick note, sara sanders, the press secretary says the president will make his way up to camp david as the work continues to end the shutdown. neil: kevin, thank you very much. we're entering our third week, the 15th day of the shutdown. the record for a government shutdown partial or otherwise, 21 days, that of course in 1995.

and chad joins us right now. how long this could be dragging on. this looks likely to break that record, chad. what do you think? >> yes, that could be possible and it's remarkable, neil, that it took two-weeks to have partial talks on the government shutdown. house republicans passed with 5 billion in border full funding, the senate couldn't act and everything slipped into a deep cryogenic freeze over the holidays. and they criticized the house majority not keeping the house open. and the republicans, passed their bill before they headed home when they had the majority. house republicans are not criticizing the senate republicans who adjourned until tuesday. i want you to look at optics of yesterday's rose garden meeting. mccarthy and steve scalise stood

there and mcconnell returned, and before christmas, the president wouldn't sign and there was a veto threat. and some said the group is too large for a settlement and there's issue for money to pay for the wall. i spoke with the chair of the armed services committee. and he noticed that lawmakers and president pushed for an increase in defense spending last year and got it in march and now smith fears that stripping that money from the military would harm readiness and invite more military accidents. and there's a question if the president could shift the money around without congressional approval and smith says he doesn't feel they can, neil. neil: is it your sense that the mitch mcconnell thing was a deeper rift than we're led to believe? every republican leader might-- mcconnell would have stuck around to join the president in

the rose garden. is he stewing over that? >> he's made it clear, if you look the a the language yesterday, this is something that has to be able to get 60 votes in the senate, something the president has to be able to sign. now, look at the two bills that the house movedment under republican watch, $5 billion bill. that was a partisan vote. look at bills that the democrats have just moved this week. they actually moved bipartisan bills to reopen the government. seven republicans voted yes on one, five republicans on the other. but mcconnell knows that they can't get that through the senate because they need 60 votes and frankly, he might even have a bigger problem now, one thing you know, just to bring along nine democrats. he now has a larger republican majority, and so, in some respects it might be harder to get to 60 votes. so mcconnell probably does feel burned because he would not have put that bill on the floor before christmas if he didn't think there was the wink and nod or hand signal from the white house, the president was going to sign it so i've been told by sources up here that mcconnell has taken a step back and nancy

pelosi, the new house speaker is leading the charge. neil: no one is giving up the fight. chad, thank you very much, my friend. then there's this issue of that wall and how important it is, even in the event of the declaring a national emergency. take a look. >> so you would support his claiming a national emergency to get this thing done? >> absolutely. it's, again, if it's going to give us border security, we're going to support that. we're going to support the shutdown, we're going to support a national emergency. neil: all right. brandon judd is among many border officials and others who are not getting paid throughout this and he says he's fine with this. the kids maybe not fine with it when he doesn't show up on christmas morning, but his point was and remains that this is worth the fight. it's a fight that could last quite a while. some said months, some said years, if no one blinks. the years part might be extreme, but it gives you an idea how

extreme both sides are on this issue. we've gott antwan and jillian. and where might the dea light potentially be? >> if i were crafting a deal and wanted a solution, what i would do is wall funding in exchange for legal status, legal clarification for the dreamers. i think that's an easy thing for both parties to bring back to their constituents, but what-- >> but they have kicked that around. >> what we have both sides are apaling r peeling to the base. both sides want immigration, on one hand the wall, operate other side, the trump administration, appealing to their bases, something they can campaign on going into 2020 so i actually think in some respects there's a perverse incentive not to come up with the solution or a deal like this and that's part of what is prolonging this shutdown fight. neil: and the president argued that the name of the national emergency he can go ahead and

start on this himself. a number of generals, with whom we've spoken on the various networks, fox business, and-- >> i actually do. neil: there you go. and saying, you know, that's while we support the president on this wall thing we're not comfortable with that. your thoughts where that could go. >> i can understand why the generals would be uncomfortable with that, because it sets a rather dangerous precedent, especially in terms of funding our military and of course, the president fought hard for rebuilding our military, which it really, we really did need to do in many respects. and i-- >> but taking the funds from somewhere else. >> he would be taking them from presumably, it's a state of emergency, it would be, the military deals with those kinds of emergencies, ultimately, would come from military funding, certainly the way i understand it in terms. budget. i wouldn't take it from that, but i think that's where the president would have to go. i agree with jillian. i think the political motivations on both sides are

clearly leading them to be more adamant about their positions. interestingly enough, with the change in the majority in the house, it was republicans on the far right who opposed an amnesty, what they perceived as amnesty for daca beneficiaries. that obstacle in the house is gone now because we have a democratic majority who will surely vote for some form of legal path to citizenship. the president has said he supports that, that was one of his pillars. i think that probably you could make an argument for a package of votes in the senate that would support that. so, i think the daca piece probably could be accommodated by the republicans. neil: not anytime soon. >> i think the president should make those arguments because whoever makes the better arguments to the public will prevail in this impasse because everybody is monitoring what's going on. >> a couple of things, this manufactured outrage and

manufactured crisis we see from republicans all is happening because donald trump campaigned that mexico is going to pay for some wall structure and it was red rhetoric to the base. and now federal workers and his staff are getting pay raises and government workers may not be able to feed their families because of-- >> keep in mind, the last continuing resolution. >> the democrats-- >> the last continuing resolution to the president and twitter roast me because of it. neil: no, we will. >> 1.4 billion dollars for border wall security, whatever i wants to do with it. less than 10% of the money is spent. so here we are shutting down the federal government asking for additional. >> the government funding. but react to this. listen, i'm trying to get you to react to this. the president just tweeted the democrats want billions of dollars for foreign aid, but

don't want to spend a small fraction of that number to secure our border. politically we're saying this is on the president and he said earlier this would be on him and earlier he reversed this. do you think that democrats risk being blase' about the border? >> up until this point we've had border security and the wall are two separate issues and now the president wants to merge the two. and what the democrats are saying until they're blue in the face, we are for border security. and the last sent to the president by durbin and graham and second one by mccain, by bipartisan and reform package-- >> and what, the wall, what if we called it the marshmallow? >> first of all, i think the democrats made their priorities straight early this week. crawl before you walk. let's open up the government. direction is more important than speed. >> that sets a political path.

>> that's going to the trump administration saying we're going to keep the government open, but in order for you to do this we're going to have you give up all of your-- >> and open up to the members before-- i'm old enough to remember, a few weeks ago bipartisan senate, democrats and republicans passed a bill to keep the government open and the president torpedoed. so let's have-- >> you're old enough. neil: bottom line, i could really see this going on for quite a while here and unintended consequences. >> 2020 republicans start to feel the pressure. we've seen two already say, you know what? >> you don't think the democrats are feeling the --. a police officer is being laid to rest today and he was allegedly shot by an illegal and you don't think people will say, we cannot understand the democrat's position. >> the democrats want to open the government, the republicans do not. neil: do you think that whatever advantage democrats glean they're getting from this from the president owning a shutdown,

that it's going to boomerang on them? >> i don't because i think the american people hear loud and clear what democrats want. let's do what we need-- >> a record one and a quarter million immigrants came into this country last year. and that happened under president trump, who supposedly the statue liberty is crying and devastated, but legal immigration was at a record last year. so i'm beginning to wonder whether this works against democrats. that's all i'm saying. >> i think it's a bad idea to own a shutdown. a bad idea to come out and say-- >> my view is they're both going to have to own it, it's not any less damaging for one party than the other. >> i think part of what's happening here is that washington's not coming up with actual solutions. both are trying to own immigration as an issue. meanwhile, we have a crisis of immigration, not the one we faced before. a lot of young people and families coming to the border and creating a different circumstance. >> and the democrats voted in 2013 for $8 billion of wall

funding. neil: all right. guys, i wish we had more time. and we do not and antwan, he doesn't use nancy language. a certain congresswoman did and since she did-- in a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. oh! under seven? and you may lose weight. in the same one-year study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. oh! up to 12 pounds? a two-year study showed that ozempic® does not increase the risk of major cardiovascular events like heart attack, stroke, or death. oh! no increased risk? ♪ oh, oh, oh, ozempic®! ♪ ozempic® should not be the first medicine for treating diabetes, or for people with type 1 diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. do not share needles or pens. don't reuse needles.

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you've heard the dust up from rashida tlaib, the newly elected, first muslim congresswoman in the united states who had choice words for president of the united states. a number of prominent democrats, including nancy pelosi have said the language is a little coarse, but they're not there to judge the intentions and senator manchin says it doesn't do us any good. mark, i think it's fair to say that this congresswoman newly elected and newly sworn in is part of a, you know, a wave of new impassioned democrats who rose to power be angry and feeling that the system and maybe the party itself has failed americans. so there's more to this passion than meets the eye. do you buy that? >> well, i think it's easy to forget that the republican party was very divided when it ran congress just over the last couple of years, and so you see on the one hand, i think you see

some very left oriented congressmen and congresswoman getting elected, but a lot of moderates were really the key to the democratic victory. the problem solvers caucus and others that really represent a desire to move the party to the center and to have a compromise. they're not getting the headlines. they did get rules changes, but not headlines. neil: so let me ask you, mark. could a bill clinton in this party now get nominated now? >> you know, we're going to see that. i think just when we thought the republican party had moved so far right they actually produced mccain and romney as nominees. we are going to see whether or not sanders and warren if they both run could cancel each other out. the party does want to govern. i think it's overrepresented that democrats want a breakdown of the government. a lot of democrats would like to see president trump gone and

like to see him impeached. that's for sure, but a lot of democrats are still moderate in their perspective particularly in the big states. neil: nancy pelosi is very careful and those who have been urging impeach the president and-- but she obviously is aware they're a vocal and powerful force so she has to walk a tightrope. >> she does have to walk a tightrope. there hasn't been a mueller report. there hasn't been any evidence used to create impeachment. she knows it's talk and requires two-thirds of the senate so what she has to weigh carefully, wow, do i want to kick off an impeachment movement and ends with a headline just like president clinton got clinton acquitted and this would end up trump acquitted and a partisan vote in the senate. the same thing would most likely happen in the absence of dramatically new information

that after two years we do not have. neil: you know, mark, representative alexander ocasio cortez made a headlines, alexandra, and the taxes that worked during eisenhower and didn't hurt us. what do you think? >> as you know, president kennedy came into office and reduced those taxes. i don't think there's a movement in this country to do that, i think that's an outlier. people, while they're skeptical where tax cuts go, they see that this is an improved economy with more jobs than ever. i don't see the american public looking for a sharp detour in that right now. neil: real quickly, then, on joe biden, whether he enters the race. do you think he will? >> i think that biden will enter the race and he has a strong chance. he enters in many ways as a front runner, in the low 30's,

not a sure winner like 40's and 50's, but he's in many ways a candidate who would appeal to the working class and has experience. a tough challenger if he can make it through the beginning. neil: mark, thank you very, very much. drug prices are going up, i thought i'd add that. just after this. [cell phone rings] where are you? well the squirrels are back in the attic. mom? your dad won't call an exterminator... can i call you back, mom? he says it's personal this time.. if you're a mom, you call at the worst possible time. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. where are you? it's very loud there. are you taking a zumba class? i am not for just treating my symptoms... (ah-choo) i am for shortening colds when i'm sick. with zicam. zicam is completely different. unlike most other cold medicines... ...zicam is clinically proven to shorten colds. i am a zifan for zicam. oral or nasal.

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on some 300 drugs by an average 6.3%, but some drugs will see their prices go up a lot more than that. check this out. they know that the pain treatment from pharma increase prices 133%. and a blood pressure medicine from hickma pharmaceuticals some 30%. and some are trying to steer clear of public and political pressure. >> we will no longer accept the inflated prices being charged to our seniors. >> drug companies, a number of months ago, were going to raise their prices. i actually called up the heads of pfizer and novartis and others, and i said, you can't do that. you can't raise your prices, and you know what they did? they brought them down, they didn't raise them. >> and they walked them down, but plan to reverse that. increases on 41 drugs in days from now, these increases are

nothing new. for more than a decade brand name prices have exceeded inflation by a wide margin. the blue line an inflation and that's the top drug prices. it's a big difference and it's an expense causing outrage on both sides of the aisle. senator elizabeth warren a 2020 hopeful wants to help lower prices by increasing competition in the generic market by having the federal government manufacture certain meds. whatever the solution, bringing down the price of medicine will no doubt be an issue for voters. >> i think it's terrible. >> we own stock and i like the dividends and stuff, but that's what it's all about, the stock owners. >> they have to have better pricing or fair pricing and we could have generics. >> and i think the drug companies are more of a business than helping people. it's insane. >> it's insane, the high prices are wholesale prices and consumers generally pay less thanks to rebates and discounts

from your insurance company, neil. neil: lauren, thank you very, very much. and here is a live look where funeral services are going to be held for the slain police officer. up next, is a retired ice supervisor, why this did not have to be after this. hey jef. what?! i'm here to steal your car because, well, that's my job. what? what?? what?! (laughing) what?? what?! what?! [crash] what?! haha, it happens. and if you've got cut-rate car insurance, paying for this could feel like getting robbed twice. so get allstate... and be better protected from mayhem... like me. ♪

>> we have two interesting developments we're following right now. one is the funeral services for the california police corporal ronil singh to take place in modesto, california and juxtaposed at the eisenhower building next door to the white house where the vice-president, homeland security secretary, jared kushner and a number of others are there, meeting with congressional aides trying to find a way to get the funding for the wall that republicans have been arguing if it was in

place this young man would be alive, allegedly killed by an illegal immigrant. tommy, good to have you. is it your sense that a wall would minimize or maybe prevent the type of incidents we sadly see like the killing of this young officer? >> it would absolutely minimize it and prevent it, neil. thanks for having me on. corporal singh would be alive today. a sheriff when he spoke, retiring in a couple of days, he had no benefit to say, you know, it was in completely preventible. it is. it's just ridiculous for the democrats to be fighting with the president over $5 billion for the wall. if you put up a wall, they'll go around the wall. i spent five years on that border and i talked to guys every day still on the border and it hasn't changed. i worked in san diego. the wall there, it works. you put the wall in texas, new mexico, arizona, it will work.

there's 52 ports of entry, neil, between san diego and brownsville, texas, 2000 miles. everything besides those 52 legal places where people can enter is open space and border. some places a couple hundred miles have a wall, have a fence. so call it a fence, call it steel slats. the president said the steel is a lot more expensive than concrete. i don't care what the cost is, corporal singh would have been alive, we need a wall, no doubt about it. neil, 14 cops all over the country have been killed by deported illegal aliens. that's not to count the regular illegal aliens. these were illegal aliens deported. 14 of them since 2003. you know, i was prepared to read the names, but for timing purposes i won't.

but i'll tell you a couple were from phoenix, a couple from houston, california, even norfolk, virginia, okay, by aliens that had we had a secure border, 100% secure, neil, and forgive me for raising my voice, but it pains me that my buried is bei is-- pains me that my brother is being buried today, tremendously upset. neil: one of the things, tommy, it doesn't have to be a wall, can be steel slats and a variety of other things, but that the issue has become maybe one of semantics. if you call it a wall, can it be something else. if it's not 5 billion could it be less? but there doesn't seem to be any daylight between the sides right now and this sort of risk continues. so in the interim, what do we do? i mean, obviously, that's a big border to police, whether there's a wall, a fence and vast areas where there's not, what happens?

what are we looking at? >> well, neil, if i were the president, which i'm not, which all the illegal aliens on the other side of the border are happy about, i'd put another 10,000 military on the border and until you give me the wall, i'm going to put concertina wire all 2000 miles, every bit of it and i'll stack that up 20 feet in the sky. and then i'll replace it and fix it until i get the $5 billion. you know, you're an economics guy. you know that 5 billion is a mere pittance in the economy. what is it, 2 or 4 trillion dollars our budget annually, 21-- >> the democrats argue, tommy as you know, the 5 billion is a future down payment on something that will be five times that price, i don't know who is right on this, but they argue this is about more than just the original $5 billion. we're talking here it's going to be more than that, a lot more than that. you say money well spent. i guess what i'm asking is, what

is a realistic goal here? if they're not going to budge on that and the president wants to claim i tried working with you, but you're not working with me i'm going to declare an emergency and build the thing now. even generals have problems with that. do you? >> no, no, and being a retired marine first sergeant, no, i don't have a problem with it, neil. i'll give you a week, i'll give you one week and i'm hopeful that vice-president pence can work this out in the eisenhower building next to the white house. i'll give them one week. until the one week, then it's 10,000 troops, concertina wire and it's a national emergency. 14 cops killed. now put the police officers aside because some would argue, that's their job they risk their life and they knew that was the possible consequence. okay, what about the thousands of civilians? anybody can google it. go ahead, google illegal aliens

murderers, or civilians killed by illegal aliens, they can google it. it's public record. thousands, neil, thousands are dead. i always say this one thing every time i'm on fox. neil: thousands are dead over what period of time? >> thousands of dead since 2003, since it became homeland security. i'm just using 2003. i could go back further and increase that number. neil: i guess i've not heard that number, thousands are dead as a result of since the emergence of homeland security at the border, never heard it that high. >> not only at the border, neil. all over the united states by illegal aliens. no doubt about it. that's a fact. neil: all right. >> that's a fact. neil: we'll look into it. thank you, tommy, we'll be following these proceedings. we'll have much more after this. ballooned your car.

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>> all right. it dropped late yesterday. a federal grand jury working with special counsel robert mueller's investigation has been extended. we don't know how long it's been extended. it's already been months, presumably all the way to the 24 month ultimate extension, that could be granted. joining us to weigh in on the significance of this, if any, is the former attorney, fox news contributor andrew mccarthy. good to have you back. >> neil, great to be with you, happy new year. neil: to you as well, my friend.

what do you make of this? what does it mean? >> is simply means, neil, they're probably at the end of their 18-month term and they need to extend in order to continue the power of this particular grand jury to issue subpoenas and hear from witnesses. it really, in terms of what it tells us about whether the investigation's winding down, which i think it probably is, or not, it doesn't tell us a lot because even if this grand jury ended, they could convene another grand jury tomorrow and have another 18 months. so, i think the momentum of this investigation will be determined by what mueller thinks in terms of whether he's still gathering useful information. it won't have anything to do with the term. grand jury. neil: would it also mean, andrew, we don't get a mueller report until at least the summer? >> well, neil, i think we've talked about this before. i think the people who think that the report is imminent, as

in like any minute now. neil: right. >> are being overly optimistic. that doesn't mean that he's got something big coming down the pike necessarily because i think if he did, he wouldn't be allowing people who would be potential witnesses to be sentenced, rather than old back their sentencing until they've been able to testify. but i do think there are loose ends here and let's not forget, this from the beginning was a counter intelligence investigation, not just a criminal investigation. and as i have tried to stress, counterintelligence is really just an information gathering exercise and the guys who do intelligence tell they never have enough information. so as long as this grand jury is open they can continue to gather information. it doesn't necessarily mean they'll charge anyone. neil: so, let me ask you this. there haven about a number of indictments and guilty pleas and that sort of thing, but not so much on collusion as on business

deals or lying about those deals or lying about contacts. do you think this investigation has veered off course? i'm not saying that they agree, the clinton investigation, the bill clinton investigation first about real estate deals and went into an investigation of an intern and a blue dress. and this was business dealings around the presidents and those who associated themselves with the president long before he's president, in some cases decades before. >> neil, see, my objection to this from the beginning, there has never been a course defined that this thing could veer off, and what i mean by that is, every other special counselor special prosecutor investigation that we've had in modern history going back to watergate, at least everybody knew upfront what the crime was that was being investigated. here, i don't mean to beat a dead horse on this, but the

justice department gave mueller not a criminal investigation, which is what the regulations say you're supposed to have factual grounds for a criminal investigation before you assign a special counsel. here they didn't do that. they gave him a counterintelligence investigation and the important difference with that is, let's say i suspect that you robbed the first national bank, right? bank robbery has like three or four, what the prosecutors call essential elements that have to be proved beyond a reasonable doubt. you do your investigation and you figure out, i've either got it or i don't. and then i move on to the next case, one way or the other. with a counterintelligence investigation, you're not trying to make a criminal case. if you happen to come across one along the way, that's another story, but, again, you're gathering intelligence, and my objection to this from the start has been if you make this a criminal-- a counterintelligence investigation, which by the way

in the justice department ordinarily doesn't even get a prosecutor, it doesn't have any natural parameters or any natural beginning or end. so to my mind, there was never even a course to veer off because they never gave this guy firm guidelines about what he was allowed to investigate. neil: which means everything is investigated, right? >> and it's being investigated. sure looks that way to me? andrew mccarthy, thank you very, very much. >> thanks, neil. neil: it's incredible, isn't it? also incredible, an eye popping figure 70% as a top tax rate. the democrat pushing it saying there was a time when we did quite well with that after this. i am a family man.

i am a techie dad. i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast.

7pgñóo i am a techie dad.n. i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. >> do you have a specific on the tax rate? >> you know, you look at our tax

rates back in the '60s, and when you have a progressive tax rate system, your tax rate, you know, let's say from zero to 75,000 dollars may be 10% or 15%, et cetera, but once you get to like the tippy tops on your $10 millionth dollar sometimes tax rates as high as 60 or 70%, that doesn't mean all $10 million are taxed at an extremely high rate, but means as you climb up this ladder, you should be contributing more. neil: all right. a 60 minutes interview you heard from congresswoman ocasio-cortez, a detail of a plan to bring the highest up to 70%, to be fair, in that example incomes of over $10 million, but the thrust is getting back to the way it used to be in this country. and before i get to the panelists i want to show you the eisenhower years, what she was

referring to prior to that where the bottom rate 20%, but the top rate as high as 91%, now to be fair as well not everyone paid that, but that was the level at that time. now, john kennedy comes to office, proposes bringing those rates down and he succeeded, but sadly after his death when lyndon johnson got down, and down to 14%. from 91 to 70%, it was at 70%. we have market analyst dan here and melissa and our jonas max ferris. dan, you're our accountant and her argument is that the super rich, ie, guys like you, can easily afford to pay more and it's not as if we're taxed at that level on the first dollar, it's on this case the 10 millionth dollar and this is where the money is. >> certainly, it is where the

money is, but that's not where the money should go, neil. look, i think the average american, quite frankly, has forgotten more about economics and taxes than the congresswoman knows because this is outrageous. look, the last time we were at 70% was in the carter administration, and you may remember, what reagan really took those rates down and the economy boomed. do we truly want to-- >> started at 28%. >> yes, and we're at the point now where we want to end our economic system as it is to go to 70%, to fund green initiatives? because that's what she's talking about doing here, fair share is 70%? i don't think so. neil: the only thing i could say, whether you like the proposals to raise that much in taxes, she realizes that a lot of these things don't come cheap and so, if you can't cut it elsewhere, you've got to get it from somewhere. i'm just wondering though, would that even do the trick, if you

went after, you know, the very, very rich and started socking them at 70%? >> ultra high net worth individuals pay a lot, it is tax where they're paying a higher percent and second, there's so much waste in the government. and even those who pay the highest tax rate now get tired of the waste in government and your producer forgot the clip where she compared herself to abraham lincoln. she's just on another level altogether that i don't understand quite frankly. neil: but the idea, we need a much more progressive tax code, much more progressive than now. >> let's talk specifically about what she's talking about taxes and spending bills and different issues. first of all, okay, she's not incorrect, we had much higher taxes and growth trades, and carter example, but eisenhower great years for america. no one paid those rates. the percentage of revenue as gdp

was around the same level. it's not what the top rate, who is paying, what the deductions are. neil: now we have half the people in the country not paying taxes, may pay fica-- and the eisenhower years paying 90%. >> you could say there's more tax indequality. there's little taxes at the bottom. and this is where the wheels come off the train with this argument. bernie sanders's argument. they don't understand how taxation works in socialist countries. the high brackets in the country are comparable to scandanavian country. no one does 70 osweden, norway, they're lower than that and basically they have a flat high tax and this is how those countries collect almost twice of percent of taxes. >> and more of paying it. neil: that's the problem. that what we lose sight.

>> people making $60,000 do they pay-- >> i think that everybody should have skin in the game. very high and very low, everyone should because they have a much more vested interest in how the government is spending money. >> the fairest way to do this, neil, which we really have never had, to go to a flat tax where everyone has skin in the game. if you do that, let's think about it, you would have almost half of the country getting a tax increase. >> the lower half. >> the lower half. now, that would be the largest-- >> that would be the largest voting block consolidated in the history of the country. neil: and how would the markets react to something like that? >> i don't know if the markets would react as far as people who are wealthy own corporations and spend money so they drive certain parts of the economy. you don't want that money leaving the u.s. you don't want them taking that somewhere else, you don't those people leaving and affect right now what helps the u.s. economy, not just the fact that they're paying the taxes. they own a lot of corporations

and buy real estate and spend money. >> all the european countries who have this program in addition to a high flat tax, have sales tax with the value added tax at least twice like even a state like new york charges. >> and you avoid it by the shelters. >> i'm surprised she's not talking about the capital gain rate how the very tippy top-- >> i would think they'd find a way to avoid it. >> the tippy top are never going to pay the rates. warren buffett was famous for saying he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary and that's exactly it. neil: carl icahn his my special guest on fbn. more after this.

>> you know, carl icahn as i was saying before, billionaire invests probably more successful in history said our tax code is problematic. not talking about the rich, but

half of the people in the country don't pay income tax and allows for abuse ins the system to fester. he's going to be talking to me exclusively, he rarely talks to the press, on monday fbn. we're about your money. fox continues now. leland: week three of the partial government shutdown in washington. changing of the guard in congress, but both ends of pennsylvania avenue appear no closer to a deal. >> president trump underlining the need for wall funding in a series of tweets from the white house this morning, while across the street at the old executive office building, the vice-president meeting with congressional leadership staff to try and bring an end to this shutdown standoff. welcome, everyone to american news headquarters in washington i'm gillian turner. leland: nice to be with you, nice to be with you at home. across washington, parks, the smithsonian museum shut down on what would be a normally busy day for thousands of visitors in