what's going happen is less seconds. jon, any parting words? >> jon: lovely to spend a week with you. i'll be back tomorrow! >> sandra: i will see you tonight. i'm joining the gang on "the five." >> jon: will be watching! >> sandra: we will see you tomorrow morning. "outnumbered" starts now. >> melissa: fox news alert, strong reactions from both sides amidst the growing feud between president trump and democratic squad members ilhan omar and rashida tlaib. as the president is pushing back over his criticism of jewish democrats for standing with the party after the congresswomen condemned israel. now house speaker nancy pelosi is entering the fray. this is "outnumbered" and i'm melissa francis. here today, post of "the evening edit" on fox business, elizabeth macdonald. fox news contributor, dr. nicole saphier. former ohio senate democratic minority leader, capri cafaro. jennings on the couch, david avella, gopac chairman and

strategist. he is "outnumbered." >> david: delightful to be here. big day for big news. >> melissa: there's a lot going on. let's jump right to it. speaker pelosi speaking to the israeli president yesterday just days after democrats slammed israel's decision to bar omar and tlaib from visiting there. israel later allowed tlaib to visit her grandmother on humanitarian grounds, an offer she rejected. a spokesperson tweeting that the conversation was spirited by their personal friendship. and the israeli president tweeting, "i spoke today with speaker pelosi about the importance of strong u.s.-israel relations, and i thanked her for her commitment. the link between us is between people, based on historical ties, strong friendships, and shared values. not dependent on the links with either party." this, as the president is doubling down on criticism of jewish voter support of

democrats amid the firestorm. >> my opinion, the democrats have gone very far away from israel. they don't want to fund israel. they want to take away foreign aid to israel. they want to do a lot of bad things to israel. in my opinion, you vote for a democrat, you are being very disloyal to jewish people and you are being very disloyal to israel. only weak people would say anything other than that. >> melissa: but democrats unleashing, seeing the president crossed the line by using the term "disloyal." even accusing him of anti-semitism. watch. speak of the president is severely misguided if he thinks that his demonstration of such a profound lack of morals, his disdain for the stranger among us, is consistent with jewish values or that jews are a monolithic voting block. we are not. i think you will find jews rejecting this president and all he stands for in record numbers.

>> melissa: republican congressman lee zeldin, who is also jewish, saying that while he was not a fan of the president's use of the word "disloyal," he thinks that democratic criticism is way off base. particularly as a standby congresswomen tlaib and omar. watch. >> he is being accused of anti-semitism, which is so not true. the definition of anti-semitism requires a hatred toward jews. he has shown he has none of it. literally, his son in law, his daughter, his grandchildren, they are all jewish. on the other side, the folks going after the president of the united states have powered, elevated, been silenced. others have backed up tlaib and omar and others, providing cover for it. that hypocrisy is one to call out, as well. >> melissa: david, we called it a firestorm a little while ago. i wonder if it's a firestorm or if it's these two parties pouring gasoline on it over and over again. the president doing it because it keeps all the 2020 democratic

contenders way off the front page. no one is even thinking about them. for tlaib and omar, throwing fuel on edge because they like the attention. they are getting their views ou out. i think it's more about both sides wanting to give her front and center. >> david: it underscores two facts. one, nancy pelosi has to defend these members of congress, and congresswoman cortez from here in new york, more than any other members of her caucus. she's not controlling the message of the democratic house. those three are controlling the message of the democratic house. their numbers rival hers, as far as name i.d. and favorable, unfavorable. they have so much influence. in many ways, nancy pelosi's speaker only. on this particular issue, they are only for ideas if they are not trump's. if there is ideas, they are bad ideas. your voting record says where

you stand on issues. if you voted for policies that support israel, you are pro-israel. your voting for policies that hurt israel, your anti-israel. >> capri: you mentioned democrats a number of times. first off, i am frustrated that -- frankly, we talk about media bias a lot on this show. i think there is a strong media bias of making the squad and there views and painting those views on the rest of the party, of which we do not share and we do not hold. >> melissa: it's not a media bias when these people jump in front of the camera -- >> nicole: they demand the spotlight over and over again. >> capri: the bottom line is they do not represent the rest of us. we need to do it better job, the rest of democrats -- >> melissa: do you want them to pipe down, then? they are hogging all of the oxygen. what are the democrats asking them to turn it down for a second? >> capri: they need to tone it down because we have a race to

run a 2020. but we need to be more vociferous about denouncing certain aspects. back to your issue about the voting records, the bds situation is not supported by most democrats. i would say most democrats have a voting record that does support israel. i think -- >> melissa: why wouldn't you name omar as an anti-semite when she is so clearly -- >> capri: if i were in congress i would have done so. when the issue came out i wrote a piece for foxnews.com condemning my democratic colleagues that do -- >> melissa: why do you think the rest of the house didn't do it, then? i think that's his question. on the republican side you are supposed to stand up and call them out. >> capri: because they are hogging the spotlight, i think there is this year that if you cross them you end up with fire among the progressive base.

>> nicole: good use of the word "liar," by the way. they are demanding a smiley. they don't represent the party, but people are afraid to go against them because of how much popularity they are getting and how much media attention. >> elizabeth: to come right out you and say, "you are a racist or personally attacking." this whole debate feels like it is followed through the looking glass and we are on the other side of the mirror. the president is not an anti-semite. he's not about -- "the stranger among us," all this inflammatory rhetoric. that's my personal opinion. i also don't think the president should be telling anybody how to vote. >> nicole: he's the opposite of obama. he's not a great or greater. fortunately, unlike obama, he's putting forth good legislative action and he's doing things not in front of the camera. yes, i don't like his comments. i thought it was a gross generalization. i don't think it's right to say

that if you vote democrat that you are anti-loyal. or disloyal. that is not true. again, he makes these bombastic statements. they spend days in front of the camera. everyone talking about it. taking away from the real issue issues. that is the majority of them, including democrats, can done what is going on at israel and they support israel. therefore we need to stop focusing on tlaib and omar. >> melissa: hang on one second -- david, she says he's not a great or rated. we end up talking about things for days at a time. that's exactly what he intends! that's exactly what we are doing. it's all a complete plan to have these women as the face of the democratic party. he even sends everybody out to say those exact words. this is exactly what he wants to go on because none of his competitors for 2020 are getting any oxygen. it is not being a bad orator, it's being a marketer. >> david: president trump

knows how to drive a message. but capri had to hyperventilate trying to distance democrats in the midwest from the squad. >> elizabeth: 93% of the house democrats did vote against the bds -- >> capri: that was my point. >> david: if democrats are going to win in 2020, they have to win states like capri's home state of ohio. they have to win in states like wisconsin. states like michigan. when you have these three democrats controlling message, whether that be about impeachment, whether it be about cortez driving amazon out of newark, the messages that are not going to win the swing voters. strategically, you understand why capri says what she says. the problem is, it's where most of the democrats are. >> capri: it's not, though. that's what it looks like because -- >> david: capri, most democrats -- >> melissa: we need to get those ladies to step back and off tv for a few days.

>> capri: we need to be consistent. if we are going to say trump needs to apologize, we have to say our own need to apologize for things, too. >> melissa: democrats slamming president trump on a proposal to end the limits of detention of migrant families. critics say this is a continuation of the administration's cruel immigration policies. how the white house is pushing back. plus, san francisco city officials want to change how we think about the criminal justice system. removing words like "juvenile delinquents" from the books. will this do anything to help the city crime rates can agree will debate that, coming up. wow! that's ensure max protein, with high protein and 1 gram sugar. it's a sit-up, banana! bend at the waist! i'm tryin'! keep it up. you'll get there. whoa-hoa-hoa! 30 grams of protein, and one gram of sugar. ensure max protein.

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willy davis, who has alzheimer's. i decided to make shirts for the walk with custom ink. the shirts were so easy to design on the site. the custom ink team was super helpful and they just came out perfect. seeing my family wearing my shirts was such an amazing reminder of all the love and support that everyone has for my dad. - [narrator] check out our huge selection of custom t-shirts and more, for teams, businesses, and every occasion. you'll even get free shipping. get started today at customink.com. >> melissa: a fox news alert, the coast guard is announcing just minutes ago that they plan to end the active search for two missing firefighters at sundown tonight.

brian mccluney and justin walker were last seen on friday, leaving cape canaveral, heading out on a boat trip. hundreds of local, state, and federal agencies have scoured tens of thousands of miles along the east coast. civilian voters have also helped in the search. they will be suspending the answer to at sundown. the trump administration facing fears backlash over ending its limits and how long i.c.e. can hold migrant children in custody. the new rule announced yesterday would replace the decades-old florez agreement which states the government cannot detain migrant children for more than 20 days. house speaker nancy pelosi saying in a statement, "the administration is seeking to codify child abuse, plain and simple. it's appalling, inhumane family incarceration plan would reprove a basic human rights, reversing decades-long in court-imposed rules, and violating every

standard of morality and civilized behavior." the move is expected to face with legal challenges, but supporters of the new rule say it's about protecting the borde border. >> this is a tool we have to have in order to secure our borders to make the american public safe. we are treating them humanely, in the best conditions we can. by the way, we are keeping families together. this is politics. they simply want to ensure that they can defeat president trump in 2020. >> melissa: meanwhile, north carolina now embracing century policies. democratic governor roy cooper vetoing a bill that would rely on state and local police to cooperate with federal authorities. they say it would force them to act as federal agents. but republican lawmakers not having it. one state senator saying, "law enforcement officers have a sworn responsibility to protect

their citizens, and that requires cooperating with federal authorities. unlike cooper, who prefers to fender to pander to his democratic supporters. we will override has a responsible veto." let's start with that last part first, e-mac. from a law enforcement perspective, what the governor is saying, when you have someone in custody, rather than handing them over to a nice agent, their plan is to release that criminal onto an unsuspecting community. >> elizabeth: that's exactly right. basically i.c.e. is saying, "we want to look into this individual." the d.a. is now saying the carolinas are now a major hub for drug cartels pray they are setting up shop in atlanta and charlotte they are using trucking routes to go through the carolinas. i am astonished at this.

not only does it affect law enforcement, because i come from a fireman family, it affects firemen, too. it puts pressure on community resources. i don't know how border patrol officials think they could operate on the law that congress writes in an environment like this. it's so difficult for them. >> melissa: david, you go back to this floor this flores agreement, the latest move by the administration. the trump administration was criticized heavily. so bring. the children. this is keeping them together. but it is still villainess in the eyes of democrats. what is that they want the administration to do instead of either keeping them together or separating them? what are the other options? >> david: democrats are schizophrenic now on the immigration issue. i will give you examples. kamala harris, when she was district attorney, supported police entering over juvenile

immigrants. we are saying families should be separated, which is absolutely true. this helps keep families together more. now it's, "wait, your keeping families together." you can't have it both ways. ultimately we would want is democrats coming together and supporting some of the initiatives that are actually going to be helpful to the trump administration. putting more judges, to help expedite these cases. building more of the welcome building detention facilities. all the things of the administration is trying to put dollars towards would be helpful. to get democrats -- let me say one less thing. the other part of this is that everything would turn for administration does is going to go to federal court, which is why mitch mcconnell continuing to put more federal judges on the court is critical to this administration's demonstration n policy. >> melissa: i would ask you -- jeh johnson came out talking about the flores agreement before, capri. democrats are saying this is the trump administration -- i think it was mazie hirono saying that

every day they are thinking of new ways to torture people. new cruel things to do to immigrants. here's what jeh johnson said. >> expanded family detention and rented to the issue of the florez agreement. i disagreed with the ruling, because i think our border patrol and immigration enforcement people need those tools available to deal with situations like this. >> melissa: so i've democrats change their mind on this policy? >> capri: here's what i think is happening right now --dash i think human beings are suffering because everyone is pointing fingers and playing politics. if you look at north carolina, where you have a democratic governor saying the legislation is a play to the republican base, and you have the republican sang the democratic veto is pandering to the far left base, it's one small example of a much larger problem we are seeing. i have said this before and we will say it again -- if we want to solve this problem, democrats

and republicans need to put their finger-pointing aside in congress and address the issue of immigration. if not, president trump will continue to do executive orders. they will continue to be challenged in court, nothing will be getting done come human beings will suffer. >> melissa: what you think will get that done? >> nicole: i agree with capri, that this is a political center the situation at the border is devastating. there are more coming than in any of the initiation before. in a tweet yesterday, that it's not enough this administration put them in cages without soap and beds pray that it's not who we are as americans. let's remember that in 2015 the aclu brought a lawsuit against the obama administration, citing terrible conditions without soaps and beds. what about your administration, joe? the situation now is that president trump is trying to make it better. but he has a lot more immigrants than ever before. they are trying make improvements and keep families

together. that 20-day maximum just is not working with our over-inundated immigration system. so it's giving them more time. maybe he should put a cap on it, because in a definite timeline is not sitting well with people. he went or legislative can go back and reform integration pray that would help, too. 2020 democrats repositioning as a field starts to shrink. washington governor jay inslee dropping out of the race after another rival left the field just days ago. plus, 2020 candidate john delaney now accusing some of his democratic rivals of cheering on a recession in the hopes of hurting president trump. wouldn't that hurt america even more? we will debate it. ♪ >> i'm not going to name names, but you get a sense -- my position is very clear, which is that i hope a recession doesn't happen. ♪ tual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. i wish i could shake your hand. granted. only pay for what you need.

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♪ >> elizabeth: the crowded 2020 democratic field slowly getting

a bit smaller. jay inslee dropping out of the presidential race last night and announcing just a short time ago that he will seek a third term as governor of washington. this, as former 2020 candidate john hickenlooper launching a senate bid in colorado today. meanwhile, 2020 candidate john delaney appearing to take on the competition. now accusing some democrats of pushing for a recession in order to hurt president trump. watch. >> i hope it's not. like, it feels like some democrats are cheering on a recession because they want to stick it to trump. i don't want a recession because i don't want these workers in here to face a recession. but i worry that trumps policies are bringing one on. >> elizabeth: okay, john delaney would not name names, though. before he made those remarks, 2020 front runner joe biden hitting back at claims that democrats would benefit if the economy went into recession. watch this. >> i never wish for a recession,

period. so i'm not going to comment on whether there is a recession. what i do think is the route the president has us going down is a big mistake. i heard my staff briefing me on what he said today, saying that he's not worried about a recession but he's going to want to lower capital gains tax. give me a break! >> elizabeth: okay, david. he's not going after the recession but he is going after the president. [laughter] to the language, to the t come up that docked in the i, the same rhetoric last year in the media as now. should the spotlight beyond the democratic policies to battle about don my counter there is no indication, the fomc, no indication due to recession. it slowed down by that is not a recession. what about the 2020 policies? >> david: he needs to be

discussed. the democrats need a recession in order to win the presidency. only twice. only twice has an incumbent president been defeated in the last 40 years. jimmy carter, and president and president george w. bush paid was a similar? voters believe the economy was weak pretty strong economy benefits president trump. at the same time, is there more that needs to be done? absolutely. more infrastructure spending needs to recur. more money for education. more policies to help keep regulations low so the economy keeps blooming. you can trust that with the democrats, whether that be the green deal were free college, whether it's higher taxes. everything they are advocating is ultimately going to make the economy -- >> elizabeth: if you confiscated 100% of the income, it still can pay.

you have been following business for so long. we know there's an enthusiasm gap right now with joe biden and the 2020 democrats. that sort of like if he talked on the economy, you talked on consumer confidence. >> melissa: it's true. i don't know if he's talking in the last couple hours, he was on the sandra smith. he's no republican. he came on and said that he thinks the biggest danger right now is that we talk ourselves into a recession. that's really true in terms of sentiment. i think it's interesting, the way we look at the bond market when people talk about these signals. i think it is sending a signal to the fed. at that kind of changes that we be at the bond market. more of a driver as opposed to a response. maybe sending a signal to the fed that the short end is just way too high. >> elizabeth: what do you think, capri, but what said before? there is a lack of enthusiasm with the 2020 policies. what would they do in a downturn? should that be the debate?

>> capri: president obama obviously had to do with it. >> elizabeth: they doubled the debt only got 2% growth, right? >> capri: save general motors, he -- >> elizabeth: but that was started by george w. bush, right connect the bailout was started by george w. >> capri: as i recall, it was dealt with under -- in 2008 prior to president obama taking office. that being said, i think one of the things that would be very easy to jump onto is to say the democrats want to make the middle-class tax cuts part of the individual tax cuts. we spent all this time talking about how the corporate taxes and how the top 1% taxes are somehow hurting the economy. could say -- >> elizabeth: but the democrats are not talking about it overall tax cuts. >> capri: i think we need to focus on what are actually policy priorities are going to be. but i think joe biden's right to

say that the policies are fair game. like the trade war. >> elizabeth: understood. nicole, the democrats are now campaigning on raising taxes. to david's point, no incumbent has won in a recession, i think going back to william taft. this debate, it feels like it's getting yanked around right now by politicians. >> nicole: i think everyone is doing what they want for 2020 and trying to keep everything he did. david is right when he says if the economy is strong president trump has a much better possibility of winning the election. are they wishing for a recession? i hope not. not only is that anti-american, it's antihuman and wouldn't be a short stop gap. we have a long-term consequence. i hope they don't want that. >> elizabeth: the intense backlash after song spicer is caps on "dancing with the stars." even the show's host is complaining. the new reaction from sean spicer, plus the political to step in with her our cultural and political climate has gotten too intense, even for dancing. [laughter]

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"thank you, real people." you're welcome. we're gonna need a bigger room. ♪ >> melissa: a backlash frenzy. abc facing boycott threats. everyone is boycotting everything, it's so exhausting. after casting former white house press secretary sean spicer on the upcoming season of "dancing with the stars" ." the cofounder of the democratic coalition and anti-trump pac, tweeting, "they had more than enough time to replace sean spicer, they chose not to. hashtag boycott "dancing with the stars" is about to turn. we won't let you normalize one of the biggest liars in the history of this country. no way." [laughter]

staffers reportedly up in arms. on the show's host, tom bergeron, treating out his concerns to viewers just hours after welcoming him to the cats. he said he had hoped the new season would be "a joyful respite from our exhausting political climate." and free of inevitably divisive bookings from any party affiliations. "before leasing up those tap shoes, sean spicer stopped by fox & friends this morning. he did a little twirl, saying he agrees with the host. >> i sure had sentiment. this should be two hours of politics-free. i hope what this show is at the end of the season is an example of people of a bunch of different backgrounds getting together, leaving politics aside, having a good time in a civil and respectful way. so my hope and goal is that at the end of the season, looks back and says, "you know what? we need more of this, not less." >> melissa: one he's hardly

the first are public and the band with the stars. rick perry, president trump's energy secretary and former house majority leader, tom delay, were both to contestants on the show. wow. [laughter] first of all, i haven't watched "dancing with the stars" in so long. they needed a controversy to get back in the headlines. if you have to look at the cast set up ahead of time, nicole, and you see lamar odom there on the call sheet, and you saw sean spicer, who do you think would be more controversial? how about ray lewis? >> nicole: this is the most preposterous thing i've ever seen. they are making a political by boycotting "dancing with the stars." lamar odom? come on, he's not the face of america we are wanting our children to see. he was found in a coma in a cocaine-induced stroke in a brothel outside of las vegas! >> melissa: the bunny ranch. >> nicole: talk about controversial! sean spicer can't get a break, just let him dance!

>> melissa: ray lewis, accused of being involved in a murder. he was cleared, but still. and their focus is on sean spicer! >> elizabeth: sean spicer can't catch a break anywhere. i know the people don't want to talk politics when they are being entertained. that's a problem with nfl protests. >> melissa: they don't have to talk politics, they will be dancing? >> elizabeth: he won't be talking about trade and currency policy in between the foxtrot. i think they will probably get really good ratings. by the way, i feel really badly for tom delay on that carnival barker outfit he had to wear. [laughter] >> melissa: what i think is interesting about this -- tom bergeron, i think i'm saying his name wrong. i'm doing the best i can. he said, "helping you put politics aside for a second." they might find out what we find out on the count all the time. when you are talking some you disagree with, the relays they are human being and you are friends and we get a drink

afterwards. you don't have the same animosity that you do when you are not face-to-face with this person. they may learn the lesson that the rest of america is missing and maybe they can share it with people afterwards. that we are all human beings even if we disagree about politics. we can all get along. >> david: let's hope that's an outcome of this. all that said, for the democrats up in arms and who want this show boycotted, viewers started boycotting this show long ago. when was the last time you watched "dancing with the stars"? [laughter] it had an all-time low for a season finale. sean spicer is getting them more ratings than they've gotten in years. >> melissa: we don't know, we'll see. >> david: at the end of the day, he can either dance or not dance. viewers will either keep him on or kick him out. >> elizabeth: have you seen him dance? >> nicole: he drove this morning. >> capri: they did a charity "dancing with the stars" in d.c. in 2017. he was one of the judges for that. so i have a sneaking suspicion that this is a lifelong life

goal for sean spicer, to be part of "dancing with the stars." [laughter] >> melissa: what you think about my point? but i don't think people across america realize that no matter how much we fight here on the couch, republicans and democrats, when you are face-to-face and sharing anything else with people it is very hard to stay angry. >> elizabeth: b experience that every year at thanksgiving. [laughter] speaker ain't that the truth! at least around my people. i'm "outnumbered" at my family for the most part with my political views. you are absolutely right. that's what i've been working on this bipartisan cookbook. people actually come together over the table. and they put things aside. >> melissa: the pc police out on display in san francisco. the progressive city introducing new sanitized language guidelines for criminals and rising crime rates. the impact on the democratic party as 2020 heats up. will there be one? we will debate. ♪ newday va guaranteed cash out loan.

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country, and staggering homelessness. the report says that convicted felons released from custody will be known as a "formerly incarcerated person." or a "justice-involve person." or does the returning citizen. could have been on vacation. juvenile delinquents rebranded as "young person with justice system involvement." "young person impacted by the juvenile justice system." you can take your pick there. addicts are now "person with a history of substance abuse." one of the city supervisor saying, "we don't want people to be a for over leveled dome likely will for the things they. want them to begin tripping citizens. referring to the mess felons like a scar letter they can never get away from." the neighbor don mcnair has yet to sign off on this proposal. e-mac, i'm struggling to understand the different. other than "returning citizen." you could be returning from an airport. or a trip to mars. that can mean anything.

but "juvenile involved with the criminal justice system?" as what, a bailiff? [laughter] it's pretty obvious what you are saying. >> elizabeth: somebody said, what are big where to call thieves? impulse shoppers can mark what you call alcatraz? "the really big, pretty, justice-involved rocket?" if you don't want to be called a felon, don't commit the crime. it's interesting that san francisco, one of know the dirtiest and unsafe place in the world, is no sanitizing language for felons. >> melissa: clean up the streets rather than cleaning up the language? >> elizabeth: i don't think of filling it with a high recidivism rate cares what they are called at this point. >> melissa: have such a focus on words right now. it goes along with everybody telling everybody else, everyone is anti-semite, everyone's a racist. now we are going to watch this language. we are so involved in words when there's a lot of actual stuff that needs doing.

>> nicole: we have legitimate issues were dealing with as a country, and all we are doing is sanitizing language? come on. i have three boys going from college to kindergarten. all in different phases of their life. i've seen what it does in the school system. my son is concerned with saying anything. "you can't call a female she or he, they have to use gender-neutral verbiage. the bathroom signs -- we are so concerned with protecting people that we are not actually focusing on issues paid this is preposterous come to sanitized language. sanitize your streets. they are riddled with disease and almost people that actually need help. focus on your almost population. it's awful. >> melissa: what you think of this emphasis on words everywhere? >> capri: i think it's exhausting. i tend to agree, i think we are spending more of their energy during verbal gymnastics then we are actually focusing on policy solutions and implementations.

i think i understand what they are trying to do here. coming from a good place in people's hearts. this is a local government decision. if they don't like it, they can vote these people out. if you really want to do with the criminal justice system, you need to focus on the system. make sure of the nonviolent have an opportunity to adjudicate through and get employment. those with substance abuse have an actual ability to get treatment and have long-standing recovery. that is where the emphasis needs to be. >> melissa: that's a great point, david. if you went and asked someone who had been released from jail, "what is your biggest hardship right now?" to help them not recommit? do you think it would be use of the word "felon," or something else? like helping them find a job? some sort of action instead of the term that you are using. >> david: actions speak louder than words. we also didn't hear from our friends in san francisco is what

new word we should use for victims. that is so often, over the last couple years, the focus in california. it's been on the defendant, not on the victim. this trend has continued. california has tried to clear out their presence, and yet every year they continue to have overcrowded prisons. the focus ought to be on a society that follows the law. not allowing people to in the streets or allow individuals to lay on the street having just shot up with marijuana. >> melissa: heroin. his basics and having a needle stick out of them. we ought to be focused on solving crimes. >> melissa: new data finds more and more republicans no longer believe colleges and universities have a positive impact on the country. what is to blame for this dramatic trend? we will debate. ♪ ok everyone!

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higher education. according to polling information collected by the nonpartisan pew research center, republicans over time have developed a negative view of colleges universities in the last decade. this year, only furtive republicans believe higher education is a positive impact on the country. that's way down from 33% in 2012. report explains why this might be the case. "republicans are far more likely to believe that higher education is shaping america for the worse. too many professors impose their politics on students. colleges go too far in shielding students of things that might offend them." but a 2010 survey found that 60% of all adults believe a college education is important, and 31% believe it is essential. what do you think, dr. nicole? quite the findings. >> nicole: i would think most of my patience think my higher education has a positive impact. with as a couple of decades ago. maybe things have changed. i do understand a certain amoun

amount. people are inserting their political opinions into everything. whether you are in a mathematics class or in psychology. it's all political right now. maybe they are not necessarily getting that education. you are also finding when people leave college they are not getting jobs as quickly. they are not able to find great jobs. maybe for some people you need to focus more on skill-building. it's not just about having a college degree. i am at a huge fan of education. i personally feel -- >> elizabeth: what do you think, capri? >> capri: i'm biased pride i have two masters degrees, i'm on the faculty at american university, and i'm a huge fan of higher education. i do agree i think it's vocational, and certifications are incredibly important. a lot of the media narrative

surrounding this issue of "higher education indoctrination" is making people pause. >> elizabeth: but we do see the fallout of students coming out of colleges. the feeling is that professors are too biased. >> david: i sit on the board of governors at shepard university. it's the harvard on the potomac river. we are always struggling with making sure you find value in the programs, because much of the view of republicans also centers on the fact that the debt children come out of higher ed with doesn't mean they find value in the program. you have democrats saying free college. if you have debt and he paid it back and now someone else's going to -- >> nicole: that $300,000 i paid back. >> elizabeth: middle class families do feel tuition gouge. the business model is a real estate model. you have a hotel-like facility for a 5-star cafeteria, a white elephant football stadium.

you see in lockstep, tuition is the same at universities and colleges. i think this issue. that colleges have lost their way in terms of helping middle-class families in lowering tuition. they are sitting on endowments the size of hedge funds, nicole. >> nicole: absolutely. the things we want to focus on, the people who might be borderline able to afford college, we want to make sure we get them to college. >> elizabeth: there's a little accountability of the bias in what's being talked about. >> nicole: does this hire of allocation education have value for the customer will give them a job to make >> capri: state educators are looking closely at that. >> elizabeth: david, find the word? >> david: there will be a big fight. >> elizabeth: thank you to david avella prayed we are back here tomorrow at noon eastern. now here's melissa and for harris.

take it away, melissa. >> melissa: fox news alert, the search is on after a sniper opens fire on a deputy. this is "outnumbered overtime." i'm melissa francis in today for harris faulkner. southern california is on edge as the gunman remains at large after wounding that deputy outside the l.a. county sheriff lancaster station. we are told the deputy's only alive because he wore his protective vest. despite being the target, he was able to call in the ambush. let's listen. >> melissa: william la jeunesse has more of angeles. william? >> melissa, this number has to be a little nervous right now. this mystery sniper is still out there. unlike last night, there is no longer a lock down, so residents can come and go.