broken lou gehrig's record. he would go on to play more than 400 consecutive games before ending the streak when he pulled himself out of the game voluntarily. how about that? >> julie: excellent athlete. >> bill: how did your day go? >> julie: not bad! it's 12:00, that means it's time for "newsroom news vault" five take it away. >> melissa: fox news alert , the white house reaching across the aisle as washington braces for a contentious debate on gun control set to begin next week. this is "outnumbered" and i'm melissa francis. here today, my partner, harris faulkner. happy friday. fox news contributor, jessica tarlov. fox news contributor, lisa boothe. joining us on the couch, executive vice president and chair of business and finance at king's college in new york city, brian brenberg. and he is "outnumbered." are you ready for us to make >> brian: i am ready! so glad to be here. there's a lot to talk about! >> melissa: let's do it! "the wall street journal" reports that president trump sat down with democratic senator joe manchin yesterday to

discuss possible gun measures. the president has signaled he wants to pass some kind of legislation after several recent mass shootings. democratic senator chris murphy and republican senator pat toomey have sought cooperation with the white house on potentially expanding background checks. this, as fox news learns the justice department has sent a gun legislation package to the white house for its consideration. no word yet on the specifics. hmm. walgreens, cvs, and wegmans the latest companies asking customers not to openly carry firearms in their stores. in texas, where two recent mass shootings took place, governor greg abbott issued eight executive orders and says he hopes to work with lawmakers to keep guns out of the hands of criminals while protecting secondment rights. the state lieutenant governor breaking with the nra on this. >> i believe they are wrong and not expanding background checks

to stopping strangers from selling guns to strangers. we want to protect families selling to family and friends without background checks, but about 10%, to 15% of all guns bought in this country are bought stranger to stranger. they don't know who they are selling to. could be a felon, someone getting to rob a bank, or someone ready to commit a mass act of violence. >> melissa: in the meantime, new backlash after the san francisco board of supervisors designated the nra a domestic terror organization. an opinion piece in "the washington post" blasted the resolution as just plain incorrect. another in the "los angeles times" with the headline, "the nra is many things, but it is not a terrorist organization." there's a lot to get to. brian, lily started the beginning of what we were talking about with this idea of the president sitting down with the folks from the other side of the aisle and getting background on what's going on from his various agencies. it's starting to have a feel

like when we saw that criminal justice reform. could it be that kind of a thing? >> brian: you know, you wish it could be, and you love the idea of lawmakers from both sides sitting down and having an honest conversation. as you read through the entire background on this issue, what you are seeing is this is such a politically-poisoned issue, with the moves away from the president and joe manchin and pat toomey and cats of this broader audience, you are seeing rhetoric more like what we are seeing out of san francisco. which poisons the well and takes us away from an honest conversation on background checks. >> harris: why do you think that is? because of the money? i looked at how many people have taken -- and on both sides of the aisle there is money flowing -- how many people are looking to take money from the nra, or have. does that complicate matters? >> brian: i think would complicate matters as there are too many politicians who want to always nationalize this issue. they want the response always to be a federal response, because --

>> harris: because they don't have to do anything in their own state. >> brian: they want the attention. anyone who looks at this honestly, they will always say to you that the real points of leverage are local. if local responses that make a difference. but that is not help a national politician who wants to get attention. >> harris: asked me to let me change that. what about tone from the top? you have the president, he sits down with somebody like joe manchin, and they say, "here are issues we can agree on." and nothing will solve all of it. we have to chip away at this incrementally. here are a few things we can agree on to get the ball rolling." those other forces on both sides that are so polarized. don't they begin to look silly not getting involved, if you start with something at the top? >> jessica: i'm definitely the most helpful have been in a very long time. president trump is not a hard-core second amendment guy. he's a liberal from new york city. i think his natural positions are not going to be in line with nra folks or hard-core gun

supporters were gun carriers. at the same time, while this is going on -- and chris murphy i see as the linchpin to this. obviously joe manchin is from a conservative state, but for chris murphy, it's deeply personal frame. the fact that he is involved and has worked with senator toomey is wonderful, on this. i'm concerned about the nra on this. i was glad to see governor abbott -- >> melissa: but they are weak right now. >> jessica: they are getting weaker. the but after the shootings we often have a conversation that goes away. after las vegas president trump wanted to raise the age that you can get bumped socks. suddenly -- >> melissa: it doesn't feel like it's going away. >> jessica: i've been accused of being a pollyanna before, but i'm the most hopeful that i have been and i think when the states continue to be affected and when walgreens and that kroger and wegmans lead to, you see they will fill that moral void congress is leaving.

>> lisa: we also don't want empty symbolism. i think that's what we're seeing from walmart and walgreens. does anyone think that banning open carry in these businesses is ultimate going to prevent mass shootings? absolutely not. it's ultimately empty symbolism. we also don't want to see that from congress, either. we don't want to see congress throw laws in the books simply to say we got something done. it has too legitimately -- they have to be able to look americans in the eyes and say, "yes, this is what actually makes a difference in mass shootings." the problem is that a lot of these "solutions" would not. >> melissa: let me stop you for a second. is there any one thing or even two things that would wipe away all these shootings? it's all going to be chipping away incrementally. that's the only way to make things better. >> lisa: sure, but things like universal background checks, even "time" magazine did a study and look through these recent mass shootings. in the deadliest of them, they said it wouldn't have a material impact. only 4% of gun murders in the

country are done with ar-15 psi weapons. can look at things like red flag was if there done smiling. but the challenge is that congress needs to actually be able to honestly say that it would make it into impacts. if not, they are lying to americans and giving them a false sense of security. >> brian: i think you're right, melissa, that it's incremental and you should talk about it that way. but what ends up happening is you take one of the things, background checks or multiple magazines or assault rifles, you make this the litmus test issue. if you want a line on this, you are immediately the bad guy on the other side. >> melissa: so i can't joe manchin say, "here's one thing i think could help," and president trump says the same thing, you can put it together, and i have two little things? >> harris: i have faith to think that's what's happening. i'm pollyanna-ish on this issue. [laughter] i stopped and wanted to play it again, it was live, so i

couldn't. but president trump said, "look, the nra, its americans," so on and so forth. i'm paraphrasing them a bit now. even with that, he wants to do the right thing. he said it more than once. i don't know, melissa, exactly what that's going to be. i think you're right. hold on a second. everybody brings a little piece of the puzzle. as brian just said, the farther away you get from the table that has a republican, a democrat, and president trump bringing people together, the more complicated it gets. it isn't just because of the lobby money. it isn't just because everybody has points of view. it's because of the national stage. >> melissa: in some ways, that can make it better. >> harris: i hope you are right. >> melissa: they go way out on a limb. was that the "los angeles times" is that they were a terrorist organization? oh, they argued against it. that's right. >> jessica: san francisco. >> melissa: those are two groups on the left.

the "los angeles times" in the same frisco legislature. you see the "los angeles times" criticizing those on their side that have gone too far. maybe you see something on the right, as well. someone saying, "hey, nra, you got to give a little bit." >> lisa: the only reason nra has power, or the gun owners behind it, i think part of that -- we've mentioned this before. the national landscape does not matter as much as what's going on in these individual states and congressional districts. the challenge is, you got people like jessica who grew up in new york city, not a gun owner, verses -- i'm not, either. that's not negative against you, i'm just saying. and you have other people in the country or gun owners, as well. if you say that that nra is a terrorist organization and essentially any other gun owner is also complicit, or we have people saying marco rubio is essentially a murder after the park when shooting, you think that is going to -- that removes any honest conversation from the table.

>> jessica: going back to what melissa said, it is so important for typically left-leaning organizations to say, "this is obviously not a domestic terror organization." >> melissa: which you did right away. >> jessica: absolutely. you will not fine a bar for serving someone alcohol who went out and drove drunk. with nra plays an important role. but only a fifth of gun owners in the country are members. they have an outside influence on congress because of donations. they've done things like block research with the cdc on gun related issues. millions of dollarss funding into candidates. and wayne lapierre says they are getting less powerful, but we know this happened, he spoke to the president. remember, the weekend after el paso and dayton, suddenly the president had a different view of things. so we need a push back on that. they aren't a domestic terror organization, but they make it easier for domestic terrorists to get weapons. >> harris: i think you and i both looked at that pew research this week. that's where we get our numbers from. 61% of members are republicans,

in the nra. 36% are democrats. more than a third. to call someone a terrorist organization when you have that many americans as members, and also bipartisan, i think it's more than just offensive. it goes beyond -- i don't even know if you would say that it is wise for them to do that politically. they are already sanctuary. they are frustrated with a lot of issues. >> jessica: you are totally right. suddenly the media cycle is -- >> melissa: we have to go. >> jessica: we have to go, bye! [laughs] >> melissa: in their lobbying for constitutional issue. the naming and shaming of trump supporter's spreading across the nation, raising fears it could become dangerous, and recent questions about intolerance on the left. plus, the dowsing of police in new york. this one is really horrible. it goes beyond water now. former mayor rudy giuliani weighing in.

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>> harris: we come in with this fox news alert, another dowsing attack on police officers in new york city. this time, a man hurls an open half gallon of milk at an officer during a building fire in the bronx. video posted on social media shows the container nearly hitting the officer in the head. it also features an obscene message there. officers chased the suspect away, but then he got away. social media video shows some pushing and shoving among the

officers, and people at the scene. and the man with the milk reportedly had it to wash pepper spray used by the cops from his eyes. the police union is blistering the situation and statement, saying, "it's becoming impossible for police officers to do our job, even in emergency situations. this crowd didn't care. they wanted to fight the cops who were there to help." this follows recent incidents of people dousing new york's finest with water and then editing one with a bucket after the book it was empty. former mayor rudy giuliani lay blame at the feet of the city's current mayor. watch. >> this is a police department that is afraid of the mayor. first of all, they know the mayor is not going to defend them. like i did. i always turned out to be right. that man probably has a wife and he's got kids and he sang to himself, "if i respond to this idiot who just threw water on me, i could lose my job, i could lose my income." >> harris: mayor giuliani

knows police officers. in this situation -- we had said this, right? it could escalate. and now it has. >> brian: one, you got the escalation issue, which you have to care about, because water and milk are not the worst thing to be hurled at a police officer. >> harris: they are doing their jobs and getting attacked. >> brian: is the bigger issue of the demonization of police o, when people congregate around them like this, and treat them this way. what is most disturbing for me when i watch this, beyond the fact you got a physical assault, as you've got people taking video of it and in some cases snickering, laughing, posting it. not because they are outraged by the behavior, but because they want to help others see it. what, so they can mimic it? this is really sick and grotesque, but it comes back to the dehumanization of police officers as objects, not people in the immunity. >> harris: social media has no shortage of narcissists, right? we will do things to light themselves up.

one thing i was saying -- jessica, i think you were on the couch and we talked about this -- in philadelphia when the police were shot responding to the call at a residence. the people outside that residence were attacking the police officers by throwing objects, and it was not water. it was not milk. there were objects hitting these officers, which means they have come to save lives, and now they have got to protect their own. that's a crime. you can't impede them from doing what they are supposed to do. >> jessica: and they are looking for this person, they still haven't found who it was, to charge them for all, as well. what he did. it's an important part of this particular story that there was pepper spray used. we don't exactly know why the police officers were using pepper spray on the people that were outside there. but it is disturbing when you say this. i grew up in the city, i haven't utmost respect for the police parent. i think it's part of the larger contextual conversation in our country. for instance, about a month ago when officer pantaleo, the one

involved in choking eric garner to death, was not charged, there was backlash for people looking for accountability. dust is for someone -- >> harris: and then he was fired. they waited for the investigation to end -- >> jessica: but he choked a man to death over loose cigarettes. >> harris: and it was a banned choke hold, we get it. we know the story. are you saying, jessica -- and there are ways to deal with that. right? eric garner's family, there are ways to do with it. >> jessica: this is not appropriate. i am completely clear about that. >> harris: but you bring it up in the context of this. >> jessica: nothing happens in a vacuum. nothing happening in the bronx outside of that house is an isolated incident. it's part of an entire cultural war that is going on. >> harris: real quickly, part of that vacuum is those same people who were throwing objects at the police as they do their jobs will call 911 if something goes wrong. right? it's just a question. >> melissa: this is why this is important in a larger context. what we are looking at here is the breakdown of the rule of

law. you can disagree with the way that police are enforcing the law here in the u.s., in new york, but there is a way to go and address that. it is not with the breakdown of the rule of law, because that puts everyone at risk. you are looking at this, you should know, year-over-year, the most recent stats, murders are up. rapes are up. felony assault come up. grand larceny, up. it is more dangerous contrary to what mayor de blasio said last night on this air. it's more dangerous to walk around the city right now while police are losing control, because they are being disrespected. the remedy is not what you're seeing here. if you feel the police are overstepping, the rule of law is breaking down in the city and we are all at increased risk, according to the statistics. >> lisa: if that's an incredibly great point. i will also say, i think the effects of the ferguson effect still exist in this country. we see the media perpetuate a

lie from 2014 and what happened in ferguson. people on the left, even senators warren and harris still pushing that lie to this day. the impact of that is real. even then, mayor emanuel said it would police officers in the fetal position, and an peer recently had an article about the cop a shortage in the country. why would you sign up to make him enough money to go out and put your life at risk and then be ridiculed by the mainstream media? >> melissa: everyone. both sides there, everyone here. we are all at risk as a result. >> harris: monday night on the steps of city hall here in new york city there holding a suicide vigil because of the number of suicides among nypd officers. morale is down. this is happening simultaneously. jessica, there is a place for those families and those loved ones. many of them who look like me, s looked at him to do with it. attacking police -- i mean -- >> jessica: i hope there is no confusion, i had no way justify that.

i was trying to contextualize it in terms of a national conversation about how police officers treat people and attacks and violence against unarmed folks, especially people of color. >> lisa: racial bias in police shootings has been sick been statistically disproven. >> harris: we have to move on. hurricane during making its first landfall in the united states today. it's north carolina. the latest on the damage in the storm's path. dorian also affecting voters ahead of a special election in north carolina that many see as a 2020 bellwether. president trump planning a rally there. will his influence give the g.o.p. a win? stay with us. ♪ ancestry provided me the opportunity to bring all of these stories that i've heard to life. i wanted to keep digging, keep learning... this journey has just begun. bring your family history to life like never before. get started for free at ancestry.com

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up the southeast coast. in the meantime, they are just beginning to pick up the pieces in the bahamas. dorian's death toll is now up to at least 30 people. hundreds more are still missing. the nation's health minister says the public needs to prepare for "unimaginable information about the death toll in the human suffering." and it dorian is affecting early voting in a north carolina special election that is being viewed as the 2020 bellwether fr both parties. the ninth congressional district recent republican state senator dan bishop against democrat dan mccready. next tuesday's vote amounts to a redo of last year's election, which the state ordered after finding ballot fraud aimed at helping the g.o.p. candidate, mark harris. forcing the state election boards to close early voting sites and four counties this

weekend. state democrats asking the board to extend early voting hours through the weekend into monday. meanwhile, president trump and nothing he will hold the rally for bishop and fight phil on monday. he tweeted last week, "looking for to being with dan bishop in two weeks north carolina. his opponent believes in open borders and sanctuary cities, and will protect your second amendment." mccready is treating back, "mr. president, here's a thought -- when you come to nc zero nine, try dropping that for a date and meeting with voters. you will see how many people struggle with health care costs. i would be happy to work with you to lower prescription costs and put people over politics for once." was that a smart response? >> brian: he clearly does not want to attach the national issues were talking about right now. he's very concerned about being associated with the hard left of those driving so much in the democratic party. what i think is interesting about this race, if it's a bellwether at all, if mccready

wins, it's because he is not going the direction of the rest of his party. i think that is still bad news for the democrats even if you wins. they are seeing the split play out in real time, he very much does not want to be branded with the far left. the president, you can see, is trying to drag him in that direction. because he knows that the winner. >> harris: i think jess could give a side eye during that period >> brian: i bet she did! >> jessica: oh, was that on national television? [laughter] i've been working on controlling my eye roll in my old age. >> harris: you are not old! >> jessica: 35 feels that sometimes. i disagree. dan mccready, an iraq war veteran, he was a captain in the marines, ran a completely centrist campaign as a majority of the democrats who flipped the house in 2018 did, as well. >> harris: except for those calling for impeachment, impeachment, impeachment.

>> brian: and everybody else right now. >> jessica: that's not actually true. the conversation we are having right now is a testament to how well right wing and the president tried to make aoc and rashida tlaib the face of the party. why are you laughing? >> brian: they don't even have to work hard to make them the face! >> melissa: if you look at the 2020 candidates, they are more like that super left-wing party then centrist. you have what because he's running ahead? >> melissa: he's the only one. >> harris: elizabeth warren is sneaking up on him, and she's not a moderate. >> jessica: absolutely. >> lisa: to jessica's point, special elections allow you to detach from the national landscape, whereas 2020 will be a little more difficult. so i don't necessarily think that this special election is going to be a reflection of what we are going to see in 2020. you shouldn't read too much into it. i will say, looking back at the 2018 elections, a lot of things people then talked about, obama and trump have the exact same

approval rating in their first midterm. obama lost 63 seats in the house, trump lost 41. is 41 great? no, but is not 63. so don't read too much into that. >> melissa: when you said it's the moderates who flipped out and they sound like this guy, is there anybody besides joe biden running for president in 2020 was in that top ten who sounds like this? who sounds moderate? >> jessica: not in the top ten. there are bits and pieces of it. >> harris: nobody else matters. john delaney sounds like it. >> jessica: steve bullock, he's my favorite who is not on the stage. >> melissa: the trend of naming and shaming trump supporter's is growing at its even got liberals concerned. is the president right to call it modern-day mccarthyism? we will debate that next. ♪ you wouldn't accept an incomplete job from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase relieves your worst symptoms including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. flonase helps block 6 key inflammatory substances. most pills only block one. flonase.

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♪ >> harris: trump supporter's across america are facing a revived effort by trump critics to name and shame them come with

the goal of hurting their business is now. one recent example, a facebook post threaten to make public a list of nearly 100 local businesses in pennsylvania owned by trump supporters. that page was taken down, but local media reports there is a similar website up now it also promises tips on how to get businesses closed down. a similar social media-driven boycott was directed at pepe's, one of connecticut's most popular pizza parlors. hollywood is getting into the name and shame game, too. it happened when debra messing tweeted about a hollywood reporter article on an upcoming trump fund-raiser in beverly hills. messing asked the magazine, "please print a list of all attendees. please!" two pleases. "the public has a right to know." that set off a wave of backlash. more recently, she apologized after critics called her out for retreating an image of an alabama church sign that read, "a black vote for trump as

mental illness." president trump weighed in yesterday. he tweeted this. oh, boy... "bad actress, deborah "the mess" messing is in hot water. she wants to create a blacklist of trump supporters and is being accused of mccarthyism. also being accused of being a racist. will fake news nbc allow maccarthy-style racist to continue?" lisa boothe, you're up. the three president trump is not alone in that comparison. we also saw whoopi goldberg recently on "the view" criticize the "will & grace" star. >> jessica: no mccarthyism talk from her, though. >> lisa: but he talked about the red scare in the blacklisting of hollywood actors. so i credit her for that. one of the things that concerns me is we seem to have now reached a point in politics where if i disagree if you that means you are sexist, racist, this, that. i find that really concerning. we should be at a point where "i disagree with you, here's why," on the issues. instead of going to this labeling. we saw this with henry clinton

the basket of deplorables comment. >> brian: it's not just illegally or call you a name, it's to destroy you. it's to destroy her livelihood, to make you unemployable, to prevent customers from coming to your business. that has affects not just for the supporter of the candidates, but what about family? what about friends? what about people who depend on that livelihood? this has gone beyond the pale in terms of taking politics and making it the center of people's identity, which somehow gives them the permission to destroy other people. >> melissa: their response to that -- because i've been a victim of that myself -- that you deserve that because were a racist. you are supporting a racist, promoting white supremacy in this country, so you deserve whatever it is that you get. >> brian: is the total antithesis of debate and reason and thought. there is no thinking here, it is simply name and destroyed. that is not what democracy -- >> harris: let's just set

aside whatever the words might be and just take a look at the simple fact that what you are doing is trying to destroy someone's livelihood, destroy who they are, basically cordon them off from the rest of society because you disagree with what they are saying. you know what that reminds me of? very early days in germany. >> brian: it's hard not to draw the parallels. >> harris: my husband is jewish. we talked about this recently. because of your faith, your beliefs, some thought that it was outside of where it needed to be, they would go after your businesses and her livelihood. i'm not saying that is a slippery slope here, i'm just reminding people that it did happen. >> jessica: it did happen. we could do an entire hour on comparisons of things that are going on in modern society today that are reminiscent, and frighteningly similar to things that went on in early nazi germany. i said this when joaquin castro published the names of trump supporters in texas. i'm very uncomfortable with it because i'm scared about

violence. of people actually being attacked. i know businesses are important, and livelihoods, but this is -- we live in a society now where someone -- >> harris: so you do see it as a slippery slope. >> jessica: i guess, if you want to use that term. it scares me. when we have people who walk into walmart's with guns to hunt mexicans and show up at bars in dayton, ohio, at 1:00 in the morning and kill their sister -- i don't know why, she might have been in the fray there. and you know people are so amped up about politics and ideology. i'm uncomfortable with it. i was glad she apologized. >> lisa: is the danger of the dehumanization of the other. when you disagree with me, as i mentioned, that demonization. frankly, it's intolerance. should not be able to be around someone else just because you share a political difference. we get along. we disagree. >> jessica: we also love cocktails. [laughter] >> harris: i love it when things end on a light note! isn't that nice? speech you may need that. >> harris: republican challengers to president trump are up in arms after a report that several states may cancel

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"outnumbered." g.o.p. challengers to president trump are crying foul over reports that four states -- south carolina, nevada, arizona, and kansas -- are poised to cancel their 2020 presidential primaries and caucuses. that would significantly end or even a long shot against trump for the g.o.p. nomination, and one of those challengers, joe walsh, is tweeting, "like a mob boss, donald trump orders the elimination of primaries. this is wrong, this is undemocratic, this is what a political party does when it serves a king." another candidate, the bill weld, also treating come "by turns, arrogant and paranoid, donald trump has made no secret of the fact he wants to be crowned a president rather than elected. that might be find in a but we overthrew hours to centuries ago. closely meetings this weekend, also worth noting, both parties have canceled primaries in the states going back to 1984. i'm going to start with you.

is it smart of the republican party to try and avoid this contested republican primary, like us out with gerald ford, jimmy carter, george w. bush? >> brian: i don't think it really matters that much. the only reason we are talking about is because primary challengers who don't have a chance are looking for some way to boost just a little bit. so they're talking about this. but this has been done by both parties for very long time. are we really talking about a serious primary challenger to president trump? why but the president want to spend the money and time dealing with that? we don't have a serious primary -- >> lisa: to that point, why is it getting so much attention? we saw in 2012 with president obama, also with george w. bush, states canceling their primaries and caucuses similarly. >> jessica: except there was not a primary challenger. that's a key component that's different. you can say it's not serious, but i can tell you that bill weld and joe walsh think it's serious. we are far out. i understands long shot but they have a case to meet care.

saying that both sides have done it with her was no competition, it's not a fair comparison. president trump has said these guys are jokers and he doesn't fear them parts of the so let them be on the ballot. he's in charge of everything the republican party right now. he could tell them, "make sure they are on the ballot and part of the primary." if you think you are going to win, face the competition. >> lisa: but if you have an incumbent president, they are essentially that of the party. so would you make of what jessica just said? >> melissa: they are that of the party, but i think all debate and conversation should be welcomed and encouraged. that's what democracy is about. he has a right to try and push them out of the race as a candidate, you would expect them to do that. he would expect them to really fight to the death for something that he really wants to do. so, i don't know. i can see both sides of this issue. i think think you should try ae them out and that they should be

welcome. >> lisa: harris? >> harris: it's not that anybody on that screen would be able to beat donald trump. [laughs] not at this point, anyway. so, what harm would it do to have the process follow through? i will say this -- things happen. as we saw with hillary clinton and barack obama a few years ago, remember when they were still battling it out? and then came out the reverend wright tape, things can happen. what i would hope for any party, but in this case republicans, what if president trump -- i don't know, what if he has a mind change? what if something were to happen before that election point? there is no way he would beat the democrat because you don't have anybody else up with anyone has looked at. none of these people has that much name recognition, do they? and looking big picture, far out. maybe that's too much fantasy, but the president has nothing to lose. it takes a lot to challenge an incumbent with a good economy. you see the jobs numbers? >> lisa: brian? >> brian: even if we go this

route, even if you don't have the primaries, if this is a bad decision and republican voters don't like it, they won't show up at the polls. this is not -- they thought about this. i think it comes the conclusion, "i don't think of republican voters care we have these primaries committees are not serious." >> lisa: will leave it there. is this a novel idea or just big government? new york city mayor and presidential candidate bill de blasio is proposing a robot tax counter jobs lost to automation. will it fly with voters committee will discuss it next. stay with us. ♪ >> right now there is no american strategy, no federal government strategy to, to adjust automation. it could be the single most disruptive force in our society that we've ever experienced. ["mr. roboto"]

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>> melissa: more "outnumbered" in a moment. first, let's check in with harris and see what sizzling for "outnumbered overtime" just a few minutes away. harris? >> harris: i'm looking hard to make that sizzle, thank you. we await a news conference now on that to the california boat fire. the latest on the investigation amid reports of serious safety flaws on that dive boat. that was a huge question when it first happened. plus, even the mainstream media are slamming san francisco for labeling the nra a domestic terror group. and the liberal author begs "normal people" to stop wearing red hats before they scare people who take them for maga hats. we are not even making this up. more atop the hour on 326. back to you >> harris: can't wait. >> jessica: is it time to tax robots? that the idea from new york city mayor and democratic white house contender, bill de blasio. this is what he told her own

tucker carlson last night." >> a worker pays income tax. you take away millions and millions of workers, that's a lot less revenue to take care of all the things we need in our society. that means, of course, millions of people don't have a livelihood. i believe and work. i think you do, is also. i think we need a future based on work. it's going to put thousands of people out of work. they should be a responsibility for making sure those folks get a new job. either in the same company or elsewhere. >> jessica: he's hardly alone. job loss to automation has become a hot topic amongst 2020 democrats. former tech executive andrew yang has been vocal about the issue, embracing a monthly stipend of a thousand dollars to reduce income inequality and balance effective about sticking drops. others, including bernie sanders, who also discusses automation as a threat to workers. brian, i will start with you. this is in your wheelhouse. bill gates is in favor of this idea, and they are thinking about it in south korea. >> brian: universal basic income.

and the taxation -- >> jessica: and the taxation of robots. south korea knows a thing or two about ai and robots. would you make of this and what do we do about job loss due to automation? >> brian: this is great, we have a federal automation and worker protection agency under bill de blasio, and somehow that agency is going to figure out all of the investment decisions that companies make, and whether or not it counts as automation? if it does, they are not taxing robots. they are taxing businesses. can you imagine the paperwork, the bureaucracy, the administration? we don't have to worry about automation in this country if we get this kind of policy. all business will grant to a halt because no one will know what is in bounds and out-of-bounds. >> melissa: and they are not taxing businesses, because businesses are people. they are taxing customers. because the businesses are going to add that tax on to the price of whatever they are producing. so there taxing the people who get the goods. these are the conversations they had around the time when mass production came around. henry ford, when he started to have cars made on the assembly line, when we stopped assembling

things one by one and instead things became automated. what happened? did everyone lose jobs? no. we became more productive. this is a normal economic thing, and it frees humans up to do other things. to do other jobs. to plan for greater things. it is scary, because of the retraining that needs to go on, but businesses -- that's where you get businesses involved. you get them involved in retraining for the jobs of the future. you don't take money away from them for the government to then waste on something else. you challenge them to get involved in training for the new job. >> brian: bill de blasio since we don't have a federal government automation strategy. good! we don't need one. it's a real issue, but you've got to think about the places it's going to get solved. i have no faith that government bureaucrats are going to figure this out. >> jessica: and bill de blasio is not doing that well, here. as both melissa and brian have acknowledged, automation is very

serious threat to the american worker right now. do you see any palaces out there that you think are properly addressing this? where do you think we should go in knowing this problem is coming? >> lisa: i think we can reduce regulation, and try to make -- whether his manufacturers more competitive, to loosen some of those restrictions. i think from a political angle, even if it's not good policy necessarily, there is a concern among the american worker over this issue. if you are bill de blasio, you're going out to push this point, you are trying to reach those voters. i see it from a politically strategic standpoint. the go and support policies like the green new deal, which would gut and decimate industries. spew on don't ask me to the kitchen and bath association, their workers go out into local schools, middle schools, try to encourage kids to be retrained for the jobs in the future. that's how businesses can get involved and he with automation. >> jessica: big fans of apprenticeship programs, huge partisan ideas.

i have a great weekend. we are back here monday at noon. now, here's harris. >> harris: this is breaking this outcome, the sheriff in santa barbara, california, is expected to give an update on tt tragic boat fire that left 34 people dead. a new report now is pointing to some serious safety issues on board that boat. the conception. you are watching "outnumbered overtime" now. i'm harris faulkner. today's news conference is coming amid reports that the preliminary investigation found some deficiencies with the boat, named concepcion. including the lack of roaming the nightwatchman, and the findings are now reportedly raising questions over why the crew was properly trained. let's go lie first to william la jeunesse and get santa barbara with the latest. william? >> harris, we can begin to connect the dots, see those deficiencies, and basically find out why so many people had to