>> sandra: [laughs] all good, there. >> bill: i need your bares defense to do well. >> sandra: but they're not. all right, that does it for us. thanks for joining us. we'll see you tomorrow morning. "outnumbered" starts right now. >> julie: fox news alert, and be a begin of president trump's former rush advisor, fiona hale, meaning behind closed doors with house lawmakers today for a transcribed interview as part of democrats' impeachment probe. it is unclear how much he actually knows about president trump's call with the ukrainian president, which happened back in july. meanwhile, as the inquiry advances, house intelligence chairman adam schiff says democrats may not need the whistleblower to testify after all. >> given that we already have the call record, we don't need the whistleblower who wasn't on the call to tell us what took place during the call. we have the best evidence. it may not be necessary to take steps that might reveal the whistleblower's identity to do that, and we make sure we

protect it whistleblower. >> president trump is now firing back, saying the whistleblower must testify, and even explain why he got the details of his conversation with ukraine's so wrong. this is to be "outnumbered," i'm julie banderas, and here today is host of "the evening edit" on the fox business network, elizabeth macdonald. fox news contributor, katie pavlich, and jeanne zaino, political science professor at iona college. joining us on the couch, the man in the middle, guy benson. most of "the guy benson show" on fox news radio, and you are "outnumbered." i hope you farewell! it's a full hour. >> guy: may come too pay [laughs] i'm buckling in >> julie: let's get right into, first of all, this person that is going to be resigning. resigned in july, before the actual phone call took place. i'm wondering how much are testimonies going to matter. since she wasn't even there in the white house on the phone call took place.

>> jeanne: i don't think we know yet. it's behind closed doors, there's a lot of questions why someone agreed to testify is subpoenaed. we do know that a republican member of the house who is not the committee try to go in and was not allowed into the testimony. so i don't think we know. we suspect she does have a sense as to what was going on potentially with rudy giuliani's involvement for that phone call, but obviously she was gone by the time a phone call was heard. >> julie: fiona hill, she was a former russian advisor to president trump. she left in august but she was essentially out in july. after she was out, that's when that phone call put it on my took the question is, why is she going to be brought forth to discuss a phone call that happened after she was there? i'm not sure what she can bring to the table. >> katie: she left the week before this phone call. before this took place. i think this is about democrats trying to give this viewpoint of asking former officials to come

forward making the impression that they have something to talk about. they are holding these hearings behind closed doors because people like adam schiff, who is leading this charge, doesn't want republicans to be able to have this out in the open to see what she's actually saying. they've been able to drip out select pieces of information that go with their narrative, rather than maybe the full context of the truth here. also, adam schiff doesn't want to bring the whistleblower's forward because he doesn't want the background of this in person, their affiliation with joe biden and what it may have been, their affiliation with the former national security council under the obama administration may have been, and who in the white house currently told them about the phone all do not call because the complaint is about he or she getting information secondhand. >> i want to talk more about her and her background pages to put it into context. she was skeptical of the president's even before he took office. she was a skeptic of putin and didn't believe the president should have relations with

putin. the putin relationship of president trump has been an interesting one, but the president has been wanting to sort of extend the olive branch to vladimir putin. where do you believe she stands when it comes to -- i guess, not being biased in this particular position? because she does have an opinion on the presidents relationship with russia. >> sure, and that's fine. i'm even willing to say i'm interested in what she has to say, especially if she can shed some light on rudy giuliani on what his role was. because it seems to be a murky piece of this strange puzzle. but i would like to hear from her, not through this blizzard that we get from adam schiff and the democrats where they are having all of these testimonies behind closed doors, these depositions, these interviews, and to get the opening statement leaked out and nothing else. occasionally they will selectively put a little drip or drab that we all then munch on collectively without giving a broad broader, more fulsome picture

about what happened by closed doors. if you go to the serious process of impeaching present, the american people have a right as he was going on, who is saying what, and way for ourselves of its relevance. >> julie: is it relevant can i give her testimony relevant? >> elizabeth: as guy just said, it's about what rudy giuliani was doing in the ukraine. right? we know that senator ted cruz is now saying, "it's not right, it's inappropriate to ask, including china, to look into a political rival." china is a communist surveillance state. but i think katie made the right point. you said it, too. the dems are setting the narrative. they are doing it behind closed doors, they are leaking out in dribs and drabs, and yes, article one say they get to set the rules of the proceedings, but this is about setting precedent for this country. we want this as a way to go forward where the republicans are in no place to cross-examine subpoena witnesses, provide counter arguments, and be accused of obstruction if they stand up and oppose? this is about precedent.

is this how we want this done going forward, where the republicans feel railroaded of the process right now? >> katie: and transparency holder to hold everybody accountable. it holds rudy giuliani accountable, the president, and adam schiff are he sing publicly. in the past, as you've seen , the opening statements have actually contradicted a lot of the narrative that is rushed out by adam schiff to the cameras immediately after. >> julie: speaking of transparency, joe biden's son, hunter, finally coming out announcing he will step down from the board of attorneys have been back private equity firm, and pledging not to work on behalf of foreign owned companies if his father in fact becomes president. this comes as president trump has stepped up scrutiny over biden's business dealings. the white house is reacting to the news. this was yesterday. >> he should have done this quite a while ago. in fact, he probably shouldn't have been on the board to begin with. i'm really disappointed in so many members of the mainstream media stretching there next to defend hunter biden, and we

must say, there is no wrongdoing here, nothing illegal. this is what people had about the swamp. this is part of how donald trump won in the first place. >> julie: this is the question. you are nodding your head. let me talk about transparency, i'm wondering why now? we are just now hearing from under biden. >> guy: politics. this was the biden campaign forced into a corner, and it's another unforced error by them. it has been astonishing to me how poorly the biden campaign has treated this entire process on this particular issue. they knew going into this presidential run, or they certainly should have known, that hunter biden and his business dealings overseas, it was going to be an issue that rival campaigns are going to bring up, including the incumbent and the trump campaign. the fact that they have been floundering and flopping all over the place with a terrible sort of ham-fisted response from joe biden, he's getting no

interviews himself about the subject. he is lashing out at the media saying various entities shouldn't book guests or treat this as a serious issue. at the last minute, finally, under biden is saying, "i'm going to disentangle myself from all of this." it's almost too little, too late is how it feels. it kind of also feels like an admission that there was something wrong. that they are doing it in the first place. >> julie: that's what i wanted to ask you. if he is saying that he is going to step down, why is he stepping down? it clearly there must have been a conflict of interest somewhere. that's number one. number two, i want to ask you about this. he was working for this ukrainian company where he was set to make $50,000 a year -- >> elizabeth: a month. >> julie: i met a month. he is now saying he didn't earn a dime. how do we believe that? who works for free? >> elizabeth: you're right. we should be able to ask those questions. he's not going to divest his stake in that chinese private equity fund. the minimus is like $420,000. it's not a big fund, but -- is also recent issues about the

trump family's dealings overseas, as well. for job i do say are not allowed asked questions i don't book guests, really? biden incorporated has been issued for decades. it's not just his son, it's also joe biden's brother, as well. his business dealings have been called into question. so the fact that he won't divest, that he will only move away from foreign business dealings, if this father becomes president there's a lot of caveats here. it feels like there's a bunch of caveats. >> jeanne: we have to be clear therjoe or hunter that they did anything illegal or wrong. your point - k >> jeanne: you have to look at -- >> julie: we have some breaking news. we will have more time to talk more about this. we have to get to a news conference right now. it's underway in fort worth, texas, with the attorney for the family of a texas woman who shot down mike was shot and killed by local police officer there. let's watch. >> seven officer have been involved deaths, that's more than most nations. for a single city in texas.

it represents a serious problem that must be addressed. of course, this family is calling for the firing of this officer, that is benign. it's the least we should expect. they're calling for this officer to be vigorously prosecuted, to be appropriate sentence. the prosecution, the investigation should be handled by someone other than the fourth root fort worth police berman paid the firm does justice, the fbi, worst-case scenario, the local sheriff's parent. other mike anyone other than the city that is competent to investigate itself should be called in. we expect this to happen immediately. this happens saturday. why this man is not in handcuffs right now is a source of continued agitation for this family, for this community. and it must be addressed. in a moment you will hear from cory hughes, an activist and a member of the fort worth community, and then you will hear directly from the family of

atatiana jefferson. >> just for the corrupt spelling of my name, it is c-o-r-y. my reality is that i've had the unfortunate responsibility of sitting in front of these cameras, sitting next to families that have lost loved ones by the hands of police officers all too often. as a member of the community of fort worth, as someone that has taken the responsibility to be a voice for my community, i want to set the record straight that we are not looking for a 30-day suspension. we are not looking for a slap on the wrist.

we are not looking for what seems to be status quo, the people that we hired to serve and protect us, when one of their own violates the community, it seems like they do more of trying to serve and protect their own. so what we are looking for is for this officer not only to be fired, but we are demanding that this officer be charged as well, like a criminal that he is. it's a sad commentary in this day and age that someone can be sitting in their home playing a video game with a family member, and not be safe. that when someone calls the police for a wellness check, instead of them checking on how well she is, we are talking about a fact that an officer took her life. it's unacceptable. we are demanding justice. we are demanding that the mayor and the city officials don't sweep this under the rug. we are not going to allow you to. this life matters. this life matters.

this family matters. we are demanding justice, and we are not going to wait. we demand justice now. thank you. >> all right, the next person you will hear from is going to be the brother of atatiana. i will allow them to traduce himself. >> my name is darius car, i am currently student down mike stationed in san diego. i serve my country for the last 12 years. in that time, i've been trained and taught that there are preplanned responses everything you do. everything you are trained about, there is a way to do things. when you don't do it though even trained with the way you've been taught, you have to answer for that. you have been trained. you know better, so you have to answer for that.

not in your command, not your department. someone comes in and investigated the whole incident. fort worth pd cannot investigate themselves. they should not be allowed to do it. this man murdered someone. he should be arrested. >> we want to continue to echo the calls and be clear that this family is standing in solidarity. that fort worth needs to recuse itself from this investigation, and they need to bring in an outside agency. they need to make sure this officer is treated like any other criminal suspect in our criminal justice system. the next person you're going to hear from is the sister of amber

-- i'm sorry, the sister of tay, and her name is amber. >> i am amber carr, i am one of her older sisters. we are 11 months apart. we grew up together. the last time i spoke to my sister was last saturday. she came to the hospital in plano where i was recovering from a major heart surgery. she came and brought me food, she brought me a cell phone, she talked about how this weekend, actually, was the weekend that she and my oldest sister were planning to take the boys to the fair and asked me whether i wanted -- she knew i wasn't going to be able to walk.

my sister, the relationship she has with my son is undescribabl undescribable. sometimes people think that they are her kids and not mine. she helps zion every day to get ready for school, because my mother was incapable of doing it. she wrote out a schedule so that he could be organized. she helped him understand that he had to be responsible for putting on his clothes, picking out his clothes, and getting ready on time to leave for the day. those were things that my mom did for him, so she helped him become more independent and self-sufficient. my son who was there to witness

the event, you would think that he would show some type of sadness or emotions, but the first time i actually got to see him and pick him up from a facility for children, the first thing he told me as he was sad. i asked him, why was he said? and he told me it's because the police had shot his aunt. at that time i knew nothing about that. so he was the one who actually told me what happened. at this time, he is my motivation and he is my biggest encourager in the middle of the night when i'm crying. he wakes up and tells me to breathe in my nose and out my mouth. he holds me, he hugs me, and these are the things i should be doing for him, but he's not reacting in that manner. he's helping me to be strong.

and i believe that's because my sister have a big part in that. >> the next person you are going to hear from, she is prepared a statement that we will allow her to come around. her name is ashley carr. >> julie: we are listening to the family and from the lawyer representing atatiana jefferson's family. she was fatally shot by a police officer, a member of the fort worth police department, over the weekend. it is just a heart-wrenching story. the details are still sort of leaking out. there was a body cam on the police officer who was outside the home while atatiana jefferson was babysitting her 8-year-old nephew. in fact, the two were playing video games. as it seems, as the facts are starting to spell out, a neighbor had made a call to the police department. not an emergency call. it was a nonemergency call. it was a wellness call. when they placed that call, the sibley told the police department that a door was left

open. that was it. the front door to be home was left open, the lights were on. so the police were simply going to check on the home. somehow that led to a police officer opening fire three window, shooting and killing atatiana jefferson right in front of her 8-year-old nephew. that is all we know now, and investigation continues. the family and the lawyer want to see this justice served, and this police officer fired and charged with criminal activity. but the investigation continues. we will continue to watch this heart-wrenching story. we'll be right back. i'm your cat. ever since you brought me home, that day. i've been plotting to destroy you. sizing you up... calculating your every move. you think this is love? this is a billion years of tiger dna just ready to pounce. and if you have the wrong home insurance coverage, you could be coughing up the cash for this. so get allstate and be better protected from mayhem, like me-ow.

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here, hello! starts with -hi!mple... how can i help? a data plan for everyone. everyone? everyone. let's send to everyone! [ camera clicking ] wifi up there? -ahhh. sure, why not? how'd he get out?! a camera might figure it out. that was easy! glad i could help. at xfinity, we're here to make life simple. easy. awesome. so come ask, shop, discover at your xfinity store today. >> katie: the syrian army deploying troops of the northern border after striking a brokered deal with the kurds to help with the military offensive.

the turks releasing this new video of air strikes hitting kurdish soldiers. meantime, back in washington we are learning the pentagon is accelerating plans to get all remaining u.s. troops out of syria within the coming weeks or days. and south carolina senator lindsey graham says he's meeting with president trump today about enacting crippling sanctions against turkey. guy, what are your thoughts on the continuing fallout over the past couple of days? >> guy: it's just a disaster. every report we've seen suggests the kurds, our friends, are all lies, people who did a lot of our dirty work on the grounds we can have a light footprint to defeat isis, they are being decimated. it is very sad to see. if there will be sections, i support sanctions. i think it's the least we can do at this point. it's a failure of american leadership era, were now the kurds, who have done so much for us, feel like they have no choice but to go to assad and

the russians to beg for protection. i can't blame them, but i think it's a shame in every sense of that word that they were forced to do so. >> katie: lives, it seems like the administration is trying to come up with a solution to the fallout to try and stop turkey, which is going further than they were initially going to. the turkish currency act has fallen to the last couple hours as a result of congress and the president talking about this. you run the business channel. what would it mean for turkey's economy if sanctions were to get pushed? >> elizabeth: turkey had a problem with currency within the last couple years, ricocheting around and being devalued. you're right, that is an issue for turkey. right now turkey likely faces russia, syria, iran, the united states, and the european union. so you wonder what turkey's position will be about. will it accept the no-fly zone, a safe safe haven? there's a lot of critics saying yes. it's horrifying that our kurdish

allies are being attacked and decimated as they are, and we know that isis prisoners are now -- 785 out of 12000 isis jihadis in the region, that's an issue, too. two they have fake u.s. passports to make with a stay in the north eastern part of the country and wreak havoc? will turkey face incursions from isis and other rebels, as well? >> katie: your thoughts? >> jeanne: one thing this really does underscore is that for those people who think the president does not have -- that he's not committed to an ideology, he absolutely is. he has been committed from the time of the election to make america great, bring those soldiers home, noninterventionism. unfortunately, to your point of view create a power vacuum. one lesson is that you can't make a foreign policy the way you wish to make it. you have to make it based on the circumstances. we have left a valuable, real close ally over their incredibly vulnerable, and russia, iran, saudi arabia, they are going move in on that. >> guy: the touchstone is

"bring our people home," which is very appealing to americans. >> julie: then why send troops? just the fact the syrian people are no victims to assad's regime is really disconcerting. is a travesty, quite frankly. they will not have protection. to listen to russia and turkey is sort of giving into the evil, the lesser of two evils, which is -- i'm not really quite sure. >> katie: guy, the isis fighters, a number of them, have escaped. the president said it'll be easy to go back and get them. to his credit, the europeans didn't step up here to take back or deal with his isis problem. was a lot of the reason why we are in the situation we're in right now. right out angela merkel of germany is finally telling turkey the mediation back off. >> guy: an angry phone call. >> katie: don't the europeans have responsibly for the current situation? >> guy: absolutely. this is one of the best point strap has made. this will impact europe more more immediately than they will the united states. some people might be misjudging

the politics of this. trump may have more support than the commentary it suggest. the first westerner they taken behead, god forbid, that some can be tested in a mentoring boat committed though my political problem, too >> speak out the basement push against president trump. what he's saying and whether he should be careful what he wishes for. ♪ i have huge money saving news for veterans. mortgage rates just dropped to near 50-year lows. one call to newday usa can save you $2,000 every year.

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impeachment inquiry, telling an audience in iowa that if the president hadn't asked ukraine to investigate him and his son none of this would be happening. okay, first of all, the phone call, yes, did involve the fact of the president, katie, want to the bidens investigated. but the impeachment hearings, last i checked he's not on congress so therefore he's not actually responsible for putting forth the inquiry. am i wrong? [laughter] >> katie: i think joe biden needs to have a common conversn without green, introduced articles of impeachment on the house for like three months after the president was elected. jerry nadler, who as soon as the depressor cover the house was found to be two. maxine waters has been all over your television saying she deserves credit. one of the first people. if joe biden wants to use this as a way to try and get some kind of campaign leverage, then go for it. but there's a lot of other democrats that deserve credit for it first. [laughs] >> elizabeth: i feel like i've fallen through the looking glass

and i'm standing on the other side of the mirror. i'm not sure this is the comeback joe biden really wants right now. the media was calling for president trump's impeachment before he was even elected. i think it started -- we did on "the evening at it" back to march of 2016. even before he was elected and sat in the office. i'm not sure this is the place, or the seat that joe biden wants to be sitting in right now given that there are still questions about what was going on. >> julie: convince her to his campaign? is he deflecting? there was an investigation of the president was in belief should be done. >> guy: most americans agree there should be an investigation into the bidens. the question is whether trump did approach that and pursue that inappropriately, which i believe that he did. look, i understand what biden is trying to say here. he's trying to say, "i held my powder, i kept it dry, i didn't come out for impeachment until this huge thing." the polls were against impeachment, 20 or 30 points underwater until the ukraine matter. biden is at the center of that.

i understand the point he's trying to make, but he's doing it badly, unsurprisingly. if i were him, or advising him -- which i'm definitely not -- he should be, instead of bubbling like that, he should say "the reason we have impeachment right now is over this inappropriate abuse of power," whatever, "for president trump." and why did he i could beat him." but he can't stay on track, joe biden. the problem is the candidates. see five this is why his campaign is frustrated. he stumbles all the time. there's no other adage in politics. when your opponent is being hit by someone else can you say quiet and before with your campaign. he better look behind them or in front of him now where elizabeth warren is coming on strong. he shouldn't be talking about corruption surrounding himself and his son and the ukraine and impeachment. he should say quiet on that.

if you want to say he supports with the democrats are doing in the house, that's enough. move forward with your campaign. you could have a very big shock at iowa, new hampshire, god preferred it for him, south carolina. elizabeth warren is beating him in the polls. he needs to look at her. run the race or running, stop fighting about impeachment. >> katie: because two weighs on joe biden. first, democrats running against him can say, "you are only for impeachment when it got personal for you. you aren't looking out for the good of the country in getting this guy you sent is abusing his power out of office." the other thing is that tom can go after him and say is that the only way he wants impeachment if he doesn't want transparency with his families dealings with ukraine and china. so i'm not sure he wants -- >> julie: he should pay attention to his own family. he said he had no idea that the lawyer was going to be releasing that statement that he was stepping down. so maybe the two of them should talk. >> katie: he also claims he didn't talk to hunter biden about the business dealings and we now know that's not true.

>> julie: we are going to move on. bernie sanders attacking elizabeth warren as a capitalist as he tries to set himself apart from his biggest challenge or on the left. will it be enough to give him a boost in the polls? ♪ oh! oh! oh!

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thanks, lady. taxi! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ >> there are difference between elizabeth and myself. elizabeth, as i think you know, has said she is a capitalist. i'm not. the reason i'm not is because i will not tolerate for one second the kind of greed and corruption and income and wealth inequality and so much suffering that is going on in this country. >> elizabeth: 2020 candidate bernie sanders looking to contrast himself with elizabeth warren, the vermont senator he was back on the campaign trail after suffering r this month is painting himself as the one true progressive in the reset of tomorrow's primary democratic debate in ohio. katie, you, you know it always bothers me about bernie sanders'

statistics? when he talks about income inequality, he's only talking about income. he doesn't take into account 401(k)s, pension plans, and income tax credit, medicare, medicaid. it leaves out all the government support programs out of his mouth when he brings up income inequality. he is consistently whipping fastballs by the american people. but he says he will raise taxes on the lower income classes, including middle-class. >> katie: bernie sanders, if you believe what he says about wealth inequality, that he's part of the problem. he's a millionaire, he says he's a socialist, but he has so the riches of capitalism at its back for years now. he has multiple homes, millions of dollars, he has received many book deals, and he has not given that money away to the poor and to solve this income inequality problem he talks about. the interesting thing here is the politics of this. when it comes to them, they have this peace pact that they wouldn't criticize each other publicly. that is over. the question is now going to be, moving forward, there can only be one of them on the far left.

will bernie supporters go for elizabeth warren and vice versa if they really have different policy? >> elizabeth: cute is the thing, do you think is a capitalist? it seems like critics or think she was up at the u.s. economy locked-in who and her teachers faculty lounge. >> guy: he calls her socialist, and she's a socialist or cauldrons of capitalist. but there's very little delay between the two of them at tecumseh policy. they both want massive, enormous, astonishingly expensive government inclusions into their lives. i'm just curious, to katie's point, they are playing nice. especially on the bit sage. will they continue to play nice? i think it's in warren's interest to keep the peace pact. i think bernie looks expert here. when you look at the polling you can probably figure out why he might be feeling that way. she's going to keep smiling and giving a sums up to bernie, as to not alienate his supporters moving forward.

he might feel like he has to make. >> elizabeth: what do you think, julie? >> julie: socialist at messerli pole so well. maybe he should look at himself and said of saying how much he hates the capitals of the rich. he's insulting himself there. there's a gallup poll that found 61% think it's a bad thing for the united states, and that's not something that bodes very well in the election cycle. obviously he's going to go up for warren, she's now leading in the polls and that's going to be her target. >> elizabeth: let's look at bernie sanders, unveiling a new plan is team is calling the boldest -- it's tax hikes. was your reaction to what bernie is proposing now, what he's talking about? >> jeanne: it's interesting to me. elizabeth warren has benefited so much during this campaign from what has happened. number one, her opponents, biden, being charged by corruption by the president. then bernie sanders us think she's a capitalist paired what does elizabeth warren need to do if she can make it through the primary gauntlet connection

is moved to the center. i'm not sure who is giving bernie sanders this advice, but she is beating him of the polls. i don't know if either of these guys are paying attention to these polls. she is beating both of them now on these polls. this is benefiting her, not him. >> elizabeth: still dodging questions, elizabeth warren dodging questions on whether he/she will raise taxes under a plan, which she would probably have two. new science president trump's push to get mexico to step up on border security may be working. details ahead. ♪ orlando isn't just the theme park capital of the world, it also has the highest growth in manufacturing jobs in the us. it's a competition for the talent. employees need more than just a paycheck. you definitely want to take advantage of all the benefits you can get. 2/3 of employees said that the workplace is an important source for personal savings and protection solutions. the workplace should be a source of financial security. keeping your people happy is what keeps your people. that's financial wellness. put your employees on a path to financial wellness with prudential.

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♪ >> katie: mexican authorities say they felt that a group of roughly 2,000 migrants heading for the united states early saturday in southern mexico near the guatemalan border. the move comes after president trump brokered a deal with mexico back in june to step up security efforts after its threatening tariffs. the president over the weekend applauding progress with mexico. >> we have 27,000 mexican soldiers on our border, and the numbers are dropped off the table. i want to thank the president of mexico and mexico for doing an incredible job. [applause] >> katie: all right, guy. what is your perspective on these numbers going down? border patrol issued new numbers

last week saying that for four months in a row border crossings are down, as well. in addition to seeing a lack of these caravans continued to move north. >> guy: it's still a problem. it hasn't been solved. but there's been significant progress. i am struck here by the short attention span of the political media, because the crisis of the border was a huge, huge story months ago and we were all freaking out about it. then everyone moved onto the next big outrage du jour, and we've forgot about what happens. but the trump in this region has not. this is an area where they deserve a lot of credit. not just striking a deal with mexico, but also three central american countries with these so-called safe third country agreements that have made a real dent in this problem. again, congress needs to step up and fix it more permanently. in terms of doing what a president can do, trump and his administration really have made headway on their spirit almost no one is noticing. >> katie: lives, that's a problem, right? the administration does things to slow down the crossings, but

now congress is like, "it's off the table, it's not a crisis anymore." >> elizabeth: to your point, i'm always curious if the democrats think they can fix climate change and they can't fix the border. [laughs] as jeh johnson, who was obama's former homeland security secretary, has rightly said, we are basically leading into this country -- or, rather, branding at the border -- the equivalent now, of indianapolis or boston in the last fiscal year. that's a lot of people. that puts a lot of stress on our border guys. it's not fair to them or this country are of the immigrants came here legally, who got in line and waited forever and do it the right way. i'm always astounded at people who are apologists for what's going on in the border. it's unfair and it's unfair to the towns are on the border. there are so many inequities in this story. >> katie: there's also the criminal element, traffickers, human traffickers, the cartels

who have benefited as a result of congress not doing anything. >> julie: i think credit needs to be given where credit is due. the fact that mexico was stepping up, this is parade was the last time we saw mexico step it up? you have people from central america and africa and the caribbean that were detained. a lot of these people were waiting for months and mexico. it was also part of the deal, that they have to wait for asylum in mexico before they are allowed to come to the country. but the fact that mexico is stepping up and taking responsibility of the border with guatemala, that's huge. i don't know if we are hearing much about that. i think we should be hearing more. >> guy: it's because of trump. >> julie: absolutely. i don't think the majority of mainstream media is supporting this sufficiently enough. that's a huge step in the right direction. >> katie: quick last word? >> jeanne: it's astonishing to have another election without congress dealing with immigration. every president and the 21st century, this is the issue they've run on and it has still not been resolved by congress. it's something to me. >> katie: moving along,

alexandria ocasio-cortez raising eyebrows with an apparent swipe at the united states while overseas. we will tell you what she said, up next. ♪ with va mortgage rates near record lows, i want to tell as many veterans as possible about newday's va streamline refi. it's the closest thing to automatic savings that we've ever offered. at newday, veterans can refinance their mortgage with no income verification, no appraisal and no out of pocket expenses. and we've extended our call center hours so that every veteran can take advantage of these near record low rates.

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and we have the fastest shipping around. dollar down. gold up. pretty clear. make gold your new standard. call rosland capital today at 800-630-8900. 800-630-8900. that's 800-630-8900. >> katie: alexandria ocasio-cortez taking an apparent dig at the u.s. while celebrating her 30th birthday in denmark, where she was attending the c40 climate conference. the aggressive fire branch reading, "thank you, everybody, for the birthday wishes. spending the day in denmark after c40, entering the social that treats health care and democracy as reds, zero carbon as parity, and infrastructure as a key public good. here's to another year of fighting for our future." so, denmark is better than america, apparently, guy. because they believe in zero

emissions, which makes me wonder how she got to the conference. she certainly didn't sail across the ocean. >> guy: she didn't. i think she's making a point about priority. i want to give her a break on her birthday. happy birthday, aoc. come into the 30s, the water is fine. [a lot of fun. it would be fun to have a beer or cocktail submit, her call, to discuss some of the profound disagreements that we have. >> katie: very careful, she might accuse you of catcalling. >> guy: are not kept calling, it's a genuine, friendly invitation for happy birthday to her. >> katie: lives, your reaction? speed through the prime minister of denmark said the fuse ago, "we are not a socialist country. stop calling us socialist, we are capitalist welfare" even the country she is and doesn't have a federally mandated union wage. the units click of the bargain of her. she hasn't gotten her facts straight about what economic models work and what doesn't. we are capital welfare state, a big welfare system supported by the taxpayer. if she continues not to

acknowledge that, she continues to erode her own credibility. >> katie: your reaction? >> jeanne: she has to follow this a bit she's committed method, with how are you going to pay for it? us the question that should always be asked. i am vying to dream and think about all these ideas. college for everybody, jobs for everybody. it's got to pay for these things that she needs to say how she plans to do that. >> katie: what about that precritical side of this? you have all these people go to this conference is taking planes to get there, they don't seem to be monitoring their own behavior when it comes to this area but they are locked on like rick wow lecturing the rest of us >> jeanne: they have to follow up with little greta about how she came to the u.n. [laughter] >> guy: skype in. >> katie: happy birthday to her. guy is being very gracious and diplomatic. in q2 guy benson. we are back tomorrow at noon eastern. now here's julian ferris. >> julie: fox news alert, the white house pushing back as democrats hear from key players in the ukraine controversy.

this is to is "outnumbered overtime," i'm julie banderas and for harris faulkner. after a big week on capitol hill, at least for current or former trump administrations officials are set to testify in democratic's impeachment inquiry. today the president's former top russia advisor, fiona hill, appearing for an interview between -- before some house committees. the nbc news reporting that hill will be testifying, that rudy giuliani and the ambassador broke with procedure to pursue a fan of policy ukraine. they have set a deadline of tomorrow for giuliani, vp pence, the pentagon, and the white house. to turn over meanwhile, they say the investigation is falling apart. >> it's of fraud being perpetrated on the american people by adam schiff, by nancy pelosi. they made up a phony conversation, they got caught. the reason they got caught this because they never thought