october 26. i'm john scott. thanks for joining us. i will see you again tomorrow. ♪ mark: hello america i am mark levin and is a "life, liberty and levin." senator ron johnson how are you? >> rate, nice to be here. mark: republican from wisconsin. when the reasons i wanted you here was because two sundays ago when he tried to actually talk and explain yourself for "meet the press" chuck todd kept cutting you off and i thought it would important to bringng you back here on my program to hear what you had have to say but also because of your position in the united states senate. you are the chairman of the

committee that oversees the cavities with ukraine and the united states among other positions you hold in the united states senate. we have this document that came out, the president's phonecall a transcript of it that the president of ukraine. in fact back in july and people are trying to, the democrats in particular, say the president was seeking a quid pro quo. i don't read this in here. you have this sum back roundedness. you hadan a meeting with the president in may of this year. do you want to tell us about that? >> sure and the transcript i think it's a pretty gracious phonecall on the part of the president but i went to ukraine in may, on may 20 for the inauguration of president zelensky credit when they were secretary perry the ambassador to the european union and kurt volker who was the special on

very to ukraine. we felt it was important coming back, we were impressed with zelensky and we thought it was important to me with the president and give him support of ukraine. we had a meeting in the oval office on may 23 of this year and again just making up point. to invite zelensky to the oval office as quickly as possible to show support and the ambassador could get strong bipartisan support. we weren't urging the president to show strong support for the people of ukraine. i was certainly surprised at the president's reaction which has been consistent throughout this. first of all he talked about the level of corruption in ukraine and mark there's all kinds of smoke about the hillary clinton campaign and the dnc being involved in the 2016 election not specific but just general. president zelensky got a mandate so it's obvious ukraine is a

crepe place than any president ought to be asking pretty hard questions. is this the place where we ought to be providing a lot of support to and secondly, and he is been very consistent on this, why is it europe showing support? those are the two main reasons and so the four of us left the meeting andbe realizing we havea sales job to do. we also ported ukraine and we wanted to make sure the president was supportive but then that was the start of light knowledge of the fact that president trump has real reservations about providing so full support for ukraine. mark: fulsome port for ukraine so your reservations for sending money to any corrupt -- >> we weren't even talking about that at that point. mark: where is europe and why are they stepping in? after all ukraine as a bulwark against russia. so as you point out.

consistent with how the president thinks about nato and wired they stepping up or syria or whatever it is. it seems. neutral in the sense he wasn't seeking anything from anybody. later you have a phonecall with the president on august 31 of this year. tell me about that and why was there a phonecall? >> i had a trip scheduled to visit president zelensky on september 5 this year in the day before or a couple of days before it heard the president was considering holding some military support which by the way he provided the referendum that obama didn't provide so he has provided that in the past but now he's considering in this fiscal year. i called up gordon sondland the day before asking what was happening here. mark: ambassador. >> ambassador sondland and i can't tell you exactly how gordon described this but there was something in the works. they are trying to do something you know that president zelensky

would have to do something in order to really free up that support. but anyway i put in your quest to talk to the president he called me back on the following day on august 31. i was trying to convince the president in that phonecall to give authority to say it's on the way. once again the president was incredibly consistent. he said ron you know how corrupt it is. he made that point and he really hammered on the lack of european support he talked about angela merkel and i asked angela why are you funding this thing and angela tells me because you are. said ron, we are schmuck's. that was the reason he gave me. i've been brought up this rumor i've heard is there something in the works? does zelensky have to do something or does ukraine have

to show you something in order for this support to be released and that is where he made the adamant vehement denial. again i describe it as expletives deleted, no way. i would never do that. who he told me that at which point i felt guilty. well gordon. i was a conversation. and went on the record lastt friday with "the wall street journal" laying that out after the text between gordon sondland and curt volcker became of -- and public. when i spoke to the president well below thet whistleblower complaint was made public out of the blue and he didn't know i was going to raise that issue. his immediate reaction was adamant vehement angry denial. i would never do that. i thought it was important to get that fact on the table. mark: i just want to underscore the point in may he says look i'm concerned it's corrupt over there and why don't we give them

support? you talk to him on august 31 and basically the same thing. irony told the wrong hee says they are corrupt over there and where the hell is merkel in germany? let them give them the support they never discussed any kind of quid pro quo. is that correct? >> correct. i'm the one that issued -- raise then issue. it's all rather nebulous but i described it enough where he got ticked off. he did not like hearing that and he jahim attlee denied it. mark: my recollection it wasn't until september 9 give or take or could be later that he began to learn about the so-called whistleblower in the leaks coming out of capitol hill and documents onto them on the ninth and the intelligence community according to the timeline so it's not the president coming up with an after-the-fact explanation for what took place. as the president of united states doing exactly what the president has said sun switches know, they got the support but i

needed to make sure they weren't going to basically rally with the money. they weren't going to abuse the money and also we wanted support from other allies. >> by the way there's a fair record of u.s. support getting wasted in ukraine going to banks and not knowing where it goes to so there's thee history of this and there's no dispute that there is a lot of corruption in ukraine so it's a legitimate concern the president had and he was expressing a concern. mark: the new united states and are you hold a couple of powerful positions in the united states and in one of them isti your relationship with ukraine. you've been there several times before. you kind of know the action -- actors over there. you have discussions with the president of united states in real time on his support on this. you are trying to lobby him to provide it and eventually he does. has nothing to do with the whistleblower and get your

message is being drowned out. the static out that they'd rather listen to adam schiff tryingng to push a quid pro quo. there's no quid pro quo in this telephone call. you are telling me now back in may of this year august 31 of this year you told the president nothing of this sort came up. it was a consistent argument he made. they are corrupt. i don't want to just give the money. is that correct? p mark i'm from the private sector and once i enter the privateyo realm which was reinforced to me, i listen to you and i'm a fan. i've always known the advice but what was reallyn reinforced to e was the bias in the media was revealed more to me than what they don't report them but they are not curious about versus the very overt and real bias on what they do report. if they are not reporting it,

it's not a new story and that's what drives conservatives and that's what drives me, it drives you and it drives president trump nuts. mark: now you have been looking into this ukraine letter for a long time, long before the last month or two. was ukraine involved in the 2016th campaign? >> this is according to "politico." chuck grassley and i have an oversight letter referring to that article written by ken volcker who works for the times. he's talking about the potential of the dnc involvement working with corrupt act years in ukraine trying to dig up on president trump or at that point in time paul manafort. it's also possible in people don't realize this as well hillary clinton had a primary. there was one joe biden potentially getting into that race as well. is it just possible or possible

that maybe the dnc and maybe the hillary clinton campaign was trying to dig up on joe biden been in ukraine? i'm not throwing out accusations are making any allegations. i'm just saying there are so many questions that remain unanswered and they remain unanswered tickets by large the press doesn't try to get the answer to these things. mark: what did hillary clinton's campaign and the dncnc do in ukraine? feed them information? >> they certainly encouraged information to be revealed by ukrainian actors. you had the ledger that showed paul manafort being paid back but at the same time you had that ledger showing people associated with the democratic party and were paid but that wasn't revealed. to my knowledge it wasn't highlighted by ukrainian officials so there seem to be at that point in timeid. one-sided. mark: back then thehe corrupt older ukrainian government was

trying to help hillary clinton against donald trump? >> they were probably making a bet. they probably thought hillary clinton had the best chance of becoming president and i don't care who you are in ukraine, their relationship with america's. darn important so you understand the relationship and their motivation to be there. mark: it's the only connectionio between a politician and the russians was the hillary campaign and the dnc paying for the dossier and they turned out on trump. you are telling me now ukraine again was the hillary campaign in the dnc and they are trying to turn it into an impeachment event. >> when people say the only campaign that was literally core operating including with the foreign government, it wasn't the trump campaign. it was the hillary clinton campaign. mark: ladies and gentlemen don't forget the most week nights you can find me on levin tv could sign up by calling eight 44 levin tv or go to blaze tv.com/

blaze tv.com/. we would love to have you. we will be right back. and getting her car towed. all i had to take care of was making sure that my daughter was ok. if i met another veteran, and they were with another insurance company, i would tell them, you need to join usaa because they have better rates, and better service. we're the gomez family... we're the rivera family... we're the kirby family, and we are usaa members for life. get your auto insurance quote today.

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mark: senator johnson you mentioned a piece in "politico" january 11, 2017 could have been busy creating efforts to sabotage trump backfire. and i want to read a partial quote. ukrainian government officials tried to help hillary clinton and undermine trump and did so by disseminating documents implicating a top trump aide in corruption and suggesting they weren't as to getting the matter i'm going to assume that was matter. trained officials reportedly quote help clinton's allies research damaging information on trump and his advisers. that is -- and it kind of went under the radar. is it conceivable that a cia or john brennan in particular, the sort of thingng is going on ande wouldn't know about it? >> i suppose it's conceivable that the headline set at backfire. i would argue this is just news.

this is an insuranceha policy. they have this information but what has happened to the trump administration. chuck todd cut you off when i started talking about the december 15, 2016 text from peter strzok and lisa page. mark: i'm not going to cut you off. can i quote it? december 15, 2016 text from peter strzok to lisa page quote think their sisters the cia had begun leaking like mad, scorned and worried at "politico" they are kicking into overdrive. >> again this is duringit the transition a little bit more than a month after the election. six months before that is the first story that breaks in the ci a is attributed to it. mark: the "boston globe" washington the cia has concluded in6 a secret assessment that russia intervened in the 2016

election to help donald trump win the presidency. isis that what you are talking about? >> precisely. mark one of the things that my staff due in july of 2017 is issue a report becausese of all these leaks. i am a seasoned rep reporter on my staff. we looked with a lexis search. let's look at these new stories talking about a leak and in that in just 125 days, 126 days there were 125 weeks into the news media. 62 of those had to do with national security and that compares to the same time period and the bush administration in eight under obama. 62 national security leaks and this is where this whole narrative began back in december with trump, the campaign being aided by raschein finally turning it into trump colluded with russia to steal the

election election from hillary clinton and that resulted in the special counsel and it's done great damage i would argue to this democracy. mark: you think the fbi and the cia set up this president, don't you? >> i have my suspicions let's put it that way and again you bet peter strzok texting lisa page about sisters leaking like mad. what are they worried about? he talks about them being political. there kicking it into overdrive. i said hey you have john brennan on your show. why don'tho you ask him what hes her what the cia might have been leaking and chuck didn't answer that question at all. i'd like to ask a question of john brennan. mark: you think in part this phony russia scandal was t pushd and developed to take attention away from the ukrainianan scandl and the ken vogel piece where he is writing in political

basically hillary clinton and the dnc were colluding with a corrupt ukrainian government. >> oral or the exoneration of hillary clinton's e-mail scandal. we started that committee in march of 2017. we did yield to the inspector general who issued his report on that but again i think there is real corruption and that. mark: his quote that i read from this ken vogel piece you pointed out the piece january 11, 2017 ukrainian efforts to sabotage trump backfire and it had some detail about what to place. that is what the president is talking about, his conversation with the newly-elected president. he sang this one on.re something to waste here. can you look into this? do us a favor and help the attorney general and so forth in looking into these things in that we have the u.s. attorney looking into these things. >> if the news media would have done their job, if they would have just sense the attention to

this as they have the whole russian collusion narrative which again i think was spoonfed to them white gap there week after week. mark: we no wonder the senior level of the yetet vi source. >> had the news media paid any attention to that, this could be a whole different story. mark: this is remarkable. we have the president of the united states now being confronted by a democrat house of representatives that is conducting an investigation, cutting out the republicans, going around the process in place for three prior presents two-faced hearings taking testimony behind closed doors, cherry-picking pieces to leak out to the media which is more than happy to just ride what they give them. not allowing the president's counsel to be t president. not allowing cross-examination. not allowing the republicans to subpoenar witnesses that happend

to nixon and clinton, pushing this narrative on ukraine when in fact the big story is hillary clinton and the dnc went to ukraine or their surrogates did to try to take out the president of the united states. >> mark that's all old news and a guy like ron johnson is just a conspiracy theorist as this ken vogel as is john solomon. you will be t part of that too because you are an airing this. that has always been my concern. when they began the whole clinton e-mail investigation out of our committee he couldn't obtain the information. it was a criminal investigation so that hampers congressional investigations. many years later we still have all the information. there are so many unanswered questions but when we start developing it by the time we laid out to the public, why are you worried out about this?

you are conspiracy theorist. from my standpoint i hear it's just the world talking about this ukrainian call was the greatest threat to our constitution. the greatest threat to ourur constitution is potentially a duly elected president of the united states having his administration sabotaged. former members of the previous administration. people potentially in the cia, potentially in the fbi and what was the insurance policy? why did peter strzok to be part of the mueller administration before he was fired why was his concern that there was no bear there? he was the leading investigator by the fbi so many months later he's already thinking there's nothings there but he's happy to join the special counsel investigation of something that he thinks there's no there there. mark: i think this is why the trove of information gets out

and it makes sense to join this behind closed doors and questions raised by the republicans. they really don't want to get to the bottom of the gray matter. they want to use the phonecall to set up the president of the united states. i will be right back. to relieve moderate pain, yet non-addictive and gentle on the body. salonpas. it's good medicine. hisamitsu. but how do i know if i'm i'm getting a good deal? i tell truecar my zip and which car i want and truecar shows the range of prices people in my area actually paid for the same car so i know if i'm getting a great price. this is how car buying was always meant to be. this is truecar.

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more people near huge wildfire in northern california. as pacific gas & electric begins another power shut off because of growing winds and high fire danger in the area affecting up to 2 million californians. but they are prevented shut off in as many weeks in the concerned gusty winds could fuel more fires that could reach up to 85 miles an hour. president trump's planning to attend game five of the world series tomorrow. commissioner philippe says the president plans to arrive when the game is underway before the final out but first tonight we have game for the houston astros will try to even things up with the washington nationals. that game begins in half an hour and you can watch it exclusively on fox. to "life, liberty and levin." mark: senator ron johnson nancy pelosi the speaker announces before the transcript is even released that she has declared

light eva peron that we are going to conduct a formal impeachment. which they really are conducting not a formal impeachment but trying to pick their topics to focus on. she had to have known about the complaints because schiff knew about the complaint from a staffer by then. she had to know the h complaint. they thought they had the president of the united states with the secondhand cia operative democrat with connections to biden complaint. but then the president says you know what, i'm going to release this thing. he t releases the telephone transcript after conferring with the president of ukraine but in and of itself what does that do to a country? releasing a transcript like ohat? >> it's incredibly damaging. drives me crazy to hear about

the phonecall being the greatest threat to our constitution. the greatest threat is now you have damaged any presence ability to conduct foreign policy. what foreign leaders going to candidly speak to the president either in private or corporate the phone? and oh by the way there's a reason wehe have executive privilege. in order to govern a president has to have candid advice from us at visors to the impeachment process and executive privilege as well so the damage being done to our democracy and the damage being done to our constitution is being done by nancy pelosi, adam schiff and whoever started this whole false russian narrative, the russian collusion with the trump campaign that resulted in special counsel. that's the problem with our democracy. mark: taking theco special counsel's report they don't even bring it up anymore. two and a half years and the american people are dragged through this with illegal

analysts goingng on and on about how the president is going to be and i did to be indicted with a secret indictment in the southern district of new york in the campaign-finance and none of it happened, zero. they keep working it and they bring mueller in the mueller falls on its face for abuse reasons. they still keep working it. they can't and then they get ukraine. they have the so-calledlo whistleblower the guy who tips off adam schiff. the guy hires lawyers who were out for the president of the united states. a secondhand guy gets information he was tied to biden but heard stuff. you know when i worked in the reagan administration if you have a cia guy or gal who is gathering information on the president of the united o states who really has no business gathering information on the president of the united states he goes to a democrat on capitol hill and dresses it up as a whistleblower complaint. wyou know what we used to call that in the reagan

administration? a spy, a spy. from what you are telling me this isn't the first time the cia has conducted itself in sabotaging the president. are we ever going to get to the bottom of this? >> i'm certainly trying to that we and our oversight capacity when struck was talking a page about putting an intelligence committed the guy in the transition with vice president pence trying to get basically a stool pigeon involved in the administration. we have got such a treasure trove of unvarnished testimony quite honestly from the tax. we don't understand everything. i can't tell you exactly what he means when there is no there there but it's unvarnished. it backs up with other pieces of information that i think are quite revealing and my whole

goal in this process is to lay out the timeline. going back to basically our investigation of the hillary clinton e-mail investigation of the attacks were being produced during that examination and how that all morphed. here's a little factoid. you realize the fbi that with christopher steele on july 5, 2016. that's the exact same day james comey held his press conference exonerating hillary clinton. it went right from that operation, how can we produce an investigation that looks like it's real but that we really don't fully utilize the grand jury. it's not a serious investigation. one about how do we exonerate hillary clinton and now we are going to make sure that we can use the same information to sabotage the administration? do i have all the evidence on

this? know a but there's an awful lotf indication and it was the strozk page text that are in the league of way revealing and when you start straining those things out on the timeline you take a look yt news reports coming out, it's pretty powerful evidence. mark: when you look at the political and particular call me when he talked about what can i do and mccabe his wife was a big-time democrat running for office and the leaking that to place. you look at renan oliver television. >> "msnbc" contributor when was the last time you've seen one on there? when it was the last time you had the director of the fbi and the acting director referred by the department justice inspector general and prosecution? that's it earth shattering. i got pilloried in the press when all is said was i had a

whistleblower talking about holding meetings outside and he shows me this possibleow corruption behind the fbi. i got in the press but i don't care because the bottom line is i want to get to the truth. i think the american people deserve the truth and i'm tenacious enough to do it. take a long time but i have no patience for they've been forced to have patience because of this whole process. mark: the will be right back. wow. thanks, zoltar. how can i ever repay you? maybe you could free zoltar? thanks, lady. taxi! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

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be trading greater pretend these it's going to be about investigations and impeachment and that was easy to predict. that's what we are seeing play out here. it's completely unfair process. the fact that nancy pelosi announced a process before we knew it there was a whistleblower complaint and of course trump by releasing a transcript i think he had to do it is unfortunate that he had to do it but got some real damage being done. certainly republicans in the senate see how close the process is and if and when it comes over to the senate think mcconnell has said we are going to have to take it up but we will be in total control of the process in the senateol. if it's completely unfair in the house i wouldak say we will take that into account in terms of how we do the trial. mark: my concern is the senate

not treated as this incredibly serious event with an extended hearing in the trial and so forth because you know even in the civilian judicial system you have motions to dismiss. i mean you've got a situation going on here where one party is driving this. they have a small majority of 37 members and apparently several of them don't even want to do this. you have effectively six committeesh chairman pushing, oe who is a liar that lied to the american people about a number of things so my concern is the senate sits there. the media is all excited. c-span has its camera and we treat this like it was done in the clinton and nixon time or the andrew johns and time and it's not. this is bogus. >> up to this point it certainly is completely unfair process. we will see what the house does

and my own prediction is the senate will treat this as seriously as the house does. mark: the only body that completes the house is the senate and that's what the framers had in mind when they set up impeachment raid the house a simple majority to impeach and the senate the supermajority to remove. there's no discussion on how the trial is supposed to be handled. we note the chief justice is the judge in the trial. you guys have your rules and have been in place apparently for some time. you can't change a rule. we need 67 members to change a rule but i know that's not true. you have the nuclear option that you use when it comes to the supreme court and the nuclear option is basically the tournament. says you need a supermajority to change the rules but you need a simple majority to overrule a parliamentarian. >> i push back on when people say we would use the nuclear option. nuclears only one option use one time and i was by

harry reid. harry reid said the new president that you can change rules with a majority vote. republicans to my mind have never used the nuclear option. we follow this precedent but we have done it sparingly. we may part company on this. i personally think the threshold on final passage has protected america from all kinds of problems. a lot of conservatives -- mark: hold on i'm talking about when this specific, each come to the senate you should use it sparingly and this is one of the times you ought to use it. >> again i don't even know what would her choir a supermajority. i think most of the stuff can be dispensed with without changing the rules at all. it's just majority. mark: mcconnell said to change the rule you need 67 votes. >> i'm not sure yet to change the rules. a lot of the rules may be procedural.

mark: is somebody looking into this? >> lori dove and senator mcconnell are taking a look att what we need to do. listen to what senator mcconnell is talking about. we will have to take it up but we will control the chamber. we will control the rules. senator mcconnell has been fairly fearless when it comes to making sure we can appoint and confirm good justices knuckling the circuit court that the supreme court. you have to give the leader a fair amount of credit for putting in some real conservative judges on the bench and we did that by using harry reid's precedence. mark: remember what reagan used to say? trust but verify. i want to trust what i want to verify this from a constitutionalists perspective if this is allowed to go through and we were talking earlier about the release of phonecalls and how that damages the constitution this process will become precedent if it's not stopped in the united states

senate. you just willy-nilly go through even at truncated trial. i'm letting you know a lot of americans are concerned about this. the constitution allows one place to do this and that the united states senate. you are telling me you guys are up to it. >> i believe so. we will be watching with the house does and if it continues to be this unfair we will treat it accordingly. mark: don't forget ladies and gentlemen you can watch me mostly nights. give me a call at 1-844-levintv or go to waste tv.com/blaze tv/mark. we would love to have and by the way if you haven't gotten your copy of this freedom of the press now more than ever. we will be right back. in the running car? are you crazy? let's hide behind the chainsaws.

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mark: senator we have talked about leaks, information in the mark: senator we have talked about leaks, what's been going on in the obama administration. is it truly possible that anyone in the united states isn't aware what's going on was a rock obama? possible but not probable. you go back into the obama and installation whether it's not persecuting thugs outside of a philadelphia polling station or

to meet the one that still completely gets under my skin is the fact that we never did find out, nobody was accountable to lois lerner and the group within the irs where the obama administration was using probably one of the more feared agencies of the federal government as a political weapon against opponents. mark: against the tea party. >> precisely. we really don't know exactly what happened and again i go back to my investigation of the sinton e-mail scandal. i would like to just read you the statute that i believe not only hillary clinton brought back president obama dead and i will skip a few words but here's the section under the espionage act. whoever having lawful possession or control of any document related to national defense one through gross negligence permits be removed from its proper place of custody or two, having

knowledge that the same as been illegally removed from its proper place of custody. and it fails to make prompt. reporter: loss with a fine of up to 10 years in prison. inspector general of the justice department came up with the precedent on this that somehow that area clear wording has nothing but intense, none whatsoever a required some measure of intent and malicious intent to store this in a place where it could get into the hands of a malicious actor. i don't know where thatat all ce from but that's the person that isn't properly through gross negligence handling this. what about the person who had knowledge of the factsus and one of the things that never got an answer on is what do those e-mails between hillary clinton and barack t obama what do they look like? what did president obama c. quick to d.c. hillary clinton and state department.gov has

classified or did he seek hillary clinton.com? obviously this is not a secure site. the point is that's why the entire obama administration made sure she was exonerated. mark: tickets he had knowledge. >> he hadin knowledge. mark: he knew where they were from. he would know the server. >> james comey report the one of those e-mails came from the territory of a hostile after to america. mark: so your supposition that he would have had knowledge or could have had knowledge and no one has ever questioned it. >> there's not a scintilla of scandal that occurred in the obama administration. no lois lerner and ignore the clinton e-mail scandal. mark: and ignore benghazi. the president of the united states, the buck stops here.

all of this is going on swirling around him. the intelligence agencies and the fbi and he's even briefed on some of it. trump's the fit dump. he is under constant investigation by the obama administration. that's the perpetrator and obama is never questioned. we will be right back. ntal, and getting her car towed. all i had to take care of was making sure that my daughter was ok. if i met another veteran, and they were with another insurance company, i would tell them, you need to join usaa because they have better rates, .. ♪

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but they are part and parcel of the democratic part yaint liberal left. they are not even hiding their bias anymore. theirbi bias was revealed far me onin what they don't report and what they are not curious about versus what they do report on. it's unfortunate. thank goodness we have alternate media and the internet. but it's hard to compete when you have the majority of the mainstream press on the left side. mark: do you think the president has been able to go around them with his tweets? >> i think the reason you have president trump and candidate trump being so bold, that resonates with conservatives. know how grossly unfair the press has been to us.

mark: it's been a pleasure having you, keep up the fight. join us next time on live, liberty and levin. [♪] jesse: welcome to. "watters' world," i'm jesse watters. left wing hypocrisy. this week donald trump use sad word, democrats used the same word in the same way, but they freeked out. here is what truck said. so some day if a democrat becomes president and the republicans in the house even by a tiny margin, they can impeach the president without due process or fairness or any legal rights. all republicans must remember what they are witnessing here, a lynching. but we'll win. lynching is and racially charged