electoral college, we had a landslide. 306-223. we had a landslide. they tried to take it away because they can't do it fairly. because these are bad people. nancy pelosi is incompetent. nothing done in congress. and now with their big star witness, this was going to be their star witness. and just so you know, i don't know him very well. the guy who got but there wasn't even on my side. he came over to me, i didn't even know that. he came over to me after i defeated other people. i defeated them all. you know what? what really we have to learn from this whole thing is the press. they ought to -- >> jesse: hello, everybody. i am jesse watters along with dana perino, juan williams, greg gutfeld, and this is "the five." the impeachment spectacle continuing on capitol hill. actually, you know what?

trump is now talking about is that impeachment spectacle. let's go back to him. >> he is a political operative. these gentlemen know it. and frankly the ig never should've brought him. if he would've compared with the whistle-blower said to what i said in the conversation. two conversations, really. but to what i said in the conversation with the president, who i think is a terrific person, of ukraine, he would've said, wait a minute, the whistle-blower said this. and that wasn't the conversation, because we have the transcribed conversation. and also, shifty schiff is dishonest, a corrupt politician. when he imitated, tried to copy my conversation and his copy, he made up a conversation, went before congress, and made up a phony conversation. just like he does every time he talks. he is a phony. he is a very dishonest, very corrupt politician.

and look, the big upset, as you folks know, was when i released the transcript. because i don't like doing that because you have to keep this very, very classified and confidential. when you're speaking to heads of state. but i released it because schiff and the whistle-blower made up a phony deal, and i tell you what, you ought to be ashamed of yourself. the press should be ashamed. and they ought to end the witch hunt right now. [reporter questions] >> reporter: why don't you let him do the right thing? >> he's already done the right thing. because the president of ukraine, if you look, his spokesman, the foreign minister, they put out, that they said no pressure whatsoever. none whatsoever. and you knew that. you knew that very well. what you are fake news and you should be ashamed of yourselves. [reporter questions]

>> the bidens are a whole different story. when you talk about corruption, and his father becomes vice president and all of a sudden he's getting millions and millions of dollars from ukraine and china, from all these countries. you just see two of them. this guy made nothing. he got thrown out of the navy. couldn't get a job. then his father becomes vice president and the press doesn't want to report it, because the press is dishonest. so i think it's a disgrace. i think the whole thing with the biden is a disgrace. [reporter questions] >> reporter: should apple be exempt from china tariffs? >> we are looking at that end the problem is that is you have samsung. it's a great company but it's a competitor of apple, and it's not fair because we have a trade deal with korea. we have to treat apple on a somewhat similar basis as we

treat samsung. now, with all of that being said, we are doing very nicely with china but i like the way it is now. because we are taking in billions and billions of dollars and giving some of that money to farmers and others. but we are looking at apple. what i wanted apple to -- i said, someday we are going to see apple building plants in our country. not in china. and that is what is happening. it's all happening. it's all the american dream. our country has never done better. it's doing better than it's ever done. unemployment, the lowest levels. the numbers just came out today. african-americans, hispanic-americans, asian-americans. at the lowest they have ever had, in the history of our country. so we are very happy. [reporter questions] >> so, i can tell you this, china would much rather make a trade deal than i would. [reporter question]

>> because i haven't wanted to yet. because i don't think they are stepping up to the level that we want. [reporter question] >> i know, but here's what i say, what do you know? i put in tariffs, everyone says, you're taking in hundreds of millions of dollars we will be taking in. and everybody said, that is going to be bad for the economy. as you just heard from tim cook, we have the strongest economy by far in the world. and we are taking in billions and billions of dollars. we'll see what happens. we are dealing with china, i have a great relationship with president xi. they are a great country, but we are a greater country than china. if i didn't win right now, china would be a bigger economy than the united states. but because i won, we picked up a net worth $11 trillion of worth, value. and china has lost probably

$25 trillion. we are much bigger than china right now and we are going to keep it that way. thank you all. [reporter questions] >> jesse: all right, that was the president reacting to this week's impeachment hearings and a bunch of other stuff. we are going to wait for today's second hearing to start. the apartment of defense official, state department official will be testifying in a little bit appeared earlier today, ambassador to the e.u., gordon sondland, facing up with lawmakers. he whipped democrats into a huge frenzy when he said this in his opening statement. >> i know that members of this committee frequently frame these complicated issues in the form of a simple question. was there a quid pro quo? as i testified previously, with regard to the requested white house call and the white house meeting, the answer is yes. >> after ambassador sondland,

adam schiff quickly ran to the media microphones to declare victory and case closed. then the investor had to answer actual questions, and it turns out, his story has some major holes. here's one example. >> there were so many different scenarios floating around as to what was going on with ukraine, so rather than ask the president nine different questions, is it does, is it that? i just asked, what do you want from ukraine? i may have even used a four letter word. he said, i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. i just want president zelensky to do the right thing, or words to that effect. >> jesse: today was a very confusing day for everyone. >> dana: i followed along perfectly. just kidding. >> jesse: even for ambassador sondland himself. he said there was no quid pro quo. he was talking about the white house meeting. he wanted a white house meeting

but not until they announced an investigation into the 2016 elections and into burisma. that is not a crime, that is just p.r. for p.r. appear that had nothing to do with military aid. at the end of the day maybe this blockbuster testimony wasn't as blockbuster as people believe. >> dana: like most days from this testimony i've heard from friends on the left to say, slam-dunk, amazing, we did so well today. republicans say, it's over, no problem, this guy was a total joke. i think both sides will try to tell their story and we can get into all of that. i felt like during the hearing that the democrats were excited to have him and then they were like, wait, we are not so excited. then the republicans and the democrats got so frustrated with him and he was just there saying, i'm just trying to do my best. he is not a notetaker. and his memory, as human memories can be, faulty. i'm not so sure on the days come of the times, the calls, plus the state department won't allow him to access his record so he

can't actually go back and look at it, so they are so frustrated, then you get to this question from representative turner. did no one on this planet tell you trump was tying aid to investigate his customer yes or no customer can he said yes, no one ever told me that. i think republicans will try to say, there we go. i talked about polls earlier today. the polls are impeachment are not going in the democrats' a favor at all. i shouldn't say at all. but the ones we've seen so far like in wisconsin, an important battleground state. a percentage points more before, people say, we don't think impeachment is a thing. he's up against all the possible opponents, but you don't have many persuadable spear democrats are going to say he's guilty, republicans will say he is not. for the people that are in the middle, i don't think it is going to be very effective for republicans does a perfect call, no problem here. they need some sort of off-ramp so they can say, the aid guide

to the ukrainians, we support the ukrainians, we are for national security, this does not rise to an impeachable offense and i think that is where the republicans are probably most successful after this. >> they may get an off-ramp from the ig report. greg, did you wake up at 9:00 and watch the hearings minute-by-minute? >> greg: first i woke up at 9:00 and that i walked home. i spent a lot of time trying to understand why i understand this better than most people in the media, and it's because i ran stuff for a living. if you manage things. we talked about this earlier in your office, we talked about how anyone who is involved in management, hiring or firing or dealing with budgets, dealing with human resources, we look at this going like, wow, this is just how the world works. and you understand how so many people in the media don't have a talent stack. they have a singular, vertical

experience from journalism in high school, journalism in college, being promoted through the ranks as a journalist. they don't have a collection of versatile skills, so they don't understand why journalists are so bad writing about businesses and the economy is they have no financial backgrounds. they are pathetic, right? and the people whose hair is on fire on twitter, the media report is, generally have no experience whatsoever in the outside world. they don't go to an office and have to deal with people asking for raises are having to cut staff. so when it comes to issues like business and employment and human interaction, they are abject failures. i use the example, there is a period in your life as a businessman where your personal goals and professional goals come inside. joe biden is a political rival. you investigate him, he benefits the country, and it benefits the leader. that is where professional and personal goals coincide. likewise we have a great hair

and makeup staff at "the five." personally, it makes me look great. professionally, it helps the show. if i look good, the show does better. if i look like a slob, it does appeared in this case, the personal and the professional g. if you're the president of the united states and you're dealing with the person who may be dealing with a corrupt country, a known corrupt country in the past or the future, it would benefit you to investigate him but it benefits of the country as well. ain't no crime, just a fun time. >> jesse: would you like to respond to that? >> greg: "i agree, greg" says juan. >> juan: i don't know where to start on that one. >> greg: i do look good, and so do you. [laughter] >> juan: all right, i think this was a bad day for president trump. and one way to look at it, is always to check out what other people are saying. today i was with dana, we were doing the coverage, and i

noticed that ken starr and andy mccarthy both thought trump had a bad day. especially after that morning session when you heard directly from ambassador sondland, it was dramatic in terms of that opening statement. it was clear that he was saying, was there a quid pro quo? you played the sound bite and he said yes. had he not said there was a quid pro quo, it would've been absolutely deflating for the democrats. this was what the democrats had advertised that this was going to be our key moment. afterwards, adam schiff said this was the seminal moment today and that is what it turned out to be. >> jesse: but what was the quid pro quo for? it wasn't at the military aid so what was it was rex before this is where details, especially for journalists, really matter. the opening statement in the morning where he said there was quid pro quo, he said it was with people working for a drum.

later in the afternoon he said directly, the president has never told me to engage in a quid pro quo. he hasn't asked me for that directly, he has never said those things. while he inferred with people he was working with overseas that may be is what was being asked for, he didn't implicate the president directly as an order coming directly from the white house. that being said, i don't think adam schiff really cares about any of the facts or whether they are good or bad for republicans. he's moving this thing forward no matter what happens. he ran to the cameras to the break to talk about articles of impeachment that he wants to put forward. guarantee you he is going to write one up on bribery and another one on obstruction of congress. he talked about it today, whether they are valid or not. get ready, house, because adam schiff is driving the train and you're going to go along for the ride. to be when they're going to impeach him for tweeting, also . much more on impeachment hearings. the second one is said to start very soon. orlando isn't just the theme park capital of the world,

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>> greg: that giant's one. welcome. welcome back, the second, yes second impeachment hearing is set to start soon. the media declaring victory before republicans even had a chance to ask investor gordon sondland questions earlier. let's take a look. >> this testimony is incredibly damaging. >> i can't emphasize how explosive this is. >> so explosive. >> completely devastating. >> it is a problem for the white house. >> i think a master's on lund's testimony today changed everything. >> every fantasy about how

corrupt this administration was is actually true. speak i don't think i want to hear about any of their fantasies. because the meeting drag on forever, his lawyer had to quit in with this lead. >> chairman, ambassador sondland had intended to fly back to brussels at the end of the day to continue his duties, so it would be a great convenience to us if we could have a shorter break now and resume with the questions and try to wrap up in time to make his flight. >> i appreciate that, counsel. we all have a busy schedule. it should take slightly less than two hours, so i think you should be good, depending on the time of your flight. >> greg: adam schiff is such a jerk. it's like he knows you have a three-day weekend with your family and he comes into your office and says, can we stay a little late and broke over these expense reports? >> dana: we need to look at the six months ahead calendar.

>> greg: but i have to catch the amtrak at 8:00! speedy when you have something you don't want to go to you always schedule something more important afterward so you have to have some way to get out of the situation. >> juan: that is gordon sondland, not adam schiff. >> dana: he is like, i know, let's get the flight so we can have a good excuse. interesting about gordon sondland, i know he wants to go back and do his job. think it is going to be very difficult for him to do so. i think he has to wonder tonight, does he still of the confidence of the president? remember, maria jovanovich was fired because the president lost confidence in her. i'm not questioning his credibility, i just think the appearance of his problem, not being able to have the confidence of mike pompeo is going to be a problem. >> greg: do you think this excuse to leave to brussels just

sprouted up? >> jesse: brussels sprouts. >> juan: i wanted to make sure i was giving him a laugh. i wanted to make sure i got it. brussels sprouts. i get it. >> greg: it's it for the kids watching at home. i care about the children. >> juan: i appreciate that. but i was going to add that i think you have to consider with today's testimony, and the fact that he is going back, who is gordon sondland? for me, i was thinking the idea that, a lot of these people are never trumpers. i don't think he is a never trumper. i think he gave a lot of money to president trump, he was selected by mike pompeo and the president. people asked him committee speak to the president often and he said, maybe 20 times. i think that is a lot. secondly, you can't say this is the deep state. again, he is a trump guy. and finally, i would say, this really struck me that he said his properties, i think it is in oregon, are being surrounded, picketed, threats to his family. >> dana: by democratic

congressman who led the charge. >> juan: no, he indicated there were republicans who said nasty things about him. >> dana: but the attempt to hurt his business did start with the congressman from oregon. in one of the things he did, for example, they encouraged people to write bad yelp reviews to be in the lobbies disrupting things so that as a patron you wouldn't want to stay there. >> juan: the final point is you can lie to reporters but you can't lie to congress. people like roger stone have found out you can go to jail. what we have seen is no documents being released, no mike pompeo, no giuliani, and i think that is getting hot. where is rudy giuliani? no bolton, and i think bolton must be sitting there thinking, i know a lot about this. no mick mulvaney, they are playing tapes of mulvaney saying, get over it, so what if there was a quid pro quo? and where's donald trump? >> greg: jesse, we started off talking about the media.

we have to remind everyone that this narrative has been pushed from the beginning. how can we trust these people who push obstruction, and justice cavanaugh and collusion. we can't. >> jesse: the media has no awareness. they cooked up a hoax for three years, that fell apart, the same week that falls apart, where mueller's thing falls apart, they cook of this whistle-blower scandal. they expect the american people to go along for another year of this question like the american people are busy and tired. what ambassador sondland thought about the inter-agency process with regards to a military age package to ukraine is not seeping into the consciousness of the american public. trump scallop numbers are up 2.6. independents are against impeachment. up ten points. in wisconsin, dana just mentioned, support against impeachment is going the other way.

i just don't think these are really breaking through. in the morning i thought, wow, this guy has the goods. he has it on quid pro quo. he started answering questions. no quid pro quo at all with the military aid. in fact, trump never mentioned "security assistance." i don't want anything from ukraine. the only quid pro quo he assumed it was they wanted a white house meeting in exchange for an announcement of an investigation. not even an investigation. an announcement. p.r. for p.r. what that is about as this, it's a corrupt country, trump doesn't trust it because they colluded with the democrats. a new president, they are supposed to throw all this money in there without checking to see if this guy is legit? send us a signal, zelensky, if you take corruption seriously. we are looking for a signal. we have a signal? the money got out anyway, doesn't even matter at this point. >> katie: after saying the president didn't instruct me to do some kind of quid pro quo on the aide for investigations.

he also said i don't think the president should be impeached. that is something he talked about. but i want to pick up on what dana talked about it being difficult for him to go back and do his job because the state department is releasing a number of pushed back saying suggestions, secretary pompeo was aware of investigations for political reasons that any claims of that in the testimony are completely false. they are also saying that he had access like any current employee to all the documents he wants when it comes to this investigation. so they are pushing back on that hard. the pens office also released a statement pushing back on some of the things he said. >> dana: i understand the real-time pushback, the ability to tweet out from the department of energy, but they are refusing to cooperate. this guy has to get a lawyer, go in front of congress, he is under threat of having to go to jail if he is caught in a lie because he doesn't remember something from before.

he has a lot on the line. if the state department is saying he has access to all this information, than sondland out to maybe get a different lawyer because that is not what he sai said. >> greg: it always sounds really exciting to be an ambassador -- >> dana: always say no. >> greg: if anyone was offering me ambassadorship, unless it was a really tiny country nobody cared about. maybe the vatican. >> dana: you want to go to the vatican? >> greg: i would be a great ambassador to the vatican. i would just get bored, i'm in there. second impeachment hearing of the day set to start any minute. we will be right back. it's tough to quit smoking cold turkey. so chantix can help you quit slow turkey. along with support, chantix is proven to help you quit. with chantix you can keep smoking at first and ease into quitting.

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♪ >> dana: welcome back, you're looking live at capitol hill where the days of second

impeachment hearing is set to start any minute. we will take you there. department of defense laura cooper is going to be testifying but there is something else happening tonight and that is another democratic debate. ten or 11 people on stage in atlanta. do you think anything will change to nyquist right to expect any fireworks >> katie: he is on the rise, we are getting closer to iowa, elizabeth warren is pulling ahead of bernie sanders. she's had a lot of pressure since her previous debate about her policies. she rolled out medicare for all, which includes a lot of policies to get there and she wants to eliminate everybody's private health insurance. >> dana: may be burning as well because she said she wouldn't do it until the third year of her term. >> katie: and she's kind of stealing his ideas. there's another bill about

prosecuting the president so we will see if tulsi gabbard takes her down tonight. >> dana: what will we see from mayor pete to nyquist mark >> jesse: he is up on the pole so everyone is going to go after him. maybe some of the other candidates are going to to go r mayor pete. this is the first debate where you will see if mayor pete can kind of stand in the center of the ring and volley with the punches. who knows what we will see. biden has not raised a lot of money, he had a goal, he hasn't even reached a purity will have to answer questions about himself and his son and ukraine. elizabeth warren has lost momentum and bernie is going to be bernie. i expect the lower caliber candidates do something wild to rejuvenate their campaigns, because in the next month or so you could see some more dropouts. >> dana: what do you think about the fact that it seems that each of these candidates has a different constituency? you have younger people for

bernie, you have white liberal, college-educated women for elizabeth warren, pete buttigief the cocktail circuit, the amtrak white wind circuit, whatever they call it. and i should have mentioned biden, of course he has the older voters. >> juan: i think there are some points of commonality. principally beating trump in 2020. i think that is pretty clear and coming out of the hearings today, i think you are going to hear no argument about whether or not president trump should be impeached or whether this was a bad strategy. to hear from republicans, this is going to drag on, it's going. even people are saying tonight, are you going to watch the hearings or the debate? i don't think you hear any disagreement on the stage. in fact i think they are going to say, in the last few days, roger stone convicted. we know about the other, i think four or five people,

paul manafort, michael cohen, and others who have been convicted in this, and now you have come in today's hearing, ambassador sondland saying, we play the hand we were dealt. we didn't want to work with rudy giuliani but that is what we had to do. then you have secretary perry, vice president pence, and now mike pompeo. they are all putting out statements. they are adding to the fire, and i think that fire will be reflected on stage. democrats rage at trump tonight. >> katie: i don't think they are going to talk a lot about impeachment. they want to talk about their programs. >> greg: i think they feel like they are being overshadowed. you know what is missing? a trump. a candidate who will come out there and immediately graduate joe biden for becoming a grandfather. you know, now that the dna tests came out here tulsi may do that. now that the dna tests say that hunter had a kid from a woman in arkansas. or the pete buttigieg stock photo controversy. everyone know about that?

>> dana: it's really bad. >> greg: to show that he had black voters he used stock photography from kenya. just before he made a list of 400,000 african-american endorsers in south carolina. many of them were either white or hadn't endorsed him and the stock photos were from africa. >> dana: that is not a good one. >> katie: not a good view. >> jesse: you know what else is significant, we were just talking, a lot of people didn't even know there was a debate tonight because this has overshadowed everything. >> katie: i think if pete buttigieg is smart he will say, the house can go to the impeachment process but if he looks at the swing state polls, it's all about defeating donald trump and he sees the polls out of wisconsin that shows negative 13 on impeachment, he's going to want to beat that bring that up. >> dana: it looks like the committee is coming up so we will go to commercial and be right back. (man) you take care of yourself.

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>> juan: welcome back, we are looking live at capitol hill. the second impeachment hearing of the day's about to start. laura cooper and state department official david hale will be testifying. jesse, it seems today in an earlier hearing, a lot of talk about rudy giuliani. and i wonder if, from your perspective, we are starting to see republicans say, may be rudy giuliani is going to get run over here because we are trying

to save president trump. >> jesse: i've heard that theory, i don't think they will need to deploy that theory. >> juan: hold on, adam schiff has gaveled the hearing to order. >> without objection, the chair has authorized to declare a recess of the committee at any time. we will proceed today in the same fashion as her other hearings. the ranking member, mr. devin nunes, will have an opportunity to make a statement and we will turn to our witnesses for their opening statements, if they choose to make one. for audience members, we welcome you and respect your interest in being here. in turn, we ask for your respect as we proceed with this hearing. as chairman i will take any necessary appropriate steps to maintain order and ensure that the committee is run in accordance with house rules. with that, i now recognize myself to give an opening statement in the impeachment inquiry into donald j. trump, the 45th president of the

united states. this afternoon, the american people will hear from two witnesses who are both metro national security professionals. one at the department of state and the other at the defense department. david hale is the under secretary of state for political affairs. the third most senior official in the department and the most senior foreign official officer. laura cooper served as deputy secretary assistance of defense for ukraine, and russia, and is responsible for a broad range of countries in the former soviet union and the balkans. between the two of them they have decades of experience expee serving both democratic and republican presidents. george can't come investor bill taylor, lieutenant colonel alexander of inman, and jennifer williams, their only priority has been the security of the united states. undersecretary hill was witness to the smear campaign against the smear campaign to the ambassador to the ukraine, maria

jovanovich, and the efforts of some to help her. in late march, maria jovanovich reached out to david hale for assistance, telling him that social media and other criticisms of her were such that she felt she could no longer function unless there was a strong statement of defense of her from the state department. he helped push to get the state department to push out a statement of praise for investor jovanovich. sadly, to no avail. that silence continues today. in late april, we heard in riveting testimony last friday from investor jovanovich, she was recalled to washington, and informed that she had lost the confidence of the president with the secretary of state did not meet with her. subordinates dealt with her instead. with the departure of jovanovich, hale watched as three new players moved in to assume a prominent role in trump's ukraine policy. the three amigos were nominally led by rick perry, but it would

be ambassador volker and ambassador sondland presumably working with ambassador taylor, who would be the ones doing the continual work here. in mid-summer, trump ordered a suspension of military aid to ukraine, despite the fact that that it had been authorized and appropriate by congress and that the defense department in consultation with the state department had certified ukraine met all the necessary requirements to receive the aid, including anticorruption reform. the aide was in the national interests of the united states, and critical to ukraine's security, a country that have been invaded by russia. from her office and the pentagon, ms. cooper oversaw a significant amount of security assistance flowing to ukraine and was involved in efforts to understand and reverse the suspension of nearly 400 million in u.s. aid. cooper, along with others, learned cooper learned of the meetings in the last weeks of july.

on july 18, a representative relayed the white house chief of staff has conveyed that the president has concerns about ukraine and that a hold had been ordered by the president. no explanation was provided. all of the agencies responsible for ukraine policy supported security assistance and advocated for lifting of the hold. the only dissenting voice was the office of management and budget which was following the orders of president trump, and still no good explanation of the hold was provided. while the aid suspension had not been made public, word was getting out. catherine croft, special advisor for ukraine negotiations who worked closely with ambassador volker and who testified of this committee received two separate calls in july or august of officials of the ukrainian embassy who "approached me quietly and in confidence to ask me about an omb hold on ukraine

security assistance." croft was "very surprised at the effectiveness of my ukrainian counterparts diplomatic tradecraft," as if to say they found out very early on, much earlier than i expected them to. ukrainians wanted answers but croft did not have a good response. in late august, cooper met with kurt volker with whom she had met many times in the past. during that meeting which they were discussing the hold on security assistance, volker revealed he was engaged in an effort to have the government of ukraine issue a statement that would "commit to the prosecution of any individuals involved in election interference." cooper understood that if volker's efforts were successful, the hold might be lifted. unbeknownst to cooper, no such statement was forthcoming. but the aid was abruptly restored on september 11, days after the three committees launched an investigation into the trump-ukraine scheme.

with that, i now recognize the ranking member. >> thank you. as we republicans have argued, the american people are getting a skewed impression of these events. that's because the democrats assume full authority to call witnesses and they probably rejected any new witnesses the republicans requested. so i'd like to take a moment to discuss a few of the people whose testimony has been deemed unacceptable for the american people to hear. the whistle-blower. the whistle-blower is the key figure who started this entire impeachment charade by submitting a complaint against president trump that relied on secondhand and thirdhand information and media reports. this began a bizarre series of events, although the complaint had no intelligence component whatsoever, the intelligence community inspector general accepted it and even changed the guidance on the complaint forms to eliminate the requirement for first-hand information.

the office backdated the forms to make them appear as if they were published a month before. democrats then took the extremely rare step of pushing a whistle-blower complaint into the public. using it as the centerpiece of their impeachment crusade. we later learned that democratic staff had prior coordination with the whistle-blower, the though the democrats themselves had united on national television. following that revelation, democrats did a dramatic about-face. they suddenly drop their insistence that the whistle-blower testified to us and rejected our request to hear from him. then, in the hearing yesterday, the democrats cut off our questions and accused us of trying to out the whistle-blower. even though they claim they don't even know who he is.

alexandra chalupa. former operative for the democratic national committee who worked with officials at the ukrainian embassy in washington, d.c., in order to smear the trump campaign in 2016. she met directly about these matters within ukrainian ambassador who himself wrote an article criticizing trump during the 2016 campaign. chalupa's activities were one of several indicators of election meddling 2016, all of which were aimed at the trump campaig campaign. once you understand a grinning officials were cooperating -- ukrainian officials were cooperating. easy to understand why the president would want to learn the full truth about these operations and why he would be skeptical of ukraine. hunter biden. biden is another witness who the democrats are sparing from

cross-examination. the securing of an extremely well-paying job on the board of a corrupt ukrainian company, burisma, highlights the corruption problem in ukraine that concerned not only president trump but all of the witnesses we've interviewed so far. the democrats have dismissed biden's role at burisma as conspiracy theories, yet they are trying to impeach president trump or having expressed concerns about the company. if we could hear from biden, we could ask him how he got his position. what did he do to earn his lavish salary and what light could he shed on corruption at this notorious company? but biden would make an inconvenient witness for the democrats, and so they have blocked his testimony. at these hearings, we've heard a lot of secondhand, thirdhand information and speculation about president trump intentions but in the end the only direct

order we've heard from the president is his order to our last witness, ambassador sondland, that he wanted nothing from ukraine. that is consistent with the testimony provided by senator johnson who said president trump angrily denied accounts that a quid pro quo existed. aside from rejecting our witnesses, the democrats are tried other petty tricks to shape public opinion. this morning they called a break in the hearing in order to press their absurd arguments to tv cameras. then for this hearing, they canceled the multiple rounds of initial questioning they had earlier today with ambassador sondland and as i have with the previous witnesses. who they bizarrely consider as their star witnesses. when you look through the presumptions, assumptions, smoke and mirrors, you see the facts of the case are clear.

president trump was skeptical fluorinateforeign aid generallyd especially skeptical of countries like ukraine. he wanted to discover the facts but ukrainian meddling in the 2016 election against his campaign. a brief hold on ukrainian aide was lifted without ukraine taking any steps they were supposedly being bribed to do. president zelensky repeatedly said there was nothing improper about president trump's call with him and he did not even know about the hold in aid at the time he was supposedly being extorted with it. so what exactly are the democrats impeaching the president for? none of us here really know. the accusations changed by the hour. once again this is impeachment in search of a crime so chairman, i would urge you to bring this to a close, during this hearing and move on and get back to the work of the intelligence committee. with that, i yield back.

>> i thank the gentleman. we are joined by david hale and laura cooper. david hale serves as the undersecretary of state for political affairs for the department of state, a position he's held since august 30, 2018. mr. hale joined the foreign service in 1994 and holds the rank of career ambassador. he previously served as ambassador to pakistan, ambassador to lebanon, special envoy for middle east peace, deputy special envoy and ambassador to jordan. ambassador hale also served as deputy assistant secretary of state and executive assistant to secretary of state albright. laura cooper is the deputy assistant assistant secretary of defense for russia, ukraine, and eurasia at the department of defense. she is a crewmember of the senior executive service. ms. cooper previously has served as a principal director in the office of the assistant secretary of defense for homeland defense and global security affairs. prior to joining the department

of defense in 2001, ms. cooper was a policy planning officer at the state department at the office of coordinator of counterterrorism. two final points. first, witness depositions as part of this inquiry for unclassified in nature and all open hearings will also be held at the unclassified level. any information that may touch on classified information will be addressed separately and second, congress will not tolerate any reprisal, threat of reprisal, or attempt to retaliate against any u.s. government official for testifying before congress, including you or any of your colleagues. if you would both please rise and raise your right hand, i will begin by swearing you in. do you swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth so help you god. that the record show the witnesses answered in the affirmative. thank you, and please be seated. the microphone is sensitive, so please speak directly into it. without objection, your written

statements and will be part of the record. with that, ambassador speed the dean -- ambassador hale, you are welcome to give your opening statement. >> mr. chairman, i don't have a repaired opening statement but i would like to comment, as you said i've been undersecretary since august of 2018. foreign service officer for over 35 years, ambassador three times serving republican and democratic administrations probably and i'm here in response to your subpoena to answer the questions of the committee. think you come undersecretary. ms. cooper. >> mr. chairman, ranking member, members of this to many, i appeared today to provide facts and answer questions based on my experience has a deputy assistant secretary of defense for russia, ukraine, and eurasia. i would first like to describe my background as well as my own role and vantage point relevant to your inquiry.

i bring to my daily work and to this proceeding my sense of duty to u.s. national security, not to any political party. i have probably served to democratic and to do. i entered government service through the internship -- working on counterterrorism in europe and the former soviet union. working on a defense's rotational assignment, i decided to accept a civil service position in the policy organization of the office of the secretary of defense in january 2001 where i am remained for the past 18 years. my strong sense of pride in serving my country and dedication to my pentagon colleagues were cemented in the moments after i felt the pentagon shake beneath me on september 11, 2001. my office was scheduled to move into the section of the pentagon that was destroyed in the

attack, but a construction delay meant we were still at our old desks in the adjacent section on that devastating day. after we had wiped the black dust from our desks, and tried to get back to work, i found meaning by volunteering to work on afghanistan policy and will give my next four years to this mission. i later had the opportunity to move into the leadership ranks of my organization and have had the privilege to manage issues ranging from defense strategic planning to homeland defense and mission assurance. i accepted the position of principal director for russia, ukraine, and eurasia in 2016 and was honored to be appointed formally to the position of deputy assistant secretary of defense in 2018. in my current role, i worked to advance u.s. national security with a focus on deterring russian aggression and building strong partnerships with the front-line states of ukraine and georgia as well as ten other

allies and partners from the balkans to the caucuses. strengthening you canes trickle ukraine's capacity to defend itself against russian aggression is central to the team's mission. the united states and the allies provide ukraine with security assistance because it's in our national security interests to deter russian aggression around the world. we also provide security assistance so that ukraine can negotiate a peace with russia from a position of strength. the human toll continues to climb in this ongoing war, with 14,000 ukrainian lives lost since russia's 2014 invasion. these sacrifices are continually in my mind as i lead dod efforts to provide vital training and equipment, including defensive legal assistance to the ukrainian armed forces. i have also supported a robust ukrainian ministry of defense program of defense reform to

ensure the long-term sustainability of u.s. investments in the transformation of the ukrainian military from a soviet model to a nato force. the national defense authorization act requires the department of defense to certify defense reform progress to release half of the ukraine security assistance initiative, or u.s. ai funds, provision we find very helpful. based on recommendations from me and other key dod advisors, the department of defense in coordination with the department of state certified in may 2019 that ukraine had "taken substantial actions to make defense institutional reforms for the purposes of decreasing corruption, increasing accountability, and sustaining improvements of combat capability." meriting obligation of the entire 250 million in usai funds. this brings me to the topic of

today's proceedings. i would like to recap my recognition of the timeline in which these events played out. i testified about all of this at length in my deposition. in july, i became aware of a hold being an obligation of the state department's foreign military financing and dod's usai funds. in a series of interagency meetings, i heard that the president had directed the office of of management and budget to hold the funds becausf his concerns about corruption in ukraine. let me say at the outset that i have never discussed this or any other matter with the president and never heard directly from him about this matter. at a senior level meeting i attended on july 26, chaired by national security council leadership, as at all other interagency meetings on this topic of which i was aware, the national security