but nobody is certain what is going to happen tonight until the numbers start coming out, and we will start those as soon a show begins. then we will have results for you. >> sandra: we will see you tonight. that's it for us. "outnumbered" starts now. ♪ >> harris: the nation, the world are watching us. america, as w we head to the pos on this election day after a bitterly fought campaign between president trump and former vice president joe biden. nearly 100 million ballots already cast. by mail or early in person voting. that's more than doubled of 46 million who voted early in 2016, and of course, voter turnout will be a key factor in the selection. all this, and the president is said to leave the white house and had to his campaign

headquarters in arlington, virginia, very soon, we are told. joe biden is stopping in pennsylvania, we are told. his plane touched down in philadelphia. he is headed there from scranton. here is what they both had to say last night. >> so, we are going to win the state of michigan, and we are going to win four more years and that very beautiful, beautiful, beautiful home called the white house. we made history together four years ago, and tomorrow, we are going to make history once again. >> this country is in your hands. i want to make this loud and clear. it's time for donald trump to pack his bags and go home. >> harris: you're watching a special election day addition of "outnumbered" for you and i'm harris faulkner. we have an all-star panel who will help guide us throughout the day and all night long. joining us, town hall editor, fox news contributor,

katie pavlich. executive director and fox news contributor, marie harf, and the coanchor as of a special election coverage, executive editor of "the story," martha maccallum, and in the center virtual cap seat, anchor and executive editor of "special report," bret baier. i am so excited for you, bret and martha. you have front row seats to the super bowl tonight. >> martha: looking at joe biden and donald trump last night as they were out in the country, they have been canvassing the entire country over the last couple days. we seen a lot of movement in these balls over the last couple days, and one of the big questions i have today is about voter turnout because on the trump site, they have been banking on an intensely enormous voter turnout today, so will they get those numbers? what we have seen, the spontaneous highway praise that we have seen, will they translate into long, long lines

at the polls? he is behind today, but no one knows what will happen tonight because we all lived through 2016, and we know that there were a lot of surprises. i also think that covid is such a big player in all of this, just the way that it has changed the dynamic of the selection, harris. and that is something that we have to -- we have to put in the center seat as well here, as we try to figure out how it influences life in america and the vote in america tonight. >> harris: you know, bret, pronounced, it seems to be very organized in. i think that's probably about the only thing we can say because it is still so very early. with 100 million people voting already, we don't know what this day to look like, but so far, from all the video, we can rotate to a lot of different cities during this hour. organization is something that i see. >> bret: so far, so good,

harris. i love election day. i'm an election day nerd because i think it is just such an expression of our country, on their democratic republic. and people going out to vote in the numbers that they are, 100 million. think about that. 100 million early votes already viewed the associated press is noting that florida has hit the 2016 total of votes. that's including early and self identity. so, you are going to see these states surpass where they have been, and that is a really great thing for our country, no matter what side you're on. >> harris: you know, katie, it really -- and i love the way bret for that because it is so optimistic. this is his favorite debut that's amazing. my favorite day is usually saturday. [laughs] when you talk with people -- we knew had shrunk. around 13%, and in recent days,

anywhere from maybe six to 7% when you look at an average poll. so i wonder if there are really people out there, as many as there were a last time, that can surprise us with their vote. what are your thoughts on that? >> katie: well, i think we are always in for surprises on election day. that's for sure. and harris, of course, former president joe biden getting into the car there, making his last stand in pennsylvania. and so, you know, looking at the surprises, there's always room for surprises, especially on election day. especially after what happened in 2016, but yesterday, the trump campaign went on record, they are very, very confident, that they can overtake joe bid joe biden's early vote total and win and battleground states across the country. they are confident about arizona and florida. just this morning, republican turnout, which president trump

needs to win arizona is 3-1. there are a lot of counties in florida that are seeing good voter turnout, but i cannot change in the afternoon, so like the news, every minute matters. but all the exciting things. an unprecedented number of people voting in this country. >> harris: what does it take dominic say to you, marie, that joe biden is back in pennsylvania? we know how important that status, but there are a lot of insubordinatimportant states. why pennsylvania in particular for this candidate? >> marie: a lot of candidates decide to spend election day in their home states, so as you mentioned, pennsylvania is one of the big prizes tonight, but you will see senator kamala harris, joe biden, others out there in places like georgia today and other states as well, and i think this is one of those

elections where we start to look at states a little bit differently perhaps. for example, a state like texas, which a few days ago surpass 100% of their 2016 vote. democrats could take as many as three or four house seats there, and the biden team thinks they are competitive. now, they certainly don't have to win it, but if you talk about texas, florida, georgia, north carolina, you know, it could look very different in terms of the parties and who takes these states were granted after tonight, and despite everything that's happened this year, harris, despite the pandemic, despite the racial justice calls, despite everything, this race has remained remarkably stable. there was always going to be some tightening heading into today, but in general, donald trump has had a feeling for support. joe biden has been above 50%, and the race for all intents and purposes has remained remarkably stable, which is extraordinary.

>> harris: bret, to you, is it that simplistic? that's not really his hometown. it is his childhood home, but he lives in delaware now and has for many years. i'm just wondering, talk to us about fracking in pennsylvania and why that blew up as an issue. in fact, as marie says, biden knows it so well, why did he step in it on that issue? >> bret: listen. he did say what he said, and so then they had to clean up for a number of days and have since been doing that. it may have moved some votes, and that's a concern. that's why they are back again and again and again. you look at a list of all the places that joe biden went to. he stopped in pennsylvania. let's put it in context. he stopped pennsylvania 19 times. the only other state that he visited as much was i think

florida. so, they see pennsylvania has a real linchpin to their strategy. you know, the biden campaign on the inside, it is sort of like "moneyball." they have it down to the point that donald trump has to get 56% of the vote on election day to win the state of blah, blah, blah. they have a down -- so did the clinton campaign, though, so we will have to see it how exactly the vote turns out to be. >> harris: so the "moneyball" reference, that's my husband's favorite film. the stock went way up. are the voters different turnaround this time around compared to 2016? are they -- we know that they are acting differently, right? we know that the that the coronavirus pandemic has put them out of voting earlier, but is there something else we need to know about where voters are? more up on the issues? the less up the issues?

>> martha: i see them as more entrenched than ever, here is. you 4.8 o 4.8% undecided. donald trump has changed politics in a dramatic way, and that has caused a lot of division in this country. he has rattled the cages of a lot of establishment in washington, and i find it so striking that the person who he is running against, the former vice president of the united states, is clearly a creature of washington, and i don't say that in a positive or negative way. it is just a fact. he has been more than 40 years serving delaware in the united states senate, and then as vice president of course of the united states. just reading into what their plan is if this goes their way tonight, they have a plan that would bring back a lot of people who have spent an enormous amount of time in washington and put them into places surrounding him as president of the united states. i think you've got a huge force in this country that is so

supportive of president trump, who wants things to be left up to the individual, who want their businesses to have independence, who want to have lower taxes, who want all of the things that he has represented, and then you have another large faction of the country that wants to go back to normal. i'm not sure what normal is at this point, to be honest with you. i think normal looks a lot different across the board, and i don't know that we ever go back to sort of the genteel politics that we used to have where opposing candidates would stand on the debate stage and sort of elbow and joke with each other. we are not there in the country anymore. we simply are not. >> harris: nonnormal in a lot of different ways pure normality is going to take a different face, even what we are dealing with with the economy, covid-19, all of it. all right, stand by. oh, my gosh. it's bret's favorite day. stick with us. with our own bret baier and

martha maccallum, anchoring, and are reporting teams across the country will also bring you updates all night long. don't miss a second. joe biden is making a final sweep in pennsylvania. we talked about that briefly. let's go deeper. why the keystone state is so critical. not just for biden but for both candidates. remember, president trump has said if he wins, he wins at all. and whether biden has been able to clarify that position on fracking. stay close. ♪

>> harris: voters across america headed to the polls today. democratic nominee joe biden is making a push on the ground in battleground pennsylvania.

the keystone state could be an early indicator. biden made us stop in scranton earlier today and is now swinging through philadelphia. yesterday at our rally in pittsburgh, he once again addressed the president's claims that biden would be on fracking. >> let me be clear. i will not ban fracking in pennsylvania. i will protect those jobs, no matter what donald trump says, but i tell you what. i will -- i will no longer support those subsidies. >> harris: president trump today told "fox & friends" he thinks that biden team is nervous. >> you notice that biden went out. he's campaigning because he is worried. we've seen tremendous changes. we've seen actually in the last

three days -- this reminds me. i hope it reminds me of four years ago. tremendous changes have taken place over the last week. we think we are winning texas very big. winning in florida very big. we think we are winning arizona very big. >> harris: you know, katie, people outside of areas where fracking is part of the economy may not understand the importance of it. is that a large group of people that that was so away from hearing joe biden say something like he's going to ban fracking and then come back, say something like well, he didn't mean that. only on federal land. try to clean it up, and then be back in p.a. today. are there that many people that fracking what effect? >> katie: well, here is, only federal lands is 13% of the entire fracking business. that's a pretty significant portion, and also, americans understand that it doesn't just

affect those who directly work in pennsylvania or texas or oklahoma, north dakota, the places where fracking takes place. a means an energy crisis for almost all americans since we have become energy independent and have enjoyed cheaper prices as a result of that. this goes back to the last debate when joe biden struggled to explain his position on fracking because he is trying to walk the line between keeping the far left of the party intact on election day with a moderate, but the fact is that during the debate, he said he wanted to phase fracking and fossil feels out of the u.s. economy by 2025. he is on the record saying that he wants to be on fracking, and in the final days, he brought along lady gaga, who is part of artists against fracking, so this is a huge issue in swing states. saying just recently that they

believe they still have a path without pennsylvania and florida. that's a pretty difficult path for joe bowen into win the electoral college at this point. >> harris: log, i'll love lady gaga's outfit. i did scratch my head when he shows up with that superstar, so against the issue that is is achilles' heel right now. >> marie: i'm not sure how many voters are familiar with the intimate details of lady gaga's fracking opinions -- >> harris: she keeps telling us. >> marie: well, she's a democrat, certainly, and a lot of people like her, which is why she's on the campaign trail. a state that is behaving more like ohio and trending redder or more like virginia and trending bluer? we don't know. the question is if there are enough voters in that urban areas and enough suburban women

in pennsylvania to get biden over the top. they won two how seeds and 2018, but if there is any state where that could be that hit intron voter that we talk a lot about,a could be one of them. i don't think that exists everywhere, but i do think that pennsylvania, given its demographics, it could exist there, so this is really a real toss-up heading into tonight. >> harris: you know, martha, the other part of the demographics in pennsylvania, specifically in philly, our black voters. in the question of whether or not they will come out. and the president got a present of the black vote overall across the country. there has been talk that it could be as much as 15. it doesn't even have to be that much if they don't go out. people of color in philadelphia, that is another issue for joe biden. and i say issue because he has

had a couple stumbles or gaffs. >> martha: we all remember the charlamagne tha god gaffe. and you see a fascinating dynamic that has emerged from several rappers and entertainers who are speaking out and saying that they don't like the fact that the entire black population has been taken for granted, as they put it. all of these decades, by democrats. and kanye west, several months ago, talking about the fact that he feels that they have not produced what they promised in terms of advancement and in terms of outreach to the black community. they basically cater to us around election time, and then they forget all about us for four years. and president trump has not an impressive record of reaching out to the black community with

the prison reform, securing the funding for historically black colleges, with opportunities all across america. a major program that he launched. so, i do think it is very interesting to watch this dynamic and watching those numbers come in and trying to figure out the breakdown of those out across democrat and republican lines on this, harris. if there is a change in dynamic, even if it is a few percentage points, significant data point to keep a close eye on, especially in some of these very tight states like pennsylvania. >> bret: can i add one thing? >> martha: absolutely. go ahead. >> bret: three counties that people should look at in pennsylvania. president trump flip to that. 26,000 votes. that's one to watch. northampton and erie. those three counties will tell you where that trump thought is,

and will it be enough? as i said, the biden campaign and their "moneyball" projecti projection. those counties will tell you can he get there? >> harris: that's fascinating. thank you very much. speaking of pennsylvania, the president went after u.s. supreme court voting ruling as conservative groups across the country are gearing up for the potential legal fight over which ballots will count and which ones. >> we've got a very horrible, horrible ruling from the supreme court of the united states. a ruling that puts our country in danger. ♪ hemical engineering hemical engineering and you're technically a genius... and it appears you're quite the investor. i like to trade. well, td ameritrade has pros ready if you need help, say talking through a new strategy... ... just in case things, you know, get a little rocky?

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both sides of the political aisle reportedly raising money and preparing teams of attorneys for what could be a county by county fight over the validity of certain ballots, including those already cast in early voting right in one case, for example, the circuit court of appeals denied a request from texas republicans to invalidate nearly 127,000 votes, which were cast out drive-through voting centers. and this morning, president trump once again criticized the supreme court for ruling that led states in pennsylvania account balance they received after election day if they are postmarked by november 3rd. >> that will be a terrible thi thing. a terrible thing. and yet the supreme court has given us very bad decisions. everyone says oh, trump has three people. amy didn't take part because she just got there. i understand that, but this

decision on pennsylvania was a horrible decision. there is just no reason to go beyond the date. >> harris: so, katie, is it reasonable to say that the rules might be a little bit different this year, just because of covid-19 and how many early votes we have had? we have almost had an entire election season of early voting. and we always know that they are counting ballots sometime after election night. why does the president want pop tart quickness this time around with so many votes already in the bloodstream? >> katie: well, here is, you are correct, that covid-19 and the pandemic have changed the dynamics of the election, but the fact is every time there was a presidential election, midterm election in this country, there are a number of election lawyers standing by to really find out the details of what is legal and what is not. what the president has said in interviews -- i believe on "fox & friends," that he wants the results on election night.

he believes the american people deserve the votes to be countered, for us to know who the next president is going to be in a timely fashion, and i think that the majority of americans also want to know who the president is without delay, especially as we see a number of cities boarding up due to the potential for unrest going forward, so it will be good for everyone to know, but on the issue of philadelphia and pennsylvania specifically, may 2020, an election judge in philadelphia who was convicted on federal charges of taking bribes, resting fraudulently, and certifying false election results, so pennsylvania has a long history of voter fraud. that's why republicans are so focused there. we have already seen a certified poll watcher being not allowed to come into one of the polling places to poll watch. it's understandable that both sides want a fair and free election, and they are standing by with lawyers on both sides.

>> harris: marie, what can you tell me about this process of poll watching and he was allowed in and who is not? you've worked for a former administration. >> marie: well, look. poll workers, we should all say thank you to them out there today because this is a really tough time to be out there helping our democracy work, without question, but poll watching, there is a long history has it in this country, both republicans and democrats making sure that people are allowed to vote, and what the american people deserve is for every legal vow to be counted. the reason we count absentee ballots after election day sometimsometimes is because thee from service members overseas. there are a lot of very good reasons that every vote should be counted. people tonight should not expect instant results. that is okay. what is most important is counting every vote. when you have someone like ben ginsberg, a respected republican

election lawyer out there saying in a piece this week that the republican party needs to really tamp down some of their legal challenges that make it seem quite plainly like they are trying to suppress the vote, particularly in democratic are areas. as soon as long -- an issue with a long history, and republicans have tried again and again to try to prevent more people from voting when in fact the opposite should be true. we should be encouraging everyone to vote. >> harris: you know, i am looking at "washington post" article appeared it was widely reported, but looking at this. dr. birx sounding the alarm. we are entering the most concerning stage of this pandemic, leading to increasing mortality. that from deborah birx. you can't get away from this -- and katie and i talked briefly about it. the impact that this can have on the electorate, and i'm

wondering what can be done? should we expect things to go along as quickly? is the president right? what should our expectation look like? >> bret: when it comes to counting votes, marie is right. you want to get as many people to vote as you can. however, he also wanted to be fair so that there is a vote counts and it is watched. what do you need? 10,000 votes. here's 10,000 ballots. that stuff, it happens. and of the problem, or at least the challenge is that each one of these elections as run-on as state or local county basis, so there is not a federal standard for absentee ballots, that they have to be signed. each municipality makes their own rules about it, so, i think that -- so far -- 12:34 eastern time, we have a very smooth

morning. let's knock on wood and say that that is going to continue. covid makes a lot more challenging. 100 million people chose to vote early, either in person or by mail. and i think that hopefully we will get a result tonight, but it might not be tonight. it might be days. it might be weeks, but we will get it. >> harris: absolutely. i am in the man cave. the closest thing to wood is this. when you look at this, and you take kind of -- perfect view, if you will, all the people that want to participate in this process. do you think that we are going to rethink how we do things going forward? is there a need for change? lord knows no one could have forecast this on the way that it happened, but are there certain parts of the system that are kind of broke in? >> katie: i think that we may

never go back -- people will probably continue to do that. i wouldn't be surprised if we see these kinds of numbers. it's not a difficult process. i've done it for years, those of us who work in elections i've probably been doing the same thing because it's hard for us to get to the election booth on this day because we are busy, although that would be the preferred way to do it because it is a great experience as an american, but is not that hard to fill these out, put it back in the envelope. in most parts of the country, they were mailed out a very long time ago, and we've seen 100 million americans able to do this successfully, so i think that a lot of that structure will probably remain. just one extra thought here in pennsylvania, it is not just that it has to be in by novembey november 3rd. they've also made allowances for situations where you can't read the postmark and then just assuming that it was postmarked in time. unless there is a preponderance

of evidence that suggests that it was not sent in that way. they are also nonmatching signatures. not having the obligation to match signatures. i'm sorry, but that leaves a lot of wiggle room. i think there is every reason to watch what's happening there very closely. obviously, with a fair eye to what is happening on both sides, but we do have to watch what is happening in pennsylvania. there is some history to mean that it should deserve some extra scrutiny. there is nothing wrong with that. it's perfectly honest. >> harris: we will leave it there. hunkering down. storefronts, business is boarded up and closed as fears grow over election night unrest. a warning that the president has for rioters. ♪ beautiful. but support the leg!

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>> biden's far left supporters are threatening to loot and riots if they don't get their way, so writing, looting will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. i'm just telling you that right now. >> harris: a nation on edge, president trump with a warning for anyone looking to stir up election night unrest. business owners in a number of major american cities are

boarding up, from saks fifth avenue and macy's to rodeo drive in beverly hills, which is shut down today and tomorrow. and they installed around the white house, similar to barriers installed along the white house perimeter over the summer amid widespread anti-police protests. bret, when you see this, it is all a precaution, and we talk about the organization, but how tough of a summary it has been. >> bret: it has. we have seen protesting to evolve into riots, into looting in a number of different cities. and it's a shame. it really is. going to these different places, and from washington, d.c. although business is boarded up. it is kind of depressing. as a citizen, we shouldn't be afraid of election day, because

it shouldn't have to be this way, but it is, and we are where we are. covid makes it even more complicated, but merely the message from authorities is don't do anything stupid. we're going to be out in full force. we will see what happens tonight. >> harris: you know, marie, what's really frustrating, after may 25th, the death of george floyd, and other violence that happened, you can understand the call for justice from the peaceful protesters, and then as bret describes, some of it being perforated with almost an insurgency of just flat out violence. but when you look at the nba championships, the people who won, that fans in the streets that stuff on fire. it looked like a riot. are we had a point in this country where you just go outside, that something on fire,

that's like the new american thing. what is it? >> marie: i think sports fans have been setting things on fire. i love lebron james as much as anyone else, but when it comes to election day, i was really sad to see businesses where i live in washington, d.c., boarded up. where we are this time in our country, we have also seen coming out of states like michigan that have a strong right-wing militia militia presence -- -- some veiled thres about what they might possibly do if donald trump does not win. so there is a lot of potential for political violence that we see after tonight. hopefully it will not come to that, but we know that security experts are focusing on a number of different ways it could. i think everyone needs to remain calm and solve their differences at the ballot box, excuse me,

and not on the street. >> harris: you know, katie, i don't mean to pick a site here, but it is kind of obvious that i don't see the same kind of talk about if joe biden wins and trump loses, that you are going to see this sort of thing. perhaps i missed it. educate me. >> katie: well, first of all, the idea that american cities are having to board up during a democratic election is just completely unacceptable, harassed, and there has been one candidate who has consistently condemned the violence, has been advocating for the department of justice do you throw writers in prison with very lengthy sentences, and that has been president trump, where is joe biden and senator harris not only took a long time, until august, to outright condemn this on the campaign trail, they didn't even talk about it at the dnc. because the polls were changing, and it became an election issue. not because it was the right thing to do.

kamala harris tweeted out a link to a bail fund for rioters who were -- this type of violence is unacceptable. something the department of justice has been trying to fight against. it's very organized. this is something that the left wing, organizing these riots in washington, d.c., they have videos about what they want to do. they are very specific about where the media outlets are, where the police stations are, where the important government buildings are, and they have plans to shut it down as a result of president trump winning. you don't have trump supporter's rallying and organizing a night of unrest. businesses are not boarding up in cities across the country because trump supporter's are planning to take to the streets with firebombs, as we have seen throughout the summer. >> harris: we will move on. my thought, i will hit you in the next round. all-star election coverage today on our digital and radio

platforms and here on fox news channel. there they are. the cohosts of our special covered just hours from now. what to expect and what to watch for. what they are watching for it. that's what i want to know. ♪ attention veterans with va loans.

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>> harris: millions of americans voting in this historic election with the first set of polls set to close at 7:00 p.m. eastern. fox news channel along with our digital platform and fox news radio all have marathon coverage for you planned all day, all evening, all night. bret baier, martha maccallum will be hosting our coverage, kicking off at 6:00 p.m. eastern. my thought, what will we see? >> martha: i think we all have sort of the haunting of 2016, so we are very reluctant to look at these numbers, which have clearly been in joe biden's favor, and we can't do anything but wait. i think this process is just beginning tonight, here is. there are 78 days between tonight and inauguration on january 20th. there are lawyers on both sides that are poised to jump in to figure out how they can exploit

the situation on the ground to their advantage, so i think this is going to be a tricky evening. i think everybody needs to stay tuned because america has been through so much with the course of this virus over 2020, and either the biden side, focusing on the virus very, very heavily or the president focusing on the future of the u.s. economy very heavily is going to win out. we don't know what side will win my, but we will be guiding everybody through it right here at fox news headquarters in new york city all throughout the night. >> harris: all right, bret, not a lot of time, but i want to hear from you. >> bret: thousands ready. ready for this election day. ready to finally be at this point. we have built up to it. we've talked about it. we have looked at polls and polls. we will start seeing those -- >> harris: amen. >> bret: it's going to tell us a lot.

>> harris: you know, i will ask this as a follow-up because i know that things will structurally be different at how we get those numbers. what can you tell us? >> bret: well, we have our own voter analysis, which is 100,000 plus people that are around the election here, and that gives us a little different view of things. then we have the raw data that is coming in. a lot of tools, actually, that they will be able to design where different counties are going, where they have been in the past. the key thing is what the electorate looks like, here is. what does that actually look like today? and in each one of these states, it's going to be different. >> harris: you know, so much has been made of polling. one of the things that i will do when i have the honor -- liberty state park. down in jersey city. will have what i call impact

statements from voters. and they are our voters voices segment that we have been doing throughout the primaries and now election season. exit polling, i don't know. i put all of that in a trash bin, and i replace it with the actual impact of asking people with this candidate, fill in the blank, what it means for your life. with his candidate, with this candidate, so we will get to hear from voters from all walks of life, i think it will be fun, invigorating, and just like a courtroom, we will get a bottom-line statement, from everybody. i can't wait. all of us, we've had a great time with everybody today on election day in this edition of "outnumbered." i will be back. "outnumbered overtime" after the commercial break. and get all of your election coverage right here on fox news. again, special covered kicks off

at 6:00 p.m. eastern, and we are fortunate to get it right from bret and martha. everybody have fun tonight. parmesan popcorn. that's what you need. ♪ sun. good morning, blair. [ chuckles ] whoo. i'm gonna grow big and strong. yes, you are. i'm gonna get this place all clean. i'll give you a hand. and i'm gonna put lisa on crutches! wait, what? said she's gonna need crutches. she fell pretty hard. you might want to clean that up, girl. excuse us. when owning a small business gets real, progressive helps protect what you built with customizable coverage. -and i'm gonna -- -eh, eh, eh. -donny, no. -oh. but when i started seeing things, i didn't know what was happening... so i kept it in. he started believing things that weren't true. i knew something was wrong... but i didn't say a word. during the course of their disease around 50% of people with parkinson's

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>> harris: breaking news right now keeping a close eye on the campaign trail, want to tell you what you're looking at. we know that both of the presidential candidates are out today. the president of the united states has gone to his campaign headquarters in arlington, virginia, what is called that are in cnx and in an area called the bullpen, expecting the president to do what he said he might do earlier when he joined fox and friends this morning and that is go by and think those members of the rnc who helped him get this far in this bid for reelection. could be a victory, we don't know, could not be. we have no idea how things are