n't she pretty? yeah. ♪ ♪ n't she pretty? water? urgh! (rocket ship) hey! hey! heads up. thank you! water tastes like, water. so we fixed it. mio howie: this is media buzz. i'm howard kurz. ahead, corey lewandowski the former trump campaign manager joins the program. it all sounds so familiar, the media arguments, the harsh rhetoric, the tv shouting about the man who is no longer president, with the second senate impeachment trial of donald trump starting tuesday, and every journalist on the planet knowing he'll be acquitted, the two sides will again debate the appalling spectacle of the capitol riot and who is to blame. >> that claim that president trump won the election somehow

and that president biden isn't really the president, he's a pretender, and he's super bowlen it and trump's the -- stolen it and trump's the rightful president, that was the basis for the mob attack on january 6th. >> thill with -- they will never miss an opportunity to politically bludgeon donald trump. they will do anything to prevent him from running in 2024. >> the people who died that day did not have to die. but they were all there, brought together that day because trump lied about the election and then he lied and lied and lied. >> this outrageous so-called impeachment trial in the senate, the senate has no authority, no jurisdiction whatever, it is absolutely rogue, it's a complete clown show. howie: joining us now to analyze the coverage, guy benson, in new york, liz claman, host of the claman count down

and clarence page. the impeachment trial is a very important story, period. will the media relentlessly hype it around the clock despite the fact that everyone knows donald trump will not even come close to being convicted? >> i think so. and you're right, it is a huge story. the whole impeachment process is happening for a reason. it's not conjured out of thin air by democrats and some republicans. the question is, how significant of a story is it, compared to say the first 100 days of a new administration and what they're trying to accomplish, what they're succeeding at, what they might not be succeeding at and you're right to point out that it's very anti-climateic because we know what the outcome will be in the senate, which is an acquittal. i think the media is thrilled to be covering this because of course it paints president trump in a negative light, historic first president to be impeached to times, he's on trial even though he's out of office.

they're sort of addicted to him, they've been addicted to him for five years and this is perhaps one big last hurrah before they have to recognize there's a new president that maybe they should work to hold accountable. howie: liz, putting aside the constitutional arguments, are much of the media hoping to use this trial to convict donald trump in the court of public opinion? >> well, it is the court of public opinion because just as guy said, there is very, very little chance that the senate, unless minority leader mitch mcconnell is going to somehow flip which he's been pretty clear right now that he will not, there's little chance we will see a conviction. i think what the democrats will do and the republicans by the way will take it directly to the conduit between the public and of course themselves and their argument and that is the media. they will use the video clips, the sound bites that donald trump used when he was at his

own rally and they will simply say, look, if you don't speak out against this and you don't vote for impeachment, then you are complicit with what happened in the insurrection and they're trying to prove incitement there and of course five people died including a capitol hill police officer who had his head smashed by a fire ex tenge wisher. -- extinguisher. i would say the republicans are going to the court of public opinion as well and they will say procedurally this is ridiculous because you're trying to convict and oust subpoena who is already out of office. it's just a matter of which one is going to be at a louder decibel level. and the media is covering all of this. it is news. it is news for a president that has been impeached or at least attempted to be i'm i peached twice so -- impeached twice so i get the media effort but both sides are playing this one. howie: the fact that donald trump is down in mar-a-lago does reduce some of the drama. liz mentioned video clips.

the media are going to endlessless replay the clips because the democrats made it clear they will show the clips of the assault on the capitol. that is not the same thing as proving that donald trump incited the violence. >> howard, i'm hearing two things in this whole discussion. on the one hand you're saying will the media relentlessly hype this story. on the other hand you're saying it's a very important story. history is being made here. you know what? this is a very important story. the whole goal is not just to kick a president out of office. you're right, there's the concern about whether donald trump will run again. democrats are quite correct to have that concern. and they want to try to get the facts laid out there so the public can decide. that is the court of public opinion. it's also called democracy. howie: i'm also wondering whether this particular moment more people aren't worried about the pandemic and getting their vaccines. let's take a broader view.

are the media trying to turn this whole impeachment saga, the second impeachment, into a proxy war about the future of the republican party and also to paint all republicans or all republicans who support donald trump as complicit in the violence at the capitol? >> i think that some in the media are absolutely trying to do that. in the next segment i know we're going to talk about one member of the republican party in particular that they're newly obsessed with. we had the addiction to donald trump for five years as i mention ed. then you start to sort of get itchy. donald trump is off social media, he's been booted off. so the fix they've gotten repeatedly all day, every day for years is gone. and if they can't train their fire on trump himself which of course they can during the impeachment trial, moving forward i think they're going to try to focus on individual flash points, divisions within the republican party. this is what they always do,

their favorite story to cover, and find particularly polarizing or controversial statements or members of the party or political conservatives to train that fire on. i'm just not sure it has the same sort of sexiness and appeal and excitement as when it's trump who is actually president and i'm not sure it's going to draw the types of audience, the eye balls anywhere close to what we saw with president trump. i think they might be in for a letdown but they're going to try. howie: it will be interesting if the ratings took a nose dive compared to the last impeachment roughly a year ago. liz, some in the media as well as some democrats like aoc have blamed the republican lawmakers who voted against accepting the electoral certification of joe biden's victory for the violence that took place in the capitol on january 6th. isn't it a stretch to blame all them and say well, they have blood on their hands? >> all of them?

listen. howie, this all goes down to a very important issue. 73% of republicans still like donald trump. and probably that number is even higher if you're looking at primary voters who are republican. they are looking right now and they're saying that is the fear factor, re-election, et cetera. yes, it did not hurt ben sasse, the senator from nebraska who just got reelected. he used strong language to cry what president trump did. you had kevin mccarthy and mitch mcconnell coming out and saying this was horrific and that president trump did serve a role in hyping up this crowd but then mccarthy goes down to mar-a-lago to meet with president trump and a he starts to look like, from anybody in the republican party, a human wind sock, trying to catch the wind and figure out which way to go so now they're going to vote against it and i think that the confusion there is very much a problem for the republicans. you could put ao of c out there,

she'll always say something. this is something the republicans have had to look at at and to guy's point about now there's a new little shiny object for the media to look at, these are unforced errors, these are republicans coming out and senators on that side have had to decry it. howie: right. you know, clarence, to go a step further, there is some commentators on the left who say, well, the problem is that 74 million americans who voted for donald trump, as if peacefuu power. who encouraged that? he said beforehand, i'll accept a peaceful transfer if i win. i don't want to litigate all

this. that's why the senate is going to have a trial, something about what is donald trump's role, his complicitness and this whole thing about how the media love to cover donald trump, i'm delighted not to be burdened with having to focus on donald trump tweets every day and so are most of the colleagues i talked to. there are other issues like covid, poverty, education, et cetera, et cetera, i'll be delighted to get back to. howie: maybe you should take next week off. it's going to be a lot of trump coverage. house managers invited donald trump to testify. that was a publicity stunt. everybody knew he was not going to testify. he will be acquitted regardless. if he had, that would have boosted the coverage into the absolute stratso sphere. >> i saw some lefties on social media trying to bait donald trump to show up and defend himself. trying to say the ratings will be huge, no one can defend trump

better than trump, it was a cynical ploy trying to get him to show. if his lawyers told him anything other than mr. president, absolutely not, it's a trap that will do you no good that, would have been derelict in their duty. instead we got a statement, it's an unconstitutional proceeding. that's debateable, of course many that's the line that trump's team is taking and therefore we're not going to participate in this sham. and i think legally speaking that was clearly the smart move. howie: it's a rare moment of agreement between the parties. they both want the trial over quickly. it could be over by this coming saturday, the house doesn't seem to be calling any witnesses or at least that's the signal right now because both parties have different reasons for wanting to move on. let me get a break here. when we come back, the media debate over marjorie taylor greene, her conspiracy theories and the democrats' decision to kick the congresswoman off her committee. ♪ got my hair ♪ ♪ got my head ♪ ♪ got my brains ♪

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howie: marjorie taylor greene didn't exactly apologize for her past inflammatory comments and wild conspiracy theories as the democrats move to strip her of her house committee assignment. after being publicly defiant, she said this. >> i was allowed to believe things that weren't true and i would ask questions about them and talk about them and that is absolutely what i regret. because if it weren't for the facebook post and comments that i liked in 2018, i wouldn't be standing here today. howie: after republicans refused to punish greene, house democrats broke with precedented, in booting the georgia lawmaker off her panels with just 11gop votes. pundits harshly criticized the freshman congresswoman for saying or liking such things

such as nancy pelosi should be shot in the head, fbi agents should be executed and a plane may not have hit the pentagon on 9/11. >> the top house republicans refusal to discipline her along with most members of the party, that and her own non-apology apology, which amounted to excuses and rationalizations, blame shifting and lies, instead of any honest show of contrition. >> 95% of the house republicans stood up and voted in support of assassination threats on the speaker of the house, anti-semitism, attacking children who survived school shootings, denying that the shootings were real. >> ultimately for democrats, this is not about marjorie taylor greene, a new congresswoman. instead it's a political ploy, the idea they want to smear all conservatives, all republicans and extreme conspiracy theorists. >> if you believe that the jews control a space laser that starts fires in northern

california, you should be taken off the prestigious housed case labor committee and confined to the dark recesses of the furthest building away from the house floor. howie: guy benson, marjorie taylor greene has said or endorsed some really wild things including qanon garbage that she now says are lies. have the media overplayed this and in fact kind of elevated this freshman congresswoman? >> oh, i mean, there's no question about that. so in the montage you played, i agree fully with what both seann hannity and karl rove said even though they were coming at it from different angles. to be perfectly clear and i said this repeatedly, marjorie taylor greene's conspiracy mongering that she engaged in the past apparently just as a private citizen was toxic, odious, disgusting and her quasi-contrition, i don't buy it, i you don't find it to be

genuine, look at how she's fund raising and some of the comments after the speech, after the vote, but this is a freshman back benchers from georgia who did some horrible things or at least amplified horrible beliefs years ago before she was elected. if you look at the amount of coverage that has been devoted to this woman and her conspiracy theories, versus, for example, the white house this week on several occasions was undermining some of their own top public let experts on reopening schools, there's a very real issue between jen psaki and the white house, the cdc director, dr. fauci, they're not in agreement on a really important issue, i think the news judgment here is highly, highly questionable given the amount of attention metet out to these two stories. howie: it's not just the liberal media. mitch mcconnell says in a statement that greene's loon elis and conspiracy theories are

a cancer on the republican party and the country, she said that the clintons crashed jfk junior's airplane, says it's not living in reality. doesn't that make it a bigger story. >> this morning, pat toomey was on cnn in the past 72 hours, you've had every from bill cassidy of louisiana, these are all republicans, not to mention kevin cramer of north dakota, all saying this is not somebody we want under the tent. i use the term, the tent, because kevin mccarthy said we have a big tent here, a lot of different opinions can be welcome. what these senators are saying is, yeah, we've got a big tent but do we want a rabid raccoon under it and we seal the entrances. i think this would have been a different outcome on the vote of censuring her if it had been like a business cheney house vote, secret, anonymous, because then people don't have to be

named and picked by constituents to say you voted against marjorie taylor greene. but the republican party has to decide is this somebody -- is she somebody who is one side of the debate aisle when it comes to right or left policy issues or is she somebody who is really damaging to the entire conservative party? howie: right. you know, kevin mccarthy later said when republicans declined to act that while he didn't think she should be punished that she -- he condemned the comments. when the story first broke, he didn't say anything. a spokesman came out and said he was concerned. clarence, the next day marjorie taylor greene held a news conference and told reporters you're doing a really good job at addicting our nation to hate, teaching people to hate people like me and president trump. how do you plead? >> what she means is we're doing a good job of publicizing her. she's benefiting from all this. it's her party that is suffering. i think we'll see a lot more

negative votes from her. liz was right, if this was a required vote, not out in the open, if this had been a behind closed doors vote, that is, this is damaging to the party and they've got to wrestle with it and i think it's -- this is part of our democratic process here and the public is going to hold the republicans in general accountable. that's something to speak of, it's the right position, like liz cheney did. we need to hear more. howie: i think nobody's defending many of the past comments that greene says she was allowed to believe, you allowed to believe, but, guy, are the media now trying to make marjorie taylor greene the face of the entire republican party? >> yes, yes. and that's what the democrats are trying to do. they're working together on this. marjorie taylor greene, i hate even talking about her. because she is kook who has done kookie things. she is one member who should be

far more obscure than she is. i'm not saying that this isn't a significant story because of what it means for the republican party. the heaviness of the coverage, the almost gleefulness of the coverage, it's not exactly so you tell what they're trying -- subtle what they're trying to do. there are other big stories that deserve more coverage than marjorie taylor greene has attracted. howie: well, we're done talking about her for now. guy, clarence, thank you very much. up next, the media argue about whether president trump is ignoring bipartisanship in pushing his big covid relief bill and corey lewandowski is up later. ♪ ♪

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my psoriasis, clearer... cosentyx works on all of this. four years and counting. so watch out. i got this! watch me. real people with active psoriatic arthritis look and feel better with cosentyx. cosentyx works fast for results that can last. it treats the multiple symptoms of psoriatic arthritis, like joint pain and tenderness, back pain, and helps stop further joint damage. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms, if your inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, or if you've had a vaccine, or plan to. serious allergic reactions may occur. i just look and feel better. i got real relief with cosentyx. watch me! feel real relief. ask your rheumatologist about cosentyx. howie: here's the media debate, how much should president biden

compromise with republicans on his huge nearly $2 trillion covid relief president, with 10gop senators promoting a bill less than one-third the cost of biden's. laying the ground work for a budget maneuver to give final approval. many say president biden isn't interested in bipartisanship because he's made almost no changes to the covid relief bill, except for changing the target level of income eligibility levels and democrats are getting ready to muscle it through on the party line votes. fair or of unfair? >> well, partly. how's that for taking a stand? i will say this, that while biden has said you know what, maybe we can get the $15 minimum wage for our thing removed and that's kind of a little bit of negotiation, basically going with 51 votes in the senate on budget reconciliation is the

ultimate majority power move and if he allows that to happen, howie, he better not expect any likelihood that the republicans will embrace him in the future when it comes to bipartisanship. this is not a good situation right now that p president biden has put himself in, specifically because -- look, go to the washington post. had are urge -- they are urging him to get more republican votes on this thing. he did of course have the monday meeting, monday night, where ten republican senators came and discussed but they were so far apart in the first place, they marched in with 600 billion versus the 1.9 trillion so a lot of this is for show for the media. howie: let me ask you this. because are the media pretty selective in their criticism? when president trump used budget reconciliation as it's called to push through his tax cuts, a lot of pundits on the left didn't like that. and objected. and now many media people on the right are saying he can't possibly be for unity if he uses

the same maneuver that the gop did. >> well, yeah, absolutely. they were certainly pouncing on president trump. it's sort of a soft pounce they're doing right now with biden and people see through that. they see that they're taking it a little more easily on him. there are a lot of questions through many media outlets, whether it's the chicago tribune or the associated press saying go big or just go without republicans, really. i mean, 12, 13 days into this presidency you're not at least going to try and take a little more time to. to biden's point, he would argue and i bet during the super bowl interview tonight he will argue that given the choice certainly between taking more time with the republicans to get more of them on-board and on the other side speeding up getting checks in people's hands and shots in people's arms, he is going to have to go with the latter because he is concerned about the train that is already half off the covid cliff. he wants to pull it back. the follow-on story may be

popularity at the moment if he starts to see an uptick in that, he and the democrats might say what do we need to go with bipartisanship for and that's a mistake. howie: you mentioned the $15 an hour minimum wage which i always thought was a liberal wish list thing added to the covid package, president biden saying it will probably have to come out. the media didn't object to that even though the senate stripped it off. even bernie sanders. they like the idea of a higher minimum wage. >> a lot of americans like the idea of higher minimum wage. one-third republicans really like this $1.9 trillion bill and two-thirds of americans like it. so people are suving right now. -- suffering right now. we still have 10 million that are on jobs assistance and don't have full-time jobs. i think the president is walking a fine line. if he stumbles and trips ant doesn't have any republicans going along that could be a real problem going forward on other

of policy. howie: right. then vote on the minimum wage separately. not everybody in business likes it. liz, thanks for sticking around. coming up, are the media making this week's senate impeachment trial about far more than about whether to convict private citizen donald trump. corey lewandowski weighs in, next. priceline works with top hotels, to save you up to 60%. these are all great. and when you get a big deal... ♪♪ ...you feel like a big deal. ♪♪ priceline. every trip is a big deal.

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howie: with the senate impeachment trial just two days away, and the former president's legacy on the line, i spoke earlier with corey lewandowski, donald trump's one-time campaign manager and a key advisor in the 2020 campaign. corey lewandowski, welcome. >> thank you for having me, howie. howie: do you believe the media have been rooting for this impeachment trial even knowing that donald trump is certain to be acquitted? >> i do think they is a big portion of the media who has looked forward to this opportunity to try and hold the president accountable and howie, look, what i really think we're

doing is we're politicizing the notion of an impeachment. what that does is sets a very dangerous precedent for every president going forward that says if the on of sit party has control of the house of representatives and they don't like something you do, they can move to impeach you, knowing the senate is not going to convict. howie: well, plenty of pundits say what's really going on here is not an attempt to convict the former president, because that's obviously not going to happen but that the democrats are trying to brand donald trump and marjorie taylor greene and republican as the party of election lies and conspiracy theories and inciting violence at the capitol. do you think that is part of what's going on? >> it might be. but look, all the democrats have to do is look within their own ranks. no one wants to talk about this, but they've been a member of congress who has been a member of congress for a long time in the democratic party who is a federal judge who not only was impeached but actually convicted and removed from that. one of six federal judges in the history of our country ever to

be removed for bribery was convicted of that charge and was removed and now he's a member of congress from the state of florida. the democrats can throw accusations at republican members of congress. i'm not here to defend any of those individuals for what they've said or done. we can look at what the democrat -- what some of the democrats have said and how the media coveraged those and see if there's two separate sets of coverage, one as relates to marjorie taylor greene and other as relate to other democrats, specifically ilhan omar, who has made racist statements against jews, against americans, and she continues to serve on committees of jurisdiction. howie: bach to the impeachment. have you a -- back to the impeachment. have you a situation where mitch mcconnell, senate republican leaders, says he believes donald trump committed impeachable offenses, you have 10 house republicans who joined in the impeachment. do you see donald trump remaining as the leader of the republican party for the next four years or some republicans are being quoted in interviews

are saying that even if they like president trump, it's time for him to move on. >> i think president trump will have an enormous impact in the next election cycle n came to a conclusion that the republicans are better in control of the house of representatives than the democrats are. i believe president trump is going to make that happen. that doesn't mean that members of the republican who voted to impeach the president don't get primaried. i think you'll see this president, donald trump, play a huge role in those 2022 elections and keep all of his options open for 2024. i think it's far too early for anyone to either count him in or out of the 2024 race. howie: leaving you aside whether he runs, you said don't get primaries, these things don't happen in a vacuum. donald trump could help, encourage, help raise monies for for challengers for those that

have opposed him. is that likely to happen? would you be involved in campaigning against those republicans who broke with the president? >> you know, howie, i'll tell you, my goal is the same as leader mccarthy, which is to return the republicans to the majority in 2022. but that being said, i'm fairly certain that if liz cheney faces a competitive primary in the state of wyoming and loses in the primary, it's a very good possibility that the individual who wins that republican primary is going to go on and serve as the republican member of congress from the state of wyoming. i think that is also true in some certain districts in ohio, in south carolina, potentially illinois. you start looking at members of congress who are in overwhelmingly republican districts and the influence that donald trump could have in those districts to find challengers to beat them in the primary. howie: liz cheney did get a vote of confidence from her own post. looking back, would it have been better for donald trump's legacy if he had graciously consistentd

the he'll he ex or at least done so after the lawsuits had failed? >> i think the president was very concerned about some of the fraud and potential fraud that he took place during the election. so hindsight, you can always look at it in 2020 vision, you can look at joe biden's record, which is comprised of executive orders. he fired over 600 people, many were drum appointees, some -- trump appointees. because they were appointed by donald trump, joe biden fired them. so hindsight is a gift that none of us have. howie: one of those people was you, president trump gave you an appointment to a pentagon advisory board and they've all been fired in an effort to start over. do you think that's unfair? >> look, it's a tip of the hat to them. there's over 600 people with who joe biden's administration fired. he told us he wanted to unify the country, not divide the country. donald trump didn't do that when he came into office. as you know, valerie jarrett

continues to serve on the kennedy board, a number of obama appointees continued to serve throughout the entire trump administration. they were not fired when donald trump came in in the first week. that's not the case of the biden administration and by and large the media has given him a pass on that when over 600 people who served on 37 boards were all summarily fired because goa wanted to start over -- joe biden wanted to start over and appoint his own people to the commissions. howie: president biden in a taped interview said this. >> should former president trump still receive intelligence briefings? >> i think not. >> why not? >> because of his erratic behavior. related to the insurrection. howie: what's your reaction to biden's decision on the intel briefings? >> i think it's a dangerous precedent to set. many people would admit that joe biden lost something of a soft

ball n the last 50 years, joe biden doesn't have the same mental capacity as he had 50 years ago. are we saying that the next president who comes in can say we don't like the role that person had or the mental acuity that person had and we'll stop the briefings. it's unprecedented. president trump didn't do that to barack obama. barack obama didn't do that to george wh bush. this is joe biden reacting to something, out of fear of ail a yen -- alienating members of the far left of his base. howie: corey lewandowski, thank you for joining us. >> thank you. howie: the biden white house clarified that intelligence officials make the final call on trump's briefings. we'll deal with media controversies at the new york times and fox in a moment. ♪♪

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howie: two new york times reporters are leaving the paper under an ethical cloud. the paper confirmed its lead covid reporter, donald mcneil, junior, used a racial slur, the n word, on a company sponsored student trip. the editor said he concluded mcneil's intent was not hateful. after staffers expressed outrage, mcneil resigned.

there was a note from mcneil who said he thought the context in which he used the ugly word could be defended. he realized it is not, it is deeply offensive and hurtful, for that i apologize. the times admitted they could not substantiate claims by a supposed former isis fighter who has been charged by canadian authorities with perpetrating a terrorist hoax. he said he was target r&d by online complaints, saying his lack of punishment came down to entitlement and mail privilege. he -- male privilege. he said he once gave a colleague a back rub and poured a drink at a coworker's head. the caliphate fiasco said led to inaccurate claims. mills and mcneil are leaving a newspaper that has had a rough year going back to the firing of

the editorial page editor for running an op-ed by tom cotton. smartmatic filed a lawsuit against fox and three hosts as well as trump lawyers rudy giuliani and sidney powell. the company which provided election services to los angeles county alleges there was a conspiracy to defame and disparage them that included lou dobbs, jeanine piro and maria bartiromo. a fox spokes person said fox news media is committed to providing the full context of every store with in-depth reporting. we are proud of our election coverage and will defend the meritless lawsuit in court. on friday, fox business network announced it is canceling lou dobbs tonight, the network's highest rating show. i've known lou as a talented broadcaster for decades.

the company said in a statement as we said in october, fox news media regularly considers programming changes and plans have been in place to launch new format as appropriate post election including on fox business. this is part of those planned changes. a new 5:00 p.m. program will be announce inned the near future -- in the near future. don mccain, one of the most passionate defender of of donald trump during his presidency and of his claims of election fraud, he said lou dobbs is and was great, nobody loves america more than lou. in my opinion, dobbs sometimes went too far. but they that was his right as an opinion host and it's fox's right to decide its programming. i want to wish lou the best in the future. after the break, cnn's jeff zucker is stepping down, a look at how he changed the network and people magazine's glowing cover story on the bidens. ♪

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howie: jeff zucker has announced he's stepping down at year's end after four years in which president trump slammed the network as fake news and cnn savaged him pretty much around the clock. >> we don't set out to be anti-trump. we set out to be pro-truth. now, i understand in this day and age why being pro-truth can be construed as anti-trump. but that's not our problem. that's not our of fault. we're just here to ferret out the truth. howie: joining us now from dallas is steve krakauer, a former cnn executive who publishes the fourth watched newsletter. how does ferreting out the truth, reporter jim acosta interrupting president trump and some of the day time anchorsy

vies rating him -- eviserating him. >> i think we saw a massive change in what the word truth means now. i liked working with jeff. one of the things he brought to cnn was this idea of we're going to take the one or two big stories and blow it out across all of our platforms, across all the hours. well, beginning in 2015, that story was trump. first it was the fascination people had with trump. during the last four years it was this existential war that cnn found themselves in with donald trump, real or imagined. and ultimately one of those casualty was the definition i think of what truth really is and the really expansion of opinion into cnn's traditionally news programming hours and finding those moments that went from just talking about the news and what happened to how do we feel about it and how should you feel about it. howie: on that point, zucker absolutely got the rating up by

going to an anti-trump business model. ratings are now down for all three cable news necessary works. did he throw away cnn's reputation, that wasn't as ideological as msnbc or fox? >> i think it will be a big challenge. it worked in the short-term. the ratings did really well. the ratings didn't necessarily overcome the ratings of fox during the last four years but they were very good compared to cnn traditionally. part of that, what do you sacrifice when you're doing that? nor the point, now that the trump era is over, the war is over. if jeff was a war-time president we're about to enter a period of peace time between the media and the administration in washington with the biden era. now what do do you? what do you build in the wreckage of what was once the great news network? do you continue down the path of opinion? unless you get impeachment every month for the next four years i

don't think the ratings are going to last in the way that they have. so what do you do now? do you still stick with this opinion area or do you maybe transition, try to go back to some sort of news-ish programming that you once had before? howie: zucker clashed with his boss at warner media. his relationship with donald trump when he made donald trump a star. trump felt betrayed because he made nbc all this money with the show. >> i don't think jeff would think he would be so intertwined with donald trump who was his big star at nbc, with the a(tigs. -- apprentice. you have to think was it business or personal with how the network ended up going over the last four years. the relationship between them was fractured once that happened. it was very good before. now you saw what we got. there's personal elements to

that as well. howie: let me just get you in on this new people magazine cover story on the bidens if we can put that up, glowing story, the president and his right. a reporter asked some policy questions, also asked is the white house starting to feel like home and could you do this job without her, jill biden. your take on that? >> yes. we should clarify, it's dr. jill biden, of course. it was like joe biden interview mad libs. you got the backbone with the ram rod and all the stuff you normally get, it told us nothing. look, it's people magazine. you've got nora o'donnell's interview tonight on cbs with joe biden. that's about the first that we're seeing with joe biden in a very long time in terms of an interview setting. i'm very curious to see whether the media coverage we get, the interviews we get with joe biden from traditional media looks more like people magazine or looks more like journalism. howie: trump and his family were on people magazine six months into the presidency, the headline was secret and lies,

donald trump taught his children to fight dirty. a little different. still to come, the media narrative for the big game, it's super bowl sunday. are you ok? it's just a cold. if you have high blood pressure, a cold is not just a cold. most cold medicines may raise blood pressure. choose coricidin hbp. the brand with a heart. for powerful cold relief without raising your blood pressure. (ringing) - hey kaleb, what's up? how you doing? - hey, i'm good, guess what, i just had my 13th surgery. - really? i just had my 17th surgery. - well, you beat me. - well, i am a little bit older than you. - yeah it's true. how are you doing? - i'm doing good. i'm encouraged by seeing how people are coming together to help each other during times like these. - kind of like how shriners hospitals for children is there for us. imagine if i couldn't get my surgery. who knows what would have happened.

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howie: the media have their story line for today's super bowl and it's all about tom brady, a 43-year-old quarterback who led the new england patriots to nine super bowls, now in his first year gets the tampa bay buccaneers toe the big game. even patriot haters have to be impressed. it doesn't quite feel like super sunday, maybe it's the pandemic, and only 25,000 fans will be in the stadium. maybe it will just be a really good football game. i'm howard kurz. we hope you check out our facebook page, we post my daily columns. subscribe to my podcast, media

buzz meter, on apple itunes or amazon device, any place you get really good pod casts. we'll be back here next sunday, 11:00 a.m. eastern. we'll see you then with the latest buzz. enjoy the game. eric: the battle over reopening schools during the pandemic is heating up on this sunday. chicago mayor lori lightfoot tomorrow planning to lock teachers out of remote learning if they don't show up for in-person classs in the morning and the teachers' union in philadelphia telling members not to report to schools tomorrow over safety concerns about the coronavirus in our of classrooms. hello, everyone. welcome to america's news headquarters. here on the fox news channel. i'm eric shawn. hi, arthel. arthel: hi, everyone. some parents are saying their children are struggling