>> we begin with a fox news alert. the stock news markets taking a hit as a new coronavirus are rattling the markets. this could be more contagious than delta and more resistant to vaccines. so after two years of covid restrictions, the markets are alarmed. we'll have more later in the hour. as the mainstream media outlets

take heat for down playing the christmas parade rampage in wisconsin. this is "outnumbered." i'm gillian turner. hire's carley shimkus from "fox and friends." we have morgan ortegas and in the center, we have mr. peter doocy. he's co host of "fox and friends." happy thanksgiving to you guys. >> happy thanksgiving. >> hope you had a wonderful holiday. >> you too. >> let's get into this. vigils are ongoing for the six victims in waukesha. they rage in age from 8 to 81. so as the community is turning out for them, some outlets are getting called out for their coverage. "the washington post" posted and deleted the tweet suggesting the

s.u.v. that brooks was driving was responsible for the massacre and an msnbc analyst took heat for calling it "an accident." watch. take a listen. >> whether it had anything to do with this accident last night in the killing of these people, others might be thinking of an attack like this. >> a red s.u.v. sped into the parade route and directly in to people marching in the parade and people watching it on the sidewalk. >> so darrell brooks jr. is facing five counts of intentional homicide and more charges are expected. his lengthy rap sheet is fuelling debate over bail reform. two separate judges freed him on low bail despite having an active warrant in nevada as well as two open cases, one he carried out this massacre allegedly last weekend. steve, i want to come to you for your reaction. what do you think of the

coverage? >> the coverage is crazy. for "the washington post" to blame the s.u.v.? it was an autonomous car? has the car been arrested? that's just nuts. that's why they wound up taking it down. but ultimately they didn't mention the suspect's name until the fifth paragraph. and then deborah messing saying don't minimize and she's got that right. let's get that straight on what is happening here. you know, it happened in wisconsin a year ago after jacob blake was shot, joe biden called him when he visited kenosha. he talked about the dangers of racism and how bad the violence was as well. now that it's happened in this other town in wisconsin, in waukesha, we don't know the motive but the "new york post" says that the suspect's social media talks about violence against white people. the question is was this racially motivated? we don't know at this stage.

the president went to kenosha and he made initial comments the morning after what happened in waukesha, but is he going to waukesha? the nation's heart has been broken over this. it would say a lot about the president if he were to go there. but instead, he's holed up at a billionaire's place in nantucket. looks like he can't be bothered by it. we would like to hear the president talk about this case the same way he has regarding others in the past. >> steve, you mentioned deborah messing. let's pull up her tweet on this so we can take a look at it together here. she basically said waukesha was a massacre and a domestic terror attack and not an accident and not to minimize it. there's the tweet right there. what do you make of this? i didn't really expect deborah messing to be the person to step up here. she's usually making headlines

for far left progressive ideology. >> we've seen so many people around the country have seen what happened. we've seen it with our own two eyes. we saw -- there were cameras and phones rolling all over waukesha. we saw what happened. for people to minimize it by calling it an accident or saying, you know, blaming the s.u.v., it's like come on, we can do the math in our heads. there was somebody behind the wheel. we don't know the motivation, you know. initially we heard there was a knife fight and then there might have been a knife involved and then it was -- apparently it was a domestic dispute. so whatever the origin was of the reason that that guy got behind the wheel and mowed down the dancing grannies, we don't know yet. but there's a lot of questions. so you have to be sober about what exactly happened. it wasn't a car that drove itself.

>> carlie, what is the media's primary responsibility when a tragedy like this unfolds? speculation should be ruled out, right? tell us the kind -- >> it's amazing that that is a valid question in this day and age. it's to report the truth and, you know -- you can responsibly speculate. but this media reaction where you're blaming the s.u.v. andit's disgusting. it's something that we see from the democratic party a lot. on wednesday two police officers were shot in the bronx. mayor bill de blasio responded to that saying, it's another example of a gun from out of state coming in to our city and hurting a new yorker. so it's the gun's fault for shooting the police officer. it's the s.u.v.'s fault for running in to this crowd of people. you do have to wonder why the

media -- i want to put them in the democratic party, it's true -- and other democrats are separated from reality when it comes to crime. the answer is political. they know that if they say things like stop and frisk is racist and bail reform needs to happen and we have to reimagine policing, they will get votes. they present themselves as the compassionate party. the compassionate policies are getting people killed. i think that republicans have a great window of opportunity here to really make a difference. it's going to take a specific candidate. i don't know who that is. maybe a tim scott. i care less about who the person is about more about the policies that they would present because those policies really could save lives. >> morgan, i want to lean on your national security expertise for a moment. law enforcement may not be investigating what happened last weekend as a potential act of

terrorism. seems like the reality here is that this attack couldn't have been more devastating had it actually been plotted meticulously by terrorists for weeks, months in advance. darrell brooks, the suspect hit a real cross section of american life at this parade. >> yeah, i'm going to say something i never thought i would say on "outnumbered," which is i agree with deborah messing. i think it was domestic terrorism. certainly looks close to it to me. the reason why i say that, if you look at europe, you know this well, gillian, we've seen isis use large s.u.v.s or trucks, not necessarily the same type of truck but we have seen terrorists in other countries in europe go after innocent civilians. and so when you look to at his rap sheet that you talked about, this is a sick and sorted individual. someone that has threatened what could be deemed other acts of terrorism like, of course, trying to bomb or threatening to

bomb the casino in nevada. so it's important to look and say what did the authorities know about him. that bomb threat is over a decade old. what is new in his rap sheet? in addition to that he was also convicted for having sex with an underage minor, someone under 16. last time i checked, that is called rape. you can't consent at that age. so i have no idea why people cover for this person. he's a horrible individual. he's a despicable person that killed children around christmas. why this wouldn't get coverage, why the president wouldn't be there is beyond me. the president can't go to afghanistan because he already ruined that country. at minimum, he should be having dinner with the troops or doing something supportive. but sitting with billionaires in nantucket while people can't afford turker on thanksgiving day while americans were killed

by a domestic terrorist? wake up. >> the president did see troops but it wasn't on thanksgiving day. >> it's the tradition of presidents to do it on thanksgiving day. >> you're right. i want to point out the context there. dr. saphier, we can debate what we call this kind of attack but to the victims, the family members, doesn't matter whether we label it domestic terrorism or not to the medical community that came out, it was incredible. the nurses, the people trained in cpr and other types of emergency, first aid started treating a lot of the victims on the ground before first responders arrived. >> that's right, gillian. we can say that the bottom line is many lives were lost because of this incident and many people were injured. it's wonderful to see a show of force, where you see first

reresponders on and off duty coming out to help those around him. to add on to what morgan is saying. this is an unstable individual that plowed his car into this crowd of people. over a decade ago, he called in a bomb threat. he's convicted of statutory rape, failure to show up for many court proceedings as well as a litany of other charges. where is the service to him and the mental health issues that are likely within him? most likely being untreated. that's one of the biggest problems we have in the u.s. correctional system right now. severely untreated mental illness. we have an epidemic in our country. we have covid going on, obesity, many other chronic medical issues. if we start in treating mental health the way we do physical health, we would see less tragedies. so moving forward, we need to make sure that these families that lost lives because of this

person get brought to justice and justice will be served. we also have to make sure we're treating the illness and we cannot continue to let people like this go through this system and just being passed on and passed on without being treated. >> coming up next, the backlash to president biden and top democrats that say as americans struggle with what may be the most expensive holiday ever that things are great. america is back. that's next. stick with us. ♪♪ with age comes more... get more with neutrogena® retinol pro plus. a powerful .05% retinol that's also gentle on skin. for wrinkles results in one week. neutrogena®. for people with skin.

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declaration while calling in to the macy's thanksgiving day parade. >> what is your message to the american folks on this thanksgiving day? >> my message is after two years, you're back, america is back. there's nothing that we can overcome, al. >> those comments come as the president and his family spend their thanksgiving holiday at a billionaire's compound in nantucket. that led republicans to slam him as out of touch. he's not the only one. elizabeth warren got torched on twitter for claiming to know the real reason for inflation tweeting this. wondering why your thanksgiving groceries cost more this year? it's because greedy corporations are charging americans extra keep their stock prices high. this is outrageous. steve, i want to talk about the president. he's right to say americans can overcome anything but a lot of people would say america would be better faster if he would get out of the way with the eviction

moratorium that kept people out of work and flooded the country with money and look where we are as a result. >> absolutely. joe biden's policies put us where we are today. the last couple months, there's been supply chain issues, the job market has been tricky. it's really hard to get somebody to go to work these days. when they're sitting on cash that they didn't have 1 1/2 years ago. suddenly all of these people are deciding, you know what? i don't need to work until the money runs out. so a lot of the businesses that would love to be open and fully employed can't do it. here's the thing. you know, jen psaki told our white house correspondent a couple days ago, when it comes to the price of turkey, i don't know if she said to peter doocy, i don't know if you ever cooked a turkey but a turkey is only a dollar more. when having gone to the grocery store a couple times this week, it's not just the turkey is a dollar more -- and trust me, our

turkey was more than a dollar more -- but everything for the pumpkin pie was a couple bucks more. the green bean casserole, a couple bucks more. this sweet potatoes, the yams. you name it. store bought gravy? $3 more than last year. >> our turkey weighed 17 pounds and cost $132. >> that is outrageous. >> what is it made of? >> are there diamond earrings? >> made of unicorn meat? >> i went to the local butcher. i didn't know what to say. >> do you go to the gucci store? >> $132. >> i hope it was dark meat. that is the best kind. >> that's true. >> sorry to interrupt. had to share that with you guys. >> first of all, so glad to see you back on tv, your baby is

adorable. >> thank you. >> president biden made a speech earlier this weekend. his message on the economy is i'm on it, i got it. don't worry. when it comes to the rise in gas prices, we're going to unleash 50 million gallons of gas from the strategic petroleum reserve. when it comes to supply chain issues, ports are open 24/7. problem is neither of those things address the issue. the bigger problem is i don't think he's said anything that has. >> part of -- lots of challenges all around, right, for the american people and for the administration. one of the big challenges for the president's agenda is that his two biggest achievements so far, the infrastructure bill and then build back better if he can get it through the senate is that these achievements are what bill mcgurn from the "wall street journal" described as washington achievements.

meaning they have been covered like 24 hours a day, seven day as week by all the major outlets. the people this they're intended to serve are not going to reap the benefits of these bills for months, probably even years to come, this is especially true for things like subsidized child care, for universal pre-k. it doesn't just pop into place. we have to build that in this country because it's not in place. so he's not even going to incur the political benefits from these two huge achievements coming up in the mid-terms. a year ago way. >> a good point. morgan, you obviously worked in the previous administration not on the economic front. you're a smart person. do you have any idea of how to make things better? how to make things better on a economic front or just take a stab at this topic in any way you want? >> i think it's looking at what

the average american is going through. really having empathy for it. we saw the same sort of attitude in afghanistan. we're getting out no matter what. we don't care. now we're seeing high rates of suicide amongst our veterans and especially amongst our special forces. so i think instead of sort of rolling your eyes about the turkey being more or the mashed potatoes being more, understand that whenever you're living paycheck to paycheck when child care expenses are going up, groceries are going up, that means a lot to families. sometimes maybe the administration can't fix everything. but maybe having empathy for what single parents or families are going through would go a long way. you have to be realistic about the problem. people are not stupid. they were first told inflation wasn't real. then they were told it's transitory. finally now they're being told inflation is good for them. the american people are pretty

smart people. they understand what the high cost of gas and food and things in their everyday life what that means. you can make the case to the american people that the infrastructure build and build back better and all of these things are in their interest if you don't talk down to them and pretend they're stupid and they don't understand what inflation is. they get it. they check out at the grocery store. they get it. >> dr. saphier, president biden posted a tweet and part of the tweet says, we also passed the bipartisan infrastructure law, which is going to make it's easier for businesses to move goods and reach more customers than ever before. my build back better act will go even further. i'm looking forward to shopping small tomorrow and i hope you are, too. the small business saturday thing, very good message. but build back better, the other side of the aisle says if that passes, inflation gets worse. >> we can build back better, but build back better with what.

>> we won't have anything. this is not the america that most people remember and probably not the one that most people want. turkey is more expensive. gas is more expensive. people that aren't going to the hospital to receive anti-body therapy for covid because the deductibles are so high that here not getting the treatment, which leaves them to be hospitalized. a lot of things costing a lot of money right now. when you have jen psaki and people laughing it off, oh, it's only a dollar more but we're not sitting at billionaire compounds like other people are. that single dollar is a lot when it comes to a lot of people. could be life or death for some people because they're putsing away as much as they can. so if someone does get sick, they can afford it. the condescension out of the administration has to go. they need to start relating with the average american, the real world that the rest of us live in. >> on jennifer granholm laughing off a solution to the rising

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holding an emergency meeting today. some nations though are not waiting. they have already moved to block flights from a handful of countries in the region. for the u.s., dr. fauci says there's no plans to ban any flights right now, but does caveat that by saying this could all change soon. dr. saphier, i'm going to come to you off the bat. there's five countries that have cases, south africa, israel, botswana. we're looking at cases in asia, the middle east. it's a matter of time, right before we get a case in the united states or is that not necessarily the case? >> that's right. still less than 100 cases of the new variant that is likely way underestimated. it's likely much more than that. whether or not this new variant has already made its way to the united states is unknown. it's possible. it's certainly not going to be prevalent.

i think it's a mistake. dr. fauci saying that we're not going to start restricting flights from south africa in to the united states. he wants to get more information. let me tell you, the one thing that president trump did off the bat early, he shut down flights from china. that gave the united states some time. unfortunately while we shut down flights from china, we didn't shut down flights from europe where the virus was already circulating. it's important to get ahead of this and not have reflexsive responses. so it's a mistake. you should start restricting now and gather information. you keep the borders open as we saw from the southwestern border and the european boards, that's how the variants come in. carlie? >> yeah, dr. saphier, the question that everybody wants to know, how worried about you about this new variant? how worried should we be? >> too soon to tell. we need more information. three things to look at. is the new variant more

transmissable? early data out of south africa says it may be more contagious or more transmissible as we're seeing a rapid rise in cases there. does it cause more severe disease? we don't know. it's too soon to tell. the good news is the wall of natural and vaccine induced immunity is still going to suppress any severity of these new variants. that brings us to the third question. is the vaccine, is the natural immunity, will it be protective against this new variant? too soon to tell. we need more information. the good news is that i can tell you the vaccines, natural immunity, it's not black or white. while the new variant has about 50 mutations, 30 specifically to that spike protein, many of those mutations have been in some of the other variants. so even if there's less efficacy from the vaccine or less efficacy from natural immunity, it is highly likely that they will both still offer some protection against this new

variant. >> that was my question. proudly part of operation warp speed in the trump administration. so a lot of us are curious is the vaccine going to protect us. several of us on this panel have small children that are not of age yet to consider the vaccine. so what do parents do as we see the delta variant, the new variant and the young children that can't be vaccinated. >> morgan, great question. here's the thing when it comes to the emerging variants. while the united states is continuing to focus on boosting subsets of population, what we should be focusing on is making sure there's accent to affordable vaccines. the stronger global immunity is, that's how you stop it. so let's get vaccines to the poorer countries as quick as possible. that's what the biden

administration has to do. how can we get global population immunity that will protect our children. i can tell you, morgan, thankfully covid-19 still seems to be extremely rare for severe illness in young children. based on cdc data before the delta wave, over 40% of children had been exposed with natural immunity. now fast forward through the delta wave with many children also being vaccinated, over 2/3s of children have some sort of protective immunity. that is just added to the growing wall of immunity in the country and we have treatments that are accessible and affordable in the united states to keep people alive. the cdc over the last three to four weeks has reported zero covid deaths in people under 30. >> dr. saphier, as covid has been out there in the world for two years now it's been floating around. as the biden administration and the world health doctors try to figure out how to get a handle

on it and where it came from, president biden just this last week was talking in a virtual summit on the the zoom screen with president xi. he never once pressed him on the origins of covid. when he was running for president, he made it clear, you know what? unlike donald trump, i have a good relationship with president xi. if you elect me, i'll work with my good friend and doing -- try to get to the bottom of these things. fast forward to today, joe biden said we were never good friends. it was just business. nevertheless he could have pressed him where to come from and he didn't. >> thankfully, steve, the scientists and health authorities of south africa are much more open andtransparent unlike the ccp. here we are two years later dealing with this pandemic. >> south africa might have a lot

of political problems a major problems but they're a strong ally of the united states is the good news here. a member of the hollywood elite is getting slammed for as what some say is the heartless response for the brazen crime wave in l.a. stay with us. ♪♪ walmart's deals for days isn't over yet. this cyber monday is your last chance to score big online starting sunday night. don't miss out on walmart's deals for days. ♪ ♪ exploring the heart of historic europe with viking, you'll get closer to iconic landmarks, deals for days. to local life and legendary treasures

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>> police searching for a group of young men that robbed $20,000 of merchandise from an apple store in the san francisco area. it was all caught on security camera. get this, in broad daylight at 11:30 a.m. this is the latest in a series of store lootings across california that are ratcheting up just in time for the holiday season. now seth rogen is getting slammed for his response to the crime wave. a youtube star said his car was broken in to and the thief took decorations for his 7-year-old's

daughter's birthday party. rogan said his car has been broken into a dozen times. he said -- >> morgan, it's easy for a multimillionaire to say that, but if you're living paycheck to paycheck and your car gets broken into our stolen, it's a different story. >> yeah, i don't think anybody wants the violation that you get from your goods being stolen, especially little girls birthday party items. we can have compassion for that. i lived in big cities. it's true that i take a lot of precautions in big cities that i don't take when i'm home in auburndale, florida where i grew up. it's a different environment. but this is one of the reasons why in nashville, tennessee where i live now, you see people from l.a., san francisco, texas you probably have a lot of californians there. people are voting with their

feet. >> they are. the district attorney in san francisco and with all the soft on crime prosecutors, he's at the top of the list. a video went viral earlier this year. showed somebody stealing everything off the shelves at a walgreen's. his response to that is the guy could have been desperate. now to the string of smash and grab looting robberies, he says that you will face serious consequences when you committed crimes in our cities. the charges are felonies. a totally different response. what changed? >> they only caught three people. you're looking at the video and there's dozens of people there. what about everybody else? ultimately when people look at that, you wonder and these images of -- are at a well-spring pharmacy where the drugs were taken out of the back room, which is heart breaking.

whose cancer drugs were taken out of that and won't have cancer drugs and things like that. why hasn't the administration denounced the looting? clearly criminal justice reform and no cash bail have gone too far. for too many people, it's like i can do it because i'm -- if i get caught, i get out. >> yeah. gillian, you know, in the 90s, new york city was one of the most crime ridden places. rudy guliani came in as mayor and said hammer somebody for the small crimes so the big crimes don't happen. you think something like that would be -- would happen? some mayor in some city would implement a policy like that in this political climate? >> i mean, it could be as a series -- a lot of the broken window stuff has been pulled apart over the last couple decades. i will say what we're seeing

with this theft spree, a lot of what we're seeing is the result of big cities and a lot of states across the country decriminalizing theft. i don't know if americans realize the degree to which a lot of states -- it's not just in one part of the country. it's spread out across the nation, have made these moves to really weaken penalties for stealing. the national median average, the threshold that you must meet in order to be changed with grand theft felony is $1,000. so in most places or a lot of places in this country, if you steal under $1,000 of merchandise, you won't get prosecuted, won't get charged. maybe just a ticket. like a parking violation. >> yeah. that's one of the major issues. dr. saphier, what is your reaction to this crime wave hitting california in a big way? >> carlie, i'm tired -- you have seth rogen. he likes to say he's part of the

homeless community, that he dresses in his usual demeanor and appearance. his net worth is $80 million. he's out of touch with reality. he says you live in a big city, dude. it's great here. by normalizing theft and normalizing the fact that personal property was taken, it's going to increase criminal activity, which is we're seeing. you have mayors and governors that are too afraid to step back because their be cancelled and the woke culture that if you speak out against any of this, you'll be taken down. but we need to get back to those days of rudy guliani. you have to prevent the small crimes to prevent the big crimes. >> that's right. i hear you there. coming up, getting pulled over by a cop wool driving is never pleasant unless you happen to have been driving in a city like mesa, arizona the other day. why police there handle traffic stops in a surprising way next. ♪♪

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traffic stops into turkey bonanzas. mesa, arizona is a place where police are looking to connect with the community and using what they're called turkeys for tickets program. so what happens is an officer may pull someone over for taking too wide a turn. when they come back from the cruiser, they got a frozen turkey instead of a ticket. sounds good. officers say some drivers get emotional. one already bought their turkey. listen to what i they said. >> thank you so much. a real generous offer. i'm shocked by it but i would like you to pass it on. >> one lady with this laugh started laughing. the tears were coming down. this other gentleman said i don't think they could afford their turkey. so it worked out good. >> so if that happened to me, i would have saved $132. >> that's right. my family in texas is still trying to figure out where the turner family buys their turkey.

but it's wonderful that they're doing that sort of outreach out there. if i were on the receiving end where a police officer pulls me over and says, okay, buddy, open you're door, i'm giving you a turkey, it's like where is the hidden camera? i'm on candid camera, right. >> this is this a drug setup? is this turkey stuffed with heroin? >> that took a dark turn. >> you know what i'm saying. carlie, what would you say if you got pulled over and they gave you a turkey? >> i'm an awful driver. i have driven in ten plus years. if i was on the road, i'd get a traffic violation and could lead top a turkey in mesa. this reminds me of a police officer that pulled a woman over and the baby wasn't in a car seat, which is you can get a ticket for. instead of giving the woman to a ticket, took her to a store and

bought her a car seat. you have to love law enforcement for this. >> morgan, this would have been perfect for you. you would have said i spent all day baking pies. i don't have to do anything. >> i'm really hungry. i haven't had lunch yet. i'm thinking of the leftover turkey. god bless this policeman in arizona. really lovely. >> dr. saphier, any sort of worries here about -- from a medical perspective about salmonella? people toughing uncouched turkeys? >> i was just -- >> yeah. no guarantees in this segment. >> yeah, i did see it came out of a cooler. that's a good thing. we don't want them sitting around. it's important that law enforcement does positive things to their community. they have gotten a negative rap right now, that you see the emotion from the people of

having a positive experience from the policemen. i'm glad the turkeys were in a cooler. >> a cool story. stick with us. coming up after the break, we're going to talk about steve's new cookbook. we might even talk more about any $132 turkey. you're never responsible for unauthorized purchases on your discover card. ( ♪♪ ) what a pain in the... alice? if it's "let's wrap this up" season, it's walgreens season. knowing where you came from, it gives you a sense of “this is who i am”. oh my goodness... wow, look at all those! you get hungry for more and then you're just like, “wow, i'm learning about my family.” yeah, yep. which one, what'd you find? lorraine banks, look, county of macomb, michigan?

look at grandma... hey grandma! unbelievable. everybody deserves to know who they are and where they came from. ohhh...cool. this whole journey has been such a huge gift for our family. ♪

remark a way to use up your thanksgiving leftovers, fox & friends cohost steve doocy and his wife can help. they're happy in a hurry cookbook is out now with more than 100 recipes including this one for a pumpkin pie smoothly. 's movie. >> first, let's put not one, but two scoops of a vanilla ice cream into a blender. next, measure up a quarter cup of milk and put that in. now add a full slice of pumpkin

pie. let's add some ice, about a cup works great. and this is what makes it a grown-up smoothie, a splash of bourbon. you're old enough. secure that lid and pulverize. the next pour into a glass, top with some whipped cream and add a pinch of pumpkin pie spice. it is so delicious. i hope you make it. >> i have one right here and i can't wait to dive in. >> it's delicious. >> was as a perk of being in new york with steve, you get one of these. >> are happy in a hurry cookbook was the number one cookbook last christmas and last thanksgiving,

we've all run out of things to cook, there are no supply-chain issues with this cookbook made in america, you can order it on amazon today and they will deliver it for you tomorrow. and also in the new york studio, we've also got martha maccallum's mom betty's bourbon pumpkin cheesecake which is available and are happy cookbook. >> you have any suggestions of what we can do with turkey feet because the butcher gave me the feet with the $132 turkey. >> no. >> a feet smoothie? put in a stocking you make a soup. they helped give flavor. i started my stock at 4:30 this morning. >> is there bourbon in your smoothie? >> is there bourbon in my smoothie? i don't know. >> just a hint. >> i'm off the clock and 30 seconds.

i didn't think i could love martha maccallum more and then i had this cheesecake and thank you so much for sharing with us. your recipes are incredible. i think about everybody has to make it, it's amazing. happy in a hurry, happy thanksgiving. now here is america reports. to michael fox news alert as the final bell paints wall street read, marking the worst trading day in a year going back to october 2020. the sell-off a reaction investors rattled by a mutant covid strain feared more contagious than any of the world has seen so far. welcome to america reports. i'm griff jenkins and for john roberts. >> i'm alicea comingn