♪ howard: the politico story that launched a national furor over the supreme court and roe v. wade had a misleading headline. the high court won't have the final vote until at least june. this was a draft from february indicating that five conservative justices were certainly considering striking down roe, but it was astonishing, shocking really the for the reporter to obtain that written document written by samuel alito, and he said "politico" was careful to verify

it. >> a leak like this is so rare, perhaps unprecedented, we just haven't seen anything like it. >> well, you know, you can imagine that we took that into consideration, and we took a lot of steps. howard: wherever you stand on the abortion questions, and there are passionate feelings on both sides, there's no question the leak has damaged the court's credibility. there's also no question that the vast majority of the coverage has been tilted to the pro-choice side. and the press has become obsessed with the identity of the mystery leaker. first came the assumption that it was a law clerk for one of the liberal justices trying to whip up pressure on the court's conservative members to derail the ultimate ruling. then came the counter-theory, it must be a law clerk to a conservative justice to try to make it difficult for any of alito's allies to be seen as back off. that's all speculation. we may never mow. what we coknow is that the politico scoop has journalists and politicians all fired up,

and things are only going to get hotter. i'm howard kurtz, and this is "mediabuzz". ♪ ♪ howard: ahead, my exclusive interview with white house press secretary jen psaki on this and many other media and political issues is and her thoughts on leaving the job. a good chunk to have the media coverage as -- has focused less on alito's plan on the returning the issue to the states than a woman's right to choose and other warnings led by president biden and vice president harris. >> what are the next things that are going to be attacked? because this maga crowd is really the most extreme political organization that's existed in american history, in recent american history. >> those republican leaders who are trying to weaponize the use of the law against women.

well, we say, how dare they! howard: the clash among the pundits has been as bitter and emotional as anything i've seen in decades. >> abort a child. at least he admitted what was really happening, the killing of a child. >> overturning roe, i'll say it slowly for you, does not mean abortion is outlawed in all 50 states, although that's what the community is hoping and praying for, for sure. >> it's a straight line from this ruling not only to banning abortion instantly and potentially nationally, but to also preventing americans from accessing birth control. >> how that practice is legal anywhere should shock the conscience of any human being, anybody with a soul. according to democrats, hollywood, the media mob who all speak in one voice, this ruling spells end of america as we know it. it does not. >> a giant step backwards for women and free people many america. >> they're not trying to bring back slavery or legalize

cannibalism. what they're trying to do is allow you to vote on abortion. that's how dishonest these people are. >> this reduction of american politics, american conservativism and american christianity down to the issue of abortion, it's just grow -- grotesque. howard: joining us now, ben domenech, former publisher of the federallest and a fox news contributor. and in new york, liz claman, host of "the claman countdown" daily on fox business, 3 p.m. eastern. ben, the supreme court leak or, is it crucial whether it came ultimately from a conservative or liberal law clerk are when just about everybody in the press agrees that this leak damaged the credibility of the court? >> i certainly hi that it's more likely to have been from the liberal side than from the right, but whatever ends up being the solution, the answer -- and i hope that we do find the answer -- i think that the damage that that has been done by this leak cannot be underestimated.

whatever the motivations were, this has done a significant level of destruction to the institution of the court which has, to this point, really resisted the kind of institutional decay that we've seen in other branches of government. the ability of the court to work with together and to maintain their friendships, we remember the friendship, for instance, between ruth bader ginsburg and justice scalia when they were both alive was something that was key to the functioning nature of this branch of government. and without that level of trust, the ability to go back and and forth with opinions, to have something in mind originally and then shift to another, this court cannot continue to function. imagine if this was something that had happened, an obamacare decision had been leaked by a conservative because they were worried about the direction justice roberts was going, the ramifications would have been horrible, and the left would have been up in arms. instead what we have today is protests in front of justices'

houses and really chaos in the streets because of what this leaker did. howard: liz, it doesn't appear the leaking itself is illegal, but certainly if the investigation shows who did it, that person would and should be fired. what are your thoughts on that? and is there any question that politico should have of published this draft once it was authenticated? >> listen, anybody who's a journalist when you get the big scoop and you look at it and, you know, you weigh all of this. it appears politico did heavily weigh this issue. they're going to go with it because it absolutely is newsworthy. i would say that all leakers, all whistleblowers, all sources are conflicted or motivated by something and, clearly, this leaker was motivated. i've heard arguments on both sides, it was the left who did it, the right who did it. both have actually plausible here, howie. you look at the left saying it was a clerk on the right who clearly started to see that perhaps one key judge might be wavering from the original alito

draft opinion, and hay wanted to sort of, as you put it, freeze them into place and maybe shame them into staying on that side. that as plausible. you have people on the right saying somebody on the left did it to rally the pro-choice people and to really get the political outrage out there. both are really, really possible. but if you're looking at all sides of this issue, the media and this guessing game inside the beltway has absolutely spread to the rest of the nation. howard: yeah, no question about that. with a couple of exceptions that first day, m msnbc and cnn, the guests were almost uniformly sympathetic to pro-choice, but they had a parade of officials from pro-choice women's groups and even the daughter of the original plaintiff. take a look. >> the slow turning of the federal judiciary including the supreme court is a conservative bastion that is anti-women's health. >> i'm in disbelief, and i can't believe that this is going to happen.

and i can't believe that that it could take, in fact, 50 years. >> the willingness to trade off women and women's rights for people's own personal political views is sickening. howard: ben, do you believe that most of the mainstream media have framed this draft opinion and, ultimately, the final decision as an outrage? >> for 50 years, howie, the media has been recording inaccurately about roe. they've done so, i think, in large part on purpose in ways that have completely distorted the debate about this subject. the vast majority of americans, i think, are surprised to learn -- as they've been learning in recent week -- that getting rid of roe actually doesn't result in a nationwide abortion ban, instead sending the issue back to the states to decide. something that has been furthered through the polls that have been done, the way that the questions are framed and the people that they choose to be on air. the fact that you have such a

scant presence of the pro-life views on this matter in a country that's divide on this issue and whether a plurality of americans, if not, you know, a significant number of them, are of the opinion that roe should go away or that there should be some limits on abortion is absolutely abhorrent and unacceptable. it's -- on an issue that is this divisive in the country, you deserve to have both voices present and with -- in ways that are balanced. howard: and on that point -- >> and we have not gotten that. howard: some fox shows have had both pro-life and pro-choice advocates on the same program. i do want to come back to this question. we saw this yesterday, we put video up of pro-choice protesters at the homes of conservative justices including in suburban maryland with, brett kavanaugh. and the washington post, rather than exhibit any concern about this tactic, has a long, sympathetic profile of the woman leading the kavanaugh protest.

now, liz, liberal pundits including, i guess, following the lead of president biden, you could say, are saying this is just the beginning. the conservative majority is next going to strike down laws about allowing interracial marriage, same sex marriage, birth control, privacy. is that a fair or a little bit of -- [inaudible] >> well, it's a slippery slope argument that is always going to be out there, and it should surprise absolutely nobody. i would simply say regarding to what ben's talked about, actually this morning i watched both meet the press and jake tapper on cnn both had the mississippi governor who is very pro-life of and gave him a big chunk of time to talk about it. i did a little bit of a scan of the media. ann create ya mitchell had one of the student for pro-life on her show the day that this leak happened. and so i do feel that there is some effort. is it balanced? you know, you could look at fox news, probably not. i'm sure at some point,

howie,pointer is going to say, oh, it wasn't about -- networks don't have to be. the the fairness doctrine was repealed in 1987, and they're simply reflecting what they feel the balance of their viewers would stand for. as for all of these people protesting judicial attacks and things like that, yeah, that's going to be somewhat of a side show to the real issue, and that is going to be do you believe that abortion is a right and women's privacy to make these decisions is a right or do you feel that pregnancy and termination of it is so abhorrent that you would make sure that -- howard: well, good for the journalists who put on these other voices, but having watched a lot of it on the other cable channels, that was not the case, by and large, with some exceptions. ben, i was going to come on and say this is not going to be as big an issue in the midterms as the democrats seem to believe, but mitch mcconnell just told "usa today" in an interview that it's possible that if roe, indeed, is struck down that the republicans in congress will try to pass a nationwide ban. you wouldn't have a situation

where it's legal in half to the the country -- half the country. won't that guarantee this comes up in every congressional race this fall? >> look, i think what mitch mcconnell was talking about there was the pro-life movement certainly wants to win in every state. they want to be able to go across in every state and achieve their goals. will they be able to to many states like oregon, new york, a states like -- maybe not. i think you're going to see these states, they're going to come up with different solutions, different exceptions, different weeks, and at the end of the day it's going to look a lot more like europe where you have limits depending where you live. just one more point on the media part of this, you literally just had the lead reporter for cbs on abortion issues go and, go from cbs to go work for planned parenthood, okay? that's the kind of back and forth that we have seen in this industry on this issue

repeatedly. and i think it's something that has been a complete, a complete blind spot for the media, and it's why this day came as such as surprise -- a surprise, i think, a shock to a lot of people who didn't see what was coming because they weren't accurately having the issue framed. howard: liz, i've got less than a minute. donald trump taking a victory lap, he said, well, it's a tough issue, 50-50, many people have been saying the proper way to do this is for the state to take over. so the former president unusually restrained. >> he actually handled that in a smart way in the most recent rally for dr. oz in pennsylvania. he talked less about the end of about alec baldwin. i didn't get to see any of that rally, but i will tell you that he knows that this is an issue for the primaries, but then it becomes a lot more dangerous in the regular election. so, yeah, he would, very calmly

exactly what he did, push the point -- howard: not to mention, not to mention 2024. let me get a break. when we come back, media question whether supreme court nominees mislead congress and the public on sensitive issues like abortion. and later, jen psaki on the prospect of the supreme court overturning roe v. wade. >> there's nothing more important than the person who's job is already really attuned to the president. that's why they're valuable total press, they don't care -- to the press. hay don't care what i think. were delayed when the new kid totaled his truck. timber... fortunately, they were covered by progressive, so it was a happy ending... for almost everyone. (motor starting) the most fun we have on the gator is just ripping around the property. it's a springtime tradition. yeah, who needs tv when you have... ...decoys and the there are millions of ways to make the most of your land. learn more at deere.com.

howe from the left and the right, supreme court nominees always say they will greatly respect the importance of legal precedent and then often vote however they want. with the leak of the draft opinion overturning roe v. wade, the testimony of samuel alito,

brett kavanaugh and neil gorsuch is getting plenty of television play. >> roe v. wade is an important precedent of the supreme court. it was decided in 1973, so it's been on books for a long time. >> it is an important precedent of the supreme court. >> that's the law of the land. i accept the law of the land, senator, yes. howard: ben, i'm in no way exempting the liberal court nominees, but in the that has become a kabooky dance. nominees including the trump picks were misrepresenting and gave little indication they would just vote to throw out as opposed to chipping away at it. >> look, lawyers and judges answer questions very carefully. especially when they're testifying in front of congress, in my experience. you know, look, i worked for a senator who was on the judiciary committee, i am aware of their approach with this, and they a try to be very careful in threading the needlen a -- need on all these thorny questions of

law. saying it's the law of the land doesn't mean it's rightly decided in terms of the approach that was used by the court in the past. i found justices alito's argument very con convincing, but i do think this shows kind of the uselessness of these supreme court hearings. there's a lot of promises that people can believe were made either behind closed doors or in these hearings that really have misrepresented, i think unfortunately, hair views when it comes -- their views when it comps to actual issues of law, and there are a lot of games played. it's the another example of the way that our congress is broken. howard: yeah. a lot of games and grandstanding. liz,for example, republican senator susan collins has said she felt betray by publicprivate assurances from kavanaugh and gore such, and so the media pounced on that. liz: well well, ben is so right on this. come on, are you kidding me? they will go in there and do

just what poll itses do. [inaudible] they will come in and say, oh, to stare decisis, that means we're going to uphold the precedent of decisions or at least we will take very careful look at this and we will respect that. they use language that you could drive a truck through so that when it does come to their opportunity, they may make a different decision. but i will say, again, this is a three-month-old draft. it is not set in stone. we don't know what's going to happen. but, again, as i said, it may be the best evidence yet the that we are shocked, shocked that the supreme court has become politicized. howard: yeah. of let's not lose sight of the a fact that it's not final. everybody's ooh moving ahead to the next chapter in media and politics. ben, given the volume and the intensity of the media coverage, can it be argued if scotus does, indeed, strike down roe v. wade, that the culture wars will intensify even more but kind of move more to the state level? >> i think that's exactly what's going to happen, howie.

what you're going to see is a lot of state-level battles, and you're going to learn a lot more about who your state respective or state the senator is when it comes to these culture war issues. now, i personally think that's a good comet. -- development. i think the states that ought to be the place deciding this level of policy in the first place. you're going to end up with differences, significant differences just as we have on so many other culture war issues in america. that's something that i actually think is going to be healthy in the long term this in reorienting our politics around the supreme court, around a lot of other issues when it happen almost singularly about abortion when it gets to that final decision on who goes on the court. that, i think, has been, unfortunately, limiting in the way that we decide the different views that ought to be represented there and, hopefully, we'll end up returning this issue back closer to the people which is where i believe it's always belonged. howard: liz, the president is

acknowledging they have no way of codifying that into law, but jen psaki said they don't have votes. even if the filibuster were abolished, which it won't, i don't think congress going to be able to do anything. liz: how much sound and fury will resonate with voters is the question. howie, make no mistake, the republicans want the midterms to be about gas and groceries. larry kudlow asked ted cruz on fox business, on the fox business show just at the end of last week with, well, does this now move the abortion topic up to the top, and ted cruz was very, calm, and he said, no, number one is the economy, number two is crime, number three is illegal immigration -- howard: right. >> this will not eliminate abortion in some states, and he was very sort of magnanimous about it. howard: yeah. >> but that's because they are worried, howie, that this will activate some perhaps middle of of the road, centrist women in perhaps some communities that

say, wait a minute, i wasn't paying attention -- howard: which is exactly what democrats want, and the media will continue to cover it. ben domenech, liz claman, great to see you both. aahead, my white house sit-down with jen psaki, but up next, griff jenkins on his interview with president zelenskyy in ukraine. ♪ ♪ stuff works. this stuff works down to the root so weeds don't come back. this stuff works without hurting your back. this stuff works guaranteed, or your money back. this is roundup weed & grass killer with sure shot wand. this stuff works. this is roundup weed & grass killer with sure shot wand. i don't just play someone brainy on tv - i'm an actual neuroscientist. and i love the science behind neuriva plus. unlike ordinary memory supplements, neuriva plus fuels six key indicators of brain performance. more brain performance? yes, please! neuriva. think bigger. [ kimberly ] before clearchoice, my dental health was so bad i would be in a lot of pain. i was unable to eat. it was very hard.

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howard: volodymyr zelenskyy sat down in ukraine is the -- the other day with griff general -- griff general kins. >> translator: they are following the same concepts of -- [inaudible] and they're using the same methodology. and the reaction, i think, is still weak in the world. howard: and griff jenkins joins me now from lviv. why did president zelenskyy feel

the immediate to hit back about such a ludicrous allegation about neo-nazissome. >> reporter: hey, howie, because he sees the nazi propaganda, and he wanted to attack it. he also went further and called on world leaders every yearen on holocaust day to say never again to be more forceful in their condemnation of comments by lavrov. interesting development, after that interview then vladimir putin apologized to naftali bennett for such comments of lavrov, particularly where he said he thought hitler also had jewish blood. it's something that zelenskyy felt strong about, and he struck about it, and it prompted this reported apology from putin. howard: yeah. putin should start making a lot more apologies. what was it like sitting down with zelenskyy? you spent about an hour with him, i'm told. >> reporter: howie, every once in a while you realize an

interview you're conducting is an historic one, and that was the feeling in that room. what stunned me was after 70 days of war, i expected the man to be exhausted, to be pressed for time. he sat for 57 minutes, and he had the same enthusiasm and vigor that has inspired in the nation and all ukrainians for 70 days. you know, he takes to the airwaves every single night and speaks to the ukrainian people, but he has rallied not just his own country, but, of course, the western leaders in the u.s. as well, and it was fascinating to see wartime leader who president george w. bush calls the churchill of our time to be so engaged and willing to sit and talk about everything from weapons to sanctions to, obviously, the anti-semitism coming out of of the russia propaganda machine. howard: fascinating. some news today, jill bind making an awe announced -- unannounced visit, meeting with zelenskyy's wife, olena.

what is the significance of that, of our first lady showing up? >> reporter: well, let me tell you how it's playing here in ukraine, it's driving home the point that president joe biden needs to now come. his wife is coming and meeting with the first lady of ukraine. it comes as the prime minister of canada as well, justin trudeau, is in kyiv at this very moment, and it comes after last night u 2, and bono showed up in a bomb shelter converted subway station, singing "stand by me" but choosing to stand with ukraine. i think it's hard, howie, at this point for joe biden to not come. he is the leader of the free world, and kyiv is the epicenter of the fight between tyranny and freedom, and that is why zelenskyy wants him to come so very bad, to send a message to moscow. howard: right. at least one member of the biden family showed up, but i agree, there's a lot of pressure on joe biden to do this.

obvious security concerns as well. thank you so much. next on "mediabuzz," jen psaki on media access to president biden, the handling of the war and much more. my exclusive sit-down in a moment. ♪ ♪ lite. in one easy appointment... ♪ pop rock music ♪ >> tech: ...we can replace your windshield and recalibrate your advanced safety system. >> dad: looks great. thanks. >> tech: stay safe with safelite. schedule now. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ here we go... remember, mom's a kayak denier, so please don't bring it up. bring what up, kayak? excuse me? do the research, todd. listen to me, kayak searches hundreds of travel sites to find you great deals on flights, cars and hotels.

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are busy, please call again, or go to loveshriners.org right away. the world could use some more heroes and your call will make a difference. thank you for being our hero. muck. howard: i was at the white house when word came that jen zack city is resigning as white house press secretary next week. her successor will be her depply karine jean-pierre, who was introduced as the first black and first openly gay presidential press secretary. and hen i sat down the with the administration's top spokeswoman. jen psaki, welcome. >> thank you. thanks for having me. howard: president biden said the other today that, quote, i've been so focused on whatever the immediate emergency is that we haven't told the american people what we've actually done. given the huge media megaphone that the president and the white house has, isn't that a big shortcoming? >> i think it's always good to take a step back and question

what your strategy has been and make changes as you want to, and i would say that we talked a lot at the end of last year about what we wants to do -- wanted to do in the new year. and the president said i want to do two things, i to be holed up less in the oval office, and i want to be traveling out in the country more talking to the american people. that's exactly what we've tried to do and what we're going to continue to do, and that's an opportunity to talk about and sell his programs to the public. howard: the president and the vice president have both denounced the leaked supreme court draft, as you know. you told reporter it's not a political issue because it's supported by a majority of the american public, that's true. you later amended that to say it's not a partisan -- >> right, exactly. howard: but a portion of the public is passionately opposed to abortion, and it's a key political battle in every supreme court nomination fight. how can you say it's not? >> according to the fox news poll, nearly two-thirds of the

public doesn't want roe v. wade to be overturned. howard: what about the others? >> it's a vast majority of the public who want a woman to be able to make choices with her doctor about her own public. who-thirds of the public doesn't agree on a lot, but they agree a woman's rights should be protected, and i i think that's pretty significant. howard: senator biden said back in 1973 that he thought roe went too far. obviously, his views have evolved on this subject, but shouldn't you acknowledge despite the polls that there's a strong minority in the country that feels very passion matily that abortion is wrong -- passionately? >> look, i think the whole point of roe is the protection of privacy and a protection of the rights of individuals to make choices about their own bodies. and i would note that roe is also, as you know, precedent for a number of other important supreme court cases that have impacted people's lives hugely whether it's who you marry, your right to have privacy about

contraception. mine -- i mean, that is what is on the president's mind, the protection of hose privacy -- those privacies. howard: you said at a briefing that many republicans, in your view, and perhaps media conservatives are focusing less on the impact of -- [inaudible] potentially if it's the final decision and more on who leaked it. the leak mystery. >> yeah. howard: but why do you think that is? you said it's a distraction. this is something the right has been fighting for for 50 years. >> well, at the same time, two-thirds of the public doesn't think roe should be overturned. so maybe they want to talk more about the leak than they do about whether a woman should have the right to make choices. i don't know, you'd have to ask them. howard: you think they're shying away from what you would suggest is an unpopular position. >> it is an unpopular position in the country including among people who may not even identify as dem. accurates. howard: sure. president is pushing a $33

billion package to war in ukraine. shouldn't a package of that magnitude have been proposed weeks, perhaps months ago before the atrocities and war crimes that we've seen in this russian invasion vegas and before fierce russian assault is on these eastern provinces? >> we're still spending out the 13.5 billion package that the president pushed forward just a few weeks ago including $3.5 billion in security assistance that we've exwe dieted to get to the front lines and help the ukrainians win the battle of kyiv and continue to battle the russians. so this was a package that built on that and is going to allow us to continue to provide security assistance and humanitarian assistance -- howard: if it passes the hill. >> as you noted, this is a lot of support for, there's bipartisan san support, i would say even, for the efforts, the bravery, the courage of the ukrainian leaders and the role the united states is playing. the united states' military in providing the assistance and the american people in many ways in

supporting the ukrainians and standing up against russian aggression. howard: let me circle back, to coin a phrase, to the message question. i mow your standard answer is biden takes lots and lots of questions, let's just agree to disagree that that's a good level of media access. with the president holding so few news conferences and doing very rarely sit-down interviews, isn't he surrendering a key part of the bully pulpit? >> i would say the president speaks to the american people nearly every day do, sometimes twice a day -- howard: not talking to journalists. >> well, but i think our objective and and our role and our focus is speaking to the public and certainly engaging in and valuing a free press which is something we do and the president does nearly every day by taking questions from the media and speaking out about how we should protect the media as he did last weekend at the white house correspondents' dinner. howard: i have covered joe biden on and off since the 1980s including his first presidential campaign. he likes to talk. now, nobody expected as

president he would comment on everything under the sun, but doesn't he leave the void by not being in the news all the time, not doing these television or print interviews that is being filled by republicans, activists, pundits, bloviaters, and doesn't about that mean he's often reacting to the news and not driving the news cycle? >> well, we can't determine what the media decides to cover, of course in that's not our role, we're not in china and russia here -- howard: [inaudible] >> yes, but the president can make news by traveling to a javelin plant and highlighting the incredible role we're playing in fighting the war in ukraine by supporting with military assistance. he can make news by talking about how we lower the deficit for the first time in a long time. howard: all right. i continue to think it's a -- [inaudible] questioning from a journalist with follow line ups -- follow ups, we always want more access -- >> of course, that's your job.

howard: you've been using tougher language against the former guy. you said, for instance, the white house policy is not to take advice from people who praised putin. president biden the other day called the maga movement the most extreme political organization in american history. have you and the white house and the president decided that with donald can trump still being by far most influential republican, that you've increasing hi got to take him on? -- think you've got to take him on? >> i think the president refers to him as the former guy k his predecessor. he did yesterday, earlier this week when he made those dependents. it's about the -- comments. it is about the impact and the hold that former president trump has on the republican party, the influence and the impact on what their policies are. and and he wants these as a reminder of how these policies can impact people every day. but he's also not going to hesitate calling out positions that are extreme and out of whack with the mainstream. we're taking on what he

represents. what the people who are currently in elected office making policies represent. pressure. howard: what was it like to have trevor noah making fun of you at the white house correspondent' dinner? >> while i are have nothing to say is on what i'm doing in the future, i will be leaving next week. they're all still together at once, i'm going to sleep, read a lot of cooks, watch a lot of movies i haven't seen what i will say is you couldn't have cone my job, i don't think anybody could do any job if they didn't value the role of the press and the media, and i do. even on days where we disagree, on days we debate. howard: by the way. -- i'll take it as as a you were a good start sport about it. >> i was asking people, did i have a strange look on my face? you never know. [laughter] howard: after the break, the

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♪ howard: more now of my conversation with white house press secretary jen psaki. i know you can't discuss your next job for ethical reasons, but it's been widely reported. you got a lot of criticism over possible conflicts during this period. did that both bother you? >> of course, because i'm a human being. but what i know is what i try to

do every day, and i hold myself to very high ethical standards. i took steps and have taken steps as i've had any discussions with any future employer that go over and above any requirement by government, recusing myself of any discussions as well, and i'm proud of that. and i think and hope, and this is very public in a job like mine, people judge me by how i engage and interact with reporters. and i think it's been clear i've treated everybody the same from the beginning, and that's been a point of pride for me. howard: speaking of interacting with reporters, do you deliberately try to lower the temperature in the briefing room? politico just had a piece about journalists now find the white house to be woring -- boring. one correspondent was voted at saying you're good at your job and jawing with jen makes me look like an a-hole. >> makes me laugh. i'm glad he didn't say the whole word because i want my mother to be able to watch this interview.

when i talk to the president and dr. bind, the biggest piece of advice they've had for me is to approach it from the prism of wringing ed -- bringing credibility back to the job, of showing respect even people who disagree with us, with him, with the policies of the administration. and, yes, some of that is taking the temperature down in the room. howard: but have you bitten your tongue on occasion? >> of course. of course, i'm human. i'm an irish lass in my heart. sometimes i get a little fiery many there. but on most days my hope and my objective is to not make it a gotcha moment and to make it a place where we are providing information, getting accurate information to the public through the press through tough questions, through debate. that's what that room is for. howard: you recently said twitter is very white, very liberal, very coastal -- >> that's a fact, yes. howard: you're right. it distorts reality including everybody, journalists. have you ever advised president

biden that he weigh in on something like the will smith slap or dave chapelle being attack thed on stage just to get people to know more about joe biden's personality? >> joe biden has an enormous twitter following, an enormous facebook following, and it's one of the only social media platforms or followings that can compete with a lot of the disinformation out there -- howard: but his tweets rarely make news. >> they reach the public. they don't always have to make news. sometimes it's about providing accuracy -- howard: again, aiming for the public versus aiming for the media echo chamber. >> that's right. and i think it's important, you know, participant of the echo chamber, and this is why i don't think he will ever become a person who is tweeting all the time, is because he always reminds us of how we can't get focused on the conversation sometimes we're all having with ourselves, and we're all guilty of this, right? sometimes the journalists in the room are talking about things on

twitter, talking about things we've seen on twitter and cable, and that may or may not be what the american public really cares about on any particular day. howard: so he doesn't want to be drawn into the beltway bubble9 chattersome. >> yes. howard: white house press secretary, you took it after the campaign,st made you something of a celebrity. is it hard to walk away from this job given that you are a pretty famous spokesperson percent president of the united states in. >> i mean, of course it's hard. this is greatest job i've ever had, maybe that i'll ever have, i don't know. and it has surpassed my expectations in so many ways many that i've learned something new every single day. a lot of that has to do with the policy people i work with and the experts, but a lot of it also has to do with the journalists and the way they ask questions and how -- howard: you're leaving because -- >> i'm leaving because i have a 4-year-old and a 6-year-old. they are the most important people in my life and my husband, of course. and i always knew that having, having worked in the white house

before that this was not a job i could do forever. it is a huge honor to do it. no matter where you are in your life. but i don't want to miss things with my kids, and i don't want to miss moments or soccer practices or ballet recitals or anything. howard: jen psaki, thanks very much for sitting down with us. >> thank you. it was a pleasure. hu hu -- howard: till to come, elon musk rips -- and what happened with those allegations against don lemon? the buzz meter is next.d ♪ ♪ hello cashback! hello, kevin hart! earn big time with chase freedom unlimited with no annual fee. how do you cashback? chase. make more of what's yours. andrea: this is the hardest thing we will probably ever have to go through. st. jude has given us transportation, treatment. to know that we don't have bills, they take every other stress off of your shoulders.

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howard: time to race the clock on the buzz meter. let's roll. elon musk is punching back on twitter these days with a trumpian edge, even throwing out individual commentators. here's what one msnbc host said

of twitter with's perspective -- prospective owner. >> the pro-q anon, pro-neo-nazi -- when a petulant and not so bright billionaire casually bought one of the most influential machines and handed it to the far right. howard: musk's response? same org that covered up hunter biden laptop story and -- [inaudible] lovely people. now, matt lawyer but only accused of miss conduct, but musk hasn't even taken over yet, and he's specifically criticized the far right along with the far left. musk also denied a claim by the head of donald trump's truth social app that trump told the billionaire to buy twitter. this is what comedians had peer after a will smith slapped chris crock. -- chris rock. dave chapelle was attacked.

isaiah lee, who was armed with a fake gun and real knife, here's the video from tmz. >> hip-hop history -- can [bleep] thank god, thank [bleep] was clumsy. he's back there getting stomped. howard: chapelle later met the attacker and said he seemed mentally ill, but this is scary stuff. are comedy clubs going of to triple security to keep performers safe? the white house correspondents' dinner has led to a spate of covid cases. antony blinken, cbs's president and reporters for several outlets. even with precautions, this was sadly predictable. new cases have doubled many recent weeks, and that's why i skipped the dinner. chuck todd is losing his

msnbc show, "meet the press daily." >> thank you all who have watched us over the years. howard: the show, which is being replaced by a "newshour", will move to the streaming service. todd is someone who's at least tried to analyze both sides to have political game. cnn's don lemon who had been accused of sexual harassment pour years ago has been vindicated. a judge ordered -- [inaudible] obey $77,000 for tampering with evidence and trying to bribe witnesses. how -- now hice is saying after a deep dive in my memory, the events weren't9 what i thought. lesson to the media, don't rush to assign guilt web accusations are made. well, that's it for this edition of immediate what was. i'm howard kurtz, happy mother's day, have a great day. check out my podcast, media buzz meter. you can subscribe at apple ituness, google podcast or on

your amazon device. you know, i used to cover supreme court nomination battles and the justice department, i've never seen a leak like this, unthink bl. it'll be a story for a long time to come, and and we will cover ate and the coverage for a long time to come. out of time. back here next sunday. we'll see you then with the latest "buzz." ♪ and we'll come to you with a replacement you can trust. >> man: looks great. >> tech: that's service on your time. schedule now. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ this is roundup weed and grass killer with sure shot wand. this stuff works. this stuff works down to the root so weeds don't come back. this stuff works without hurting your back. this stuff works guaranteed, or your money back. this is roundup weed & grass killer with sure shot wand. this stuff works.

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eric: churches on high alert on this mother's day. you know, pro-choice activist plan to stage protests across the country over the leaked supreme court draft indicating that the court is ready to overturn the landmark roe versus wade abortion ruling. hello, everyone, welcome to fox news live, happy mother's day and happy ve day. i'm eric sean. hi, aishah. aishah: i'm aishah, arthel neville is out today.