border successfully. maria: yeah. >> because they're so focused on the crisis. maria: yeah. and you've got the mayors of new york and chicago and d.c. blaming greg abbott instead of joe biden. we didn't even get to the 10,000 pounds of fentanyl seized. we appreciate your time. mayra flores, thank you. have a good day, everyone. i will see you tomorrow on fox business. >> fox news alert, queen elizabeth's cat can debt is arriving at the scottish capital, will lie in state -- will lie at rest, i should say, at the palace of holyro to od house. joining us now from london, martha maccallum, she's in westminster. fox news correspondent congresshunt and in jonathan

hunt. martha the, a whole lot of people, it seems, have turned out to watch procession in scotland. i'll let you set the scene. >> so this morning -- howie, good to be with you, first of all. this morning the queen request with's coffin left in the hearse from balmoral castle, one of her favorite places in the world to spend time. she spent every scherr there through the middle -- summer there through the middle of october, generally. today when the casket went through the gates, no doubt there was not a dry eye. many of them have spent decades in service of the queen. it went down to a small village nearby where she would be able to go and be a normal person, walking into shops and visiting. and they said she was our queen, but she was also our neighbor. then we watched the hearse as it has wound down through the scottish highlands, and it is about to arrive, as you just said. and king charles has called in the final journey, her final journey.

and, indeed, she made so many journeys in her life all around the world. the common if wealth at one time really encompassed a third of the globe, and throngs of people would come out to see her in every country she went to. today she makes this final journey in one of her favorite places in the world, in scotland. so we wait for the cortege to arrive at holyrood castle which should happen moments from now, howie. howard: world wild attention, obviously, for this journey of the queen. jonathan hunt, how have you reacted to the queen's passing yourself, and why do you think this has struck such a chord even among people who don't have much use for the monarchy? >> yeah. i think the queen, if you like, transcended the monarchy itself. she was personally so belovedded by so many people. her character, her dedication to service certainly struck a chord

across the globe. i think, howie, that is why even those who perhaps, particularly in scotland, have a hankering for more independence for the scottish people had a real love of queen elizabeth ii herself. it wasn't necessarily about the monarchy, it was about the person. you asked for my reaction, howie, you know, i've not been a monarchist. i was one of those who left the u.k. for the united states and made that my home, but i remain a dual citizen of of the u.s. and britain. this morning was very interesting. we were on air with martha, and right just after 10 a.m. local time we got the first glimpse of the coffin coming out of the gates of balmoral inside the hearse. and i actually caught my breath, howie. it was a real moment of motion. and my mother texted me immediately and said, this brings home the reality. i just feel so sad. and i think that reflects the mood of a nation, howie.

howard: well, thank you, jonathan. that emotional reaction, i think, shared by people around the world who have never even been to the u.k. or, obviously, most people never met the queen. charlie, queen elizabeth carefully controlled her image. she never gave an interview or perhaps just one. was it her use of television, allowing cameras in for the meet and greets not just with foreign leaders, but with other high profile visitors and behind the scenes bbc documentary that helped her forge a connection to her subjects and admirers around the world? >> absolutely. and i think one of the things that many people will actually remember most about the queen is her christmas day speech. it became such an integral part of britain's tradition. and i think that that's something that really helped to draw the world into what was otherwise a very private life. now, we saw the queen executing official public duties, she would smile, she would wave, she would greet people. but actually when it came to her

life at buckingham palace, at balmoral, we never really got to see anything too intimate. and i think that for her majesty that was very much about allowing herself to have something of a private life. she was never someone who would sacrifice duty or who would put herself before her duties as the monarch, but in allowing herself to have a bit of privacy, it meant that she was also able to have a life as a wife, as a mother, as a grandmother and as a great grandmother and not just as a monarch. howard: right. and that bit of reserve, i think, also added to the mystique of queen elizabeth. and, boy, you talk about duty, she did it for 70 years. martha, this, of course, is the only story in the u.k., understandably. where you are. but there are some voices here in the states who say days and days of coverage of a monarch whose role was largely symbolic, not entirely, is too much. the american media are overdoing

it. what's your thought on that? >> well, i think it's only natural, you know? america was born out of rebellion against the united kingdom. we have a very different way of doing things. we don't have a royal family. i think it's very understandable. i do think though that this is an unusual moment, and it will be -- [laughter] it will be a long process because the funeral is a week from tomorrow. and there will be, obviously, coverage in and out of this over the course of the next couple of weeks and coverage of everything that's going on in the u.s. as well. but i will say this, i would kind of challenge anyone to think about any other individual who would even come close in terms of the global attention that this event will garner from around the world and throughout the media. there's been such a lifelong fascination with her. and i think also that one of the things that really gravitates americans to her is this selflessness that she expressed, that she put her duty before her

family even and her allegiance to her country. and it's that kind of ideal that we heard a lot more about, frankly, during world war ii. that kind of heroism, that kind of believing in something bigger than yourself, serving something bigger than yourself with. we've become such an intensely me, you know, instagram, social media kind of society in the u.s. i think there's some respect for someone who didn't live their life that way. and i think that's one of the reasons that she's getting a lot of justified attention in terms of examining this life that was well lived, by and large. howard: yeah. you're right, i can't think of another individual in the world who everyone has felt this connection to for so long that would garner this much attention. charlie, what's your thought on that? why is there all so wall to wall television coverage here in the states, but there's a potential section in the if new york times, every paper, "wall street journal", the whole top half of the front pages here, washington

post, here's new york times, it's filled with news about the queen, the new king and the royal family. >> well, you know, i think you have to look at it, first and foremost, there is a kind of intrigue around the fact that britain has a royal family. that's obviously not something that the united states has ever had. and i do think that there is an almost fairy tale-esque element about kings and queens and princes and princesses that draws people into the story. then you add to that what we've always called the pomp and circumstance, the traditions, the celebrations, everything that we're seeing going on now with the leadup to the queen's funeral. those are all traditions that have been ingrained in british and in royal culture for centuries now. and i think that adds to the interest not only in the queen, but in the royal family this general. in general. and then to refer to her imaginy

specifically, this is a woman who held a role for 70 years. she reigned through 14 presidencies. you look at the fascination that still exists when it comes to someone like former president trump, former president obama, everything that they do still garners interest. well, the queen maintained her role through 14 different presidencies -- howard: yes. >> -- so it's no wonder that people continue to be fascinated by her. and and on top of that, i would be remiss if i didn't mention the recent pop culture phenomenon in terms of things like "the crown," netflix documentaries, all of these different things really helping to bring more attention and more interest to the monarchy from from around the world -- howard: yeah. >> -- particularly here in the u.s. i've had so many conversations with people about "the crown," is it true, how accurate -- howard: right, right. let me bring in jonathan on that because i think what's been moving is television showing all these pictures.

the queen as a princess meeting harry truman, that's how long -- and, you know, she, of course, had a connection to winston churchill, dancing with jerry ford, going to a baseball game with george h.w. bush, state dinners. but also plugging into pop culture. she did a skit with paddington bear. i think those pictures have served to remind us of the shared history between -- she's been queen from the time that most people have been alive, and this reminds us of that. >> reporter: yeah. and she absolutely had the common touch. she just got people, i think, howie. she was obviously ruled from inside what many people would see the ivory tower of buckingham palace, but she had a common touch too. she also recognized, absolutely, the limits of her actual practical powers. for instance, she said in her

christmas speech of 1957, five years, just five years into her reign, she said these words: i cannot lead you into battle, i do not give you laws or administer justice, but i can do something else. i can give you my heart. and i think every single person across britain, across the commonwealth would say whatever you think of the queen, whatever you think of the monarchy, queen elizabeth ii absolutely gave everybody her heart. and and now you are seeing how everybody across the commonwealth and in the u.k. in particular gave her back their heretos. now they are willing -- hearts. now they are willing, i think, to give their hearts to king charles iii. he has a lot of work to do in living up to the legacy, so it's going to be a challenge, i think, for king charles. but i think a lot of people felt in his first address the other night he did live up to the

challenge ahead of him. and in the words, again, of my 84-year-old mother sitting in the english countryside here, she felt she had been all adrift, as she put it, all at sea when she heard of the queen's death, and and charles' words gave her some feeling -- again, this is a strange word -- but it gave my mother a feeling of safety. i think a lot of people of a certain age here, howie, needed that safety, and they felt they got it in king charles' first address to the nation. howard: yeah, next time we'll have your mom on. [laughter] lots of people still paying their respects and leaving flowers and so forth there, we see. >> reporter: yeah. howard: okay -- >> reporter: the crowds are extraordinary howie. howard: yeah. "the new york times" quotes an oxford professor as saying there will probably never be another occasion in which a british figure is so mourned globally.

it is in some way a last moment of british greatness. i don't know whether that's an overstatement, but it does tie into the notion that even with the queen's passing, britain still faces severe economic problems, brexit, covid, a new prime minister in liz truss who, of course, was officially anointed by the queen just two day days before her death. so at some point, there's a certain back to reality of the problems in great britain. >> absolutely, howie. and i think that's one of the reasons that you see this outpouring. and if i think it's exactly why jonathan hunt's mom talked about feeling at sea. i think there is trepidation about the future, and she did represent that consistency in so many people's lives. and i agree that there may never be a funeral like the one we're going to see this week for a british monarch again in history. charles is 73 years old, and remember, elizabeth came to the

throne at 25, a beautiful young woman, in the early 1950s when women simply were not bosses. they weren't leading things. she set an example for a woman who could sort of do all of those things, be a leader, be a mother. and so i think this is a rare moment in history, and i do think that it touches upon people's concerns about the future here in the u.k., also in the united states. i think people feel very unsettled around the world. so losing this person that has been sort of a stay for so many people, a touchstone of history and that nostalgic kind of breadth of history is unsettling. and i don't think there are guarantees about the future -- howard: right. >> although i think she said at the jubilee she was very hopeful and optimistic about the future of her country, and i think that was always a tone that she tried to strike and her father tried to strike in the middle of the worst days of the battle of britain back in world war ii.

keep calm and carry on is something that they had as an underpinning of their approach to the world. howard: great point and also a great point, of course, about her being a woman, you know, especially in the earlier decades when men wielded most of the power. the casket is getting much closer now to holyrood. we will, of course, make sure to take that. charlie, there was a u-gov poll in may that said 74% of people who responded 65 and older believe the monarchy -- which is 1200 years old -- is good for britain compared to 24% of 18 to 24-year-olds. and i'm wondering, you know, given all the past scandals going back to the racy tapes between charles and the now-queen consort, camilla, and, you know, everything from fergie and now harry and meghan which we actually will talk about in a moment, how is it that those soap opera scandals which, you know, certainly have gotten

enormous attention around the world, never seemed to affect the queen's image? >> well, i think they have. you know, you have to look back at the death of princess diana, and the queen actually faced a huge amount of criticism at that time. however, i really do, as martha said, that man rah that of keep calm -- mantra of keep calm and carry on, get on with your duty and don't pay mind to the scandal and the controversy really have helped the queen through her 70-year reign. you know, she never really addressed any of these mega-scandals or controversies unless it was absolutely necessary. and when it comes to meghan and harry, she has,s you know, very much helped the monarchy to come out on top, if you will, simply by not addressing any of these jibes, any of these allegations that have been coming across the pond. it's the really helped the monarchy to look much more mature, much more respectful, you know? when you have harry and meghan kind of throwing barbs at their

family members constantly -- howard: yeah, difficult situation. >> -- to go unaddressed really, it helps to take weight away from them, if i'm completely honest. howard: all right. let me go back to martha maccallum, because it seems like the approach to holyrood is taking place right now. why don't you kind of explain the importance of this moment. remember, the queen lived in scotland, so the scottish people have a very special feeling for her as well. >> yeah, absolutely. i think, you know, that this is very fitting, that the queen spent her final hours at balmoral. she worked up until the bitter end. she was working on tuesday when she invited liz truss to form a government, her 15th prime minister. and she once said, you know, if i stop, i'll drop. she was a doer. [laughter] she wanted to be working until the very end. and, you know, so -- and she didn't ringer.

and -- linger. and i think that also is very in keeping with the way that queen elizabeth approached her life. she always wanted to be in the middle of, of the importance, of the life of this country. [applause] you can hear the applause which is something we haven't -- we've heard a lot of silence from the individuals. now she's in edinburgh, and we hear this nice outpouring of applause. [applause] the coffin is drapes in the scottish royal standard flag which, obviously, is well received by this crowd as a loving tribute. the flowers that are on top come from the estate at balmoral., some of her favorite flowers -- howard: that's a huge crowd, martha. that's a huge crowd. march. martha: this is a huge crowd, howie. i look back at images of her many australia, in canada, in delhi, i mean, literally people were hanging off the sides of the tops of buildings simply to

get a glimpse of this woman. so there is something very, very unique here, you know? i'll say it again, i can't really think of anyone else, you know with, if you think -- if if you had to wrack your brain and say, well, whose funeral would be as important as this in the rest of our society, pretty tough to come up with an example of someone who -- she's definitely the most well known individual in the entire world. howard: right. yeah, you know, on that point as we watch the procession in its probably final approach to holyrood, charlie, she's the most well known -- was the most well known individual in the world, but she was so private that i think we don't know that much about what her real life was like. and so she's the most famous people about whom we actually know only what she wanted us to see. briefly pick that up. >> yeah. i mean, you know, we obviously know aspects of her history, of

her life growing up as a young girl, her very quick ascension to the throne and so on and so forth. but we've also had some lovely anecdotes over the years from those who were closest to her. we know that the queen had a wicked sense of humor. that's one of the things that she and philip bonded over. and also something that she and harry bonded over for so many years. we know she loved to prank, and she also loved being around her family. something that we saw in recent years when she became a great grandmother was her softening image. she did allow more photos of herself in the palace with her great grandchildren. she allowed a lot more imagery and so on and so forth. and i think that that was something really wonderful for the world to be able to get a glimpse of in those final years of her life. howard: you know, holyrood house, which we will see shortly, has been kind of a royal residence since the 12th century. and those apartments were once

occupied by mary, queen of scots, from her return to scotland in 1561 to her forced abdication. and, jonathan, king charles, as i said, i thought gave a very -- he struck all the right notes in that videotaped address. but we know a lot more about his views because, as a prince, you know, he was an environmental act a vis and so fort whereas the queen was always very careful not to say anything that could be construed as political. does he now have to take a more restrained approach now that he has become the monarch? >> reporter: i think he does have to, howie. and i think he acknowledged that in his address, that he would follow constitutional principles. one of those, of course, is that the king or queen in the u.k. is apolitical. so he has passions. environmentalism is certainly one of those. and i think you may see that

creep into his reign to some extent, but i don't think you will hear overtly political statements from king charles. he is aware that that that is not his role. his role is to be a symbolic leader. his role is to unite people, to lead them as a single unified people. i think he absolutely gets that. that is not to say he won't privately be as passionate about some of the causes that he has supported over the years, but he's going to step away, obviously, from running his charities, etc. he has to do that. he does not want to be seen to be political. privately, he's still going to be passionate about the things he believes in, howie. howard: right. martha, why do you think there was so much intense international interest when yesterday prince harry and meghan markle as well as prince william who's now the next in line for the throne and his wife, kate middleton, appeared

together and were shaking hands? everybody's, like, oh, maybe they're going to heal the rift. we tonight know whether that's true or not -- we don't know whether that's the true or not. maria: -- can. martha: i think it was surprising. we had heard that they were on the same property in windsor a couple of minutes apart in their two residences and that staff was kind of running interference to make sure that they didn't run into each other. and i think that there was an olive branch that was put out by the prince and princess of wales, we're going to go outside and see some of the mourners, and would you join us? and i'm sure it was a welcome outreach, i would imagine. and it really was reminiscence sent of those -- reminiscent of those moments when william and harry were 15 and 12 years old and walked behind their mother's casket. i don't know if that rift has healed. i think one of the big issues is outstanding biography, tell-all, as we understand it -- howard: yes.

>> -- that harry is writing and coming out with this winter. howard: harry's book. >> i think there's going to be trepidation until they have a comfort level that, you know, there's been some reports that he goes after camilla, which is not going to to be well received by his dad -- howard: martha, i'm going to pick it up, i'm going to pick it up with you in a moment, but let's just listen for a moment as we see holyare rood -- holyr ooh -- holyrood palace and the casket arrive. let's listen in. [background sounds]

[background sounds] howard: -- so good at pomp and ceremony. and that's ooh quite the theme, martha. why don't you take it from here. martha: indeed, it is. this is holyrood palace, it's at the base of the royal mile. our understanding is that the coffin will be met by royal

archers, and this is a spectacular setting. it's the royal palace of scotland. it is the smallest of the royal palaces, but a beloved place for queen elizabeth and her family. just as a reminder, the only family member who's here with us at this stage is princess anne, the only daughter of philip and elizabeth, as they arrive. and we are about to see this coffin lifted and brought into the throne room at holyrood where it will rest until tomorrow when it will be taken to st. giles cathedral in edinburgh. >> i was so struck by the crowds that lined the streets. let's pause again and listen in. [background sounds]

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howard: there you see it with precision and, you know, i find myself getting a little emotional now that the queen has arrived on this stop of her final journey. as jonathan hunt was saying earlier, there's something about seeing the casket that brings home the finality of the woman, the monarch who over 70 years of age, had been in our lives for so long. so many prime ministers, 15, i believe, 14 american presidents. and, of course, the queen of -- martha: yeah, that's right, howie.

these are the royal archers that you see, scottish royal archers. they have an eagle feather in their cap, and all of this has been choreographed, gone over. you know, they would have meetings, there's a funeral office, essentially, that has been at buckingham palace for decades where, basically, one of the staff of very high ranking staff members, you know, was given knighthood to oversee this funeral process has overseen every single detail of exactly how this will play out. and the fact that she passed away at balmoral sort of flipped the switch on operation unicorn, which is avenue of the beginning of this week of funeral services. and there's a 10-day mourning period which is now very much in motion here with this beginning stop at holyrood at the palace. you may have seen when they go out of the car, princess anne was standing to the right of that archway with i'm think lawrence.

she -- timothy lawrence are. she made the trip down here to edinburgh, and you see this is the base of what's called the royal mile. it's the stretch between holyrood palace and edinburgh palace, medieval structure at the very top of that royal mile. so this is a stunning landscape and a place that was very close to queen elizabeth's heart, to be sure, howie. howard: right. the plan has been from the beginning, for years -- because of, after all, the queen was 96, it's called operation london bridge, and some people, i've read, were so touched by her passing, some people thought she would live forever somehow, that the feeling was that london bridge was down. i've seen that word over and over again, that she was the rock. she did more than just a symbolic job as the monarch, you

know, she just touched people's hearts around the world and in the commonwealth countries and, of course, in britain, in scotland and elsewhere in the united kingdom. so she has now arrived -- martha: well, it is -- howard: go ahead, martha. martha: it's definitely more than just a symbolic role. it's a constitutional monarchy. and it's actually a system that they've mastered9 quite well, because it sort of allows this royal family to be the patriotism, to be the flag of country, the banner that all political sides can get behind. and it operates separately from the government, but the monarch has to invite the new prime minister to form the government. they meet weekly. those are substantive meetings that have an opportunity to sort of have advice and listening from the monarch which most prime ministers have said they found extraordinarily helpful in their governing. so it's a quite interesting --

it's a very rare example of a long-term, successful constitutional monarchy, but it has worked quite well mt. united kingdom. and now, obvious, the burden falls on prince charles and then, after him, prince william, to carry that on and to see if they can have that continuity of the crown that was so vital and so important to queen elizabeth as structure of this country, howie. howard: right. and king charles iii, of course, will have his own style, ascending to the throne at the age of 73. charlie langston, it's been said that queen elizabeth exercises soft power when she dealt with a lot of diplomatic situations. and, for example, becoming the first monarch in 100 years to go to ireland. so at times, you know, it was more than just pomp and circumstance and going to state dinners and so forth. >> well, and i think it was jonathan who said it earlier, the queen with understood peopld

people. charles mentioned that in his address to the nation. she understood people, and she saw the good in people. and i think that one of the queen's strongest powers was her ability to connect with people on a personal level. it didn't matter whether they were a stranger in the street who simply wanted to come out and wave or whether they were one of the most important leaders of the free world. you know, one of my favorite stories is when michelle obama broke protocol by putting her arm on the queen's back. now, it is tipple call that you are strictly -- typical that you are strictly forbidden, but her majesty took it in her stride, understood that michelle was nervous and returned the gesture by placing her own hand on michelle's shoulder. that might seem like something insignificant, but it's that really personal detail and personal understanding that allowed her to do what you said, execute soft power. because she had such an innate understanding of what made

people tick, what made people really get motivated, she was able to offer advice and not necessarily steer people, but she was able to kind of insure that they remained on the right path particularly when it came to prime ministers. and that's why so many of our country's prime ministers have said that their meetings with the queen were so very helpful to them. howard: jonathan hunt, there have been some critics many of them -- some, i should say, anti-westerners -- that say why did the queen never apologize for slavery, colonization, launching wars, i mean, some pretty difficult things that happened during the can centuries, but she never saw that as her role because that would be political. and i think her avoidance of any kind of political statement was kind of the key to her popularity. your thoughts. >> reporter: yeah. and i think, i think, howie, she always looked to the future rather than the past.

and i think that was very significant in the way that she was, she reigned for 70 years. she was always trying to move the u.k. forward rather than backwards. and you talk about the soft power, and i just want to mention one of the incredible examples of her soft power. in 2011 you also mentioned she visited ireland. on that visit he shook the hand of martin mcginnis. martin mcginnis was, at that point, 2011, the leader of shin feign. prior to that, in the decades prior, he had been a commander of the irish republican army. now remember, the irish republican army had targeted the royal family frequently. they targeted the u.k. consistently. the irish republican army killed the queen's cousin, lord louis mount baton, off the coast of ireland, yet she shook the hand

of a man who was the commander of the precise army that killed her own cousin. if that wasn't a demonstration of soft power and a signaling to everybody to move forward, i don't know what was. it was an extraordinary moment and a real example of just the way the queen looked to the future, not the past, howie. howard: yeah. an extraordinary moment, and thank you for remember reminding us of it with that level of detail. martha, you know, many of the commonwealth countries have chosen, you know, to have the queen as their sovereign. there's been some chatter that maybe they won't want to be part of it anymore. so the new king taking over at the age of 73 really has his work cut out for him. martha: yeah, he absolutely does, howie, that's correct. prince -- i'm sorry, king charles iv had a meet -- iii had

a meeting today this afternoon obviously trying to shore up that relationship. we've seen a very difficult trip last spring that kate and william took to the islands, to the caribbean where there was open sort of expression. it's wonderful to have you here, but we're going to have a referendum on whether or not we're staying in the commonwealth later on this year. so we saw barbados fall away from the commonwealth. and it's interesting to note that queen elizabeth never once attended a ceremony where they bring down the british flag in any of these situations. obviously, she really wanted to hold the commonwealth together. there are still 14 members of the commonwealth, and that will clearly be a question for a number of these countries, whether or not they choose to remain under king charles iii. howard: right. just reflecting for a moment on how moving it was to see her arriving, her casket arriving in

edinburgh at holyrood palace. charlie, did royal journal is ever resent the fact that they had virtually no access to the queen though they wrote and spoke a lot about her and that everything was choreographed and accidented? -- scripted? >> you know, i don't think so. in all honesty, the relationship between the queen and the media was always on pretty good terms, if i'm totally honest. i don't think anyone expected that they were going to get a sit-down with the queen. and the truth of the matter is her advisors at buckingham palace were very good at working with their trusted royal correspondents -- howard: ah. >> -- to insure that the news was shared. howard: all right. >> no one ever expected they would have a one-on-one with her imagine majesty -- majesty, i think the younger -- howard: thank you for staying with us for this coverage. i want to thank charlie langston, jonathan hunt and, of course, martha maccallum who's been doing this since we were all asleep here in the eastern

united states. we're going to leave the scene now and rush to our regular programming -- return to our regular programming. the victory for donald trump, a federal judge agreed to name a special master to review the classified documents seized at mar-a-lago, an outcome applauded by media conservatives. >> it's just notable this decision has come under unbelievable, overwhelming and near-universal criticism. >> the judge seemed to be saying here that merrick forwardland went too far. he grabbed too much, and he gabbed too much, whispering into the ears of the media that a hate donald trump. >> cannon calls this all unprecedented and says it raises serious concerns about bias coming out of the biden team. she even says the doj's review team is tainted. howard: all right. we have more sound bites. joining us now to analyze the coverage, jason chaffetz, former

republican congressman, and tara palmieri, chief correspondent for puck news. the media had scoffed at the idea that trump could get a special master appoint ifed, and now they are saying, well, this is just a trump judge who is doing his bidding since she is a trump appointee. >> shame on them. come on. having somebody without the political bent to them is not a hard ask. quite frankly, the special master should have been put in place prior. there is obvious political conflicts of interest here when you're dealing with a president of the united states authorizing the fbi to move forward and do this against his biggest political rival. and so i think it's the right thing. i think it should have been avoided by having garland appoint that special master prior to the fbi reviewing these materials. howard: right. and, tara, with the d the oj planning to appeal this ruling to the 11th circuit, this will

at the very least delay the justice department investigation. the judge took nine days to make the decision, but haven't journalists found plenty of legal experts who call this a terrible ruling by judge cannon? >> that's right. there are an overwhelming number of legal experts who oppose this ruling, and that's a story. as a journalist, you're always going to, you know, focus on the conflict. if everyone afield with her, in this wouldn't be a story to agree with. even just the suggestion by trump's team, there was an outpouring of legal experts saying that this is ununheard of, unprecedented, undeserving. but, yeah, that is the story, is that -- and to to many people, they say this is just another tactic that trump has used throughout his career, to delay, and that asking for a special master in which he asked for a 90-day period of time to review these dock units that we could be in december still talking about this. howard: donald trump's response

is they leak, lie, plant fake evidence, the doj says he may still have classified documents. jason, let's turn to that report involving the nuclear capabilities of a foreign nation. there are only nine nuclear powers that we know of. this was clearly a leak from merrick forwardland's justice department -- garland's justice department in what is supposed to be a secret criminal investigation. >> how many times have they gotten this absolutely wrong? i'm sorry, howie, every single time we hear about this i've seen this, adam schiff is saying it's absolutely true, everybody's saying it's true and then, guess what in when the mueller investigation happened, there was nothing. so don't color me, you know, call me surprised when maybe it's not true. this is why you need a special master. you need somebody without a political bent to them to go and look at it fairly. that is not a heavy, big ask from the trump team. and how dare the people say, oh,

my goodness, donald trump is asking for some political neutrality in law enforcement? wow, that's the outrageous thing that a donald trump's asking for? more power to him. howard: yeah. i think the leaks are really troubling. but, tara, when "the washington post" first reported on a nuclear-related document, donald trump called it a hoax. he has not denied that he had the document with, he just talked about lying and leaking and so forth. so while we could decry the fact that doj is leaking -- i see we lost jason's shot there for a second -- don't you think there's a strong likelihood that this leak is accurate? >> there's a very strong possibility that the leak is accurate. obviously, the doj has seen the documents. they asked for this special master about nine days after the actual documents were retained. so there's a very high likelihood that people have already seen the documents that donald trump does not want people to see. it is interesting to hear news leaks come -- these leaks coming

out. i think this is the justice department trying to defend themselves in the court of public opinion. we know, ultimately, they will -- everything will get tried many court. but in the meantime, you know, there are a lot of people -- specifically, the former president's supporters -- who are wondering if there was an overreach of power, if the justice department was right to execute a search on a former president. and the more that they are able to reveal the severity of the alleged crimes or at least as they see them in the press or public opinion, then they're able to support the decision that they made which, some without much -- without knowing the full story, you know, there could be conclusions that are made which the former president's making is that that a political witch hunt. howard: let me go back to jason chaffetz, we have about half a minute. it seems like people many your party aren't willing to criticize the former president based on what we do know, which is he took a whole lot of classified documents and was reluctant to return them.

>> i don't know that i believe that statement, howie. how dare the fbi lay out and take a picture of so-called classified documents only to find out more than 40 of them were empty folders. that's why you need a special master. howard: all right. good to see you both. next on "mediabuzz," mike pence's chief of staff, marc short, on the various trump investigations. ♪ ♪ wered my a1c, cv risk, and lost some weight. announcer: ozempic® provides powerful a1c reduction. in studies, the majority of people reached an a1c under 7 and maintained it. ozempic® lowers the risk of major cardiovascular events such as stroke, heart attack, or death in adults also with known heart disease. and you may lose weight. adults lost up to 14 pounds. ozempic® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes.

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howard: when mike pence was in mortal danger during the capitol riot, his chief of staff, marc short, was there with him. short has been summonedded to testify in the various investigations of donald trump. i spoke to him earlier. marc short, welcome. >> thanks or for having me. howard: you're a republican, you want your party to win the

midterms. how much of a distraction is the constant investigation of donald can trump? >> howie, i think there's no doubt that republicans would do better in the midterms if our focus was on joe biden. if we're talking about crime in america's cities under joe biden's watch, the crisis at the border, if we're talking about inflation, if we're talking about all of the things that biden has failed to do, then i think republicans prosper concern -- howard: unfortunately, the media are mostly talking about the former president. >> if instead our focus is continuing to a talk about the investigation and what's happened at mar-a-lago -- and i think republicans sometimes feed into that by claiming we should defund the fbi -- i think when you adopt those talking points, you're basically giving away one of your best issues which is we're the law and order party, they're the ones that have asked to defund the police and helped create the problem of crime in our cities. we're much better if wire focusing on joe biden -- if we're focusing on joe biden. howard: since the fbi raid a

whole lot more evidence has come out, some of it leaked, about trump refusing for many, many months to give up all the classified documents he had taken, and the nature of those documents. has the media coverage of this been fair? >> you know, howie, i think my point at the beginning was less one of condemnation if about the way doj went about this, instead acknowledging that i think doj has an extra burden of transparency in this case. the reality is the fbi was politicized when donald trump was elected president. they, director comey did, his first introduction to donald trump he lied to him and said you're not a target of investigation. and then the i think what you saw at doj for months after afterwards, continuing to perpetrate the steele dossier and disseminate it in ways that were incredibly harmful. in light of that history, obvious there's going to be a concern by republicans to say you need extra transparency. having said that, howie, it's certainly baffling as to why a

lot of those documents were at mar-a-lago. it doesn't seem like it's the most secure environment. and there's also a question about why trump's lawyers apparently were so misleading, potentially lying in the affidavit saying they'd returned all the information. there's a difference between playing a lawyer on tv and actually having good legal counsel, and i think that's one of the challenges they currently face. howard: we all know the vice president's life was in danger on january 6th. a mob chanted, "hang mike pence." you were with him at the capitol x you said if the rioters had gotten closer, there would have been a massacre. much of the media say that trump incited that riot and did the little to stop it. is that fair given the 187 minutes of inaction on the 6th? >> well, i think, howie, i think there's a fair question about what the president was doing during that time period to quell it. but i think it is unfair to suggest, in my opinion, that he wanted that riot to occur at the capitol. i don't believe that, and i

think that that was more of a combustion of a lot of factors at the time. and i do think that the secret service did an amazing job that day, and they should be commended for the way they protected not just the vice president, but his family and staff around him. howard: you've testified before the grand jury in the trump probe, given a deposition in the january 6th committee. i've noticed that you don't criticize president trump directly. you say he was poorly served by people feeding him conspiracy theories. now, given the bitter split with mike pence, who may well run for the top job in '24, given the violence on the 6th, do you still consider yourself a trump supporter? >> sure. i'm very proud of the four years. i'm very proud of much that was accomplished. i think donald trump deserves much credit for rebuilding our military, for nominating and confirming conservative judges, few new -- for new trade deals, for securing our borderrings. i think those are incredible

parishments. even though i acknowledged that i think the president was pyre -- poorly served at the end, the buck ultimately stops with him too. howard: so if he were to get the nomination, you would be happy to support him for another term? >> i think that's a hypothetical that's a long way off -- hugh. howard: howe right, but given what you went through on the 6th, i'm surprised you are general russ -- generous in saying it was the people around him. >> as i said, i think the buck ultimately stops with him, but i do think the president was poorly served at the end of the four year ares. i think he had a very successful term, but i think that the advice is he was getting at the conclusion was poorly served. howard: president biden, as you know, has repeatedly attack thed maga republicans as a threat to democracy, clear and present danger. many in the media have applauded these attacks, some have embraced them by saying, oh, well, he's not going after min

stream -- mainstream republicans. your take. >> well, certainly he has. he may have couched it in that terminology, but he'd go on to talk about all sorts of policies that many people who supported donald trump also support. 75 million people voted for the trump-pence ticket. and basically, if you listen to the rest of his speech, he highlights so many different policy positions that we certainly support. and so i do think it was a mistake to say it the way he did. i do think, in my mind, it is similar to hillary clinton calling trump supporters deplorablings. i think that this will come back to haunt joe biden. i think the speech was a mistake. howard: marc short, thanks very much. >> thanks verying if me. good to see you. howard: that's it for this edition of "mediabuzz". i'm howard kurtz. apple itunes, good place to subscribe to my podcast. we're back here next sunday, we're the only media analysis show on television. very happy to be a part of the

coverage of queen elizabeth's final journey. she now many, casket at the palace there, holyrood. martha maccallum and the team did a great job. just look at that and all the pomp and ceremony led by the pomp and, you know, the people who know how to do this. that's it for us. i'm a performing artist. so a healthy diet is one of the most important things. i also feel the same way about my dog. we got her the farmer's dog sent in the mail. it was all fresh. i want my dog to have a healthy and long life. the farmer's dog helps that out. see the benefits of fresh food at betterforthem.com do you have a life insurance policy you no longer need? now you can sell your policy - even a term policy - for an immediate cash payment. we thought we had planned carefully for our retirement. but we quickly

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to help keep me sharp. neuriva: think bigger. we were ordered to land. >> during a horrible time we were there and those people took care of us. ♪ martha: we begin with news from the uk. queen elizabeth arriving in scotland in the past hour. this has the u.s. and world marking 21 years since a september 11 terror attacks. a low unwelcome. i am arthel neville. hello eric. eric: i'm live at ground zero. we are remembering those lost on this day 21 years ago when the