what's the grade tonight? >> anyway, as far as i'm concerned, you're always an a. you may have some issues i have a problem with and of course with what's going on. can i say this -- >> sean: we've got to roll. >> i'm not done. >> sean: we love you. next week, random people. 1-800-941-sean, 3:00 to 6:00 on radio. laura's next. have a great night. >> laura:: this is laura ingraham and this is the ingraham angle. after 11 votes, we still don't have a speaker of the house. but a high level source is telling ingraham angle tonight that kevin mccarthy is closer to peeling off 12 more supporters but that doesn't get them to 218. we're going to talk to one of the holdouts, the congressman elect matt geatz in moments. the brutal murders of four idaho college students including who

in the house saw the suspect, and how many times the suspect was actually in the house or around the house before the murders took place. joining me now from moscow, idaho is fox news chief correspondent jonathan hunt. these details are unbelievable, grisly and shocking to many americans, what can you tell us tonight? >> laura, they are indeed grisly and shocking and investigators say the evidence against brian koeberger speaks volumes even as the accused killer himself had little to say in court today. listen here. >> do you understand these rights? >> yes. >> i am now going to go over the criminal complaint with you. >> as 28-year-old coeberger dressed in the jump suit listening to the charges against him, officials released the

probable cause affidavit tin colluding the cell phone records and dna evidence led them to koeberger. they found a ninth sheathe in the house where they were stabbed to death. on that sheathe, a dna sample they say they matcheded to koeberger with 99% certainty after retrieving trash. a white hyundai elantra was seen on surveillance video multiple times near the site of the murders in the early morning hours of november 13. it's the same that police say koeberger and his father were driving when the police pulled them over for a traffic violation as the pair drove across-country the month after the murders. the cell phones suddenly stopped pinging cell towers around the time of the murders indicating, according to police, that it may

have been deliberately turned off. but they say it did show up near the victim's house 12 times in the weeks and months before the killings, according to police, that's a possible sign that he was stalking one or more of the victims and planning the killings. and perhaps, laura, the most chilling part of the affidavit was the revelation that a roommate of the victims actually saw the alleged killer having opened her bedroom door because she heard crying and a male voice saying, it's okay, i'm going to hell you. that roommate told police she saw a man dressed entirely in black and wearing a mask walking towards her. she hurdly shut and locked her bedroom door. the man left the building. police say that man was brian koeberger. laura? >> laura:: i know it's been a long day for you. thank you very much tonight.

and as jonathan just said, this was a wild detail that we learned in this affidavit, something we never heard before, one of the roommates of the victims crossed paths with the murderer. now, to the extent that she could reveal that what he looked like, he said she saw bushy eyebrows, that he was wearing a mask. now her response, we noticed, is being trashed all over social media. because after seeing him, she as brian said ran back in the room and locked the door. joining me is the former fbi special agent, brian foley, former homicide detective and hartford chief of detectives. brian, i'm trying to, you know, think about this for a moment. it's the middle of the night. there are people apparently coming in and out of the house a lot. they left the door open to the house a lot.

people in retrospect are judging in the harshest way, this roommate for having closed the door and locked the door at the time. is there such a thing as being paralyzed with fear if you're a victim or a potential victim of a crime? >> absolutely. let me make one thing clear. there's only one person to bevillified and that's the monster that killed the four people. hard stop right there. toville fie this witness is wrong. you don't know how you're going to react in certain situations. as cops, we train for it. we see so many scenarios and we think of how we're going to react. the average person, you don't know how you're going to react. you don't know the scenario. you just described what that house was like. the movement after hours. you had an uber -- or a food dropoff at 4:00 a.m. from like a door dash. there's a lot going on there.

i know witnesses that have lived with this. i feel bad that she's in that scenario. it's horrible. we all say how we are going to react, bottom line, you don't know how you're going to react. there's one bad guy in this situation, he's behind bars. >> jonathan, a videotape shop employee, this is another detail that we learned had several interactions with the victim. he revealed something rather disturbing as well. watch this? >> four, five girls at most all the time would come in together. i made a joke earlier, coming together, nice to see you girls are trying to stay safe. one of them said, oh, yeah, we had a friend of ours be stalked before, so this why we all travel in a group like this. maddie said it and it was more like motioning to caylee too, who is right next to her.

did you think they came into contact with any of these individuals? >> ted bundy showed that can happen. he went up to several people and kill or attempt to kill people. it can happen. these people are hunters. but i think in this case, what the evidence shows is that he was very interested in that neighborhood. specifically where that house was on king street leading up to that time. and i want to say one other thing, laura, about this whole thing, that comes back to what you were talking about with the internet sleuths. these are people that go up to individuals on-line. theyville fie people, it's a cult mentality, a hive mentality where they pounce on people. and what this young lady did,

when she got froze and the way this worked out, she actually disrupted this individual's attack, i believe, and they left. she could have been the next victim had she not come out and startled him. the way it works out, the way the psychopathic killers work, that's just the way they are. they're there, very aggressive, but can be startled very easy. and i wouldn't be surprised if we find out this guy has killed multiple people. we know that he stalked people are at least going to the pub or brewery there in pennsylvania and was asking bizarre questions of women. we know he has a pattern of this behavior. loim why do you think the police -- well, they allowed people again to trash law enforcement.

law enforcement was dragged through the mud. it does demonstrate, does it not, the methodical nature necessarily so of putting together a solid case against a suspect? >> as painful, as a cop reading through the arrest warrant, for a four-year cop, this is a heck of a warrant. we have big brother helping them write the warrant. but this is an amazing investigation, very tight. and the police -- the cops aren't in the business of naming suspects. they're in the business of arresting people and convicting them. i know how frustrating it is. they did a decent job of keeping the confidence of the entire country. they communicated as much as they can. they knew they knew something they did tilt their hands a few times if you watched the press conference. they were narrowing down on

somebody three weeks ago. that told me it was coming, he seems confident there was going to be an arrest. they have to keep the victim's family confidence in their investigation. that's difficult to do. the families get frustrated. the worst life in anyone's life, as you can imagine. they did a good job of maintaining confidence and holding their cards close to the chest. it's a cat and mouse game, ain't about arrests, it's about convictions. that's what they're going after. >> laura:: great to see both of you. despite all of the details we got today from this affidavit, questions are swirling tonight. like did the killer say anything else? did his parents really have no idea that he was involved in any criminality. why were some spared? how familiar was the suspect with the victims?

he walked right by her as he was leaving. people are asking, why did he leave her? >> i think he was in a rush to get out of the house. usually with these types of killers, at a certain point, don't forget, he's tired. he's killed a number of people already. at this point in time, maybe something is getting to him and he wants to put himself between him and the bodies as quick as possible.

he felt it was in his favor. he was dressed in black. had a mask on. he wanted out of there. too risky for him. >> laura:: a couple of interesting details. his sister appeared as a character named lori in this 2011 film called two days back. it was a horror flick about a group of young students who go hiking in the remote woods and meet their end at the hands of a maniacal killer. everything we heard about the scene of this crime, john, it was horrific. without, you know -- we don't know all of the details, but it was horrific. the police were visibly shaken who arrived at the scene. is there something in the culture of what people are marinading in today that could be adding to the depravity of

these murders? >> it's certainly always possible. there's plenty of violence all over if you just want to put on the television set, you're going to see violence in lot of different places. i just really believe this type of person, you know, just has a volcanic rage inside that's going to explode on his victim of choice. goes without saying, they all have different types of victims. usually, underneath it all, it's a lot of rage. and, you know, of course they want to control and dominate their victims and it's usually through violence. >> laura:: there's another detail, john, before we let you go about his cannibalistic tendencies. he had a bizarre approach to eating. forensic psychiatrist said he reported obsessive compulsive

eating habits indicating he was afraid he would become addicted to meat if he ate it. and it represented the struggle against his cannibalistic urges. this is just freak show central. >> yeah, this is central freak show. you're absolute lit right. i don't know what i'm going to hear next. you never know what you're going to hear. bottom line, if you look at this obsessive compulsive behavior, if you look at every serial killer, we've done research on this, you will find that they have some type of obsessive compulsive behavior. and like dahmer, cannibalism is up for grabs. you know, it can happen. >> john, great to see you. thank you for your expertise on this. up we'll check back next week. great new details in the fight for speaker. mccarthy is closer to peeling off a significant number of votes.

i talked to one of the holdouts, matt gaetz, after my hang. that's next.

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lie. that's the focus of tonight's "angle." 218, not 200, 205,

216, it's 218. >> the tellers agree in their tallies that the total number of votes cast is 434 -- the honorable kevin mccarthy of the state of california has received 203. jim jordan of the state of ohio has received 20. byron donalds of the state of florida has received 20. kevin mccarthy of the state of california has received 201. would one member as present. donald j. trump of the state of florida has received one. kevin hearn of the state of oklahoma has received two. no member elect having received a majority of the votes casts. the speaker has not been elected. the house stands adjourned until noon tomorrow. >> and samantha fox, my senior producer, receives a vote from

me, okay? you need 218. that's the number you need if you want to be speaker of the house. it could be fewer, technically; if members vote present or other members are absent from the floor for medical or other reasons. but whatever you think of the freedom caucus, for opposing kevin mccarthy or whatever you think of mccarthy's record, in the end, this is a number's forward game. mccarthy, you could argue, has had months to muster the votes he needed. after three days of voting, he came up 20 shy and that was 11 votes. now, the numbers still aren't budging. as for mccarthy's opponents, they claim they're standing on principles and i understand their points, they don't yet have an alternative who himself or herself can gather the requisite 218 either. that's where we are. so this process is messy. you kind of don't want to look at it at times. but it is what it is.

the republican party is not a monolith. it has establishment types, it has populous, and some moderates. there are three scenarios, basically, that are possible now, one, the freedom caucus basically take mccarthy's concessions as a win, and enough of them support him for speaker. number two, mccarthy could withdraw and allow another candidate for speaker to be proposed, one who presumably could get 218 votes. you heard a number of people's names mentioned, steve scalese is one. others could emerge as well. a third scenario. moderate and establishment republicans could strike a deal with democrats whereby mccarthy or another republican actually gets to be called speaker, but essentially both parties share power on the committees. now, the third possibility, a lot of people say it's farfetched, never going to happen.

probably is farfetched, but the folks opposing mccarthy ought to realize they are playing with fire here. you have to think of it this way, did any of them when they were campaigning promise the voters that in the event that they had the majority in the house, they would be willing to turn power over to the democrats if they didn't get their way in a number of points. not saying that the points aren't important. i don't think they campaigned on that, even though they campaigned on principle. and what do you think the voters are going to say, though, if that is what happens in the end. and at some point, if this goes on day after day after day, there may be other problems. and i'm talking serious problems. that the republicans could get blamed for. >> something that the democrats and some republicans have started to hint now that this might be a national security issue. if you look in your constitution, the first officer that's mentioned for the united states is the speaker of the house. the speaker of the house is the

constitutional officer for this branch of government. you have democrats and republicans who are starting to say, wait, we can't get briefings on important things that we need to talk about. what would happen if there were to be a crisis. that's a problem. >> laura:: no one has been more critical of the establishment gop than i have been. i devote add lot of time, you remember it, to exposing the waste, fwraud, and abuse and the $1.7 trillion omnibus bill that senate republicans voted for, an issue of the ridiculous infrastructure compromise to immigration to china trade. i have been battling the establishment forces on capitol hill for decades and also when we had a republican president. that went on for years and years. but congressman bob goode could not have articulated the conservative populist position on all of this any better. >> crisis after crisis, there $32 trillion in national debt.

and we just spent $1.7 trillion, both parties, republicans joining in the senate, a few in the house, to pass a $1. 7 trillion omnibus spending bill. we have got to have a leader who not only has true conservative convictions who reflect the majority of rebe uns who send us but, yeah, a courageous leader. >> laura:: courage, yes but one also has to ask the question of how you get from point a to point b. how does staffing mccarthy moving the needing toward america first solutions? the way to advance the populist cause is to get more power, to elect more members, not to grandstand. and you get concessions, absolutely, but if you get the concessions and you still oppose the person who's giving you the concessions, what does it all mean in the end?

to a lot of folks, it looks unserious at a time when we need a very serious approach to real world problems. but there's a good news story out there as well. pause we saw what works. it can work. president trump showed us. populist policies, yeah, put into motion, they're successful. he delivered peace, prosperity, wages were up, taxes and regulations were cut, the border was secure. there were no newars. and china was held accountable. that was serious stuff. it all worked. president trump won more votes than any republican presidential candidate in history. and right now, tonight, he's urging the freedom caucus to take the win and support mccarthy. so, i don't think any of the republican holdouts campaigned on a platform that included turning power over to the democrats. which, tonight, remains a distinct possibility. principle disagreements?

you bet they exist. i have a lot of them with the establishment. i'm as frustrated as anyone is about the spending. it's hideous. up in of this gets any closer of r reining it in or holding biden accountable. as for mccarthy, let's remember this, if the party had won more seats, he probably would have had an easy time sailing to the speakership. but despite the huge sums of money that he helped to raise for the party, there wasn't a red wave. so, here we have. that's the angle. >> when donald trump was president, the prices were slashed, wages were rising, the economy was roaring. i nominate president trump because we must make our country great again and he can start by making the house of representatives great again. >> oh joining me now, florida

congressman matt gaetz who has voted 11 times for candidates other than mccarthy. great to see you tonight. i love seeing you with congresswoman jayapal. any scoop that you can give us? that was funny. what are they talking about? >> my conversations with democrats have been about making sure they don't leave the floor for dinner or fundraisers or whatnot. we need them to stay there so that the denominator in the equation on the election of the speaker allows us to have leverage to push for many of the things we've been discussing on the budget, on term limits, on really the order of the house of representatives. so, committee assignments and chairmanships aren't bought and sold on who's able to redistribute the lobbyist money while the american people are left behind in a corrupt broken system in congress. >> laura:: your point about rushing off to events with

consultants or fundraisers is important. i saw there was a fundraising email sent out by andy biggs, one of the individuals opposing mccarthy. he sent a fundraiser out as the action was happening on the floor saying we block kevin mccarthy from becoming speaker of the house. now we conservatives must lead the fight to getting the leadership we deserve. congressman gaetz, is that the right -- we love congressman biggs, is that the right approach given your message, don't run out to the fundraisers. >> i wanted to make sure people stay on the floor. the reason is pro mccarthy groups have been running robo calls in our districts trying to pressure us and leverage us. so, yes, when you have kevin mccarthy pressuring, we want the patriots in this land to go to mattgaetz.com to chip in so i can get the message out about

what we're trying to achieve. ite not the end of the world we take a few extra days or weeks to sort it out. there are some days in congress where the only thing we vote on is the changing of the name of one post office. we're deciding who's second in line to the presidency. and the construct of the rules concessions functionally term the speakership to a ceremonial position. if my colleagues get what they want from mccarthy, the freedom caucus will be more important, amendments were process and why spending is going forward. >> laura:: i get the -- you know on the establishment issues, i'm totally with you. okay? i'm about the art of the possible. what's possible here? so, you did get a number of concessions that i'm not sure if i'm on the other side i would have given you. but a number of concessions from mccarthy in an attempt to get to 218. he lowered the threshold of the votes required to get to the

process of removing himself as speaker, just one person, one member of the conference can do it now. and to keep -- he agreed to keep his own pack out of gop primaries and to add more freedom caucus members to the house rules committee. and i understand, he also signed on to a separate approval process for earmarks and allowed floor votes on term limits for members and specific border policy legislation. what else do you require that he do or agree to before matt gaetz will say, okay, i'm onboard. >> i wouldn't look for my vote any time. >> laura:: that's personal. you made this principled point. you can't have it both ways. you can't say, i'm a man of principle and i believe in x, y, and z, and if he gives me x, y, and z, what?

how does that make sense? >> here's how it makes sense. he's the masthead of the lobby core. i resent to which kevin mccarthy utilizes the lobbyists and the special interests to be able to dictate how political decisions are made. how policy decisions are made, how leadership decisions are made. kevin mccarthy has been in the leadership for 14 years. he's sold shares of himself to special interests, to political action committees, and that's why i don't think he's right. >> laura:: why is trump -- >> why is that? >> laura:: you're close to president trump? why is trump for him? how many posts on truth social can we see from president trump telling y'all, this has been fun, but let's wrap it up here. >> i love president trump, i -- >> laura:: is he wrong? >> i love president trump, i defended him a great deal in congress. but hr wasn't always his strong suit. president trump got us folks like jeff sessions and bill barr

and jim mat 'tis and mark esper. they didn't get us america first policy. >> laura:: you think he's wrong on this. >> i think he's wrong if he supports mccarthy. i'll support president trump if he runs for election in 2024 but i'm not going to back him on this play. >> laura:: are you going to be okay, congressman, would you be okay if there's a deal struck with moderate democrats that give democrats co-control of the committees. you're fine with that? >> absolutely not. that will not happen. there's two potential scenarios here. i'm on the floor. these 212 democrats are going to vote for hakeem jeffries every single time. he's an historic candidate. they're not going to cleave off. if democrats join up to elect a moderate republican, i will resign. >> laura:: okay.

okay, steve scalese okay for you? >> well, there's two -- it depends on if he would accept these rules. we would have to have that discussion. so far he has not indicated he would run. i would prefer jim jordan. if kevin mccarthy pulls out of the race. >> laura:: you don't have the votes. >> i do expect him to campaign. he hadn't running yet. if kevin mccarthy got in the race, jim jordan would get into it and i believe he would win and invigorate our movement. he's broadly trusted in every corner of the republican party. and with a lot of our donors and supporters and activists. that's the type of option if mccarthy bows out. if he doesn't bow out, he'll have to live the entirety of his speakership in a straitjacket constructed by the rules that we're working on now. >> laura:: you prefer a speaker with a straitjacket than one who you believe is just a spend-oh-rama. >> if it's kevin mccarthy.

if it's jim jordan, we wouldn't need that. we trust jim jordan. there's zero trust in mccarthy. there's a large body of work to evaluate. continued voting for big spending bills, support of amnesty, the refusal to join us to break up big tech. this is something whose compass is like a wet finger in the wind. >> laura:: going to be watching this closely tomorrow. can't wait to see what happens next. thank you for joining us. we we appreciate it. now, what kevin mccarthy has to say about the speaker fight. plus, charlie hurt and molly hemingway are here. so stay there.

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the question everybody is wondering. >> has it undercut the power? >> has it undercut -- >> it was used over john boehner. >> i'm not -- >> since 1859, doesn't that mean that you would be a weaker -- >> no. no. >> only be a weaker speaker if i was -- (indiscernible). >> laura:: joining me, charlie hurt, "washington times" opinion editor and molly hemingway, editor in chief at the federalist. both fox news contributors. charlie, this has been tough to watch. and i'm trying to do a glass half full here. because i do think there are principle points to be made and ones that you and i and molly have made time and again about spending, immigration, china, trade, all of this stuff. what about the precedent that this sets to set up a speakership which is weakened and debilitated. is that a problem or is it

overstated? >> i think it is a bit overstated. i think it's going to be difficult -- it's going to be difficult for mccarthy to govern under any circumstances given the narrowness of his majority and the fact that he has control of the house. democrats still control the senate and the white house. but i think honestly, the overall fight is a very -- i think it's a very good thing. i think it's a very -- it's a cleansing argument. it's out in the open. it's democracy. it reminds me in a lot of ways of the 2016 primary where it was scaldingly honest. the interview you did with matt gaetz a few minutes ago, it's blaisingly honest. it's pointing out the problem with this place -- it's spending. the whole debate is about spending. the debate is happening on the republican side. the democrat party is so dishonest and so corrupt that they're not part of the debate

that was they refuse to acknowledge that spending is destroying this country. and i think that mccarthy ends up pulling it out. when he does, this is a baptism by debate. he's going to be a much better speaker. and i think republicans are going to be better because of this scalding, nasty, and at times, entertaining but also a little bit worrisome debate. >> laura:: well, molly, i have to say the establishment really has no one to blame but itself for what it's done and what it's agreed to, that infrastructure bill that senator cassidy and mcconnell and shelby and all of them agreed to a year and a half ago. and then the omnibus bill they're all celebrating in kentucky -- this is obscene. so that did bring it on. i mean, this is what caused all of this. >> i do think that the behavior of mitch mcconnell and other squishy senate republicans in helping democrats with their big spending agenda after these

midterm elections does contribute to what we have now. and i do understand that this is a little disconcerting to have this kind of fight. but really what's far more embarrassing than a healthy debate about who should be speaker and what the rules should be is that there was never a debate in the senate about who should lead the republicans on -- you know, in that body after a couple rounds of failure from the current leader, mitch mcconnell. i'm actually pretty glass completely full on this debate we're having. i think kevin mccarthy has done a good job of trying to build consensus and continue to build support for speakership. but also, these 20 conservatives have shown how you can get things done even when you don't have a majority. you know, they don't have enough to pick who they want for their speaker. but they do want these rules changes to help have a much more functioning congress. if you think congress has been operating well for the last several years, you should just want the speaker to be elected without any debate. if you think it could be

improved -- and i think a lot of americans desperately want it improved, a lot of the rule changes will help to contribute to a better body of republicans and some constraints that will help them pass better legislation. >> laura:: well, i want to move to a couple of topics quickly, cori bush made one of the most ridiculous comments about byron donalds, of course nominated a speaker and voted for for by a few people. you're saying he's not a candidate, historic candidate for speaker, he's a prop. despite being black, he supports a policy agenda intent on upholding white supremacy. his name being in the mix is not progress, it's pathetic. charley, when in doubt, the left smears conservative minorities. they do it every time. this shows it again. >> they're the last racist -- they're the last racists in america. cori bush is a disgusting woman.

the black conservatives on capitol hill are open season to these people. they have no shame whatsoever. it's so disgusting. the only reason they treat them like this is because they're african-american. and this is the definition of racism. cori bush is a racist and she's a disgusting racist. >> laura:: that made me sick. molly and charlie, great to see you both tonight. thank you. when we come back, a breaking news update on damar hamlin in moments.

people murmuring, okay, football, given this near catastrophic injury for dama rvshgs hamlin, is it too dangerous and violent? should we discourage young people from playing it? what about the net positives of football? great news about the remarkable progress that damar hamlin has made. what other questionses are rising about football itself? that debate continues. joining us is the head team physician for the l.a. rams and the dodgers. not too shabby. great to see you tonight.

you have daily interaction in the season in the top football players in the country, pro football players in the country. if they hadn't been on the football field, many of them, coming from difficult backgrounds, what might have happened to their safety and well being had they not been in the nfl? >> good to see you too, laura. it's clear that football is such an important part of our culture and it's taken such a major role in helping provide opportunity and financial benefit to a whole group of people that never would have had that opportunity. we saw a big problem in front of our eyes when these programs at the school level had to be shut down in the early stages of covid. and we participate very heavily in school projects and athletic -- athletic programs

for the inner city schools here in los angeles. and we know that when these kids don't get a chance to play a sport, oftentimes, they're not going to be going to school. and if that's the case, then they could fall prey to a whole myriad of things that are detrimental to their life. now football has provided far outweighs the costs in the -- in the risk of playing this sport. i want to make a special mention along with what we saw happen on monday night. i mean, you saw an amazing performance by the medical staffs on both sidelines on the bills and tb bengals and being able to revive and bring back a great player who was -- who was -- and revive him from death. you saw a very talented group of athletic trainers and physicians and all of these people,

they're -- their education and their dedication to the sport -- they -- these talented people congregate at these nfl games. and also in college games, same types of people, same talent. this is an indication of the dedication that the nfl and the ncaa has to being able to provide increase in safety, the health and safety for their players. so, one of the safest players you can be, quite frankly, if you have a catastrophic event like you saw happen was on the nfl football field, literally 30 yards from you, there's a -- there's half a dozen people who can save your life. >> laura: doctor, it's so inspiring on so many levels. damar hamlin's personal story, the devotion to the all mighty and the medical professionals and the teammates and the fans all together praying. doctor, thank you for your expertise and being with us tonight. appreciate it. final thoughts when we come back.

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>> my administration will work to make things better at the border using the tools we have, and the failure to pass him up on the plan has increased challenges we are seeing at the south border, no one knows this better than the vice president. >> laura: wait, wait, i'm sure the vice president and that one visit and made her an expert, thanks for watching, "gutfeld!" next. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [cheers and applause] >> greg: stop it! oh, you are a -- stop it! stop it coming you are making me blush all over. could be the hives. savvy thursday, i love thursda