if i know what is important to the voters, maybe i could assess someone's chances, it may be. if i don't know what people are looking for i would not be very helpful at knowing when they found it. >> and good night from south shannon: i'm shannon bream. the president, lawmakers and western leaders look on with concern as china and russia grow closer. ♪ >> there's no secret that the relationship between putin and xiing has gotten much stronger. hay share a common if adversary. shannon: the president huedings with german leaders as chinese president xi meets with the russian ally, the two superpowers flexing their diplomatic might, trying to shape the outcome of the war in ukraine. and intelligence officials say hay don't see any proof -- they don't see any proof that foreign

weapons caused the mysterious havana many syndrome, but american victims and their lawyers still have a lot of questions. >> it just doesn't make sense. >> we'll bring in the top senator on the intelligence committee, mark warper, and we'll get -- warner, and we'll get reaction from mike pompeo who's considering a run for the republican nomination. we'll ask how he would manage these global challenges. then -- >> can can i answer the question? >> no, you cannot. you have refused to answer -- shannon: republican lawmakers blast biden's attorney general over protests near the homes of supreme court justices. we'll ask our sunday panel about the fiery exchanges on the hill all right now on "fox news sunday." ♪ ♪ shannon: hello from fox news in washington. the president met with op the democrats this week as he thinks through his 2024 strategy, but foreign policy challenges

continue to push his chest cantic plans to the side -- domestic plans to the side. breaking overnight, the chairman of the joint chiefs visiting u.s. troops in syria. general milley is there to talk about are preventing a resurgence of isis. syria's foreign ministry are calling it a flagrant violation of syrian sovereign i. many in a moment, virginia senator mark warner joins us live on the war in ukraine, on china and a new u.s. intel assessment about the mysterious havana syndrome. but first to the lucas tomlinson live at the white house. lucas. >> reporter: shannon, u.s. officials privately admit the war in is at a stalemate right now. the front lines haven't changed in months despite billions of dollars of american weapons flowing into the country over the past year. russian forces making incremental gains assaulting the eastern ukrainian city of the

white house and presenting this flag to congress in december. friday president biden hosted his german counterpart with ukraine dominating the discussions. >> beyond the military support, the moral support you ghei to the -yard line -- gave to the ukrainians is profound. >> reporter: despite both sides approving tanks for ukraine, u.s. officials commit few have been sent more than a month since the announcement. today russian forces control 17% of ukraine, and there are more russian troops inside ukraine now than anytime in the past year. in late are january the u.s. military's top officer admitted getting the russians out of ukraine this year would be, quote, very, very difficult. only about half the 20 leading economies in the world are sanctioning russia. inya has increased its oil -- indian has increased its oil imports.

russia's top diplomat made the following claim, immediate wily rebuked by the audience. >> the war which we are trying to stop which was launched against us using the -- [inaudible conversations] >> reporter: one of the biggest concerns in washington, china potentially arming the russians. >> we haven't seen the chinese make this decision. we don't think they've taken it off the table. >> reporter: the president also meant with democrats late last week on capitol hill. the backdrop, his potential re-election bid and his annual budget rollout this week. president biden already making this pledge: >> i want to make it clear, i'm going to raise some taxes. if any of you are billionaires out there, you're going to stop paying 3%. >> reporter: right now former president donald trump leads biden in the polls in a potential rematch in 2024. trump spoke last night for nearly two hours outside the nation's capital at the conservative political action conference better known as cpac.

florida governor ron desantis was among a handful of prominent republicans who did not attended. shannon? shannon: lucas tomlinson from the white house, thank you. joining us now, virginia democratic senator mark warner, chairman of the senate's intelligence committee. welcome back. >> thank you, shannon. shannon: okay. so this week you all have a hearing on worldwide threat assessments. you'll have the dni, the director of the cia there. you have long been warning about china on multiple fronts. do you think that we have lost valuable time in assessing the threat accurately? >> well, i think for a long time conventional wisdom was the more you bring china into the world order, the more they're going to change. that assumption was just plain wrong. china even changed their laws in 0 the 16 to make it explicitly clear that every company in china, their first obligation is to the communist party. so we have never had a potential adversary like china. soviet union, russia was a military or ideological.

china is investing in economic areas, they have $500 billion in intellectual property theft, and we are in a competition not just on our nation's security basis, but on a technology basis. that's why national security now includes telecommunications, satellites, artificial intelligence, quantum computing. each of these domains we've got to the make the kind of investments to stay ahead. i think we're starting that in a bipartisan way. we did the chips bill to rye to bring semiconductor manufacturing back, we've kicked autohuawei out of our -- out huawei. this week i've got a broad bipartisan bill that i'm launching with my friend john thune, the republican e lead, where we're going to say in terms of foreign technology coming into america, we've got soft a -- to have a systemic approach when necessary. shannon: does that mean tiktok? >> tiktok is one of potentials. listen, tiktok is not only -- you got 100 million americans on tiktok 90 minutes a day. even you guys would like that

kind of return -- [laughter] 90 minutes a day. they are taking data from americans, but what worries me more with tiktok is this can be a propaganda tool, basically the kind of videos you see would promote ideological issues. if you look at what tiktok shows to the chinese kids which is all about science and engineering versus what our kids see, there's a radical difference. shannon: we'll watch that because that's a bipartisan offering, potentially, this week. this past week it was revealed that both department of energy and fbi believe that the origins of covid were most likely a leak from the wuhan institute for virology. this was something early on was called a conspiracy theory, you were racist if you talked about it. the senate has unanimously passed a measure that would call on this administration to declassify information that we have about the origins. white house with won't say whether the president will veto it or not. coamericans, really world wild do people not have the right to see that information? >> shannon, here's an example,

again, what we're keeling with with the communist party in china. this virus had originated virtually anywhere else, you would have had world scientists there. the chinese communist party has been totally to ache pa about letting in outside scientists to figure this out -- opaque. some in the science community think it originated in a wet market, others think it came out from a lab although one entity says it came from one lab in wuhan, another entity says another. we've got to keep looking. we've got to make sure in terms of future pandemics that we can have access to where the source originates a lot earlier on in the system. we're three and a half years late, and we still don't have access. shannon: they're not going to cooperate especially if they were at fault. how do they pay for this, billions, probably trillions in losses, millions and millions of lives. >> i think, again, this is where we've got to have that united front of countries all around the world that there has to be

the consequences. potentially in terms of sanctions, it's one of the reasons why china moves forward to support russia in ukraine, i can't understand some of my colleagues who are willing to say, well, i don't really care about ukraine, but i'm concerned about china. well, china and russia, these authoritarian regimes, are linked, and we've got to the make sure putin is not successful in ukraine, and we've got the make sure xi does not have further expansion plans for taiwan. shannon: and we we know even if they aren't sending bullets over to russia, they are buying copious amounts of russian oil, they are sending dual-use products that could be used on the battlefield. xi doesn't seem worried about the warnings, they haven't even acknowledged or apologized for the balloon that went across america, capturing information as it went, we think. is xi afraid of this administration? do your -- our warn, mean anything? >> i think xi, as putin thought, that the west would basically

throw in the towel when they invaded ukraine. the fact that we've not, for example, you've got german chancellor in just this past week, germans dramatically increasing the defense budget, the fact that we've got nations like fin and sweden joining nato, i think putin made a major miscalculation, and i do think xi is watching the west stand up against putin and is taking lessons. shannon: you're just back from india, they abstained from the u.n. vote that condemned russia's invasion of ukraine and called for an end to this. how important is it, a critical place like india, that they choose a side and with the west? >> i think it's time for -- india's a great nation. matter of fact, i'm chair of the indian caucus, i'm a big support of india. and india's now the fifth largest economy in the world in a place where remarkable things are happening. and my message to the indians has been we understand that you have historic ties to russia, and you still get a lot of your arm, but you cannot be a world

leader, attempting to be a moral world leader without picking a side. and in this case, i think the younger indians get this. some of the older generation i think we still have some work to do. shannon: okay. let's urn to continued funding for ukraine -- turn to continued funding for ukraine. there are questions about there'll be more requests from congress, no doubt, in the coming weeks about that. and while there is strong support there, here across the u.s., across the west, the polls show that it's pulling back a little bit. and here's the reality from what analysts -- from one analyst, funding has not been made with any tough bureaucratic trade-offs. we've hit our debt ceiling, we've got some kind of negotiation that's to got to the happen very shortly. there are competing needs, and they are very real. so where do we assess our financial commitment -- >> shannon, let's look at this. we've allocated $113 billion, we've actual only given them actually less than half of them

and -- that and on the military side roughly 60 billion. we've till got some run to go there. but -- runway to go there. but i think we need to keep that commitment. and the truth is the russian army is being chewed up by the ukrainians. we spent $800 billion a year on defense most of my lifetime to prevent russia from exploiting that. we're having the ukrainians do that right now, in a sense, for us. i think we need to continue that. i think you will see the vast majority of members of congress in both parties, there's some loud mouths on both sides that are pulling back. but if we're going to keep in this competition existence russia and china, putin cannot be successful. and at the same time we have to realize as we look at china that national security is no longer simply tanks and trucks and guns and ships. s the also telecom and a.i. and quantum computing and advanced sin met thetic biology. we're going to have to the make investments in those des moines.

shannon: speak of other national security interests, iran and the report on their nuclear capabilities came out this weekend, and it's kind of getting lost are, i think, in all the other foreign policy headlines. basically, what the international atomic energy agency told us is they've hit 80% as far as enriching uranium, just short of the 90% you would need for a weapon. britain, france and germany want to censure iran over this. reportedly, the biden administration doesn't want to go there. are we now then softer on iran's nuclear program than europe? >> i do not believe that. we have made explicitly clear, and i was just in israel recently with a group of senators, that we agree with israel, iran cannot be a nuclear power. and i think that has been our policy, it will continue to be our policy. there are two steps in this process. one is the enrichment issue, and i believe we will be tougher than europeans -- shannon: so whyen don't we censure?

reportedly. >> listen, we already sanctioned and censured more iranian companies by far than our european friends. but there's also the question around delivery systems. again, i think we and our israeli friends are following this very closely and, again, we will not allow iran to become a nuclear power. shannon: okay. i've got to hit this havana sin droa. the reporting out this week, an assessment from several intention agencies, they don't think -- it's unlikely a foreign adversary was carrying out these attacks where our diplomats and intel officers around the world have suffered really debilitating symptoms from this. senator rubio, your colleague, tweeted: the cia took the investigation of havana syndrome seriously, but it's hard to accept service the caused by a/c unitses and loud cicadas. something happened here and just because we don't have all the answers doesn't mean it didn't happen. will you continue to try to the pursue answers? >> absolutely. first of all, the most important thing is anyone who got sick,

whatever the source was whether they are cia, whether dod, state department officials, we owe them the world's best health care. and i think we are providing that now. initially, frankly, under the last administration this whole issue was being swept under the rug. we are now making sure that health care's provided. and i know how extensive the cia investigation's been, and i've made very clear to them if there are -- they need to continue that investigation. if new facts come to light, they ought to pursue that. but at this moment in time, i know how thorough they've been, and they have not found the evidence that i think perhaps they thought they would have found. we've got to follow the facts. at the end of the day, that's what we owe these members of the intel community to protect our nation, and that means getting them the health care. and if it ends up some other source than what's been discovered so far, we've got to pursue it. shannon: all right it's great to have you with us. all right, there are several

former trump administration officials who are either running or considering running in '24 the, that includes a few who had a direct hand in the trump foreign policy. former secretary of state mike pompeo is joining me next, and we'll ask again whether he plans to challenge his former boss for the white house. ♪ ♪ and it's easier than ever to■ get your projects done right. inside, outside, big or small, angi helps you find the right so for whatever you need done. with angi, you can connect with and see ratings and reviews. just search or scroll to see upf on hundreds of projects. and when you book and pay throug you're covered by our happiness it's easy to make your home an a

check out angi.com today. angi... and done. ah, these bills are crazy. she has no idea she's sitting on a goldmine. well she doesn't know that if she owns a life insurance policy of $100,000 or more she can sell all or part of it to coventry for cash. even a term policy. even a term policy? even a term policy! find out if you're sitting on a goldmine. call coventry direct today at the number on your screen, or visit coventrydirect.com.

♪ shannon: the energy department has now joined the fbi concluding that the covid-19 pandemic more likely than not originated from a lab leak, a notion characterized at one point as a fringe conspiracy, deemed by some even as racist. when the trump administration began giving the lab leak theory

credibility at the beginning of the pandemic. joining me now, author of "never give an inch," mike pompeo. good to have you back, secretary the. >> good morning, shannon. shannon: your book, you were an early adopter of the possibility this could have been a leak from the wuhan institute of virology. and you said you weren't surprised that the chinese pushed back on it and some of your opponents on the left politically did a ooh the, but you were surprised that some u.s. scientists were. you mention dr.s fauci and collins and say i think they were fearful of being exposed for conflicts of interest and activities that sidestepped american laws. what exactly did you mean many. >> well, shannon, we now know that there was u.s. money funding the research that was taking place inside that laboratory the, and i think dr. fauci and peter daszak knew that. and so they went full battle sayingses in march, goodness, three years dog. three years ago i was on good morning america concern excuse

me, this week, on abc, and i said it looks like it came from the institute of virology, and they went full battle sayingses. they were fearful -- battle stations. i don't think we know the full scope. the chinese communist party has on the up all the documents, thrown away the journalists, they've made it all go away, but it is now good to see that the department of energy has come to the same conclusion that i did, my state department kid years ago, that this leak came from a lab are story in wuhan shi gin finning -- xi jinping foisted this upon the world. shannon: are you optimistic we will know on the u.s. side our part of the equation in this, and should there be responsibility? who should be held responsible? >> yes, we should hold all parties accountable for this, shannon, everyone who had a role. make no mistake, this was a chinese virus that came from their laboratory. there's no mistaking that. but we should understand fully what the u.s. role was in the, and if there were laws violated

by any senior american official, they should be held accountable. millions of people divided, we've had billions of dollars worth of economic harm inflicted on the economy. the only way to make it right so to make sure everyone connected to this is held accountable. shannon: you have been criticized for calling vladimir putin things like talented, savvy, elegantly sophisticated, not reckless, always does the math and that you have enormous respect for him. you know you've been criticized for that. is there a context to that? how grow explain those very flattering descriptions? >> yes. those are what i was taught at west point. always respect your adversary. don't call isis the jv, what barack obama did, don't underestimate the putin administration. when you think of your enemy as weak or dumb or not capable of executing things that could harm your country, you put american lives at risk.

so when i used those words, i was serious about them. this is a guy who made a huge strategic blunder, but we even today, shannon, even today we should not underestimate his tenacity, his capabilities. the willingness of the russian people to continue to impose enormous harm on ukrainian civilians and to upset the space here and the global order. vladimir putin should still not be underestimated. he's threatened all kinds of things, we should be sure that we're doing the right things to deter this adversary who wants to do the american people harm. shannon: to be clear though, on a scale of morality, where would you place him? >> zero. shannon: okay. very good. >> assuming one is the lowest, zero, shannon. shannon: all right. let's talk about what's going on in ukraine because there is a lot of speculation there's a pit of a split within the gop. folks who are on the hill now, folks who are running for president, who may want to run for president. here is what former president trump said last night about us spending tax dollars overseas. >> instead of spending hundreds

of billions of collars to defend the -- dollars to defend the borders of distant foreign countries, under my leadership we will defend our borders first. shannon: okay. of as we talked about with senator warner, there is some flagging of support in ukraine. people know we don't have our own first a call house in order here, we may face other threats around the globe. there are genuine competing needs, so how do we make that assessmentsome. >> shannon, there certainly are competing needs, but america can do this all right if we get lots of things right. let's talk through three things that are buried in what you asked. first, yes, we should secure our southern border. i was involved in that, we built remain in mexico, we actually had sovereignty for the united states of america. i'm proud of the work we did the in the trump administration to make sure that our southern border was secure. it is possible to do. we simultaneously made sure that vladimir putin didn't invade europe and had deterred that kind of aggressive attack on europe. for four years on our watch, we

didn't allow vladimir putin to take an inch of europe. and finally, four years of the trump administration spent clash 6 trillion more than it took in adding to the deficit. i came to congress, shannon, you'll remember this, in 2011 as part of the tea party class. we were determined to get america's fiscal house in order, and it's going to the take serious american leadership another the it, but i'm confident we can do each of those three things. america will get there, we just need serious leadership that's prepared to speak honestly with the american people about each of those. shannon: would a president pompeo do a better job of managing the deficit and debt the than a president trump did? >> i think a president pompeo or any conservative president will cobetter than not only we did during the four years of the trump administration, barack obama, george bush, the list is long, shannon, of folks who come to washington on one theory and aren't prepared to stand up and explain to the american people how we're actually going to get that right. it matters to the next generation. the system is at risk. if we don't get it right, we are $31 trillion in the hole, we've

got to begin to grow the economy, build it back with lower taxes, and when we do that and grow our economy, we'll get it back right. st it's going to talk a true conservative leader, shannon. shannon: are you saying president trump wasn't a true conservative leader? >> $6 trillion more in debt, that's never the right correction the for the country, shannon. shannon: okay. i want to hit on iran as i talked about with senator warner, it seems to be flying if under the radar just a little bit, this nuclear advancement. your critics say: the scope of trump's failed iran policy lands at your feet. as iran's nuclear program advances, it's important to understand just how spectacularly donald trump's policies failed and in turn created the current mess. you were secretary of state, do you accept any of the blame for where they are now? >> hey, shannon, they blamed afghanistan on us, they blamed the china problem on us. eventually, the biden administration will take the responsibility for something, i guess who years in, right? no, our policy on iran was fundamentally right. this administration has walked away from the nation of israel.

the israeli leadership doesn't have the confidence to do what it may need to do to keep iran from having a nuclear weapon, that america will be with it in its time of need. we had isolated iran. we built up the abraham accords because with we sanctioned the iranian regime. we made life difficult for them, we took away their money. they went from $96 billion to $4 billion worth of foreign exchange reserve. hezbollah soldiers were getting paid less. we had the right policy with respect to iran. we had begun to put them in a box where they would have had to make difficult decisions, and the israelis knew that, the gulf arab states knew that, and i think the american people understood that our relationship with iran can't be one of coziness, we can't negotiate with them while they're trying to kill americans. those are the wrong policies with respect to the united states and iran. we have to get this right, and the biden administration has failed miserably. shannon: they've been kicking forward on that program, so i want to give you a chance to respond to what senator warner said about the havana syndrome, that it wasn't a weapon or

something end done by a foreign adversary. he said you guys didn't take the it seriously, didn't seven an investigative team. send an investigative team. >> yeah, i'm disappointed in that because senator warner knows better than that. he was the chairman of the intelligence committee when i was cia correcter. we identified this problem, we got our officers, broadly speaking, both state department and cia out of the courageous places that they were in, and we began a massive effort to try to identify what happened. proven very complex, it's now five year years on, still not clear precisely how it is these folks became sick and injured. we ought to keep at it. but to make this about partisanship or suggest that somehow if our administration didn't either help the folks who were ini injuredded, we did, we provided them medical attention, or do our best to figure out how to deter the it and push back against it, that's just -- i wish senator warner hadn't done that. that's beneath him. van san last time you were here, i asked you if you were going to run president. we are still waiting.

[laughter] any announcements at that point? you were at cpac, hit a number of topics, you sound like somebody who could be giving a stump speech. i want to play a little bit of what you said friday night. >> we can't become the left, following celebrity leaders with their own brand of identity politics, those with fragile egos who refuse to acknowledge reality. shannon: washington post said in case it isn't obvious, pompeo is talking about his former boss, donald trump. pompeo avoids naming names so he can have plausible deniability and potentially avoid a backlash. so celebrity leaders with fragile i goes. who were you talking about? [laughter] >> oh, shannon, i was talking the to the american people. i was talking to the american people about the seriousness of the moment that we find ourselves in. we've been focused on foreign policy today but, shannon, you and i have talked about the problems in our schools, crime in the streets, we've spoken for a moment about our southern border. i was talking about the time to elect serious read e -- leaders who speak about america as the

most exceptional nation in the history of civilization. they're not denigrating it, not spending all their time thinking about twitter. that's what i was speaking to. it's the moment for celebrity, the moment for stars is not with us. it's the moment for america to go back to its conservative founding, its conservative -- i am very confident that room cheered thatted idea, and i am very confident that we're headed back that direction. shannon: okay. she can i think leaders with fragile egos, people obsessed with twitter, you leave are us with no other assumption that you are talking about your former boss and you may be considering a serious run yourself. i mean, who else are you talking about? >> oh, shannon, again, i'm not talking about any -- i'm talking about what's happening in states, counties, school boards across america. it is time for a thoughtfulness and a weightiness and a seriousness that i think we've kind of moved away from, and we've got to get back there. it's not about former president bush, it's not about president biden. it's about the american people and getting right. i'm not dodging your question either, we are working our way through, my wife susan and i are

trying to figure out what's next for us, and in very short order we'll let everyone know. shannon: what does short order mean? got a timeline? >> not a hard one but next couple months. shannon: okay. we'll see you back here on "fox news sunday "for your announcement. >> all right, shannon, have a great day. shannon: you too. our big name republicans fanned out this weekend at at a couple of gatherings. president trump took a few veiled swipes at potential challengers, and he's pretty excited about the straw poll results. we'll talk about the new heat in the 2024 race, next. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ get $1500 purchase allowance on a 2023 cadillac xt5 and xt6.

♪ visit your local cadillac dealer today.

introducing the limited edition disney collection from blendjet. nine exciting designs your whole family will adore blendjet 2 is portable, which means you can blend up nutritious smoothies, protein shakes, or frozen treats, just about anywhere! recharge quickly via usb-c. it even cleans itself. order yours now from blendjet.com and bring a little disney into your life.

>>st that's why i'm standing before you, because we are going to finish what we started. we're going to complete the mission. we will expose and appropriately deal with the rinos -- [cheers and applause] we will evict joe biden from the white house. shannon: president trump taking the stage at cpac laying out his re-election platform and vowing a return to the white house. it is time now for our sunday group, white house reporter for "the wall street journal" katherine lucy, former bush white house adviser karl rove, fox news senior political analyst juan williams and host of the jason rantz, it could only be jason rantz. guys, good to have you with us this morning. let's put. the cpac poll, no surprise p donald trump runs away with it, 62 percent to ron desan since --

ron desantis at 20%. karl, you have talked about who the nominee should or shouldn't be or may or may not be. this is just one slice, this is one straw poll that we knew was going to go this way, but our polling showed that president trump continues to dominate the primary field. >> yeah. he's the front-runner. it's interesting, july '21 he was 70% at cpac, and august '22 in dallas at c pablo he was 69 -- cpac and now he's 60 -- shannon: 62. >> 62. shoon san he's not going to want to give up -- >> and this is trump fest, let's be clear about this. shannon: it is. >> this is totally trump fest. but, look, he's the front-runner, and the question is, is he going to be the front-runner in early 2024 or is he going to be slipping in some of the early sates. early states are indicating, new hampshire, for example, and nevada, there's polling that indicates he's not the front-runner there. so we're in for an exciting contest, but he's in the pole position nos, ands or -- no ifs, ands or buts about it.

shannon: larry hogan, a frequent trump critickings say -- critic, says he's not going to run. >> that thing that we saw in 0 the 16 with donald trump is that a lot of people ran against him split the rest of the vote, and it allowed him to slidfy his support and rise concern solidify his support and rise above. i think the question now i is, is there another candidate, and we just don't the know yet. is there another candidate who can really rally the rest of the party support existence trump. shannon: well, he wassed asked apparently what happens if you get indicted, and he said it will probably help his numbers which, jason, it's probably true. >> it probably is. look, he is someone who has done really, really well because he is seen as anti-establishment, that folks are out to get him and he's obviously going to play into that. the question is, can someone else move ahead would want alienating the trump supporters.

larry hogan would not be able to do that, and a lot of the folks who are contemplating running including mike pompeo, they will be seen as sellouts to this administration. and ron desantis, i think, is playing in the really, really, really well where he's not going after donald trump very much, kind of not even mentioning him at all and focusing on his record in florida. i think that has, for him, that's going to be a very, very strong strategy. shannon: interesting that marquette university had a poll of people who describe as gop or negotiation -- gop-leaning independents, 70% of that group still had a favorable view of president trump, but when they went head to head, they had desantis at 64% and trump at 36%. juan? >> i think jason's right, i mean, what former president trump is doing is making desantis into the establishment republican candidate. and i think back to '16 and the races there, and what i see is that nobody figured out how to counter trump's very personal

mocking, belittling attacks and his kind of popular culture place in politics, you know? low energy jeb, little marco, lying -- go on and on, right? nobody figureded out how to the the counterpunch. desantis is not mentioning trump. it's as if he's just saying, you know what? i'm counting on something else to take you out of the race. he could actually come at trump from the right. and when i say that, he could go after him on failing your to win elections, you know? [laughter] he could go on failure to deal with covid, failure to deal with immigration. you could say look at florida on covid, look at florida on immigration, i'm farther to the right than you. but he hasn't cone it. he's on this book tour, but it looks like he thinks he's pretending to run but not willing to say it because he doesn't want to alienate the trump base. shannon: well, and potentially they've got to fix this potential issue down in florida this legislative session that there may be a state law that would bar him from running for federal office -- >> well, it wouldn't bar him, it

would require him to resign -- shannon: right. can't do both at the same time. >> i don't mean to disagree with my friend juan -- shannon: what? what? [laughter] last night in dallas, huge crowd. night before that, both houston and dallas the republican party fundraisers are the biggest ones in history both in collars and people. he is out -- dollars and people. he is selling his vision of what florida freedom means, and that's a very important step to the lay out his case. and you cothings in a campaign -- do things in a campaign building upon things, and he is doing the very important work of giving people a lot of things to understand that he's to cone in florida, and that's an important part of a winning strategy. you don't need to come out of the box throwing haymakers at donald trump, but he is very effectively counterpunched. when trump the came after him saying you shut down florida prethat maturely, i'll take my record existence opening up

florida against your record of shutting down america and did so in a passion that the i fought -- >> that's what i think he has to do more of, but he's avoiding people like shannon bream. he's not doing media, and he had a big slip-up on ukraine. shannon: he is doing -- [inaudible] >> by not saying i 100% -- shannon: by the way -- [inaudible conversations] juan williams announcing this morn,. >> there you go. shannon: by the way, open invitation, governor desantis the, come on down. >> no, all i'm going to say, desantis is taking these arguments to the early states. and what we know from our reporting is that there are a lot of iowa republicans who are interested in an alternative to trump who have not made up their minds. those early states end to really kind of keep their options open, so that's the play he's making right now, trying to tell the story of -- shannon: well, and we don't even know, jason, if president biden is going to run again. we've always assumed he would, but there are questions now.

>> it is, but the public obviously knows that if desantis is going to do this and be successful, he's going to have to go after trump, he's going to have to defeat him and do it in a way that is still polite to the an extent. but he understands there's a threat here, and right now he's focused on the substance of his record instead the of being drawn into a battle with donald trump which is a lose-lose for him. because, again, it will alienate the base. and just being at k pac and speaking to these people -- cpac, they are very open to ron desantis. they're fans of donald trump, and they are his concern their first choice. however, if it doesn't go that way and he ends up not advancing, you coneed someone who's going to be the able to keep the party together, and with all due respect to larry hogan, while his argument is a valid one where you don't want to break everyone apart, he wasn't going to be that candidate. shannon: i want to make sure that we mention the train derailment in ohio because there was another one this weekend, not to the extent and reportedly not carrying hazmat materials. but we're a month into this now,

and the daily beast is calling out president biden on this. they say biden's befuddled response to the ohio train disaster is unacceptable. showing up is an important part of leadership. biden should know that by now. failing to show up many in east palestine was a crucial mistake, and biden's opponents have seized on it and used it to say you don't care about rural white people. he says he's going at some point. juan, should he be there? >> yeah. , look, what's important is taking care of people in the midst of a crisis, and i think everyone agrees including governor mike dewine, the republican governor and republican members of congress, that the epa's been on the ground from day one. the people who are, you know, in charge of, like, you know, health controls and helping people who might have health consequences from the spill have been there from day one. the transportation d. has been there. so it seems to me there's a certain performative aspect of in that's being requested by biden's critic.

but to me, it's about taking care of those people. and i just think that so far based on what, you know, the opposing party has to say, the administration has been doing its job to force norfolk southern to take full responsibility and promise full compensation to those people. >> they don't feel like they're being taken care of. shannon: right. perception for people is realit- >> absolutely. hook, at the end of the day if focus are still showing up to their homes and saying i'm sick, my kids are sick and then you have the epa coming out and acing, oh, no, everything is fine, the president won't show up, you're just not feeling confident in the administration. and there are significant health and political implications to avoiding this particular demographic when you're deciding whether or not you're going to run for are re-election. >> well, you don't want to interfere -- >> what would be the interference to show up -- >> as someone who's painfully been through this process with a thing called katrina, the president, president biden needs to have been there long before one month after the event. >> yeah.

>> yeah, the president, a president fills an empathetic role, and the president of the united states needs go to this place. he should have been there within a matter of days, not a matter of months, and he's going to suffer from this, and it is going to leave a bad taste in the middle part of the country and a belief that he is, you know, more inclined to fly off to eve kyiv than he is to -- kyiv than to east palestine. shannon: panel, don't go anywhere because president biden has sparked outrage in his own party after backing down on an issue a lot of democrats support. one lawmaker reportedly calling the president's move, quote, amateur hour. and there's new momentum in the push to end daylight saving time. we'll explain, be right back

>> when rioters descended at the homes of six supreme court

justices night after night after night, you did nothing. the department did nothing. shannon: republican senator ted cruz blasting attorney general merrick garland over protests outside the homes of supreme court justices. we are back now with our panel and, catherine, he took a lot of incoming in the hearing this week, but he stood there and look the it. >> yeah, he took it. he pushed back. he defended the department, said it's not politicized. and specifically on safety to supreme court justice, he said they had sent u.s. marshals to the their homes, he had not done nothing. but it was certainly a fiery hearing. shannon: it was. i want to play a little bit more of this because with senator mike lee, republican of utah, was pressing him on arrests of pro-life protesters versus people who have attacksed pro-life pregnancy centers. >> there are many more prosecutions with respect to the

blacking -- blocking of the abortion centers, but that is generally because they are, those actions are taken with photography at the time during the daylight. those who are attacking the pregnancy resource centers, which is a horrid thing to do, are doing this at night in the dark. shannon: jason, you're shaking your head. >> we can't really coinvestigations because it's dark outside? sive seen -- i've seen the surveillance footage from washington state where a number of these lower occasions have been targeted. there is a difference between -- it is fair to say that we're doing a lot of stuff behind the scenes. that's how investigations work. however, when there are attacks or vandalism or threats towards entities or people that happen to be progressive or liberal, there is a very loud push vocally to say we're going after these folks, that that we're actually going to make sure that we make these arrests, and yet there was a lot of silence when

service the conservatives or those who were perceived as conservatives being the target. so, again, it's very similar to east palestine where if you don't feel like your concerns are being herald, you start to -- heard, you're earning resentment on the left. shannon: yeah. and there are these questions, the everyone to general said we're not politicized, that's not how we make decisions but, juan, there were questions about classifying catholics who actually believe catholicism as radical, whether they were some kind of threat, parents at school board meetings, you know, all kinds of things that this attorney general was confronted with, that they had to deal with the optics of. >> let me just say no evidence. there's no evidence of this accusation. by the way, he was up there for four hours, all of this happens in the last 0 the minutes. it looks like -- 20 minutes. basically, you had cruz and others wanting to create made-for-tv moments to show that they were taking on the attorney the general better right wing.

but there's -- for the right wing. there's no evidence, and the suggestion that he goes somehow easy on left-wing extremists but hard on right-wing extremists and and is also that he plans to indict president trump. it looked like, basically, they were trying to drum up the idea that this guy is partisan and fighting for the far left are. and, you know, what is with this? if i mean, right says we are tough on crime, we love police. but when it comes to the fb eric, oh, you guys raided president trump. gee, did he do something wrong? you don't like the justice d. because the justice department has rightly said white supremacists, white -- right-wingers are the major record theist threat to this country. but somehow -- what? >> they're not. >> come on. >> there is -- [inaudible conversations] >> i'm repeating what the fbi said. >> but here's the difference. number one, the criticism is against leadership, not against the men and women in uniform -- >> [inaudible] fbi agents after the trump visit

to try to recover stolen -- >> widely celebrated by the right. >> i'm just telling you, this is a fact. >> number two, all the conversation about white supremacy, you know what we don't hear about? jane's revenge, antifa which are organizations that the left pretend do not exist. shannon: you mentioned jane's revenge, they take credit. they were online celebrating attacks on pregnancy centers and leaving their tags on the building. again, karl, get back to this idea of perception. >> yeah, look, i'm going to give attorney general the benefit of the doubt that they really are investigating, and there is a certain logic to the fact that people protesting abortion clinics generally coso publicly and in front of cameras, and people who assault pregnancy crisis centers generally do it at night because they're i cowards. i will say the though with all due respect, juan, there is ed. we know at the highest echelon at department of justice there was a soars effort to consider -- a serious effort9 to consider parents at northern

virginia who were upset about their schools as terrorists and that there were progressives providing draft can language to the department of justice. we also know that there were people inside our u.s. law enforcement agencies who are openly talking about doing do we need to target catholics because of their views? and there's a culture inside our government that is, that merrick garland ought to be concerned about if we're sitting there and having u.s. law enforcement agents saying, you know what? if you're a deeply observant catholic, you're a threat to the united states of america. >> karl, i think some of this comes from letters written to the justice department of arguments among people about, well, hour we -- >> this came -- [inaudible conversations] >> that discussion is totally legitimate, it's not evidence of bias. >> this is a report being circulated, recommendations being framed up by people inside our government that we ought to seriously investigate -- >> i think we want them discussing where the threat exists, and i don't think it has to do -- >> -- a deeply observant catholic is not a person who represents a threat, and that's

what they were talking about. shannon: all right. let's take it down to this which is concern the. [laughter] off of that, should we keep changing our clocks? senator rubio offering up this measure again. he says, quote: the ritual of changing time twice a year is -- [inaudible] catherine? >> i'm not, i think there's lots of views on both sides of this, and that's part of the reason this hasn't actually advanced all the way yet. it didn't advance in the house, there's some people who think there should be more daytime in the morning, some think more in the evening for businesses to stay open. i think this debate keeps going. shannon: so the hill spells this out, the sun typically rises around 7:15 is in the morning, sets at 4:30 p.m. in new york city. it would change sun vise to 8:15 and sunset to 5:30 p.m. i'm for that but, jason, you say it should be dark at night -- >> no. shannon: are you a farmer? >> i'm not -- [laughter] but i do live in seattle, at

10:30 at night on summer it's still bright outside, and it's kind of creepy. it's hard to sleep. look, at the end of the day, the argument is all about safety and health, right? i would argue that we should probably be more in line with our actual body which which when it's dark, we're supposed to go to sleep are. when it's light, we're supposed to wake up. and i think, ultimately, that will make all of us healthier. shannon: senator rantsz is vote toking no --. keyes council has changed the criminal laws here, it was going to lessen penalties for some things. there was a big backlash on this. house and senate have a right over this federal district to say we're not going to do that. they've overturned this. the president says he he won't veto it and, frankly, karl, democrats are mad. they say the president -- this proves that d.c. needs statehood. >> yeah, well, he's saving them from themselves. it would do away with mandatory minimum sentences for many violent crimes, it would elevate low rank aring crimes to have jury trials which would

discourage people are from being charged, and then it would reduce the penalties for burglary, carjacking, robbery and some others. the president of the united states is doing his party a favor by keeping the, you know, soft on crime label being able to be slapped on them with ease as it would be if the democrats opposed this. >> so i think in reality republicans are trying to put biten and -- biden and democrats many in a box. and as karl said, i think the president avoided the trap. by the way, i'm a d.c. resident. i think this is a bad bill, the president kid the right. >> good for you. shannon: a moment of "kumbaya." [laughter] thank you, panel. see you next sunday. up next, a prominent religious voice found herself caught in the middle of a political firestorm. we're on that next

why do vitamins and supplements cost so much more now? other companies are charging you more and more for less and less. and we hate that! that's why force factor has partnered with walmart to provide amazing supplements at great prices for all americans. force factor products use clinically studied patented ingredients to powerfully improve your health. they're also delicious, easy to use and affordable. that's why force factor is now the number one best selling herbs and supplements brand at walmart. rush to walmart and unleash your potential with force factor.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ quick she spent decades at a prominent bible scholar and teacher and her new book beth moore is incredibly transparent about everything from childhood abuse she suffered to finding herself in the middle of a political firestorm that turned her life upside down.

she is my guest this week on living the dream podcast it is freshly out this morning. you can download it right now and he reelected her podcast but that is it for today but thank you for joining us. i am shannon bream have a great week, we will see you next "fox news sunday"