♪ ♪ howard: at first it seemed like it would happen any moment, and then like it would never happen. and then, the manhattan district attorney's office leaked first to the new york times, of course, that the grand jury had indicted donald trump. we don't know what's in there. number one, he is presumed innocent like anyone else, the arraignment set for tuesday. number two, even some liberals argue that the stormy daniels probe was a weak case rooted in a business records violation following hush money to a porn star and should not be brought

as the first prosecution and perhaps not at all. number three, trump's republican poll numbers have gone up as his most ardent supporters have rallied around him. trump's reaction on truth social is to blame d.a. alvin bragg's case on thugs and radical left monsters and accuse bragg of doing joe biden's dirty work. this is an attack on our country the likes of which has never been seen before. the u.s. is now a third world nation, a nation in serious decline, so sad. as for all the saturation coverage, the stark reality doesn't fully hit you untilst the happened, a former president of the united states has been indicted. i'm howard kurtz and this is "mediabuzz." ♪ ♪ howard: ahead, alaner the can, wits on why he believes all four investigations of donald trump are unfair. the new york indictment caused a media eruption that quickly broke down along partisan lines.

>> democrats are branding trump as a criminal. along with the 74 million people who voted for him. they think the mug shot will scare you. they're wrong. >> this is somebody who has spent more than four decades trying to avoid being arrested or being indicted, and so this is a really scary moment for him despite whatever he says. >> alvin bragg is no different from many of the host, of course, on msnbc. for them it's get trump and go home. >> he's been scary the whole time. >> you have to raise your hand and say, stop, because this is too great an assault on our system. much greater than january 6th, that's for sure. >> donald trump has spent his lifing being able to lie, being able to live in his own reality, being able to tell people whatever he wants, and now he's going into an area where that, there are real consequences for that. howard: joining us now to analyze the coverage if in nashville, clay travis, the founder of outkick, cohost of a

syndicated radio host with buck sexton, and a fox news contributor. and here in washington, lou sis caldwell, political strategist and foreman republican. clay, whether you like the stormy daniels case or not, and i've been highly critical of it, does the unprecedented nature of this indictment warrant all the wall to wall coverage? >> look, i think it does warrant wall to wall coverage because we're 240 years as a republic, and we've never had a president, a presidential candidate or a former president ever indicted for a felony such as this appears to be. so i think wall to wall with coverage is justified. i'd also point out i think one of the great legacies of trump has been actually that he destroyed cnn in particular and maybe msnbc ooh. but they need the sugar high of trump. if you look at the rating, i believe cnn's numbers were up over 100% compared to what they typically have been. they just hit a 30-year low in

prime time, cnn did, and they desperately need trump -- howard: so they're happy to have him back on center stage. >> the derangement syndrome is the foundation in many ways of their network. and so this is what they have to have. but i also think numbers reflect that people care and that you should be covering it. howard: yeah. i guess i agree with that. lucy, are the media addicted to the trump show? and isn't the former president driving a lot of the daily coverage with his constant attacks such as against degenerate psychopath alvin bragg? >> well, of course, donald trump is driving a lot of this coverage. donald trump is how we began talking about this indictment a few weeks ago, it was donald trump himself who let us all know that he expected to be indicted imminently. it was donald trump himself who made quick work and and republican colleagues of his of fund raising off of this -- howard: by the way, axios reporting that trump has raised more than $5 million since this -- >> yeah, absolutely. in terms of the setup between donald trump and alvin bragg, it

has components of it that the i think really show a media landscape that is a little more nuanced than people might like to believe. i've been really interested this week in the fact that a lot of the coverage around this, the questionableness of this case, whether or not this case had legs, is coming from what people might call liberal, mainstream sources, right? saying this is a bad test case. this is, this is not going to be the best moment for the left. howard: everybody shows pictures of stormy daniels. clay, the trump team's argument is that this opens a new era of divisiveness ask that some are republicans will retaliate by launching unfounded prosecutions against chem captains. but that's basically a prediction of a dark future. >> i think they're right. look, this is across the -- a cross the rubicon moment, in my opinion. again, 240 years, this hasn't happened. at some point in time, there will be a prosecutor -- remember, it's intensely

political because these prosecutors in many big cities and all over the country are elected, so they're directly tied to the political process. alvin bragg ran on idea that he was going to get trump, and now he is delivering to his constituency from a purely political perspective. i think this is a huge win for alvin bragg with. maybe he's going to run for governor going forward. he has made himself into a bona fide if candidate in a major way, certainly for statewide office in new york. but as you mentioned, i also think it's an incredible boon to donald trump in the republican primary because many people are going to rally around trump. so if you rook at this purely from politics and don't consider the awfulness of what i believe is a new precedent being set that will make our politics even more divisive, it makes sense for alvin bragg as the d. a. of new york politically, and it makes sense for donald trump as the republican presidential candidate. they both win when it comes to their respective constituencies based on this case being filed. howard: they should be

high-fiving each over. [laughter] i guess i would say usually a politician being quieted in the middle of -- indictedded in the middle of a campaign, not the best strategy. lucy, as a former republican, hasn't the country been bitterly divided since donald trump came down the escalator in 2015, and are the media plague it up, perhaps -- playing it up perhaps for if ratings? >> of course, they're stoking the divisiveness. there's no question. and the fact that, you know, we've seen in the trump era just the further siloing of where americans get their news, right? people could be next door neighbors and living in completely different environments and realities, right? we've lost as a country the sense of a common set of facts, right? that said, i think that in this particular case you can hold in your mind, i just want to sort of take issue with clay's characterization that this is setting a precedent. you can hold in your mind that this is both discome discomfit -- discomfiting to the think of a prosecutor being

overly politicized and a prosecutor running on the promise of prosecuting a former president. of course, that should make people nervous. but also that donald trump himself is a very unique animal and that what we're seeing with donald trump is not necessarily precedent-setting because he himself is such an outlier as a political figure. howard: clay, do you want to return serve here? >> yeah, look, this is me putting on my lawyer hat a little bit here. you show me the person, i'll show you crime. any politician the, joe biden got accused of sexual assault by a after ther, his son, the laptop that hunter biden still has not been charged for probably has 20 or 30 different felonies that could be justified based on that laptop the alone. certainly, you look at hillary clinton and her history, i mean, she just paid a fine out associated with the steele dossier, is my understanding. there's any number of things she could have been charged for a crime with. bill clinton actually had, you know, whatever you want to call it, sexual dalliance with an intern in the oval office and

agreed to sign off to give up his law degree on his final day in the presidency. just those last several presidents. maybe you can say obama didn't necessarily have anything or george w. bush, those guys end thed to be, i think, a little bit cleaner, but by and large, i think it's virtually the case that you could charge any major political candidate with a crime. now that d.a.s are incentivized to do it and see that there is a political value to them, i think it's going to the happen down in atlanta. i'm not sure what the department of justice -- howard: right. >> but certainly, there's a republican d.a. out there now who's saying my pathway to political prominence runs through the biden white house, kamala harris or whoever is going to be the next prominent political candidate running for president or any other office. and i would suspect that there will be many more of these in the next generation. howard: yeah. it does make you wonder about whether we're headed toward an era of retaliation as happened with certain impeachments. and, by the way, every five

minutes or ten minutes on tv i see the 36,000 nypd officers are going to have to show up on use the when donald trump will be arraigned. i'm sure he'll come in the back door and there's not going to be a big spectacle. i think the tv or the media might be generally sort of hyping fears about violence. the more we talk about it, the more i think we contribute to it. lucy, many of the pundit debates are asking this question, is this a test for democracy? can trump get a fair trial in new york? the mere fact that a former president has been indicted, is that right question? it is, as clay pointed out, we've never been down this road before. >> yeah, it's a worthy question to the ask. i think we have to keep the perspective a we actually even as of this moment, we do not know what the charges are. this indictment is still sealed. howard: yeah. >> we are all speculating, and part of the problem with the 4 the-hour news cycle -- 24-hour news cycle is we learn about this on thursday afternoon, we're going to learn more on tuesday, that that's five days for a lot of speculation.

howard: right. >> in terms of whether this is a good test the of democracy, i'm not sure. the less sexy part of this story is there are all these downwind effects of how the case does or doesn't play out. and of course remember, this is just an indictment. this is not a conviction, right, and a lot of people including people on the left believe these charges will not stick. howard: right. and, in fact, if donald trump is acquitted, then it won't look so good for alvin bragg and probably makes trump even more popular. let me play a sound bite from a woman whose name is toss thed around a lot, stormy daniels, talking to the times of london. >> the first time i was, like, gold killer, slut, whore, you know, liar, whatever. and this timest the, like, i'm going to murder you. >> are you frightened? >> for the first time ever, yeah. howard: clay, i've got about half a minute. the press has kind of treated her as a foot note, but it sounds like she's worried because she's gotten a lot of death threats. >> yeah, look, she got $130,000 and never had to open her mouth

and violated the fnda -- howard: and has made a lot of money off this since then. >> yeah. she's put herself into the central part of this story. i think it's awful anytime there's claims of violence or threats, but i don't think you can be surprised that given the temperature in the country right now and given this particular situation, that things like this would arise. howard: do you agree with that. >> >> yeah. i mean, if you don't want to take the ride, don't take the ride. that's the reality. howard: take the money and keep your mouth shut. when we come back, the sometimes-ugly debate over the nashville school shooting, and alan dershowitz is on deck. ♪ my most important kitchen tool? my brain. so i choose neuriva plus. unlike some others, neuriva plus is a multitasker supporting 6 key indicators

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howe we were all heart broken, we're all sick of it, another care, another mass shooting except the one in nashville involved deaths of three

children under 10 along with three school staff members. the blame game would begin, the shooter, who's believed to be trans, how did she legally buy five guns whiling being treated by a. >> the for a disorder? the media finger-pointing has grown pretty intense. >> the radical trans group the trans-resistance network, is already coming to the nashville shooter' december fence. to the -- defense. sympathizing with the child kill e almost justifying the mass murder. >> why can't you have a rational conversation with a republican about maybe everyone only needs one gun, not seven? maybe if you're motionally kiss you should thed, you get one, not seven. >> a lot of republicans say there's nothing that politics can do about this. >> the dishonest media mob, they also rushed to politicize shooting. now in a headline reuters, they referred to the shooter as a, quote, former christian school student.

"the new york times" all but a apologized for, quote, misgenderring the killer. howard: clay, it seems like in the wake of this horrible tragedy in your city that we're having the debate again about guns even though you know, i know, all journalists and politicians know the congress isn't going to do anything on guns. >> that's true. but i think also this is something deeper, how'd. and -- howard. and, look, this is my hometown, so this strikes close to me. of i've got a ninth grader, a sixth grader, a second grader, all three in different schools close in proximity, to my heart aches for the family and loved ones. but this is intensely political because every time there is a shooter and particularly anytime there is a white male shooter, we hear from merrick garland, and we hear from joe biden that domestic extremist the -- extremism is the single greatest threat this nation faces, that right-wing donald trump zealots are committing murders at horrible rates. and they have politicized to

such an extent that whens a trans shooter, they try and run from the reality. now, i don't like to share the names of any shooter because i think -- howard: yeah, i'm with you on that. >> i'd encourage anybody out there that makes shootings more likely, but it is important to note the motives here. and i think it's significant that joe biden, who usually hops on a plane anytime a event justifies the left-wing narrative that he wants to spread, we're almost a week since shooting, he hasn't come to nashville, he hasn't sent anybody from his administration to come here and console the community and speak out against the violence that may well be coming from the trans community. and i'll also point out that we still haven't seen man fess toe. howard: yeah. >> usually when there is a manifesto and it is something that makes a right-winger look bad, boy, it sure steams to hit the news -- seems to hit the news wires almost immediately. we don't know what this shooter said, and until we co, in that absence of the release of this manifesto, it allows all sorts

of negative i felt, i think, to continue -- negativity to fester around what is a truly awful story. howard: jill biden, it should be noted, did go the nashville. and the value of being treat for an emotional disorder, apparently tennessee doesn't have any of these red flag laws. it just drives me cra crazy. what do you think can about clay's point that the left wing jumps on this politically? >> well, i don't concern i guess we need to expand readings lists because i do the 23409 feel like the coverage of school shootings or mass shootings in general typically stresses that these shooters are, like, maga, maga supporters, right? in fact, there has been coverage of shootings in recent years like the shooting of the members of congress who were at a softball practice years ago in virginia where it was quite clear that the person who committed that act was -- howard: a liberal. >> yeah, and that was covered. so i don't think that is actually consistent with the media narrative that i see. i do think one of the things

that's sod about any -- so odd about any concern over whether or not we should spend more or less time on whether the shooter was supposedly transgender is that the blur of anecdote is noa transgender person committed a shooting in nashville does not take away from the other amounts of data that we do have about these typically being committed by young, white men in many cases. so if a part of this is about creating the right context. howard: right -- >> hold on a sec. she just said white men usually commit the shootings. that's not true if you break it down on a per capita statistical basis. most mass shooters are not white men. that is the story that is out there. most white shooters are not donald trump supporters. that is the story that is out there. and when does a trans shooter -- i think this is important, this is a religious elementary school. so i don't think it's crazy when there is a manifesto out there for people to say, wait a minute, was religion involved in

this attack the, was this potentially motivated by the trans ideology of shooter? these are questions that immediately get raised. joe biden would have been on the ground along with merrick garland in 12 the hours if there was a manifesto out there and somebody said they were shooting up a nashville elementary school because they were donald trump supporters and they believe the 2020 election had been stolen. howard: [inaudible] >> they would have been here in a heartbeat. it would have been the number one story for months. but this story is vanishing to a large extent, and there's a report that cbs news has even told their staff you can't even mention that this is a trans shooter -- howard: got it, got it, let me -- >> [inaudible] howard: unfortunately, these shootings cofade from the news after two or three days. washington post says a new wave of anti-trans activity connecting them to violence, is that true or is it just the post coming at this from the left?

>> well, just as you don't like to name shooters, i don't like to say the names of irrelevant, sort of dead on arrival presidential candidates, but one such republican presidential candidate really thought he was going to have his breakout moment this week on this network and in other conservative channels by saying that this is all about fact that the shooter was trans and that this is -- we must unlock this. i think, of course, this is going to become part of the backdrop of the culture wars. but i don't think -- all of these shootings end up fading. all of this concern over christian, transgender, this is just identity politics playing out in the media. howard: right. unfortunately, you know, everybody in the media wrestles with this, it's become so common that you cover it for two weeks or three days. good conversation. thanks so much for joining us. up next, the irs pays a strange visit to journalistist

matt taibbi's house, and the judge sends that given onlawsuit against fox to trial. concern dominion lawsuit existence pox to trial. ♪ when you're a small-business owner, your to-do list can be... a lot. ♪ [ buttons clicking ] that's why progressive makes it easy to save with a commercial auto quote online, so you can take on all your other to-dos. already did. see if you could save at progressivecommercial.com.

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don't hesitate. ask your doctor about otezla today. ♪ howard: a delaware judge ruled friday that the dominion voting systems lawsuit against fox should proceed to trial in mid april, a decision that was not unexpected. but the ruling in the $1.6 billion suit favored chin onin key respects -- dominion in key respects. the case is and always has been about the first amendment protections of the media's absolutely right no cover the news. fox will continue to fiercely advocate for the rights of free speech and free press as we move into the next phase of these proceedings. dominion's statement said we are great gratified by the court's thorough ruling. fox has contended that reporting on false claims of 2020 election fraud by donald trump and his allies did not amount to

endorsing those claims. judge eric davis writing: there is no genuine issue about the false ifty the of some statements aired by fox if hosts and guests representing trump. he said the evidence was crystal clear that none of the statements relating to chin onabout the 2020 the concern dominion about the 2020 the election are true. such anchors as bret baier had said many internal messages or depositions that today did not believe the election fraud claims. judge davis also granted summary judgment to dominion on whether fox news had aired or published 20 false and derogatory statements, yet he denied summary judgment on whether fox corp., the parent company and was responsible for these falsehoods. but the judge said there was no clear and convincing evidence that there was actual malice. such mall plus or reckless disregard for the truth is a high legal standard that makes it much harder to prove defamation. davis would not grant summary

judgment on this point and said it would be up to the jury as would be the question of damages if any are awarded. bottom line in this 130-page ruling, fox had a difficult day in the courtroom. matt taibbi, who's done most work digging through elon musk's twitter files, testified before a house committee last month. and on the very same day, an irs agent a paid a visit to his new jersey home. you might call it a strange coincidence, but i'm not buying it. why would an irs agent show up in person? agent left a note telling taibbi to call the irs. when he did, he was told his 2018 and 20 the 20 the returns had been rejected but why not send that in an envelope or e-mail? taibbi gave the house weaponization of government committee documents showing his 2018 return had been electron create accepted -- closing bell terrorically accepted concern clerk terrorically accepted. congressman jim jordan has

demanded a response from the irs and so far has notten go -- gotten no response. ♪ i was born on the south side of chicago. it has been a long road, but now i'm working for schwab. i love to help people understand the world through their lens and invest accordingly. you can call us christmas eve at four o'clock in the morning. we're gonna always make sure that you have all of the financial tools and support to secure your financial future. that means a lot for my community and for every community. every piece of land has a story - written by those who work it. like the caggianos, who are brewing their own legacy. or the wrens, with their drama free plot - tranquil and serene. the upshaws? they diy, all the time.

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howard: what are we to make of the manhattan d.a. bringing criminal charges against donald trump in the stormy daniels case and other informses as well? -- investigations as well? joining us now, alaner the, wits, author of "get trump." 9 -- now, alan, i know you've been slamming alvin bragg and his stormy daniels case with the caveat that the indictment is sealed, we haven't seen all of what he has. how much of it has to do with the credibility of michael cohen, trump's former lawyer,ing with the key witness in. >> well, everything has to do with it. it turns out that michael cohen was the central witness in front of the grand jury.

bragg tried hard to to prevent michael cohen's former lawyer from testifying in front of the grand jury. he didn't call him, didn't give the e-mails. basically, costello burst into the grand jury and insisted on being heard. and i think it's unethical for a prosecutor to use a witness who has such a long history of lying. and, by the way, the history hasn't stopped. he tweeted other day a malicious lie about me. he didn't like the fact that i had called him a liar, which is true, and so he said i was associated with jeffrey epstein, underage girls on the island, all of that stuff. so he's continuing to lie. it's not as if god came down to him and said, you know, we know you lied to everybody, your own lawyers, the feds, the state, now please we know you're going to tell the truth. he's still lying -- "happening now" but isn't it true the, let me jump in, isn't it true that every day there are criminal trials where some corrupt figure, maybe mobsters who have lied to authorities, say, yeah,

i lied then, but i'm telling the truth now, and the jury hashes out whether to believe them? >> yeah, that happens all the time. it happens all the time that there are acquittals and hung juries when that kind of testimony is given. but when you combine the credibility issues with the lack of legal theory here, i mean, basically bragg's legal theory is when a person pays hush money to prevent his wife, his business associates, his voters from knowing about an adulterous affair, he has to then list specifically on his public corporate forms the pact that he paid the money -- the fact that he paid the money to prevent the fact of adulterous relations to come out. never mt. history of america has anybody ever paying for an nda done that, and never in the history of america has anybody ever been indicted for not doing that. howard: right. >> i don't think any right-thinking person will tell you that this indictment would have occurred but for the fact that the man's name is donald trump. not that he's a past president, but that he is a potentially future president running

existence the head of the party -- against the head of the party, the democrats, and these people got elected, both letitia james and bragg, on the promise of get trump. i didn't invent the title of this this book. i'm not that creative. [laughter] the title comes from the campaign pledgings of these two d.a.s. and that's what's wrong with this case where you combine the legal failings with the issue of credibility, you're really getting, you're really getting nowhere. and the other thing is, you know, it's very likely the reason we know about this indictment, how can we know about it? it hasn't been made -- hadn't been made public -- howard: right. >> -- is because somebody either in the d.a.'s office or on the grand jury probably leaked this which is a more serious felony than anything that donald trump has been charged with. howard: oh, absolutely. >> as far as i know, there's been no investigations of the leak. howard: since you held up "get trump," first of all, i agree that the stormy daniels case is

weak and relatively unimportant. but you also say in your book that the other investigations, the one about vote tampering or pressure in georgia and doj classified dock units as well as his role on january 6th, they're all cases that are unfair to the former president. how is it that every single one doesn't pass the alan dershowitz law school legal test? >> well, it's not the alan dershowitz test, it's the justice robert jackson test. it's the that prosecutors should not be rummaging through statute books to try to find something against somebody when who's designated as a target. in my book "get trump," which, by the way, for two weeks was a number one, number two bestseller on amazon but is not available in incompetent bookstore is it's. independent bookstores don't like a book entitled "get trump. " we always hear we should buy independent. for years i did, but now i realize independent bookstores

are also censoring books that they don't like. so i'm no longer buying in independent bookstores. i'm buying at amazon and barnes & noble. howard: got it. >> but, you know, the issue of the four cases, any first-year student, law student, should win three of them. let's go over them one, two, three. georgia case, president says on a tape i need to find, find 13,000 votes. find mes they're there, they're to be -- means they're there, they're to be found. he didn't say invent, concoct, he said find them. you cannot make that the basis of a prosecution. in the d.c. case, he said -- although january 6th committee doctored the tape to leave it out concern he said i want you to go ott capitol and demonstrate peacefully and patriotically. you can't have a prosecution consistent with the first amendment when that speech is made. the third one is a serious one, and that is florida. he's guilty, i believe, almost certainly guilty in florida.

but so is biden under that theory, and so was pence. howard: do you mean georgia? >> no, i mean florida. howard: okay. >> the confidential material. howard: right. >> i think politically that case can't go anywhere because the american public is going to ask -- howard: oh, i see, classified documents. >> how do you selectively prosecute? but the weakest of the four cases is bragg in new york. howard: okay. so in the time we have left, you, of course, were a lawyer for donald trump in the first impeachment. >> that's right. howard: politically speaking, you're a liberal guy. do you want to see donald trump the lose the next election? >> i co. i do. and i don't want to see bragg help him win the election. i think that it's an interesting dynamic going on, i write about this in my book as well, the political implications of this this. the dynamic is that many democrats want to see trump win the nomination because they think they can beat him. and many right-wing republicans want to see him win the

nomination. so there is a kind of spirited effort to get him to be nominated. donald trump call me the other day to thank me about the book and say he was going to endorse it, he wants everybody to read it. he also said i think you really do vote for me, you just say you don't. and he said what advice do you have for he? i said, i think you should buy an interest in a t-shirt company that specializes in putting mug shots on the t-shirt. it will be the best selling mug shot in the country. howard: all right, well, thank you -- >> and he laughed and thanked me. howard: thank you for that conversation, alan dershowitz. we appreciate your insights. >> thank you. howard: after the break, with even his republican rivals backing him, how does the trump indictment impact the 204 the campaign? ♪ ♪ can help your business get a payroll tax refund, even if you got ppp and it only takes eight minutes to qualify. i went on their website, uploaded everything, and i was blown away

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howard: while we were on the air, the trump campaign notified journalists that he will be speak, the former president will speak from mar-a-lago tuesday night after being arraigned in new york. donald trump east indictment has shaken up the 2024 race, and yet the republicans who are running or gearing up to run existence him are rallying behind the former president. >> i think the unprecedented indictment of the former president of the united states for campaign finance issue is an outrage. howard: ron desantis tweeted: florida will not assist in an extradition request given the questionable circumstances. trump's likely general election opponent isn't touching the

story. >> reporter: mr. president, do you think that the charges against trump are politically motivated? if. >> i have no comment on trump. [inaudible conversations] howard: joining us now from utah, jason chaffetz, former republican congressman and fox news contributor. and here on set, griff jenkins, fox news anchor and correspondent. jason, is this indictment helping donald trump at least among republicans each as it gets savage in the press? >> immediately, yes, i i think everyone's rallying behind president. they see it's a selective prosecution. they don't go after biden's, they don't go after clintons, anybody on the democratic machine, but hay seem to be picking on the guy. it's a story that republicans have heard for, i don't know, seven years now? but to actually do it on such a tiki, tacky hinge that nobody else is being prosecuted on just infuriates people. howard: i've heard a lot of descriptions, ticky tacky is a

new one. give, ron desantis going down, i've been advised he should punch back but not much of that. is the press overlooking the fact that a criminal case may not help trump in the long run? >> well, that's the million dollar question. howard: yeah. >> and, by the way, i can give you 5 million reasons why the indictment helped trump, $5 million dollars in fund raising. and, of course, that poll where you've got trump up by 11 points increase and desantis down 4 buzz was cone before the indictment. so i reached out to the trump team, they tell me their internal polling which, ache with a grain of salt a because they did it for themselves, but they say they polled after the indictment and they say a 13-point advantage that said general election voters would be more likely to vote for him because of of the indictment, not less likely. howard: that's fascinating. jason, trump's been beating up on alvin bragg for months, and now he's ripping the judge assigned to the case saying judge hates him. and then there was his truth

social post about how an indictment could potentially lead to death and destruction. here's what he told sean hannity. >> i didn't say death and construction. i said i'm afraid. these are people that said you can't do this prosecution, it will cause tremendous problems. howard: what trump actually said was it's known by all that no crime has been committed and also known that potential and destruction in such a false charge could be catastrophic for our country. does that worry you at all? >> look, donald trump is always going to take the nonconventional way of doing things. he's going to defend himself. he's not going to just sit back and take it and let some other attorney go out and talk. i'm sure every attorney would a vise their client, just don't say anything, but that's not donald trump, and that's why america loves the guy, is that he will go right into the face of whatever's coming after him and get back in their grill and tell 'em exactly what he thinks. howard: griff, doesn't this put

trump's republican rivals and just this morning former arkansas governor asa hutchinson said he's getting in the race which might mean a lot of people splitting the anti-trump vote, doesn't it put them in an impossible position because they have to, they think, defend him on this particular indictment? and yet he's sucking up all the media oxygen, and the only question people ask is, well, what do you think about the trump indictment? >> absolutely. and, look, chaos is donald trump's currency. that's how he got elected, he's going to get the nomination existence those the rivals because of of that. look, all the other candidates are just a side player because all the attention's on him. and here on capitol hill you've got jordan on the judiciary committee, comer on oversight also trying to crag alvin bragg here here to testify. at the end of the day, look, we will know what the charges are and what the evidence is on tuesday, and that'll tell us a lot about really how successful he'll be in maintaining that -- howard: right.

unfortunately, we have a lot of coverage when we haven't seen what additional charges there might be, but we will know tuesday, as you said. i understand, jason, a lot of people like trump's sort of punch in the nose style, they liked that as president. but couldn't some republicans in the long run react by saying there is so much cast around him maybe go with somebody who's not fighting criminal charges? >> oh, yeah, there's a portion of the population that does not like the tornado. but at this point i think what people looking at is stop the picking on the guy, you know? if we want to debate issues and we want to actually get out there and talk about policies, how the, how much better the trump years were than the years of biden, then let's have that discussion. but i think it is, i think it's bait in many ways by what the democrats are doing or at least what alvin bragg is doing. i think they want an overreaction by the so-called maga republicans to do something, lash out, do something violently. howard: right.

>> i don't think they will, i hope they don't. howard: i hope they don't. okay, just a few seconds, chris christie told me in an interview that everything he does is about trump. he's never going to be anybody's retribution but his own. most candidates are not going at trump so hard, does that work? >> i don't think so. i mean, the game has changed, and he is the victim. you know, he's being charged with paying off a porn star, and yet he's being seen as a victim because of government prosecutorial overreach. howard: yeah. most politicians, that would probably end their campaign. trump's poll numbers go up. jason chaffetz, griff jenkins, good to see you. russian authorities detain a "wall street journal" reporter on supposed espionage charges. is he looking at a long ordeal a la brittney griner? ♪ ♪

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howard: the russians are holding an american journalist hostage, there's no other way to put it. moscow's security service has detained evan gersch cowits on what i think are go bus charges claiming he was gathering information about a secret russian military project on behalf of the u.s. the journal vehemently denies the allegations and seeks immediate release of our trusted and dedicated reporter, we sand in solidarity with evan and his family. >> this espionage charges are ridiculous. the targeting of american citizens by russian government is unacceptable. howard: joining us now, david satter, former russia correspondent for the financial times and the first foreign reporter expelled by moscow since the end of the cold war. why wouldn't the kremlin odd the do the same thing as was cone to you in 2013 and just expel again gersch cowits? is it's a different party.

>> people many russia now are afraid to do many of the things that they did as a matter of course only a year ago or a little more than a year ago before the war starteddedded. they're afraid to concern started. they're afraid to speak over the telephone the, afraid to make comments on social media, afraid even for public, you know, cushions in public with people. discussions in public with people. howard: yeah. >> and now the rules have been changed for the press as well. howard: right. so president putin regime is using these trumped-up charges of espionage to, is it a way to whack the u.s. over ukraine as tensions escalate? and if so, why? to get a bargaining chip? >> i doubt that it's directed so much at the u.s. government. i think the real target is the russian population. they want to make sure that information count circulate -- doesn't circulate that can undermine the war with effort.

they have concealed from the russian population the extent of the casualties. howard: so, therefore, the average russian thinks the war is going better from moscow's point of view than it actually is -- >> that's absolutely the case. howard: yeah. >> and they also, they fear the kind of information that could come from sources within the country. they don't want at this point russian citizens talking to western journalists. i don't know what happened, but evan gersch covisits had some conversations with russian citizens. howard: i see. st really aimed at chilling news gathering. as we saw in the 10-month imprisonment after a b.s. trial of brittney griner, the wnba star the, does russia ultimately want to trade him for some terrorist? or is this really much more about sending a chilling message

to western news organizations? i've read that some are now downsizing or perhaps if even pulling out of trying to cover russia. >> well, it's intended to send a chilling message to russian citizens as well as western news organizations. now, they may in addition, now that they have him in custody, they may seek to trade him for someone they want. in fact, as we know, there was a russian spy who was caught who had intended to infiltrate the international criminal court. we don't know his true value as a russian spy, what he knew, how badly they want to get him back. but it could be used in this respect, but i don't think that was the motive. howard: right. >> i think the motive is that this is part of the overall crackdown on any movement of information. it's a wartime measure. howard: that's a great insight from somebody who's been there. david satter, thank you very much.

with we hope the biden administration can get him back. that's it for this edition of "mediabuzz." i'm howard kurtz, subscribe to my podcast, media buzz meter, we have all kinds of fun with it, and apple itunes is a good place a another it. we're back here next sunday, 11 eastern, you know the trillion, with the only media analysis show on national it's. ♪ ♪ national television.

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wow. (vo) request a cash offer at opendoor dot com we are learning more than expected arraignment of former president trump it is just up 48 hours. his legal team arranging for him to surrender without handcuffs on tuesday in the stormy daniels hush money case with all the angles covered for you right now we are live at mar-a-lago where the former president has him playing golf this week and he will address the nation when he returns from the manhattan courthouse from maryland on tuesday night. and we are also life outside his new york city home in trump tower that is where he i