♪ if. ♪ ♪ howard: i watched in utter disbelief as the media's obsession with all things trump reached absurd new heights not for covering the first indictment of a former president, but for tracking or waiting for his every move minute by minute by minute. on the day donald trump was flying to new york, all three cable news networks had the same shot of the trump plane just sitting there on the tarmac and then a motorcade heading for the airport which was eerily

reminiscent of o.j. and that white bronco chase a back in the '90s. the plane took off and hours later landed at laguardia. what suspension, and no one was immune. >> it's what gets everybody to watch the news. they're going to cover him like a burka. they pretend he's awful, but all of those clowns need him to survive. >> we covered it like that -- [laughter] >> clowns! >> you know, it's live, it's happening, he's landing. it's a beautiful day in new york, it's the big trump plane -- howard: the next day, everything was soon. soon, the defendant to leave trump tower for lower manhattan courthouse, and there go the cars. now you know what these were about, ratings. so the media had trump where they wanted him, back on center stage. or is it the other way around? i'm howard kurtz and this is "mediabuzz."

♪ ♪ howard: we caught only brief glimpses of donald trump before and after the arraignment in the stormy daniels case. one still photographer capturing the grim image before manhattan d.a. alvin bragg spoke to reporters and the former president had his turn that night at mar-a-lago. >> no matter who you are, we cannot and will not normalize serious criminal conduct. the defendant repeatedly made false statements on new york business records. >> this fake case was brought only to interfere with the upcoming 2024 election, and it should be dropped immediate wily. immediately. >> i have nothing to hide. i'm the only one that has been telling the truth. howard: while some media liberals seemed happier with the unsealed indictment than those on the right.

some legal analysts were highly critical of the charges. >> now that trump's running again, a filthy d.a. is assassinating your right to vote. what's the crime? well, the indictment says trump made a false entry in the general ledger. lock him up! >> facts are established, they're in black and white. they're in michael cohen's sentence, he directed and coordinated hush money -- >> now to the entire class of politicians ask media figures who cheered the proceedings today, donald trump represents an existential threat. a threat to the regime that's run our country into the ground for decades, a threat to the credibility of the media that he calls out relentlessly. >> in terms of a case that's being brought against a former president, it's a little underwhelming. there's, there's not more to it. >> if donald trump had retired in 2020 the, would he will be arraigned today? of course not. this is the boldest election interference ever attempted in

this country's history. >> i'm extraordinarily distressed by this document. i think this is even weaker than i i fearedded the be -- feared it would be, and it's easily subject to being dismissed or a quick acquittal for trump. howard: joining us now to analyze the coverage, emily jashinsky and in new york, liz claman, host of "the claman countdown" on fox business week days at three eastern. emily, you have donald trump being indicted, and liberal pundits have been fantasizing about this for centuries. yet there's virtually nothing new in the indictment, a charge of false ifying business records which is a misdemeanor boot strapped to a possible potential felony violation of federal election law. are you struck by how much media criticism this case is drawing? >> it's interesting because i would say there is three buckets of media reaction. they said bragg's charges were weak, they were weaker than the ore cases that might be brought, or they're strong on their own merits. and the people in the weak camp,

not just john bolton the, andrew mccabe, slate, vox, all of these places ran pieces critical of it. and yet the new york times, all these mainstream places, cnn, still were saying that it's strong. so to have those two things together where even harsh trump critics are in the media saying these cases are weak, i think it shows there's some, let's say, legal gymnastics going on in the people in the media who insist they're strong. hogan: howard: say they, well, it's not a slam dunk. liz, michelle goldberg writes: for all the hype indictment feels antiically mackic the, count feel all that momentous. why do you think there's this sense of deflation on the left? >> well, surprisingly, you have the centrists and the center-left media looking at this in a very unusual and mostly balanced way, and i think that that should speak volumes about what even legal experts say, howie, is kind of a weak

case. you have centrist or dominant media coming out and saying one of two things. two things. number one, the indictment is weak, nothing to see here, this is six years old. there's nothing that we've seen that is more dramatic. number two, it should not have been the first foot forward when it comes to prosecuting a former president which is a huge deal. so c or nn, washington post, msnbc, they were all talking about this, and they were questioning the way, you know, howie you used the term boot strapping the way alvin bragg, the manhattan d.a. would have boot strapped this into a felony, which brings me to the what i find very interesting. you just had emily talking about "the new york times." actually today a huge portion to of its opinion page was written by ted handlesman sugarman who is a law professor from boston the university and fordham. the entitled article is historic prosecution is also a legal embarrassment. he calls it 34 half-indictments, it's more of a misdemeanor and

that a state judge could very well throw it out because it count conflate up to a felony. howard: yeah. it just cuts across the usual ideological lines. one new twist in the accompanying statement of facts by the da. a. is this $50,000 -- 150,000 payment to karen mcdougal handles through the national enfirer, as the $130,000 hush payment to stormy daniels. let's take a look at her talking about this with aperson cooper. >> did you ever think about rekindling your relationship many. >> not while he was married, no. of course i did, i had feelings for the guy, but, no, not while he was married. at that points in i'm the, i would never do that again. howard: but this is also an old story dating back to 2016. and so i think everybody thought, well, there's going to be something else in here. and clearly, there wasn't. >> and that's what we heard. that was the line on cnn and msnbc heeding up to it, there could be something in here. he has to have something more

than what we already know, and it turned out he didn't. and msnbc continued throughout the day on tuesday to just say this is nobody's above the law. they took the line straight from bragg and continued to use it despite the fact on cnn and even in the pages of the new york times you have people saying, legal experts who don't like trump saying, hey, this isn't great. howard: liz, for those not familiar with the "national enquirer"'s role, it was owned by david pecker and was involved in these payments as well as a $30,000 the payment to a trump tower doorman who claimed -- it wasn't substantiated concern that there was some out of wedlock child somewhere. so, like, michael cohen went to the jail in this part because of this case. we have seen the checks. he was reimbursed. so the isn't really a dispute about the facts, is it, as much as a media debate over whether this case is worth bringing and whether it should be the first case since every other organization is about more serious things involving the presidency. >> the which is equally as important when you talk about

what the media overcovered, what the media undercovered, howie. the media undercovered the fact that these might not be conflated to felonies, but if they're misdemeanors, misdemeanors are illegal acts that are often charged and convicted for things all the time like what former president trump has been accused of. and, you know, if you look at those i'mss of situations, the media has not covered the fact that should president trump be held to the same standards as hundreds of thousands of other people throughout the united states have been busted for, and that is misdemeanors, or is it back off, this is a former president ands it's not a felony, so the bar is lower? is. howard: right. we'll see what a jury has to say, if it gets that far. if it's not tossed out. meanwhile, i'm really struck, i just want to make one other point, and that is this: you know, all republicans who were defending trump including people running against him, nobody'ses saying, oh, there's no way that he did this. i can't imagine donald trump

doing. i mean, look, people knew who they were electing in 2016 just like in 1992 with bill clinton. now, this debate, at least in my mind, took a whole turn when donald trump posted this on truth social. republicans in congress should defund the doj and fbi until they come to their senses. the democrats have totally weaponized law enforcement in our country. now, emily, my whole adult life republicans were the party of law and order, and they said that democrats were soft on crime. so this is the really kind of turning the universe on its head. >> yeah. and he's not alone in saying concern can that's a really, in the conservative movement, conservative media, you'll hear that over and and over again now. it's definitely a pivot for the right, and it is, i think it raises an interesting question of why you see msnbc, for instance, that has typically been very critical of law enforcement over the past decade or so more now constantly coming to the defense, almost reflexively, of law enforcement. it's been such a flip-flop, like

a realignment. howard: yeah. i just think that defund the police was such a dumb slogan on the left after the murder of george floyd. trump knew exactly what he was doing, well, i've been indicted and, therefore, law enforcement's out of control. it seems, liz, you have two media camps. one of them says trump attacks law enforcement when he gets indicted and paints himself as a victim. the other camp says the real outrage -- and you've been hearing and you heard this when donald trump was president -- is the weaponization of law enforcement against republicans. it's like two parallel universes. >> oh, absolutely. [laughter] and it is fascinating because, obviously, no one should be surprised that donald trump turns things upending the universe because that's very much how he was elected back the first time around. and when you, when you focus on what's the dethe fund the police message -- defund the police message, to me, this cements his far-right base, certainly. that's exactly what they want to hear. but it puts -- and the media has covered this -- it puts the gop house and senate at odds.

the hill has a very interesting article that talks about how you've got mitch mcconnell in the senate, the leading republican, using that defund the police against democrats and saying this is the most ridiculous thing. most americans want law and order, and so when you say through donald trump's eyes let's defund a law enforcement agency, that is going to turn i off people. and, in fact,s steve doocy of fox news held a panel, i believe it was wednesday, on this the very subject. and he asked the group, and there were some diehard trump voters and others who can't like trump. he said does anybody agree with the defund the fbi? nobody raised their hand. howard: interesting. >> and, in fact, there was somebody on the panel whose child had been murdered who said, no, we uphold the police. this is a problem. jim jordan says, yeah, maybe we should look into it. howard: what about the argument, emily, you touched on this briefly, that this is going to the encourage local gop

prosecutors to bring shaky or exaggerated charges existence democratsesome in other words, we're setting. a cycle of payback? >> sadly, i think's true. what happened in tennessee this week, we had expulsion rather than censuring of legislators there -- howe black legislators who were in control of the floo- >> right. republicans could have chosen to censure them, and a lot of people in the conservative movement think it was the right decision to expel them because those the powers have been used repeatedly by the left against conservatives. so, i i think absolutely we are going to see this from republican prosecutors. howard: more and more divisiveness. and news ratings were up last week for cn m&m snbc by a third. fox sill had a greater audience than almost the other two combined, so that that goes back to what i was talking about at the top. a possible gag order and hours later the confident delivers his answer. ♪ ounded. take your lawn back

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howard: when donald trump was arraigned in new york, judge juan merchan warned both sides are to refrain from making statements that could incite, otherwise he might have to invoke a gag order. trump spoke at mar-a-lago that night attacking the prosecutors and the judge himself. >> i have a trump-hating judge with a trump-hating wife and family whose daughter worked for kamala harris. they've got a local, racist democrat district other than in atlanta who is going -- attorney in atlanta who is doing everything in her power to indict me. then you have a rad law school left -- radical left lunatic who is harassing hundreds of my people day after day over the boxes hoax. the criminal is the district attorney because he illegally

leaked massive amounts of grand jury information. [cheers and applause] howard: emily jashinsky, the press has been highly critical of those attacks. a picture was posted of the judge's daughter, she runs a liberal consulting firm. what do you headache of this given the judge's admonition to tone things down? >> as a journalist, this is totally backwards to me. it's weird for me to see journalists art to congeal and say we're going to coalesce around this powerful person. i was watching it on msnbc. this is a serious question of bias and a serious question of the judge's connections. now, trump's handling of it aside is, journalists should have journalistic skepticism and curiosity about people in position of power. these stories only came from conservative outlets about his daughter's connections. again, donald trump takes that a little too far. but whether that that's a legitimate source of journalist ig inquiry, it is, and i find it odd. howard: it's interesting, liz, i think families should be off

limits unless they're directly involved, but the larger question for all of us covering candidate trump is how do you craw the line between his free speech, his ability to fight back, his ability to define his candidacy as the front-runner and the constraints he now face as a criminal defendant? >> that's a lot to deal with, isn't it, howie? howard: it is. but i know you can do it. >> i think that i've seen -- [laughter] it's very hard. many people on both sides feel l give trump some wiggle room here. and how can you possibly impose a gag order, call for it and then enforce it? he is the lead republican candidate for president, and there are all kinds of first amendment issues if he were to try and gag or muzzle him that will bubble up and just explode. that is a major, major issue that i think is going to be certainly something that is focused upon. however, perhaps the dividing line is that if donald trump has information that, of course,

most confidents get ahead of their own -- defendants get ahead of their own trials and he starts to talk about that, you know, that would prejudice a jury, and perhaps that would push the judge over the line because you can't do that. howard: yeah. that was mentioned by the prosecutors, and i think -- i don't think a judge wants to impose a gag order. it'll be good if he didn't. on the other hand, i don't think we've heard the last of some of these leanings. so i watched all the -- these lines. i watched all the coverage which is part of the job, and trump's going to speak at mar-a-lago. and on msnbc just before he starts, rachel maddow says this: >> this is basically a campaign speech in which he is preeting his same lies and allegations existence his perceived enemies. it is the just getting started. so far he's giving his norm list of grievances, we don't consider that newsworthy. howard: msnbc decrees viewers shouldn't see his speech for 5 minutes because that would be

horrible -- 25 minutes even though they could spend the next 23 hours attacking the speech. what do you think of the way they just sort of said we're not taking this, 40 no way, no how in. >> i think it's really insulting. not just bad for business, but bad for media. that speech got really big ratings for a lot of folks, and the question is the newsworthiness of a speech from a leading presidential candidate is not determined by how smart you think your audience is, by your perception of to your audience's ability to interpret it responsibly, and that's what rachel maddow is saying. you can't be trusted to know that this guy might be exaggerating like politicians do. he might be making things up. that's not her job -- howard: no politician has ever done that. >> right. [laughter] and that's the audiences job -- audience's job. i think it's insulting. we're almost ten years into the trump era, they still haven't learned that lesson and double down on bad discussions. howard: in fairness, other shows the next day ran clips of the show. how could you not?

you want to talk about what he had to say and create eke the it, that's a what journalists do. liz, it's almost condescending to me. we don't to the want you to the hear what the republican front-runner has to say because you might fall for it. >> i'm wondering if emily would think that the fox news has decided not to cover on donald trump, a rally or speech in that has been happening in the past, and i love people who just want to throw that out there and say the editorial decision was supposed to be this. eded editorial decisions are made for all kinds of reasons, and msnbc feels that their viewers probably didn't want to see what maybe they felt was going to be the same old grievances or some lieus, you know are, or president trump going out there, howie, and and saying that this doesn't happen in first world nations, only third world nations. actually, it does. nicolas sarkozy and jacques chirac of france both were prosecuted and convicted. benjamin netanyahu of israel

went through bribery charges, civil owe berlusconi. howard: okay, when fox didn't take the two january 6th hearings in prime time the, i was critical of that. i just think let the viewers decide. they're start and concern smart and you don't have to shield them. thanks so much, emily lashinsky and liz claman. up next, andy mccarthy e on why he's calling the falsified records indictment of trump a disgrace. ♪

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the a major purpose of an indictment in american criminal law is to put the defendant the on notice of what the crime is, and mr. bragg fails to state a crime. he's trying to inflate a misdemeanor charge in new york of falsifying business records into a monoifny -- felony. in order to do that, you have to spell out a crime that trump was supposedly trying to conceal by falsifying the records, and nowhere in the indictment because he alert him to what the crime is. so at a very basic, clinical level, the indictment fails even as an indictment. howard: now, even beyond the indictment you where i in the new york -- you write in "the new york post" that leftists want to put trump through an expensive, emotionally-wrenching, psychologically-exhausting and publicly-humiliating spectacle. and you know this how? >> well, i think it's a fair inpresence from the fact that we have -- inference from the fact

that we have a prosecutor who is not an appoints prosecutor in the new york system, he's an elected prosecutor. he ran as a progressive democrat promising to use the power of his office to go after trump. and it's on that basis that he was elected by progressives in new york. so already even before they knew whether they had a crime or not, the promise that was made, the commitment that was made was to exploit the powers of the district attorney's office to go after one person which is un-american. howard: well, i just add that however partisan alvin bragg may be, he count stand for all leftists concern he doesn't stand for all leftists. you say bragg would like to be able to prove trump was trying to hide this at the end of the 2016 campaign from the voting public. why is that crucial to the indictment? >> well, it makes the story incoherent, actually, because what bragg says his rationale

is, is that trump stole the 2016 election by fraud. and even if you buy that as a herely, the problem -- as a theory, the problem with the indictment is the crimes, howie, that he charges begin in february of 2017 and continue through the end. so right off the bat he's got the logical problems of if these crimes were the way that he defrauded the public into electing him in 2016, how can they have been committed after that had already happened? howard: well, we'll see how the case holds up. andy mccarthy, thanks very much for joining us. >> thank you, howie. howard: next on "mediabuzz," donald trump's republican rivals aren't the only ones being overshadowed by his legal melodrama. president biden is barely on the radar. stay with us.by ♪ i even if you got ppp and it only takes eight minutes to qualify.

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espionage despite secretary of state antony blinken telling his counterpart that evan gersching cowits is wrongfully detained. that's where we began with ari fleischer, fox news contributor from new york. ari fleischer, welcomement. >> thank you, howard. howard: is it important that we keep this outrage, what happened in russia, in the news? or is it better for quiet diplomacy by the administration? >> well, i think it's both. history shows that the more noise there is about people who are taken, who are kidnapped, the better it is. the families appreciate it, and there is some evidence that over time this type of public pressure matters. on the other hand, at the end of the day, it's always up to the nation that engaged in the crime of kidnapping to decide whether they care about international opinion or not. and that's what's being tested in russia right now, and i'm sorry to say that russia's going

backwards on these issues. howard: yeah. evan gershkovich is not as famous as britney guy man, but he's -- brittney griner, but he's being held hostage. president biden doesn't make much news, and that's especially true right now being overshadowed by the trump legal melodrama. he's giving speeches about infrastructure can and climate change and so forth. why do you think biden is so far off the radar? >> because being off the radar won him the presidency. this is a repeat of what he did in the 2000 campaign in the year of covid when he campaigned from his basement when covid was his excuse knob to be vigorous, not to go on the stump, not to make it about him, but to let it all be about president trump. he's doing the same thing now. it was successful for him in 2000. he won. and so i suspect he's thinking let the light shine on donald trump, let trump explain himself, let him deal with his indictment, and i'll just

quietly govern the country, is what joe biden's thinking. that, howard, is why he's doing it. he count need the media. he thinks the media hurts trump. howard: yeah. and he gives so few interviews. here's a perfect example. i mean, this week in tennessee republicans expelled two black democratic legislators for having been part of this proprotest with bullhorns over gun control. so president biden put out a statement saying this was shocking, undemocratic and without precedent. he was at camp david. why not come out to the cameras and say it and take a couple of questions as opposed to having anchors read your statement? >> yeah, first of all, i've never seen an issue that's been more biasly reported than what happened to those tennessee legislators. occupying the floor, violating all the rules at the same time that the capitol was under siege by protesters, and they stirred them on. worst coverage i've ever seen, howard. as for president biden's handling of it, i think it's obvious. he's at camp david, he's

resting, he's relaxing, he can't be disturbed, he doesn't want to put on clothes, go on camera, put on a suit, so he just lets a statement speak for itself. that's why. he's 80 years old. he needs time off. be 82 if he runs for re-election. this is the consequence of having a president at that age. he is down. he is winding down, and he cannot be wound up, at least not this weekend at camp david, not for this cause. howe well, i think he could come out in a polo shirt, and it would take about 10 minutes, but i take your point. during your time as white house press secretary the, you took your fair share of heat. karine jean-pierre gets a fair amount of criticism for not just deflecting and refusing to answer certain questions, but politico saying many reporters privately grumbling that when she because have answers, they're often vague and just taken from the briefing books, the talking points. are those fair criticisms as somebody who's been behind that podium? >> oh, howard, they are fair

criticism, and i'm reluck ant to criticize any press secretary. let me just point this out. i cannot understand how somebody who's been in the job as long as she's been doesn't talk about foreign policy. she's letting john kirby do the heavy lifting that is the burden, the chore and the joy of the press secretary. press secretaries have to be responsible for the answerrings. she speaks for the president. this bifurcation is only because john kirby is so much better at it than she is, and no to press secretary should want anybody to be better at their job hand they are. howard: whatever you think of the indictment of the president, trump, former president trump, the stormy daniels case, how is it that donald trump has been absolutely buried under all this negative publicity, has gone up in the polls, gone up in fund fund raising where most candidates would probably be crushed? >> yeah. my gut tells me the only reason this is happening is because the

trump voter when trump rallies the nation or what he rallies his voters to is that the deck is stacked. no matter what you co, washington is against you, the system is existence you, and i'm the fighter for you. and there's a huge swath of this country that believes that. when you see it, the d.a. in manhattan, one of the most democratic counties in the united states of america, indict donald trump over something that's awfully flimsy, there's a rally around the republican flag, and donald trump happens to be the flag carrier at this moment. so i think that's why. i'm very worried that in a general and a primary, i'm very worried that all of this weakens him in a general, and that's something other republican candidates in the primary mare are going to have to handle out how concern have to figure out how to handle. howard: office holders are rallying around trump over this much-publicized indictment, but maybe people who even like trump, who feel they're just tired of all the chaos of which this is just one prime example?

>> yeah. and the reason republicans are rallying is they may be tired of the chaos, but they think that the democrats are wrong, and you have to rally around the guy who's being wronged. now, i i think here's what you should look forward to. first debate of republican candidates is in august, and then we have a series of debates throughout that fall. if the polls show that nikki haley, ron desantis, iowa a saw hutchinson or any other candidate is running ahead of joe biden, ahead of kamala harris at a greater margin than donald trump is, that's when you'll know that republican primary voters will say i like trump, but he might not be our strongest candidate. there may be other candidates who can win. that's what you need to keep your eye on, howard, heading into the august debate and throughout the fall, into the iowa caucuses. howard: i'll keep my eye on it. ari fleischer, always good to see you. thanks so much for joining us. >> thank you. howard: after the break, the media insist the criminal case against donald trump will hurt him in a general election, but

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after all these years and multiple investigations, two impeachments, finally gets indicted and his popularity gets up and he's raised $10 million? >> you know, one thing i've learned about donald trump is he has an amazing ability to defy the laws of political graf i. but, look, i'm a democrat k and i'm looking at these numbers, and i would be more frustrated, frankly, if i were a republican. what we're seeing here is that these indictments might produce some short-term gain for him, some gains with the republican base, with the republican establishment and even some of his republican opponents rallying around him concern. howard: they're almost all rallying around him. >> yeah, they are which i think, frankly, is a mistake. this would be a perfect offramp for the republican establishment and opponents, but, no, it seems like they just can't quit donald trump. but it's the going to create some long-term pain for him because while we are seeing his numbers go up with republican primary voters, we're seeing them go down with general election voters. and that's a big problem for him

because he faces a real serious math problem. he lost fairly handily in 2020 the, and to win in 2024 he's going to have to pick up some of those biden voters he wasn't able to win. and numbers show he won't be able to, and common sense tells you this, that throw in a few indictments, at least one next to his name is not going to help his case winning over swing voters. howard: well, probably not in a general election. but when he lashes out against fake news, enemy of the people and all that because he's gotten just a tsunami of negative coverage, it seems to help him at least with republicans because they don't like the media, they don't trust the media. >> yeah, and there is this thing with donald trump that lends some truth to that old maxim that all press is good press. we saw this in 2016 where the overwhelming coverage of his gaffes whether it's john mccain can or immigrants, there was this view that would until sink him, and it didn't. and part of the reason why it didn't sink him was because it allowed him to block out the sun for all of his opponents.

and we're seeing the replay of that now. you saw breathless coverage of his empty plane on the tarmac, the empty hallway in the courtroom, very rem reminiscent of the coverage of his air time for the empty podiums in 2016. and if that continues to be how the media covers this, that's very good for donald trump because the 24/7 trump show benefits donald trump. howard: yeah. good publicity, bad publicity, it doesn't matter because he sucks up all the ox general. i know you brag about joe biden having had the best midterm of any democratic president in 60 years, but how can it be then that a majority of democrats in these recent polls don't want him to run again, and the latest cnn poll it's 54%? what explains that? >> well, look, we've seen this movie before. you know, i worked for one of joe biden's a opponents in 2020, and in 2020 we saw joe biden lose iowa, lose new hampshire, lose nevada and only begin winning at the fourth primary

contest. and there were concerns then that not enough of the party would rally around him, that he wouldn't excite younger voters, that people who supported other candidates wouldn't vote for him, and then guess what? in the end, he was still able to defeat donald trump. and it's important to remember this, elections are about choices. but the choice in this election won't be between joe biden and some mythical democrat, it's going to be between joe biden and whoever the republican nominee is. howard: right, right. >> and i feel pretty good about joe biden's chances against the current republican party. howard: i understand it's about choices. it's like you better than the other person. but it almost seems like a vote of no confidence. and do you think that has a lot to do with him being 80 years old and people who maybe even like joe biden feel like can he serve another six years? >> no, i cofeel like these set up false choices because if you look deeper or into them, people aren't saying there is one specific candidate that they would prefer, it's just sort of

human nature, right? no one candidate is going to check all 100 boxes for any 1 voter. and that's part of life. you don't get everything you want in life, you op don't get everything you want in politics. what matters though is what happens in november when the choice is between the democrat, joe biden, and whoever the republican nominee is. howard: to who at the moment looks like he might be donald trump. like many pieces before, a piece in outer s saying biden feels kamala harris doesn't rise to the occasion. she gets an unusual amount of media criticism for a vice president. why do you think that is? >> well, you know, she's been the beneficiary of her historic status, right? i think a lot of people in this country, a lot of people even around the world look up to her because of her his or thetic status. she's the first woman vice president, first black vice president, first south asian vice president. but that comes with some down sides too, you know? there are some extremely high

expectations that go along being a historic first. expectations that you can't have on a mike pence, that you didn't have on a dick cheney, that you can't have on a joe biden. you can't see this criticism of them out there, and it's not because they were going out and solving world peace or going out there -- [laughter] or going out there and having these magical viral moments, it's just that they weren't facing the same expectations. and i think kamala harris does have really high expectations for her based on that historic status and the fact that she ran for president in 2020 and people are looking at her as a potential future president. so, yes, i understand that there is criticism of herr, but she has -- of her, but she has the ability to blunt it. and being vice president is a really, really tough, thankless job, not very gam rouse. that's why the only show about being vice president is veep which is essentially a come key the of err errors -- errors. howard: liz smith, thanks for coming back on show, good to see

you. >> thank you for having me. howard: kamala harris made a last minute decision the other day to go to tennessee and meet with the two ousted democratic lawmakers who helped take over the floor with bullhorns in that gun control protest. the still to come, lesley stahl getting ripped for her interview with marjorie taylor green and a scathing report on how don lemon treats women. ♪ >> woman: why did we choose safelite? we're always working on a project. while loading up our suv, one extra push and... crack! so, we scheduled at safelite.com.

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howard: cbs' lesley stahl has been getting ripped online for her or interview last weekend with marjorie taylor green. a lot of them are lefties who don't think the georgia congresswoman should be given the platform. i got some blowback when she was on this program. people don't realize she is a key ally of kevin mccarthy. but she still says highly

provocative things, and she was asked about a comment she made last year. >> and things she says that are over the top like -- >> the democrats are a party of pedophiles. >> i would definitely say so. they support grooming children. >> they are not pedophiles. why would you say that? >> democrats, democrats support -- the each joe biden, the president himself, supports children being sexualized and having transgender surgeries, sexualizing children is what pedophiles do children. >> wow. howard: now, i can't defend that. every member of the democratic party is a pedophile? joe biden is a pedophile? i understand opposition to transgender surgery for kids, but congresswoman went well beyond that, and that brought the second wave of criticism existence lesley stahl. how could she only say wow? shtah concern stahl says viewers are perfectly capable of watching the exchange and making up their own minds. cmn's don lemon has been

under a harsh spotlight since making this dispicker -- disparaging comment about nicki haile's age. >> nikki haley isn't in her prime, sorry. howard: multiple sources on lemon's unprofessional antics dating back nearly two decades. in 2008, after friction with his cohost, keira phillips, variety says he threw pictures and notes on top of and inside her desk. she later received two threatening texts. variety says cnn traced it back to the lemon. a network spokesperson says congress says the legged -- alleged incident never occurred, and cnn cannot corroborate the allege events from 15 years ago. the piece accuses lemon of misogynystic behavior such as calling one producer fat and mocking his colleague, nancy grace. lemon has also said to have suggested that seoul cad o'brien isn't black black and she says he's long had a habit of saying

idiotic and inaccurate things. a cnn spokesperson says lemon conditions city my such control story remark. he say it is the story, which is riddled with patent9ly false anecdotes and no concrete evidence, is based on unsourced, unsubstantiated, 15-year-old nonmiss gossip. it's amazing and disappointing shah variety would be so reckless. two very different versions of eventings. elon musk changed his mind after slapping a label on npr's twitter feed, u.s. sate-afill affiliated -- state-affiliated media. the network called that unacceptable since npr gets less than 1% of its budget. now he's in a feud with matt taibbi who did the much of the twitter files reporting. now taibbi's quitting twitter, musk disabling the links, but substack and its writers say otherwise. that's it for this edition of

"mediabuzz," howard kurtz here. happy easter to all of you who are celebrating and happy passover as well. you can subscribe to my podcast, media buzz meter, we do have the five buzziest stories of the day, plus whatever else catches my eye. there we go. we are back here next sunday, 11 eastern. thanks for watching the only media analysis show on national television.ou ♪ ghd a lot of questions when she came in. i watched my mother go through being a single mom. at the end of the day, my mom raised three children, including myself. and so once the client knew that she was heard. we were able to help her move forward. your client won't care how much you know until they know how much you care. this is going to be great. taking the shawl off. ok i did it. is he looking at my hairline? is plaque psoriasis making you rethink your everyday choices?

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