and airing on fox business on saturday night, i hope you enjoy it. >> did you hit the target? >> crack shot with the muscat, off with the mini gun. >> don't forget to dvr the show. here is "america reports." >> gave putin no excuse to blame this on the west or nato. we made clear we were not involved. we had nothing to do with it. this was part of a struggle within russian system. still too early to reach a definitive conclusion about where this is going. the ultimate outcome of all this remains to be seen. >> sandra: fox news alert, waiting an update from the state department moments from now as well as from the white house, biden administration scrambling to respond to the internal rebellion against vladimir putin

that saw the private military wagner group seize cities and come within 120 miles of reaching moscow. hello, welcome. great to have you here, trace. >> trace: this is "america reports." whereabouts of yevgeny are not known, but he claims he was not trying to overthrow the government but rather to protest the kremlin's mishandling of the war in ukraine. >> sandra: dan hoffman moments away where putin will go from here. gillian turner at the state department and how the biden administration administration is responding to the turmoil in russia. benjamin hall is live in london. what's been putin's reaction so far today? >> good to see you this afternoon. today we finally heard from both putin and putin was giving a

normal talk to a youth group, and saturday he was talking about mutiny and he was threatening those who were going to attack him. that being said, what we have seen over the last few days is the worst cracks to his regime over the last 23 years. we saw wagner moving to within 120 miles of moscow. they shot down at least four russian helicopters. they took over a major city, rostov, a population of a million, and control center in ukraine. what was amazing, crowds greeted them when they arrived and marching to moscow. today we also heard from

prigozhin, says he had done this because wagner was ordered to be part of the formal russian army here is a sound bite. >> we did not have the goal of overthrowing the existing regime and the legally elected government, which was said many times. we turned around in order not to shed the blood of russian soldiers. >> and this could, of course, impact the war in ukraine as well. the russian soldiers on the front lines will have known what happened inside russian and how many will wonder who they are fighting for, why are they fighting, should they continue in the awful conditions. and that sense, must be a big opportunity for ukraine to try to push the counteroffensive forward, try to harness the chaos going on. we don't know where prigozhin is, he is in exile at belarus, and wait to see what he does and 25,000 or perhaps more wagner

troops will do. >> sandra: benjamin, thank you so much. >> trace: u.s. diplomats are scrambling to make sense of the wagner march toward moscow and details of the deal remain unknown in the u.s. also expect to hear more from the state department any moment, and that is where gillian turner is live for us. >> gillian: no word today from state department as to his location. we are learning the national security team did not believe putin was to cave so quickly. it sounds like it happened under their noses. >> this is an unfolding story and we are in the midst of a moving picture. we have not seen the last act. we do know putin has a lot more to answer for in the weeks and months ahead.

>> gillian: the intelligence community new the wagner group was likely planning some kind of a mutiny against putin's forces but did not believe putin and they would strike a group. >> they keep people inside the units loyal the kremlin but did not do anything about it before it reached the fever pitch is really quite strange to me. >> gillian: secretary blinken acknowledging the u.s. does not know what terms they agreed to or how it's going to play out inside ukraine. >> we don't have finality in terms of what was actually agreed between prigozhin and putin. i expect we will learn more what deal they struck.

too soon to tell what will happen to the wagner forces. >> gillian: they are obligated to keep americans safe, a briefing in a moment at the state department and we will press them on this. >> trace: back to you as the news breaks. thank you, gillian. >> sandra: dan hoffman, former cia station chief in moscow and fox news contributor. what do you anticipate as we await the briefings? >> i think vladimir putin has to navigate the path ahead and it's a tricky one. unstability in russia the likes we have not seen since the coup

in 1991. putin said he would not tolerate treasury, he sent military officers to the u.k. to poison a defector with a banned nerve agent, and he never demanded an end to putin's regime or the war of ukraine, but critical of shoigu and the war at large that is by extension a criticism of vladimir putin. and listen to vladimir putin's speech on saturday morning he calls out the wagner group for the treachery they caused, the mutiny, you have to believe that vladimir putin will take action against prigozhin. >> do you feel it's important for the biden administration to distance itself from what happened, wagner group and

prigozhin, why do we care? >> prigozhin is under indictment in the united states for having sought to interfere in the 2016 election, the idea the biden administration would have had anything to do with this mutiny is pretty preposterous and i was surprised the president even spoke to that. the russians know we had nothing to do with it. putin knows it, prigozhin knows it -- >> sandra: interview with condoleezza rice, on putin's response. >> now the problem for putin is he has to explain why after going on television in that five-minute address, rather alarmist address about how it might be 1917 all over again and

we were going to crush them and they were treasonous and then you make a deal? one reason you have not heard putin speak to this, probably trying to get the story together. >> sandra: interesting take away, dan. your response. >> she's absolutely right and it does demonstrate in the kremlin certainly just an inability really to function effectively. putin has had that one public appearance, but he really has not been otherwise seen or heard from and we don't even know specifically where he is, let alone where prigozhin is. putin spoke out clearly about doing something about the mutiny and holding those who caused it accountable. and yet there seems to be no evidence that he plans to do that. but i do believe that behind the scenes that's what he plans on doing. at the heart of this it was an intelligence failure, like the intelligence failure to accurately assess the will of

ukraine to fight, of president zelenskyy to lead ukraine courageously. p utin failed to understand his own fighting force, woefully inef inef ineffecty -- ineffective, it may never have reached vladimir putin's desk because he has a culture of loyalty rather than competence. his security services are not so interested in tell the leader what he needs to know when it's not what he wants to hear. >> trace: dan, we have reports out of ukraine, ukrainians look at the internal dissent in russia, they say "it's too good to be true." how does this benefit ukraine in your perspective? >> well, this definitely has a negative impact on the russian army, their morale. but i would caution our viewers

that the ukrainians are really in a tough place here. they are fighting along a 600 mile front with a lot of mines that is impeding their progress, and we never gave ukraine the close air support they need to wipe out russian artillery or the tanks, those are things ukraine would really night right now and maybe the best thing they have going for them is the damage the russians are doing to themselves, self-inflicted wounds. but i think when history is written here we will look back and say there was more we the united states could have done to help ukraine at this time. this is a time for ukraine to take the fight to the finish. i don't know that they have all the military equipment that they need to do it. >> sandra: just last hour the president spoke about our continued support in ukraine saying no matter what happened in russia, we will continue to support ukraine's defense and its sovereignty and territorial integrity. dan hoffman joining us on those

developments. thank you so much, good to see you. >> all right, you too. >> trace: moments ago, jacqui heinrich was able to press president biden whether he stands by his claims he has never spoken with his son hunter about his overseas business dealings, watch. >> did you lie about never speaking to -- >> no. >> mr. president -- >> sandra: very interesting moment, jacqui heinrich getting that question in, have you ever spoken to your son about his overseas business dealings and she got a firm no from the president. which would contradict the text message we have seen by now over whatsapp where hunter biden references his father sitting right next to him during a business dealing. >> i know jonathan turley is your guest, it's interesting to

me because in his last op-ed he was saying the bottom line in all of this is that somebody is lying, right. somebody is not telling the truth about the involvement the president had with hunter biden and it's going to be fascinating in the hours and days to come as this trickle of information comes to see what else james comer comes up with and to see about where this investigation might lead. >> sandra: because both cases cannot be true that, is for sure, trace. all right. so, jonathan turley coming up in a short time from now on that, meanwhile, await those two briefings and the atlanta d.a. at odds with the state's attorney general, refusing to prosecute a mob accused of attacking a police training center. leo terrell and georgia's insurance and safety commissioner john king who has experienced this firsthand. he will join us coming up on that. >> trace: fascinating. and nancy pelosi taking a swipe

at conservative supreme court justices by floating the idea of term limits. is there a double standard? judge thapar of the sixth secretary court of appeals weighs in, in a first-ever television interview right here on fox. pelosi also took a swipe at him. his reaction to that. >> here we have a body chosen for life, never have to run for office, nominated confirmed four lives with no accountability for their ethics behavior. know your glucose level and where it's headed. no fingersticks needed. manage your diabetes with more confidence. freestyle libre 2. try it for free at freestylelibre.us veteran homeowners making a big car payment every month? car loans can be expensive and the payments high. consolidate that car loan into a newday home loan and save hundreds every month.

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>> sandra: fox news alert, a live look at the state department. a little activity in the room, we will listen in after the rebellion over the weekend.

we will dip into the state department when the briefing begins, stay tuned for that. it should be beginning shortly. >> stop cop city! stop cop city! >> atlanta prosecutor says her office will no longer pursue cases tied to the dozens of out of state protests arrested in march for violently attacking police officers and the $90 million training facility. she disagrees with the state's attorney general who has sought domestic terrorism charges against some of the suspects. complete coverage now, leo terrell and john king are standing by, but charles watson has more. what's behind this decision, charles? >> well, trace, we posed that question to a local atlanta defense attorney not associated with this case and he tells us

that dekalb county district attorney decision not to prosecute cases at the riot that broke out in atlanta so-called cop city, less about the cases themselves and more about politics. >> so they are very, very different political constituencies these two politicians are answering to. the constituency in dekalb county might punish the elected prosecutors at the polls if she goes forward with the locally unpopular prosecutions. >> so dekalb county boston, a democrat nearing the end of her term says she pulled away from prosecuting cases associated with the riot at the police safety training facility because of differences in the prosecution philosophy with the georgia attorney general's office. dozens of people allegedly involved in that riot, most of whom live outside of georgia, now face domestic terrorism charges.

but after months of discussing the evidence in the cases, the d.a. says it's best the attorney general's office moves forward alone with the charges it believes are warranted. george attorney general chris carr says the district attorney has decided not to prosecute, they will look at the charges at the atlanta police training facility. >> sandra: leo terrell, and john king, georgia insurance fire and safety commissioner. john king, you've been writing about, the truth about atlanta's cop city. you write being great for the city, a win for the city, communities across the metro atlanta area. for the law enforcement officers, our first responders. so why the violent protests, why

is this happening. >> part of a nationwide movement that has gone after police. and atlanta has been needing a permanent training facility to train our police better, so we can have them be able to be better prepared to deal with the crisis on the streets. all these radical trust fund brats are coming from out of our state to come in effect and burn down our communities, which is incredibly unfair. you know, i'm asking because i was an atlanta police officer, i've been shot in the line of duty serving this great community that i love and i am very proud of the fact that the mayor and the city council have stood strong to support the police. and i'm disappointed in the d.a. in dekalb county, bowing to the pressure. >> sandra: these are called coordinated attacks, ongoing 7

months, more than 40 people are charged, fireworks and rocks were thrown at officers, police vehicles, construction equipment was torched. the georgia statute, rarely employed prior to december, carries a sentence between 5 and 35 years behind bars. yet here is the dekalb county d.a. explaining why she is leaving the case. >> we had some differences and when i say we, myself and the attorney general's office about who should be charged and what they should be charged with. i will only proceed on cases that i believe i can make beyond a reasonable doubt. >> sandra: why are these charges not worth pursuing? >> thank you for that question. >> absolutely. i'm sorry, let me be very clear, sandra. thank you, this is a slap in the face of every law enforcement officer in atlanta. when she talks about philosophical differences,

translate that to you as a lawyer. she does not want to prosecute the individuals. these are democratic agitators. you have video right now, no doubt about it on the evidence we are looking at, this is domestic terrorism. but it will destroy her political career and what this is, atlanta, just like los angeles, just like chicago, just like new york, sandra, this is democrat politics at work. anti-police, no support for law enforcement. it is very disingenuous. >> sandra: the georgia a.g. has stepped in and said they will continue to pursue the case. if you shoot officers, throw molotov cocktails, and set fire

to vehicles and offices, you will be held accountable, we will not waiver to put a stop to violent crime in the state. will the violent protestors be convicted, john? >> you know, when these cases go to citizens of our great city, they will be held accountable. the evidence is overwhelming. all these brats, i call them, trust fund brats, from maine, from canada, from france, very few if any are local, you know, agitators. they are local folks and they are hurting the community's ability to protect our citizens and this -- it's more than just partisan this is just an absolute abdication of their sworn oath to protect our community. >> sandra: john you write it

makes you sick, it's vital that they have the best very sources and training to do their jobs. and you say that from first-hand experience. thank you to both of you for joining us on that. we will certainly follow the story. we have a call into governor kemp as well. thank you. >> thank you, appreciate it. >> we want transparency with the school. our children are safer when we know more about what's happening. >> trace: the fight for parent l a rights heats up in new jersey. parents say they have a right to know what's going on with their children. transgender policies in three school districts heats up. >> sandra: democrats jump on the band wagon as two conservative supreme court justices face ethics questions. critics say a double standard, and the first tv on tv of a federal judge.

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>> it's shaim shame --. >> it's shameful how justice thomas and alito have been cavalier of what is expected of a justice of the supreme court. the president formed a commission, they did not recommend expansion of the court, that shouldn't be the end of it. but there certainly should be term limits. >> sandra: democrats pouncing on thomas and alito. nancy pelosi suggesting term limits might be necessary. is there a double standard at play? judge amul thapar joins us now, he six on the sixth court circuit court of appeals, and author of "a book at the justice," and clarence thomas's record. what may be his legacy in a moment, welcome to you, judge, thank you very much for joining us. the new interview with nancy

pelosi. >> thank you for having me. >> sandra: it's a huge moment for the supreme court. a position you have been up for, and i wonder if it will happen any time soon, but looking at those comments from nancy pelosi and this scrutiny of these conservative justices, what is your reaction when you see that? >> i think first and foremost the american people should judge them by their record, and that's the point of the people's justice, is to show for the american people what the cases are actually about. about the real people and their struggles in front of the u.s. supreme court. it lets them see firsthand whether the critics laying out of justice thomas's jurisprudence is consistent with what it actually is. in other words, if you read "the people's justice," you'll see justice thomas and how he deals

with parents struggling to educate their children, parents struggling to keep the street safe and trying to keep violent video games out of their children's hands. you'll see firsthand suzette kel to keep her house, and angel as she battles to keep government out of her medical care so she can make the decisions alongside her doctor that are best for her. >> sandra: a very interesting move to have a sitting supreme court justice fire back at such allegations in this case these ethics violations. we don't see that from the justices often, as you well know, judge, and he did just that. this is the headline in the wall street journal, which the editorial board did publish, labelled pro publica misleads its leaders. getting ahead of the publishing of that, he wrote they have leveled two charges against me, first i should have recused in

matters in which an entity connected with paul singer was a party, and second i was obligated to list certain items as gifts on my disclose report, neither charge is valid. it is a rare moment to have a justice fire back in such a public way. >> it's very rare to have a justice fire back but i would say they are attacking their personal integrity. and i know the justices of the supreme court and all people of intense integrity truly just trying to get the cases right. that's why the people's justice is so important because it shows are the justices being consistent with their priors. is there something different in these cases, and there's really not, and that's the problem the critics have is that the justices, the originalist justices and the other justices are being consistent. they are consistent with their prior jurisprudence and nothing is changing. >> sandra: nancy pelosi said just the opposite in that

brand-new interview. i'll play it out. she said this about justice thomas. listen. >> there should be some ethical rules that would be followed. i had one justice tell me he thought the other justices were people of integrity. like a clarence thomas. i'm like get out of here. >> sandra: how do you respond to that, judge? >> well, justice breyer sat next to thomas for 28 years, and said he's a man of integrity, i've never seen him say or do anything underhanded. and as the book points out, justice sotomayor said he's someone who cares deeply about the institution, cares about the people. and so i think it's really important we pay attention to the people who know him and those are the justices on the supreme court and see what they say. the i think it's important we pay attention to how he cares passionately about people. so much so that he befriends people in r.v. parks and homeless people without them

knowing who he is. >> judge, rarely have we heard from a federal judge weighing in on such matters, including the protests that happened outside the supreme court -- the conservative supreme court justice's homes such as justice kavanaugh one year after roe v. wade was overturned. what do you have to say about those acts by americans who see that as a form of protest? >> you know, i think protest is an important bedrock of our community. it's one of the things that makes america such a great country that we can protest our government, that we can protest the rulings i make or anyone else makes, but we have a lawful way to do it and unlawful way, and it's important we stay within the law when we protest. we shouldn't be able to, and no one should be able to threaten the justices, their families, attempt to assassinate them reported as to justice kavanaugh, those things should not happen in this country. indeed, it's why it's so

important the court stay strong and that people push back on the relentless criticism of the court that isn't founded and that's one thing hopefully when your readers read the people justice, arm them with the information, it's meant for lay people, to explain firsthand the originalist jurisprudence and how it favors ordinary people, the real people that come in front of the court. >> sandra: really interested. why did you decide to write about the people's justice, clarence thomas, in your new book? >> the reason i decided to write about clarence thomas, the ultimate originalist, and critics are strong over the weak, rich over the poor and the corporations over the consumers. i don't tell the reader what to think, like the critics do. instead i show them what happened in these cases and let them decide for their selves. i venture to guess if the critics read the book with an

open mind they may be surprised by their answer who justice thomas favors. that makes sense, the meaning of the constitution is to protect ordinary people, it was a contract between the american people and their government and created limited federal government and other than that limited federal government, allowed the american people to retain all their rights. when justice thomas looks at the original constitution, he often ends up on the side of the little guy, and this book proves it. >> sandra: interesting stuff, 2024 election is coming up, you've been up not once but twice for the possible position of supreme court justice. there could be change in leadership in the white house. would you be up for the job? >> you know, too many people look ahead to the next job and i can tell you i'm on a phenomenal court with phenomenal colleagues.

we might disagree but not disagreeable. i'm an immigrant's child, my dad came with a one way ticket and $5. my mom told me work hard and do your best. i've met with multiple presidents. appointed three times by presidents. once as u.s. attorney, once a district judge and once a circuit judge. i'm grateful for the opportunities i've been given and love my job. >> sandra: judge thapar in your first-ever tv interview. appreciate the conversation. >> thank you for having me. >> trace: an attorney representing 1 of 3 new jersey school districts over the transgender policy says it could go to the supreme court. a parents group supports rules that say teachers must inform parents if the child shows signs of changing gender identity. but the attorney general says it

violates state law and would harm trans children. nate foy has more on this, one of the districts is now saying they don't want to go to court. what are we hearing? >> yeah, the school board tells me they stand behind their policy, believe parents should be kept in the loop if their child is showing signs of changing identity but the goal is not to go to court. instead requesting a meeting with the attorney general to come up with a compromise. the take a look at this statement, reads rather than expend taxpayer money litigating, we hope to have new jersey law serve as a template across the state. some trans activists and parents, take a look at the next video, they protested in

middletown last week, one of the three districts sued. but other parents believe they should be kept in the loop about something so major happening with their child and cory deangelis with the american federation for children agrees. >> parents should be part of that discussion, they shouldn't be firewalled between the government and their children. again, the kids don't belong to the government, they belong to their parents. >> so trace, in the past few years, parental rights groups have sued school districts in at least five states over gender identity policies, two of those cases were dismissed, while three of them are ongoing. back out here live, the previous cases involve parents suing school boards. in this case, the lawsuit is coming from the state. we are expecting a decision in the next 30 days about a possible injunction. back to you. >> sandra: let's get to the state department, the spokesperson is getting right to questions. listen in here. >> you never know, matt.

try your best. >> what's your understanding of the situation in ukraine, russia, wagner, belarus. >> i don't have any specific assessment in terms of facts on the ground. we all saw what happened over the weekend. in our assessment it remains a dynamic situation. it's unclear what the ultimate implications of what happened will be. as it relates to united states activities, and united states interests, i'll speak to what we did over the weekend. number one, the president focused on convening allies and partners, he had a call with members of the quad, secretary blinken had a call with members of the g7, and with foreign minister of ukraine, and foreign ministers from turkey and poland. we continue to have discussions with our allies and partners today and made clear to ukraine as we made clear in

conversations that steadfast support will remain for ukraine no matter what happens in russia, and with respect to the activities over the weekend, obviously they were a significant step. it is certainly a new thing to see president putin's leadership directly challenged. a new thing to see yevgeny prigozhin calling out the war is conducted basically on a lie, something we have said previously but not coming from russian officials previously. those are significant steps. >> you think prigozhin is a russian official? >> he was a leader that remains on the battlefield, or was. remains to be seen the final, or the current or final disposition

of wagner and yevgeny prigozhin. >> do you have any idea where he is right now? >> i don't have any assessment about his location. >> and last thing is do you think that it's going to have any kind of impact on the russian operations in ukraine or also on wagner activities outside of ukraine, like in syria and africa? >> i think it's too soon to tell with respect to both of those questions. certainly the events we saw over the weekend where you see wagner forces to some extent withdrawing from ukraine and instead marching on and occupying a russian city are a significant step. what happens to the wagner forces in the wake of the announcement on saturday and a couple days, we don't know what will happen to wagner in

ukraine, don't know what will happen to wagner in africa. i will say as we have said before, wherever are we have seen wagner operate in the past, we have seen death and destruction follow in their wake and we have policies to hold them accountable and to counter wagner's influence, and where he is in the world pick up the mantle that wagner has carried, we will take actions to hold either wagner or successor accountable. >> ambassador tracy went to the foreign ministry or called the foreign ministry and there were communications here in d.c.? and what were -- what were they? >> we had communications over the weekend on -- actually, we have communications on saturday with the russian government, both ambassador tracy and at other levels here in washington, where we delivered two messages to them. number one, we expected russia

to withhold its obligations, to uphold its obligations, i should say, to protect our embassy and diplomatic personnel in moscow, and two, to reiterate what we said publicly, internal russian affair, the united states is not involved and will not be involved. >> matt, senator warner, obviously the chairman of the committee, told me on the air that they believe, he believes reports he's seen that prigozhin is in minsk. do you have indication of that as well? >> i don't have an assessment of his location, no. >> do you know what concessions he may have received regarding shoigu or anything else? >> i do not, i would note in respect to that, we have gotten a lot of questions with respect to shoigu and the united states

does not take position on the leadership of the russian federation. we do not take a position of the r ministry of defense, violate the integrity and sovereignty of the neighbors, malign influence across the world, that's our policy with russia, not the disposition of the ministry of defense or other offices inside the country. >> on the record statement that came out on saturday was the confidence in command and control of the nuclear forces. and i infer from that there is military to military communication as one would expect, between us and the russians. in contrast to a different

situation with china. >> i won't speak to any inferences, i will let the pentagon speak to military to military communications whether it happened or not. i will say however as the secretary said yesterday, we do not -- did not see, do not see any change in the disposition of russian nuclear forces and have not changed the disposition of ours. >> the secretary did say p utin's influence power has been shaken. can you speak to that. >> this certainly was a new moment in -- if you think of the events of the last few years, as the secretary said, 16 months ago the russian federation and vladimir putin envisioned that russian forces would be taking kyiv and instead over the weekend, we saw russian forces taking a russian ministry of defense office inside a russian

city. the entire pretext of the war questioned openly. something we have done, allies and partners have done, something you have not seen in russia, you can be thrown in jail inside of russia. we saw yevgeny prigozhin challenging putin's leadership. all significant steps and change from what we have seen. what that means going forward, we don't know. >> has vladimir putin, as you know him, and this administration knows him, tolerated this kind of insubordination, whether in the immediate future or long-term. would he tolerate this kind of challenge to his authority. >> i would not ever want to speculate on how vladimir putin might respond to any event,

certainly not inside russia. >> on the diplomatic efforts that were made over the weekend, did russians respond to those messages from u.s. diplomats, ambassador tracy and the others? >> i won't speak to the russian response, just the messages we delivered to them. >> i'm not asking you to characterize them, i'm just asking -- >> it was a conversation. it wasn't a one -- one-way conversations we deliver and the other side hangs up. it was a conversation, yes. >> and then one thing the secretary said over the weekend is that to the extent that russia is now distracted by what's happening internally in its country, that could create an additional advantage for the ukrainians. how exactly is the you state encouraging ukrainians to take advantage of this moment? >> i would say -- i would frame it slightly differently. we continue to supply the

ukrainians with equipment they need to conduct the counteroffensive and to defend themselves long-term. we continue to have intelligence sharing channels with the ukrainians, continue to have military channels, continue to have diplomatic channels that are open with ukraine. what the secretary was speaking to is the fact that you did see what wagner forces withdraw from ukraine and instead move on a russian city. how that shakes out, what happens in the coming days with respect to wagner forces or other russian military forces i don't think we can say. but certainly we are in close consultation with ukraine and the ukrainian military about the ongoing counteroffensive. >> thank you. last time white house and the state department said that prigozhin and [indiscernible] what trade with north korea?

>> i think it's too soon to tell, too early to tell how any of the existing wagner operations or wagner arrangements will change, if at all, moving forward. >> chinese foreign minister had a meeting yesterday. do you know about the content of their meetings? >> i do not know the contents of the meeting, but reiterate what secretary blinken said in beijing and a number of interviews afterwards, when we were in beijing, over a week ago now, or sunday and monday, the issue of ukraine and the russian invasion of ukraine did come up in the meetings and secretary blinken was quite clear with the chinese officials he met with if they wanted to play a constructive role in helping find a just and lasting peace

that recognized ukraine's territorial integrity and sovereignty, we would welcome them playing such a role, but i don't have a readout of that which took place. >> to follow up on that, is there anything you can parse from chinese statements about the mutiny, and do you think that this -- seeing this instability and the cracks in the russian regime might give china pause in their support for the russians? >> i wouldn't want to speculate how they might read this situation. i would reiterate what secretary blinken said, we would urge them to continue to not support russia with direct military assistance. they discussed that in their meetings, and whether it changes

how they have approached this conflict or not, i don't know. but if they did want to play a constructive role that recognized the need to preserve ukraine's territorial integrity and sovereignty, it's a role they play. >> belarus, any direct contact between the united states and lukashenko or people in the regime? >> not that i'm aware of. >> relations with lukashenko are quite bad, how do you see the fact that prigozhin is going to belarus? >> i want to wait and see what actually happens, where prigozhin does end up before i make a speculative comment to what will occur. >> do you think it's possible he will wind up in belarus? >> we don't have an assessment

at this time. >> is there a message the united states has to some countries in africa that have partnered in wagner about what the unrest shows and which direction they should go? >> i will say two things. number one, reiterate the message to these countries publicly and privately in the past, which is that any time wagner enters a country, death and destruction follows. wagner exploit local populations, we see them extract local wealth, we see them commit human rights abuses. we have always encouraged any country not to engage with wagner forces because of the deleterious effects it will have on their countries and most specifically on their people. and with respect to this, what happened over the weekend, it would just reiterate -- it would reinforce the concerns we stated about the instability wagner

brings with it when it enters any country. >> just a couple of questions to follow up on what he just said. to backtrack a little bit. the state department definition on what happened or nearly happened or failed to happen over the weekend? >> what do you mean? >> just said the events that happened. do you have any definition, how do you call it? >> i think the events that happened were yevgeny progression prigozhin took a group of forces and marched on rostov and marked toward moscow and stopped. i won't speak to what his intentions were. i'll say it is vladimir putin that raised the spector of 1917, not anyone from the united states government. >> timeline, precise and when did exactly the ambassador reach out to russian and what did she convoy. everything we have heard from lavrov, was it accurate?

>> i'm not going to speak to lavrov's characterization. the conversations we had with the russian government were on saturday and along the lines i outlined a minute ago. happy to go through them again. >> the secretary said we have not seen the last act yet. sentiment this might be just an episode of what can be a long-running, you know, internal fight in russia. >> i think what the secretary was speaking to is quite obvious, this is a situation that remains dynamic. and we do not yet know how it will end. >> the last act. >> the secretary envisions the last act is russian withdrawing forces from ukraine. and if not, ukraine being victorious on the battlefield. beyond that, i would not want to speculate. >> do you have an assessment on the status of the wagner kind of forces after the weekend's events? >> i do not.

i do not. >> so just to summarize what happened, whether you call it a coup or not, almost a coup over the world's largest nuclear power over the weekend, and you mentioned him questioning the war as a positive but prigozhin has criticized putin for not being aggressive enough in the war on ukraine and said things like russia should be more like north korea to have success in this war. so, he took over russia's southern military district, that district is 60 miles away from one of their nuclear air bases. so, in general, this seems like an incredibly dangerous situation. i see you are viewing some of the developments in a positive light, but to me it just seems like this was the most dangerous situation that has happened since the beginning of the war and my question is, you know, given how much funding we have provided in this war, more than any other country in the world, more than the two countries even

fighting the war. we could end this diplomatically but we are still steadfastly supporting ukraine to the end. was there no consideration to how differently this coup could have gone, how out of hand it could have gone and then does that affect your consideration into like -- is it worth it, is it worth this nuclear risk, is it worth a mercenary getting access to russia's nuclear arsenal, are the crimea and donbas, who rules those regions. >> wow, that -- that was a lot, wow. i will say a few things. first of all, i do not agree with your characterization of how we interpreted the events here. number two, i will say there are no heroes on either side of this conflict between the russian regime and yevgeny prigozhin

attacking civilians and infrastructure. and the russian matter, a decision for the russian people to make. third, i will say when you look at the events over the weekend it only reinforces the need for us to continue to support ukraine, which is the country that was invaded by russia, by russian military forces and by wagner forces. if anything, our support for ukraine and the wake of this event is more steadfast than it has ever been. >> i was not trying to say -- i was not trying to say that you were supporting prigozhin in any way, i'm saying this development was extremely dangerous and do you at least admit that. 60 miles from their nuclear air base. >> the secretary said yesterday instability in a major country is a concern and something we monitor closely. >> i want to change topic. >> one