♪ live in the moment. ask your doctor about otezla. my name is brian delallo. i teach ap and honors economics in pittsburgh, pennsylvania. financial well-being to me is knowing that i can be free to do the things that i love to do. i hope when i retire someday, they say, that guy made this place a special place to come to school and gave as much as he could to help the community. >> the fbi is offering to help new york homicide investigators as they chase a possible serial killer. >> two dozen police recruits expanded the search for bodies from the thicket to the beach. >> she was grabbed and pulled

into the truck. police missed her by five minutes. >> could have kept her from getting out of here. that weighs heavily on your mind. >> sandra: it is a case that has baffled investigators on long island and captured the attention of a nation over a decade now, but a suspect is about to be arraigned. >> nonstop dogged determination of the men and women of the police department, investigators and partners in law enforcement, all of that work never stopped. >> sandra: welcome back, a second hour kicks off of "america reports," and it is a busy news hour indeed. sandra smith in new york. hi, rich. >> rich: good afternoon, sandra. i'm in for john roberts in washington. rex heuermann is expected to be arraigned after he was arrested

in new york city. >> sandra: heavy police presence outside his massapequa park home, 25 minute ride from where four minute were found along the highway leading to gilgo beach. six more victims were found in 2011. many neighbors acting to the arrest. >> the guy has been quiet, never bothers anybody. we are kind of shocked. >> it's crazy, mind blowing. it's, you know, quiet massapequa park. >> i've had small talk with the gentleman because he was do like woodwork, you know, average guy living in suburban area. >> rich: retired connecticut homicide detective foley is standing by, but first to lauren green. >> so far what we know about the suspect is that he is just an everyday kind of man.

leading a middle class life in one of long island, new york's bedroom communities. 59-year-old rex heuermann is in custody and expected to make a court appearance. new information from the bail application lists the charges against him, three counts of murder in the first-degree, and three counts of murder in the second degree. he is the owner of r.h. architectural, and he does consulting and helps building owners navigate the building codes. a swarm of police vehicles swarmed his home on long island, searching his home for evidence of the gilgo women of four women, and could be linked to ten killings. shannon gilbert, 24-year-old

melissa, 25-year-old maureen, and megan, and amber, now known as gilgo four, working as craigslist escorts. heuermann's neighbors are finding it hard to believe. >> everything is safe, everything is good. this was totally a shock. >> shocked, surprised, crazy that it happened in, you know, where you live now. >> investigators are scheduled to hold a press conference in a few hours, and as i said, heuermann is expected to make a court appearance any minute now. back to you. >> lauren, thank you. sandra. >> sandra: retired connecticut homicide brian foley. great to have you here, brian. make some sense of what we are seeing here, this is obviously riverhead new york, expecting the arraignment to take place. the family of one of the victims was speaking outside of the

courthouse a few moments ago, suggesting they believe there is more than one killer involved here but at last they said somebody is in custody. >> well, certainly there could be more. what we are going to get here at his arraignment, appear before the court and get a look at the charges but not the full case, bare bones at best. police officers or the people talking out of law enforcement are using the phrase good old fashioned police work. typically that does not weigh heavily on dna. i have to suspect dna does play a part, but typically when you have dna, you want something linking that person to the area and the time when the incident occurred, too. that would be where the good old fashioned police work comes in and that's chasing down credit cards, license plates readers, anything to find to put that person in the area around the time of the murder. i like good old fashioned police, they never stopped working the case, this is a comfort to families around the

country to have cases solved more than ten years after, good work by the police department. >> sandra: the one family speaking outside the courthouse, the first cousin of jessica, 20 years old when she was found killed. the map of the gilgo beach killings, the vicinity in which these did take place and what we are dealing with now, and then the map of the suspect's home in relation to the killings. just 15 miles away. to put this in perspective, and now what we are learning about the suspect, rex heuermann and the gilgo beach murders, 59 years old, an architect, he's married with two children. he was arrested in midtown manhattan thursday night. the lawyer for the family just a short time ago said they learned about this suspect and his arrest at 6:20 a.m. this morning. and other than that, this was not somebody who was even on their radar. so, how do police handle a case

like that where the families are not even getting tipped off they are following so closely. >> sometimes you can't tip off the families. the families sometimes talk to media and this is a widely publicized case. i promise you, the minute he became a suspect, he grew a tail of police officers 24/7. if he's a suspect, the worst thing that can happen while you are investigating he takes another body out as well. so, you have to follow him. it gets expensive. he made it easy in the close area geographically, making it easier for the cops. only so many law enforcement agencies now that are going to get involved. a handful of federal agencies, state and local but these teams, you have the prosecutors, the cops and the scientists all working this case together but that's a small area. i'm sure all police departments know each other, everybody is familiar, they have something strong to put down three murders and behind bars.

and now working the rest of the cases of the gilgo beach murders. >> sandra: this arraignment could be happening right now, we have asked to put cameras in the room, we can't get a whole lot of information out of the courthouse directly. you are smiling, i'm sure you know how that goes. but no electric devices in the courtroom itself we have been told, so we don't know what we are about to see but it's expected to happen by 2:00 eastern time. >> so we'll be ready. but at best, allow one pool camera in there and that cameraman feeds it to the rest of the agencies, obviously they are very tight letting people in there, and each judge and each courtroom is different. there's no uniform way of determining whether or not cameras are going to be let into the courtroom. and i was a reporter for a while, too. it's very frustrating when you want to get in there and you can't, so i understand the reerns, -- reasons.

victims' families might not want the camera on them. >> sandra: a family just spoke outside, but then our producer asking what the long line was in the courthouse a moment ago say some identified as family members of the victims. so they're there. they are certainly there, and they are hopeful this leads to something. this was the lawyer for some of the victims, john ray, on fox news earlier today. listen. >> we do know that the dna has been the key to all of their investigation and that dna was -- has been worked upon over and over in the fbi's labs. so, it's very likely that's the source of the entire thing. >> so that's really interesting. we'll see if that was ultimately what led to a crack in the case. but earlier we saw the investigation at his home with the protective clothing on, the

investigators, we saw them remove a vehicle from his home, they removed a freezer from his home. a lot is happening here and going back to who knew that they were on to this guy, he was still going to work every day as an architect in midtown manhattan. >> my guess is they had a tail on him. the office in manhattan might get searched. they had to get search warrants for the locations and go in and get them. that takes time and evidence and they went and got that evidence and the families are going to have to relive this. you have other families out there who are not one of these, that still their victim has not been, killer has not been caught yet, it's painful for them. when the cops make arrest on a homicide like this, they will work through conviction, hopefully or adjudication and i promise you he will have one heck of a defense attorney. this is a man of means, so i likely -- you will find out arraignment and he can afford

somebody decent. >> sandra: a little more information and i will tell you what i'm getting and have you react to it. we are hearing from the bail application "if convicted on the current charges, defendant rex a. heuermann faces multiple sentences of life without parole." ok, we know that he's been charged with murder and the death of three of the 11 victims in this long unsolved string of killings. he's charged with first and second-degree murder in connection with the death of three victims, the authorities say he's also the prime suspect in another killing, so from that bail application, again, if convicted on the current charges, the defendant faces multiple sentences of life without parole. >> no surprise there. they have the three arrests, he's behind bars. now they can slow down and really be methodical about chasing down all the remaining murders that are out there.

but again, these -- one murder is enough to keep this guy at 59 years old behind bars for the rest of his life. so, this is a monster off the street, got to be relief for the whole community. >> sandra: interesting, more from the courthouse now, there appears to be a clear pattern wherein heuermann used burner phones and burner/junk email addresses to contact the victims. that's really interesting. dr. bodin was on fox news earlier today in anticipation of this and talking about the advancement in phone technology. listen. >> it's interesting the way the technology of phones is also what was most important in the four deaths in idaho, it's an amazing technology being able to match up the calls made from a phone with the owner of the phone. >> sandra: clear pattern of burner phones, burner junk email

addresses to contact the victims. >> interesting, burner phones we saw in the city a lot, go to a small store, purchase it and use it and chuck it or toss it when they are done it with it and i think that's where the good old fashioned police work comes in, video or data again from those locations and then chasing them down. i don't know how we used to solve homicides before cell phones but cell phones are one of the greatest things. >> you mentioned chucking them, he stayed in close proximity to the murders. mary ellen o'toole joined us earlier and talking about the confidence in this suspect to stay so close to the crime scenes. >> he lived such a pro social lifestyle. his job, his family, that's why people around him said gee, he looked like such an ordinary guy. all of that contributed i think to his confidence in staying in

the same place and not moving throughout new york or even throughout the country. >> sandra: what does that tell you about the suspect? >> premeditation, this man is an intelligent person, he's an architect, like an engineer, and plan and think thinks out. everyone thinks they have a good plan for murder and turns out not to be so hot. i know the charges are alleged right now, a press conference at 4:00 where they are going to talk about everything. i promise these charges are going to be solid and firm on this person. >> sandra: really interesting and the fact that he was showing up to go to work every day, carrying on, his neighbors said, but it's not uncommon. >> it's always the guy you never knew and never suspected. never the creepy guy around the corner, always the guy that fit in with society. >> sandra: so again, this arraignment could be happening right now but we were expecting around this time. i'm sorry? okay, so we are continuing to watch what's happening. we know there are victims'

families in there, we know that -- we know the country is watching. this has been more than a decade now, brian. unbelievable it's coming to this moment. looking back at what we heard from the attorney speaking outside the courthouse a few moments ago, he said this is a positive step but noted it's just the beginning. but the fact that this was not somebody who was even on their radar until this morning at 6:20 a.m., you got to imagine what that was like for the families of these victims to get that phone call. >> yeah, you never -- one, they had to tell all the families, not just the 3 or 4 in the affirmative part of the case. you never know how they react. one, they have to live through all this, and i promise you in the arraignment they are living through it again right now. when they hear the details. it's painful. not the celebration when you think it is when you make the death notification, more often than not there is absolutely just sorrow being relived and pain for the family as they go

through that exact moment, the last time they saw the cops and talking about the death if they lost their loved one. so very painful. >> sandra: and some of the families contacted after the revolution of this suspect and his arrest yesterday when asked to speak said they were not ready, they were so taken aback by this news, having just learned about it in the wee hours of the morning, many families are just taking this in and watching this moment right now. brian, can you stick around with us as we await more news here. >> rich: mercedes colwin, thank you for joining us. according to the biography, the suspect is married and according to the bail application police were able to find out was that when you had these disappearances his wife was largely out of town. she was either in iceland, she was out of the country, or she was in new jersey. you know, when you look at this type of suspect, is this the type of pattern, one of the

pieces of evidence you are going to present and put forward here in any type of trial? >> well, certainly they look for alibis. as a defense attorney you look for ways to deflect the criminality of what's happening to the client. they look to say well, he was taking care of his children, create another alibi, but a key person that would fortify any explanation why he wasn't the killer would be his wife, she is suddenly out of town. it is such an incredible break, i'm glad to hear the story broke. i have a home in long island, this has been dominating across the news and on long island people were fearful. it's a popular beach to this type of activity taking place. >> rich: another thing we are learning, march 2022, directly from the application, two months

found a first generation chevrolet avalanche was registered to the defendant as described they say significant because one of the witnesses, amber costello identified a first generation chevrolet avalanche. we do know there was a vehicle, we had video of it, a vehicle getting taken away from his home in massapequa park earlier today, had no idea what vehicle it was, but another key piece of evidence. >> without question, it's a lot of dna evidence. we don't know where the women died. we know from at least one 911 call, a woman panicked and thought her life was at risk, some evidence she had gone to a location not at the beach. so if the young women were killed in a home near the beach, then transported, all the dna

evidence is going to be found in the vehicle that was used to make that transport. so, any where, any locations where dna evidence could exist, in his home, in his car, at his offices. there might be trace elements, because he was going to work every day, another shocker. and maybe not so shocking for those of us that cover a lot of this, all of us do cover serial killers, btk killer was installing security installments in homes for 40 years, dennis radar, so a lot of these serial killers have normal homes. they have normal routine. they have great jobs. they have families. they are married. it's all of that and then they have this terrible dark secret that doesn't come to light until great law enforcement work is done like today. >> so police have been at his house all day long, a big black

box truck there, white suits on not to disturb what they are looking into there. you mentioned this has been a dozen years since we have had any victims found along that stretch on long island. what could they find? we have the chevy avalanche that prosecutors say could be part of all of this. what other type of evidence do you look for in a case like this? >> well, any digital evidence. so, and it sounds like this suspect had burner phone and burner emails, these fake email addresses he was corresponding with the victims. that's all going to be such critical evidence because as in any crime that there is that much evidence, so you are going to start with the dna evidence and then move on to the forensic evidence, which includes the digital data, digital footprint, the telephone, emails, all of that is needed when you charge someone with depriving them of

the balance of their lives. they -- he could, if he's convicted, four consecutive life terms, he's not going to live long enough. 59 years of age. one life sentence is enough for him to spend the rest of his life in prison. >> rich: and he will have time to put his case out there, but the case they are willing to at least release to the public at this point. mercedes colwin, thanks for joining us this afternoon. back to you. >> sandra: we are learning a lot more from the bail application, bring back retired connecticut homicide detective brian foley, we are going through the application together, a hair that was removed from a burlap material wrapped around the victim and another, in january, a surveillance team observing and recovered a pizza box that

was thrown by the defendant rex a. heuermann into a garbage can located in front of 385 5th avenue in manhattan, a swab was taken from the leftover pizza crust. how big of a development is that? >> it's fantastic. that was back in january, so before that, prior to that, if they were trying to get a swab, where he left a cup of coffee, he drew a tail of cops wearing sunglasses a long time they have been following him and now the swab to match the hair, trying to do a 1 to 1. original hair was not enough to get a hit on a certain person. he's a suspect, they get the swab and now match on 1 to 1. now they can start digging into him now that they know he's not

only a suspect for one, but for more. now they are going to start digging in and this gentleman is not going to see the light of day. i'm guessing at his arraignment, he's going to come out in his new uniform and we will not see him in street clothe again. >> sandra: do you know this particular courthouse? >> i don't. >> sandra: we will know when the arraignment happens and when it's over, a rush of reporters will come out of the room. no electronic devices in the courtroom. you are referencing the hair found in the burlap the victim's skeletal remains. initial examination of a recovered male hair from the bottom of the burlap used to wrap that victim by her killer. initial examination of that hair was revealed to be caucasian european characteristics, but was unsuitable for more at the

time, hair was subsequently submitted for further dna analysis, and in july 2020 they had a dna profile of the hair, and then enter the pizza slice, and then they are connecting the dna from the two and they have found a match. >> yes, back when the murders happened, dna technology is not what it was and since between, when that happened to where we are now, it's moved so fast and so detectives had to be along all this time careful about consumption. talk about consumption for a minute. you have a single hair. test -- every time you test it you lose a part of the evidence you have and you worry about consuming all that evidence when you know that technology is getting better and better. if it was -- if technology was that good ten years ago, imagine what it's going to be ten more years from now to have it. what we are missing here, how did they know to good to him to

get the swab off the pizza box, and the avalanche, they are going to shake that thing upside down and see what falls out and get any bit of dna they can out of it. usually -- in my experience you have a car used in a type of murder they tend to turn up evidence at a high rate of success. the detectives that worked those -- the cars and actually know where to look and the crazyyest little spots to find dna and one more thing, looking at the burner phones and the emails. you can bet an electronic lab and electronic detectives chasing down data and everything, they are not out in the street, they are in the labs and the computers and doing work. they are incredible. >> sandra: can you tell me how they found the pizza slice -- ok, it was found in 2020. they obviously had the hair from the burlap material a much longer time before that.

why are we sitting here three years after they found the pizza slice and then they already had the hair. why would it take so long to make the dna match. >> in january -- >> sandra: sent to the lab, the swab from the pizza slice this year, march of 2023. so you are saying the timeline still sounds about -- >> it's right on. test it in 2020, they don't have a great hit but something better than when they originally tested it and now developed him as a suspect. where do we get from the dna hit to know we want to follow this guy around and test. they are not testing everybody in the city of new york, they went after this guy's slice. >> sandra: does this also tell you he's not been acting very carefully to throw away an unfinished piece a pizza? >> he'll have to hide in a survival shelter in his basement

if the cops following him. if he opens a doorknob, they are going to go after him. >> sandra: two live pictures on the screen, courthouse where we understand the arraignment is about to happen or is happening in riverhead, new york. massapequa park, new york, outside the suspect's home. i believe we also have, you referenced his office. you imagined a search of his office. this is the referenced address in the bail application, 3855th avenue in manhattan. this is his office where he was going to work every day as an architect and has been for the entire time that this search and investigation has been ongoing. >> search warrant, the police officers will write we are searching for electronic evidence or devices. and if they have enough to get in his home, they have enough to search in the office. if they are looking for burner phones, looking for electronic

records, they will seize computer. if they have not hit the office, and they could have done that quietly, a team could go in there more quietly than a team in a neighborhood, do it after hours, work with the police report management, and in an office building and make a mess for the other people. so, that would be done typically more quietly. my guess is they have not hit it yet but are going to. >> sandra: just to go back to the timeline, 2020 when they went for another round of the hair -- took another shot at the hair from the burlap. it was january 2023 they found the pizza slice, that went in for testing, this was sent -- the swab was sent from the pizza march 23. so here we are july and these victims' families, you have to think, wow, a really big phone call this morning. >> they are probably upset, some angst over the told they were not told in january or 2020, all

these facts, but the cops are playing poker here and have to keep their cards close to their chest and be secretive about this until now and the united states they have to make it public when they take somebody off the street and take away their freedoms. >> sandra: i want to end with this part of the bail application tying together the hair and the pizza slice -- ok, significant the defendant, heuermann, cannot be excluded from the male hair recovered nearby the bottom of the burlap used to transport megan waterman's naked and deceased body. and if you could, brian, stay with us. rich. >> rich: sandra, bring in former fbi investigator bill daley, and you've been listening to the conversation with sandra, and recap what prosecutors and police say they have. a dna match, connection to a burner phone, a car, a chevy

avalanche and spouse out of town each time one of these victims or many of these victims would have been found. how damning of that is that of a case? >> well, certainly based upon just kinds of the facts right now, extremely compelling, a stunning development in this case. probably say, you know, certainly what we see in the bail application, the details provided, goes to show you the extraordinary depth the police have gone through. and this case is now over a decade from the conception with the police investigated the fbi on the crime scene as part of this, at one point, kind of went quiet. the police commissioner in suffolk county reignited the investigation, and bringing back some former detectives who worked on the case and goes to show you the fruits of those labors. also probably say it goes to show you kind of the advancement of some of the for instances

that have gone on is that many of the cases we are seeing happened and the country are resolved, much like this one, coming through the fact that advances in dna analysis and other forensic analysis have come a long way even from the time the crimes were committed. so a very successful case however much longer than one would have expected. and having followed this case both as a former fbi investigator and knowing the area where these remains were found it's stunning, compelling and relieving for many of the people, not just associated with the victims' families but overall, people from long island and people who frequent those beach areas during the normal course of their days. >> rich: you talked about the timeline, and it has been a dozen years. how much more difficult and was it the development of dna forensics that really saved that case, do you think, that brought it back and brought it to the

point we are today? >> i do think based again on the preliminary information we have from the filings in court, is that you know, forensic analysis, the dna analysis, is something that has been kind of compelling part of this, and kind of drawing him in to being a more -- a suspect. and the pizza box and the connection with the forensic analysis, dna. so, it's a combination of good police work, of hard police work over the years, multi-agencies, we need to keep in mind this -- these crimes in the gilgo beach area, which by the way for people who are listening and viewers is that this is a really one of the most majestic kind of drives you can have in and and the new york area.

i frequently go down that drive, the ocean on one side, bay on one side, and desolate during times. the area where it was found led to some diminishment early on, it's near salt water, you know, out, way out in the open in the reed, the wetlands area, adjacent to the ocean parkway where ultimately the victims were found. going back to answer the question -- i think good hard police work and nose to the ground has paid off many years later. >> rich: hearing from the team, county crime lab technicians are in the home. two state police trucks appear to be in the area, emptying the driveway, bringing out evidence, and we have a walk of the respect led by authorities.

we are working to get you that video as soon as possible. but bill, this idea, and this came from the attorneys representing some of the victims' families here, that there is more than one suspect. what do you say to that? >> well, in the case such as this where there could be other people either knowingly, complicit, actively complicit, or just benignly complicit, meaning they have some concerns and suspicions but did not come forward, i think that it is very possible. i know there are some earlier leads being tracked down by the fbi in places like alabama and elsewhere regarding tattoos of some -- >> rich: we have the video, and here he is, 59-year-old suspect picked up in new york city, a resident of massapequa park. police believe he is responsible for at least a handful of the deaths, bodies that were found along that portion of long island back in 2010.

they say they revived this back in 2022 and that dna evidence, car connections to burner phone, his wife being out of town, a number of different pieces of evidence have led them to the moment and led them to the person they believe did this, ongoing initial appearance in long island, and i want to get you back to the idea we were just discussing here. to that end, you know, what we are looking at here, where are we in this process and you know, this is a suspect who is also going to have a day in court and likely multiple days in court. >> exactly. and suspect is the key word, as' digsal information is gathered we don't expect as far as the court filings is the be all and end all that they will come up with, searching his home, his office, the vehicle, you know,

all come into play and maybe sheds more additional light on one individual or several individuals who are deceased as a result of this potential suspect. i would like to point out to people who are viewing and listening is that where he lives in massapequa park is over the great south bay causeway from where the bodies were found. that's only circumstantial, it does kind of play into some of the logistics in and and where the remains were found and where this suspect has his home. so i think a number of things at play here. another thing that cause me by of interest, and i don't mean to play off my former colleagues analysis, but someone like this, who knows there's been intense, intense investigation. not only just news reports but some documentaries put together regarding the case, its been in the headlines on and off over

these many years has stayed in one place, you know, stayed in perhaps the same home with a vehicle that was perhaps used during the commission of these crimes. it is kind of quite interesting is that how this person continued on that kind of everyday life kind of hiding among his fellow citizens and fellow co-workers and has come to this point where he's been found out. but it is quite interesting. and also interesting to know whether or not there are any other crimes out there that may be eventually connected to him, not suggesting that there are, but because sometimes these individuals who commit these heinous crimes do sometimes stop and does not mean they do it for their entire lifetime, but perhaps there are other crimes committed since these four remains were found that may be connected with him and time will tell and forensics will certainly tell the story. >> rich: bill, major, major developments over the last

couple of hours, these keep coming along in cases that go back more than 20 years. bill daly, thanks for joining us this afternoon. sandra. >> sandra: our coverage continues as we await for the arraignment, the suspect's home right side of the screen where county crime lab trucks, you can see the truck, the empty truck there, parked in the driveway, and we are told that it looks like they are bringing more evidence outside momentarily, they have removed a vehicle, they have removed a freezer, we have seen this throughout the course of the day. brian foley is still with me, retired connecticut homicide detective. the perp walk video, just in, it's striking when you see this, we have seen his picture, the suspect. obviously a very tall man, as he

is walked out of the shirley, new york precinct, polo shirt, khakis, handcuffed, and trying to get an expect time stamp on it, our affiliate grabbed it he's taken to the courthouse. >> you are right, that's a big dude, a big guy, and when you look at the victims, that is scary. look, you typically don't have a perp walk like that, but every police department has a sally port to do that in an enclosed area where the media is not there. with so many years that have gone by, a lot of people have lost confidence in the law enforcement to solve these cases. walking him out, not too conspicuously but if it were a shoplifter they would not have the entourage.

i see different uniforms, so different departments involved. they are taking him from there to the state of new york corrections, intake procedure before he appears before the judge this afternoon. so that is the departure from p.d., and the handoff over to the state court system or state corrections. i see reporters exiting the room. this is activity as you just mentioned we would see. >> this is a planned arraignment. they grabbed him this morning, they knew they would be able to get him pretty easily, and you have an arraignment that happens this quickly in the afternoon, i promise you the court knew it was coming and the detectives, prosecutors, they work with the court and the judge to get an arraignment done this afternoon. i bet that's the only event that happened in that room today. this was all preplanned because you have such a big fish in the boat, look, we intend on locking

him up. detectives want to take another bite at the apple and mirandaize him and unless he confessed all day to everything else, no way they would get the arraignment done this afternoon. so prearranged, and well done -- >> sandra: he pled not guilty to all six counts there. >> 0 shock there, 0. not guilty, no doubt. and let's go, and let's see what you've got and now throw our cards down on the table. detectives, like i said, detectives ain't stopping now, they are going to pull everything out of the house and they got -- they know the wife was out of the country for at least one of these, my guess is you will see that type of pattern. yeah, one time she's out of the country for one of the murders, suspect's wife out of the country, is that circumstantial

for a lot of them. >> you have to think about what it means not just for the families of the victims but that community. everybody who has been living through this fear for years and years now and governor kathy hochul of the state of new york, just appearing somewhere on long island and said this is a day that is a long time coming. hopefully a day that will bring peace to the community and the families, peace that is long overdue, and you just heard mercedes colwin, everything to these people who live there. not a day that goes by it's not a prevalent thought for members of that community. >> like i said, it comes back to confidence and confidence in your police department, your law enforcement, this whole time that's been out there, people are losing confidence in the police department. so to make this kind of arrest is significant. look, i'll take it one step further and you are also losing another family here, he has a

wife and children that have to live with this and cameras chasing them arnold schwarzenegger -- we can look at the closure if not closure, for the victims' families moving forward, a lot of pain for people involved and they'll interview the wife, interview the children. >> sandra: and whether or not she had any idea or suspected anything. you mentioned she was out of town at the time of one of the murders and go back to the police work done then and per phone records she was travelling and away at the time of at least one of the murders. >> she might be able to lead police, if she cooperates, to other things. hey, might want to look in this area for evidence or in this storage container or this apartment or something along those lines. she'll have the most intimate

knowledge of the whereabouts and movements, even then she might know some things and also some patterns and she'll be able -- that's a big interview for detectives if they have not will are talked with her, they are probably talking to her as we speak. >> sandra: after being transported, we show the video again to anybody tuning in of the suspect arrested yesterday. victims' families were made aware this morning, evidence being recovered from his home. this him leaving shirley, new york, the precinct there, he has pled not guilty to all six counts against him. two kids, married, lived in that house since the 1980s, law enforcement saying the suspect has been on their radar since last year. they matched him to crimes by tracking phone calls made there burner phones, a huge part of the discovery. cell phones over ten years ago, they are saying this is good old fashioned police work, you and i just went through the bail

application that revealed ultimately what they were able to do was tie a hair found in a burlap wrap of one of the victims a long time ago to a piece of pizza he threw away outside of his manhattan office, he's an architect, still going to work every day, threw away a piece of pizza, they swabbed that pizza and they were able to match that to the hair strand they found many years ago. >> you are seeing that so much these days. when you have the new investments and the female dna side of things, not a 1 to 1 match but narrows down to a couple cousins and brother here and there. you are seeing the cold case detectives getting a lot of success when they have a suspect, chasing him down, following him around and waiting for them to leave something to get a good 1 to 1 match. the guy probably does not have a criminal record, dna is not in

the system at all so now when they have the piece of hair off the burlap sack, they wait for him once he's a suspect and then the exact 1 to 1 match, give them probable cause to make the arrest and probable cause to turn the house upside down, search the office, find the avalanche and all those things which they may have already done. >> sandra: a chance there could be some post arraignment pressers, hear from victims' families, lawyers involved as they entered the courthouse, we'll go to that if they speak any moment now. rich, off to you for the moment. >> rich: sandra, trial attorney mercedes colwin. thanks for joining us again this afternoon. you heard it there, he's pled not guilty to six counts here. what comes next? >> not surprising he did so. probably remanned prison, he

could very well be a flee, because the charges are so significant and might be a flight risk, that will probably be denied, and then starts the process, continuation of the investigation. especially now that they have the right to go in and search awesome the key spots, key areas that other dna evidence may be found. his office and home and of course the truck they seized. >> certainly doing that. we are learning there is a bail hearing august 1st, which is a couple of weeks from now. through his attorney he pled not guilty to all counts, three counts of first-degree murder, and three counts of second-degree murder, remanded without bail at the ask of his attorney, michael brown. bail hearing august 1st. suf

suffolk county district attorney said he was linked by dna, and during the murders his family, wife and children were out of town. and there is that, the dna, the burner phones on top of that, the vehicle that one of the victims said -- identified as a first generation chevy avalanche, he had one registered to him. how does it look and stack up for him and what challenge does he have over the next several months. >> there are lots of challenges but the defense attorneys are going to look to criticize the collection of evidence. was this a rush to judgment, that may be deflected readily. but then the battle of the forensics, did you do the proper investigation, the proper lab analysis, look at all the other avenues.

talk there might be others involved. if there are others involved, maybe the focus on rex heuermann is not as fixed and as strong as it could be. but you are exactly right. if you look and piece together all the evidence right now and the defense attorney is going to look at it like massive pieces of puzzles, the only way to do it, pick it up one at a time. say the lab analysis was not done properly. perhaps the chain of custody when you get a piece of evidence, what's the chain of custody, was it handled properly. the pictures you see, you see the investigators are in full hazmat suits. why? they don't want to be accused of having the collection of evidence and integrity of the evidence called into question. great example of that, o.j.

simpson trial, the collection of evidence and what happened to the blood samples. that is a master class what needs to be done by law enforcement to make sure those types of attacks are not -- >> rich: and you are looking on the left, family members, attorneys representing family members, by the way, a point here, heuermann's attorney asked for more time to prepare for the bail hearing, the judge postponed the hearing to the first of august. you mentioned the timeline. how much does that complicate things. you are talking about evidence left out between a bay and the ocean and talking about murders that happened 20 plus years ago. how difficult is that to ensure

this is the type of evidence to be present and be confident in to try to get conviction? >> those are great points. that's so key for the defense. they are going to start to looking and challenge the integrity of the evidence and you are raising great points. you are talking about the degrading of those types of evidence. of course it's going to diminish over time, especially when you are talking about body samples and samples, dna samples that come from the women, come from the suspect, and obviously this is the suspect, the actual criminal who committed the heinous crimes but has to boil down to. was the evidence kept in a way the integrity, or the fact it may diminish over time, has been stored in a way that it really does diminish any sort of issues that may come when you are talking about the passage of time and frankly, the defense is going to jump all over that. there are so many elements that could possibly affect the integrity of the evidence they

collected. >> rich: the judicial process just starting here, you have seen the video and thank you for joining us. back to you. >> sandra: chris swecker also joining us by phone. your reaction to everything and the break in this case ultimately was matched dna found on a pizza slice that went back to a piece of hair on the burlap wrapping of one of the victims. the suspect has pled not guilty to all six counts happening a short time ago. we did see him walked out of the shirley, new york precinct as he was driven to the courthouse. clarify about the bail. the attorney asked for more time for the bail hearing, so postponed to august 1st. chris, your reaction to all of this as we have now gotten a first look at the suspect this many years later? >> yeah, it's pretty

extraordinary. i mean, it looks like a good gum shoe case built on forensics over the last year so when they revived the cold case. so it isn't just the dna as you read up on it, it's cell phone evidence, it's -- there was a lot to work with here because he's one of those serial killers that felt the need to keep in touch with the victims and taunt them. >> sandra: one of the attorneys representing one of the families of one of the victims is now talking. >> family, she grew up with, in the household. jasmine robinson. she is, she's a cousin. first cousin. [indiscernible] >> that's correct. the only ones that were covered is three of the four. as you can tell, the police are

doing more work as well as the d.a. for us, it's a bittersweet victory after all those years of struggle to find the true killers. here is one of them. and there's other evidence. we have possibly with respect to this man that we are going to present to the district attorney in due course. we still think there are other suspects involved depending which other victim is involved and not found yet. so -- yes, there are. we are not giving up on our quest. my case continues in the civil court as against peter hacket on the death of shannon gilbert. that's still on the table, still going full force. so we are satisfied with what occurred today and finally a touch of justice has come to

suffolk county. how i would look at it. we were caught not completely by surprise. we had a tip not quite a week ago that something was about to occur. it was a very good tip, a credible source, so not surprised. just surprised when it happened, that it was first known early in the morning hours apparently, he was arrested in new york city, and we are surprised at who it is because we don't have any information about this man. so, about you -- >> police arrested him in new york city. >> this man was arrested in new york city, yeah. and we are hoping some of the other evidence that we have will be helpful to the district attorney in this prosecution as well as others. >> what do you think about the other bodies found [indiscernible] >> we are hoping that the murderers of those women will be located. now the police have been hopefully regenerated. it appears that what happened is

there was a hiatus of nothing happening until the year 2022, according to what you heard today. so, it's good to see that maybe the police will be regenerated to go out and do the rest of the job and finish it. we are a little worried about one thing is that when this concentration by the public, by the media, upon this fellow, that everything else will get sort of pushed aside and you know, it will -- everybody will feel satisfied that they have gotten somebody. we are hoping that's not going to happen, and rather that the police will be regenerated to do more than ever to find the murderers and nail them and put them in jail and do their job. that's all i can say. >> sandra: you've been listening to john ray there, the attorney representing two of the families calling it a great bittersweet victory for the families, for the community, justice for the

community he said as he walked out of the courtroom. and by the way, our first look at the evidence that has ultimately led to the arrest of the suspect, this is the pizza box provided by the suffolk county district attorney's office. i feel you have to jump in here. >> no one is going to accuse the suspect of being skinny, and as far as a dna or crime scene detective, plenty to get evidence off. just a little crust is plenty, one crust is many. but that is not even -- that's not even a challenge for dna detectives. >> sandra: so that was january. and chris swecker is with us. chris, they found the pizza he threw away outside of his office in manhattan, also a police presence right now, he was arrested at his office last night. the families were made aware this morning, and you just heard from the families they did not

have any head's up on the leads of this case, especially the pizza box was leading to dna and a hair on burlap material wrapped around a victim so many years >> yeah and i think that the pizza box is downstream from the better work. which is the cell phone tracking and the electronic evidence. all the things that brought them to this particular suspect. so at the end, all they had to do is wait long enough for him to discard something and then make the match. but dna and all forensic techniques advance every year and get better and better. and you see a lot of times when cold cases derived and the benefits of technology, and that's the case here. a lot of good police work here. but i think cell phone track

technology and in contact with the victims and contacting them on the burner phones and set up the dates on the burner phones. we don't know everything they did, but just a beautiful piece of forensic work done here. a combination of things that led them to that final step which was the pizza box and matching the dna. >> just a little bit more information here on the victim -- the victims families and obviously a big presence inside of the courtroom and the suspect, real quick. >> so he didn't get any bail today. the defense attorney didn't know this was going to happen and 2 o'clock arraignment and can i get more time. some argument that my client deserves bail. i doubt you see it and the weight of these crimes on august

1. >> the victim's attorney, get back to the courthouse there. >> absolutely want to take to trial. >> did you say that his wife is here? >> i did not say that. >> where was he last night when arrested? >> i don't have the details, may have been arrested at the house. i just stepped into it. manhattan, okay? >> what about all the evidence provided. >> i didn't see any evidence did you. you talking about the district attorney and circumstantial and i haven't seen anything and develop the defense. hard to comment, but important to know if someone is charged with a crime and you have to afford the presumption of innocence. >> [inaudible]. >> i just got this case an hour ago. the answer is no.