we are out of time. things to joe machi, kat timpf, my name is gg unafraid. here's laura. ♪ >> laura: i'm laura ingraham, this is "the ingraham angle" from washington tonight.

americans are devastated by violent crime and the railing against the system that puts thugs back out on the streets. citizens are begging for help. >> it's breaking my heart. lifetime resident, never seen nothing like what's going on now. it hurts. it hurts. and, you know, we just praying and praying, hoping god can intervene. >> laura: the families of victims across the country are demanding action before others get hurt. we're going to talk to one of the mothers whose sons was murdered and his killer may be getting a plea deal. plus, who the biden administration is blaming for commander's secret service sweet tooth. it will make you all say what the failla. jimmy failla will be here later in the show. first, the big news, kevin mccarthy is out as speaker of the house. >> washington must change. we have to break the cycle. kevin mccarthy is the speaker of the house of representatives and he has failed to take a stand where it matters.

so, if he won't, i will. >> the office of speaker of the house of the united states house of representatives is hereby declared vacant. [gavel] >> there is 2022 republicans up there. there is 190 of them not moving away from kevin mccarthy. they are just not. >> he will continue to being speaker there would be chaos that would continue because he has not been honest with either party. >> kevin mccarthy is a feature of the swamp. he has risen to power by collecting special interest money and redistributing that money in exchange for favors. we are breaking the fever now and we should elect a speaker who is better. >> laura: now, at this moment, the house g.o.p. conference is meeting to decide who can be the next speaker of the house. after the shocking ouster of mccarthy. now, you remember it took five days, 15 rounds of voting to get him confirmed back in january. but, just hours now to kick him out. it was an historic move orchestrated by florida congressman matt gaetz.

up until just before the show, gaetz was supposed to be sitting right here telling me what was going to come next in the big fight. and giving you behind the scenes details of the ouster. but he is in that all hands on deck meeting and can't get out. he did send us this note to share with you. i'm sorry i can't join you don't. i'm meeting with the house republican conference to chart our future. it's been a an historic day and our work is not done. now, i think we all do understand the underlying point here about governing by these continuing resolutions. we need a plan to protect the border. i mean, that we need to seriously consider the billions in aid that we're just rubber stamping, sending out to ukraine. but i have to say tonight, it's hard to see how what happened today gets republicans closer to achieving any of those goals. so the legitimate concerns may have, you know, some sticking power, but, the problem here, i

think, is two fold. number one, there is no plan that follows. that's what supposedly they are working on tonight, the folks suggested to take up the gavel have all said that they support mccarthy. so what's next? number two, after contending that mccarthy was wrong to use democrat votes to assist in passing a short-term spending package, gaetz and the seven other g.o.p. members use 208 democrats to oust mccarthy. okay what they do it. for all the talk about principles being at stake, i mean, congresswoman nancy mace proved to oust mccarthy as well because in her view, he didn't move fast enough on women's issues. another ken buck, another congressman isn't just, you know, opponent of impeachment inquiries, with mccarthy, he just moved forward on this idea of liz cheney being a friend of his. i mean, liz cheney is a friend

of ken buck? ken buck is supporting this gaetz. speaking of liz cheney she reportedly called dan goldman after one of his tv hits to tell him that he and the democrats should take mccarthy out. joining me now victor davis hanson, senior fellow at the hoar institution. charlie hurt opinion editor at the "washington times" fox news contributor. chearlg, to you, i think to people watching at home they don't understand the ins and outs of this but they are hard pressed to understand how this gets republicans republicans to the type of majority they need next year to effectuate change. >> i think it was completely incoherent. republicans only control by a very thin margin one half of 1/3 of government. that one half of one third has been pretty successful in marshaling what resources they

have to slow down this progressive revolution. then right in the middle of this when we are looking at impeachment. all these serious issues, just to get rid of the speaker without any plan condition continue again genesee to replace him feeds into the narrative that the republicans can't govern. while you do that, i don't know. more importantly gates argument too friendly with democrats. he used democrats to oust mccarthy. so hypocritical and contradictory and counter productive at a time when the republicans have no margin of error and they need to unite in every aspect of that word. here they are committing suicide. it doesn't make any sense. >> laura: charlie, this is at a time where republicans have an historic advantage on which party is better at handling the economy. i mean, going back to 191. they had the biggest lead on the

most important issue facing americans and now the attention is drawn to capitol hill and the fact that the republicans are so incapable of governing they lost a speaker in what, you know, hasn't really happened before in this way. your reaction tonight? >> and the most devastating question for matt gaetz today, just as it was eight months ago is, okay, what's the alternative? and he doesn't seem to be able to give you an alternative, and the alternative he offers have people that don't want to have anything to do with it. i do think that, you know, you can -- you know, we have known we were going to have a calamity since the day speaker mccarthy got elected speaker after 15 rounds. we knew it was going to eventually come to this. it was going to come to a government shutdown. the criticism, i would have of kevin mccarthy is, that he hasn't gone on ahead from the beginning and laid the ground work make this catastrophe we are seeing today about something. say a government shutdown

because democrats refuse to enforce the border or a government shutdown because democrats refused to stop inflationary spending. all of which american people would understand. so it's kind of a marketing thing that i would criticize kevin mccarthy for. but, honestly, when you look at what happened today, the same criticism you could level against matt gaetz because nobody knows what this is about. i think that a lot of underlying issues are important. and i agree with matt gaetz about it. but you can't beat something with nothing. and right now, matt gaetz has nothing. >> laura: reminds me of the green eggs and ham speech that ted cruz gave to try to get rid of obamacare. it was kind of a fun speech. it was fun filibuster but it didn't get to the point that they wanted. didn't achieve the goal. victor and charlie stay with us. we have a fox news alert about what just happened inside the republican conference meeting. joining me now fox chad pergram live from capitol hill. chad, what you are hearing

tonight. >> we just confirmed that kevin mccarthy indicated to colleagues that he will not run again for speaker of the house. that's his message tonight. he is going to talk publicly here at the capitol around 7:30 eastern time tonight. and the reason here, it seems that kevin mccarthy was just never going to be able to get the votes. i talked to him, interviewed him twice in the halls on two different occasions today. and he kept reiterating to me the same thing that he said over and over again. i never give up. never give up. and i asked him at one point, right before he went in for the vote to -- that was the first procedural vote, to kind of tee up this vote to oust him as speaker, i said if you lose tonight, will you run again? and he was completely silent. he kind of shook his head and walked off. that was the end of the interview. this was live on fox earlier today. and i think that was rather telling. you know, he forecast this, even though he said he would be the speaker of the house still tonight, he said that if he lost five votes on his side of the aisle, you hear me say it all the time. it's always about the math, that he would not be speaker.

he said that this morning. he will talk at 7:30. it's unclear at this point if his name might be placed in nomination. again, you don't have to be a member to be speaker. now, we don't know if he is going to resign from his seat, necessarily. we want to be very careful about this. keep in mind that nancy pelosi is still a member of congress. and she stepped down from her speakership when democrats lost the majority last fall. so, you can continue to serve in the body as a member. we don't know what kevin mccarthy's plans are. he won't be speaker of the house. we don't know if there will be an effort to draft him. it is hard to see with the physics of the house how he gets to the magic number how he has the votes to continue or be reelected as speaker of the house. this is such an historic day here at the capitol. the fact that we have never had a speaker ousted. compared a lot to what happens in europe in parliamentary systems where you have a no confidence vote for a prime minister or something like that. we have never had this in the middle of a congress except when speakers have either passed away

which happened back in the 1930s or speaker resigned it happened twice in the past 30 years. you obviously had jim wright who was the speaker of the house in the late 1980s and he resigned and also john boehner stepped down both for very different reasons there kevin mccarthy will speak tonight. laura, it's going to be very hard to see just how long it takes the house, and i will say the house, not republicans, but, perhaps, a coalition of democrats and republicans or whatever this mixture looks like to get together to elect a speaker. here -- >> laura: chad, apparently they just said patrick mchenry, congressman mchenry said they anticipate the meeting to conduct the vote will take place on tuesday of next week. they are setting the pre-meetings and then the ultimate vote on tuesday. so, they don't have a lot of time here. >> yeah. they don't. and, also, it means that we go without a speaker. he is acting as the speaker pro tem. this is a continuity of government function that was put in place after 9/11 that you have somebody who kind of is

administratively the speaker pro tem. they are not actually the speaker and that's what patrick mchenry is. it's pretty clear to me that they were not going to re-vote tonight. the house can't do anything until it elects a speaker. you can't put something on the floor, a bill. say to fund the government or honor a girl scout troop. committees are still in order. and, you know, jim jordan and others indicate oh, we are still going to forge ahead with our impeachment inquiry. but at some point might have you people even on the republican side of the aisle say you're focused on impeachment and we can't even elect a speaker and barely keep the government open? what are you doing? some moderates might blame them for that so, because they are not getting direction from the speaker. keep in mind that the speaker is the first person mentioned in the constitution. they are the constitutional officer of this branch of government. and the house cannot function at least on the floor without a speaker. and this gets into national security issues. there is a reason why. >> laura: third in line to the

presidency. >> patrick mchenry i should note if he is the speaker pro tem he is the president and vice president it would not go to him further down the line because we don't have speaker. this is why there are concern about national security issues. >> laura: this just doesn't look good all the way around. chad, great to see you. thank you so much for the update. >> thank you. >> laura: remember, former speaker mccarthy is going to speak at 7:30 tonight. go back to our panel victor davis hanson. charlie hurt. victor, you just heard per gram's update there. so right now we have things flying around social media where congressman troy nehls, district 22 from texas. is he proposing that donald trump become speaker of the house. i don't know how serious that might be. but, that's where he is coming from. so, i guess anything is possible. what is your sense here? >> i think right now they don't need more chaos. they just need a return to their majority. what we are witnessing is a slow motion surrender of their

majority advantages. so all that work in the midterms. all that razor thin effort to get a majority to stop this progressive agenda, they just surrendered it from what we can hear they are going to keep surrendering it and be consulted by lynne cheney and the democrats. if they're really worried about physical sobriety, in 2001, they came into office with a republican president and a republican senate and a republican house and they did not balance a budget. they ran up one of the biggest deficits in history. they did the same thing in 2017. they had a senate, they had a house, they had a president, and they ran up big deficits. so, what they need to do is agree this time to get a majority in the senate and the house and the white house and break with their tradition and actually show some fiscal responsibility rather than all these antics by, you know, giving up what little power they have. >> laura: well, charlie, i think the main argument that

republicans have in november of next year is we know how to run things. biden is the agent of chaos and all the people pulling his strings. look at the chaos on the border. look at the chaos on the economy. real median wages are going down. crime is going up. so they are the chaos party. does this detract from that or is this just a temporary blip, perhaps, given that they are pushing steve scalise who is kind of really people like him' in general. i think people have a lot of respect for steve scalise. they are pushing him to take over as speaker. >> honestly, laura, i think this will end up being sort of an irrelevant thing in the big picture when voters go to the polls next year. i don't think -- we get obviously for important reasons, we follow this stuff very closely. we -- but it's a little bit like government shutdowns. when you go back through the history of government shutdowns, every one of which republicans get blamed for and you look at the election after the government shutdown, in which

republicans get blamed, you find that republicans don't do that badly or in many cases in most cases actually pick up seats after they have been blamed for a government shutdown. voters don't care about this stuff that much. they are far more concerned about the invasion at the border. they are far more concerned about gas prices and inflation and all of the things that make their lives personally more miserable. and this is kind of a side show. but i do agree with you that it is, you know, bringing sanity to washington. if that's your calling card, and that has to be republicans' calling card, this sort of undermines all that. but i don't think that it ends up doing lasting damage if republicans wind up rallying around somebody who is able to bring regular order and i have to say that this issue and you and i have talked about this before. this issue of single issue legislation, and regular order for appropriations bills, the most important thing that

this -- that a congress can get back to doing. >> laura: they should campaign on that, victor, back to the point that you and i made on my podcast yesterday, this idea that you can't act like you have a super majority when you have the thinnest of thin majorities. so, i mean, it's unfortunate. wish you had a bigger majority but you don't. you have senators who are frankly on the republican side working against a lot of the core views of the republican base. so you not only don't have a big majority in the house. you have senators who are working against you. so, that's what any new speaker is facing victor. that means they do have to compromise sometimes as much as people don't like to compromise. that's just the way of the world. >> this idea that you have to be perfect ideologically to do good is crazy. more importantly, i think charlie needs to know that it's damaging the whole congress. we have a guy pulling a fire alarm. we have a why dressed as a slob in the senate. this just contributes

incrementally and insidiously to this notion that congress is either irrelevant or mall vent. and i don't think the republicans want to be an agent of that what they need to do unite and either reelect mccarthy or get somebody quickly as speaker and use what little power they have to stop this progressive revolution this at the can't do that they are committing suicide. they are not helping their constituencies when they do these antics. >> laura: kevin mccarthy says he will not run again as speaker and we will cover it live here on the angle when he speaks in a few moments. because he says he doesn't want it does it mean that he definitely wouldn't be renominated if there wasn't some deal cut maybe there some deal to be cut with gaetz? i don't know. gaetz says no way it's never going going to be him what if

it's someone gaetz dislikes even more got to give him all the authority here. >> i would imagine the population. after the ball today the ball was very much in kevin mccarthy's court. the only question was what was he going to do? because if he wanted to fight this and fight it fight it as vociferously as matte gates fought it. we could fight it for am rounds as mccarthy had the fortitude and desire to stick with it and it would have gone on perhaps forever. but the pool of other candidates, potential candidates, patrick mchenry is one. i think, obviously, steve scalise is one. but what i think is kind of interesting, what if you wound up with a jim jordan? and we saw in that massive round of voting last time that a guy like jim jordan actually got a lot more votes than, you know, you would have dreamed that he would have gotten, say, eight years ago when he was a back

bencher rebel rouser. well, he still sort of a back bench rebel rouser he has a lot of control. thanks to mccarthy, he has lots of control in this congress. he has managed to impress a lot of his colleagues. so a lot of his colleagues that despised him say 10 years ago, like him a whole lot more now. and so democrats could have sort of helped oust mccarthy and then wind up with a speaker that they like even less. >> laura: yes. really quickly, victor, that is a possibility, right? i mean, they are telling me i have to go. >> yes. >> laura: hold on. >> you have a moment of power that everybody has been waiting for and what do they do? they completely implode and now we are discussing this candidate a, b, and c when we have all these existential challenges that they should be addressing 1, 2, 3, quick. and they act is as if they have super majorities in both of houses. >> laura: victor, charlie, we have got to go because congressman gaetz is going to join us in a moment.

i guess he has been watching. one of the stories obscured today was the president's son spending his day in court. the president's son pleading not guilty to federal gun charges. but his legal team is already talking about filing a motion to dismiss. fox's david spunt is live from wilmington, delaware with all the details. david, we can't let this story go away tonight. >> yeah, laura. this was a quick in and out for hunter biden today but still a big story. the arraignment lasted less than 30 minutes here at federal court in wilmington, delaware. if he does not abide by these release conditions, i will list some of them in just a moment, he could face some serious consequences, is he out free tonight pending trial. he pleaded not guilty to three felony counts surrounding his ownership of a gunfire years ago back in 2018. inside the courtroom he sat just feet away from attorneys representing special counsel david weiss, the man who in july, just a few months ago, was ready to cut a plea deal with hunter. that deal fell apart, now weiss wants to put hunter biden in prison. potentially up to 25 years. unlikely given no prior

felonies. his conditions of release include that he must seek employment, communicate all international travel plans. he can't have a gun. he can't use alcohol or drugs. his medication must be prescribed. he must get drug tested randomly and must participate in substance abuse counseling. now, his lawyer says the doj caved to political pressure from donald trump and republicans. the probe has sparkedout rage from critics saying hunter has received preferential treatment as he sat in court back in washington, d.c. u.s. attorney matthew graves was on capitol hill for a transcribed interview about his alleged involvement in the five year investigation. house republicans, including judiciary chairman jim jordan believe that graves blocked david weiss from initially charging the younger biden. weiss has repeatedly denied that anybody has told him what to do. he said he has been in charge of this from the beginning. hunter biden's attorney, laura, abbe lowell says he wants to seek a motion to dismiss this entire case. you can't forget those potential tax charges looming.

special counsel david weiss said those tax charges that were part of that plea deal that fell apart could be refiled in either washington, d.c. or southern california where hunter biden currently lives, laura. >> laura: unreal. david, thank you so much. all right, matt gaetz will join us now in moments. plus, kevin mccarthy addresses his ouster live. it's a wild night.

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>> laura: now the man though led the ouster to kevin mccarthy matt gaetz joins me live. congressman, i want to get to the chief criticism by some of your g.o.p. colleagues that we have been covering in the angle made the point that it took your aligning with democrats, and even pals of liz cheney and the republican party like ken buck to produce a result that as of now has no solution. is what's your response to that. >> the solution is quite easy. we should get to electing a new more conservative, more trustworthy speaker immediately. and i'm calling on patrick mchenry who currently is the speaker pro tem to reconsider the decision that he just made to send everyone in congress home for a week. this is not the time to go home for a week. we should stay and elect a new speaker. that's the path ahead. as far as the criticism that i worked with democrats, the yellow brick road of working

with democrats was paved by kevin mccarthy. whether it was the debt limit deal, whether it was the continuing rest lewises. this is a guy who was willing to partner with conservatives on the frivolous. >> laura: right. >> whenever there was a spending matter he partnered with democrats. that said, speaker mccarthy's time is over. i wish him well. i have no animus with him and i hope he finds fruitful pass temperatures i'm sure he will. we have a job to do here. this is about keeping the commitment to have single subject spending bills. >> laura: how do we get there? congressman, we already established tonight that i have been doing this with all due respect decades longer than you, okay? you are a young guy. and so i agree with -- >> -- i don't believe that, laura. did you start when you were like three? >> laura: continuing resolutions, the budget, the spending, it's a total nightmare. but the fact of the matter is y'all don't have the votes. you don't have the margin to get from a to b to c. and so how does that. >> i reject that.

i categorically reject we don't have the votes. >> laura: hold on a second, matt. how do you get closer to all these things that are legitimate concerns when you still have a senate that says no can do? i mean, you have got several senators who are actually completely on the other side on a lot of these issues. you still have that to contend with. how do you get to your nirvana points which are the conservative holy grail points of governance the way we are going? >> because the senate does not control how the house approaches its spending business. so -- hold on, congressman. because we have got to go to mccarthy now. is he speaking live but then can you respond on the other side. >> if reagan gave us advice, he would say if you believe your principles, bring people greater freedom, you should be happy about it. i have always been excited that i have been a happy conservative. but i have always believed that i have been so fortunate to be an american. my journey to this office was something people wouldn't

understand. i grew up in a town of bakersfield, california, the son of a firefighter. the grandson of immigrants. parents worked hard, youngest in my family at any time have great wealth and got out of high school, i didn't have great grades. i couldn't get a scholarship. i went to community college. flipped cars to try to pay my way through it. i went to visit some buddies, away at college for a weekend, stopped at the grocery store to cash a check and i won the lottery. one of the first in california. it was before bidenomics, only like 5,000 but it went much further back then. i took my folks to dinner. put the majority of the rest of the money into the stock market and did pretty well. the next semester i took a break from school. i went to buy a franchise but no one said they would sell me one. only 20 years old. what i learned then never to give up. so i opened my own business. selling sandwiches. three things i learned.

first, to work the last to leave, last to be paid. i wanted to the finish my college degree at that time no one in my family had finish add four-year degree. did i pretty well. i now had enough money i could pay my way through school as long as i went to cal state. i sold my business, going to school. opened up the local paper be a summer intern in washington, d.c. with my local congressman. did i not know this man, but i thought he would be lucky to have me so i applied. do you know what he did? he turned me down. but do you want to know the end of the story? i got elected to the seat. i couldn't get an internship for. i ended up being the 55th speaker of the house. one of the greatest honors. i loved every minute. and the one thing i will tell you is doing the right thing isn't always easy but it is necessary. i don't regret standing up for choosing governing over grievance. it is my responsibility, it is my job. i do not regret negotiating, our

government is designed to find compromise. i don't regret my efforts to build coalitions and find solutions. i was raised to solve problems, not create them. so i may have lost a vote today, but as i walk out of this chamber, i feel fortunate to have served the american people. i leave the speakership with a sense of pride, accomplishment, and, yes, optimism. from the day i entered politics, my mission has always been to make tomorrow better than today. i fought for what i believe in. and i believe in this country of america. my goals have not changed. my ability to fight is just in a different form. you need 218. unfortunately 4% of our conference with join all the democrats and dictate who can be the republican speaker in this house. i don't think that rule is good

for the institution but apparently i'm the only one. i believe i can continue to fight, maybe in a different manner. i will not run for speaker again. i have the conference pick somebody else. i hope you realize that every day i did the job, regardless of whether you under estimated me or not, i wanted to do it with a smile. i grew to enjoy you, even on your toughest days and your questions. i could always tell what day it was based upon your question. [laughter] monday you would ask if i could pass the bill. tuesday was whether the rule would pass. wednesday was the greatest challenge ever to my speakership. and thursday when we passed the bill you didn't think it was a very big deal. and it all started again on friday. you know, i wouldn't change a thing.

i do believe i got a new portrait in there, too, of teddy roosevelt. you all know the man in the arena, one of my favorite parts of it whoers, who comes up short again and again but there is no effort without error and shortcoming who spins himself in a worthy cause high achievement if he fails at least he fails while daring greatly. i always like to take a risk. saturday, i took a risk for the american public. regardless what anybody says, no one knew whether that would pass. the democrats didn't want that bill. yes, they pulled a fire alarm. yes, they do their conga line. yes, they wanted to delay. but it was all for the american people. i could not look the troops in the eye and say i would not pay them. for those who spoke on the

floor, i thank them for their positive talks. i don't know what those who voted against and said there was some deal they were never a part of any deal. for those who said about what we accomplished, i'm proud of what we accomplished. from the parents bill of rights. for our energy bill. but if they want to hold me liable because the senate didn't take it up or the president didn't take it up, that's politics for what i know. but the one thing i do know, this country is too great for small visions of those eight. to any child that are listening and who are coming to visit the capitol, this is a place i want you to visit. i liked opening the capitol back up again. i liked taking away the metal detectors. i liked committees being able to work. i liked people being able to visit. i hope you like being able to be back in. i think it was important that

members actually show up to work as well. you know, to pair phase lou gehrig, he said i might have been given a bad break but i truly still consider myself to be the luckiest man on the face of the earth. there is no other country that you could rise to be the 55th speaker, not get an internship, and be able to fight for the american public. it was my greatest honor to be able to do it. i love my conference well. i love to be able -- i have been a part of the leadership team for quite some time. we won two majorities. as leader, i'm proud of the fact we only gained races. only gained seats. i'm proud of the fact as a republican leader we elected more women. we elected more minorities. we expanded the base. i'm proud of the fact that for the five years i leaderred two election cycles we gained five more seats in california. five more in new york. we won in places no one thought we could win.

the same thing you would under estimate me you always said we would lose each time around we kept gaining. i intend to we gain and keep the majority in the next cycle as well. with that i look forward to your positive questions. >> yes. >> [inaudible] >> i will look at that. >> you still obviously loyalty with the conference. we have heard you say approximately 10,000 times that you would never give up. i'm wondering why make the decision not to put your name forward again and try to grind it out like you did when you won the job in the first place? >> you know, you need 218 for the rule. 218 to move forward, and i will never give up on the american people. that doesn't mean i have to be speaker to do what i have to do for the american people. there's a lot of things i can do for the american people. but, you know what's interesting? everybody sitting there in today's world if you are sitting in congress, and you took a

gamble to make sure government was still open, and eight people can throw you out as speaker, and the democrats who said they wanted to keep government open, i think you have got a real divide. i think you have a real institutional problem. interesting, it was in this room after we had won the majority i had became speaker last. and nancy pelosi came to me, she was speaker at the time on the way out. and i told her i was having issues with getting enough vote and she said what's the problem? i said they want this one person can rule you out. she was the only speaker that changed that rule. i had the power to call the vote on her but i never. we i lost some votes because of it. and she said just give it to them. i will always back you up. i made the same offer to boehner and same thing to paul. because i believe in the institution. i think today was a political decision by the democrats. i think -- i think the things

they have done in the past hurt the institution. when they just started removing people from committee. when they just started doing the other things. my fear is the institution fell today. because you can't do the job if eight people -- you have 94% or 96% of your entire conference but 8 people can partner with the whole other side, how do you govern? and for them to make a motion on me because i made a decision for the country, that they agreed with, but they choose to do the other. that becomes a problem. >> one, are you planning on endorsing successor to your role? >> i might. >> you might? >> yeah. i don't know who is running yes, sir. i will talk to people. >> and when you look back, is there anything you would have done differently with those eight members -- >> -- yeah. a lot of them i helped get

elected so i probably should have picked somebody else. [laughter] >> what if 200 don't give up on you. there is others that really really -- nominate again, if you keep getting nominated, would you think -- >> you know, i love these 200, they have gone through so much. they are down in the conference. they will say they're going to keep voting for me. i think you should put the country first. you know, this job was never about me. i hope you felt that that i always felt what can we do best to move forward? i treated hakeem the way i wanted to be treated. i would tell him things we are doing throughout so he never was questioned. i wanted to bring the body back differently. we created a select committee on china. i changed the intel committee. they just came back from mit

where they all had bipartisan briefing on ai and quantum. started doing briefings with a.i. the whole conference of republicans and democrats alike. we're far from solving that problem but i'm proud of what we were able to do there so we will continue. yes, sir. >> when [inaudible] make a decision not run again or was it right afterwards? >> you know, not all those eight but these are the same people that never voted for me. they thought it was big they went to present after we went through 15 rounds. why do i do something for myself that can hurt the country? why create -- i'm not quite sure those individuals are looking to be productive. it concerns me as a republican based upon watching what they do. i want to be a republican and a conservative that govern.

and we're going to have to find our way to do that. the challenge is we had so many opportunities, these are the same people that sat on the floor and criticized me that we didn't get all 12 spending bills done but we first had to do a debt ceiling that they didn't support. they held up every appropriation bill in the summer. because they wouldn't let it come through. after the debt ceiling they stopped us from doing anything on the floor. when we had a continuing resolution that would do something on the border i listened to one talk about how it made him think about the border and when he voted against it. and then they wanted to challenge me because i worked with the other side so america could go forward and government could stay open. you know, if you have to lose for something, i will always lose for the country. it is a much better battle to have. >> [inaudible] what advice do you have for the next speaker?

>> change the rules. [laughter] >> do you regret [inaudible] >> do you think i let it? i mean, for the whole point, talk about like a gaetz. gaetz came to the whole conference and said we will never use. this we will never use this. you know. this is a man that sat there on the 14th vote and said okay i'm going to vote for you next time and falls back and nod. the trustworthiness of a lot of individuals makes it divvy do not think that regardless of who the speaker is that you should have that rule. you know, everybody had it but pelosi it weaver never used until it started getting used against boehner. and if the entire -- if you can always count on the other party to vote in a block against it. then you are allowing four to five people to control whatever. so it doesn't matter even if you have 96%. so, that is not a government that works.

that is chaotic. [shouting questions] >> speaker mccarthy is there -- >> wait, go right ahead. [inaudible] i wonder what it says about the republican party. >> i don't think it says about the republican party. it says something about the people who are not a conservative. i mean if you were conservative and you only had one entity making the battle and you vote against securing the border. you vote against cutting funding -- the wasteful spending, and then you partner with all the democrats. now you phrase it all the other different ways, that's not a conservative. look, you all know matt gaetz. you know it was personal. it had nothing to do about spending. it had nothing to do about everything he accused somebody of he was doing. it was all about getting attention from you. i mean, we're getting email

fundraisers from him as is he doing it. join in quickly. that's not governing. that's not becoming of a member of congress. and rawrsless of what you think, i have seen the texts. it was all about his ethics. but that's all right. >> can you verify from the first question, are you considering resigning? >> no. i said -- he asked about that. i haven't thought about that i said. >> and [inaudible] institution. >> look, no, no, no. i'm not going to blame anybody. there is not blame anywhere. look, i give it as good as i get it. right? you know the challenge, i knew going in. you would take a poll all the time is he going to get thrown out this week? but you know what? if i lose my job over what i truly believe was right i'm very at peace with it. you asked earlier when did i decide? i knew they would make the motion on me.

it didn't make one bit of difference. i felt very comfortable in that decision. i think the american public believe that decision was right. [several asking questions at the same time] >> that's the conference's decision. >> you mentioned that you were looking to help another way. would you consider [inaudible] >> no, no, no, no, no. there is a lot of great people in conference. there is always other people to do jobs. it is amazing the talent that we have. and the one thing i have always hoped as speaker that we lifted more of that talent up. i looked at people doing a lot of different jobs and the different opportunities we did. they are doing an exceptional job. we have so much talent. it is remarkable. >> is this [inaudible] much more narrow reporting on what you

anticipated what republicans 15 rounds [inaudible] >> i made history, didn't i? >> well, you did do. but, was that [inaudible] >> would any of you think, if it took that long and had you one person you knew it was always a possibility. so that was fine. didn't bother me. didn't change any of the decision i made. it was interesting. i read a tweet the other day of matt rosendale. he goes to mass every day. but you know what he said his prayer was all last year? >> that republicans didn't have a big victory, that they had a narrow victory. when you have members like that, that are part of your team, you have got a tough team. when i was in business, i got the hire and fire who worked with me. somebody else hires them and somebody else fires them. my job was to inspire them. i think we did some good work.

and i think we will continue to do great work. yes, sir. >> can you reflect back on 2010 when you guys were the young you, paul ryan. >> eric cantor, yes. >> now all three of you guys -- >> -- we're not that young anymore. >> pushed out by so-called more conservative member. >> no. let's be fair. it's wrong that you ever say. they are not conservatives. they voted against one, the greatest cut in history that congress has ever voted for 2 trillion. they voted against work requirements. they voted against neep pa reform. they voted against border security. they don't get to say they are conservative because they are angry and they are chaotic. that's not the party i belong to. the party of reagan was if you believed in your principles, that you could govern in a conservative way. they are not conservatives and they do not have the right to have the title.

[inaudible] donald trump in this direction to make it difficult to govern. make it difficult to get solutions? >> why do you say that? because your question doesn't hold true to history. when donald trump was president, we did tax reform. you can look at all of our different successes. so i mean you may dislike the policy. we have been very successful. you watched the abraham accord. i mean, can you go victory after victory. the price of gas, we were energy independent at the time. we had more businesses growing at the time. we didn't have to evacuate our embassies. you know, it's easy on its merit to see the difference of what biden has destroyed america to what the policies we were able to create. yes, sir? >> can i ask you [inaudible] hakeem jeffries? what did he ask of you and what

were you asking of him? >> no. we didn't ask for anything. >> you didn't ask for anything at all? [inaudible] anything like that. >> no, no, no. and, you know, i have a lot of respect for hakeem. >> laura: all right. we will continue to monitor that back with me now is congressman matt gaetz. congressman, i know you have been listening in to former speaker mccarthyens comments. he named checked you and said, number one, you are not a real conservative because you don't want to govern conservatively. he said this really was personal intimating that you are really p.o.ed that he didn't step in and put down that ethics investigation into you and he knows it's personal and you know it's personal. and you say? >> that's totally false. i'm the most investigated man in the entire united states congress. i have been cleared by the fbi, doj, the federal election commission. and so i -- >> laura: you don't think mccarthy did enough to stop this? wasn't that well-known that you were mad that he didn't do enough to stop that investigation? i'm not saying there is anything

wrong with being mad, by the way. >> i'm not. by the way, the beginning of speaker mccarthy's comments there were lovely and nice about his past and his history. but when he says we're not conservative because we didn't vote to secure the border, i think that does merit a response. we passed a department of homeland security border bill that would have required everify with a host of other reforms. then, on a continuing resolution search mccarthy wanted us to surrender every other fight. jack smith, weaponized government, everything else going on just to isolate the border thing. i don't believe that the way conservatives get ahead is surrendering everything but the border in order to address the border. and i don't think that the way to address the border is to pass everify and then say that the strong border position is the abandonment of everify in a vote that occurs 14 hours later. >> laura: you are not going to get the border done the way we want to do it until you get the numbers. you are not going to get what you want on the border. none 6 us are until you get the numbers in the house and you

kick out some of these senators. >> frankly, laura, i think it's worse than that i don't think we will secure the border until we have the white house. i want to address this notion conservatives. kevin mccarthy believes we have to utilize continuing resolutions and if the continuing resolution is conservative enough. if you hang some bells and whistles on it that that really ought to pacify people who are right-leaning throughout the country. i believe that the only way to achieve programmatic reform and put downward pressure on spending is to do what was done back in the 1990s where every individual bill is conferenced and debated and subject to amendment. and, of course, you have to compromise. and, of course, you have to govern. as a matter of fact, just last week i voted for four appropriations bills after my amendments were largely defeated by house moderates and put further pressure on spending. >> laura: that point was made, but they are making the point tonight, congressman, we have limited time if you don't mind me moving on. we made that point of what you did last week. but, look, i think that the concern here is that people are

seeing your fundraisers instantly going out about this. you are raising money. it is chaos right now. >> i need to address that. >> laura: is it not a fund raidser? i think we have a full screen is it a fund raider or not. everybody fund raises that is another criticism of what is going on here. >> yeah, if can i get a word in here. i'm the only republican in the entire united states congress who takes no lobbyist money and no pac money. absolutely, i communicate daily, vigorously with regular americans. because the only way i'm able to advance my political goals is just regular folks give me 10, 20, $30 i will take no lecture from the likes of people who do three lobbyist fundraiser as day and trade favors in order to get cash from special interest on how i raise money. and i take deep offense to anyone who wants who criticize the mayle mailman, the active duty service member. the grandmother who believes in me and goes to matt gaetz.com

and donate. as a matter of fact is i hope they do that right now and i'm not sorry for it at all because i won't take the lobbyist and pac money like every other person does. >> laura: i think it's awesome that you don't. i think it's fantastic. by the way, do you plan to stay in the house? have you thought of running for office like maybe the governor's race in 2026? what is your thought there. >> you know what? , laura i think i'm exactly where i need to be doing exactly what i need to be doing. >> laura: you are not thinking about it at all? >> whether a's that? >> laura: you are not thinking about it at all? again, there is nothing wrong with it but why are we playing cute here? >> i'm not running for governor no 2026. i'm here serving in the house in 2023 trying to get a budget. why is it when i'm trying to get a budget in single subject bills and return to pre-covid spending all everyone is spending is in a political race three years from now. i'm here doing this job. my voters elected me to do this. and that is what i have endeavored to do. at times with a very small group of people but dedicated people

because we have to send a shock wave through washington, d.c. >> laura: definitely need to do that. >> we have to change the system. >> laura: congressman, president trump took to truth social this afternoon and he said why is it the republicans are always fighting among themselves? why aren't they fighting the radical left democrats who are destroying our country? now, i know you have had conversations with president trump and you intimated that he was, you know, you understood where he was coming from and it seemed to indicate that maybe he was maybe in favor of what you were doing but wasn't going to say so publicly. what can you tell us tonight since he really is the leader of the party and you are a maga republican and he is the top dog? so what do you . >> absolutely, i support president trump, eager to campaign with him. our private conversations i am going to keep to us, i am in good stead with the former president. you know who won't see on the campaign trail at a big rally, kevin mccarthy. he would be booed

off of it like lindsey graham. >> congressman, do you think -- let's say next year, who knows how this is all going to play out. but next year, november, whatever it is, 8th, 5th, 6th, republicans lose the house of representatives. because democrats think this is going to help them. they wanted mccarthy out, just as much as much as you did. let's say republicans lose the house, will you feel any regret for having done what you did today? >> absolutely not. i believe that we were destined to lose the house, if we didn't do what we did today because we didn't give anyone something to believe in. i traveled all over this country and i have seen the disupon dense, sadness in conservatives who don't believe republicans in congress are -- about the failures about house conservatives to dig in and fight you are a true north to help us focus on the thing that matter in these contentious debates and discussions over

legislation, do you know what, we are not going to lose the house, donald trump is going to drag a bunch of people to victory who wouldn't have deserved it otherwise. that's what happened in 2016, 2020 was another good year for republicans at the congressional level. when trump is on the ballot we do pretty well and i suspect that we'll do well when he is our nominee. >> congressman we appreciate you joining us tonight, thank you so much. charlie hurt, opinion editor, charlie reaction to what you just heard from gaetz. >> of course on the issues that matt gaetz is talking about he is not wrong on it. when it comes to single issue voting on single issue legislation, regular order for bills, spending bills, is he not wrong about that, as we mentioned, you and i have been talking about it a long time. where do we go from now? and even if you get somebody who is speaker mccarthy or better, you're still in the same situation that we were in before he was ousted so, not that i think that this

issue is going to wind up being something that is going to define the election or is going to somehow help democrats, i don't think that is going to happen. but you know, you turn to somebody like steve scalise who let's not forget was nearly murdered by a violent extremist democrat. and if we want to go forward and make steve scalise who is the face of democrat violent extremism and have that be what we talk about in the next election i think that might be actually not a bad thing. >> do you agree with gaetz and his point is that republican voters aren't pumped up enough because they think there is a lot of sellouts on the hill so this will actually be a way to energize the republican base next year. could there be something to that or is that off base? >> no i think that that's entirely possible. but again, as you were just pointing out a minute ago, that doesn't change the dynamics of what house republicans are going to be able

to get done in the next year. they are still dealing with -- you know, a democrat majority in the senate and still dealing with aluna particular mad man in the white house who doesn't care about our economy, doesn't care about the american people, doesn't care about our border and will do absolutely anything. he is so corrupt -- and the question should be, who is joe biden working for? because he is not working for us. and apparently he is working for the ukrainians, the russians, the chinese and the mexicans. but going forward, that's what we need to talk about. >> charlie, thank you for hanging in there with us, buddy. great to see you. that's it for us tonight, we'll see you where this all shakes out, there will be a new speaker it looks like next week. follow me on social media, with we'll continue the conversation, it is america now and forever, >> carley: a fox news alert, please are searching for the