next time, remember, the spin stops here because we're definitely looking out for you. [captioning made possible by fox news channel] captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- sean: the president is urging congress to rush a universal health care bill through congress before the american people have a chance to give it a good look. we here at "hannity" aren't going to let that happen. tonight we're going to show you what happens when the government takes your life and death decisions into its own hands. we're going to show you what rationing looks like, and we'll take you to the state of hawaii which implemented a universal health care program for seven short months. welcome to tonight's special, "universal nightmare." you will also hear from ainsley earhardt who reports on two patients whose stories we're going to follow throughout the show. the american health care system did in fact save their lives, but would they have been so lucky if the government had

rationed their care? you can stay tuned to find out, but first let's meet the patients. >> major general william davies retired from the military as a two star general in 2002. one year later he went to the emergency room complaining of chest pains. >> i was there for many hours. they took blood and the whole works, and they came up with the conclusion that well, we really don't know what caused this. and it could be indigestion. >> not buying that explanation he went to carlisle, pennsylvania, cardiologist david kahn for a stress test. >> i was probably on the treadmill no more than four minutes, and he says i guess you know you've got a little bit of a problem here. >> it was markedly abnormal, and i was concerned enough to not want to wait several days to have the patient studied.

>> i was thinking ok, how many weeks away is this going to be, and he says are you ready, and i said for what, and he said i'm going to take you to the hospital. >> the quickest way to get him studied was to take him to the hospital, so i did. i saw no up side to waiting several days. >> so he wasted no time. >> he personally drove me to the hospital. >> that's a good doctor. >> and had his staff get ahold of the hospital. >> did a diagnostic cath terization that confirmed my belief that he had pretty significant disease and arranged to have his arteries fixed. >> how do you feel today? >> well, this procedure was about four years ago. i did not have a heart attack, i did not have any damage to my heart, i had four stints put in to my arteries, and i'm living a normal life. >> 1,700 miles southwest of carlisle lives katherine hail.

ten years ago she was facing major health problems of her own. >> i was diagnosed with -- they said a walk in the mark cancer, had surgery by a gynecologic oncologist, and after the surgery he said it's much worse than we thought, you have no more than six weeks left to live. don't even try chemo, it won't even touch the cancer, and that was it. he told me not to go anyplace else, that he was positive. quote, unquote, he said if you don't die in a car wreck, you'll be dead from the cancer in two weeks. >> but she didn't accept that answer. she went to a cancer center in houston for a second opinion. >> these are just little blood vessels in your lung and liver. >> the original doctor had recommended chemotherapy only. when this type of cancer is advanced, it is never ever cured by chemotherapy alone. so what we did here was we

tailored a specific plan with her, we combined one type of chemotherapy with radiation because we knew the original chemo wasn't working, and then we added chemotherapy after the radiation was done. >> i was told not to give up, let's try this, if this doesn't work, there's other things we can try. >> we take advantage of multi-modality care, and somebody that has this advanced disease, and we know that one regimen is not going to work, we integrate several regimens, and that worked for her. >> i had special teams that all met on my case, and here i am today, seven years, eight years next month. >> she's seen her children grow up and the birth of her two grandchildren, something she could have never put a price on. sean: socialized medicine is by no means a new idea. canada and the united kingdom are living through what can only be described as a universal nightmare. take a look at what could soon be a reality right here in

america. >> as president i will sign a universal health care plan into law by the end of my first term in office. >> folks, reform is coming. it is on track, it is coming. sean: it's coming all right, and if the obama administration has its way, millions of americans are staring at another massive government tax hike. >> the reform of health care are very worrisome to me. i think they represent a slippery slope for health care reform to be successful, they have to reduce costs, and the only way in fact to reduce cost is to reduce services, and ration care. sean: canada and the uk have government-run health care systems and many opponents say be careful for what you wish for. >> i think that once the american people realize that

this is where the plan will lead us, they will not accept it. sean: shana holmes is a native of ontario, canada, and she knows all too well the struggles of being a patient in a government operated health care system. >> before i went to the doctors in canada, i started to come down with some symptoms, and i had to go and find out what was wrong with me, and at that point i was told that my vision was going and that we needed to see an endocrinologist and a neurologist immediately. unfortunately i couldn't get an appointment with either one of them for up to four to six months for either one. i realized that i was in trouble, and at that point i decided that i better go down to the states and get a diagnosis and at least find out whether or not there was something serious to worry about, and that's when i traveled down to the mayo clinic in arizona. sean: she received the frightening news. she had a life-threatening brain

tumor and with a full diagnosis in hand she headed back to canada to fight for her life. the people wouldn't even look at the diagnosis that i brought back and i basically got thrown back to the system for testing, and i had been told that i needed to have this surgery in order to save my eyesight within four to six weeks. sean: with little health from her own health care system they returned to the mayo clinic in arizona. within weeks she had surgery that changed her life. >> the u.s. health care absolutely saved my life. sean: earlier this month shona testified on capitol hill. >> what started many years ago as a seemingly compassionate move of our government by treating all equally and fairly has in fact turned into a nightmare of everyone suffering equally, and when it doesn't work, it doesn't work. sean: recently a pajamas tv reporter went undercover in a canadian hospital to get a firsthand look at what the american people could experience. >> it's hard to get a family

doctor. >> yes, i know. the only thing you can do is just call the phone number. >> i did that like three months ago. >> maybe it's like two or three years. >> to get a doctor? >> yes, you're young, so you have the time. sean: stories like this are common across europe. katie was another victim of a government-controlled system. >> when i was 19 everybody around me seemed to be getting smear tests, and i weren't to the doctors and asked if i could have one, and they told me that i was too young, that the age limit in england to have a smear test was 20, and so i went back whether i was 20 years old, and they said the same thing, but this time the age limit had been raised to 25. and i didn't need one until then. but when i was 23 i had symptoms i was worried about, and i weren't to the doctors, and we eventually found out that i had surgical cancer. >> when you have a x number of doctors for triple x number of patients, this results in

waiting and waiting delays diagnosis, waiting delays treatment, waiting results in poor health and bad endings. >> i didn't get the care that i should have got. i didn't get it when i asked for it, and it ended up leading me to having an incurable cancer all because of one simple test that is too expensive for the government to have allowed me. sean: so if patients lose out and doctors predict disaster and all we hear are stories of long lines and wait lists that stretch for years, well, we have to wonder why this president is pushing for a system where poor quality health care is the norm. >> i have difficulty understanding why we as a country are trying to move towards systems that are not successful. i don't recall hearing of anyone flying to canada or to the united kingdom for second opinions in specialized care. they all come here. >> in the united states i felt like a patient, and i felt like i was cared for, and in canada i'm nothing but a number.

>> for those nay-sayers, the cynics that think that this is not going to happen, don't bet against us. we are going to make this thing happen. sean: unbelievable. now let's check back in with ainsley earhardt and the two patients she profiled. >> so how would our two patients have fared under the socialized medical system of canada or europe? >> i can only suppose that given the circumstances that i was facing, if that happened in canada or the united kingdom, that perhaps i could have died. that's the conclusion i can draw. >> remember general william davies? >> i went into er, and the result was that i probably had indigestion because there's nothing these we can determine. >> but when he went for a second opinion, his cardiologist put him in his own car and drove him to the hospital for immediate heart surgery.

>> you were on an operating table getting stints put in to save your life. >> the same day. it happened so fast. >> general davies has a daughter-in-law enforcement and a son currently fighting in iraq. he worries that the long waits for care in other countries could one day be a reality here. >> everyone has a health problem one time or the other. given that, my concern is how is my daughter or my son going to be taken care of when they have a health problem that has to be dealt with immediately? are they going to have to wait in line, have an appointment that's six months out or six weeks out? it wouldn't make any difference if you're going to die tomorrow. >> and what about katherine hail, the cancer patient in texas. >> i do know they have gynecologists in canada. i don't know how easy it is to access those physicians or how easy it is to get second opinions there, and the second opinion's what saved katherine's

life. >> if i were living in a country where you don't have a choice, i would have done whatever it took to come to america, to seek out the specialist that gave me the best opportunity to give knee a life. >> i was born in canada, so i'm pretty familiar with the health care system there because my relatives still live there, and it is my impression that there is a long wait in terms of seeing a physician, getting the appropriate imaging, and then getting the appropriate treatment. sean: and coming up british politician daniel hannan reveals more horrors of universal health care in the uk and reports straight from hawaii where the straight from hawaii where the government already create addfe] introducing a revolution in stain removal. new tide stain release. it's an advanced in-wash booster that works with your detergent to help remove the toughest stains the first time. new tide stain release. available in duo pack, liquid or powder.

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sean: great britain instituted a national health care system in the aftermath of world war ii known as the national health service, it has been plagued with problems since its inception, so should the u.s.

follow suit? i asked a member of the european parliament daniel hannan. you have tried on a couple of occasions to warn america, and you describe us as a friend, as an ally, a supporter, you're fond of america, you know american history. let's start with a broad overview, and then i want to get into the specifics. why do you warn americans that nationalized health care is a nightmare has we're calling it? >> well, i'm already living in that system. i'm the man from your future who can see how it isn't working, and the clearest proof of that is to compare which country you'd rather get ill in statistically. this isn't an opinion thing, there's empirical data. if you get prostate cancer, you are four times as likely to survive in the u.s. as you are in britain. breast cancer, the same thing. stroke, heart disease, surgery, your survival rates are way, way better, and that shouldn't surprise anyone. we have a system that is run

along marxist principles, funded out of general taxation, contribution according to ability, distribution according to need, and like everything else in a communist system it doesn't produce efficient outcomes, when you have something that's free, it's abused, and it's abused in a much more insidious way which is that there is absolutely no attempt to make efficiency savings either from the point of view of the person prescribing or from the point of view of the patient. there's no incentive to get exactly the same treatment for less because everything is free. we all know this. if you and i were in a restaurant and we knew that somebody else was paying, we would be less -- concerned about what we're ordering not because it would make us any better off. and when i say this, there was a big rou when i said these things on your program before, and people say how dare you even talk about money in the same

sentence as health care, we're talking about such a precious thing, but of course there are limited resources in this world. and if they are not spent carefully, then there is less to go around for everybody else, and there is a lower quality of health care overall. and the best way to allocate resources efficiently is through consumer choice. we know that in every other field of human activity. you know, the one thing i would likely say to you is once you get a system like this, it becomes almost irremovable. we have 1.4 million people working in the system. it's a massive electoral block of people who really refuse to contemplate any change, and my understanding is that canada when they started going down this road did it in much the way that is being proposed in the u.s. they said well, there will be a state option alongside the private ones, but of course pretty soon that drives out all

of the alternatives, and the logic of the alternative means you end up where they are in canada where there is no private alternative, and that's where we are in britain, and let me tell you, you don't want to be there. sean: i appreciate the admonition, the warning, and i've got to tell you, what you're describing daniel as a nightmare, i hope americans will listen to a friend and a great warning, appreciate it as always, thank you for being with us. tell everybody at the national health service i'm glad they're watching. doctor shortages are just one problem of a national health care system and what it would create. you're going to hear from the medical student who confronted president obama about this issue at his nationally re. just be ready for it to tackle back. save on the gear to get it done at bass pro shops. like redhead canvas utility shorts

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sean: president obama often brags about having the support of doctors when it comes to health care reform, but is that really the case, and how will the democrats' plans for reform affect doctors across this country? america has some of the top health care and top medical technology available anywhere in the world today. what makes it so great? >> the current health care system is based on choice. we need a system where americans can choose the health care they want just as they can choose to buy one automobile versus

another. sean: congress has decided it wants to throw another choice into the mix, a cheaper government-run, quote, public option for insurance coverage. >> if you like the plan you have, you can keep it. if you like the doctor you have, you can keep your doctor too. >> when president obama says that you get to keep the health care you already have, he's being completely disingenuous. millions of people are going to lose their current health insurance in favor of this government insurance because the public option can come in cheaper for patients, the private insurers can't compete, the government can regulate the amount of care that's delivered, that's also known as rationing care by the way. >> the government's going to be dictating what kind of care that people are going to be able to receive just because of cost effectiveness, how much money we'll be able to get out of this person, how much will they be able to put into tax dollars into the system. that's not a fair or just or an american way of looking at things. sean: mary is about to enter her

second year of medical school at georgetown. >> i fear how this is going to allow flee practice as a future physician. i want to go back and serve the communities that i'm from, hispanic and asian communities that are underserved, but this plan is going to undercut my ability to be able to serve in that capacity. it almost takes away the whole point of me even being in medical school. >> it's a situation that inevitably will have the government being more intrusive and interfering with the physician-patient relationship. sean: several physicians believe unnecessary strains could result in future shortage of doctors. >> by 2030 you're going to have a shortage of 500,000 physicians in this community. >> what kind of system are we going to have where it expands and we have more and more patients? doctors like me are not going to be there to take care of you. >> we need more primary care doctors, and we need more

surgeons to just take care of the population that's currently being treated. if the physician is forced to spend less time with each patient in order to cake of all of the people -- take care of all of the people that are out there in their waiting room, then the quality of care is going to suffer. sean: another fear physicians have is that their decreasing salaries could take a huge hit from government-provided reimbursements through the public option. they've already experienced this through programs like medicaid and medicare. >> in the last ten years in the united states physicians have gotten no increase in their reimbursement from medicare. at the same time theirs been a 20 to 25% increase in what it costs a physician to run his practice or her practice. and as a result of that physician income has gone steadily downward which is having a negative effect on the

best and the brightest wanting to become physicians. if you're going to go to school and not finish your training until you're 32 years of age and work 80 hours a week, there does need to be some compensation for that. >> if you're not going to get paid for it why go through it? primary care physicians especially. these moore guys are on the battle front taking care of these patients right off the bat. >> there will be a continual decrease in the number of students wanting to go to primary care and that includes family practitioners, pediatricians, psychiatrists, emergency room physicians, more students are going to be wanting to go to more of the specialties or subspecialties, they're going to offer higher pay. sean: she's worried she may not be able to pay back her student loans. she recently had a chance to address this concern with president obama directly. >> i'll be in about $300,000 in medical education debt. >> that's serious money. >> and you would like to go into

primary care? >> definitely, that was my motivation. >> but now you will be remun rated at a lesser level than a specialist. >> yes. and now that i'm going to have that much debt and serve my communities, it's going to make it that much more challenging. sean: will anyone still want to be a doctor? >> most of these individuals did not go into medicine to make substandard living for a physician. >> it doesn't seem like it's going to be a very winning situation for providers, hospitals, private insurance companies, as well as patients because patients won't be able to get the care that they want. sean: and why is that so important? >> that's what medicine should be all about. we provide the kind of care to our patients that we would want provided to us and to our family members. if people lose the ability to choose their physicians, then some people will get to go to

good doctors and some people will draw the short straw and perhaps not get to see the physicians who would do them the best job. sean: when it comes to matters of life and death literally, is that a gamble you are willing to take? so how would the two patients we have been following have fared under a different system? let's check back in with ainsley earhardt. >> the theories about doctor shortages and disappearing specialists are just speculation, but to the patients and the doctors, the pros specs are frightening. dr. david kann who saved william davies' life says the quality of care is already being threatened. >> in cardiology today there's a bill to cut reimbursement for several of the studies that we do as much as 40%. if that would get through congress, and it may, it would make it almost impossible for me to practice medicine the way i do today. and the kind of care that i

deliver would not be available to people like the general because it's simply financially impossible. every cardiologist in central pennsylvania that i have spoken with is terribly concerned. this bill will change the way cardiology care is delivered, and it will be a disaster. >> cancer survivor katherine hail worries the specialist who saved her life might not be able to stay in business under the universal health care proposal. >> i've had between 30 and 50 experts that are dealing with cancer every single day. that's all they do on my case at all times. >> there are multiple studies done in my specialty which is gynecologic oncology that show that patients that are treated by g-1 oncologists live longer. we are traind to do the aggressive surgery, we are trained to give the chemotherapy, and we follow the patients over time. >> when you do find that specialist that has been able to hang on were the changes, how experienced is he? how long has it been since he

performed the procedure? yes, he knows how to do it, he was taught 20 years ago. he's the only one left in the country, and how long has it been since they've done it? >> if somebody were to start with a different -- maybe not a specialist or a different sub specialist, their outcome is not likely to be as good as patients who are treated by g-1 gynecologists. >> with this change with the insurance possibly going the way it's going to go, i'd be scared to be in the shoes that i was in when i was fighting cancer seven years ago, very scared, and i don't know if i'd be talking to you right now. sean: and coming up before the president charges ahead with health care reform, he may want to look back where he came from. hey, it's me, water. did you know that when you filter me at home

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sean: welcome back to "universal nightmare." hawaii was the 50th state admitted to the union, but the first to implement a universal health care scheme. it did not go as lawmakers had originally planned, and griff jenkins tells us the story why. >> welcome to hawaii, home to surfing in the aloha spirit. in the childhood home of president barack obama, and it's home to a failed experiment in universal health care, an experiment whose lessons seem

lost on its most famous son. >> it's time to give every american quality health care at an affordable cost. >> critics of president obama's plan for universal coverage for all americans worry that while the goal of universal health care might be noble, the government may not be able to pay for it. >> we will have some up front costs. anywhere from 1 trillion to $2 trillion, so what i've proposed is that we cap the itemized deductions that the top 2% or 3% get, people making over $250,000 a year, with that additional money we would have paid for all of the health care that i'm proposing. >> the president may not be able to make good on that pledge. although he's vowed to study other attempts at universal health care like the canadian system and the united kingdom system. >> a lot of those countries employ a different system than we do. not all of them use a socialized

medicine. almost all of them have what would be considered a single payer system in which the government essentially operates a medicare for all. >> but note he has failed to mention hawaii's now defunct program to insure all children. hawaii became the first in the nation to attempt universal health care. on june 30, 2007, governor linda lingle signed legislation into effect. the word kaki means child. in the kaki care program gave free ins to children whose families could not afford it on their own. those covered at no monthly premium and had access to doctor visits for just $7. the program partnered the state of hawaii with the state's largest insurance provider hmsa. >> it had public-private partnership. we had a health insurance plan that was putting up 50% of the cost. and the state was putting up 50%, so there's a match between

the public and private entities. >> the plan targeted hawaiian residents who were the, quote, gap children. kids ineligible for state programs who had not had health care for six consecutive months. >> the original estimates for kaki care were $33,500 children and the monies in the statutes covered 3,500 plan, but the plan was being abused. >> what the legislators did was they created a state insurance program that allowed parents who already were paying for their children's health insurance to drop their private coverage and to come take advantage of the state coverage, and what that meant was that taxpayers were subsidizing parents for health insurance that they were previously paying for. it just didn't make sense, it couldn't be sustained. >> the governor cut funding for the plan after just seven months because the state budget could not handle the strain of more families jumping from their

private insurance to the free government health care. most affected were the smaller private insurers left high and dry when families switched to the government plan. a plan that just happened to be cosponsored by the largest hawaiian insurance company. critics call it the crowd out effect. >> when the government made the decision to cancel it, the democratic run legislature was baffled. >> we were shocked. everybody agreed that the kaki care program was working as we expected it to work. it was a very targeted program, it was targeted for those who are not able to qualify for medicaid and yet are not able to afford health insurance costs. >> but governor lingual argues that the statistics were on her side. according to the department of human services 85% of those enrolled in kaki care previously

had insurance. >> conservative radio show host rick hamada has the governor on his show every week discussing the health care system. >> the primary failure was the fact that there were so many loopholes that individuals were able to take advantage of the state system, individuals who up to that point provided health care for their own children paid for out of their own pocket. they now found a way to have the state taxpayers pay that responsibility. >> the obama administration has vowed that their plan will have has every oversight, but with the pressure the president is putting on the house and senate to push through landmark health care reform, there is the potential for loopholes and abuse like in hawaii. stan slom is truly a minority in the hawaiian state senate, one of only two republicans up against 23 democracy. to him the experiment failed. >> it's not doing what it's supposed to do. it's not taking care of those gap children, it's not taking care of the children that cannot through no fault of their own or

their parents pay for the care. >> as the president and the democratic led congress rush in an unprecedented fashion toward universal health care for all americans. >> the cost of fixing our problems are great. the costs of inaction, of not doing anything, are even greater. >> they may want to take a closer look at how that worked in theent's birth state of hawaii. >> i think it should be a cautionary tale to anyone that that can be unintended consequences of these plans, and when you think that you're doing something that's a good idea and you have good intentions, that's often not enough. sean: and coming up your life soon could be placed in the hands of government bureaucrats. it's a hidden provision in the democrats' health care proposal that you need to hear about.

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sean: and welcome back to "universal nightmare." as the health care debate rages on one possible provision of the democrats' plan hasn't been getting much attention at all. let's take a look at the new government bureaucracy that could have the power to change your life forever. there is a little talked about provision in the democrats' health care plan that may shock you. if approve this bill could force millions of americans to join a government-run hmo and abandon their current health care. and even more frightening aspect of the legislation is that a nameless, faceless board would decide what health benefits you are eligible to receive. this body would determine the quality of medical care that you receive in almost all areas including both maternity and pediatric care. democrats argue that you'll still be able to access

treatment not covered under the definition of quote essential health benefits, but you'd be paying out of your pocket for those services. for the most part important health care decisions will be taken away from trusted physicians and then given to a group of government bureaucrats whose mandate would be to cut costs, not to save lives. many of president obama's closest advisors advocate cost cutting. dr. y zekial emmanuel brother of rahm rahmbo has praised england's rationing. they take into account the life expectancy of a patient to determine in a treatment is cost effective. another presidential aide has said government controls are the proven strategy for controlling health care expenditures. so should americans be penalized for receiving medical care they themselves deem necessary? and should the citizens of this country put their lives in the

hands of an unelected board operating in the shadows? that could happen and happen soon. and joining me now is patient advocate and founder and chairman of the committee to reduce infection deaths dr. betsy mccoy. i want you to explain these two big has. >> this is the house tricommittee bill, this is the kennedy bill making its way through the senate. sean: this is the kennedy bill, and this is the house tricommittee bill. >> these are going to be melded together at some point. sean: this is what congress never reads. >> what's really important to know about these bills is that they are not about covering the uninsured. they are about forcing everyone into budget grade hmo's and giving government the power to limit your health care even though you or your employer is paying for the whole plan. in both bills kennedy bill page 62 house bill page 37 an appointed commission will decide

all the specifics, how much the plans will cost, what they will cover, but most importantly what the limits will be on the care. sean: isn't that the equivalent of great britain's government rationing body or seemingly? >> certainly in the letter of the law, it appears to be that way, and i'm particularly concerned about the role that these advisors will play. sean: let me ask you this because we now have a history where it doesn't matter if it's cap and trade or the stimulus bill, look at the size of this thing. literally congressmen and senators are voting on bills that they don't read. >> and they've excepted themselves and the president and federal employees. sean: you have read -- i guess light sunday reading for you, but you have read every page of both of these bills. sean: what else have you gleaned from this that may shock the senses of the average american who thinks all right, i want the government to provide this for me. >> most of the spending in these bills is in the back half of each bill. it's not just to cover the

uninsured. hundreds of billions of dollars allocated to other types of programs, so when you hear the urgency of covering the uninsured, we could probably do that for between 28 and $49 billion a year depending on the kind of coverage we offered. it doesn't have to be $1.6 trillion, and most importantly it doesn't have to limit the care that people who already have insurance can get. sean: how about what i have advocated for a long time, and that's medical individual medical savings accounts for every individual which would guarantee catastrophic care, everyone would be in case of catastrophic illness, it would also mandate or encourage or entice people to get a checkup every year so we can catch things earlier, which would help save in the cost of health care. >> most importantly it would put the decision making back in our hands. sean: do you support that? >> yes. one of the most dangerous misconceptions driving this legislation is the idea which you hear the president say often that we have to shift the

resources from treating the sick to keeping people well. well, the fact is, and the president said to the ama, cancer, heart disease, lung diseases, stroke, diabetes, are all preventable. well, they're not and neither is alzheimer's or ms or cerebral palsy or several others linked to genetics. right now 5% of patients need 50% of health care resources, and that is not going to change as long as we look after the sick, and that's what families have to be aware of in these bills, that these are plans, these are health care for the healthy, but when you're sick, it's not going to be there. sean: when you need it. >> that's right. and that's my concern. sean: it's very impressive. bly the way, ladies and gentlemen, unlike your congressmen and your senator, somebody actually read a bill before it happens. this is a nightmare, and we're calling it "universal nightmare." thank you, betsy mccoy, thank you for being with us. ainsley a

ainsley is up next with our two patients, and we'll take a look at how their cases would have differed in an obama sty o need

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call the number on your screen for free information. sean: all evening we have been following two patience through the health-care system. how would their treatment have been affected if the government played a role? >> these people suffered from very different medical problems 1,700 miles apart. they both say that their lives were saved by heroic doctors, doctors they worry they might not have been able to get to under a different system. >> i have thought about that many times with the current discussions and controversies that are going on with the health-care system.

i might not have survived if you could reject this a year from now. i went to an individual doctor that is not constrained by a system that is under the government. >> the concern on the part of most physicians that i know and most patients is that we don't know what is coming, we don't know what the system is going to be like, the government is going to take over and we will not have the opportunity to do that kind of thing in the future. we don't want to risk that. >> my husband has been with a big company for decades and we have great insurance but if his company decides to let the government pay for this, what would happen to us? >> the notion that you can expand services and save money is absurd. you cannot afford the health care system, we can do a better job, but i would not be in favor of revamping the entire system with a government run

system. there is no where to him that we spend money that is more important. we just embarked on an incredible spending spree. i am being told that we cannot afford the health care system. if it makes sense to spend money on bridges, it makes sense to spend money on disease. a fleet of five people of the carrot that they need when there say -- if we deprive people of the care that they need, we will not succeed. >> the patients are left with the same basic question -- >> how fast is the system going to react to my need and will it be fast enough to save my life? >> do you feel that you are alive because -- >> no doubt in my mind. >> this woman says she owes her life to the treatment she received and the fact that she did not settle for what the first doctor told her.

>> i was not willing to accept the bad news that the oncologist was telling me, which was giving up. i would not be here to be a grandmother had i listened to the first doctor's advice. >> in catherine's case, if she had not decided to fight, she would have only had chemotherapy. if she did not have a second opinion, she would not be able to participate in these interviews. >> when my daughter was 18, i was diagnosed. my mother died when i was 18. i am here and i am very glad to be here as a grandmother. sean: a look at what might be coming your way if youu hang yor health care over to the government. this is not a mistake that we can afford to make because the can afford to make because the