the lights are blinking. we are closing down shop. do not forget gretawire. we have a new forum, a new feature. captioned by the national captioning institute ---www.ncicap.org--- >> three, two, one, beck! >> welcome to the glenn beck program. tonight, a special hour that i think is either going to make blood shoot out of your eyes or make you run for home depot. get the shovel, because you're going to need t the government is trying to bury millions of businesses alive and somebody has to help dig them out. don't let uncle sam help destroy our mom and pop shops. if you believe this country is great but you will be damned that you will let it murder your small businesses, it is time to bail out small ones, not the big ones. sit yourself down for a few minutes, pump up the volume and come follow me.

g.m., seiu, acorn, city citibank and all the rest. i'm tired of all the big businesses. hello, or should i say goodbye? this is kind of a funeral, i guess, today. we're holding kind of a wake, maybe, or an awakening for small business in america, because it is being crushed and the government has blood all over its hands. the obama administration and both parties in congress are forcing socialized medicine right down our throats. they are frorsing unions to take over successful businesses, and the hijacking of contracts of workers under the interestingly worded employee free choice act. they're raising your capital gains taxes, and when that frightening cap and trade passes, energy prices are going to skyrocket, not just in your home, you but also at te small business. how are they going to be able to afford to pay their utility bills? small businesses are some of the fastest growing ones out. there joining me is a man who

knows all about the threats they are phrasing. his name is patrick burn, c.e.o. of one of of the moment successful retailers out there, overstock.com. also in the studio audience, we have a few other people. we have james murphy and lindsay pyren, president and vice presidents of a small business in ohio called e.s.t. an an lit analytical that smalls environmental instruments to the environmental testing labs. do i hate you guys? are you green? are you, really? oh, boy. but they're here because they're also being crushed. maureen o'connor is an owner of center sheet metal, a business started by her mother in the bronx, new york. she's here to talk about the new universal healthcare proposal and how it's going to affect her business. everybody in the audience here is a small business owner, so let me start with overstock.com, which my wife just got a package yesterday. >> think of the money she is

saving. glenn: yeah, that's right. tell me about how your business is going to be affected here with what is going on? >> well, in general, if we're talking about the common denominators, when you say cost of anything, people do less of it, and that includes if government raises the cost of businesses of starting up and employing people and hiring new people, they're going to do less than that. that's not what we want in the country. glenn: you are all small business owners. how many people are looking at the future and saying, my gosh, i'm going to expand my business and hire a bunch of new people? two? two up here. three. ok. >> you're trying? ok. i love to try as well. is this the atmosphere that is going to do it? are you going to hire them here? >> there is a lot of political risk out there, but if you can get past it and get the capital, there are opportunities that are once-in-a-lifetime. glenn: anybody else? ok. if you are watching from home and need a job, that guy is

going to be hiring. the thing that i don't understand is when it comes to taxes, they really truly keep selling to people that all of these businesses -- immean, you're overstock.com, you have all this cash, because you're overstocked, and you won't pass that on to the people. >> no, and this is what they fundamentally meant. a price is the price that the government charges for its services. we are in a deal that says we will give half our stuff, all of us collectively, half our stuff to the government in return for services, in return for protecting us. do we really think government is doing that good of a job for half of the stuff that it takes? glenn: no. tell me a little bit about cap and trade. i think of overstock.com and i don't think of cap and trade affecting you. >> well, i actually believe market based solutions to pollution. ronald reagan started it 25

years ago. i would support a carbon tax. glenn: you would? >> a simple carbon tax -- certainly cap and trade has big disadvantages because you get all kinds of manipulation in the market and it creates an opportunity for wall street to suck more wealth out of the economy. glenn: how many people here believe that the steps that we have taken for the stimulus -- now, remember, steven moore from "the wall street journal" is here. correct me if i'm wrong. 70% of all new jobs are created by small business, right? >> yep. glenn: how many people here think the stimulus package will create new jobs? these are 70% -- how many people think they will create new jobs? >> what about cash for clunkers? glenn: is there an automobile dealer here? no. i mean, i can't imagine how that is. that's just getting people to go buy the cars now that they might have been thinking about buying already years ago.

>> it is like injecting yourself with morphine and saying i feel a little better now and then you come down from it. that's the idea with the stimulus t feels good right now as we still have 9 1/2% unemployment, but does anybody think when we have to pay these debts off six months from now that anything will be any beter? glenn: no. you guys are in ohio. employment is fantastic there, low, low unemployment, coupled with low interference from government. you have a fantastic state government there. that's sarcasm, by the way. tell me, is it 11 or 11 1/2% now unemployment in ohio? >> 11 1/2. glenn: ok. you guys make instruments for -- environmental instruments, right? >> for laboratories, right. glenn: what are you measureing? >> organics. glenn: fascinating. so, you guys, here we are in a green atmosphere. you guys do -- you make instruments to measure environmental stuff, and yet

you're having a hard time. >> oh, yeah. glenn: why? >> well, the e.p.a. -- it is e.p.a.-mandated technology. there is not a lot of money going into that from are the government. it all comes from government. either government or industry. let's say ford and g.m. have to test and the oil companies have to test. well, ford and g.m. don't have any money. the oil companies do what they have to do. it's not a growth market. the growth is in china. here in the u.s., it's a pretty flat market. >> we have the same problem that any small business does. lots of people that we sell to are contract laboratories that are another small business and they've got the same problems and it all rolls downhill. glenn: so you guys, when the government makes regulations, for these other people, then, like an oil company, you make the instrument so they can be in come miance? >> correct. glenn: and you're having a hard time selling it to even those guys? >> correct.

glenn: and it's not a growth market? i would think that the way the government is regulating that people would be beating a path to your door. >> one of our competitors who is much larger than we are, by the way, is down about 38% this year in their sales. we were down about 25%, but we've managed to secure a large order from china and get some of our yankee dollars back and kind of saved us more on an interim basis. glenn: how is healthcare going to affect you guys as a small business? >> it's a killer. we pay 60% right now. we're one of those small businesses that is under 50 people. we pay 60% of the healthcare costs. we think we have a good healthcare program for our employees, and it's going to go from 60% to 72% now, and on top of everything else that has happened with the tax increases in january, are wier an s corp., so we're one of those bad guys, too. it is really going to hurt. it is going to make it very difficult. glenn: i just had a meeting with my staff.

i am a small businessperson. our name is called mercury, incorporated. i cover 100% healthcare. we have the best we could get for new york. this year, i think our healthcare went up 40%, and the next year, it was up, like, 47% and they keep taking away options. this year when we renewed, the healthcare provider came into my office and he said are you really going to pick that? i said, well, yes, as long as i can, and he said you are the last person in the state of new york that is covering your employees like this, and i said -- i just had an employee with my meetings, and i said "i don'ti don't know how long in do that but we will do it as long as we k" they're making it impossible. they are making it impossible for you to do the right thing for your employees. >> we feel like if we keep the increase to 15 or 20%, it was a good year. that's scary. glenn: let me go to maureen.

now, maureen, last year -- you have a sheet metal company and you provided the sheet metal for yankee stadium, did you not? >> yes, we d >> so you had to have had a spectacular year last year? >> yes, we, did for us and our employees. >> how many people do you employ? >> right now? glenn: yeah. >> right now, we have 54. glenn: what exactly is it that you're having a hard time with? >> last year, i had 125. glenn: but you were building yankee stadium. >> but i'm supposed to be building something else this year. glenn: ok. >> so we had layoffs. our revenues are drown about 40%. our payroll is down 40%. we tried to save the jobs using a shared work program with new york state where all the employees gave up one day, and they got one day's unemployment benefits, so they shared it. they all got paychecks then

for four days a week. they saved on commuting for one day a week, so they could still pay their bills, and fund their 401k's, and pay their rents, but the next job didn't really come around yet, so we finally had to lay them off, so that's troubling to me, because we tried very hard, at an expense to us, to keep people. you know, when you don't have the next piece of duct work to hang, you know, the guy takes his time, which is understandable, so we did that as long as we could. glenn: is anybody here -- because, again, i'm a small business owner. i just finished building my offices here in new york. we started last november. because of unions, it took us that long to get everything done. is anybody here concerned about card check? >> absolutely. glenn: what is your fear on card check? >> well, there is absolutely no way i can keep the doors open if they were to unionize our place. there is just no way. couldn't do it.

couldn't do it. >> my company, we have 375 employees, and the majority of them are part-time, hourly-type employees, and when you think about the possibility of, you know, all of a sudden someone comes in one day and puts 50% plus one cars on your desk and you have 120 days to sign a union -- excuse me, a union contract, and if you don't get it done, you go to binding arbitration, and now, you know, the labor department is going to tell you how much to pay. glenn: you don't think the government is an honest broker, an honest mediator? so let me ask you this -- what are are the things that you see the government doing right now that you scream at the television and say, good god, don't they understand? what? what is the thing that -- yes? >> healthcare. like you, i pay 100% for my employees. there is 8 of them who are part of my staff, and they

don't pay any part of the premium whatsoever. it costs me right now $115,000 a year for those eight staff members. the 8% penalty tax on their payroll would be 65,000 dollars, so it would save me $55,000. i don't want to save that money at the expense of giving them universally controlled government healthcare, but if they tax me another 10 or 15% because i'm the e sill subchapter s, they're going to tax me into negative tax flow. i pay the profits on the taxes when they are recognized, not when i collect the money, which could be six or 7 months after i paid uncle sam. they are going to force me to pay a tough choice. where am i going to get the money to pay the extra taxes? at the expense of putting my -- i don't want to do that. i yell about that. i want my employees to keep what they have, their doctors, the tests they want, when the doctor says to get them, not

if the government says you might need the test or might not need the test. glenn: america, the average person makes $45,000 a year. our average congressman makes $173,000 a year and they have great healthcare and they have great perks. i don't know if you heard this, but they just bought three new gulf streams, which of course businesses like general motors, they shouldn't have that. citibank, they shouldn't have that, but now that we own general motors and citibank, congress needs three gulf streams g-550's. what i think most americans don't understand is that the people in this room are the people that create the jobs. it's not the people that have screwed it up like general motors or citibank or anything like that. the average person in this country is employed by people like this, and they were all people that had dreams. america, what you need to do for just the remaining time that we have is listen to these people.

i don't know about you, but i have never worked for a poor guy. i have never worked for somebody who made $20,000 a year. he has never offer the me a job. why? because he doesn't have the money. i only work for people who have dreams and people who have some money where they say, hey, come on in and we're going to struggle together and we're going to grow rich together, and you can work with me and you will have an idea and you can grow rich r i never worked for a guy who didn't have money. these people in this room actually have frustrations and some answers that you need to help them actually get answers for, or movement on in washington, because it ain't going to be the unions that save the country. it's going to be people like you and people like these people here in thehe

specialelcome to the on the death of small businesses in america, one thing that could kill small businesses faster than you could imagine is card check. bowlmor lanes has been famous for 50 years in new york, and one of the longest running bowling alleys. this business is being severely threatened by our government. >> the greatest political threat to our company is card check. >> think card check. if you think it is good for the american worker, think again. if the government takes up card check, more unions will be created which will put the squeeze on small businesses all across the country, and for small businesses that maintain a number of part-timers, union mandates on benefits and other rules will force many small businesses just to close their doors.

>> it would be so enormously expensive and make it so difficult for us to run our business that i don't know that we would survive it. surely, i will tell you if this would have been passed two years or more ago and we were a union shop, when we started facing the revenue declines that we faced over the last year, we could have never dealt with it and survived. >> bowlmor is an american success story. eight years ago, they had 40 employees, but today they operate in 8 states with 400 employees an offer healthcare to many of their full-time employees. there is no way they would be able to sustain this type of growth and hiring power if they faced pressure of a union or government mandated healthcare. >> our government right now is proposing some of the most radical fundamental changes in america that we have seen in a long, long time, and i think people need to be very careful when they look at these programs and not think about change as a goal, and if we

let this president and this congress run wild, they are going to take drastic measures and change fundamental things about our society, which, i think, they don't even understand the consequences of. >> if the obama administration is allowed to force healthcare, card check and not to mention cap and trade down the throats of american entrepreneurs, you can kiss many small businesses and jobs goodbye forever. here is bowling alley c.f.o. brent parker with bowlmor lanes here in new york city. you would think that your business would be doing well right now, because you're not going to a league place, you're catering to the regular everyday schmo, are you not? >> we cater to a pretty upscale audience. glenn: i bowl!

>> well, a year ago, we did derive 50% of our revenue from crorp corporate and special events, and as we sort of came through, a.i.g. and bonuses and junkets and this whole deal, and you know, we have the how dare you, shame on you spend money on corporate entertainment and whether it's for employees or customers or whomever, and that market has just implodeed. glenn: is there any way -- i see carmine's people behind you. jeffrey, you're the c.e.o. of carmine's? >> yes. glenn: are you seeing that businesses are not bringing people out to be entertained? >> only on the high end. you will see the high-end corporate parties that might have been $100 a head drop down to $60. glenn: as long as you're not a restaurant in las vegas or orlando, you're fine. healthcare for the bowlmo. lanes, about a million dollars

extra to provide healthcare, is that right? >> well, we're not just one property. it's six venues in four states glenn: still, a million dollars. >> that is a whole lot of money. the problem is that's our money that goes for naught, from my perspective and it crushes us. glenn: what do you mean? >> well, you take that money, as far as i can see, you pour it in the drain because you're going to put it into a government-led program where who knows how that is going to go. it is all cash pulled out of our company that we can't then invest n12 years, we've gone from 1r 2 employees -- we were at a high of 450 and now we are at 375. you can't have that sort of growth from a big business. that's a small business thing. we can't do that if all of our money is going into paying for healthcare. glenn: who is -- you look at this board and i will get into it in a second. i wrote over here -- raise your hand if you agree with

this -- that our government seems to be a government of special interests. it doesn't seem to be a government of we, the people, right? if you're in the right company or the right special interests, basically, if you're in the unions, you're in big finance, you're a giant corporation, which has big unions, or you're in a favored group or industry, you'll be fine. when i was trying to look at stimulus package, i thought why wouldn't you go to the, you know, the list of the most successful small businesses in america, and then pour the money into those businesses. you're going to do a stimulus, so how about looking for those companies that are growing instead of pouring the money do down the drain from businesses that have screwed everything up? >> we don't want a handout, but g.m., i think the number was $64 billion that was invested in them. you could have given 64,000 small businesses $1 million. can you imagine what that would have created? glenn: what would a bowling

alley do with a million extra? >> build more bowling alleys! glenn: is there anything that needs to be added on this list? i see taxes going up, i mean, crushing, just the taxes alone are going to be crushing. healthcare, crushing. cap and trade, crushing. slow down just in the business world, just the way it is naturally happening. you have regulation. who you can hire. who you can fire. i don't know about anybody else, but sometimes we try to hire very, very carefully, because you know once you hire them, you ain't firing people. is that a problem for anybody else? how about the litigation? the workforce alone, you know, there's a lot of jobs that americans just won't do. that pisses me off. is anybody else trying to hire people for good jobs, and they're either not educated enough, or they're lazy and

they won't do it, and so you're sitting here saying -- i mean, sometimes you is to hire two people because the person you hire just won't do it, or you can't keep that person -- you got to see it in the restaurant business a lot? >> we have a e.s.l. program that is english as a second language to allow people to move up, talking about people coming in entry-level positions and we hire them and pay more than minimum wages and then to promote from within, we started our own training programs. our things that we see is a lack of credit. glenn: they have made all those loans to the banks. >> right. so the banks have it. we run a successful business and want to open another restaurant and could create 225 jobs if we open another restaurant. glenn: i want to go back and then we have to take a break. i want to go back to you

saying you started an english as a second language program. is there anyone here that doesn't want more legal immigrants in this country, because legal immigrants, people who work to get here and do it the right way are, a lot of times, better than the americans who have lived here for generations and just expect it all to be handed to them? is there anybody here that disagrees with that statement? i mean, we're playing a game, america, and you're not hearing the truth on any of this stuff. if you're sick of the government destroying small businesses and changing fundamentally transforming this country, you're not alone. if you feel that way, sign up for my free e-mail newsletter at glennbeck.com. at glennbeck.com. back for mororororororeororbeatk ♪ singer:wanted to get myself a new cell phone ♪ ♪ so i could hear myself as a ringtone ♪ ♪ who knew the store would go and check my credit score ♪ ♪ now all they let me have is this dinosaur ♪ ♪ hello hello hello can anybody hear me? ♪ ♪ i know i know i know i shoulda gone to ♪ ♪ free credit report dot com!

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glenn: welcome to our special on the death of small business in america. small businesses are responsible for the bulk of jobs in this country, 70% of the jobs are created by small businesses and yet you never, ever hear anyone talk about them on television. oh, you might see them on a business network here and there, but you most likely, if you're working in america, work for a small business, and the small businesses, i could say, are dying. i think they're being killed. here now are "wall street journal" senior economic writers, steven moore, and

danni beck, on the fox business network and fox news senior judicial analyst, judge andrew napolitano. stephen, let me start with you. you have called something the triangle of evil. what is it? >> well, you have got three major pieces of legislation coming down the pike that we have been talking about -- healthcare, the cap and trade bill, and the union card check issues, and the victims are all small businesses. let's take healthcare for a minute. how are they going to fund that trillion dollar bill, glenn? payroll taxes on small businesses as high as 8% on every small business here, and then they're going to raise the income tax 5 percentage points on, quote, the rich. now, the people who are rich, are 70% of those people are small business owners. now, you ask the question why don't these members of congress get it? why doesn't nancy pelosi get it? why doesn't barack obama get it? because they have never run a business. they have never made a

payroll. they have been community organizers. they really believe, folks, that members who run small businesses are like a.t.m. machines, you just pluck dollars out of them. glenn: that's the way they run their business. they just pluck it off of a machine. mike. >> i don't believe a lot of people realize what small businesses in order to make it do. we have to mortgage our houses and go for loans to family and friends. when money doesn't come in, we're the last people to get paid, so a lot of people never really appreciate what we do. yeah, at the end of the year, we may make a little more money, but what about when we don't have the cash flow? we are the last people to get paid and our children are the last people to be taken care of. everyone else gets taken care of first. >> the number one question that my partner and i take on the weekend show is entrepreneurs calling in for 2 hours asking questions. number one is, how do i get money in this economy, in this market, and why are the banks turning me down?

why is the small business administration not backing loans that they said they would loan, and why are banks not making loans even if people put up personal collateral? >> when the federal government is borrowing $2 trillion, it is hard for small businesses to get credit. glenn: stephen, explain something to me, because i had one of my financial advisors explain this to me, a guy who has been in global finance for a long time, and he said that here's where the economy was, and then we've been bailing out all of this money. we're about here now. this is where it should be, right, let's just say housing, ok, so we have bailed out and filled this space, all of this space, with the cash that we have borrowed, ok? right? now, it still has all of this space to go, and that's just going to historic norms, it will most likely go someplace down here, so we have to come up with all of that cash.

he told me the reason why the banks don't loan to people is because -- and i barely understood it, and you would be the guy to explain it -- the way that the interest rates they are charging right now, they are making the money here, and they're trying to make it over a long period of time to cover all of this money. does that make sense to you? >> who wants to lend money to businesses when there is no consumers out there that want to consume the stuff? i mean, glenn, that $800 billion stimulus bill, there was more money for the national endowment for the arts than there was for small businesses. i mean, this is craziness! >> the government is run by people who have a couple of attitudes that probably no one in this room shares. one of them is government knows best, and the other is -- glenn: does anybody believe that? >> no! there are so many historic and contemporary examples of that. the government runs social

security, bankrupt. medicare, bankrupt. post office, bankrupt. amtrak, bankrupt. now, of course, they want to start running the healthcare system and it will be bankrupt, tooment. so that's the first mentality, that government knows best. the second mentality is that if we can do something to make you feel better in the short run, even if we take your freedom of choice away, the vast numbers of people will give us what we want more than anything else -- re-election. glenn: i am going to take a break here. you brought up the post office. the post office had a problem with efficiency. people were standing in line too long. you know what their solution was? take the clock off the wall! i'm not kidding you! how many of us would be in business if we did that to our consumers? the other thing, when we come back, congress and the white house. i know. watch this program every day. these people are going to give the white house and congress the white house and congress everythingngngngngng.ngng bull market or bear, traders are always hungry for ideas.

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glenn: welcome to our special on the death of small business in america. we have small business owners here. i know the people in washington watch the show, and now it's their turn. since they won't meet with you, we thought we would bring a little town hall meeting to them and they can watch it like cowards in their office going, oh, ok. so, your chance to talk, guys. yes? >> when we started our

business 19 years ago, and i feel as though -- first of all, we have had our ups and downs like many people in the room have had ups and downs over the years, but i feel that since january, when they ins creased the tax rate on s&p corporations, those people make over $50,000 a year. first of all, do people know how an s corp. works? i mean, people think that all that money that the company makes -- let's say we have a good year and make $400,000, that it goes into my pocket. it doesn't. it goes to create jobs t goes to increase expenditures in r&d and build a business. glenn: your business again? >> analytical sensors. >> two out of three people that barack obama wants to tax are s corp.s like james.

those are r-9 people that create the jobs. glenn: what is an s corp.? >> it is basically a small business that pays its profits through the individual income tax. >> an s corp. has to pay the taxes, the owner, when the profits are realized. december 31st is your fiscal year end. you might not have collected that money. on paper, your accountant says you just made $300,000 this year. it is not in your checking account yet. your customer hasn't paid you, but you have to pay taxes on it. right now, it is 35%, going to 39.6, and we're headed to 50%. glenn: wait, wait, wait. people don't understand this. america, if you are working in a company, what is the definition of small business? how many employees? >> less than 500 people. glenn: most of us work for

that. this is why you can't just say, hey, screw the evil rich person, because give me the taxes. run down the taxes, what it's going to be, all of the additionals. >> right now we are at 35%. they want 5% for healthcare. they want 5% to repeal the bush tax cuts. states like california, new york, oregon, new jersey, have 10% tax added on to that and it comes up to 55%. >> we came up with 54. >> payroll taxes, 6%. glenn: it is going up to 8, is it not? >> an additional 8! >> we paid a quarter million in pay payroll taxes for 47 people. >> plus workers comp and liability and all the other stuff we have to cover. >> i'm going to jump in and explain why this is happening. it is not just attitudinal. i saw you on the show a couple of weeks ago, and you were talking about oliga are.

chy, the powerful guards that have hijacked our government. if you're g.m., you can pick up the phone and you have a personal senator to call and get a bailout. if you're a wall street banks, you can. if you are a union, you are powerful enough. you can call your congressman and get the bailout. small businesses, you don't own your personal senators and congressmen. glenn: that's the problem, we don't have lobbyists. americans don't have lobbyists. you know, a lobbyist didn't happen -- correct me if i'm wrong, judge, because you may know this -- lobbyists didn't happen. they began in world war i under woodrow wilson. be >> absolutely. glenn: it was one guy who said because of world war i, some of my people need representation because they build military. well, after world war i is over, he went to albany and said wait a minute, there is a lot of money to be made here. that's when it happened and it really kicked in during world war ii. >> we should think that members of congress are there to hear our views and vote on

ways to enhance our freedom. they don't. they're only interested in special interest groups that have the numbers that they believe will guarantee their re-election. >> there's not a single person here who can afford to have a lobbyist. glenn: anybody have a lobbyist? back in just a second.ddddp

glenn: tonight we're talking about the death of small business in america. think about your first job. your first job, most likely, you worked for small business. has a poor person ever given you a job? yet somehow or another we're eating the rich, but not the uber rich. we're helping them get even richer. we're just helping them eat the person that actually

probably gave you your first job or somebody like that. this next two segments, i want you guys to address two people, anybody in washington that has power. tell them what you want them to hear, and two, if anybody has anything to say to the american people that you think they done get it, they don't understand, or please help us, this is what you can do. who wants to start? yes, ma'am? >> at the risk of being lynched, i wanted to say that absolutely the government should support the national endowment for the arts, because every dollar spent in the community that the national endowment for the arts spends is exponentially supporting small business. >> do you know they're funding porn? >> it is shakespeare. >> no, no! it is actual boom boom porn! we're not talking about

shakespeare porn! it is real porn! let me ask you this -- is the government paying for your business? is the government paying for your business? is the government paying for your business? do you help out the communities that you serve in? do you help out the communities that you serve in? how about you, carmines, do you help out the communities you serve in? >> >> where do they get the power, judge? >> they claim they get the power in the constitution. they have exceeded the constitution and come up with a ridiculous bases to justify their having the power. glenn: let me go to steve. >> i agree with the judge, he is one of my heroes. it is beyond the national endowment for the arts. the government routinely, glenn, and almost everything they do now a days is unconstitutional. this whole mess here is rooted in the fact that they make up the rules as they go along. they think something is a good idea, so they say let's do it. all these bailouts, they are

constitutionally dubious at best. national endowment of the arts is an egregious example. glenn: you want the national endowments for the arts, fine, but how about the $700 million that we just spent on wild horses? our country is burning down to the ground! we need to make some priorities. i say, sesame street isn't brought to you by the letter a, how about sesame street is brought to you by someone who actually has money to pay for sesame street! yes, go ahead. >> my question to washington is, you can't solve this problem yourself. let small business solve this problem for you, and give us credit and we can help the country get out of this mess. we don't need a stimulus package. let me have cash for canollis annually go out and open restaurants. >> how much credit does it take to open a restaurant for 225 jobs? >> we would need a credit line of maybe $1 million.

>> for 2235 jobs? >> glenn: how much would it take to open up a new restaurant? >> when we finance a restaurant with our money, and we take credit. so how much do you want to borrow is, that the question? >> around a million. >> four gand a job they could create a new job with. with the stimulus plan, it is $400,000! glenn: let me ask you this -- if you open a restaurant in texas, or in -- i'm trying to think of another state that doesn't have taxes. >> florida. glenn: florida. how much does it cost to open a restaurant in florida as opposed to new york city where the regulation, the taxes, the everything? >> we're fortunate that we do well in new york city, and we're expanding. i tell you and you laugh. the only place we feel comfortable expanding right now is in washington, d.c. because they're expanding government and that's where the money is. >> until we remember that our

elected officials, and 37% of our workers, 42 million people work for employers that employ 100 employees or less in this nation, that's' a huge percentage. i have been working, my partner and i,, a 24-year retired air force veteran, willing to put her home on the line as collateral, with equity to open a business. cost of business $147 grand and she is still being turned down, and opened a fruit stand to sell 3.2 million tomatoes over the next four years to make her dream happen, so we're hoping she can raise funds and using every source of credit possible. family and friends are reluctant to loan today. that used to be a good source of income for small businesses for startup money. people need to understand that small businesses are being drastically affected by all of these concerns, and a lot of people that want to put money into research and development, marketing and advertising and so on are holding back to see what is the heck is going to

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glenn: tonight we're talking about the death of small business in america. our last segment, we go to -- let's go to miles first. miles. miles, come over here. >> i would like to own a small business but that isn't possible in the u.k. and i just graduated from oxford and speak three languages and feel

that i'm qualified but the government over here has forgotten that by neglecting small businesses you are neglecting a lot of graduates and there are going to be a lot of unemployed but talented people out there. glenn: why can't you go to work in england? >> the government has loaned money but not to small businesses. >> you own a small business where? >> in parish, new jersey, a rundown town on the rebound. throughout this country, people have to realize that we give jobs to people in the neighborhood. it is a very small business. unfortunately, it is a lot smaller than it was 18 months ago but we employ people from the neighborhood that would otherwise be sitting on the corner doing nothing. glenn: go ahead. >> i'm in the south bronx. we employ people right there in the neighborhood. the neighborhood is much better than it was, 15, 20 years ago because of small business growth and hunts point market. glenn: maureen, you wanted to address america? >> i want to s