>> all only through a really heavy-handed manipulation or coercion of the rules -- only three that. sean-- only through that. sean: all right, greta van susteren is standing by to go on the record. she is right there. greta: it is hard to find out what is what these days. there were the 1500 pages of an incomprehensible health-care bill, and the republicans just released their bill of rights. is it any better, or is it just a stunt? rnc chairman michael steele is with us. and john mccain faced a huge crowd at a town hall, and he

said our nation is in the middle of a peaceful revolt. what does that mean? we will ask the senator. he is going on the record. and lots and lots of your money, over 1000 people just got stimulus checks, but there is a problem. they were not supposed to. and it gets worse. guess who these people are? and guess where they are? that is next. and the town halls are not stopping. >> have you ever or any of your family members lived under socialized medicine, as i call it? i have, and i have relatives living under it, and trust me. it is not working. >> i have a really simple question that i think everyone can agree on. why do we not take the $23 trillion --

>> that is not right. that is not appropriate. >> you invited us here to speak. >> are you willing to take the plan? you did not answer it. will you? >> the answer is yes. >> ok. >> if it had not been for the veritable uprising of people all across this country about these proposals that were about to be rammed through, we would not be here discussing it, we would be lamenting it. >> the health-care proposal needs to be killed and now, in its entirety. no compromises, senator, please. no compromises, no compromises, no compromises. senator, nuke it now.

greta: rnc chairman michael steele joins us now. >> good to see you, greta. greta: let me just start there. what is this a bill of rights? >> in the beginning of the spring and summer, we watched the administration say we were going to have an of-care bill by july 31 without any real input or discussion by the american people little of members of congress. they were going to try to get it done by then but we raised concerns and talked more about it and laid out clearly what we thought we should be doing. town halls began to take place, and the citizens began to get ahold of it, and the one thing that struck me that was being left behind was our seniors. the administration put out there cutting $500 billion from the medicare program with no

indication here if that would be cutting waste or the substance of programs or what that was -- with no indication if that would be cutting waste, or the substance of programs. why we should be doing on behalf of the seniors as we begin this debate in the fall, so i wanted to lay out principles that kind of talk about the doctor-patient relationship, the role of government, the decision making process involving seniors and their care givers, and i wanted to be clear about it -- and their caregivers. greta: this is how you would like to see these proceeds, right? broad-based principles? >> yes, -- how you would like to see these proceed, right? broad-based principles? >> yes. to put into law those guidelines or protections, if you will, for

our seniors. greta: , are they sitting back, waiting to see what the democrat bill is so they can put some holes in it -- greta: , are they sitting back? -- greta: are they? >> between the house and the senate, there have been over 800 pieces of legislation and amendments to various bills introduced by democrats in the house and senate that have been rejected outright, so they tried that, writing the bill, if you will, where putting their input into the documents that have been produced -- or putting their input into the documents, and they were rejected, so i thought, let's put a place market in place, and and let's follow up. -- let's put a place marker in place, and then let's follow that up.

there is all of the bipartisanship this anti- partisanship that when the leadership is not doing anything -- and this bipartisanship that. the president is giving lip service when he is demanding that we work together -- is not demanding that we work together on this problem. greta: i understand that many what reform and say it is meeting. i understand they do not like the public option, the government option. i understand they say there is no bipartisanship. but why is it the republicans did not do health-care reform when they own to the house, senate, and presidency which when they owned -- when they owned the house, senate, and presidency? >> to me please put in place our

version of the health care debate, but that is the path, and i understand that. i am now the new chairman of the party. we have got leadership in the house that we are working with. we have governors run the country to deal with this issue every single day from mississippi to indiana to the vienna. they are fighting to try to balance those budgets -- to indiana to louisiana. i will applaud the administration for putting this on the table. what i will not a plot is the way they want to go about reforming our health-care system when the parts -- what i will not applaud is the way they want to go about reforming the system. there is no money here in about six or seven years, so with all of the spending, where will the money come from to deal with our seniors when there is no money

for medicare? greta: i understand at the town hall meetings, it is their opportunity to make their politicians listen, and sometimes they turn up the volume a little bit. do you have a sense that the democratic party and the president as leader are listening to what the republicans might offer, or is this sort of, "we know best. take it or leave it. this is the way it is going to be." and not a battle has been engaged. >> i think it is the latter, a take-it-or-leave-it, and i think the president set the tone when he said "i wanon," so i get bac, but do they not come back when the citizens of the country rise up because of the abuse of power, the arrogance of the policies you are putting in place to say, "this is not what

we want," to say there is an orchestrated effort by the republicans to undermine this when, in fact, that is not the case, and today, we find out the dnc is planning to do the very same thing they accused us of doing it by organizing 1000 town halls or even over the next weeks using the unions and the moveon.org-type organizations to help coordinate a response, so this is a very interesting dynamic i-5 right now, the democrats are doing what they accused us of over the last weeks -- so this is a very interesting dynamic right now. their concern is manifest at this point, and this administration is choosing to call them "out of touch" or calling them ": riggins" or " unamerican" -- "coul

hooligans.": greta: have you spoken to senator olympia snowe? >> i have not spoken to her. i hope that she and senator collins and others, who understand, from some very difficult parts of the country in terms of being a republican running for elected office, but i think on this issue, i think the philosophy is right. i think politics is right, and i think the opportunity is right to really define this in terms of the patient-doctor relationship with as little intrusion from the federal government as possible, and i think senator snowe and others will understand that. they are having town halls up in maine and parts of new england, as well. it is no less exciting, if you will, then it is elsewhere

around the country. greta: thank you -- than it is elsewhere around the country. this was just faced at a town hall. >> please answer this, because you dr. a hard question. greta: right in the heart of the action -- because you drucked a hard question. and senator john mccain goes on the record in minutes. "a few inches of water caused all this?" "but i don't even live near the water." what you don't know about flood insurance may shock you. including the fact that a preferred risk policy starts as low as $119 a year. for an agent, call the number on your screen.

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word. i am not sure they have seen this much action since these town halls began. there was about 60% of the crowd support of the president's health-care initiatives and about 40% against. we saw people organizing on both sides. there was something printed up by organizing for america. there are thousands of these in the stands, so a lot of support. interestingly enough, once the auditorium got going, you could feel the energy. they handed at george washington's rules of civility. in all causes of passion, reason should govern, and i am not so sure that was the case inside or outside. take a look. >> health care now, health care now. >> whoo! >> we came out here.

we heard about this. we are, obviously, opposed to the government takeover of health care. >> the fact of the matter is you want to reform the entire health-care system. it is a farce. >> it is outrageous that not every american has health insurance. prove to was that it works, and then we will consider doing it nationally -- proved to us that it works. >-- prove to us. >> the cost is going up exponentially. >> this is a huge amount of money, and we need to be able to look at it rationally. >> we do not need a government option. >> solutions instead of just complaining about what we do not have, and work to being part of the solution instead of just saying no to everything. >> i am here. i am a physician. i spent my life taking care of people for nothing.

do you? >> if you had a chance to talk to him tonight, what are you going to secure them? -- say to him? how were dean, bringing most of the fire out in people -- how borodin -- howard dean, and he was on the sunday talk show circuit. take a look at what he said. >> this republican party is a shrinking republican party. it is just determined to undermine president obama, and, unfortunately, you have to undermine the country in order to undermine the president, and i think that is too bad. >> i had a chance to talk to men entering tonight's, and here is what happened. he is changing his tune a little bit -- i had a chance to talk to him entering tonight. listen to this.

can you clarify that? >> i did not say that. i did not say that. >> he was not made available and left very quickly, so i could not get him to verify that, but this has in no way lost steam. as you have seen, we have covered these for the last several weeks, and we will continue to do so. this got to a point where one was escorted out of for disrupting the events tonight. it lasted a little over two hours. greta: griff, i think you may hold the record for going to the most town hall meetings. are they smaller, bigger? what is the difference between the states? what are the similarities? >> a couple of observations. first, the earliest ones seemed to be a real referendum on washington, cash for clunkers,

an array of issues, and the last cabin focused on the health-care fight, and as we saw tonight -- and the last have been focused on the health-care fight. you see a larger turnout of folks that are opposed to it and focusing on health care. but it is not getting any lower, and, of course, the recent polls suggest support is waning a little bit for the president's health-care initiatives, and tomorrow, the democrats are going to continue to have these organizing parties, not tea parties, but they will be organizing rallies in support of health care, and something we will cover here on friday, california and making its way all the way to washington, so this fight is heating up here at the end of august as kids get ready to go back to school. greta: griff, thanks. and many people, over 1000, just

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greta: here is a novel idea. how about the government being competent? especially when it comes to your money? the government mistakenly sent out stimulus checks to 1700 inmates to the tune of thousands of dollars. now, how did this happen? a reporter joins us. how is it that 1700 prison inmates got these stimulus jacks? >> -- the stimulus checks? >> they were distributing 52 million stimulus checks to people all across the country, and they were unaware that those individuals were, in fact, in prison. greta: is it really true that $425,000 was paid out? >> yes, that would be the

figure, if you take that figure and multiplying it. greta: how did you get wind of this? -- if you take that figure and multiply it. >> we went to the department of corrections, and they did confirm that some 23 inmates in massachusetts did receive the checks. critics of what happened to the checks? >> well, it turned out that some of the inmate to receive them were entitled to them, and the reason for that would be that some of them were free -- greta, what happened to the checks? they were under -- greta: what happened to the checks? they were lawfully drawing social security during that time were entitled to benefits. the other individual was a retiree from the railroad system, and there are no

restrictions on railroad retirees collected their benefits -- collecting their benefits once they go behind bars at some point in their life, and then the remaining -- just the remaining individuals who got the checks, we know that only five of them have sufficient funds to be able to pay the restitution. greta: so out of all of the checks, 1700's, and the $425,000, -- 1700's, -- 1700, how much did we get back? >> that is what the social security and administration is looking at right now. because they did not have any record -- what the social security administration is looking at right now.

whether they're actually entitled to the money or not. separately, the inspector general's office, or the social security administration is in the process of conducting an audit of those payments, which would look at whether payments were sent out to inmates, to people who were deceased, to fugitive felons, to people no longer living in the united states or no longer your lawfully. greta: do you have a profound sense that this is well organized, or do you get a sense that this is just a nightmare? >> you have to keep in mind that some 52 million people are drawing social security checks in the united states, so relatively speaking, 1700 is not the most significant figure in the world. greta: except that $425,000 would do a lot for a lot of the

unemployed people. i imagine they could feel upset about that. anyway, thank you. >> thank you for the time. greta: a up next, john mccain goes on the record about a revolt here in the united states, and yes or no, where a john mccain vote for a bill without a public option -- and up next, john mccain. and the white house is saying one thing, but there is another thing being said.

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shovel-ready projects. >> there you go. greta: you called a town hall meeting a peaceful revolt. is that what you think these are? >> i think what is happening in the country is a peaceful revolt that has sort of a ignited because of the incredible generational theft. with all of the spending in the trillions of dollars of debt, now an estimate of $2 trillion more in the next 10 years, and people are very nervous and very upset about that, and then you have a government-mandated health-care plan that costs $1 trillion or $2 trillion more, and i think in probably one of the most unusual ways that i have seen, they are standing up and saying "enough." greta: you say they are upset about the projection of the 10- year deficit and health-care

costs. do they feel any better after the town hall meeting? >> i do not know if they feel any better. there may be a better understanding about the issues and challenges that they face, a public option, which is really the government option, which is not really something that would do anything but lead to a government takeover of health care in america. they are very concerned, of course, about many aspects of the issue, but the, quote, public option, and i use quotes because it really is the government option -- greta: is there any way you would vote for health-care reform that had a public option in it? >> no, i could not do that. i think the hippocratic oath is first do no harm, and we would do great harm, because there is no doubt in my mind that this public option would sooner or later takeover of our health- care system. if it was just another insurance

policy, then we would have 1501 opportunities, but this would over time deprive people of choice. one woman stood up at this town hall meeting, and she said, "i get the sense that we are losing our freedom," and in a way, when you're talking about your freedom to choose your health- care provider, your doctor, your medicine, and all of those things, in a certain way, her freedom and many americans' are at risk here. greta: with the democrats and the house, they could lose some, and even in the senate, as well. has anyone paula deen aside to say, "listen, i do not like that government/public option either. i do not think i can vote for it"? -- has anyone polish you

aside? >> medich there is going broke. -- has anyone pulled you aside? >> medich here is going broke. -- medicare is going broke. medicaid is going broke. if the democrats insist on this, quote, "public auction," no, i could never supported. it has to be off of the table -- it did a public option." -- "public option." greta: what about this reform? >> i think the president is torn. there is, of course, the center that is also becoming more and more nervous because they are hearing from their constituents.

it is not clear to me where the president will go. one of the things he might do is come up with a proposal on its own, but, again, i repeat. i know that republicans are willing to try to put incentives and wellness there, to reform medical malpractice reform, to have a broader choice and range of options, such as the purchase of health insurance across state lines and many other changes that i think we can agree on, but not a big government solutions. greta: -- not a big government solution. greta: is there anything that he is saying now that you did not hear before during the run-up which is a big change? >> no, except that the president continues to say that if you like your health insurance policy, you can keep it, and if you have a public option, and

some of the proposals that are passed through the senate health committee which i am a member of and is about to be voted on in the house, if you cannot keep your insurance policy. it would fundamentally change. greta: why is he saying that? he simply disagrees with you? where he has different information? is he dead wrong? -- or he has different information? >> i think he must have bad information, and i respect the president. i respect the results of the election. the fact is that the president was for this quote public option many years ago, and he does have a very liberal, big-government voting record, and this is where we of fundamental, philosophical differences. i say that with respect -- and this is where we have fundamental, philosophical differences. greta: senator feingold said, and i am paraphrasing, these are

my words, but he was talking about there being a health-care reform bill by christmas. is this going to happen? >> i do not know. i am very disturbed to hear recent -- and it is only in the media, because i am not consulted -- information that the democrats would bring up the so-called reconciliation, which means that you can pass significant legislation with only 51 votes. that would set a terrible precedent. i think it would blow up the senate. i think it would fundamentally change the way it functions, but i also thing democrats believe they do not want to repeat the failure of clinton care, the proposal by the president and then-mrs. clinton, now secretary clinton, his back in 1993, 1994. i do not know what they are going to do -- secretary clinton, back in 1993, 1994, but

it would have devastating consequences if they did that. i am not sure. it is obvious that some democrats have been leaking that that proposal is under consideration. greta: senator, thank you very much for joining us, sir. >> thank you for having me on, greta. this is one of the most interesting times of all of the years i have been there. greta: indeed. thank you. here is a look at what is coming up after the show on "the o'reilly factor." bill: greta, is mandatory health care constitutional? we will debate that on "is it legal." greta: do not ms. bill o'reilly, number one in all of cable. -- do not miss bill o'reilly. and we have a tape with david

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greta: there is much more "on the record" ahead, but first, we go to our new york newsroom with ainsley earhardt. >> nasa having its third attempt to launch discovery. there was a faulty fuel valve. bad weather halted the first attempt. the shuttle is set to deliver

supplies and equipment to the international space station. if discovery has not launched by sunday, the mission could be delayed until october. more than 40 dead, including four american soldiers, and five car bombs went off in qanbar -- in kandahar. they believe there may be more victims underneath all of that debris you have been seeing. kandahar has been the subject of many attacks in recent years. i am ainsley earhardt. now, back to greta. greta: hours ago, the white house and congressional budget office released a new projections about our exploding national debt. now, here is the weirdest part. their numbers are grossly different, but they both suggest we are much worse off. our guest joins us.

>> it is crazy, is it not? does anybody truly understand when we reporters and news people who talk about the government does this, the government does that? people do this all of the time. with the help of some really cheap props and a couple of times, i am going to talk about the budget, the deficit, and the debt, and then we will get to the key point, which is why does anybody give a darn about this. the white gauze and congress say this year will be $1.60 trillion. -- the white house and congress say that this year, the deficit will be $1.60 trillion. i have got a dime right here. they have to borrow 10 cents, and each year, they have to borrow 10 cents, and each year, the deficits keep adding up. that is the deficit. it adds up to what we call the national debt. all of those times, according

to the white house, within 10 years, the deficit will grow, the white house says, by $9.10 trillion. congress is saying it will grow by $7.10 trillion. greta: a big difference. >> yes, that is the debt, all of it. all of those deficits add up to the national debt. so the question is why do you, greta van susteren, why do i, adam shapiro, all of us americans, why do we care? here is why. i have a trustee $1 bill. greta: that is your favorite one. but i was going to use a real one, but i was worried that they would come after me -- >> i was going to use a real one. roughly 66 or maybe 76 depending on his estimates you believe, let's say 76% of the country debt, it would be equivalent to

this amount of gdp. that means the crofton the -- that means this is a problem, because when you are financing this much debt, when you have trillions of dollars in debt, the government has to borrow money at higher interest rates that they pay to borrow money, and when they borrow money at high interest rates, two things happen. if there is less money in the marketplace for you to borrow money, and then to borrow more money, they have to keep raising interest rates, and the rate you pay will be even higher. that is what the deficit is a problem. we all think of it in terms of paying it back. forget paying it back. it is that the cost of doing business keeps getting more and more expensive. greta: why is it that the white house number and the congressional budget office number are some different? >> here is the simple answer.

the white house answer includes the potential for health care. notice i did not say "health care reform." let's just say health care legislation. the projections of what over 10 years, $1 trillion added to the budget and deficit spending -- the congressional budget office, in their review, is only looking at everything as it is right now, as the law is right now, because there is no health care spending. it is assuming that the tax -- this is mind-boggling -- the tax cuts with president bush will expire in 2011, and the cbo is counting be new money that would come into the treasury, so you would think that it is lower. it is lower than what the white house is saying. on the other hand, they say it is still going up, even with that tax money, so it is really bad. greta: who do we trust? >> who do you trust? your mama? your dad?

greta: i do not know. when you overspend your means, it is not good. >> we always think about it as rational people that we have to pay it back, and we do. think of it this way. the more debt there is, the more expensive it is to do business, and the more expensive it is to do business, the more expensive it will be for you to borrow money. not as much as other countries. we are still a case like that. greta: adam shapiro, thank you. up next, the best of the rest. actress jessica biel is the most dangerous actress in the world. why is that, the most dangerous? you will find out. and there is a guy in a hotel that takes fly the friendly skies to a whole new level. coming up. [ female announcer ] the deeper you clean, the cleaner you feel. olay deep cleansers go beyond what the eye can see.

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greta: you have seen our top stories, but here is the best of the rest. there is a show happening in new york city, and is very much happening out in the open. some people have allegedly been showing off, showing a lot of themselves, and the hotel has large for a to ceiling windows facing the park, and they are

seen in front of the windows, getting frisky with each other, and it has become a tourist attraction. according to "the new york daily news" the hotel is cracking down on the problem. yes, we report, you decide, and speaking of naked, a man is being charged with getting naked on an airplane and punching a woman sitting next to him. the man allegedly exposed himself to a female passenger and then punched her in the face. after that, he mean? the man -- after that, a man just went berserk. the plane returned to oakland. the man was charged with interfering with the flight crew. and look out for actress jessica biel. she is dangerous. here is what we mean. according to reports, internet searches for her name have a large chance of leading you to a site that will hurt your

computer. more people end up with computer viruses after that search than with any other celebrity. in case you are wondering, jessica simpson, tom brady, and beyonce are also on the list. andy's tiger cubs made a debut at a zoo. they are critically endangered cubs -- and these tiger cubs made a debut. they are on display. in 2003, their mother was also born at the zoo, and there you have it, the best of the rest, but still ahead, your last call. one last more before we turn down the lights. is david letterman having trouble with women? and, yes, we think you'll like this.

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greta: 11:00 is almost here. it is time for last call. david letterman may have just met his match. a "vogue" editor went to his show, and meryl streep's character was based on her in a movie. >> i am and elian, fleeing from district 9. a dominatrix -- i am an alian. -- alien. >> that movie, "doevil wears prada." >> well, i remember that movie was fiction, and we really like

fiction active a vote -- at "vogue." >> i tried to give very clear direction. unfortunately, they do not hear the answer that they would like to hear. >> have you ever put anybody in a headlock prov? [laughter] >> maybe you. >> i was impressed that before it went to press, it was still undecided, that there were still re-shoots going on. is that typical? >> absolutely, like a television show. you guys did not even call me until friday. [laughter] greta: did dave just get a smackdown? we report, you decide. we will see you tomorrow night. do not forget,