>> thank you, everybody! that's it for forbes on fox. keep it right here. "cashin' in" starting right now. have a wonderful weekend. >> is the real insanity believing the government won't go overbudget and turn this into a multi-trillion dollar boondoggle? plus prostitutes an pimps funned by your tax dollars. >> are you a hooker? i thought i was on a date with you. >> acorn stripped of federal cash, but wait until you hear of another group still on the public dime. a "cashin' in "investigation you can't afford to miss andayñ?ñ? s regaining power across america. >> i will do what i have to do

to get the union back! >> the president with his biggest push yet for organized labor, but is he really pushing more jobs out of america? all that, and oprah on the ropes. she's losing her audience fast. what's her plan to get it back? it's the billion dollar strategy everyone can take a lesson from. your money, your life, your show to stay ahead of the game. "cashin' in" starts right now. >> a full-court press this weekend to sell the president's $856 billion health bill. democrats tout how inexpensive it is, but do two other programs they passed this year prove it will cost at least twice that much? hello, everybody. welcome to "cashin' in."our cree rogers, jonathan honeig along

with tracy byrns and john layfield. also joining us democratic strategist julian epstein. welcome to everybody. remember cash for chunkers? it was supposed to cost only a billion. it turned out to be $3 billion. how about that tax bake for first-time home buyers. the original price tag was $6.6 billion. now they say it's more than double that, and these are vim pell short-term programs. jonathan, what is going to happen with something as complex and permanent as healthcare if it gets more expensive. >> well, we'll end up like our existing entitlement programs, broke. you have to be on mushrooms to believe that a government-run healthcare program is going to end up on time, efficient or underbudget. look at medicare. it started out as $60 million in the '60's and it's hundreds of billions today. if you total up all these programs we're on the hook for

non-funded liabilities in the trillions. in promoting healthcare, the president is killing the last parts of the private market and enslaving americans for generations to come. >> it's hard to believe that we can't get a guarantee from congress that they won't add a ton of pork barrel projects to this bill and turn it back over to a trillion dollars. >> the democrats are looking at a py-go which republicans never did. these are crocodile tears from conservatives who never paid for the iraq war or tax cuts. if democrats want to pay for it, you have the c.b.o. able to enforce t look at what is hannoning with tarp. all the conservatives said it would be a waste. now we have 32 banks on the mark for paying -- repaying at least $130 billion worth of tarp funds t depends on how you manage it. if you manage it well and cut the waste, which the democrats want to do, in the healthcare system, 30% is wasted on overhead n a government-run medicaid and medicare only 4%

are on overhead. the government programs are more efficient. >> half the banks were forced to take tarp money. tarp is not a good comparison. you have healthcare that will be pushed through regardless. we are all going to get burned in the end because it is going to cost more. they're going to pile on crap we don't need and you're going to be nickeled and dimed. already we're talking about slicing off your flexible spending account, penalties on pulling money out of your medical savings account, all this to cover the cost and they will do it without letting anybody know and you will feel it in your pocket. the american consumer is going to pay the price of this medical bill, which we don't need in the first place. >> well, it's going to be debated in the light of day and paid. for conservatives nerve are paid for any programs during the bush administration. this will be paid for by cutting the fat. >> i don't believe that! >> the point is that how can we say it will be under $900 billion when you have already

got members of the house saying when it gets to us and it will go there, of course we will add more security to the healthcare system. that means more money. >> that would only be the tip of the iceberg. the thing to compare it to is not the mickey mouse things. it is the medicare drug bill passed under the bush administration that was supposed to be a few hundred billion and is up to a trillion because that's what happens when you don't pay for things and use government estimates. i wish it was just nickel an dime stuff. it should be dimes an quarters and dollars because that's how you have to pay for it. there is no efficiency game to save trillions from the system without cutting existing benefits in medicare to pay for it. >> we are talking talking about $350 billion in extra fees an taxes to paid this and expand medicaid under the baucus plan. >> well, i think the proof of the fact is that there is no government program, in spite of what you say about tarp, you're wrong, but there is no

government program that has ever not exceeded whatever estimates they have made. if this was so easy to fix, why don't they fix medicare? just start with that. fix that first, then you can have some kind of plan. they can't fix that. >> that's right. >> jonathan, go ahead, finish. >> even if they said it was half a trillion -- this thing is $500 billion. it is government vox itself that drives up the cost of prices. government accounts for 50% of all the healthcare spending in this country. why is that that the cost of computers have gone down and i don't know, maybe a postage stamp has only gone up? another government monopoly. >> everybody on this program totally opposed the economic recovery plan coming out of the white house.

now everyone is saying that the recovery plan is working and the economy is coming back. >> that's not what everybody is saying! >> nobody is saying that! >> it is the democrats that come in and actually pay for these programs. >> oh, jewelian! >> by spending cuts an cutting the way, we are ron the way. >> i guess you get your numbers on the sports page because they have nothing to do with reality. government has never done anything right! they're talking about paying for stuff. they're not paying for the iraq war. i hate to tell you that, they're still not paying for it. they're extending the afghanistan war. somebody, a republican, who is going to run against him next election will have it in the bag because these guys are not paying for anything! >> coming up, acorn coming under

fire for shady practices. >> a bunch of girls will be coming in doing these things, performing tricks and she will give me the money. >> congress cutting out federal funding to acorn, but is it time to stop giving taxpayer money to all community organizations? plus, oprah falling off her throne. what the queen of daytime t.v. is doing that has folks fleeing. (announcer) it's applebee's 2 for $20. the one deal in the neighborhood where you get the real food. featuring a half rack of our new double-glazed baby back ribs with your choice of sauces. get one full-sized appetizer and two real entrees for just twenty bucks. it's 2 for $20. only at applebee's.

this country definitely needs to focus on other ways to get energy. we should be looking closer to home. there are places off the continental shelf. natural gas can be a part of the solution. i think we need to work on wind resources. they ought to be carefully mapping every conceivable alternative. there is an endless opportunity right here.

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>> from america's news headquarters i'm kelly wright. new fallout from the acorn tapes. new york governor paterson ordering state agencies to put a 30-day hold on contracts with the community-based group. the move comes after this undercover video came out. in it, acorn employees in brooklyn were shown telling a couple posing as a pimp and prostitute to lie about her profession to apply to loans. also developing, 7 former c.i.a.

directors now urging president obama to stop the investigation into harsh interrogation techniques used on terror suspects. attorney general eric holder announced last month that an independent panel would investigate c.i.a. agents but the former directors warn that the investigations could discuj c.i.a. officers from doing the kind of aggressive intelligence work needed in counterterrorism. "cashin' in" returns right now. >> that's exactly what i would do. try thai massage, you know. there are just a bunch them. >> the house and senate voting to cut off federal funding to acorn this week after numerous workers at the community organization were busted giving advice on how to beat the system. john, we're not going to go into the prostitution comments in all

of this. i don't want to go there with you, buddy, but many community organizations do a lot of good but you're saying cut them all off. >> i'm saying cut them all off, especially the ones with ties back to the government. you have a lot of community organizations that do well, but these community organizers, unless they're going to run for president are ruseless out there, except if they're going to be corrupt. giving money to acorn and they're giving you back votes, that's where corruption starts. >> $50 billion in lost revenues to community organizations across the country, we're losing tax money and this is what we're getting for our money, stuff like acorn. >> the devil is in the details again. i mean, would you cut out the united way, for example? no. that's the well-run one. you have to regulate it in the proper way. if they had to make audits and have an audited statement and go before the congress every year or before the i.r.s. -- let me

finish, please -- to get their 501c3 qualification, if they had to do those kinds of things, that would be fine. then you could have legitimate organizations running quite well let me finish! geez, jonathan! everybody lets you talk. why don't you let somebody else talk? and if you allow those organizations that are well run to prove themselves, then that's fine. just don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. >> ok, jonathan, you can speak now. >> wayne, if you want to support united way, then write a check? i support diabetes, and a lot of organizations. but why is the government writing any of these people a check in the first place? the role of government, why do we have it? it is not to fund community organizations not to protect me in a community organization. >> these groups have strong

lobbying arms and taking the money they get from the feds and spend it on wining and dining congressmen and senators. >> no, actual actually, there are restrictions on the use of federal money for lobbying wavment we need is more accountability and more audits. there are tons of religious-based organizations that are doing an enormous amount of work in communities and there is a bipartisan agreement that they do good work and more effectively than the government can do it. we need more accountability. wayne is exactly right. >> the current audit system is weak and i say thats as someone who has been here, when you do the audits on non-profits, unfortunately, somehow or another we get governmental involvement and the next thing we know things slip through. we need transparency and stricter rules. >> so fix it! >> hang on, julian! give me a break. i'm supporting it. we can't get rid of them all because if we did and they lost their tax-preferred status,

there would be no churches, there would be no united way. >> i don't buy that. >> why not? >> remember george bush had the community based faith initiative actor something like that? that's how they got money in the first place. i'm with honeig. there should be no money going to these groups. this is a private sector sending donations, charity, whatever, and i question the tax deductibility and the tax is-fre status of many of these organizations. >> jewellian, you say well, there is all these restrictions on lobbying efforts because we can't police acorn as a nation, and this is one group of out of 1.8 million. how do you watch the groups out there to make sure they're not doing anything improper with taxpayer dollars? >> wayne said it, you can have auditing requirements. you can have transparency requirements. i hope with the investigation of acorn will show it was a few bad eggs but we will wait to see what the investigation shows.

>> why at the end of the day am i paying for that trash? i mean, honestly, if an organization where they're supporting and propagating pros stiewtion? why is my money going to that and not to my own wallet or an organization that i want to support? why is the government involved in funding that at all? >> we will leave that question to our viewers to ponder at home because they're very smart people and they love watching this show. coming up, the president making a big push for big labor this week. big loss for you? cheer clear

>> let's all get behind the employee free card check! >> president obama has promised to big labor this week he will work to dis sick kret worker ballots. he stiffed china on the tires imported and that was to help the union. tracy, you think that is the worst thing for the economy? >> unions are not needed. our labor conditions have improved. now all they do is promote excessive costs to america. what we're doing to china is awful. we're killing free trade. you find me a union that is actually working. the teachers union, government unions all have underfunded pension liabilities. none are making money. what is the point these days? i don't know. >> we interview these executives all the time that say the union

costs are killing the bottom line at companies. it's hard to support union jobs when they are so costly and they can possibly put you out of business. >> it was actually the healthcare costs killing people more than the union costs. one of the biggest reasons we have the economic problems is real wages didn't rise under the bush years. finally we have a president sticking up for working people. the chinese instance wasn't a question about fair trade practices. they were stealing jobs through unfair trade practices. >> we hear that a lot. what does it do for the working people? >> let him finish! >> finish your sentence. jonathan, be quiet, please. >> finally we have a president that is standing up for working people, not just on healthcare but on unfair trade practices as the bush administration only sometimes did. jonathan, go ahead and respond. i know you're dying. >> i'm sick of the marxist finesse. his job is as president to all

the citizens not people who work with their hands. >> are you really saying something like that? >> i'm saying it is a subsidy to the unions. >> wayne, the think about the chinese tariff is that it could start a trade war in this country and that could not only destroy jobs but destroy the economy. >> let wayne respond. thank you. >> i think that's a separate question, really, the question is if you're trying to create jobs in this country in a time of stress, like we are, economic stress, the majority of the jobs in the united states are created by small businesses not by big business and tracy was right to say big business, big labor came as a result of big business and big everything is not good. it destroys competition. it is a question of how to solve this is really not a union question at all. it is a question of getting

entremendous entrepreneurship and taxes, cindy, to small businesses to create job. >> i know what you're saying, and you make a great point about small bises businesses in this country. >> unions don't serve the purpose of country. there are gains to the workers. they are stealing the gains. unions are allowed to be there but they're not serving a purpose. tariffs is a bad way to solve a problem with another country. >> we have to leave it there. thanks to julian epstein for joining us today. coming up, the queen of daytime slipping frommer her throne. find out what she is doing that could cost you money, next. doesn't make you choose. it neutralizes acid in seconds and controls heartburn all day or all night. pepcid® complete , works now and works later.

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not 1999 money but the internet boom is back. this will last, because money isn't piled into internet stocks like commodities. so i'm recommending the dow jones internet index. this is not an area of speculation with the masses. that's ok that did is up a lot at this point. >> jonathan, what do i need to know from you? >> well, yu-gl-oh is at highest bought card game. it is one stock that i own in my fund and it could do very well. >> jonathan, i'm a big fan of that! >> federer won didn't miss the u.s. open but tiger woods is going to win the fedex cup and bet on fedex once the economy

comes back. >> tracy? >> oprah winfrey's few viewership is down, under 7 million. look, she alienated a lot of women when she chose obama over hillary, and alienated republicans when she chose obama over the right. now she's starting to feel t keep your political views to yourself if you're trying to sell a product. >> wayne, what do i need to know for next week? >> well, you're going to get a healthcare bill whether you like it or not. it will be terrible. it will be a mash mash but you will get one. congress is determined to do something. i would suggest you get some of your money, put it in biotech if you need it and by the way, john layfield, you're right. tiger is going to win. >> we've got plenty of support for tiger. we have not had the september sell-off. what is going on? >> that tiger woods thing is a real long shot. i'm going out on a limb. i think the