across town. [ laughter ] mitch mcconnell, john boehner, karl rove, they are all warning you of the tremendous impact if you support this legislation. now it could be that they are slid having a change of heart and they are deeply concerned about their democratic friends. [ laughter ] >> giving you the best possible advice in order to assure that nancy pelosi remains speaker and harry reid remains and all keep the seats. that is a possibility, but it may also be possible that they realize after health reform

passes and i sign the legislation into the law, it will be harder to mischaracterize what this effort has been about. because this year small businesses will start getting tax credits so they can offer health insurance to employees who currently don't have it. [ applause ] because this year, those same parents who are worrying about getting coverage for their children with pre-xfg conditions now are assured that insurance companies to have give them coverage, this year. [ applause ] because this year insurance companies won't suddenly be able to drop your coverage when you get sick or impose lifetime limits or restricted limits on the coverage that you have. maybe they know that this year, for the first time, young people will be able to able to stay on

their parents' health insurance until they are 26 years old and that might be popular all across the country. [ applause ] >> what they also know is with a won't happen. they know that after this legislation passes and after i sign this bill, lo and behold, nobody is pulling the plug on granny. [ laughter ] >> if it turns out that in fact people who like their health insurance are going to be able to keep their health insurance, but there is no government takeover. people have discovered if they like their doctor they will be keeping their doctor and more likely to keep their doctor because of a stronger system. it will turn out that this piece

of historic legislation is built on the private insurance system that we have now and run straight down the center of american political power. it turns out this is a bill that tracks the recommendation, not just of democrats, tom daschle, but also republicans, bob dole and howard baker. that this is a middle of the road bill that is designed to help the american people in an area of their lives where they urgently need help. there are some that wanted a single payer, government run system. that is not this bill. the republicans wanted what i call the foxes guard the hen house approach, we further

deregulate the insurance companies and let them run wild, the notion that was going to lower costs for the american people. i don't know what serious economists that buy that idea but that was their concept. we rejected that. we said we want to create a system in which health care is working not for insurance companies but working for the american people. it's working for middle class families. so what did we do? what is the essence of this legislation. number one, this is the toughest insurance reforms in history. [ applause ] we are making sure that the system of private insurance works for ordinary families. a prescription -- this a patient's bill of rights on steroids. so many of you individually have

worked on these insurance reforms they are in this package to make sure that families are getting a fair deal. if they are paying a premium, they are gag good service in return. making sure that employers, if they are paying premiums, the employees are getting the coverage they expect. that insurance companies are not going to do the system with fine print and decisions and dropping people when they need it most, but instead are going to have to abide by basic rules of the road that exemplify a sense of fairness and good value. that is number one. the second thing is to create a pool, a marketplace where individuals and small businesses who right now are having a terrible time out there getting health insurance, are going to be able to purchase health insurance as part of a big group

just like federal employees, just like members of congress. they are now going to be part of a pool that can negotiate for better rates, better quality, more competition. that is why the congressional budget office says it will lower people's rates for comparable plans by 14-20%. that is not my numbers. that is congressional budget office numbers. so people will have choice and competition just like members of congress have choice and competition. number three -- if people still can't afford it, we're going to provide them tax credits. biggest tax cuts for small business is when it comes to health care in history. [ applause ] >> number four, this is the

biggest reduction in our deficit since the budget balance act, one of the biggest reduction deficit measures in history, over $1.3 trillion that will help put us on the path of fiscal responsibility. [ applause ] >> that is before we count all the changing measures that are going to assure that the delivery system is working for patients. everybody that has looked at it, every single good idea to bend the cost curve and actually reduce health care costs is in this bill. so that is what this effort is all about, insurance reform, a marketplace so people have choice and competition that

right now don't have it and are seeing that their premiums go up 20% to 50%. >> and reduction of the cost for american families. there was a study that said this would potentially save employers $3,000 per employee on their health care because the measure in this legislation. by the way, not only does it reduce the deficit, we pay for it responsibly in ways that the other side of the aisle that talks a lot about fiscal responsibility but doesn't seem to be able to walk the walk, can't claim which it comes to their prescription drug bill, we are actually done for. this is paid for and not add a dime to the deficit or reduce the deficit. [ applause ] >> now, is this bill perfect?

of course not. will this solve every single problem in our health care system right away? no. there are all kinds of ideas that many of you have that you are not included in this legislation. there are discussions in how we're going to deal with regional disparity. i know there was meeting with secretary sebelius so we can make sure that we give people the best bang for their buck. [ applause ] >> this is not -- there are all kinds of things that many of you would like to see that isn't in this legislation. there are some things i'd like to see that is not in this legislation. but this is the single most

important step we have taken on health care since medicare? absolutely. is this the most important piece of domestic legislation in terms of giving breaks to hard working middle-class families since medicare? absolutely. is this a vast improvement over the status quo? absolutely. now, i still know this is going to be tough, i know this is a tough vote. i talked to many of you individually. i have to say that if you honestly believe in your heart of hearts, in your conscience that this is not an improvement over the status quo, yet despite

all the information out there that says without serious reform efforts like this one, people's people's premiums are going to double over the next five to ten years. folks are going to keep getting letters from their insurance companies, their premiums went up 40-50%. if you think that somehow it's okay that we have millions of hard working americans who can't get health care. that it's all right and acceptable in the wealthiest nation on earth that children with chronic illnesses that can't get the care that they need -- if you think that the system is working for ordinary americans rather the insurance companies, then you should vote no on this bill. if you can honestly say that, then you shouldn't support it. you are here to represent your constituents and if you don't think they will be honestly helped, you shouldn't vote for

this. but if you agree that the system is not working for ordinary families, if you heard the same stories that i've heard, everywhere all across the country then help us fix this system. don't do it for me. don't do it for nancy pelosi or harry reid. do it et for all those people that are struggling. some of you know that i get ten letters i need a day out of 40,000 we receive. started reading some i got this morning. dear president obama, my daughter, wonderful person, lost her job. she noose health insurance. she had blood clots in her brain, she is now disabled and can't get care. dear president obama, i don't

qualify for medicare and my cobra is running out, i am desperate and don't know what to do. do it for them. do it for people who are really scared right now, through no fault of their own, who played by the rules, who have done all the right things. suddenly found out because of an accident, because of an ailment, they are about to lose their house. they can't provide the help for their kids. or they are small business who up until now who has taken pride for their workers and found out they can't do it anymore. they have to make a decision to i keep providing health insurance for my workers or do i just drop the coverage or do i not hire some people because i simply can't afford it. it's all being gobbled up by the insurance companies. don't do it for me. don't do it for the democratic

party. do it for the american people. [ applause ] >> they are the ones that are looking for action right now. [ applause ] i know its tough vote. i am actually confident -- i talked to you some of you individually -- it will end up being the smart thing to do politically because i believe that the good policy is good politics. [ applause ] i am convinced when you go throughout and you are standing tall and saying, i believe this is the right thing to do for my constituents and the right thing to do for america, that ultimately the truth will come out. i had wonderful conversation with betsy, there she is right

there. [ applause ] the biggest newspaper is somewhat conservative as betsy described. they weren't happy with heath care reform. they were opposed to it. betsy, despite the pressure announced she was in favor of this bill. low and behold, the next day that same newspaper runs and editorial, we've considered this we've looked at the legislation and we actually are pleased that congresswoman is supporting the legislation. [ applause ] [ applause ]

>> when i see john -- stand up, with whole bunch of his constituency. [ applause ] [ applause ] >> in toughest district there is and stand up with a bunch of help from his district, with pre-xfg conditions, i don't know what is going on in washington, but i know what is going on with these families. i look at him with pride. now, i can't guarantee that this is good politics.

every one of you know your districts better than i do. you talk to folks. you are under enormous pressure. you are getting robo calls and e-mails that tie up the communication system. i the pressure you are under. i get a few comments made about me -- i don't know if you noticed. [ laughter ] i know what it's likes to take a tough vote. one thing for sure, i'm not bound to win, but i'm bound to be true. two generations ago, folks were sitting in your position, they made a decision, we're going make sure that seniors and the poor have health care coverage that they can count on. they did the right thing.

i'm sure the time they were making that vote, they weren't sure how the politics were either. any more than the people that made the decisions to make sure social security knew how the politics would play out or folks on the civil rights act knew how the politics were going to play out. they were not bound to win, but they were bound to be true. now we've got middle-class americans that don't have medicare, don't have medicaid watching the employer-based system fray along the edges and being caught in terrible situations. the question is, are we going to be true to them? sometimes i think about how i got involved in politics.

i didn't think of myself as a potential politician when i got out of college. i went to work in neighborhoods, working with catholic churches in poor neighborhoods in chicago. trying to figure out how people could get a little bit of help. i was skeptical about politics and politicians, just like a lot of americans are skeptical about politicians right now. my working assumption was, when push comes to shove, folks in elected office are looking out for themselves and not looking out for the folks who put them there. there are too many compromises. that the special interests have too much power. they just got too much clout. there is too much big money washing around. i decided to get involved because i realized if i wasn't willing to step up and be true to the things i believe in than

the system wouldn't change. every single one of you had that same kind of moment at the beginning of your careers. maybe it was just listening to stories in your neighborhood about what was happening to people who had been laid off from work. your own family experience, somebody got sick and didn't have health care, you said something should change. something inspired you to get involved. something inspired you to be a democrat instead of running as a republican. somewhere deep in your heart you said to yourself, i believe in an america in which we don't just look out for ourselves. we just don't tell people, you are on your own. we are proud of our individualism and liberty, but we have a sense of neighborlyness and we are willing to look out for each

other and help people that are vulnerable and help people that are down on their luck and give them a path way to success and give them a ladder into the middle-class. that is why you decided to run. [ applause ] [ applause ] now a lot of us have been here a while. everybody here has taken their lumps and bruises. it turns out people have had to make compromises. you've been away from families for a long time. you've missed special events for your kids sometimes. maybe there have been times where you asked yourself, how did i get involved in politics

in the first place. maybe things can't change after all. when you do something occur on age us on, it turns out sometimes you may be attacked. sometimes the very people you thought you were trying to help may be angry at you and shout at you. you say to yourself, maybe that thing that i started with has been lost. you know what -- every once in a while, every once in a while a moment comes where you have a chance to vindicate all those best hopes that you had about yourself, about the country, where you had a chance to make good on those promises you made in all those townhall meetings

and all those constituency breakfast and all those people that you looked in the eye and said -- you know what, you're right. the system is not working for you, and i'm going to make it better. this is one of those moments. this is one of the times where you can honestly say to yourself dog gone it, this is why i came here. this is why i got into politics. this is why i got into public service. this is why i've made those sacrifices because i believe so deeply in this country. i believe so deeply in this democracy and i'm willing to stand up even when it's hard. even when it's tough. every single one of you has made the promise not just to your

constituents but to yourself. this is time to make true on that promise. we are not bound to win, but we are bound to be true. we are not bound to succeed, but we are bound to let whatever light we have shine. we have been debating holiday care for decades. it is now been debated for a year. it is in your hands. it is time to pass health care reform for america. i am confident that you are going to do it tomorrow. thank you very much house of representatives. let's get this done! >> president obama at the state capitol speaking live as he address the democratic caucus. his last ditch effort to get this health care reform through.

welcome to a new hour. i'm julie banderas joined by gregg jarrett. a day before this big vote set to happen tomorrow. dysz now saying they are confident they have the votes to pass the biggest health care overhaul assistants the great depression. let's get straight to carl cameron with the latest developments. hi there. >> he let democrats know that he knows the pain that they feel. the problem for passing for democrats has been the division in the democratic party. just one thing, here is some of the comments to help frame in it terms of heavy thing he has to get it over the necessary votes. by some democrats, they are only short five votes but we have them over the threshold. he says i know it will be a tough vote but it will be good

politically but three minutes late i can't guarantee you this is good politics. he went on to say, if you are constituencys would not be helped, you shouldn't vote for this. is still perfect? of course not, and will it solve all the problems, no, but he says it's been bill order the private insurance companies and called it a middle of the road bill that will help average middle american families. i should tell you, all over capitol hill today, tea party activists have been going door to door talking to their congressmen complaining about the bill. i'm told that a lot of them are middle-class americans and they don't like it. he is making his sales pitch over the visitors center while the visitors are going around the capitol saying no thanks.

>> julie: carl, even republicans are saying it would be very difficult for this thing not to pass, but republicans are holding out hope. holding out that americans will reach out to the constituents and jam the phone lines, according to some republicans urging congress to voice their opposition. do you think the american people really have a say at this point in this stage of the game? >> oh, sure, absolutely. it has been public opinion that has in part slowed the process down. it's an insider versus outside game. it's the tv ads and special interest groups that are vulnerable to democrats and frankly vulnerable republicans in the upcoming midterm. that is the outside game. in the past three weeks, it's been an inside game. the vote has not been one of the american public. the vote has been the ones in the congress h the they are voting their conscience as well as their constituency.

the inside game has been tight. we have it down 218 for and 214 against and those leaning for and against the bill. ultimately, passage will require democratic votes. there is a small coalition of democrats joining republican opponents but it may not be enough. today and yesterday the democratic leadership has been saying they are confident when the tally is counted tomorrow, they will have the votes to pass it. to make health care reform the law of the land and reconciliation comes after that. >> julie: carl cameron, thank you very much. great coverage, thank you very much. >> gregg: president obama urging house democrats to vote for health care reform. did he make a compelling case? perhaps he already has the votes and the address was for a larger skeptical audience. we'll go to our fox news

contributors. not withstand ago bunch of democrats who are saying they are undecided, i have to tell you leaders of the party say and seem confident they have the 216 votes. do you think they have it? >> yes. they do. i would say the guy in the parking lot came foup me, is it going passion or not. i said pass on sunday, he is sure. i'm sure. you are hearing from hoyer they have the votes. you seem seen individual democrats moving and carl is talking about the polls. they would not be dropping this deem and pass bill, but they didn't have votes. >> gregg: i think you are right. >> and parking attendant took your word to the bookie. [ laughter ] >> gregg: republicans are vowing to en lure every procedural weapon available to stop the bill. if the votes are not there, why

not vote? if they are there, aren't republicans delaying what is it going to happen? >> sure. they are trying to get these sound bites in places and get the sound bites for campaign commercials. there has been more baloney settled on today than available at a local supermarket. they won't pull the plug on granny, no, but they will deny her care because she is too old. there are so many things you could pick out of the speech. people are going to get one test instead of five tests but what if one test doesn't find the cancer. they get the five tests because the trial lawyers who look over the shoulder of every doctor of america can't wait for a lawsuit. but there is no trial reform in this bill. >> gregg: polls consistently and you know this show americans are pretty angry about the back room

deals that perceive vote buying and the president promised to strip all out special interests. yet this stuff is still going on and has been for several days with some house members getting special deals just in the last two days. i got a whole list right here seemingly in exchange for their yes votes. why is that still going on? >> i'm shocked. [ laughter ] they are still gambling in las vegas. i know cal will find that shocking. this is politics. >> gregg: americans say they are sick of this stuff. they don't want it anymore. >> look i don't think the process has been ideal. cal and i would agree on that. i don't think the back room deals are a great political tool, but i have to tell you at the end of the day, anybody that

professes to be shocked on a close bill the president goes one on one with members of congress. >> gregg: we need a hard break. thank i both. thanks so much. we'll be right back with more of our coverage.

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>> julie: moments ago we all heard from president obama addressing the democratic caucus sounding determined to get health care passed. democratic leaders sounding confident they will get it done in the next 24 hours, but there are still some pretty hot button issues that could possibly come out in the final countdown to tomorrow's vote. geraldine ferraro is a fox news contributor and rick santorum is a fox news contributor, as well. i want to start with you.

the deem and pass maneuver is dead. many by now would probably know this was controversial ploy to passes the version before the house begins on a second fix-it resolution known as reconciliation. many viewed the move as a shortcut. now that it's dead, democrats to have come up with a votes. how does it change things? >> we're focusing on process. this isn't about process. this will be done this deem and vote, that is not going away, it's not dead, but it's not dead for the future because this is used and focusing on it. what i want to point out to you, i believe that president obama just now voiced what i think a lot of people were concerned about -- whether or not the members of congress can trust what is being told to them as

far as whether or not their vote will count and how they will be followed up on. the word is trust. if you take a look a what he was talking about. we're talking about nancy pelosi is an incredible speaker but we're forgetting that she is nancy delasandro. when she was living in baltimore her brother and father were mayors of baltimore. she knows the process, but she also has been raised with this idea that when you get into a position that you can help people. that is what you should do. that is what you are seeing from her. usual seeing from the president, you are seeing from steny hoyer. people can trust them. so if you take a look at the issue of abortion.

one of those people that are still on the edge on this one. marcy has been in large enough, she knows these people. i think that is where it comes down to. >> julie: let's talk about one of the big fires that need to put out, abortion. pelosi says there won't be a separate bill. i guess if it means they can't do a separate side car bill without losing pro-choice democrats or they don't need the votes of the pro-life democrats, the question is cot supak amendment prevent democrats from securing the magic number considering pro-life democrats are very much against the federal government's funding abortion? >> there will be a lot of pro-life democrats that will vote no. right now the speaker believes they can pass this bill without having to make any changes on

the language. planned parenthood research parm has predicted if the bill is put into law, there will be no changes to this bill will mean there be over 400,000 abortions in america as a result of this bill. you have a lot of pro-life democrats, one democrat announced he was going to vote for this bill even though it's going to increase abortions by 400,000 a year. you are going to see a lot of members that are follow obama to be is going into political oblivion, nancy pelosi can't be trusted on this one. this is a bill that will expand abortion coverage greater than we've seen in the history of this country. what i would argue with roe versus wade. >> planned parenthood and others

are quoted and misquoted. let me point out one thing. the point is that the current law is that no federal money can be used to fund abortions. you know, let's not make this an abortion bill. this is about -- take a look, wait a minute, are rick. take a look at what you are saying. you are saying that the potential for something could happen in the future on this issue of abortion is something we should debate now. no, it's not. this is a bill that will cover 31 million people who don't have heath care. >> and abortion. >> and there is an old story, we are all concerned about the issue of abortion or whether or not the provide choice rights -- this shot about the debate. >> this is about tax funded abortion. >> there shall 31 million americans. listen, rick. i have told you something. having gone through a situation

where if i didn't have coverage, health care coverage and for medicare which is the beginning, it's not the beginning. we've had the health care program for 40 years. if you take a look at this thing i'm sorry, if you take a look at this, 31 million people will be covered. no pre-xfg conditions. >> julie: abortion is the elephant in the room. i want to talk about the resolution that would add to the language of the health care bill before sent to the president. if passed by the house and president, hoyer says it's unlikely that such a measure would get through both houses. do you agree? >> it will not get through both chambers. they will not approve this. bart stupak knows this. if he is using it for cover to get the votes in the house. maybe they can get the votes in the house, but they can't get

the votes in the senate. there is no way the democrats will pass this. this is a complete red her richk >> i'm inclined to believe when you have somebody on the other side like marcy who has been for last 30 years supporting pro-life she trusts the leadership of the people. >> every pro-life organization, this will expand abortion. >> julie: we have to go. we thank you very much. 216 votes needed to pass this thing. we'll find out tomorrow. >> gregg: even if the democratic lawmakers say yes to health care overhaul, 37 states are saying no. we'll be talking to a constitutional attorney on the legal challenges already filed. will everyone with constipation please report to gate 17?

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overhaul. they plan to sue the government as soon as the measure becomes law. mandate that requires all americans to buy health insurance. a constitutional attorney at fox news analyst joins us now. the mandate requires individuals not the state government, to buy shoorps. how would the states be standing to sue? >> idaho is the first one that passed a law. governor signed off the law earlier this week. 37 other states are lined up saying, it's not just an individual right, it's a state's right and the state is going to step in and say federal government, you can't tell us and mandate and penalize as citizens of the state for not buying your government insurance. >> gregg: and since 15 million people will be put on medicaid, it's the states that pick up the costs so they are directly harmed. look, conscious has authority in the constitution to levy taxes

and to regulate interstate commerce. where in article one, section 8 or anywhere in that esteemed document does it say you can force americans to buy health insurance simply because they exist? >> nowhere, gregg. nowhere does it say that. that is what idaho is depending on. there is a clause that states that the federal law supreme to state law when it comes to issues of constitutionality but nowhere in the constitution does it say they can do that. >> gregg: what about interstate policy. supreme court is given wide latitude to economic activity. refusal to buy health insurance negatively impacts the overall marketplace higher health care costs, taxpayers have to absorb that burden, isn't that commerce? >> it's an excellent argument. it will be used when it reaches

the supreme court. any time you have a product that transfers from one state to another, yes. it affects the commerce clause. again, under the commerce clause supreme court has said you can't levy fines or penalties for people that are being burdened like this. >> gregg: a strict constructionist would say the following -- if i choose not to buy any health insurance at all, i'm not engaging in any activity at all, and i may not go to a hospital if i get sick forcing a hospital to absorb the costs. i may deal witness myself. that doesn't impact anybody and it doesn't impact congress commerce. if you do go to an emergency room and sign off on paper, you do go to the emergency room, they have to take you which does affect commerce. i am sure you would agree with me on this. you have a state for idaho, 37

others, really huge constitutional issues. it's going to wind up in the supreme court. >> gregg: and it may come down to one guy, anthony kennedy with a swing vote. i get e-mailed, i'm forced to buy car insurance. that is misnomer, driving a car is a voluntary privilege. >> you don't have to drive a car. nobody is putting a gun to your head and you have to buy a car and drive. versus here, you have mandatory insurance, you have no choice but to buy this. >> gregg: if i don't buy health insurance under the measure, i get penalized. what about the old supreme court decision, bailey versus drexel that says congress may tax to penalize? >> that is what comes square against the idaho law. feds are going to say, once you have standing.

the decision with the drexel decision, that is right on point. there can be no tax like this. that is what exactly is written into the idaho lay and other laws being drafted as well. >> gregg: i think this is heading to the supreme court. you have four conservatives, four liberals and one swing guy, anthony kennedy. so we'll wait and see. >> julie: it could be a rough ride for some incumbents in the next few months. new dynamic polls show that voters are not happy with the lawmakers in washington right now. take a look at 68% of voters say they would oust all incumbents, 20% say they would keep all lawmakers in office, just 20%. what else are they saying about the current state of congress. let's ask larry sabado, director of center of politics. great to have you on. with 68% saying that it's trial

for a big change and 20% saying, you know they are happy, is it time for our representatives to go? >> this is not a good year to be an incumbent member of congress. it's particularly not a good year to be an incumbent democratic member of congress in moderate conservative districts, in southern districts, in the 41 districts carried by john mccain where an incumbent is running. we're going to see a lot of changes in november and health care reform is one reason. >> julie: what are people saying about congress's job approval? >> it's as low as it gets. the fox poll showed it at 18%. gallop had it at 16% approval. there have been several others in the teens. that meenls that 85% of the american public disapproves of the job they are doing that. would be an f minus in my

classroom. >> julie: you say it's a result of bad things, bad economy, congressional scandals and push for holiday care. does congress follow the will of the american people according to those you polled? >> i think it follows the will of the american people they listen to. remember, a lot of those districts are partisan gerrymandered. many of the members have to be concerned about the primary. they have no to worry about being nominated because the districts are so tilted to one party or the other. that is the reason why you are seeing some of the representatives majorities may oppose the health care reform. they are going in the other direction. they are thinking about the nomination, not the general election. >> julie: you talk about danger ahead if health care passes. let's talk about the new poll numbers you have which indicates it could be a tough election for incumbents. what would happen if the

election was held today, who is better off now, democrats or republicans? >> it's not even close. republicans would pick up anywhere from 27-37 seats in the house of representatives. they need 40 to take control. in the senate, i think they would pick up somewhere around six or seven senate seats. they would need a total of ten to take control in the senate. so you are seeing democratic margins sliced down to the minimum. remember, it's march and it's a long time to november. you never know what people will be thinking about around november but i think some of these concerns will be present based on what people are telling me. >> julie: all right, great larry great to have you on. >> gregg: showtime on capitol hill, more like showdown. president that just left from

speaking he says time to vote. we'll have more on tomorrow's vote on the landmark legislation expected tomorrow coming up. fancy feast appetizers. [dinner bell chimes] high quality ingredients like wild alaskan salmon in a delicate broth, without by-products or fillers. fancy feast appetizers. celebrate the moment.

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ú? captioning by, closed captioning services, inc. and that's good because the competition's steep today. >> julie: major developments in the fight over health care reform as we begin a new hour of america's news headquarters. president obama speaking moments ago to members of the house

democratic caucus, urging them to pass what could be the most important and divisive legislation of his entire presidency. we have fox team coverage today, on this saturday, wendell goler is live at the white house, carl cameron on capitol hill, i'm julie bandaras in the studio in new york city. >> gregg: and a beautiful day outdoors and house leaders preparing for a big vote on the legislation tomorrow and last check the current estimated vote stands at 218, for or leaning for, 213 against, or leaning against the bill and the democratics need 216 to support the measure, still, this is a very fluid situation, the numbers changing almost hour, so, anything can happen. before the actual votes, are made. carl cameron is live on capitol hill, and, carl, quite a speech the president gave to the democratic caucus. >> reporter: it was, had a lot to do and a lot of messaging to

accomplish in talking to the house democrats recognizing they are right on the cusp of the historic vote and there is still a possibility, they are a couple of votes shy and the democratic leadership and whip counters made it clear they are confident the votes will be there and there may be last minute deals to need to loom and be culminated but for all intents and purposes it is going forward and to give an idea of how resigned the republicans are to the reality, a rare moment of g.o.p. congratulations for democrats, in the house rules committee they decided they wouldn't use the deem and pass technique that would ultimately require only one vote, on the rule for the reconciliation debate, that would have deemed the senate bill passed onto the president. through the house, and that is not going to happen now. and, because democrats chose not to take that route, republicans are congratulating them for the openness of tomorrow's process which will actually involve a house vote on the floor, in which they'll actually vote on the senate bill in order to send it to the president and it looks clear they have the votes and you can hear in the confidence and the triumphant tone from the majority leader of the u.s.

senate, harry reid and democratic speaker of the house, nancy pelosi of san francisco. listen to this: >> we are on the verge of making great history for the american people and in doing so we'll make great progress for them as well. the president has said, over and over, we will measure our own success on the progress that has been made by america's working families. that is our responsibility. and we will honor it, when we vote on health care reform. >> reporter: and, harry reid echoed those sentiments and the democratic leader is confident they now have been able to set up a system, a process, that even president obama said was ugly. ultimately, would prevail and he acknowledged that it is a tough vote for a lot of democrats and said he wasn't guaranteeing it was good politics but many democratic lawmakers understand the constituencies in their district and if they feel it is not good for the people that voted them into office they

should vote against it and it amounts to a tough political dare from the president of the u.s. and the administration and most democrats believe if they don't pass health care the political fallout from that would be far more devastating than the political fallout, voting for a bill the public is not fondl of now and the president said once the implementation and the reforms takes place the american people will come to it down the road and that is the gamble and the vote cast tomorrow and with in a matter of a few days it is expected the senate will wrap up its work making the process complete. a huge triumph, seemingly in the offing, notwithstanding the tea party activists who fanned out across capitol hill, trying to get people to change their votes to nos and the american people who suggested they still have ambiguity and ambivalence and out right doubts about the wisdom of all of this. >> gregg: carl cameron live on capitol hill, thank you. >> julie: the president on capitol hill a short while ago, rallying his fellow democrats, for a final push on health care.

and, reassuring them we're going to get this down, wendell goler is live from the north lawn of the white house with more. so, wendell, what did we hear? >> reporter: julie, we have been told to expect the pep rally, but, much of it was really a heartfelt speech reminding lawmakers they got into politics to help people and decided to get into politics as democratics and not republicans, and the president repeatedly said he understands the vote tomorrow, will be stuff and it will take courage and though, he says, he believes ultimately, it will be politically the smart thing to do and repeatedly invoked the one republican president, that democrats love to quote most, that is abraham lincoln who said, i am not bound to win, but i am bound to be true. a bit of what he had to say. >> president barack obama: every once in a while, a moment comes where you have a chance to vindicate all of those best hopes that you had. about yourself, about this

country, where you have a chance to make good on those promises you made in all those town meetings and all of those constituency breakfasts and all of that traveling through the district. >> reporter: this president has reportedly told lawmakers, privately, that the fate of his presidency rests on the vote they'll make tomorrow. but on this day, he said, don't do it for me. don't do it for the democratic party. vote yes for the american people. julie? >> julie: wendell, how important was it to the white house for the democrats to avoid the deem and pass parliamentary maneuver? >> reporter: it is an important plus but the president himself, partly, made it happen, by repeatedly saying in public and private no matter what the parliamentary procedure was, that -- of the vote the democrats took, the public would see it, as a vote for health care reform, and, since the president and his aides said, republicans are going to use the rather unpopular nature of the process over the past year, to

beat democrats up with and the polls, in the fall, they might as well have a bill to show for it. now, house leaders made it a little easier pill for members to swallow. by allowing to vote on the president's fixes, before voting on the senate bill whip many chf them don't like and will be the law of the land for a time and senator harry reid came along today with a letter signed by more than 51 members of the senate, promising they will vote for the president's fixes and not leave the unpopular senate bill the law of the land and the white house will continue to play its part by not really celebrating until the senate actually corrects that bill and votes for the house fixes. julie. >> julie: wendell goler live at the white house on this saturday, thank you, wendell. >> gregg: first day of spring, officially and you went know in parts of the country and oklahoma. blizzard conditions, are whipping up, heavy snow is

falling and strong wind making for a slick saturday and colorado, plenty of snow, falling to the ground, and a foot of snow in the mountains and snow to massive flooding and warnings and watches up along the banks of the red river between north dakota and minnesota. but, there might be a sliver of good news. the national weather service lowering its predictions now, this river is expected to crest at 19 feet, above flood stage tomorrow. instead of 20 feet. we'll take it. and, national guard soldiers, inspecting clay dikes, they say, they are -- no real immediate problems they can detect. meteorologist domenica davis is standing by live in -- in the extreme weather center, happy spring. >> happy spring. it is good news for the red river here, and the national weather service, about noon time, they decided that they were going to take the forecast crest and put it down to 37 feet by tomorrow and that means, as far as the historical records go, it could not make it into

the top five, which would certainly be good news. last year, they had a record crest, so that would be nice if that didn't see that, this year and we'll have to see on sunday, but, as you were mentioning, some people are getting hammered with the snow and it is not feeling like spring, mainly down through the southern plains and you can see a line of storms moving off to the east and here's the cold front and this is basically separating spring on the eastern side from winter on the western side. so, plenty of snow, and, we could have anywhere from three to six inches, through parts of the southern plains, with thunderstorms. down to the south and if you notice, look at these temperatures, out of whack, 31 for the current temperature at kansas city where the front is and 71 in new york and cooler air, arrives to the east with that front sunday and monday. >> julie: domenica davis, thanks very much. >> julie: it is all coming just down to the wire. the hours literally after more

than an -- a year of debate, the president making a final push on health care, this saturday afternoon in a live speech here which we carried live, and, democratic leaders growing confident by the hour, how much momentum is there now? and, how much resistance is left, our next guests will be in the thick of it tomorrow, republican congressman paul brown of georgia and democratic congresswoman allyson schwartz of pennsylvania. thanks for talking to us on this eve of what will be a very, very busy day for you both. >> julie: i want to start with you, congresswoman schwartz. how many votes will the bill require. the tax cuts, who will benefit as a result, in the end, what say you. >> the fact is we have committed to pay for the legislation. and have savings and increases, taxes on the health care

industries, and, some shared by the -- wealthiest americans, and the president made a commitment, that no one who makes under $250,000 a year, in family income will pay any new taxes, that is true in this bill and, as you point out there will be a great deal of help for small businesses, with tax credits and containing costs to the american people with families being able to purchase more affordable health insurance, 32 million more americans, being able to have choice in affordable insurance coverage, and greater protections for every american in making sure the insurance they do buy, covers the kind of health care needs that they have. a very important piece of legislation for the american people. >> julie: congressman brown, talk to me about tax increases. talk to me about medicare cuts and how many years will it pay for benefits. >> the medicare cuts of $500 billion and the simple truth is tax increases will hit everybody. every, single -- taxes will go up, with tax increases on all

aspects of business, in fact, the simple truth is this, too, families making $66,000 or less, will have half of the tax increases fall on their backs and every family in this country is going to see higher costs, for everything -- higher taxes, on most people here in america and it is just, it is just beyond the economics, the democrats used, and, in fact they'll give six years worth of benefits, as an example, for ten years worth of tax increases and the benefits won't start until 2014 and tax increases, if this is passed and i hope and pray that it does not pass, will start immediately, so, it's the economics they are using, and it is simply not true. >> julie: when it comes down to economics, today, president obama said that he will be reducing the deficit, congresswoman schwartz, in the weekly g.o.p. radio and internet address today john boehner took aim at the democrats' health care bill and he said and i'm

quoting, democrats in washington showed the partisan path and a costly big government agenda, the trillion-dollar stimulus is national correspondent working as struggling families continue to ask, where they're jobs. and taxpayers' hard earned money is spent so fast that $2 trillion has been added to the national debt on the president's watch. now, democrats want the federal government to take over health care. which represents 1/6 of our economy and he says -- >> i'm happy to answer that. this is -- you know, it is so outrageous, of course, mr. boehner knows it is not a government takeover and knows if we do nothing and what he wants to do, and paul wants to do as well, and it is unfortunate, want the status quo, which is 20, 30, 40% increases for american families an american businesses. >> allison you know that is not right, actually -- >> excuse me, that is really creating an economic, really, can't be as competitive with these kinds of health care costs, and, you know, you

mentioned the recovery act. and this fact is that as much as we hear from the republican leadership and republican members, that this -- in their opinion has not work, every economist really -- right wing, left wing, middle of the road said it would have been an economic disaster, financial disaster in this country, if we hadn't taken action and we have seen a turn around, at least a stabilization, we're beginning to see renewed confidence in the marketplace and seeing those kinds of investments -- >> julie, the truth is -- >> go ahead. >> the truth is the same people who said if the stimulus package was passed unemployment would not go above 8%, and the same people are telling us that the deficit is going to go down over the next ten years, by $100 billion and it's not true and i asked the american people, i asked allison, do you really believe this is going to happen? it is just not going to happen. >> the independent, nonpartisan congressional budget office, which -- we don't even like this numbers, sometimes, but this time what they came back with,

they said, it will be $1.2 trillion deficit reduction, over 20 years, we need to take this action, both for our federal budget, but also the american people. and, for our businesses, who are really struggling every day to pay this cost of health care. we are going to contain the rising cost of health care, for our families, our businesses and for government and we're going to improve the quality. we have to take the action, the status quo is really -- >> congressman brown i'll give you the final ward, i started with congresswoman schwartz and then i really have to go. >> julie, the cost to everybody's health insurance is going to sky rock and the experts tell us, a family of four, is going to see a $2100 increase in their cost of insurance, so, they are not -- and they used the zombie economics and figure ten years worth of huge tax increases on everybody, which will increase the cost of goods and services for everybody, and, to try to

binge a deficit reduction of $100 billion, and it is just not going to happen and in the out years, it will skyrocket, so, they just use the zombie economics to try and prove a point that is just not true. it will be very costly and drive people away from providing, and doctors... >> julie: okay. i -- >> just opinion. >> julie: and, you addressed one another without even looking at even other and that is exactly why this will not be a bipartisan bill. >> we were instructed to look at the camera, and we know each other and that is not what it is about. we do not agree on this this piece of legislation. >> it is a "no" vote, we'll have a number of democrats that understand that this is costing too much and i've had a number of them, who told me they will vote no. >> julie: all right. >> -- because it is too costly for everybody, and, it is too costly for government. >> julie: all right, we have -- >> and, bipartisan vote is no. >> julie: we have to wrap this up. >> it is a --

>> we have to wrap this up, thank you very much for coming on, congresswoman schwartz and congressman brown, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> gregg: and fannie mae and freddie mac, lawmakers are ready to make a move. could that be done? and what would that cause, maybe another melt down? we'll talk about it, coming up. when you hear a click, you know it's closed and secure. that's why hefty food bags click closed. be sure it's secure with hefty food bags. just one click and you know it's closed. hefty hefty hefty ♪ stinky! ♪ stinky! ♪ stinky! ♪ stinky! ♪ hefty! ♪ hefty! ♪ hefty! ♪ hefty! hefty bags with unscented odorblock technology help neutralize odors and stop the stinkies. ♪ stinky! stinky! ♪ stinky! stinky! ♪ hefty! ♪ hefty! ♪ hefty!

>> julie: they are the american top two mortgage finance companies and are also at the center of the collapse of the nation's housing market. and, now some republicans in congress say they want to phase out fannie mae and freddie mac. over the next four years. fox business network's tracy burns joins us live, all right, so they were at the center of the mortgage melt down and now there is a plan from g.o.p. members in congress to phase them out within four years. is that even possible. >> it is a grade yes idea. look they -- grandiose idea and they want to redo the housing finance market overall and fannie mae and freddie mac were in the center of the collapse the last few years and they are part of the secondary mortgage market and you go, you get a mortgage from your bank, fannie mae and freddie mac buy that mortgage from them, and free up cash from your bank so your bank can continue to go out and make loans and that was part of the problem. threw money out there, simply

and once fannie mae and freddie mac had these mortgages, they went out and sold them off, as securities, but, backed them pretty much said, we'll back anything we sell. so, they had a lot of money on the line, and we all know what happened, so they lost their shirts, and thankfully the government was there to backstop them and, julie, as we heard on christmas eve, the government has pretty much said, we'll back you forever. now they have a clean slate. >> julie: if fannie mae and freddie mac were to phased out, i mean, let's speak hypothetically could it stabilize the housing market. >> it would bring us all back to rea the notion that we have the back stops and there will be someone there to catch us when we fall, that has to stop. that was why the housing market came down in the first place and the availability of money, the availability to quickly get help, if, god forbid you needed it, that has to go away and getting rid of fannie mae and freddie mac could take that part of the equation out. but, we have $1.5 trillion invested in these two companies

and the government owns 80% of them and we'd take a financial loss if we talked away, right now. >> julie: with the massive bailout you talked about, pumped into fannie mae and freddie mac, the question is, are they just too big to fail. >> well, i mean, we heard, you know, our fed chairman saying the other day, we have to stop this notion of too big to fail but these guys are big and we own 80% of them, on paper, we would take a loss, the taxpayer can't afford to do that now and these things need to be liquidated slowly and succinctly and smartly, not what we have soon happen this far down in our government, they need to think it through and do it properly otherwise it could tlohrow a lo of gyrations into the market. >> julie: tracy burns from the f fox business network. thank you.

>> gregg: fox news on the job hunt, plenty of people going to veterinary school to one day treat the family pets, makes sense given the time money an attention a lot of folks place on what they consider to be members of the family. but, the demand for family veterinarians creating a shortage of them, trained to treat large farm animals. that is a problem, reaching a crisis level in rural areas. casey steegel live from davis, california with more. hi. >> reporter: gregg, good to see you, as medical doctors have specialties like oncology, and pediatric, think of it, the same with veterinarians, the vast majority of vets are more interested in caring for the small animals, than large animals, which means vets ha to work on farms an ranches at uc

davis, one of the most tres prestigious schools in the country, 25% of students elect to work with larger animals, which leads to bigger problems down the road. >> we are facing a crisis in the next ten or 15 years, inasmuch as 50% of all of the veterinarians, that work on livestock senate u.s., are 50 years of age or older and there will be a big retirement phase happening. >> reporter: now, experts say while working with livestock it may not be the most glamorous of jobs but is arguably more important, considering, the health of these animals impacts the nation's food supply. from the meat you eat to the dairy you consume. listen to this: the american veterinary medical association estimating there are 500 counties across the nation with large populations of food animals and no vets to treat them. >> livestock, sheep, cattle, beef, we need large animal

veterinarians to keep our herds healthy and when we don't have them it is harder to keep them healthy. >> reporter: one way the feds are getting involved to try and lure more veterinarians to the field forgiving the loans if they work in these settings for a period of time. they are badly needed. >> julie: thanks. the final push to get health care reform across the finish line the president on capitol hill telling fellow democrats today backing the bill will end up being the smart thing to do politically, but did he do enough to convince those who are still on the fence, our political panel weighs in, next. these are actual farmers who raise vegetables in campbell's condensed soup.

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>> julie: the bottom of the hour, time for the top of the news now, oklahoma city bracing for blizzard zart conditions on the first day of spring, strong winds creating snow drifts and dangerous driving conditions, as

you can see. >> julie: >> gregg: a federal judge holding off on a ruling for ground zero workers and will not approve a proposed $657 million settlement, until more negotiations are heard and he wants lower legal fees and dollar amounts given out to 10,000 workers, before they make a decision on a claim. >> julie: and, acorn possibly on the verge of bankruptcy. the group reportedly holding a teleconference this weekend, to discuss their plans, for the future. over the last six months, at least 15 of the group's 30 state chapters have been disbanded. >> gregg: democrats expressing confidence this afternoon they have the votes to get the president's health care legislation passed. still a lot can happen, between now and the vote, and, president obama is leaving nothing to chance, making a rare visit to capitol hill to rally the troops and did he seal the deal, we'll

ask john fund and juan williams, good to see you both. john your latest column, aptly entitled "the fat lady has not sung." was really based on about a dozen democrats, who didn't like the slaughterhouse rule, now the deem and pass has been thrown out the window, effective, what, three hours, four hours ago? in your mind, does that change the count? >> i think that the democrats did themselves a favor by getting rid of deem and pass and now they'll have a direct up-or-down vote in the senate bill and i think it will help them pass it. passage is likely, but not certain. but, they paid an awful political price for this. you know, the democrats, you a few days ago got a poll from the service employees international union, one of the top supporters saying one of the biggest problems they've had in passing the bill is the public reacts against these processes and don't like all the special interest deals and don't like the fact they were trying to avoid a direct veenote and whene

house votes tomorrow they'll vote for a lot of things people don't like and then will have to turn themselves over to the tender mercies of the senate and the house will have to vote on this again, tomorrow will not be the last vote, though though bill will become law if it passes. >> gregg: juan, what is your assessment? do you thing the president has the numbers, nancy pelosi as well. >> i think the momentum is with them and i think the president did a terrific job this afternoon went he went out to seal the deal and what you see is the president making the case, that not only john fund but karl rove, and john boehner, mitch mcconnell, really had the interests, if they had the interests of democrats at heart would they advise them to vote against the bill, he said, you know what? once the bill is passed and you are able to make the case to voters directly about the benefits they'll get from the bill, he thinks it will be a political bonus and spoke about abe lincoln and this being a

moment and we can get it done and it was like a pep rally. >> gregg: john many of the popular health care provision as you know are front-loaded and if it passes, americans will experience the good stuff, first, and second of all, there are signs the economy is recovering and the stock market is up and the next jobs data, coming out, shortly, is supposed to be pretty darned good and, third i'm sure you probably saw, those pew research policy numbers that were just out, those are actually pretty favorable for the president, so, is the prediction of a political tsunami in the wake of the passage of this legislation a little overwrought? >> well, i think the democrats are going to have a short-term bounce in the polls after it passes, for one thing the base will be reinvigorated and they'll have passed the health care bill and for another, they'll be able to mutual onove safer ground like jobs but there will be a lot of bad news, the insurance increases we saw that led to the bill will continue, for the next few months and just

this week, arizona announced it is ending its s-chip program and throwing thousands of people off the medicaid rolls and all of the uninsured people that will be covered, over half will be covered by putting in the medicaid which the states are rejecting and we saw recall greens in oregon, the largest pharmacy reject medicaid patients and the news may be that finally health care is off the radar screen, and they can be relieved, but, the bad news on health care, is going to continue through november. >> gregg: this president calls it the most transparent legislation ever. he said everybody will be able to read it and know what it in it but on wednesday, it was c conspicuous when he talked with bret baier, he was struggling to explain what was in or out of the bill and it was posted on thursday and thereafter several changes have been made and they are still being made and pelosi may make more changes through the manager's amendment after the legislation, is brought to the floor tomorrow.

so, in truth, this isn't transparent, is it? >> well, i think on the big items, you know, for example, regulation, the insurance industry, insisting, you know, for all the things the president talks about, that if a child with a preexisting condition is -- has and insurance policy the child cannot be banned or excluded and other benefits for families like a child getting out of college can stay on the parents' insurance plan until the child is 26 and i guess that is not a child but, gregg the point from -- in terms of transparency, has been a negative for the president. you know, in my mind, this whole episode, if we look back to a year ago and the failure to get anything done for a year, when the president had all of the momentum coming out to the election and the election of scott brown in january, that seemed to be the death knell for this, it has been perils of pauline, a soap opera and now it is revised and all about process and will we have deem and pass, what about reconciliation, is

that fair, is that legitimate, what about the nebraska cornhusker kick back and greaat on aid and john said there was a poll and americans think it stinks and back room chicago style politics and it stinks. >> it is worse and hastings, on the rules committee today, said, quote, there ain't no rules here, when the deal goes done we make it up as we go along, unquote and normally the american people don't care how a bill is passed but i think this will be the exception that proves this rule -- >> that is the question, john, that is the question, does this have some carryover? for most of the democrats i talked to today they don't believe it and we'll see. but they think in fact the american people will focus on the impact of the legislation, and there are so many positives from the president, the white house point of view they think that is why they've made the case today, to win any kind of -- >> you may be right and the taxes come first and benefits

custom later and they have front loaded the pain and back loaded the benefits. >> gregg: gentlemen, good discussion. juan williams, john fund, always good to see you. thanks so much. >> thank you, gregg. >> julie: one of the democrats' favorite arguments for passing the health care bill. you probably heard them say, insurance companies have a near monopoly and they are using it to gouge customers. gut but john stossel looked into it and found that is not necessarily the case. >> president barack obama: so many are so concentrated, not like you can go shopping. you are stuck. >> the concentration has gotten even more serious. >> my home state of alabama, blue cross/blue shield, has roughly 89% of the private health insurance market. okay? >> the president called that one and raised it. >> president barack obama: in alabama almost 90% is controlled by just one company. >> reporter: blue cross is the company. and, this does look like a near monopoly. but, the 89% claim is wrong. blue cross itself says the correct number is 75%.

and, that is only if you leave out employers that act as their own insurers an add those companies in and the alabama market looks like this. blue cross does have a third of the business, but it is hardly a monopoly. but the monopoly myth is everywhere. >> there's only two or one insurance company allowed to sell in most states, but in every state, there is some competition. if one -- we will not pay people, they'll lose their -- >> here's what happens, stossel like the oil cabal. >> there is no oil cabal. >> or insurance -- heck go on-line to ehealth insurance you see there are 72 nonblue cross health insurance plans offered in alabama. >> o'reilly is right, we'd have more choices, if we were allowed to buy insurance, from another state. >> my state, new york, forces me to pay more for my health insurance because my state's legislators have insisted every policy must cover chiropractic care, fertility treatments,

alcohol rehab, things that i don't want. but, too bad. i have to pay for them. i don't hear the president celebrating the improved competition we get by allowing people to buy from out of state. instead i hear, market bashing. >> president barack obama: somehow market forces will make things better. well, we have tried that. >> no, we haven't. it is time we did try it. but obama care goes in the other direction. to government price controls. on insurance companies. >> president barack obama: they will no longer be able to arbitrarily and massively hiker premiums... >> we've tried price controls before. >> i am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the united states... >> we will not let the oil companies profiteer. >> reporter: the result, lines around the block. give uncle sam the power to set insurance rates, and american health care will start to look like this: >> julie: john stossel reporting.

gregg. >> gregg: the debate over the gaunt detainees, whether to try them in civilian courtrooms or a military tribunal, are away closer to a decision? and what is the best way to bring the suspects to justice? find out next. from capital one, we get double miles with every purchase. so we earned a tropical vacation in half the time. we earn double miles every time we use our card. ( shouts ) double miles add up fast so we can bring the whole gang. ( grunting ) awesome! it's hard to beat double miles. everyone knows two is better than one. introducing the venture card from capital one... with double miles on every purchase every day. go to capitalone.com. ( gasps ) what's in your wallet? wait up!

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>> julie: over the past couple days we have been hearing reports of a new deal to shut gitmo down. it would reportedly pave the way for more detainees to be tried before military commission, but, the fox white house team has now learned that a deal is not near and lawmakers still must come up with a framework assigning detainees to military commissions. here to talk about it is charles cully stimson. you know, the president was very, very stern when he took office, and he wanted to close down gitmo, and, wanted to pass

health care reform, and i guess he is so busy trying to pass health care reform gitmo remains open and we are hearing a deal is not near, there are no negotiations with the senate yet on where to try khalid sheikh mohammed and the other 9/11 defendants, and the question is can closing gitmo be done safely before congress passes a law defining the rights an privileges of the detainees, once on u.s. soil? >> julie, julie, it can be done, bus i think there are certain prerequisites. and, although it has been health care all the time, behind the scenes they've done a lot of work to triage and figure out who can stay and who can go and who should be tried and who should be detained indefinitely and that is important work that has been done and unless this define the rights of the detainees and have congress pass a law, defining those rights and authorizing preventive attention i don't think you are in a position to close gitmo and the american people don't want gitmo closed and want ksm and his c

coconspirato coconspirators, to be tried unthis military tribunal, and making a deal is ill-advised. >> julie: and i understand they haven't talked with the white house for a couple of weeks and if the courts continue to define the rights as you talk about and as you said, the american people don't want the gitmo detainees here in the u.s., they want gitmo to stay where it is, and want gitmo to house these terrorists, but, do you run the risk of ultimately releasing the detainees inside the u.s., considering there is still no agreement on the table, as to how to deal with suspects, captured in the future, and where to put them? >> yes. the likelihood of them being released into the united states, goes up exponentially if you bring them to the u.s. because they are vested with the pull panoply of constitutional rights an judges will then, no doubt, if the rights aren't defined, find ways to to allow them to be

released and order them released into the u.s., and if they stay at guantanamo bay, the only constitutional rights they received so far is the constitutional right of habeas, i.e. the challenge -- to challenge their detention overall and those who were words ordered release, by the way, in guantanamo today are awaiting transfer to a third country and have not been brought to the u.s., and that is the difference. >> julie: the key difference, releasing them to yemen, for example so they can rejoin terror cells and rejoin al qaeda's fight against america? >> yes. fortunately at least temporarily, the obama administration suspended the transfer of those folks, back to yemen but, forget -- don't forget that the obama administration has approved over i think it is little over $100 million, in aid to yemen to fight terrorists, that is a good thing, but i suspect some of the money may be going towards a rehabilitation program, in yemen, which they have failed to set up, so far.

>> julie: if you closed gitmo would it pave the way for detainees to be tried, before military commissions, and if that were to happen, how difficult would it be to decide, then, who gets the civilian trial, and, who gets the military tribunal? >> i think it is important to keep in mind the following principle: there is no linkage, really, between closing or keeping gitmo open and military commissions, military commissions can commence now and implementing rules are almost ready and congress passed the law in 2009, upgrading the rules from the bush era. and, i think the general principle, one should follow in terms of trying folks, before military commissions is if you are a war criminal you go to war crimes trial and if you are a fraudster, a -- doing wire transfers -- >> pretty much every detainee should get a military tribunal, they are not robbing banks. all right. >> i disagree. many should be held preventively for a long time. >> julie: a have long time but

eventually have a got to be tried at some point, i mean, unless you just hold them -- >> they don't, they don't. >> julie: you don't take them into a court. >> no, they don't need to be tried. they can be held under the law of formed conflict for the duration of the hostilities and you don't have to try them. >> julie: thank you very much, we appreciate you coming on. >> thank you. >> gregg: the democrats say they have enough votes to pass there health care reform plan, lawmakers education questioned certain procedures and we'll look at possible legal challenges, next. my doctor said most calcium supplements... aren't absorbed properly unless taken with food. he recommended citracal. it's different -- it's calcium citrate, so it can be absorbed with or without food. also available in small, easy-to-swallow petites.

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>> gregg: a huge development, democrats dropping the plan to use the slaughter rule to pass health care and it is named after congresswoman louise slaughter the chair of the house rules committee, a prime mover behind the approach and it would have allowed house members to pass health care without a direct vote on the bill itself. why did they drop, suddenly the idea, was it because of the legal opinion of a promise inept constitutional scholar, the opinion published in the "wall street journal," joining us now, constitutional attorney, of the american center of law and justice and the name of the retired u.s. circuit court judge, is michael mcconnell.

stanford university. >> good friend of mine. >> gregg: and knows more about common law than anybody and here's what he wrote: the slaughter solution cannot be squared with article one, section 7 of the constitution in order for a bill to become law it shall have passed the house and senate and be presented to the president for signature or veto unless a bill has actually passed both houses. it cannot be presented to the president and cannot become law. in other words you cannot pass a bill and amend it simultaneously. was judge mcconnell correct, this was unconstitutional? >> yes, absolutely, gregg he was correct and is correct, article one, section 7 is clear, there has to be yea and nays on a bill and if there is no vote on the bill you don't get to pass it. it doesn't become law and cannot go to the president for signature and the reason the democrats today decided they are not going to do deem and pass, two reasons. number one the outcry of the american people, on this was huge and by the way, that

includes people even supportive of the health care plan, that didn't like the constitutional shen nanigans that were going t be developed and the lawsuits including one for the american center of law and justice on the legislation would have been filed the next day, which would have been monday. if they used deem and pass. so, the unconstitutionality and you are right, judge mcconnell is one of the best in the country and someone i have tremendous respect for as a former judge and supreme court advocate, he's brilliant, righted right on this and there are a lot of lawyers getting lawsuits ready this weekend. >> gregg: the slaughter rule would have allowed members of congress to pass a bill without actually voting on it. doesn't that totally defy the intent of the framers, which is to hold representatives accountable for their votes? >> yes. not the only framers, but it violates what the president of the u.s. said, president obama said he wanted transparency and how can you have transparency when the house doesn't vote on

the particular legislation, that played into the scenario that developed and that is why you saw today, the moving away from the deem and pass, now, it is quite clear, gregg they probably have the votes now, very, very close, probably 1 or 2.point margin but there will be constitutional challenges to the legislation, especially that mandate issue, which has a lot of us concerned on the legality and state attorney generals. >> gregg: we discussed that the last hour but is the mandate unconstitutional in your judgment? give me a yes or no. i'm out of time. >> absolutely, unconstitutional, lawsuits will be filed this week. if passed. >> julie: jay, constitutional scholar, great to see you, thank you. >> you, too. >> julie: jam-packed two hours, that will do it for us, by this time tomorrow, we could actually know if health care is a done deal. so, where do things stand right now? kelly wright and juliet huddy with continuing coverage, next and i'll see you in one hour, from out on the fox report, see you then.

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