how the nine months in your womb shapes the entire rest of your life. >> that was fun. good times, didn't have to go for food, didn't have to move for food. join us for the after the show, show. >> they're gone, but spending plans aren't. as lawmakers high tail it out of town. we're hearing that some are scheduled to gramming through bills, and said to cost $400 billion. but can our economy afford another massive spending list? hi everybody i'm liz claman in for brenda buttner. tobin smith, gary b smith, eric bolling and jonas max

ferris. in two weeks, forget if they pass it on time. can our economy afford it this time. >> lizzie, what part of we're broke does congress not understand? we're maxed out and by the way, spent half a trillion dollars in a lame duck session, you what that that is? that's nothing sort of a slap in the face to american taxpayer. why are you doing this? you're out of congress and some of you are leaving, you shouldn't even be voting on this money, it's our money. stop spending. >> 20 bills, gary b smith, can we pay for this? >> i think, first of all, yes, we can pay for it. but the real question, should we be doing this? you know, it's interesting just this past week i noticed harvard came out with a study where they've studied 200 instances, countries around the world of fiscal policy and without a doubt, the best way to stimulate growth was to cut spending and cut taxes. so, look, i'm willing to get on whatever side of the

equation is going to work, but it-- from harvard, not exactly a bastion of conservativism they've found that exactly the policies that the right wants to do. cut down on governments, cut taxes and we'll help stimulate the economy and this, this administration's going exactly the wrong way and going to increase our deficit. >> richard, what do you think? >> well, a lesson from 1937 is that exactly what gathry is saying what brought us not out of a depression, but back into an even worse one so i think the lesson in the u.s., no, actually we have a hole, the private sector is not filling and spending is the answer. that said, if you want it look at some of the bills you ticked off. arms control, not a spending bill. stopping epa in its tracks from issuing greenhouse gas regulations, that's not a spending bill and that's what the companies want. look, the one thing that actually is spending is providing relief for 250,000 low income people that haley

barber and conservatives active belief you want to keep those people connected with the work force. if you lose them you pay a price in the economy. >> tobin, how many conservatives are for this? >> wiell, this is like identity theft. takes your credit card and spends and you bet the bill later. he's right, it's not just spending per se, it's the idea. it's the ability to look people in the eye and say, you know, we are borrowing 200 billion dollars a month we don't have from mostly off shore people, but we're going to continue to do that because we know what's better and by the way, we're going to take, for instance. 330 billion dollar medicare, which is supposed to be a key part of obama care, we're going to throw that away because we really didn't mean it. >> i think, i think i heard that tobin just do an irish

brogue. can we afford this? should we do that kind of spending? >> wiell, we can afford a lot of things if we cut other things. let's hear it, spending money and take it out of a program-- >> and there are a lot of bills that won't cost anything. the dream act. what is the cost of that, the food safety thing, don't ask, don't tell repeal, is that going to cost anything to taxpayers? i don't think so. it boils down to medicare reimbursing doctors and these tax cuts. that's really the action that's going on now and by the way, if they're going to do this massive tax hike schedule and part of a massive thing or all of it, that doesn't hurt-- that doesn't benefit taxpayers anymore than spng the money and borrowing from china. we're spending more than we're taking in. >> part of the-- part of the aggravating part of this it's done in the lame duck session, meaning, it didn't half before where they could be held accountable in

november for some of the bills they pass. >> the president will in two years. >> if i'm against it and you're for it, i'm going to run against you, guess what, guys, and tell every taxpayer, this guy or this guy here is spending your money. >> well, what happens is that everybody says we want to bring down the deficit just dent cut my medicare, don't cut things that matter to my community. how can we straddle this lien and make it happen? >> well, look, the big news in the lame duck, none of the issues we've talked about. it's the report of the commission that comes in. and we know everybody on this panel, as you know, there are two solutions to dealing with the debt, mainly entitlement reform. we're not going to do na the lame buck. the spending bills that's not going to happen. part of the reason eric said, people are going to come back after the voters pass judgment and do the opposite what the voters said. i agree with that, that's exactly why your viewers should rest assured the bills are not going to pass, but the

debt commission is the recommendations and probably tax reform as well. >> maybe it's not going to act because i guess there's a thing, called the senate and they don't quite move as fast and until it's done. but that's not the point. the point is the audacity. you know, we have the audacity of hope and now we have the audacity of scope and the idea they're going to add this, on to the credit card bill after the credit cards are maxed out they're going to get another one and our name is on it. >> gary b. some of the programs such as what john kerry wants to do and for sort of an arms control treaty with russia, are some of these things valid? >> well, some are, yeah, some are valid, some sound good. i'll give you one that sounds good, but kind of silly, it's the extending the unemployment benefits. that's going to cost about 33 billion dollars. well, you know, they've already done studies on what effect it's going to generate and on the dollar benefits. my gosh, almost any other program is going to be better than that and plus, paul krugman himself said by extending unemployment

benefits what do you get? you're basically going to get more unemployment. >> well, what happens, guys. >> and basically going back to work. >> what happens if let's say ten of them pass. does this put the economy into a spiral? jonas. >> really, the medicare doctor reimbursement and tax things, most people will vote they want the tax next year and medicare doctor reimbursement so they don't wait for the doctor. >> and most people want them to actually deal with, the most important every human being in the united states, keeping the tax rates where they are. they decided to-- >> that costs money. >> they won't admit that they need to cut stuff. people won't vote for the government to go into a hole every election and we've been going to for years. they like it in the ab tract, but not when it gets to-- >> sure, the abstract. i want to go of up scotch and that's not going to happen and we are going to have a lame

duck, spend time and energy and money and not going to work and not going to pass. >> richard, ten seconds. >> the prediction, congress is going to get back and democrats are going to say you want to balance the budget, you want to lower taxes, republicans, guess what, republicans knock yourself output two and two together and get the number you're coming up with, it's not four if you go in both directions which are inconsistently with each other. >> eric. >> i think you're out of your mind. pick the one that matters the most. forget the taxes you'll get neither of these and taxes going up. the opposite. >> that's the last word on that. coming up on neil's show, jack welch says the president is no friend to america's job creators. >> his corporate balance sheet is tough on business. business should be celebrated for its growth and its jobs. >> and that's before he's really got mad. it's the full jack at the bottom of the hour and you do not want to miss it, but

first, how some say wal-mart may have just made the best case to repeal the health care law. hey, lawrence, my parents want to talk to you. oh. about what? uh, they don't really think you're an exchange student. what? they think you're a businessman, using our house to meet new clients in china. for reals, player? [ woman saks chinese ] they overheard a phone call. speaks chinese ] something about shipping with fedex to shanghai. and then you opened a bottle of champagne. that was for a science project. [ man and woman speaking chinese ] i'm late for..occer... rehearsal. [ man speaks chinese ] you and i are cool? i'll be home by curfew. [ male announcer ] we understand.® you need a partner who can help you go global. fedex.

. >> bret: to america's news headquarters. i'm juliet huddy. a new report released from osama bin laden the second in as many days. in it the terrorist leader

takes aim at the government and media. and flood ravaged pakistan and accusing the media not reporting on the tragedy effectively and some sources tell fox news bin laden was directly involved in a terror plot just uncovered in europe. drying out and finally the storm that hammered the east coast for days now into canada, but the threat is not over. flood warnings remain in effect for portions of the mid atlantic and also new england. the storm system is being blamed for six deaths. meanwhile, the new storm is expected to dump rain on western new york and i'm jewel huddy, log on to foxnews.com. >> another wow from wal-mart. the retailer teaming up with humana to offer prescription drugs to seniors as low as $2. and wal-mart proved we don't need the nearly 1 trillion

dollar health care law, why. >> here is why. you'll see all along, a lot of the segment of the economy has been saying, look, let the competitive market work. it works for fast food, for crying out loud. it can work in health care and here you see, look, why is wal-mart doing this? they're not doing this just because they're nice, you know, they want to be good citizens, they're doing this because they want to bring those seniors into the store. this medication, which most seniors need with some way, shape or form is a loss leader and they want to come in and buy the grape fruits and the cereals and all of that other jazz in the supermarket and general merchandise. this is terrific. they're using their clout to cut down prices and everyone benefits. this is the way the health care industry can be modified not through obama care. >> jonas max ferris. >> i like that mcdonald's. people do don't roll into mcdonald's and eat $25,000 in one month as often happens with health care, with the

elderly. this plan, $14 a month. why do you think you can offer any kind of any plan in health care for $14 a month. because the government, paying them to do it. it exists because of the medicare and drug part d plan was passed, extension passed a few years ago under the bush administration and the new drug plan gets rid of the donut hole at great cost taxpayers which makes it less costly to the consumer, the person with the health care and lets wal-mart offer $14 health care plans. wal-mart would offer a health care plan if there was no medicare. it would cost about $1,000 a week to have health insurance without government backing thee consume a lot of health care, these people. >> jonas is saying because of the government's involvement that wal-mart is able to do this. >> he's dead wrong. three reasons. if you look at the government as an entity they've said by 2014 they want to go out and try to cut some of the fraud costs they could do it today.

there are private companies, public companies that are going after fraud, cut 2 or 3 billion dollars, but the government doesn't think it's a good idea. if you look at wal-mart and you look at their health care centers, their health care centers, if they were allowed to be primary care delivery agencies to medicare and medicaid the other big spender, that all of the studies show they would cut the costs 45%. that has nothing do do with the government, jonas, it has to do with health care. >> $14 a month. wal-mart is not paying for the health, the drugs the old people are consuming. >> these are. >> and the government and health care for old people would cost a fortune? >> richard. jump into the conversation. i'm happy to.

>> there's a question whether wal-mart can do it because of the government or health care is basically going to move to the side here. >> gary b's point was we didn't need the government because private sector would come together with wal-mart. and let me kick off the things done in the health care bill that the private sector is not doing. providing care, conspire tiff, ap what they're doing actually works and providing-- seeing that people don't get kicked off health care plans when they hit the maximum. one second, make sure the preexisting conditions are not a grounds to disable somebody from getting health care and guess what, that provides mobility in the work force, so people aren't stuck in a job they don't want to be in because they can't go to another one and adds efficiency to the economy. i don't see the private sector saying that and young adults staying on their parent's plans and the fact, going to the donut hole. there's 110 billion dollars in small business. >> go ahead. >> well, richard, two things that you left off that, the big one being bending cost

curve down laboring like they promised and turns out the cost curve is actually being bent up. so, wal-mart comes in, under j cuts it and maybe wal-mart will do what the government wouldn't do and reference to children staying on parents's policies, they have to now because health providers aren't insuring children with pre-existing conditions on their own. they're requiring that-- for you to buy as part of a family plan. so two things that they've promised aren't happening and maybe wal-mart will help bends it in the other direction. >> richard. >> i think it's fabulous wal-mart can bring down the cost. as jonas said they're not doing it to al true is particular. every time we've had had a health care bill going back to medicare and since the cost has been less. >> specifically the bush plan, they estimated that would be

100 billion dollar a year this drug plan which this works off of it's actually coming in now about 60 billion a year to taxpayers which is a lot better than it was supposed to be so hopefully you'll see that kind of-- >> wow. liz, chase conclusive evidence. >> the good news is, wal-mart works in volume and they're going to do volume and we'll be watching the story, thanks, guys. more teachers unions are yelling and more taxpayers are cheering as more states take on teacher tenure just like new jersey's governor is doing. . >> i do not bash teachers. i bash their stubborn, self-interested unions. that's who i bash.

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with pringles cracker stix. ♪ crackers turned into tasty, crunchy sticks! ♪ pringles cracker stix. ♪ so delicious... your mouth will be strangely attracted to them. ♪ everything pops with pringles cracker stix. >> call it a ten year take down based on performance, unions are pulling out the stops to stop it. plus, the tarp expiring an

>> effective teachers, super teachers. master teachers. and we'll take that to make it worth their while. >> new jersey's governor chris christie started it and more states demanding it, by teachers by performance and give tenure, you'll save taxpayers money and improve education. every step of the way. toby who has it might. >> the unions are wrong. we have a teacher who was an exotic dancer, shall we say, for a number of year and all of a sudden she gets tenure and want it fire her for that and performance issues, they can't fire her. tenure maybe works in a college university, private school and firing being crazy,

but we're talking about grade school and high school year. tenure-- >> could be a good teacher. >> high school and grade school is about preparing for the future and this idea-- we know pay for performance worked in almost every test case, there's one test case it hasn't, quote, unquote work, that's from the unions all day long. >> irk a do we jetson the concept? >> bingo, we should wage war on tenure and what tenure is it, it's a gift from the teacher's union, back to the members, but what you are really doing, is pricing teachers out of the job market. it's been costing municipalities more and costing teachers jobs and really, go to some of the municipalities that fire teachers and say, hey, do you realize what's going to happen and they say, whoa, i didn't realize that and i would definitely, definitely not taking the tenure or not the higher wage and the union-- richard, shouldn't we reward good teachers and jetsonning the ones that aren't, that

cannot perform for our children? >> absolutely. and look, i have to say that, president obama, a place that he's picked with the teacher's union, he's been a stand-up guy for pay for performance and they're not happy about it and he has stood up a hundred of these charter schools around the country and they're hearing smart young teachers and my fellow is assuma cum laude and enjoying it and not paying for it, but pay for performance is definitely the way to go and we see the evidence in d.c. where politically when teachers had a choice of going to tenure route for possibly higher pay than pay for performance, and they threw a fit and they didn't want that choice and they knew which way it was going to go. i think that pay for performance is the way to go. >> gary. >> well, if only obama had sent his kids to public school, instead, maybe he could speak with more authority. but you know, liz, we have some of the greatest companies in the world here, some of the

most innovative, sisco, microsoft, google, and they all pay for performance. we can do the same in education, unions have it right for unions, they want to get their teachers paid the most and not ever get fired. that's great, but that's not t the-- shouldn't be for public education. >> by the way, most presidents send their kids to private school. >> jimmy carter didn't. >> well, alt politicians that are-- now, will the me just say, low brow. >> really? >> what most those companies have in common, they keep hiring people to work from them from other countries where they're educated properly and we read the study for students in japanese run circles around students in-- and point is that a union doesn't make your students stupid. we have a lot of problems here, the unions are a very small piece of it.

you're not magically going to have smart kids if you scrap the unions. >> one small piece. thanks, guys, and thanks to richard for joining us, thanks, richard. the same thing that has these folks so mad could high pressure you make bad profi-- mad profits in the stock market. find out how next. for over eight years, helpi them build a strong dealer network. bringing music to people... i like that. ♪ ♪ [ bob ] i didn't know you could play. i didn't either. ♪

>> predictions, gary b. what's the prediction. >> as you know, alberto, tour de france winner tested

positive for banned substance, but here is what you need to know. spain is behind him. i'm behind spain. dwp is the etf. ng up 10% in the last quarter. >> a long way to get to that, what do you think. >> should be a banned substance. >> jonas doesn't like it. >> toby your prediction. >> and don't work, the company is taking over the robbo signed mortgages and thing the stock is up 40% by april. gary b. do you agree? ? [laughter] he doesn't like it. jonas,your prediction. >> the what are they going to do. the constellation brands benefit from the weird weather pattern making california 2010 delicious. >> wrong, too much wine and even i know that. >> you're saying that, i can't believe said that. gary your prediction. >> ecuador rising from the street and any contact that goes on oil prices will go up.