welcome to this special edition of "hannity." we have heard about how the american people do not want the u.s. intervening in syria. tonight for the full hour we are giving the show to you, the mesh, to hear what the average citizen has to say. frank luntz has a focus group to discuss syria and more. let's go to the group and frank in washington, d.c. >> i have been doing testing on world leaders for two decades. i don't think i have ever had a score as bad as this. let's take a look. >> we are not sure chemical weapons, even though you have seen the videotape, the bodies, your own officials have been there. >> i haven't finished. our soldiers in another area

were attacked chemically. our soldiers. they went to the hospital as casualties because of chemical weapons. in the area where they say the government used chemical weapons we have video, pictures and allegations. our forces, our police, our institutions don't exist. how can you talk about what happened if you don't have evidence? >> do any of you trust him? >> no. >> no. >> what should we do with him? >> treat him like the dictator he is. marginalize him and get him out. >> do you want to kill him? >> no. >> raise your hand if you want to kill him. sir, you want him executed? >> yeah. >> why. >> he killed a hundred thousand. >> why is it the u.s.'s decision? >> we're doing it now. obama has a hit list. >> who is re placing him?

seriously. who takes his place? it could be worse. >> we are a constitutional republic, not a constitutional democracy. assad isn't part of the constitutional republic. he doesn't matter. he still controls a sovereign country. we don't have the right to go in and alter the sovereign country. >> do you agree? >> yes. >> we can't trust him. >> go ahead. >> if he's using chemicals of mass destruction against his own people i suspect he's a bit crazy. we can't just go annihilate a dictator. there has to be a diplomatic approach to it prior to -- diplomatic, yes, and treating him with dignity and respect. we are never going to get anywhere i if we strong arm every dictator. >> i don't think we have an opportunity for diplomacy in this area of the country with these people. >> the problem is that how do

you treat somebody with respect when they lie to your face? he sat there, talked to the reporter and said, i can't confirm that we have weapons and, oh, just a couple days ago he said, i'll give them all up. >> i don't understand. if people think he's crazy and a dictator, why don't we bomb him? why does everybody disagree with using force? >> we have to worry about the splinter in our eye before the plank in someone else's eye. >> what does that mean? i don't understand. >> we have so many issues right now in this country. we are talking about taking vengeance. that's not a deal with the military. >> it's not about vengeance. >> it is a moral obligation -- >> chemical weapons. >> it is a moral obligation when people are alive uh after the fact -- >> this is an extreme line on the world stage. >> there is no evidence. he didn't give conclusive evidence. he did not. >> there's never been leadership here. if he started off we would have understood it.

if he went in and did what he was supposed to do the or didn't his leadership would have helped a lot. no. he needed just to make a commitment. he needed not to waffle back and forth and back and forth. >> to do? >> whatever he wants to do. demand what he wanted and coit. that's what bush did. >> the problem with syria is the problem in the rest of the middle east. there are no better options. they are not better off in iraq. we destabilized it and made iran the power. afghanistan might be better off. >> therefore -- >> let sleeping dogs lie. stay out of it. we don't have a better result uh. >> it's a revolution. we have to let it play out. >> we should not be involved at all? >> don't interfere with the revolution. but you have to take the chemical weapons off the table for assad. >> how do you do that if you don't get tough with him? >> they say we need an agreement we can verify president obama

said it. >> if he is using chemical weapons, we play on a world stage. the united states is part of a big global conglomerate. we are not alone. we have to act. le. >> killing your own people and gassing them is a war crime. if we believe that, let's build a real coalition of international partners, go in and overthrow him. >> i feel we are the lone ranger. out here all by ourselves. there is nobody else coming to aid and assist us. >> can i ask you a direct question ? >> sure. >> that's one reason people voted for barack obama in 2008 is that he would improve america's standing across the globe. what does it say that this president who was elected to re-establish relations has no global support. >> he's being punked on the world stage right now. >> punked?

>> that's the same thing i said. >> you said global support before. >> now people are tired of crying wolf. at this point we are very war-weary, but something needs to be done. >> that's the point. we are trying to figure out -- you watched how assad responded. we need to wrap up. >> we know he's working with iran, destabilizing, trying to destabilize iraq. somebody said we don't know if we'll get a democracy if he goes. we don't. but if he stays we'll have a dictatorship. he'll work in the middle east to destabilize. >> who agrees with that? who disagrees with that? even on something so clearcut, with still don't have consensus. as the debate goes on i don't think we'll ever have a consensus. the president has to act.

congress has to decide whether or not to support. let's hope something happens. >> thanks, frank. coming up, the group tackles congress's role in this and how they think our commander in chief is doing in the role. check out hannitylive.foxnews.com and we'll continue. with angie's list,ly re-done the house. i was able to turn my home into the home of my dreams. for over 18 years we've helped people take care of the things that matter most. join today, at angieslist.com

welcome back to this special edition of "hannity." >> the question for the american people is not what is the role of the president but what should congress do? the president spoke. let's look at how our group responded with the dial. >> though i possess the authority to order military straks, i uh i believed it was right in the absence of a direct or imminent threat to our security to take this to congress. i believe we are stronger when the president acts with the support of congress.

i believe america acts effectively abroad when we stand together. this is especially true after a decade that put more and more war-making power in the hands of the president and more burdens on the shoulders of troops while sidelining the people's representatives from the critical decisions about when we use force. >> tell me, what is the role of congress? what should they do? >> evaluate what the president wants to do, ask questions, have hearings and make a vote on the resolution. >> they don't have to support him? >> no. they don't have to support him. i think they should. we need to show a unified front to the worldwide community. >> i vote for my congressional representatives not so they will vote exactly how i want them to all the time but because they will make the best informed decision. i don't have all the information they do. >> for once i'm glad to see congress having a debate that doesn't fall on party lines. i i think it is refreshing if they don't wake up and do what

the leadership says. >> it's refreshing that everybody is voting no. >> he was being interviewed on the radio and he said my constituents all believe we shouldn't go into bombing. he said, being said, i will vote for it. that's ridiculous. >> we have congress to listen to the people. we have the senate to listen to the president. congress is supposed to listen to the people. let them listen to the people. let us give them advice. if they don't, vote their ass out. >> it's exciting what's going on. we are getting information from all different sources that you have liberals agreeing with super conservatives. you have all the tea parties working with the aclu. what's going on now because we are getting more information from various sources, not just listening to the one official line. to me that's what's exciting because all different types -- independents, you know, republicans, democrats -- are actually agreeing. >> help me here.

>> not going into syria. >> you have john boehner and nancy pelosi on the same side. >> scary. >> last time that happened was never. seems you have a majority of both political parties on the other side. >> yes. >> what's going on? >> i think there is more robust discussion amongst the people. it's less robust in congress because they are mostly still driven by party or driven by key constituents who don't represent most voters. >> they are professional politicians. >> until that changes the vote in congress will be -- same thing. >> i don't think there will be a vote. >> why didn't they say this is so important, obama thinks this is crazy important why didn't they come back? >> they really didn't want to have to vote on it. >> exactly. >> they don't want to go on record on what they do or don't want to do on the issue.

>> re-election. >> isn't that their job? >> they don't want to lead. >> in this case congress, to me is less trustworthy because there is so much politicking involved. the president, you know, in a sense this is his last term. he's a little bit of a lame duck. i trust his decision-making more. >> i want a vote from all of you. who do you trust more -- congress, the president, trust them both or trust none of them? who trusts the president more than congress? who trusts congress more than the president? not many. who trusts both of them? >> neither. >> two of you. who trusts neither? >> neither. >> okay. we have a problem. we have a crisis in confidence. and the american people have spoken. >> more with frank and the group after the break.

how do they think president obama is doing as commander in chief? the answer may surprise you. so, i'm working on a cistern intake valve, and the guy hands me a locknut wrench. no way! i'm like, what is this, a drainpipe slipknot? wherever your business takes you, you can save money with progressive commercial auto. [ sighs ] [ flo speaking japanese ] [ shouting in japanese ] we work wherever you work. now, that's progressive. call or click today.

welcome back to this special edition of "hannity." the crisis in syria and what to

do there could be the most important moment of president obama's second term. how is he handling it? let's see what frank luntz's focus group thinks about the commander in chief. >> the president's speech continues to elicit divide across america. we saw the division right here with our voters. let's look at how they dialled that clip. >> this is not a world we should accept. this is what's at stake. that is why after careful deliberation i determined that it is in the national security interests of the united states to respond to the assad regime's use of chemical weapons through a targeted military strike. the purpose of this strike would be to deter assad from using chemical weapons, to degrade his regime's ability to use them and make clear to the world that we will not tolerate their use. that's my judgment as commander in chief. >> he was very clear about his

role as commander in chief. tell me as an average american, and you voted for him, how would you describe in a word or phrase barack obama as commander in chief? >> right now, weak. >> indecisive. >> i would say he's effective. >> embarrassing. >> average. >> middle of the road to average to better. >> he's dmon stated re strant and leadership. >> no leadership. vacillating and weak. >> i will start with your reaction. that's pretty positive compared to how the rest of the group responded. >> he's demonstrated restraint over the past couple of years and leadership. he's engaging congress. i think he's done a terrific job under the circumstances. >> your reaction? >> embarrassing. >> why? >> there was a time when america was the leader of the world. when our president spoke he had people behind him to follow.

>> there is the issue. exercising restraint is fine but a year ago he talked about a red line. now the time has come to act and he's not acting. >> it was clear when he put the line down he never put a plan in place. when it was crossed he's scrambling. that is not a commander in chief. that's not a forward thinker. >> go ahead. >> one problem is the president governs by committee instead of making decisions. >> he's being sensitive to the american people. he was clear he wanted to use air strikes. i was convinced for a while during the speech that's what we were going to do. >> first of all, it's ironic he got the nobel peace prize and now he's talking about bombing people. the second thing is there is a red line. he said if it's crossed and the it was crossed two or three times now and he does nothing until the third time and pushes it on congress. it's embarrassing. indecisive. >> it does take strength.

it's hard for the population to recognize that. more importantly there have been many times in the history of this country where there's been civil uh war between countries and we have rushed in and not understood all the issues at stake. all of the things people are saying he's vacillating, he was trying to understand the situation. now he's determined to deal with human rights issues. >> i'm going to address your point. you said he was so strong on strike then why didn't he strike? you know, it made him look weak. >> he told us syrians shot off six rockets. then there is evidence that chemical weapons were dispersed. what is to tell us if he strikes chemicals aren't going to be dispersed from our strikes? >> it was clear he wanted to garner support. >> clear? when has he been clear. >> he doesn't need congress's permission to go in. >> just because he tells us he'll be clear doesn't make him clear. >> i i feel like congress stomped their feet like

children. >> there you go with congress again. you said you don't want to be political. everything you say is political. >> he threw them a bone. he didn't have to. >> now he wants to throw them a tomahawk. it's ridiculous. >> he's trying to get -- he did say -- the support of congress makes it for a more unified front. >> he went for that support when he attacked libya, too. >> now the liberals are being like war hawks and the conservatives don't want to go in. >> i don't understand why left of center is calling for military action and right of center says we are not the world's police. >> i i feel like the drugs i took in college just kicked in. >> as a registered independent it's exciting for me. i love what i'm watching. the element of surprise is over. >> as commander in chief i think we got what we elected -- somebody who is eyde ldoesn't h

leadership. >> we can't fault him for going to congress, asking for support. it sets a good stage for his predecessor, a good stage to have the president and congress work hand in hand. >> why is this the one time he wants to walk to congress? let me give you an example. congress turns down clear air act. he does it by executive order. that's the will of the people? >> you're right. >> he did it anyway. >> like it or not, we are the world's policemen. he's the leader of the world's policemen country and he vacillates on everything. he's no leader. he needs to get out front. >> if he believes he had the power to do it he should have done it. if he believes congress does have -- he shouldn't have said anything and then went to congress. >> you say he should have ignored congress? >> if he believes, and some do, that he has the right to bomb another country without the approval of congress he probably

should have done it rather than make the comment first and then going back. >> he doesn't want to take responsibility. >> that's leadership. >> i want a collective opinion. i want everybody's feedback in this decision that involves lives that we are going to put on the line for this country. >> and our lives. >> the president didn't vacillate with osama bin laden. he was criticized for threatening to go after obama in pakistan which demonstrated a lot. >> you voted for obama. you have been one of the most critical people of him. >> i am critical. i am disappointed. however, i see he's in a tough spot. he's trying to make it work. obviously we are not all going to hug it out. but some of the processes and the steps in order to get advisers, people that are going to be on the committee to voice and share their opinions, share data and whatever. >> quit playing word games.

>> i hear you. it's frustrating. >> we are playing word games now. the president wants limited air strikes. what he wants is permission to do an act of war. we need to stop kidding ourselves. syria has treaties with other countries. they are the ones we should be thinking about now. >> i want the american people to know this is reflective of the country. 15 of you voted for barack obama. 11 of you voted for mitt romney. the numbers here, the people opposed to it oh are similar to the numbers in the polling data almost every day and the division that you all reflect in this room are the divisions we see in america. every day. >> plenty more coming up tonight. frank and the focus group will be back. don't forget, we want to hear from you. log onto hannitylive.foxnews.com. follow theive show, share your thoughts.

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now back to "hannity". welcome back to this special edition of "hannity." the president's handling of the situation in syria has been described as confused and even embarrassing, leave b many to wonder whether or not america is on the decline internationally. here to answer the question and more, frank luntz and his bipartisan focus group. >> the american people are divided. the question is where do we go from here? the best way to look for it is i want a show of hands. is america going to be more safe or less safe over the next ten years than it is today? who thinks america will be more safe? raise your hands. six of you. why are you optimistic? >> i'm so optimistic because of the fact that i know we are a super power. >> are we? >> i really do. i think we don't manage our

power in a manner that will allow us to remain a super power. >> why are you optimistic? >> i think people, particularly in my demographic and age range are becoming more involved. >> how old are you? >> 28. i think we are paying more attention and being more informed voters. the more we educate ourselves the better people we put in office and the better national security will be. >> i i think the american people are more together than they have been. the aclu is working with the tea party and the liberals are not wanting to go to war. a lot of different groups are coming together. we are more informed and waking up to what's going on with the leadership. we need better leaders on both sides of the aisle. >> the country lacks leadership now. the president will leave in three years. i think the country will turn a corner and elect a leader. >> i'm sorry. you keep saying he lacks leadership. a leader reflects on what happened in the past, analyzes and makes the best decision.

he's looked at the country not wanting to go go to war. he knows we have had two wars. the country was taken in by false information. he 's reflected and said, okay, i have to balance these issues. >> so we have learned from the past, from the mistakes. >> this president has. >> he leads from behind. when he wants to defer to the united nations, that's not leadership. >> we have not learned because as long as conservatives turn a blind eye when their own party is not fiscally conservative, when their president says he's not going to engage in the nation building and does it twice. when he says he'll be a compassionate conservative and they didn't demonstrate that we haven't learned anything just as liberals on the let's go fight bandwagon because their guy is suggesting it more than a super strong conviction to do something about the helpless people in syria. >> if we continue down this path that we are a constitutional democracy when it's not what we

were yesterday according to what i believe. we are in serious trouble if the congress doesn't get back the constitutional authority they have suggested to the executive branch. we are in trouble. >> michael, congress has an 11% job approval rating. gadhafi had a 15% job approval rating. >> they will start taking back their constitutional authority and start representing the people i believe the approval rating will go up. >> we need a strong congress. that's how our system was des n designed. we need checks and balances. everybody who talks about the lack of leadership, stands out front is not a leader. everybody who leads you over the cliff i doesn't lead you where you want to go. we live in a complex world. someone who takes time to understand the myriad of oh oh complex issues that we never know we are getting into isn't something to be looked at as not a leader. >> she was talking about it was a good thing for president obama to step back and measure it. why wasn't the first thing he

did diplomatic. if that doesn't work then go to war and take it to congress and if congress won't act he acts. he's done it backwards. claiming he'll strike, then let's go to congress and then, oh, wait, let's be diplomatic. >> i have been thinking about it in this discussion. when he talked about drawing a clear red line is that a mistake? >> yes. >> sure. >> if you don't follow it. >> the mistake was -- he made a mistake acknowledged by his staff but he didn't choose to back away from it. he stuck to it and ramped it up. >> if he hadn't made the statement we wouldn't be talking about going to syria. i believe he made a mistake, went off the rails. he said i draw a red line when asked by the reporter and he couldn't backtrack from it. >> how many of you believe because he was trying to protect his own credibility we are in the situation we are in now. half of you. more than half. are you saying he would risk

bombing a country to protect himself? >> yes. >> happens all the time in history. all the time. >> i say yes because he's a politician like most of the politicians. only reason boehner came on board is he got an invitation to give approval for the war from the president. that's what this is about. >> do you understand how radical this sounds? >> yes. >> the more they talk about it the more divisive it becomes and the more we learn about what americans really think about what this president, this country, and their future. >> coming up next it is something many of us where are asked. do you feel safer today than ten years ago? frank will pose that question after the break. stay with us. the humble back seat.

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welcome back to this special edition of "hannity" featuring a special focus group of bipartisan american. time to go to d.c. and check in with frank luntz with a very important question for the voters. >> in conversations about budgets and very often national security is not discussed. we have been asking americans

like you do you feel safer or less safe now than you did ten years ago? why don't you answer that for me as a way to begin the conversation. how many of you feel safer today than you did ten years ago? raise your hands. maybe eight of you. who feels less safe? tell me why. >> leadership. who's in charge, whether it is republican or democrats, they are hard to trust. even the question of enough spend ing. it's hard to trust that they will spend it properly. i don't know. spend more, spend less, i don't trust people in charge. >> safer or less safe? >> less safe. >> why? >> similar reasons. i don't believe they have kept their eye on what the strategic interests of the country are, what's important. the countries that are threats to us today. it hasn't gotten less. the respect of countries around us that are allies and our enemies has reduced. our allies cannot depend upon us and our enemies aren't afraid of

us. >> do you agree ? >> they are chopping the budget. we can't do as much, protect ourselves. they are eviscerating the military. >> we are living in a different time. the enemy is gaining a huge technological advancement -- >> who is the enemy? >> our enemies. >> who? >> the terrorists. >> that's a general thing. >> i'm specifically talking about the islamic regime. >> it's hard to know who the enemy is. >> yes. a lot of it is that's where the -- that's where it's coming from. >> in syria, if we support the rebels we are supporting al qaeda. what part of the rebels are against the syrian government? it's hard to know. >> it's difficult to know who the enemy is. i don't feel less safe than before is less was discussed.

less was talked about. this issue of terrorism has been with us even bf the '70s. i don't think the situation changed much. our spending in military is so much more h than anywhere else in the world. i'm not threatened. >> i think the real issue is with our elected officials it's not only trust but their own special interests. they can't make rational decisions. they don't make realistic decisions. it's not just based on the budget but what is best for the country. >> who is "they"? >> members of congress. >> do you blame congress? >> i do. >> the president is the commander in chief. >> the president is the commander in chief. >> why blame congress? >> i didn't vote for him. so i should put him in that as well. i look more specifically at the elected officials. they have the power to make decisions that impact upon us. they are not doing it. >> go ahead. >> somebody said before our enemies are the terrorists.

we need more high tech stuff to monitor them. it's a different type of war. every time we have a budget they have a peace dividend. they cut the military. they never raise it up. >> you are nervous they're not spending enough? >> i believe they have to spend more money on the military. >> it's not the idea of how much they are spending. it's how they are proep raappro the funsd and where it is going. >> do you agree? >> yes. >> is this government investing in sufficient technology? you are saying no. >> you need to put 5,000 rather than 35,000? >> we are still using word war 2 the era mentality where we put ourselves. we are not taking advantage of -- >> jason, go ahead. >> the technology is the lie.

it doesn't protect you. it's man power and money being spent at the department of defense going to weapons like the v-22 osprey and other crafts they have checks to support. >> they are using technology against us. nsa, there was no denial about what snowden said. they are using it against americans. >> in the back. >> i don't think the politicians know what to do. we have been more po lit sized since 9/11. >> go ahead. >> they don't know what to do. they are fighting against each other rather than pulling together as americans. >> is congress making the right investments. >> no. >> to provide you -- why not? >> they don't know how to make rational decisions. they don't. >> professional politicians. >> no. they don't know how to make rational decisions. we have money, a budget. why are we in a deficit? i don't understand. >> where people are supporting the politicians, instead of

spebding money where it can be effective. >> i'm so tired of following -- walking backwards trying to follow this president. i can only imagine how the military must feel. there is a reason why leaders lead from the front. it's so we all know where we are going. if we don't know, how will we get there? >> i hope the people in washington are listening. we can't afford to make mistakes f. something goes wrong with national security it is not a republican or democratic tragedy. it is an american tragedy. this debate over national security will be waged in the months to follow. let us hope they have the common sense of good americans. >> when we come back, the group turns its attention to another critical and controversial national security issue -- that being immigration reform as "hannity" continues. weigh you down?

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one issue that has not

gotten a lot of media attention is immigration. just because the debate isn't in the headlines doesn't means the going away. we check in with frank luntz and the focus group of american voters. >> there isn't a more contentious debate in america than immigration. the battle between those who want small re forms, those who want a significant overhaul and some who don't want change at all. it is a tough conversation. people's tempers are flaring. i want to begin with an ad. i want you to dial test it. react second to second. i will ask you whether this ad truly connects to you in the discussion about immigration. let's look. >> a porous border threatening our security while millions live in de facto amnesty because washington does nothing. our borders and workers aren't protected and america is losing the global race for talent. our immigration system is broken and doing nothing isn't working.

congress must act now. to build an immigration system that benefits america because if they won't act, guess who is the only one who gets to decide? >> raise your hand if you thought it was effective. most of you. most people don't agree on anything. why was that ad effective? >> because it didn't point fingers at anyone. it wasn't partisan. it was a general concept of we have a problem that we need to deal with. as a country we need to come together, look at leaders in congress to solve this problem. >> what's wrong with pointing fingers, holding people accountable? >> when you do that people get into a defensive measure and think, it's not my fault and want to fight, fight, fight. it's an easier way to present a problem. >> go ahead. >> we should point fingers. there is a problem that needs to be fixed. >> i think we are past pointing fingers. we should be looking for solutions.

>> that's why the ad was effective. it went to that very issue. it said we are trying to fix the issue, not trying to put blame. everybody knows the situation. it's not a surprise. >> we point fingers on everything and not get anywhere. >> they are using the word illegal like a cuss word. it's got to stop. >> i think we need to use the word illegal. >> i agree. >> these people are illegal. >> i believe they are illegal. but they are saying you shouldn't use it. >> we are not going to solve this by soft stepping the issue. these people need to get to the back of the line, speak english and do what's necessary. >> personal opinion, they don't need to get online at all. you can't ask 12 to 20 million people to leave. give them some kind of legal status. citizenship? never. >> there is a law on the books that the employers have to check. if you've got -- if you arrest an employer hiring illegals you have an answer. >> it's two issues. unuh till we fix the first issue

of securing the border there is no sense in going to the second issue. we keep forgetting. >> it's not securing. most illegal immigrants overstay visas and we never track them down or arrest them and say come back to court in six months. they don't show up and nobody goes after them. if you don't have an enforcement regime there is no deterrent. >> they are here because they got through the border. >> they came here legally and overstayed. what about those people. >> about the word illegal, you can't go to any other country and stay there and you don't have citizenship status. that's one reason why we are over budget. we have a lot of problems. these people do not bring economic incentury tif or whatever. take care of oh americans. americans need jobs. >> so are you going to deport them? >> they should be. i'm telling you. >> you're going to deport them? >> yes. >> does this woman sound compassionate to you? >> no.

>> why are you angry? >> it's not angry. it's a sense of using common sense. i i go across the country and i'm sick and tired of americans talking about taking care of everybody else but americans. we pay the taxes. >> do you agree? >> no, no. we pay the tax bill but get very little benefit. >> it's back to leadership. >> right. >> these people are trying to survive. it's the leadership that did the policy that allowed them in. many of oh them are trying to help their families. >> i'm appalled that we are talking about numbers like they are not human beings in this country and part of the society. >> tell her. >> they are human beings. i can't wrap my arms around the fact that when someone is here illegal, that is a crime. these people came here illegal ahead of others. >> i i do illegal things every day.

i sped on the way here. that's a crime, too. >> i want everyone to know that holly -- holly does illegal things every day. what else? >> will this be on tv? there is the issue of the children of these people. they have families. they are escaping horrific situations. there are americans milking the system worse than some of our illegal immigrants are who just want a better life. >> we can't be responsible for what's happening in their country. frankly some of the people need -- >> but what is the statue of liberty represent? >> if they are here legally i don't have a problem with that. it's the fact that they are here illegally. >> my grandparents came to get away from discrimination in europe. they came legally. they went through the system. they came over, got a job, learned english so their children, my parents could be good americans and now i'm an american. >> there is more to it. if the standard of getting into

the this country was consistent no matter what country you came from, i can buy that. how do some people get here easier ? the time period, waiting time period is shorter for some countries than others. there is a problem. >> when you hear this conversation, how does this make you feel? >> it's horrifying to me that people would treat other human beings like this. it is far more complicated. getting immigration in the united states is difficult and costs a lot of money. and the questions on the citizenship test are difficult. >> okay. we are not solving it here. >> right. >> you have proven my point that holly breaks the law. [ laughter ] >> and that this is probably -- immigration is probably the most contentious issue. we'll be debating it over the coming weeks and months. we'll ask for one thing -- civility as we