good evening with the nurses are on strike . they want an awful on strike. they want an awful lot of money 19. but i'm asking in is rishi being raised the bill with what the government is offering? because i'm not sure that they are. i'll give you my response to both judgement. yes they do. but says the rwanda dealis they do. but says the rwanda deal is legal. let's find out. i'll give you my view as to whether it's actually ever going happen. joining me on talking pints, katie waissel , she was a pints, katie waissel, she was a star on x factor and that runs a charity for those that left high and dry reality television .

and dry by reality television. and there are just too many of them. all of that, those debates in just a moment. first, let's get the news with polly mendel, host . now nigel, thank you and host. now nigel, thank you and good evening to you the top story tonight, ambulance workers and paramedics are preparing to go on strike tomorrow after last minute talks between government and unions this afternoon failed to address the issue . pay the to address the issue. pay the health secretary met union representatives but paid were off the table . instead the off the table. instead the government was seeking reassure assurances over strike cover and patient safety at least five ambulance trusts have declared critical incidents as they face unprecedented pressure ahead of the walkout . at around 600 the walkout. at around 600 members of the army, navy and raf have been drafted in to help dunng raf have been drafted in to help during the walkout its members of the armed forces have been part in two days of specialist

training . wellington barracks in training. wellington barracks in london where they're being trained to drive ambulance vehicles, the workers said they were honoured to cover for workers despite having to sacrifice time off and thousands of nurses in england, northern ireland, wales have been walking for the second time in under a week . the royal college of week. the royal college of nursing has warned the action could go on for six months unless . an agreement is reached. unless. an agreement is reached. they're calling for a 5% above inflation pay rise. but the government says demands are unaffordable. the health secretary, steve barclay, says the government has instead the entire nhs . on we have an entire nhs. on we have an independent process . we have independent process. we have accepted that in full and of course that comes on top of the extra parties ation of the nhs last year. but we also, alongside need to focus on patients. we need to focus on those pandemic waiting lists, get those waiting . and that's get those waiting. and that's why we've invested extra 6.6

billion over the next two years. so prioritised the nhs and social care in the autumn statement at a time of difficulty for the economy because we recognise we need to get those things down. meanwhile, the prime minister has backed the findings of the independent pay review body as faced questions over nhs strikes appearing before a super committee of mps rishi sunak defended the government's position and refusal to increase its offer nurses and paramedics. he said the best way to help the country was not to increase wages, but to bring down inflation . i've acknowledged inflation. i've acknowledged that it inflation. i've acknowledged thatitis inflation. i've acknowledged that it is difficult. it is difficult for everybody . difficult for everybody. inflation is where it is the best way to help them and to help everyone else in the country is for us to get a grip and reduce inflation as quickly as possible. and we need to make sure that decisions that we make can that outcome, can bring about that outcome, because it wrong and because we get it wrong and we're still dealing with high inflation year's time . inflation in a year's time. that's to help that's not going to help anybody. i don't to see

anybody. i don't want to see that. to things get that. i want to things get back to and. that's why having to normal and. that's why having a independent pay process is an important part of us making those decisions . rishi sunak now those decisions. rishi sunak now scotland yard is an allegation of racially abuse after the conservative bob stewart told an activist to go back to bahrain in the comments were made during confrontation in the street last week . the mp confrontation in the street last week. the mp for confrontation in the street last week . the mp for beckenham confrontation in the street last week. the mp for beckenham has apologised but denies that his intention was to be racist. the met police says the case was opened following complaint from sayeed ahmed wadi . 12 people sayeed ahmed wadi. 12 people have been charged with burglary after five dogs were stolen from after five dogs were stolen from a counselling centre . breeds a counselling centre. breeds animals for a search . cambridge animals for a search. cambridge cambridgeshire says officers responded . reports of a burglary responded. reports of a burglary at mba acres in witton on early sunday morning, at mba acres in witton on early sunday morning , then again on sunday morning, then again on monday afternoon, 12 people aged between 20 and 52 years old are due to at cambridge magistrates court today. the dogs have yet

to be recovered . you up to date to be recovered. you up to date on tv online and dab plus radio with gb news where now it's time for thurrott . for thurrott. good evening. it's the second day of a national nurses strike and that is bad news. operations cancelled waiting lists, getting even longer. and that, of course, ahead of an ambulance strike which will go ahead with the army doing their best to fill in for those roles and many other this week, other strikes this week, including the post office and border force. but let's stick for the moment to the nurses now their demand for a 19% pay rise. i that's for the birds. it isn't going to happen. but guess we could call it and negotiating position. but in order to get a settlement both sides at some

point in time have to be reasonable. what i'm asking tonight is other being reasonable now. stephen barclay of is the health minister working directly prime minister rishi sunak on this issue . he rishi sunak on this issue. he says he is happy to talk happy to sit down with the royal college of nursing until but he also says the accepts in full the recommend dation of the pay review or the pay review body have suggested a 4% rise. so the health secretary is happy to talk to the nurses , but not talk to the nurses, but not about the issue over which they're striking. now that , i they're striking. now that, i can remember saw what happened in seventies when pay demands government gave in again and again and. again. and all that did in an inflationary environment was to fuel it even . but government needs to be

fair . government needs to be fair. government needs to be seen to be fair. government needs to be reasonable. and i have to say, whatever straits were in, i don't think four per makes sense. vanessa i also feel very for many of this new generation of nurses who've been made to go to university to get a degree. many whom have a very high level student debt quite why nurses need go to university is completely , utterly beyond is completely, utterly beyond me. so for that and other factors , i don't think 4, factors, i don't think 4, frankly, is enough at this moment in time. frankly, is enough at this moment in time . you tell me what moment in time. you tell me what you is, rishi being reasonable. i don't think . so. give me your i don't think. so. give me your view. farage at gb news dot uk . view. farage at gb news dot uk. now earlier on this afternoon this programme was out on westminster bridge talking to striking nurses and asked them whether they the government's offer was reasonable. i think

it's rubbish absolute rubbish and . we we're not asking for and. we we're not asking for much, we're not greedy, we're just asking for cost of living. at the moment nobody coming into northampton because they're looking around at what's going on and thinking about the point. so in order to get our new graduates into northam, we need so in order to get our new gr'make s into northam, we need so in order to get our new gr'make the to northam, we need so in order to get our new gr'make the condition '-\m, we need so in order to get our new gr'make the condition below need so in order to get our new gr'make the condition below thezd to make the condition below the parapet. nowadays most of our experience and well—trained living because we can survive with the current situation with the economy, you can see what we think of the government offer. that's all of us telling us, telling you it's good enough. do you think we should stay ? just you think we should stay? just behave overnight behave reasonably over overnight 7 behave reasonably over overnight ? appallingly, appallingly there should get made up the whole lot of them and bring. think somebody would feel like it should be you . we are doing this should be you. we are doing this to save you. to save save . well, to save you. to save save. well, perhaps not surprisingly if you talk to striking protesters on a

bndge talk to striking protesters on a bridge in london, you're going to get a strong point of view. but i return to that word reasonable . both sides need to reasonable. both sides need to be . if we're going to settle be. if we're going to settle this dispute because the prospect of this dragging on for a further six months, given the awful state much of the nhs is currently in, is frankly unacceptable . well, joining me unacceptable. well, joining me now from county durham is sam lees, a clinical nurse specialist . sam, welcome. specialist. sam, welcome. welcome the programme . you've welcome the programme. you've heard my view . i don't think the heard my view. i don't think the government being reasonable, but sam would you accept that? by the same token , given where we the same token, given where we are a country, given the massive escalation of national debt dunng escalation of national debt during lockdown to much else that actually nurses demand the actions . for 19? isn't actions. for 19? isn't reasonable either. well i think it's we need to think about it in terms of negotiating. i mean,

for the last years, nurses and, all health care professionals under gender change have had pay cuts or freezes and what we're seeing is , the lack of staff , seeing is, the lack of staff, all service and a massive recruitment and retention issue, which is then linking in to the state staffing levels . so state staffing levels. so whether or not i agree with the 19, does not actually be in any negotiations . yes. so that needs negotiations. yes. so that needs to start . now, listen to i take to start. now, listen to i take that point. i take that point fully . but stephen barclay , the fully. but stephen barclay, the health secretary says he's happy to talk , but he accepts the pay to talk, but he accepts the pay body review of 4. so what is there to talk about with nursing at the other than pay and i. well i don't see how you can leave the peer aspect out it when we've got a like i said a massive recruitment and retention problem right across

the country . i retention problem right across the country. i mean adequate staffing levels is absolutely necessary for patient safety and patient care and in order to get to get that staff has to feel they're being paid appropriately as well. and that's what a lot of staff don't feel that they are, which is why you get in a lot of people leaving so you're to me that people leaving because of money more the working conditions . or because of money more the working conditions. or is it a little bit of both ? it's both little bit of both? it's both it's both. i think the working conditions is a massive part. i mean you've got nurses. well, not just staff, but overall health care profession . also not health care profession. also not being able to take breaks where i can over hours over the hours often then find it difficult to take that time back. so that's all having its toll along with 12 years of pay cuts and pay freezes . yeah. i mean look ,

freezes. yeah. i mean look, here's the funny thing. you know, we're now spending 12% of our national cake. 12% of our gross domestic product is now being spent on health. that's gone up 50% over the course of the last decade. pro—rata so it's not as if we're not putting money into the health service . money into the health service. and maybe this is an unfair question . but but what's going . question. but but what's going. well i think firstly, just myob's evasions of it is this is that a lot of the money because there isn't the stuff on the shop floor there isn't there isn't the care to be able to be provided. so therefore it has to be outsourced to the sector. so that's where a lot of the increase in money has gone so is into the private sector to cover for the nhs lack of staff . yeah for the nhs lack of staff. yeah we. do these eyewatering you don't we sometimes agency workers are recruited at very very big sums of money and. just let me just finish with you. i

mean, you know, you're doing this job. mean, you know, you're doing thisjob. i can tell mean, you know, you're doing this job. i can tell from the way you're speaking about you care passionately about what you do. as i think the vast majority of do . i mean, are you of nurses do. i mean, are you prepared? are prepared to go on strike a week , week ? yeah. i strike a week, week? yeah. i probably should explain . the probably should explain. the organisation that i work . we organisation that i work. we didn't meet the threshold to be able to strike, so i'm supporting my colleagues in other trusts who are able to strike . and it's frustrating to strike. and it's frustrating to not be able to join join properly on a picket a picket line and but yes , if and when we line and but yes, if and when we get the opportunity again to vote within six months, then hopefully there'll be more trusts that will the threshold if they just feel sometimes i mean our patients being let down by nurses . no patients have been

by nurses. no patients have been let down by the government. the nurses were doing and all health care professionals are doing absolutely the best that they can with , the resources that can with, the resources that they've got. no, i don't feel that patients have been let down by health care professionals all. all right, families. thank for joining us on debate. thank forjoining us on debate. thank you and keen to get your is rishi being reasonable . i don't rishi being reasonable. i don't think he is. i think if he sticks to this course we going to get a settlement soon. i don't really think we need one. in a moment, rowan that we were told yesterday by the high court . it's legal. does that mean the government's problems on cross—border channel crossings are about to end. we'll debate that in just moment.

welcome back . is rishi being welcome back. is rishi being reasonable? i've got some of your thoughts coming in here, paul says no good . offering paul says no good. offering a high pay rise as that will sadly just escalate inflation. yes, pauli just escalate inflation. yes, paul i know. i get that better to offer something like 5% a year for the next two or three years. well, you know what? that actually might as being reasonable . just to say it's 4% reasonable. just to say it's 4% and we only get about and we won't even talk . it strikes me won't even talk. it strikes me being unreasonable. surely we all want resolution. we all want all want resolution. we all want a settlement of some kind . david a settlement of some kind. david says no . a sensible solution says no. a sensible solution would . be a says no. a sensible solution would. be a lump sum in. says no. a sensible solution would . be a lump sum in. well, would. be a lump sum in. well, yeah you can do a lump sum across all pay levels and you the low paid a good rise that would encourage better recruitment. well, you what you could do that david equally . do could do that david equally. do you know what you could do? might really you might actually just raise the threshold at which people start paying tax to

get more of the paid completely out of tax that might be a better fairer way not just for nurses but for everybody on lower pay. although how dare talk about a reduction of taxes as i get a wash my mouth out with soap and water. jeremy hunfs with soap and water. jeremy hunt's in charge now we can't have that sort of talk now, can we? and finally on mike says no , he's being irresponsible he calls the inflation with lockdown schemes interesting and he is giving billions to ukraine interesting criticism of ukraine policy you will not hear in westminster you will not in our newspapers. but you find it in your local cafe pub. it is a question that people ask . now question that people ask. now yesterday we got the judgement . yesterday we got the judgement. the high court say the rwanda dealis the high court say the rwanda deal is legal. it will comply with the un declaration of what a refugee is it will comply ? so

a refugee is it will comply? so this judge believes with human rights law and that's been taken as a great victory. secretary is very very relieved about this andindeed very very relieved about this and indeed some very optimistic leader columns written in conservative supporting . well conservative supporting. well tell you what folks i've seen it all before . point one, we are all before. point one, we are still signed to the cia job and. they've made it absolutely clear they wouldn't any of this until till the end of legal process. what does that mean. it means judgement yesterday will be contested . it'll be contested by contested. it'll be contested by a variety of groups like care for who appear to be remarkably well—funded. and this will now go well—funded. and this will now 9° up well—funded. and this will now go up to the court. it will then go up to the court. it will then 9° up go up to the court. it will then go up the supreme court ultimately , guess what, folks? ultimately, guess what, folks? it might even back to the european court of human rights in strasbourg. i think even that optimistic judgement the judge said this must be dealt with on a case by case basis and i can

see . the 1998 human rights act. see. the 1998 human rights act. i can see the 2015 modern slavery act being used in case after , case after case, to argue after, case after case, to argue against extradition . i would be against extradition. i would be mightily surprised , mightily mightily surprised, mightily surprised if anything changed on this between now and the next general election . am i being too general election. am i being too pessimistic? am i being too cynical? well, i've learned when it comes to protecting our borders, the more pessimistic you are , the less likely you are you are, the less likely you are to be disappointed with joining me to discuss this issue. vital issue. ben habib , businessman. issue. ben habib, businessman. former party mep . ben, do we not former party mep. ben, do we not keep this story? we do mean it's absolutely typical of the conservative party it to come up with a massive headline a new policy we're going to deport them all true one we're going to get ahead of this problem and

then suddenly you find the whole project, know, get stuck in project, you know, get stuck in the mud you hit the nail on the mud and you hit the nail on the mud and you hit the nail on the head. nigel when you said, ultimately it's a case by case debate . it doesn't matter that debate. it doesn't matter that in principle, the rwandan plan doesn't breach human rights legislation. that doesn't matter because when it comes to hearing people's cases, they will be taken one by one. and if someone claims that they were subject to servitude, enslavement and sexual abuse or whatever it is used, then are stuck in the british judicial system. nothing, by the way, to do with the european convention of human rights , our own laws having rights, our own laws having fight it out with the british judicial system as a government to deport these people who may in all likelihood as far as at least you it is very significant number of people coming across the concerned. our the channel are concerned. our economic migrants and that is the problem and the rwandan plan by the way just for a second, but absolutely irrelevant . the but absolutely irrelevant. the rwandan plan was never going to

work it, nigel. was never to work it, nigel. it was never to work. well, i just you know, a judge or a judge in the high court yesterday, perfectly court yesterday, it's perfectly legal. fair to the legal. i mean, to be fair to the government. that was it was something of a victory for them . but presupposes every . but it presupposes that every case. so the he has the programme is legal but it be legal to deport anyone to that programme . and that's the big programme. and that's the big question and it's the second question and it's the second question where the rwandan plan is sadly lacking and. you know, when you think about it, of course, rwanda was going to sign up to it. we pay the m £120 up to it. we pay them £120 million upfront. i think we've paid another 20 million since then. there's a hotel there's a 50 bedroom hotel, which then. there's a hotel there's a 50 bedroom hotel , which we've 50 bedroom hotel, which we've all seen photographs of. yeah. waiting for these people to read comes on this programme sometimes. read a piece in today's daily mail, but it's a lovely hotel. it's empty but we've we've already policy with a great deal of money we one and a great deal of money we one and a half % of the gdp of rwanda. no a half% of the gdp of rwanda. no wonder they'd sign to this. this

was a this is manna from heaven . money from british . it was money from the british government effectively to play the 24 hour news cycle to get the 24 hour news cycle to get the headlines the tory party wanted and the tory party no doubt will now be backing that drums look, we told drums saying, look, we told you it was legal, they're it was legal, but they're missing still be missing the point. they still be able it . and there able to implement it. and there are a whole host of other issues with the plan, by the with the rwandan plan, by the way. applies to men. it way. it only applies to men. it only there's got be a quid only there's got to be a quid pro quo . got be pro quo. we've got to be prepared to take from prepared to take people from rwanda country . rwanda back into this country. pause you for a moment? yeah this point, think , has been this point, i think, has been lost by everybody. it's in the small print . so let's just drill small print. so let's just drill into that for a moment. small print. so let's just drill into that for a moment . we can into that for a moment. we can we will send . migrants to we will send. migrants to rwanda. we don't yet know what the cost per migrant will be, but many, many thousands per. absolutely. many, many, maybe five figures. but i think people are talking about 30 or 45 figures i had to do . but in the figures i had to do. but in the small print , figures i had to do. but in the small print, we're going to take rwanda. rwanda into our country

. people who have perhaps difficulties . is that right? difficulties. is that right? disturbed individuals ? there is disturbed individuals? there is there is a straight quid pro quo. and rwanda money and it gets to get a lenient for it citizens coming to the united but we're also going to take problem people this was written in what are the press not focus on i don't know and the single man issue is worth focusing on too nigel because if you're a people smuggler , if this is people smuggler, if this is genuinely about human rights and, protecting human life, if you're smuggler, the you're a people smuggler, the last going to last thing you're going to do, you're against is go you're legislated against is go down. either go down that down. you either go down that path, you're going to stop exporting single men and you're going to focus on women and children so what they're actually doing with , the rwandan actually doing with, the rwandan plan is putting and children in dangerin plan is putting and children in danger in the channel, assuming the rwandan plan were to work which it won't and here's the really important thing i think deportation which is what the

rwandan plan is what you do when border control has failed and we talk border control and deportation as if they're the same thing they're not border control is to prevent of people ever entering the united kingdom in the first place. and we have all the laws we need internationally and domestically to stop boats at the point that they seek to enter our territorial water. we have the right to send them back to france if we are going to do a deal with france and try and get some of agreement that suits the french us. the only agreement that's worth paying for is that allows british boats to patrol french waters so we can actually get to those dinghies before they even try to get into british waters and take them straight back to french shores . straight back to french shores. i would love to say a final thought on on the broader issue . there's huge a huge about a focus on what's happening in the channel i'm quite right to. yeah, but the bigger point is

that 1.1 million people were given permanently to remain or visas into this country last yeah visas into this country last year. yes, i know many were students for what's to say they won't stay anyway . net migration won't stay anyway. net migration half a million. many of those who were going up young people going off to portugal because the tax regimes good people retiring to spain or whatever it may be . is it retiring to spain or whatever it may be. is it racist to retiring to spain or whatever it may be . is it racist to talk may be. is it racist to talk about mass immigration ? not at about mass immigration? not at all. i mean, it is it is it is a real problem for the united kingdom. you talk about the 1 million people who came in last yeah million people who came in last year. but remember we gave pre—settled and settled status to a half million eu to six and a half million eu member state citizens . when we member state citizens. when we left the european, we were told it was 3 million, you remember? yeah were told and it's six and a half million. and where are they. here somewhere. we they. they're here somewhere. we about a population of 68 million. it's probably a lot a long way north of that and no wonder our public services are under no you know, we under stress. no you know, we have got an open door policy .

have got an open door policy. and when boris johnson talks about , and when boris johnson talks about, having and when boris johnson talks about , having delivered his about, having delivered his points based immigration system, it's a misrepresent nation. those points are so easy to come by that actually unskilled labouris by that actually unskilled labour is still coming into this unchecked and we've got to stop what we've got. they know with the criteria . i mean, they put the criteria. i mean, they put up a points based system as you the bar, wherever you want to , the bar, wherever you want to, set it. and we've loved that, but learned we but we've learned it. what we need upskilling of the need is upskilling of the british workforce and we need the british workforce to come back into them, back into employment . and you touched on employment. and you touched on it in the previous segment make it in the previous segment make it worthwhile to work cut taxes jeremy hunt is completely wrong and you're so right nigel take increased that threshold at you pay increased that threshold at you pay the basic rate this would help those low paid take people really the tax. i agree ben habib thank you. well another heretic there a man who thinks we should cut taxes. i mean,

perhaps we a weird cult. well, maybe actually, it's that behind me that are really out of touch with the rest of the country. in a moment, we will talk about the death of those four young boys on the ice in the west midlands last week. but what of those? the ten year old lad who out to do his best to save the three? well there's a campaign to get him an award. we'll discuss that in just a moment.

well, it's a story that touched all of us. i'm sure it happened. the baptismal lake near solihull in the west midlands last week . in the west midlands last week. three young boys, two brothers, samuel butler, finlay butler . samuel butler, finlay butler. their cousin thomas stewart in dire difficulty . that lake and dire difficulty. that lake and ten year old jack johnson . when

ten year old jack johnson. when tim went out there to try and give these lads hand. all four of them very, very died, as i say. i the story touched all of us . but now say. i the story touched all of us. but now there's a campaign has been launched to get an award for johnson, an has been launched to get an award forjohnson, an award for award for johnson, an award for valour , for jack johnson, for valour, for jack johnson, for and i have to say sometimes i think that we dish out awards to all and sundry when perhaps they're not deserved this time. i think there may well be a very very strong case for acting. well rob lofthouse is a military veteran. he's on the line with me from portsmouth and he's got a petition going and he wants to get jack johnson a posthumous george cross . rob joins me the george cross. rob joins me the line now. rob evening. welcome the program, i think. i you're doing exactly the right thing . doing exactly the right thing. would you please just explain very clearly to the audience on telly and radio what the george

cross and i say this because it's given so rarely. just tell them what the george cross exactly . the george cross is the exactly. the george cross is the civilian equivalent of the victoria cross . the criteria victoria cross. the criteria make such an award . it has to be make such an award. it has to be impulsive. it's most certainly reckless . it's selfless in the reckless. it's selfless in the endeavour to help others and. certainly. above all, it's courageous and. that is on par with the victoria cross, which is awarded to armed forces personnel for extreme . yes. personnel for extreme. yes. i mean, it's medal that is given out. victoria is to i guess, but it's a medal is given out very rarely . what makes you think rob rarely. what makes you think rob that your politicians got a chance here of succeeding. have you got an mp supporting you? have you got figures supporting you?is have you got figures supporting you? is that what you're looking to try and do ? and so when the

to try and do? and so when the story broke as can imagine, kids going through the ice is devastating. i mean they've obviously any of my kids in such a thing it would absolutely be shot to me. and when you come to learn of the boys certainly finley and samuel butler cousin thomas stewart and then the fourth lad came into the equation, jack johnson, who was only ten years old. he was not of their party. he was just just happened to be walking on by, i suppose. and he took it upon to try and lend a hand . it cost him try and lend a hand. it cost him his life and that just had me as not as well as heartbroken just had me in absolute all that normally you expect lantern jawed heroes come to the rescue and save the day. this is a ten year old boy that gave everything in his , dare say, his everything in his, dare say, his childhood naivete to try and do some good on a bad and i said to

the wife, i said , that's george the wife, i said, that's george written all over it. and, you know, i was trying to keep myself together and not think he was very calm and understanding , went, don't put in for , went, why don't put in for one. why don't you start one of them petitions and i've only been doing it about three or four days now and just got over just got over 7000 signatures. no little no finger up . i tell no little no finger up. i tell you what, rob , we are going to you what, rob, we are going to do our best here at to help you get that number up substantially .thank get that number up substantially . thank you. absolutely i know. i think you're right. i just think i don't i don't often go along with these. i think sometimes we're inclined to say, let's give people awards and honours. but i think you're absolutely right. this is george cross . this is absolutely right. this is george cross. this is the absolutely right. this is george cross . this is the equivalent cross. this is the equivalent people in the blitz coming in, burning buildings and taking people out and some sometimes getting away with it themselves and sometimes not. it's absolute duty on par with that. i agree

duty on a par with that. i agree with you. how do people help you? how do they get to your position ? so they're they can go position? so they're they can go on the change org website. they're welcome to look me up on the social media platforms , the social media platforms, particular facebook on prolific with the link and sharing it on my platform and just follow link and then follow the prompts on. right, good. so .org is the easiest place to go. yeah yes. and what . and it's basically and what. and it's basically george cross for or for jeff johnson . well i'm going to sign johnson. well i'm going to sign up and i'm going to encourage rob to do it. you're doing exactly right thing and well done. you can you for coming on my show share ideas. i think my show to share ideas. i think that be a very, very appropriate thing . very appropriate thing. thing. very appropriate thing. thank you . now a quick what thank you. now a quick what fridge moment remember in wonderful netflix documentary basically meghan harry what?

meghan does it harry uncomfortable she's practising ing to the queen it all looks really rather disrespectful. you see, one of the things you said throughout the whole thing was no one told her. no one trained her. she didn't know to do a curtsy. well, have a look. this clip from suits the tv series that she appeared . we the that she appeared. we the problem it's me . please do me problem it's me. please do me. so there you are in professional life, working in tv's serious suits . she had to curtsy, but suits. she had to curtsy, but somehow now when she married prince harry, she forgot what a curtsy was and had to make a huge deal of it. now awkward and difficult . the whole thing was difficult. the whole thing was no doubt she felt oppressed by all of it. now, meghan does raise very, very strong opinions

on both sides of the divide . on both sides of the divide. jeremy clarkson in his article the sun a couple of days ago went i think a little bit too far. he said that he hated it and hate . i don't think he's and hate. i don't think he's a particularly word to use. well the independent press complaints commission have received more complaints about jeremy clarkson's article in the sun than any that they've ever had in history of the organisation, observed had so many complaints and clarkson has now apologised and clarkson has now apologised and amazon newspaper taken the article down. meghan does tend to drive people absolutely, totally and utterly barmy . a totally and utterly barmy. a congressional committee have decided that they think donald ought to face proceedings along with all of those around him. i doubt much directly come of that. and a quick final thought on this section, sunak today. there he was before the committee . and he will not rule

committee. and he will not rule out the fuel being put back next spnng out the fuel being put back next spring on a litre of fuel. it could mean as much as per litre extra tax going on a litre of fuel. extra tax going on a litre of fuel . while i'm on it. have you fuel. while i'm on it. have you noficed fuel. while i'm on it. have you noticed diesel is 25 p more expensive . more expensive than expensive. more expensive than unleaded and unleaded in parts of london and the south—east appears to be running out. i am not trying to spot madness. we saw earlier this . i'm just saw earlier this. i'm just pointing out there are some real genuine problems with fuel supply and fuel prices and we're going to do a big feature on all of this on thursday of this week. in a moment i'll be joined on talking pints by katie waissel she was on back 2010 the x factor when . it was just the x factor when. it was just the most mega programme on british television, but she'll tell us about the dark side of people who go on big reality and find a bit of fame overnight.

gb news. it's that time of the day. yes talking pints. i'm joined by katie west katie. welcome to the program. thank you for having me. now there you are. we go back couple of years . oh, it's back couple of years. oh, it's nice. good i have not been around forever . i've really into around forever. i've really into the spirit of this. yeah so you're out there, you're trying make your own way in music , make your own way in music, journalism and life, and suddenly x factor comes along , suddenly x factor comes along, right? difficult to. almost. explain people now just how mega as show that was simon how everything . and suddenly you're everything. and suddenly you're there you're singing on x factor and you get involved in one or two of the controversies is right on the programme. how much

fun was that. was it just the most nerve wracking thing to be honest ? it i most nerve wracking thing to be honest? it i mean still look thinking about it, it makes my body physically shake. and interesting enough is that what goes behind the scenes at the conversations when i try speak out about it and why i do on social media platforms . and it's social media platforms. and it's the one topic that is very very spoken about publicly. but trying to get those conversations going continued to. to share one's in terms of . to. to share one's in terms of. how one finds themselves on that show what they are signing what happens afterwards . well we're happens afterwards. well we're going to come to that . yes. going to come to that. yes. i mean, you know, having done this and, you know, you've got your own you're making your own group and you're making your own group and you're making your own way. but you then talk about sort of a punishment . you then sort of a punishment. you then go celebrity big brother . go into celebrity big brother. that was different that was a very different experience , you know, in terms experience, you know, in terms of well, i can only speak for me

personally the way that i was taking care of . from a mental taking care of. from a mental health standpoint, they were absolute on it with. yeah, they actually really were. and i, i felt like i'd want to take it to , experience the show from inside. and it's not something that i would have chosen to do after the x factor , but there'd after the x factor, but there'd been enough breathing space that i thought you know what, this would be a perfect opportunity to show people in real time that . i'm not how i was made out to be or how the press completely pred be or how the press completely ripped me apart. but isn't this what isn't this and isn't this the point that what you're campaigning on today , that all campaigning on today, that all these people you get involved with all these different reality shows can be cooking, it shows and it can be cooking, it can be imagining whatever may can be imagining whatever it may be. a lot people have be. yeah, a lot of people have not had a public profile. right suddenly have a public profile. you know , we have on benefits you know, we have on benefits straight other people we talked

about these and suddenly you're getting abuse. suddenly you've got a degree of people recognise you in the street and fame . you in the street and fame. suddenly you've got people wanting to use you abuse you. people just prepared for this ehhen people just prepared for this either. no. and you don't know . either. no. and you don't know. should they be expected to either? and i think that the narrative that is very heavily spun by press and media, which is often found to be kind fed into by either production companies or pr depart with or without someone's acknowledgement of it. i think it's very unfair , somebody that it's very unfair, somebody that have either experience training in the industry to and in terms of press and media training to then be faced with with such a huge amount commentary , whether huge amount commentary, whether positive or negative and doesn't have independent, almost chaperone , so to speak, to guide chaperone, so to speak, to guide them through that and what that

looks like. it is just not we've we've even had suicides who've appeared on reality show. i mention the show, but this has happened, doesn't it. right. and |, happened, doesn't it. right. and i, i, i made some notes because very quickly i have adhd and i'm just, i'm, i just want to make sure that i, i touch upon these a statistic and very, very seriously because you're right, the awareness said that the risk of suicide elevated was elevated for those in media and sport and. it was 20% higher for males in the industry and 69% higher for females in the industry is incredibly worrying . so i'm incredibly worrying. so i'm currently working alongside some incredible people that we were kind of brought together by the secretary of state at the dcms all industry heads . and here all industry heads. and here i made some notes. thanks this is important. it says industry

round committee that we're working on creating independent standards authority to prevent, monitor and protect against bullying, harassment, discrimination etc. and with my own charity as well the our foundation to provide that safe space for people that not employees so to speak or maybe from self employed that are experienced seeing what we're talking about that are vulnerable or potential victims of misconduct abuse which you've suffered yourself . yes, i have suffered yourself. yes, i have to turn to for mental health support and legal advice and guidance that process, because right now . i it's like finding right now. i it's like finding a needle in a haystack in terms of for the right law and legislation . the is the not the legislation. the is the not the responsibility here on the programme. hundreds 100. but the problem is that we often find ourselves facing or the research that i've been doing

independently is that nothing for the either participant or whether they've agreed to sign up to a show like that or not is independent that you're not offered independent legal advice or an independent doctor to go and see it all comes from the source. you're absolutely right. they they have neglected the duty of care and protocols and, the roundtable committee, because there's a little money. well, look , i'm i understand to well, look, i'm i understand to a certain extent, a commodity , a certain extent, a commodity, they are investing their money to in providing entertainment, but don't get started over. but not at the expense of people's fundamental human rights and safety and wellbeing. i mean, if you think about minors, vulnerable adults that are thrown into a situation that they don't know what they're signing they don't have somebody there to say advise them. no and no and then sending their lives . katie would look at looking at

it. yeah you know and some people have gone through these programs and gone through these experience is and they flourished and done . others have flourished and done. others have a say . i say flourished and done. others have a say. i say many, flourished and done. others have a say . i say many, too flourished and done. others have a say. i say many, too many about a really horrid time of it because it was the media turn on you for whatever it's a pretty lonely tough old place to be would advise people not to go on these programs . that's would advise people not to go on these programs. that's a would advise people not to go on these programs . that's a really these programs. that's a really good question it's more i alongside others are doing our absolute utmost make sure that it is safe to go these programmes i would the creative industries when i was a child i used to look at it like it's magical. it's so special i mean to even be in a studio . it's to even be in a studio. it's a dream. it's a dream to many people . yeah. but again if we people. yeah. but again if we put the right measures in place with the right people to safeguard , then absolutely. go safeguard, then absolutely. go follow your dream . i'm not here follow your dream. i'm not here to tear an industry down. i'm here to make it safer as a mother. if my son to get into it. absolutely so i do. if the

next generation's as well that you know what? whenever i'm asked by young people any advice i'd give them about journey of life, i'd always say , follow life, i'd always say, follow your dreams . you've got to your dreams. you've got to follow your dreams. i don't think absolutely think you're absolutely right. if can help in any way at if you can help in any way at all to make this industry a little bit safer. yeah, you would done a very very good would have done a very very good job. well, i'm hoping suella braverman reads my letter that. i knew that you were at school with that go to school. with that i did go to school. which, yes i know. even which, yes i know. but even still, that doesn't it doesn't qualify. this area exactly still, that doesn't it doesn't help a little bit ? yeah. no, help a little bit? yeah. no, exactly. and again, it doesn't there's no such thing as an overnight . and the same goes overnight. and the same goes with the tremendous work that so many people are doing, even ground level. i i speak to so many people on, social media, multiple platforms that a campaign tremendously hard for transparency to seek justice for those that have been your stuff you did what you did but i just

want to make it safer not tear it down. i love that it's positive. note to end on. oh, i'd like to draw more me. i'm going to have to do that. give me time to catch. katie me time to catch. oh katie waissel, very much waissel, thank you very much indeed. you . okay we've indeed. thank you. okay we've now got time for the barrage. yes, we have you send me and your questions raab asks what gary neville make a good labour party mp. well, i tell you what, gary neville may well have been quite good at football and at one point might have been quite a good pundit. i think what happened on it he v during that world cup special , i happened on it he v during that world cup special, i mean, it was an all out for the labour party to compare the difficulty of nurses on the nhs to virtually slave migrant labourers who on those buildings in qatar was an absolute disgrace . and itv should make it disgrace. and itv should make it very, very clear . disgrace. and itv should make it very, very clear. he will disgrace. and itv should make it very, very clear . he will not be very, very clear. he will not be on the programme again unless i

mean, if they want to turn it into a sort of pub style debate before the football , get before the football, get somebody on with a different point of view . well, that's not point of view. well, that's not what people switch on for. they switched on to watch the football. perhaps football. what was perhaps ultimately one of the best world cup finals that has ever been seen so mr. neville no more thank very much indeed, mary , do thank very much indeed, mary, do you think rwanda will happen and will it make a difference . well, will it make a difference. well, i think, to be frank, mary , we i think, to be frank, mary, we cover that already. i think it really is going to happen all. and finally mike asks, do you think the could be found to fund pay think the could be found to fund pay rise for the nurses at the nhs reduce levels of waste, corruption , diversity, trainers corruption, diversity, trainers and other pointless jobs ? mike and other pointless jobs? mike i going to on this point we now spending 12% per annum of our gdp of our national cake on health a decade ago it was barely pushing 8. we increased the amount of money we're

putting into the health service and the results get and worse and the results get and worse and worse it part of broken britain something is fundamentally wrong but you can't put all of that down to the when they need to be offered a reasonable deal enough from me now mark steyn . i was very sad now mark steyn. i was very sad to hear the suffered a couple of heart attacks and is not in great. he's recuperating in france. we wish him very very well tonight stepping in for him is patrick christys quite shocking . yes indeed absolutely shocking. yes indeed absolutely . well, we obviously wish martin all the best. but yes, i've got loads coming your way. just quickly are going to be looking at the who've been at some of the staff who've been at some of the staff who've been at migrant hotels and will at these migrant hotels and will as well. when we a lot as well. when we talk a lot about what's been going in terms of rwanda got of the rwanda deal, we've got a grooming investigation for grooming gang investigation for you, going want to miss you, not going to want to miss the on that the latest on that. that really shocking and our shocking stuff. and yes, our military heroes. yes, again, are filling the void for striking filling to the void for striking workers workers . hello there. workers workers. hello there. i'm greg hurst and welcome to the latest forecast from the met office over the next few days

there'll be further outbreaks of rain and showers across the uk. a lot to quite cloudy, but temperatures around average. if we the bigger picture, we look at the bigger picture, we look at the bigger picture, we remains in we can low pressure remains in charge of our weather over the next few . bringing wet windy next few. bringing wet and windy weather across the north of the uk. even in the south uk. but even in the south we'll see some wet weather at times. but in between that be some dner but in between that be some drier through tuesday drier interludes through tuesday evening we'll see a batch heavy, more persistent rain moving in across parts of wales, stretching up into parts of northern england , the midlands, northern england, the midlands, south—west england . the other south—west england. the other side of this, some clear spells, but northern scotland but northern ireland, scotland seeing some outbreaks of seeing also some outbreaks of showery temperatures showery rain temperatures overall remaining above freezing . so a frost free start to wednesday , but a wet start. wednesday, but a wet start. outbreaks of rain east across england and wales, some of this heavy at times frequent showers across ireland , across northern ireland, northern england scotland northern england and scotland through some sunny through the day some sunny spells though blown spells in between, though blown in a blustery in, but in on quite a blustery in, but brightening up for much england and wales into the afternoon sunny spells temperatures

generally 7 to 11 south is feeling a little cooler across the north with brisk wind into evening time on wednesday. we've got clear skies initially, however, just to become cloudier. this batch weather moves in from the atlantic, bringing some rain into parts of wales, southern counties , wales, southern counties, england, clear skies further and northern ireland into scotland means it will turn quite chilly here with some scattered showers for five celsius in the south, holding up with the cloud and rain . this means a cloudy wet rain. this means a cloudy wet start to the day across . much of start to the day across. much of england and wales thursday morning. but we'll keep an eye on this rain as it moves across seven counties of england and wales during the morning and into the afternoon. some of this could be heavy at times, could lead to some tricky travelling conditions. thank drive conditions. further thank drive scattered over the next scattered showers over the next few days. further rain and showers as possible and it starts turn a little colder .

a welcome along everybody to. tuesday's edition of the mark steyn with me patrick christys. and we have a stellar line up of stories and guests for you today so you won't want to miss a single second of it as the army are called in to clear up the mess left by striking ambulance workers and staff and of course, nurses as well. we take a deep dive into . the living conditions dive into. the living conditions of , our dive into. the living conditions of, our military heroes short changed yet again. they got absolutely appalling accommodation . army reserves . accommodation. army reserves. they are basically going to be telling all about that nightmare some of course as well. we've got mp tobias ellwood who's joining me with his thoughts and as well of air strikes, one group of people here will have at the hands of the home migrant

hotel regime