coming up on today's commit combination show that all new show show for we're going to be speaking to maria caulfield the health minister about the crisis affecting , the nhs. we're also affecting, the nhs. we're also going to be speaking to wes streeting. what's labour's answer to these problems? and we're going to be joined in sydney by former australian prime minister abbott to prime minister tony abbott to discuss the migrant crisis. we'll also covering of harry and meghan, of course. but first, here's news with . tatiana

here's the news with. tatiana sanchez. here's the news with. tatiana sanchez . camilla thank you very sanchez. camilla thank you very much. this is the latest from the gb news. the prime minister is calling on health leaders to take bold and radical action amid the ongoing crisis within the nhs. during talks held yesterday , rishi sunak said yesterday, rishi sunak said a business usual mindset will not fix the challenges we face. many a&e units struggling to keep up with demand with trust, declaring critical incidents , declaring critical incidents, labour has urged to team up with the snp to defeat the government's plans for minimum service levels during strike . service levels during strike. snp, westminster requested a meeting with sir keir starmer to policy proposals . the bill will policy proposals. the bill will be introduced in parliament in the coming weeks to ensure vital pubuc the coming weeks to ensure vital public services, maintain a bafic public services, maintain a basic function when workers on

strike and prince harry has been accused of making the invictus games a target for extremists by revealing in his memoir that he killed 25 taliban fighters in afghanistan. the former head of the royal navy says the games due to be held in dusseldorf , due to be held in dusseldorf, germany, will now have a theory of security issues because the connection to harry. he called the duke a very stupid tv online and dab radio. this is gb news. now it's back to camilla tominey. well, good morning and welcome to my brand new show on gb news. it's a long time coming. i have to a bit of nerves. however i have been distracted all week , have been distracted all week, as you can imagine. i'm sure you know, i also cover the royals as

well as politics. one minute i was writing about rishi sunak five point plan. the next. so i was making an analysis of prince harry's genitals and whether they been. that's nature they had been. that's the nature of the news, i'm afraid. that's what it's like week to week. and of course, the harry and meghan story dominates the papers. we're getting on to we're going to be getting on to that later in show. that little later in the show. we're also going to talking about the nhs because of course, it's you we it's in crisis. you know, we know this. going to be know this. we're going to be speaking maria, who is the speaking to maria, who is the health the tories health minister about the tories plan about it. it plan to do about it. what's it going to speaking to? wes going to be speaking to? wes streeting? shadow streeting? he's the shadow health to ask labour health secretary to ask labour what their and let's what their plan is and let's also discuss migration and again, topic we're going again, a key topic we're going to former to be speaking. former australian minister tony australian prime minister tony abbott. run you through abbott. let me run you through the front pages. first of all, i'm going to bring my guest in just a moment. martin townsend i'm going to bring my guest in just a reditort. martin townsend i'm going to bring my guest in just a reditort. mart sunday;end former editor of the sunday express. but before we hear from him, what his favourite stories are, run you through are, let me just run you through some headlines. sunday some of headlines. sunday times and buy up care bits and she has to buy up care bits to ward's sunday to clare ward's sunday telegraph. harry's guilt. i couldn't cry in public when my

mother died, the observer also goes with the story about the nhs . nhs goes with the story about the nhs. nhs hospitals push goes with the story about the nhs . nhs hospitals push private nhs. nhs hospitals push private route too quick and easy care. sunday express my former stable . harry puts children in danger . that's in reference to his brag that he killed 25 taliban fighters . sunday mirror harry fighters. sunday mirror harry has made invictus games a target . mail on sunday again , another . mail on sunday again, another royal story involving harry. you've been brainwashed by therapy, william told prince . therapy, william told prince. and finally the sun on sunday will lunge at me after philip . will lunge at me after philip. this is a different argument to faux wildness involved a row that the brothers had after prince philip was . would you prince philip was. would you believe now, martin . lovely to believe now, martin. lovely to see you. lovely to see you. do you like this idea that i've ianedin? you like this idea that i've invited in? a former boss of my first show so you can put me through my paces as he ever did

when i worked for you? you were sunday express for, what, 17 years, it? 17 years and years, wasn't it? 17 years and okay. before yes, okay. magazine before then? yes, indeed. during beckham. the golden beckhams. so golden years of the beckhams. so to both . now i know that you to both. now i know that you know your onions on there. so let's go through the papers and the that you chose, the stories that you chose, particularly there much particularly. there is so much coverage , harry. it's hard to coverage, harry. it's hard to pick and isn't it? yeah, but harry, who that be? what? harry who? yes, exactly that a shy and retiring royal went to montecito to live a private life . but to live a private life. but you've chosen for quote of , the you've chosen for quote of, the day lord west of spit head, former head of the navy . now, former head of the navy. now, this is quite astonishing . former head of the navy. now, this is quite astonishing. he's called harry very stupid for giving details of his taliban kills. we can say it here in this spread in the mirror. why did this particularly appeal? because it's a difficult day to get an exclusive it. yeah, well, i mean, the interesting thing about the whole harry week , about the whole harry week, which this week , is which we've had this week, is that there's been sort of claim after , claim after claim in all after, claim after claim in all these coming we these stories coming out we know about talking peddle pins about and talking to peddle pins

. about him, you know, . we know about him, you know, sort cavorting with women sort of cavorting in with women behind pubs you we know behind pubs. you know, we know about into a dog about him falling into a dog bowl breaking his neck bowl and breaking his neck necklace . i mean, it's just been necklace. i mean, it's just been mad. to me that most of mad. it seems to me that most of the punches aimed at the the kind of punches aimed at the royal family haven't really landed.i royal family haven't really landed. i mean, that's my impression the one line, i think which sticks stands out where you would have thought someone would have said, no, don't go there is when he said that he'd killed this number of taliban fighters and that he'd not them over as if they were on a chessboard which to me is just the most appalling thing to supporters. and obviously still got his cheerleaders have sort of said this is to be taken out of said this is to be taken out of context. and he he said he didn't feel any emotion either way about it was the job. way about it that was the job. so of perhaps the so regardless of perhaps the nature he bragging or was nature of was he bragging or was he just telling it like it is? there's concerns among the there's key concerns among the military and in the royals security experts that it's not just exposed his own family and, the royals, but also the public. i mean, there's coronation

coming up. absolutely and the point that lord west , head of point that lord west, head of the navy, makes in the royal navy, makes in particular piece and the reason why thought it interesting why i thought it was interesting was only not only will was that not only not only will the security have to be increased at the invictus games , obviously, because we saw what happened with with salman rushdie a few months ago on that book worth pointing out the book tour worth pointing out the invictus games full of invictus games is full of ex—service. yeah but ex—service. absolutely. yeah but also every event now that harry attends, they're going to have to at security more to look at the security more carefully. and himself has carefully. and harry himself has put a position where put himself in a position where he and his family are going to be looking over their shoulders, possibly for the rest of their lives. know, it's crazy lives. so, you know, it's crazy it's absolutely crazy. it's extraordinary so much, extraordinary there's so much, obviously harry meghan obviously on harry and meghan but that but the other fame that dominates of course is the dominates of course today is the nhs . yes. i mean crisis that the nhs. yes. i mean crisis that the nhs. yes. i mean crisis that the nhs faces the moment i know we keep on talking about unprecedented natures of crises in 2023, but i mean it's quite serious and this is the leader that you've chosen, the leader page obviously at every

newspaper talking about what the newspaper talking about what the newspaper thinks about any given crisis this is in the telegraph. why did you like this? you felt this was punchy. just felt it this was punchy. i just felt it timely. mean, rishi sunak timely. i mean, rishi sunak today talking about, today has been talking about, well, both rishi sunak and sir keir starmer have been talking about nhs reform today. i mean, i ran headlines when i was on the sunday express, we ran headunes the sunday express, we ran headlines every single winter talking about an nhs crisis every single winter. i i can remember so for years, for decades then thing i don't get at the moment is that this is specifically tory problem. it's not specific a tory problem, it's a government problem. when the nhs set up originally by the labour government , there was a labour government, there was a minister who made the remark that it would work as long as people exercised restraint , but people exercised restraint, but well clearly that has not happened. you know, i think the fact that lots of people use and a&e instead of to the doctors that's not exercising restraint and that there's a huge on on any and all that kind of stuff

but in alongside that we've seen that there is this reluctance to touch this this sacred cow which is the nhs become a religion, it's become a religion and the point that this particular leader is making enough, you know successive governments have failed . we know that there's no failed. we know that there's no way for elderly people to go if they're in hospital and they're discharged, where do they go? you the care homes, the you know, the care homes, the kind in—between that my kind of in—between homes that my mother went into, for instance, after leaving hospital that's closed. now, i mean, there's i think at least 40,000 patients waiting hospital that can't waiting in hospital that can't get care. yeah. just get into care. yeah. just to take to the next piece take you on to the next piece that you've chosen, this is for your best opinion page, it's dan hodges the sunday, hodges in the mail on sunday, andifs hodges in the mail on sunday, and it's boris's . now, and it's about boris's. now, would believe in this week would you believe in this week of of of weeks there's loads of coverage tim shipman's got it in the sunday times about boris briefly martin just talk me through this story. briefly martin just talk me through this story . well it's through this story. well it's basically it's based around the fact is going to be fact that boris is going to be making appearance of cult making this appearance of cult and club in london on tuesday to

unveil portrait himself is unveil a portrait of himself is a that ex—prime a normal thing. that ex—prime ministers off the back ministers do. and off the back of that, there is a lot of excitement around his former supporters, his former his former cheerleaders about possibility of a boris. what do you back the possibility ? well, you back the possibility? well, you back the possibility? well, you know i kind of get this headune you know i kind of get this headline for team ricci. boris is now a real threat for team keir. he's the only. yes and i think for the tories, he may well be the only way that they're going to win an election. you know, the case that the tories have made a terrible mistake getting rid of this guy. no think he had to go at that point? i he really did have to go. i think it was it was it wasn't done lightly. and i think partygate he basically boxed corner is boxed himself into a corner is the instrument of his own downfall comeback. downfall but a comeback. i wouldn't off but never wouldn't write it off but never write boris off. i it's write boris off. i think it's the conclusion. and then the best conclusion. and then finally , exclusive face that finally, exclusive face that 3,000,000,000 million mini tanks won't ever be on track. what's this all about, martin? well, this all about, martin? well, this interesting one. this this is an interesting one. this is this is a project called is a this is a project called ajax, which these mini tanks. ajax, which is these mini tanks.

and originally this and this originally this originally started back in 2017. it's taken all this time for these takes two to be delivered to the mod. they've been put into trial and 300 troops who tried them out was shaken about. so badly by these tanks that they've had to go in for hospital care. so know it's one of those examples, one of the many examples i think you see the years of mod sort of projects that either never happen despite , squandering happen despite, squandering billions of pounds or just go wrong. i remember there was a gun a few ago and it did work that never worked and it's just another one of those. and i think it's just, you know, a time where everybody's got to be in the middle of an economic crisis. yeah. if we've got money, can we spend it sensibly? please yeah. martyn please do. yeah. martyn townsend, you much townsend, thank you very much for me on first of forjoining me on my first of a paper here. hope you'll paper review here. i hope you'll come will indeed. thank come back. i will indeed. thank you much. thank you. well you very much. thank you. well now you've the news. now we now you've got the news. now we also your i'm going also want your views. i'm going to you the r news, but i'm to give you the r news, but i'm also going to be inviting for your views. got this

your views. and we've got this new in broadcasting new concept in broadcasting called people's, called the people's, where essentially that essentially we feel that political take to political shows too take long to kind at you as an kind of preach at you as an audience that don't get audience and that you don't get to have your say. and so therefore, we thought we would go week and go to sheffield this week and speak some people about speak to some people there about what are about what their views are about what's the news. but what's going in the news. but equally, some reaction equally, for some reaction to some ministerial some of our ministerial interviews and want to interviews and if you want to apply for the people's panel, you to gbnews.uk forward you can go to gbnews.uk forward slash panel. we've got tom harwood, i hope, in sheffield. tom, can you hear me? who have you there ? i can indeed. camilla you there? i can indeed. camilla we are here in sheffield specifically at the la piazza caffe . and if we just walk in, caffe. and if we just walk in, we do have a people's panel waiting for us inside. they've got a of things they want to ask the politicians on the show today. we'll just inside. now, first, let's have a quick chat to rebecca, who owns la piazza cafe. thank you for having us. first of all, how's business going? it's going all right. apart from the energy bills and the which have tripled over the year and the cost of living.

yeah, no , really tough time, no yeah, no, really tough time, no doubt. but it is a beautiful cafe that you've brought us to. thank you much. you so much thank you very much. you so much for let's not waste for hosting us. let's not waste time all now in terms of time at all now in terms of talking to panel, who will talking to our panel, who will be to ask a number of be wanting to ask a number of things from the politicians today, first of all, and what's the biggest issue impacting you ? for myself, it's the small boats coming across with the united . we are an island we are united. we are an island we are not going to be able to fit the amount there are coming over each year. and as i hear that you speak into the previous prime minister of australia easy , doesn't it work ? why can we , doesn't it work? why can we not adopt that same if it ain't broke? you know , and i that's broke? you know, and i that's what i think. i think why we just take control of our borders really, really, really salient issue. let's speak also to john snow. what's the biggest thing that's really on your mind at the moment ?

that's really on your mind at the moment? at that's really on your mind at the moment ? at the that's really on your mind at the moment? at the moment, as small businesses , we've got small businesses, we've got nowhere. and confidence in the markets we don't know what's happening. we need less strong leadership to let us know what's happening. small businesses at the moment are not spending money. they're not working together. there's no bee to be treated as such is being impacted because we don't know what's happening. immigration and the economy, two huge issues. we've also got sam, who's young voter here in sheffield . sam was the biggest sheffield. sam was the biggest issue facing. he the government's failure to act on all levels essentially . i mean, all levels essentially. i mean, we've spoken about immigration there, but the strikes as well. i mean , they're letting public i mean, they're letting public service go into a state of complete disrepair without even attempting to fix it. i mean , attempting to fix it. i mean, you've got the nursing crisis now , and if we've got money now, and if we've got money fund, a proxy war in ukraine, then we should have money to pay nurses more. and it's as simple as that . and the government have as that. and the government have failed to act on all levels really stuff there. now,

finally, let's talk phil. phil what would you want to ask people to ministers? well one want health minister. one person who wants to be a health minister on the show today, what would you want to ask them? the nhs you just all get nhs why you just all get together and have a cross—party consensus on how the nhs can be fixed. no one party can do this because you're not going to be there for longer than i don't know , years at the most. we're know, years at the most. we're talking about 50 years to look after sam when he gets older. why not have a cross—party all agree on something, get it rubberstamped , get it in law, rubberstamped, get it in law, and then that's it's fixed because we've got a thousand diverse city managers in the nhs. now what do we need 8000 diverse city managers , 50% of diverse city managers, 50% of them are on care year over year . that's three junior nurses or three junior doctors at law

level coming to a higher. so it's to me as a layman , it's it's to me as a layman, it's obvious you don't need bureaucrats and people pushing pens to run the hospital you need nurses, doctors and the auxiliary staff . and would auxiliary staff. and would everyone here agree with that. i mean the nhs seems to be a huge, huge issue that's affecting everyone right now . the biggest everyone right now. the biggest solution, what do you want to hear from the politicians ? to be hear from the politicians? to be honest with you, i can't . i mean honest with you, i can't. i mean myself , i honest with you, i can't. i mean myself, i can't complain about the nhs. i had an art attack in april , the pandemic they amazing april, the pandemic they amazing . i have a condition that i have have i've never had an appointment. ms. they have never cancelled me my doctors. if i have phoned on the morning i got to speak to a doctor and then he will decide if i need to him. if ineed will decide if i need to him. if i need to see him, he'll say, come in. so personally i say

that you know, i have a problem with . the nhs, there are some with. the nhs, there are some big issues for globally, globally within the united kingdom. yes, i can see the damage that has been done. well, we will be coming back to all of you after we've heard interviews. but for now, back to you, camilla. and let's look forward to what the politicians have to say. thank you so much for that, tom. interesting to hear actually what people feel outside of the westminster bubble. always a lot of criticism. the political shows only on london and clearly those key concerns up in the north the nhs like there is anywhere some of the statistics on the nhs at the moment are quite staggering . a commons library report the nhs waiting list for the treatment topped 7 million as of september 2022. that's up from just 2 million in 2010. we know that keir starmer's about his solutions for the nhs we're going to be speaking to wes streeting that soon. there's also other statistics to suggest

that people waiting a long time for treatment as well. so that commonly brings up support. a report shows that now 45.2% want a new record high are waiting for over 4 hours for treatment and a this compares to less than 10% in 2011. what's the westminster voting intention right now? well, let's have a look at that, because obviously it's critical to both parties to find out where they are in the polls. well, the latest yougov polling on the fourth and 5th of january puts labour 21 points ahead of the stories . tory, so ahead of the stories. tory, so they're on 46% versus 35. and i suppose the key concern for a number of mps , tories in number of mps, tories in marginal constituent is this nofion marginal constituent is this notion they are going to lose their seats and the nhs is going to be a key that's going to cost them on the doorstep. i think all of polling consistently shows that it's the economy, stupid is . bill clinton's stupid is. bill clinton's adviser, once famously said. and

the nhs that is really affecting people . we're waiting for maria people. we're waiting for maria caulfield to come down the line in millbank. she's going to be with shortly. maria, i think join us now. can you hear me, minister ? i can, yes. good minister? i can, yes. good morning . hello there, minister. morning. hello there, minister. thank you very much for joining us today . you just heard me give us today. you just heard me give all of those statistic about waiting lists. the tories record after 12 years on the nhs is appalling, isn't well? the uk government is any for health care in england . these these are care in england. these these are issues where it's ambulance waiting times or the number beds available are problems across the uk. so where labour run the health service in wales, they've actually got a worse performance in wales. the snp have similar problems in scotland and it's also the case northern ireland. so you know, these are clinical indicators of factors, which means that we're under so much pressure this winter we're seeing a twin democrat, both and flu we're seeing over 50% increase in the number of patients in with flu at the moment that has knock on effect

if beds aren't available for a&e, leads to the long a&e, which leads to the long waits which you describe and a knock on effect on ambulance has been stuck at a&e trying to their patients. so winter is particularly difficult . i know particularly difficult. i know we've seen record of patients need to get bishop but minister just saying that it's across the whole of the uk it doesn't help the tories cause you've been in power for 12 years and the nhs to be in a worse condition . it to be in a worse condition. it was when the labour party left it in 2011 . well, that's my it in 2011. well, that's my point. we are not responsible for health care across, the uk, we're only responsible for health in england. so all political parties , if they want political parties, if they want labour run their health service in wales, snp , scotland are in wales, snp, scotland are facing exactly the same issues. but what all do think in these numbers are a terrible minister, isn't it? but was all numbers know wales are in a worse position than we are and certainly scotland are are probably on par with england and that shows that there's clinical

reasons for why we're facing these pressures. but what we are doing in england is we are creating 7000 more beds by funding social care so that we can get patients of hospital. in december alone , we were able to december alone, we were able to discharge over 8000 patients who had been in hospital waiting to be discharged. we actually knew such perhaps over 90 across england and, over 90 new diagnostic centres . we're diagnostic centres. we're increasing the numbers minister as well. so there's a of factors we are trying to tackle this problem. okay minister, of those 14 new hospital bills that boris johnson had promised, can you tell me where one is newly been built ? yes, i tell me where one is newly been built? yes, i can tell me where one is newly been built ? yes, i can actually say built? yes, i can actually say next door to me in brighton we've had the need to parliament. that's almost finished. the other me at scott, they're going to be staffed their hospital fairly soon their new hospital fairly soon and addition to that, getting and in addition to that, getting and in addition to that, getting a surgical which will be a new surgical hub which will be completed next year. new completed by next year. the new hospital program between and hospital program is between and 2030. so there are some

hospitals that won't have started, but there are some hospitals that are always going to hospitals where to finish and hospitals where work has commenced . so we are work has commenced. so we are serious about building these hospitals, but that's in addition to the over 90 rapid diagnosed centres, again i've got one just on the edge of my constituency at the amex stadium former and they're providing over 2 million new tests that patients can access that traditionally they would have had to go to the hospital for. so there's lots of investment going into the nhs that patients will start to see the difference very safe . but isn't it a will start to see the difference very safe. but isn't it a timing issue minister in the sense that patients don't feel they're seeing difference? and the telegraph reported in the week that only seven hospital on that only seven hospital was on work on seven hospitals, it started out of the you talk started out of the 40. you talk about staffing , we've got the about staffing, we've got the nhs now being crippled by strikes. what's position on strikes. what's your position on the strikes? as a former nurse, they safety in they put public safety in dangen they put public safety in danger, don't they . see the danger, don't they. see the secretary state is meeting specifically with health unions

tomorrow to discuss the pay and conditions . obviously we don't. conditions. obviously we don't. what strike to go ahead they do impact patient care. they do make it difficult for patients to get appointments. and that's why the secretary of state is meeting with to talk, both pay and working conditions to see if we can make some progress on that. but the reality is record levels in investment into the nhs and we want to make sure that that's going to frontline service . so patients feel that service. so patients feel that benefit you talk about record levels of investment , but levels of investment, but actually in the week rishi sunak's speech on wednesday rolled structural reform of the nhs one up would you pay more money the nhs without reforming it? minister well that's because we're putting money straight into frontline services right now. i about the new hospitals that are being built, the new surgical capacity dealing with the backlog so patients aren't waiting as long as they are at the moment to get surgical

procedures. we've got the new rapid diagnostic centre site . rapid diagnostic centre site. patients can go to a community centre in local area to get things like mri seats, x—rays, where traditionally they would have had to wait for the hospital to send them an appointment. we've got 10,000 more nurses. we've got over 4000 more nurses. we've got over 4000 more doctors. the money is going to frontline services and it will start to make a difference this winter. we're seeing huge numbers of flu, respiratory viruses patients in with covid that make it very, very difficult to see that difference. but we will get that. that's why the prime minister met with health leaders yesterday to see what more we can so that patients can feel can do so that patients can feel benefit investment . i know benefit that investment. i know although that prime ministerial meeting has been described as a talking shop minister, i know you used to be a nurse in the nhs. i got into nhs. i know you got into trouble. i think in 2017 for talking about, scrapping that for inflation price cap on for low inflation price cap on wages . what percentage rise wages. what percentage rise would you give nurses? would you give them the 19? and as a

former nurse, surely you'd be clamouring for that kind of figure ? well, i'm still work as figure? well, i'm still work as a nurse , so my declaration of a nurse, so my declaration of interest, you can check what shifts i do. and if i'm not elected again. i will be returning to full time nurses so no one is more passionate about nursing than me. but we also are in charge of the taxpayers purse strings. and if we were to give a 19% pay rise, that's ove r £10 a 19% pay rise, that's over £10 billion, i think the unions recognise that and they're wanting to discuss with the health secretary tomorrow . so health secretary tomorrow. so i think you know kroger's well i get what you touched on it that ministers start negotiating. well we've got to start negotiations with the unions tomorrow on this year's pay rise and that will be submitted to the independent review body the independent pay review body to they that to see what they think and that will look at things like inflation, staff levels, retention and so, you know, i'm not going to make comment on what what is going to be on the table at those discussions tomorrow. that's secretary tomorrow. that's what secretary of companions of state and companions to discuss . okay. thank you very discuss. okay. thank you very much for that. that's minister

maria caulfield. she's in the health department and she's, as she's pointed out, nurse and she will go back to nursing says if she loses her seat come 2024, well we're going be hearing well we're going to be hearing from streeting for labour's from wes streeting for labour's response the nhs crisis after response to the nhs crisis after this short .

he's the king of breakfast tv and he's back and returning to his throne. this is breakfast and gb news with eamonn holmes

and gb news with eamonn holmes and isabel webster. good morning. it's a it's my favourite time set your loves, eamonn holmes back on gb news breakfast on 9th of january at six. have . six. have. still to come on the camilla tominey show. i'm going to be speaking to labour's wes streeting about his party's answers to the nhs crisis. let's go to sydney to speak to go live to sydney to speak to former australian prime minister tony we'll be going tony abbott and we'll be going back to our people's panel, sheffield out what they sheffield to find out what they think the minister's think about what the minister's have telling have been telling me this morning. but first, here's the news with tatiana sanchez . news with tatiana sanchez. camilla, thank you. good

morning. it's 10:00. camilla, thank you. good morning. it's10:00. i'm tatiana sanchez in the gb newsroom. the prime minister has admitted the nhs is an undeniable , ably under nhs is an undeniable, ably under enormous pressure . rishi sunak enormous pressure. rishi sunak has told bbc's sunday with laura kuenssberg . he has a renewed kuenssberg. he has a renewed sense of confidence and optimism to get to grips with the ongoing crisis within the service. following emergency talks yesterday. his calling on health leaders to take bold and radical action, saying a business as usual mindset won't fix the challenges . the royal college of challenges. the royal college of nursing has warned upcoming strikes will be the biggest ever in the industry if the prime minister does not negotiate on pay - minister does not negotiate on pay . the rcn general secretary pay. the rcn general secretary pat cullen has told rishi sunak's to meet her halfway to ensure the industrial action set for later on this month does not go ahead. the union says it's willing to consider a pay rise of 10% rather than the 19% previously requested . labour has

previously requested. labour has been urged to team up with the scottish national party to block the government's plans for minimum service levels during strikes . as snp's westminster strikes. as snp's westminster has requested. a meeting with sir keir starmer to discuss policy proposals . the bill will policy proposals. the bill will be introduced in parliament in the coming weeks to ensure vital pubuc the coming weeks to ensure vital public services , maintain public services, maintain a bafic public services, maintain a basic function when workers go on strike . russia has bombed on strike. russia has bombed eastern ukraine minutes after ending its self—declared ceasefire in the country. the governor of kharkiv says a man died as a result of russian shelling . president putin shelling. president putin ordered a 36 hour ceasefire in honour of russia's orthodox christmas , which ended at christmas, which ended at midnight last night. ukraine had rejected that truce and shelling continued along the front line . continued along the front line. prince harry has been accused of making the invictus games a target for extremists by revealing in his memoir that he killed 25 taliban fighters in afghanistan. the former head of

the royal navy says the games due to be held in dusseldorf in germany, will now have serious security issues because of the connection to harry. he called the duke very stupid . and one of the duke very stupid. and one of princess diana's most famous dresses is set to go on sale at the sotheby's in new york later this month. the strapless evening dress as well is worth between 66 an d £99,000. diana between 66 and £99,000. diana first wore the dress for an official portraits with the then prince of wales in 1991 . tv prince of wales in 1991. tv online and the abbey plus radio. this is gb news. now it's back to camilla tominey. this is gb news. now it's back to camilla tominey . welcome back to camilla tominey. welcome back to camilla tominey. welcome back to the camilla tominey show . to the camilla tominey show. we've just spoken to maria caulfield, the tory health minister. we're about to speak to wes streeting. we're just getting waiting for him to get ready and we're going to go back

now harwood, who's now to tom harwood, who's in sheffield people's sheffield with all people's panel sheffield with all people's panel, what they panel, to find out what they made maria caulfield. i made of maria caulfield. i thought she wasn't really giving very many straight answers to my fairly straight questions , but i fairly straight questions, but i don't know what they there. don't know what they felt there. tom yes, camilla. i think there's a broad sense of agreement here. let's start off with joss. what did you make of what the minister had to say? i come to believe that their interest is to pour more money down the drain. the system is broken and needs rebuilding . if broken and needs rebuilding. if this was a business, it would be able to go out of business. the nhs foundation does need rebuilding, not just pouring more and more money down the drain and getting it wasted. yeah, that was the important question about whether or not reform was necessary follow reform was necessary to follow all the much more money all of the much more money that's gone in. that's right. it needs structure. yes, it needs the money to bring it bring the structure to pass . but to keep structure to pass. but to keep throwing money at the front line workers, it's not working. they

need to change the middle management. i, i don't blame these nurses at all. the frontline staff. it's just the middle management. and they are the ones that are running this nhs into the ground . and i also nhs into the ground. and i also believe as well that the conservative party are doing this because they eventually want this because they eventually wan t £10 to go and see your want £10 to go and see your doctor , £15 to go. when i was doctor, £15 to go. when i was specialist . they want part specialist. they want part privatised and you see that as a conservative voter? yes well, i'm not a conservative voter. i was a labour voter. i borrow george. i lent my vote to the conservatives to get brexit. then that's where i am now, in the wilderness and reform uk is edging that bit further for me because that is what i believe. i'm phil. phil, you wanted to come in there? yeah i'm a conservative vote, and i don't

believe they want to privatise it . they want to streamline it , it. they want to streamline it, which is what sam just said, is get rid of the middle management. it's them that's running the nhs and they haven't got a clue . you want a doctor got a clue. you want a doctor running the nhs , all the nurses running the nhs, all the nurses you want a form of people. now as a whole, did you think that maria caulfield, the health minister, answered the questions that she was asked? i don't think she i don't think she listened to our questions because there was no relative answer to anything either of us have said. what do you think ? have said. what do you think? yes. she didn't come up with any strategy whatsoever . and this is strategy whatsoever. and this is typical. there is no outline of any kind of semblance of a plan. there's nothing there's absolutely nothing. and we have the same with the rail strikes. they don't they don't want to say what they're going to do. they say, oh, we're going to go to the negotiating table. well, what does that mean? you can what does that mean? you can what with the what you can do with the negotiating table, they won't tell just to tell us. they're just going to let services run into

let public services be run into the ground before do the ground before they do anything so here anything about it. so sense here in sheffield we're not in sheffield that we're not getting clear answers, not getting those clear answers, not letter, least back letter, not yet. at least back to you, camilla . thanks very to you, camilla. thanks very much for that, tom. ministers thank you very much for that, tom. a lot of concern there about part privatisation , which about part privatisation, which is interesting because my next guest, wes streeting shadow health secretary. it seems to be coming up with a plan for labour that involves part privatisation . mr. streeting, isn't this against everything the left believes . morning, camilla. believes. morning, camilla. we're not talking about privatising the nhs, but we all talking about using spare. private sector capacity in the short term to deal with the biggest backlog in the history of the nhs . because at the of the nhs. because at the moment people through the charity system in this country , charity system in this country, the shadow cabinet , fully the shadow cabinet, fully supportive of it, but the problem we've got is we've got to tier system where those who can afford to pay to go private do those who can't are left

waiting longer. going back to your point about principles, i don't think it's a principled position to leave people who can't afford it waiting longer and those who can, being seen faster. so we would use the private sector capacity to bring down the nhs waiting list faster . and as with the nhs patients will have to pay a penny. and the last labour government did it. highly successful. it. it was highly successful. and the same time we made the and at the same time we made the nhs good that use of the nhs so good that use of the private sector because the private sector fell because the nhs was so good, people no longer they had to longer felt they had to go to private and know , we're so private and you know, we're so far situation after far from that situation after nearly 13 of conservative nearly 13 years of conservative government and mr. streeting , government and mr. streeting, how do you think the doctors, unions are going to be reacting to this plan? there's a piece in the mail on sunday today saying that becoming that they're becoming increasingly allies. increasingly military allies. they really the idea they don't really like the idea of contractors coming in of private contractors coming in to the nhs today. of private contractors coming in to the nhs today . well lots of to the nhs today. well lots of doctors do private practise alongside their work in the nhs, which is why the capacities their doctors are saying they'll

give up their private practise and throw all their out since the nhs will be wonderful. but i don't think that's going to happen any time soon. and the point committed. we know that point is committed. we know that whenever proposed, whenever reform is proposed, whatever is, i've whatever that reform is, i've been floating ideas this week around reform to primary care, to improve people's access to gps it's met with gps. it's always met with opposition from somewhere. and if you give up reform if you just give up reform because opposed it, because someone's opposed to it, you anything done. you wouldn't get anything done. so we all having to reform the nhs . i'm so we all having to reform the nhs. i'm afraid the public finance ideas are in such a mess because the conservatives are crushed. the economy and actually poorly managed the economy. for more than a decade now, which means that the money is scarce, public finances are tight , so we is scarce, public finances are tight, so we will is scarce, public finances are tight , so we will invest is scarce, public finances are tight, so we will invest in the nhs straightaway. let's talk about funding because keir starmer , the labour leader, has starmer, the labour leader, has said that you need to have more nurses, more doctors , you need nurses, more doctors, you need reform, you need pay to be increased. but then he said this week that we can't spend our way out of this mess. so how is

labour proposing to spend what is proposing to spend and how is labour proposing to afford all of these reforms to the nhs ? if of these reforms to the nhs? if you don't want to spend any more . mo you don't want to spend any more. mo deliver the biggest expansion of nhs staff training in history, doubung nhs staff training in history, doubling the number of medical school places, 10,000 more nursing and midwifery, clinical training places as well as 5000 more health visitors and double the number of district nurses. so we can do more care in the to community we would pay for that by abolishing the non—dom tax status that allows very wealthy people who make britain their home to pay their taxes elsewhere. of obviously at a much lower level . so we'll deal much lower level. so we'll deal with that anomaly. but this is what expect to see from what you can expect to see from where how much will that where we are. how much will that raise ? well, the tax changes raise? well, the tax changes themselves would raise just over £3 billion. 1.6 billion of which would go to the nhs staff

training programme . and this is training programme. and this is what you can expect to see from labour this year where we are proposing additional spending. we will say how much, why it's needed and where we'll find the money. but the message that care is delivered this week is because the public finances are in a mess. we are not going in such a mess. we are not going to to do everything for to be able to do everything for everyone there are everyone everywhere. there are some things that we would probably like to do but simply won't be able to do as fast as we would because unless we we would like. because unless we get economy again get the economy growing again and it working for and that's we get it working for working people the public working people. the public finances a mess. finances are going to be a mess. and we don't want to do is and what we don't want to do is do the conservatives have do what the conservatives have doneis do what the conservatives have done is hike taxes on done is just hike up taxes on working the tax burdens working people. the tax burdens already in years already is highest in 70 years and that's why we've got to get the economy growing again so that we invest in all people that we can invest in all people without hitting people with more spending . well, we're having to spending. well, we're having to make difficult choices around spending , as make difficult choices around spending, as i make difficult choices around spending , as i say, where we spending, as i say, where we choose to invest more because it helps to deal with fundamental problems . well, then take the

problems. well, then take the sticking plaster pipes, concerts . he's had to show how much it costs, money comes costs, where the money comes from, what the impact would from, and what the impact would be. said very clearly be. but keir said very clearly this we are not going to this week, we are not going to be get the big be able to get the big government chequebook out for everything economy everything because the economy is mess. and we're is in such a mess. and we're honest about and want honest about that. and i want people know the next election people to know the next election when they pick up their manifest so that the promises they read when they pick up their manifest so there the promises they read when they pick up their manifest so there are promises they read when they pick up their manifest so there are promisesthey read when they pick up their manifest so there are promises to y read when they pick up their manifest so there are promises to a read when they pick up their manifest so there are promises to a well in there are promises to a well thought promises that thought through promises that we can , promises the can keep, promises that the country afford . that will country can afford. that will mean some difficult choices . and mean some difficult choices. and believe a member the believe me, as a member of the shadow are plenty shadow cabinet, there are plenty of when starmer, of times when keir starmer, rachel to me rachel reeves say no to me because they've got other choices to make, because the pubuc choices to make, because the public finances are in such a mess. and i understand that we won't going to no to won't be going to say no to nurses when they demand 19% pay rises. how much would you give nurses? mr. streeting ? well, i'm nurses? mr. streeting? well, i'm afraid i did have to say to the nurses. however much i totally sympathise with their pay claim, we would i would cut up on all honesty to say if i was in

government today, i'd be able to give the 19. but we did say we would sit down and negotiate. i think that's what the government should do. so disappointed about before . well, if before christmas. well, if i were the health secretary , i were the health secretary, i wouldn't be negotiating live on camilla either. and i'm not going to do that. it's a shadow house, but we would willing house, but we would be willing to we would be able to negotiate. we would be able to negotiate. we would be able to negotiate. we would be able to negotiate pay. i think to negotiate on pay. i think pat cullen, who leads the royal college of nursing, offered to actually off the strike actually call off the strike action before christmas if the government would only sit down and talk about pay. you've got nothing lose and you're nothing to lose and you're giving me a figure. nothing to lose and you're giving me a figure . just give me giving me a figure. just give me a figure. the criticism of that soundeeis a figure. the criticism of that soundbite is no substance . so soundbite is no substance. so come on, give me a figure. how many percentage points rise? would you give to nurses in their pay packet? it's a simple question . well, i think i think question. well, i think i think i think i'd lose my job if i gave you a figure live on air. camilla, i think it said very clearly this morning that we don't expect the government to negotiate live on air to and pluck figures of the air. we pluck figures out of the air. we do them down, to

do expect them to sit down, to negotiate. i do understand the pressure that nurses are under. the junior doctors under. the junior doctors are under. i have , i going have to say, if i were going into those negotiations , my into those negotiations, my focus on the lower paid focus would be on the lower paid staff in nhs, on the lower staff in the nhs, on the lower paper and the poorly paid nurses and the junior doctors . paper and the poorly paid nurses and the junior doctors. i do understand why in the middle of a cost of living crisis they are really feeling the pinch and we've see this in the we've got to see this in the context of retention to lots of people are leaving the health service paid jobs service for better paid jobs elsewhere we afford to elsewhere. we can't afford to lose them. we've got take lose them. we've got to take that account well . why that into account as well. why did msp support did labour msp support scotland's moves to allow children to self identify as a different gender? and that move, as you know, mr. streeting, has effectively resulted in biological men with their genhaua biological men with their genitalia intact being able to go into women's spaces simply on the say so that they've changed genden the say so that they've changed gender. why did labour msp support that, do you think ? support that, do you think? well, we wanted it. obviously it's an issue for the scottish parliament, but we wanted the

age of which people could legally change their gender to actually be set higher. and we put amendments to the bill to that effect . i think we would that effect. i think we would probably take a different approach in england, but since scotland has gone down this route, i think we can now look and see how it works, learn from that experience because , you that experience because, you know, i think that you know, there are clearly problems with there are clearly problems with the way that the process does work as it stands today, i know that there are lots of that there are also lots of people who are anxious about how any to change people's any system to change people's gender might be subject to abuse . we're alive to those concerns . we're alive to those concerns . we would want to tread carefully on this issue, treat people with the dignity and respect that they deserve . i respect that they deserve. i think in the latest census, nought point 5% of people this country, so not a high proportion but still if you're part of that 0.5% of people who suffer from gender dysphoria, whose gender doesn't match the sexual born. and so you have a pretty torrid time of it in terms of discrimination that's just straight abuse, mental ill health. got to those

health. we've got to treat those people but make people with dignity, but make sure system and isn't sure the system works and isn't subject abuse . so that's the subject to abuse. so that's the approach that labour approach that a labour government take. government will take. final question , mr. streeting. the question, mr. streeting. the labour party's response to prince harry's revelation time for a public . no, we're not for a public. no, we're not republican is in the labour party. historically, we never have been. and that's not to say there aren't some people in the labour party as there are across the rest the country who the rest of the country who might prefer to change the system. but i think the monarchy served it gives served us well. it gives us stability . a i think it is stability. a i think it is something that people look to around the world with a great degree of affection. it brings tourism to the country . and i tourism to the country. and i think , you know, for the best think, you know, for the best and worst reasons in the last yean and worst reasons in the last year, you know, we've seen the monarchy and its finest hour. i think the hate for the worst of reasons, because it involves the loss of a dearly beloved queen elizabeth ii, but also in response to her passing , we saw

response to her passing, we saw millions of people taking to the streets to show the warmth and affection not just to her late majesty the queen, but to the royal family and to the monarchy . and that's a system we don't plan to change. and i don't see any great appetite there in the country a to a republic country for a move to a republic . mr. streeting, i'm going to put you down into team windsor in that case. thank you very, very much for joining in that case. thank you very, very much forjoining me in that case. thank you very, very much for joining me this morning . well that was the morning. well that was the shadow health secretary there talking about the nhs and its crisis as another crisis of course facing the uk . and that's course facing the uk. and that's the migrant crisis going to bnngin the migrant crisis going to bring in tony abbott now. he was australian pm from 2013 to 15. let me just give you a statistic here that sums up abbott approach to the migrant crisis in america. in australia in the first year of his term of office in 2013, there were 20,000 migrants entering australia illegally by boat . by the end of illegally by boat. by the end of his term in 2015, there was zero illegal migrant entries by boat

. that's quite a statistic, mr. abbott. how on earth did you achieve it ? well we basically achieve it? well we basically decided that the boats were going to stop because those boats coming at that rate and people entering our country illegally at that rate amounts to a peaceful invasion and no sovereign country can tolerate its borders being violated by people who just get on boats , people who just get on boats, land on your shores , and land on your shores, and basically , if you can get here, basically, if you can get here, you can stay here. so we had to stop that . so we did a number of stop that. so we did a number of things. we reinstituted some howard government's policies, a temporary protection visas offshore processing and turning boats around where it was safe to do so . we also brought in to do so. we also brought in some initiatives of our own. we had a combined command and operate on sovereign borders which ended the i suppose, dysfunction of different parts of government, all doing

different things and too many cooks spoiling the broth. we had a news blackout because of announcing every single arrival was effectively shipping news for people smugglers and most importantly , where the people importantly, where the people smugglers scuttled their boats. we gave their passengers unsinkable boats and put them back on the water towards indonesia from whence they'd come. so we had a very determined and very clear set of policies . i can't say they were policies. i can't say they were popular policies. there were lots of claims that these would be against human rights. some even said they were against international law, but we were absolute , only determined to absolute, only determined to stop the people smuggling trade , to stop the deaths at sea , to , to stop the deaths at sea, to keep our country secure and sovereign . and the only way you sovereign. and the only way you can do that is by keeping control of your borders when you talk about the lack of popularity of the policy there.

mr. abbott, my understanding is, is that subsequent to you being in power, labour then obviously took over, tried to reverse it initially , but now these initially, but now these measures remain in place and presumably they're all now no migrant arrivals by boat in australia. is that still the case ? that is still the case . case? that is still the case. there was a brief flurry of activity where people smugglers tried to test the resolve of the new labour government. but to its credit, thus far at least the new labour government has maintained the former coalition governments policies. but but these policies were bitterly opposed by the labour party when we first put them forward they were very heavily criticised from many, many different quarters while we were actually doing them. but once they worked they suddenly became quite popular and were embraced by the labour party. in the end this is one one of those situations is

where success creates popularity and because the policy succeeds , they were widely adopted and i certainly think there's a lesson there and a potential model for other countries such as the united kingdom, that have got a problem with illegal arrivals by boat. problem with illegal arrivals by boat . what do you think has gone boat. what do you think has gone wrong with the uk's policy then , mr. abbott? i mean, you'll be aware of the legal challenges that have taken place. do you think perhaps former home secretary priti patel was a bit short sighted that she didn't predict that this would be challenged the courts ? well, challenged in the courts? well, if you've got a problem with the activist lawyers bringing legal actions to try to frustrate the policy of the government, well , policy of the government, well, you've simply got to change the law. now, my understanding is that there's no reason why the uk parliament couldn't change the law to remove the jurist fiction of the european court

that prevented the removal of boat people to rwanda. no reason why the law couldn't be changed. and certainly a successive governments in australia confronted with active lawfare against the government's policy to keep our borders safe, we simply changed the law and that's what you've got to do. where the law isn't working . i where the law isn't working. i just want to move on to another subject now. if you don't mind, mr. abbott, because i remember the last time we spoke, i think i covered a tour of australia by william and kate. it was when they brought little prince george and george along from memory. and you australian then what you were australian pm then what do of some of the do you make of some of the revelations come out revelations that have come out into papers now following into the papers now following the spanish publication of spare prince harry's autobiography? i know you know both of these princes. what's your reaction to it . well, camilla, i don't it. well, camilla, i don't really want to get into a running commentary on anything that prince harry has said . i

that prince harry has said. i just make the general observation that you shouldn't dump on your family. i know there are all sorts of issues inside families , but the last inside families, but the last thing anyone should do is publicly dump on their own family . and that's speculation family. and that's speculation in here, mr. abbott, that it might lead to calls for a republic not least in the uk, perhaps not because popularity for the monarchy remains about 6040, but over in countries like australia, where obviously there is a flirtation with the idea of dispensing with the royals, do you think that might strengthen the case or weaken it . you think that might strengthen the case or weaken it. i think there's no doubt that whenever a sort of a soap opera quality afflicts the royal family that tends to detract from the lustre of the monarchy. but in the end, it's the office, not the office

holder that counts . let's not holder that counts. let's not forget that . king charles, forget that. king charles, prince william have appeared to carry themselves in an exemplary fashion through this time . they fashion through this time. they have been quite supremely indifferent. if you like, to the kind of things that are being said and look , if you've got said and look, if you've got nothing good to say , say nothing good to say, say nothing, that's a pretty good rule , isn't it? now, i should rule, isn't it? now, i should also say that whatever what whatever the issues with prince harry and his memoirs and his interviews , i think that the interviews, i think that the death of the queen last year and the ascension of the king has been a reminder of the importance of the monarchy and how the monarchy contributes to stability and continuity in government , and how the monarchy government, and how the monarchy adds almost a spiritual dimension to our public life . it dimension to our public life. it adds an element of ceremony and

pageantry to our public life. it keeps one important part of our pubuc keeps one important part of our public life free of the taint of party politics. and i think this is the great strength of the monarchy. and this is why i hope the monarchy that we share with you endures forever . mr. you endures forever. mr. corbett, while i've got you, i'd like to talk to you very briefly about foreign policy as well. china russia, news of a meeting between putin and jinping . between putin and jinping. obviously, your closer to that territory than we are in the uk. what are your feelings about the ongoing war in ukraine? putin's behaviour? first of all, can you envisage any kind of ceasefire there ? look i think there's there? look i think there's really only one good answer and thatis really only one good answer and that is for russia to be driven out of all of the territory. that's its illegally seized from ukraine. it's waged a war of

utmost brutality. it's indiscriminately targeted civilian infrastructure , civilian infrastructure, people's homes. it it has killed civilians mercilessly. it's committed war, crime after war crime . there's only one satisfy crime. there's only one satisfy factory solution to this. and thatis factory solution to this. and that is the complete expulsion of russian forces from the territory of ukraine. and if we don't get that now, that will embolden dictators everywhere, including china's red emperor , including china's red emperor, who obviously has cast covetous glances on taiwan . and if he glances on taiwan. and if he thinks he can get away with it, i certainly think he would give it a go . the heroic defence of it a go. the heroic defence of the ukrainians and the help that the ukrainians and the help that the ukrainians and the help that the ukrainians have been getting from western countries , from western countries, particularly countries like britain , i suspect are giving xi britain, i suspect are giving xi jinping pause , as in any

jinping pause, as in any ambitions that he might have to take taiwan. and that's that's a very, very good thing . as very, very good thing. as a former prime minister what's your analysis of putin mad, bad, both . well, i think that we've both. well, i think that we've got to take dictators at their word. and when someone like the russian leader says that the collapse of the soviet union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century, when he says that ukraine has no right to exist as an independent country , when he says that it's country, when he says that it's run by palpably false. of course i. i think we have to accept that. as far as he is concerned, he wants to recreate the russia of peter the great. and that means that can never be an independent ukraine and they can never be independent . and baltic never be independent. and baltic states , they can never really be

states, they can never really be independence for georgia and moldova . poland is under deadly moldova. poland is under deadly threat. if he gets his way because these are all territories that for hundreds of years were part of greater russia and of course, most of eastern europe was under the thrall of the soviet union for about three years. so, look, we're going to have to leave. there is no doubt i have massive ambitions. thank you. thank you very , very much indeed for very, very much indeed for joining me in sydney. that was former australian prime minister tony abbott. let's cut back to tom harwood now in sheffield. tom harwood now in sheffield. tom what's the reaction there in the people's of germany ? the people's part of germany? yeah, so many varied questions asked. let's dive straight in. what did we, first of all make of wes streeting, the shadow health secretary on his idea about the nhs ? both, again , about the nhs? both, again, there's no plan, is there ? i there's no plan, is there? i mean there's no strategy in place . he's talking about using place. he's talking about using the private sector. well, that's not a long term solution, is it.

i mean, how is it how is that going to help long term? there is no plan of action for what's going to be paid where there's just oh, well, this is how we're going to deal with it. short term, but no one's got any clue how going to do long how they're going to do it long term. there's clearly just no strategy. streeting strategy. and phil wes streeting wouldn't a number. wouldn't commit to a number. well, i think we should go beyond the nhs now and do about immigration now. we should get tony, have it here and the new york mayor in london, tony, have it on our our side telling our ministers what to do , how to do ministers what to do, how to do it, get out of this stupid and rtc and we don't need it. we're not. we can do make our own rules. so a lot of agreement here with tony abbott. what did you make of what the former prime minister had to say if australia . i agree with every australia. i agree with every word, he actually says because we control all he told them in australia that he was going to control their borders . he did control their borders. he did it. he kept people offshore.

they wouldn't not let them put their feet on australian ground . and just you agree with that ? . and just you agree with that? totally consult the party at the moment is the new labour and there is not a difference between them. they all speak the same rubbish and they don't give a straight answer. it is constantly skirting around the issues , speaking in folk tongues issues, speaking in folk tongues and the people are sick of this . we want a person which will say this is the problem and this is like how we're going to fix it. we need a strong leader such as anyone's stand up and speak on the people's behalf. but since nigel brought us out of the brexit, so i nominate , the brexit, so i nominate, that's what we've got to do. say it and on it a lot of agreement here with tony abbott and a lot of mistrust of the two politicians that were on at the top of the show. and they're skirting perhaps of the big, big questions . back to you, camilla questions. back to you, camilla .thank questions. back to you, camilla . thank you very much for that time . i love that endorsement of

time. i love that endorsement of fellow gb news presenter nigel farage, as would be expected from a tv audience. now after the news we're going to be talking harry and meghan, talking about harry and meghan, of here's of course. but here's the headunes of course. but here's the headlines with tatiana headlines first with tatiana sanchez sanchez . camilla, thank sanchez sanchez. camilla, thank you. this is the latest from the gb newsroom. the prime minister has admitted that the nhs is undeniably under enormous pressure . rishi sunak told , the pressure. rishi sunak told, the bbc, he has a renewed sense of confidence and optimism and to get to grips with the ongoing crisis within the nhs . following crisis within the nhs. following emergency talks yesterday, he's calling on health leaders take bold and radical action, saying a business as usual mindset won't fix the challenges . labour won't fix the challenges. labour has been urged to team up with the scottish national party to defeat the government's plans for minimum service levels dunng for minimum service levels during strikes. the snp's westminster has requested a

meeting with sir keir starmer to discuss a policy proposals. the bill will be introduced in parliament in the coming weeks to ensure vital public services, maintain a basic function during strikes . prince harry has been strikes. prince harry has been accused of making the invictus games a target for extremists by revealing in his memoir that he killed 25 taliban fighters in afghanistan. the former head of the royal navy says the games due to be held in dusseldorf in germany , will now have serious germany, will now have serious security issues because of the connection to harry. he called the duke very stupid . tv online the duke very stupid. tv online and the abc plus radio . this is.

gb news. welcome back to the camilla tominey show. now this is the section i've been most looking forward to. it's called generation gap. i kind of realised probably having debates with my dad . we're on the same with my dad. we're on the same side. ideologically, but because of the age between us, we seem to disagree about quite a lot. so i thought maybe an idea rather than to have these debates between and debates often between left and right to , have between right to, have them between young and old. and i say that with stanley johnson in mind. i hope you don't mind me calling you of generation you that end of the generation gap, sadly. author former conservative mp is joined by imani ayton blm organa eisa. i think we can agree without being impolite that there is a generation gap between, you know , there's an abyss, there's an abyss . all right. well, abyss. all right. well, i wouldn't put it that way, perhaps, but let's discuss harry and meghan, because the polling does show that opinions vary widely depending on how old people are. and older people to

perceive. harry and meghan more negatively, perhaps than younger . standing. i'm going to start with you because you were johnson and that's showing it there look on the screen so you can see how 18 to 24 year olds seem to favour prince harry. much more highly and meghan than, say you're 65 pluses. so the read kind of represents people who don't really like the purple representing people who are fairly positive about them . are fairly positive about them. and that's interesting, isn't it? that is kind a it? i mean, that is kind of a massive generational divide. now, , i wouldn't get my now, stanley, i wouldn't get my side job. no get your side up. but why ? i'm intrigued by your but why? i'm intrigued by your response to all this is you are a member of a family dynasty, so to speak . and wondered to speak. and i just wondered what you felt about people talking about family members like this. your used to being in the public eye. so is your family should be done or not? dufing family should be done or not? during my thought here , i think during my thought here, i think i'm speaking more in sorrow than in anger. that's what the headmaster would say. when you just get up, whack here at school, horace are buried. and i think it is unfortunate what

what has happened . i think that what has happened. i think that something went went wildly wrong and i've obviously been mentioned a of kills of taliban who were killed that i think was a huge a huge and i think that getting that stuff out there about the fight here with our fight credit card fight, i think i remind you more about the fact he was wearing a necklace. yes you know , and then there's then you know, and then there's then a third, third important, i would say , is that i do feel you would say, is that i do feel you mention of, you know, the fact i am a family man. it's probably true. i do have quite a lot of children. i feel very sorry for king charles, obviously, you know, that's the dad and all this. yes. i mean, he may not be the in the book, the target in the book, but nonetheless, it all nonetheless, you can see it all going on. i feel very sorry about that. and my last point is about that. and my last point is a frivolous one. just a totally frivolous one. just i think it does show my generation, i do say to myself, have seen of prince have we seen enough of prince harry's well, have we harry's beard? well, have we

seen edmund prince seen enough, edmund of prince harry together? know harry all together? i know you've been a stalwart you've always been a stalwart supporter, particularly of meghan. this made you meghan. yes. has this made you less supportive or not? no, not at all. so fast that if you wouldn't mind, i'll just make a few points. so i just want to throw out there the commercialisation of the rift was by—product of framing was a by—product of framing things now that seen the things now that we've seen the documentary. so number one was things now that we've seen the doc media|ry. so number one was things now that we've seen the doc media onslaughtrber one was things now that we've seen the doc media onslaughtrbe abuse. as the media onslaught of abuse. number two was lack of number two was the lack of support the royal family support from the royal family pertaining to media abuse and lost racial prejudice within lost of racial prejudice within the the institution. the media and the institution. now, in terms apologies, in now, in terms of apologies, in terms of the whole exposing issue . i terms of the whole exposing issue. i think terms of the whole exposing issue . i think that's natural. issue. i think that's natural. i think when you are silenced for most of your life, that's a natural by—product when you have to suppress feelings, what you often find is they will inevitably make their way to the surface. that's just human nature. and is nature. and when that is compounded by the need to. defend might find defend and explain might find themselves exposing all sorts of truths. truths that can offer clarity and truth, that can help an individual heal. clarity and truth, that can help an individual heal . and an individual heal. and according to neuroscientists such as patrick porter and bobby

banks, the need to overexplain oneself is all derives from childhood trauma and gaslighting. is there a limit to overexplain? i mean, is just here we've got sort of tales of frostbitten penises . we've got frostbitten penises. we've got tales of losing virginity in a kind of with horse woman behind a pub and isn't this a case of two too much infamous fashion? i mean, you must have been cringing at some of it, man. come on. lived experience in fact, i actually felt like it made him more relatable. and i'll just make this point before stanley continues. i think harry's interviews his book spare , whites opportunities for spare, whites opportunities for him as an individual, as a man, as a husband, and as a member of the royal family to take back control of the situation by exposing the truth , defending exposing the truth, defending himself, ultimately himself, and ultimately eventually making amends. he opened up pandora's box in defence so now he has to defence and so now he has to find a way to close this. and i believe him up is his believe him speaking up is his attempt so. stanley well, attempt to do so. stanley well, i think i do perfectly ofsted come from a different

generation. father was there generation. my father was there a partner for five years during the war, but i never, ever heard him mention the war or terror. he really didn't. have you had a couple of crashes . i he really didn't. have you had a couple of crashes. i think he really didn't. have you had a couple of crashes . i think that couple of crashes. i think that for me, it's the perhaps lack of reticence , which is going to be reticence, which is going to be the most upsetting thing about about this . i go, i don't about this. i go, i don't understand that exposure at all. all is the name of the game now. but one feels that this was not really well—judged. no there is a thought. i'm not. i mean , this a thought. i'm not. i mean, this is somebody who here today with me and there's much more about other. but the reason i thought that maybe you explain all this in terms of what's called post—trauma stress. yes. disorder and this is a way of deaung disorder and this is a way of dealing with it. but i'm not alone in this. you've talked about psychology that. yes. are you looking at harry and seeing a mentally healthy man or are you seeing somebody who is really someone ? the really seeing someone? the latter. is no denying that

latter. there is no denying that this is that's been this is someone that's been through certain trauma. again, through a certain trauma. again, the combination the the combination of the aforementioned factors that led to the two parts. so yeah, i think he's contending with a lot. so i, he is dealing with a certain level of trauma that has affected his mental health, but it doesn't negate the fact that he is allowed to defend himself and share lived experience. and share his lived experience. do this is going help his do you this is going to help his mental health in the sense that, you he's come for you know, he's come in for a hell a lot of criticism. he's hell of a lot of criticism. he's been concerned in the past about invasions privacy. invasions into his own privacy. this the this is just open the floodgates. well, i have to say, there millions there has been millions of people been speaking people that have been speaking this couple for years. and as far concerned, i have counted far as concerned, i have counted five as of late. we five at all as of late. so we have oprah's interview , netflix, have oprah's interview, netflix, anderson's , tom's anderson's interview, tom's interview and the book that is five adults versus millions of people, including tom dick and abdul. the five year period vocalising their half baked opinions about the couple. so for there no comparison. for me, there is no comparison. if has an issue them if anyone has an issue them responding, i think they're ultimately just being unreasonable, likely leading with their prejudices or blinded

by prejudice . isn't it by the prejudice. isn't it interesting there isn't interesting that there isn't actually that in the book actually that much in the book on at all? no, there on racism at all? no, there isn't. why think that is? isn't. why do you think that is? i think this is more focussed on harry, to be honest with you. this is his moment to kind of delve into his personal lived experience. and i think, my goodness, we know there's a book i'm looking forward to. i'm really looking forward to. it's a from and it's a book from meghan and hopefully able into hopefully be able to delve into real much supported. real that's very much supported. a lot of the work harry has been involved with before involved with because before he got invictus and got involved with invictus and so he was in very on the so he was in very big on the whole wildlife. wildlife as was then william . these then prince william. these things, i think it's really rather sad that that aspect about his career and harry's importance had been slightly as it were derailed now by this emphasis on the inner harry. i'm not sure any of us need to in our in ourselves to be experts on you seem to be saying he should keep on speaking and certainly what's your view you should up . i think should just shut up. i think it's should just shut up. i think wsfime should just shut up. i think it's time someone said about mr. hadley, appear to silence might

be in order and generally the sibling rivalry and how have you had to deal with sibling rivalry in your own family? how would you do it more? jeb brother. my brother. peter well, brother. brother peter well, that was a problem that was a problem because i ended up in the same form as was at school and i was for years younger. so there was a there was problem. the was perhaps more the problem was perhaps more on his on my side. i his side than i'm on my side. i don't think i really i was talking more about your children, sadly. joe children, actually, sadly. joe bofis children, actually, sadly. joe boris it's been in boris right. oh, it's been in the press sometimes there's a bit rivalry. is it a good bit of rivalry. is it a good thing bad thing? i no idea thing or a bad thing? i no idea at all. i'm sure they all get all will get on foreign. all they will get on foreign. much hope, sir. no of course, you could say you want to be truly cynical about all this. maybe he's right. maybe harry's maybe living out the sheer horror of his time at eton. or, i mean, i'm sure he had a wonderful time at eton, but not to you didn't. final thought to say you didn't. final thought to say you didn't. final thought to a man. let's be honest. i know you're a champion of the couple, if your own siblings couple, but if your own siblings did you'd be did this to you, you'd be devastated, you? no

devastated, wouldn't you? no because on this in because it depends on this in the press. it they do in the press, it depends on the circumstances. again, am circumstances. so, again, if am having to defend myself, then there an issue . they are the there is an issue. they are the ones that ultimately fell to the royal are ones that royal family are the ones that fail that support. so fail to offer that support. so what we're witnessing is the couple defending themselves. so it's not about slagging off. it's not about to bring down the monarchy. it's not about anything. those things. it's simply defending. anything. those things. it's simplto defending. anything. those things. it's simplto defend defending. anything. those things. it's simplto defend the afending. anything. those things. it's simplto defend the quote1g. anything. those things. it's simplto defend the quote unquote want to defend the quote unquote royal family at this point . i royal family at this point. i think they have really done everything they to support everything they can to support harry. what i think. all harry. that's what i think. all right. fair thank you right. fair enough. thank you very stanley johnson and very much, stanley johnson and amal. thank for joining amal. and thank you for joining me for my first ever generation gap. psychodrama. gap. forget psychodrama. thank you. she says you. so far, so good. she says with crossed. now i'm with fingers crossed. now i'm going to two people going be speaking to two people after break. that really after the break. that really did no prince and william very no prince harry and william very well. come back in well. but let's come back in couple of minutes .

welcome back . before we start welcome back. before we start discussing the royals again, let's go to michael portillo , my let's go to michael portillo, my fellow gb news presenter . and fellow gb news presenter. and michael, what's coming up on your show today will come in a first of all, let me say welcome to gb news and congratulations on your first show, which i've enjoyed enormously. and my just remind people that you are right at the beginning of the meghan and harry story. want you to and harry story. i want you to tell about your very earliest tell us about your very earliest contribution to the story, michael, your two kind. i was the person that broke the news michael, your two kind. i was th

had wes streeting on. he didn't get a very good view from your panel get a very good view from your panel, i think a lot of panel, but i think a lot of tories will be thinking why are government spokesman not talking more about reform? surely the time has come for national service reform and. i think we're going to be continuing that theme on the show. coming up, i'll be talking to stephen dorrell, who is a former health secretary, has the latitude to talk about reform . and to talk about reform. and to professor jay murray and thomas , who's been a very outspoken critic of things that are going wrong in the health service. by the won't just talking the way, we won't just talking about life will also be talking about life will also be talking about deaths. also got about deaths. we've also got professor black , who professor sue black, who recently gave a series of absolutely fascinating christmas lectures . she is a forensic lectures. she is a forensic anthropologist . so we're going anthropologist. so we're going to be talking a little bit about death well as life . it sounds death as well as life. it sounds .thank death as well as life. it sounds . thank you very much, michael portillo's on at 11 now. i'm delighted to be joined by ailsa anderson, the queen's former press secretary and ken wolf, princess diana's former bodyguard. thank you so much for joining me on this week of weeks

. let's start with ailsa. actually, now, i'd like to know this, ailsa, when you were press secretary, weren't secretary, why weren't you giving of stories? giving me loads of stories? harry the palace was always harry says the palace was always feeding journalists feeding stories to journalists like camilla in like me. oh, well, camilla in the 13 years i worked in the royal household as the queen's press secretary, there was not one when i briefed one occasion when i briefed against another member of the royal to my own. royal family to promote my own. so afraid as much as you so i'm afraid as much as you would have liked me to spoon fed you all sorts of exclusives that was not my bag. now, she was not my bag. now, as she can't possibly suggesting can't possibly be suggesting that telling some that harry might be telling some fibs this i am just fibs in this book, i am just talking about my own experiences. yeah, experiences. camilla yeah, again, i never happened again, just say i never happened on watch and actually the on my watch and actually the queen wouldn't the queen wouldn't sanction it. the queen wouldn't sanction it. the queen not her members of queen not want her members of staff briefing against people in her family . staff briefing against people in her family. that's just staff briefing against people in her family . that's just not her own family. that's just not on. would not you would on. so you would not you would not come to doing that . okay. not come to doing that. okay. let's in this. let's bring you in on this. i mean, you're reactions. you knew these very well these princes very well when they little. you saw that they were little. you saw that dynamic them . have you dynamic between them. have you been shocked by some the been shocked by some of the revelations? i actually think that, you know, the books bear i

mean, what i've read so far is actually it's rather pitiful because i'm rather saddened by it for him. i'm saddened by it for the royal family that you know, this is an episode , a know, this is an episode, a story that they didn't need . story that they didn't need. and, you know, people talk about revelations and actually what we're hearing is a sort of an airing of his problems publicly that include his father. it includes his brother and other members of the royal family and like any airing of anyone's problems, any any chance of a reconciled seems not to be faded fast, because if you're going to reconcile the problem, you need to do it privately. you don't do it like this. and there are so many things that come out of this. i'm of course i remember them both as very young children and, that was a very and, you know, that was a very pleasant you know it pleasant experience. you know it was to have a was a privilege to have a sibling rivalry from young sibling rivalry from a young age. it i mean, age. well, it was. i mean, i went when harry was three, william six. and william was was five, six. and was always the sort of the court just, you know, the entertainer . and, you know, understandably

, you know, in any sort of there's always going to be sibling rivalry. and william, understandably, was a bit jealous of harry's popularity, but then. but, you know but that was then. but, you know , beyond it overstated that even at that that age of harry, as a five year old, i remember, you know, it was clearly under the knowledge that he was never going to be king. i mean, there's that interesting story that i remember travelling to highgrove one weekend, which we did, and there's diana driving the nanny, the late olga palace referee , seeing this fight on referee, seeing this fight on the back seat and suddenly out of nowhere, harry sort of leans across to william and said so right for you, you know, you'll be king one day and i won't. therefore, can do i want yeah, therefore, i can do i want yeah, that was a six year old. that was a five, six year old. but you've hit something but you've hit on something there harry clearly there because harry clearly feels what he wants. feels he can do what he wants. you're in the royal you're working in the royal household, you get household, ailsa. did you get the impression of this man raging against the machine there seems to be something in him saying that he felt like he was a wheel to william and a spare wheel to william and kate. never got that kate. i never got that impression at all. and actually,

i maybe want to counter that and think if you're not the heir to the throne, maybe that gives you more freedom to live your life. yeah. you know, he wouldn't have been to afghanistan been able to go to afghanistan on two tours if he was the heir to the throne. presumably so i think the think actually it took the pressure a bit while he pressure off him a bit while he was be that second was growing up to be that second son. you know , come out and son. and, you know, come out and what family isn't that rivalry between siblings? know myself between siblings? i know myself . do. but he paints . i'm sure you do. but he paints this picture people like you this picture of people like you having manage complex having to manage these complex relationships , diary clashes , relationships, diary clashes, personality clashes. he paints a picture of charles and indeed william and by association catherine as being cold and unfeeling people that didn't hug . i mean, i appreciate you were staff and not family, but what is that how you found these royals? never and i have to say, ihave royals? never and i have to say, i have been helped by a member of the royal family before female member. you had to tell us which one. absolutely not so i found any member of the royal family other than warm , caring, family other than warm, caring,

considerate and helpful. i mean, it was just an honour and a privilege to work in that organisation. i must say that for the staff as well, they must be feeling extraordinarily bruised over all these allegations . and as i said, allegations. and as i said, i couldn't work for a more professional , loyal, honest professional, loyal, honest group of it was a privilege. can lot has been made of this is it a boast ? is it just a statement a boast? is it just a statement of fact that he's killed these 25 taliban fighters? i know you came into the police force as a cadet. i know you sas trained. not sure if you've ever killed anyone can or whether you'd ever tell what do you think are tell me. what do you think are the security implications of what about the taliban? what he said about the taliban? but i think this is probably one of the most aspects of of the most serious aspects of this and you i think this book. and you i don't think we take lightly. we should take this lightly. we've over the last two or we've read over the last two or three a number of leading three days a number of leading military personnel that have actually condemned his actions. and i think it was incredibly foolish because him and his. but i think it does mean let's be quite frank about this. we've already had statements now from

from afghanis, don. and this, you know, the sort the you know, the sort of the popular media now this this has actually gone global . and, you actually gone global. and, you know, was talking at the know, i was talking at the moment ago about, look, what happened to salman rushdie recently. nobody anticipated an attack . so think attack like that. so i think harry and his security, harry now and his security, wherever might be , wherever that might be, seriously needs to reassess his own security. and that of his family, because we live in very dangerous . family, because we live in very dangerous. so to make that statement was an incredibly rude one to make which brings on the question of why he didn't someone really sort of advice him go through this prove this book and identify the areas that were likely to cause him a problem. and that clearly didn't happen. but it was a very, very bad. are you worried about the pubuc bad. are you worried about the public as well, bearing in mind that there's a major royal event in the coronation happening in may? you know, may? well, already, you know, the security arrangements that are well underway and will are well underway and that will now part the problem. now become part of the problem. and it brings into question and then it brings into question , will harry invited to the , will harry be invited to the coronation that? we don't know exactly were. perhaps exactly that there were. perhaps

we but but but you know we won't be but but but you know it will there are serious implications of that statement that seems to me to have now dominated the of the world's media and rightly so. it's put aside, the in aside, you know, the fight in nottingham cottage full of nottingham cottage it's full of put falling dog put aside the falling of the dog boat. you know, we can boat. i mean, you know, we can laugh at that, but the actual implication surrounding the fact that he shot 25 afghan, whatever is that was a huge mistake on his part. and also briefly, ken , before i come back to you. ailsa, you the arrangements around princess diana's funeral in 1997 reflecting on it, do you think it was wrong that those princes walk behind that coffin ? well, i think it was very it was very difficult for harry. but i think what you have to remember here, camilla, is that there was what they call a sense of duty you know, this is of duty here. you know, this is what happens in state funerals for british royal for members of the british royal families is all part of being royal. i personally, it royal. i think personally, it was for a child was probably wrong for a child of age of 13, but was part of that age of 13, but was part of that age of 13, but was part of duty , very difficult as of his duty, very difficult as it may be, but one thing i would

like to say that, you know, there's always been a lot of criticism about his father . you criticism about his father. you know, no doubt in my know, there's no doubt in my mind of being on the other side, as it were, working for the princess that always found the princess that i always found the to prince be extraordinary, to prince be an extraordinary, forgiving man. and one thing that i see now is that he would like to find a way and would wish to find a way to reconcile himself in the papers this morning with that. he was sure he there's no doubt he would be. there's no doubt about very, briefly, about that. very, very briefly, kent. diana's on kent. kent diana's thoughts on this devastating . this should be devastating. well, she be devastated, well, she would be devastated, but herself exactly but diana herself did exactly the thing. so worse yet , i the same thing. so worse yet, i know would she would say , know she would she would say, hey, think you're making hey, look, i think you're making a know, listen, a big mistake. you know, listen, look what i did, elsa . you've look what i did, elsa. you've worked with her professionally. you knew her well. there's been reports in the papers today and yesterday saying this devastated the in her final years. i the queen in her final years. i mean , what do you think she made mean, what do you think she made of all this? i think she would be absolutely what the queen wanted was an institution to go forward. and i have absolutely

no doubt the institution will go forward . this is not a crisis. forward. this is not a crisis. i mean , we've seen an application mean, we've seen an application in 1936 that was a crisis. this is not a crisis. this is a bump in the road. shall we say. but i do think this would have affected the queen horribly. she'd lost her husband, who was her strength and stay. and now she's got awful rift with her grandchildren and her son. i mean the people that you speak to at the palace, i'm sure you still have friends there. do they say that it did adversely affect her as she was in her final weeks and months, do you think? i it would be think? i think it would be something certainly to discussed and you can see whether it was hurt. her lack mobility. and you can see whether it was in the so of her, in the last year or so of her, she was winding down. she was not doing as much as she as she did previously. and i think this family row , public family row family row, public family row was bound to have an effect on her mentally and physically . her mentally and physically. thank you very much, ken wolff . thank you very much, ken wolff. elsa andersen, very grateful for your views this morning. thank your views this morning. thank

you for tuning in to my first ever show. please do tune in next week. thank you very much for having me and have a great weekend .

pulling and welcome to sunday with michael portillo each week at this new time of 11:00 i hope to bring to your sunday good conversation arts and entertainment expert dilemmas and a sense of the ridiculous two. coming up, as the prime minister calls on national health service leaders to be bold and radical in addressing the treatment crisis . tomorrow,