good evening . it's 6 good evening. it's 6 pm. good evening . it's 6 pm. that good evening. it's 6 pm. that means it's time for dewbs& c0 i will be keeping the seat warm for michelle for the next couple of evenings. now, of course, we've just had a very tragic news that the body discovered in the river wa yesterday is in fact that mother nicola fully fact that of mother nicola fully three in a bit weeks after she disappeared it's sad news. disappeared. it's very sad news. we course , be bringing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the course , be bringing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the veryourse , be bringing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the very latest be bringing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the very latest on bringing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the very latest on that.|ing disappeared. it's very sad news. we the very latest on that. but you the very latest on that. but of course, as every evening on dewbs& co we want to get stuck in to the big political questions of the week of the

day. i want to ask you whether you think it's time now for an annual cap on the number of refugees allowed into britain. i think it's pretty clear that the status quo cannot go on as it is . i'm asking this because robert jenrick , the immigration jenrick, the immigration minister, admitted what we minister, has admitted what we all know that many, probably most local authorities are at breaking point in terms of the amount of housing and support they're able to give . those are they're able to give. those are his words. he said parliament should have the power to decide how many seekers should how many asylum seekers should be admitted to britain. but do you even believe that the government can actually do this? they often talk strong , but can they often talk strong, but can they actually back it up ? and they actually back it up? and would even trust the current would you even trust the current bunch of mps in the commons to, well, come up with a figure . let well, come up with a figure. let me you think. it me know what you think. is it time annual cap on the time for an annual cap on the number of refugees to number of refugees allowed to settle in this country? then sadiq has found a new way sadiq khan has found a new way of spending londoners money. the mayor wants all state primary school pupils in london to receive free school meals next

yeah receive free school meals next year. a £130 million scheme paid by, you guessed it, the taxpayer. but of course , the taxpayer. but of course, the hundreds of millions he'll get robbing london drivers will sort that bill out to us. the ulez i'm talking about, of course, but i worry there may be a bit of a moral hazard here. surely the vast majority of parents in london and across the country should able to feed their should be able to feed their children lunch, but perhaps i'm drastically out of touch. perhaps you think we should go the whole hog and offer free school meals for every single child in the land? let me know what you think on that one. and the asbo, it's back. or at least it could labour into it could be if labour get into government. evette government. yes. yvette evette coopen government. yes. yvette evette cooper. shadow home cooper. the shadow home secretary, has pledged to reintroduce a new look , asbo, reintroduce a new look, asbo, that would allow people to arrest those engaging in anti—social behaviour . do you anti—social behaviour. do you think this is necessary to frankly get louts and thugs under control or do you think it's a little sinister and a thought heron? what i do know is that many of our cities and town centres currently feel utterly

lawless and something needs to be done . and lastly, it seems be done. and lastly, it seems like our entire history is under attack. do you agree? it's been revealed that scotland yard have a secret list of contentious statues prone to attacks. guess why? because they have perceived links to war, imperialism, slavery . i want to get your slavery. i want to get your views on that, too. all of that to come tonight on dewbs& co with me, emily carver. but first, let's get the latest news headunes. first, let's get the latest news headlines . emily, thank you and headlines. emily, thank you and good evening to you. well, in the last half hour, lancashire police have confirmed that the body discovered heard in the river wyre yesterday has now been formally identified as that of missing mother of two nicola bulley. the body was found a mile away from where nicola disappeared. three weeks ago. dufing disappeared. three weeks ago. during a morning, dog walk. it was found by members of the public. was found by members of the pubuc.the was found by members of the public. the cause of death has not yet been revealed. a police liaison officer read out a

statement on behalf of nicola's family a short time ago. statement on behalf of nicola's family a short time ago . finally family a short time ago. finally nikki , you are no longer nikki, you are no longer a missing person. you have been found. we can let you rest now. we love you . always have and we love you. always have and always will. we will take it from here . well, in other news from here. well, in other news today , the families of people today, the families of people killed in a shooting spree near plymouth in 2021 have spoken out against the investigation . five against the investigation. five people died, including a three year old girl in a shooting rampage by 22 year old jake davison . today, the inquest jury davison. today, the inquest jury said the victims had been unlawfully killed. the inquest heard how davison legally held a shotgun certificate and had an obsession with firearms. a lawyer for four of the victims families says there's been a catastrophic failure . devon and catastrophic failure. devon and cornwall police, the system has

hopelessly failed us. in particular, the devon and cornwall police force has failed us.the cornwall police force has failed us. the evidence we have heard dunng us. the evidence we have heard during this inquest over the past five weeks is a consistent story of individ failures. breathtaking incompetence and systemic failings within every level of the firearms licencing unit of the travelling cornwall police . well, in these away from police. well, in these away from home, president biden has promised more than $500 million worth of aid to ukraine. after making a surprise trip to its capital today , that comes just capital today, that comes just days before the first anniversary of russia's full scale invasion. mr. zelenskyy said the visit was an extremely important sign of support for all ukrainians. important sign of support for all ukrainians . the us president all ukrainians. the us president said his country would stand with ukraine for as long as it takes. with ukraine for as long as it takes . putin thought ukraine was takes. putin thought ukraine was weak and the west was divided . weak and the west was divided. as you know, mr. president, i

said to in the beginning, he's counting on us, not sticking together. he was counting on an ability to keep nato united is counting on us not to be able to bnngin counting on us not to be able to bring in others on the side of ukraine. he thought he could outlast us. i don't think he's thinking that right now . god thinking that right now. god knows what he's thinking . don't knows what he's thinking. don't think he's thinking that . senior think he's thinking that. senior doctors in england have voted overwhelmingly to strike for 72 hours next month. over pay. the health secretary steve barclay, says he's deeply disappointed by the decision. the british medical association's announcement comes as more than 11,000 healthcare workers from the gmb and unite unions in england and wales are striking today in their canteen during dispute over pay and staffing . dispute over pay and staffing. the most dangerous domestic abuses will be added to the sex offenders register as the home

office fails to treat violence against women. as a national threat. the government plans to invest up to £8.4 million over the next two years to fund specialists , support programmes specialists, support programmes for victims . domestic abuse for victims. domestic abuse affected around 2.4 million people in england and wales in the last year. the home secretary suella braverman says the changes are needed. i'm changing the law to ensure that there's more robust monitoring of perpetrators were introduced . measures to ensure that we will be able to tag a offenders of domestic abuse . and we will of domestic abuse. and we will be also adding offenders of domestic abuse onto the violence and sex offenders register and also all police chiefs and forces around the country will now be put on a fitting to deal with violence against women and girls as a national threat . the girls as a national threat. the foreign secretary has described talks today with the european commission's vice president out over the northern ireland protocol as productive. this comes as number 10 denied

reports. the prime minister's been forced to delay announcing a breakthrough amid a backlash from his own mps. the dup and backbench tories say they won't support a deal which retains oversight from the european court of justice. but the labour leader, sir keir starmer, said there's a real window of opportunity now to move forward . the uk and the eu have obviously edged closer together . the question now is whether the prime minister is strong enough to get it through his own backbenchers . and what i've said backbenchers. and what i've said is on northern ireland, the national interest comes first. so we will put party politics to one side. we will vote with the government if there's a deal to vote for. and so the prime minister doesn't have to rely on his backbenchers . sir keir his backbenchers. sir keir starmer, you're up to date on tv, online, on dab, plus radio with gb news snap back now rather to dips in his emily carver .

carver. yes. welcome to dewbs & co with yes. welcome to dewbs& co with me emily carver. i will be standing in for michel for the next couple of days, so i'll introduce my panel with me until seven. we have daniel moylan, who is a conservative peer in the house lords , and kevin the house of lords, and kevin craig, labour craig, a former labour councillor and the ceo of community actions company l m are now i just very quickly want to get your reaction really to the news that the body while the worst of all possibilities is the body that was found in the river yesterday , is in fact the river yesterday, is in fact the mother nicola bulley . it's mother nicola bulley. it's a terrible tragedy and we can only feel for the family in their loss and i do believe they should be left alone. i think they've had to go through some pretty horrible stuff. i'd only say that we all make mistakes in life, and i'd be i wouldn't want

to be quick to beat up lancashire police. i think they did some things wrong that are fairly obvious, but they probably were doing their best and a lot of, you know , did a and a lot of, you know, did a lot of hard work and i think we should cool and calm in should be cool and calm in assessing performance assessing their performance rather than having any sort of knee jerk reactions. it's tough . the police, too. well, that statement from the family was very much a reminder of how much of a circus the media and public can when it comes to can be when it comes to mysterious cases like this. but in some ways , kevin, the in some ways, kevin, the investigation is only just begun. it's only just begun. and the two things i would say, let's down the line, it let's assume down the line, it turns out there was no third party know, party wrongdoing and, you know, all go to the family, all feelings go to the family, number one, is a to case number one, there is a to case answer for why it took so long to find the body very simply. and secondly, my industry, pubuc and secondly, my industry, public relations. why do lancashire feel the need lancashire police feel the need to intervene with personal details? that to me, watching the very closely was an the story very closely was an example force was under example of the force was under pressure and it buckled and they

can't take that back. now that was a pr mistake and frankly the question of why it took over three weeks for the body to be discovered , it is a very long discovered, it is a very long time indeed. please do let me know your thoughts throughout the show on that, of course, but also on the topics that we are going to cover tonight. please do get in touch with me at or on twitter at gb news is now to kick off the show. i want to know whether you think at home that britain should set an annual cap on how many refugees we are willing to accept . this we are willing to accept. this is because immigration minister robert jenrick has said he will create a safe and legal routes to areas where the uk has a historical or moral obligation . historical or moral obligation. but he said the plans wouldn't allow anyone to apply from anywhere . and he added that many anywhere. and he added that many local authorities are at breaking point with the amount of support they're expected to provide. i think that's been clear for rather a long time , clear for rather a long time, particularly if you speak to

local councillors who essentially have to find the resources day after day to cope with the numbers, whether it's putting up in in in a hotel accommodation, whether it's putting people up in new homes or social housing, etc. the resources are very much being strained , but is a cap the strained, but is a cap the answer? kevin well, i'm very attracted by some elements of the announcement and i think it's a very good idea that parliament talks about it every yeah parliament talks about it every year. last year i finished 17 years as a councillor in london and i know that local authorities are at breaking point, very good to see point, so it's very good to see a government minister acknowledging that and i'm delighted around delighted that he's come around to the idea of safe routes, which has been articulated by the some the labour party for quite some time. think viewers and time. i think viewers and listeners to feel it's okay listeners want to feel it's okay to ask for limits on immigration and asylum without being labelled as racist or extremists . so i think some of this is quite positive. but robert jenrick, the immigration minister , he's made clear that minister, he's made clear that safe and legal routes wouldn't apply to anywhere . and it seems

apply to anywhere. and it seems like the labour party has presented more with the idea that anyone from anywhere could apply. so it's a different policy. it's not suggesting being a bit more picky with where you take people from, where you take people from, where is the labour party have been well wanted safe and legal routes for people to apply from from anywhere . well to a degree from anywhere. well to a degree you're right but the government has not at any stage spoken about safe routes before now. and in my opinion they're only doing that because of the labour situation. labour is not proposing uncontrolled immigration or asylum. i mean, that's very clear. and i think today's is announcements to be welcomed . he's very specific welcomed. he's very specific about countries, afghanistan, colonialism , hong kong places. colonialism, hong kong places. we've got historical background with this mentioned in the piece , daniel, but i think overall it's a good idea that every yean it's a good idea that every year, all employees of all parties are held to account in parliament by their constituent just to what they say on it. daniel i can just imagine how many days of debate this would

take for employees opposition parties, all the different politicians to come up with some kind of magic figure for the amount that britain can cope with. i don't think a figure is possible. i think robert jenrick is trying to hit several targets with one shot in this. one of them is not because of labour pressure, but because there's a logic to it. we have an obugafion logic to it. we have an obligation under the refugee convention to take and consider genuine refugees and look after them . and at the moment, it is them. and at the moment, it is difficult for them from many places to have legal routes for getting into the uk . so some getting into the uk. so some structure needs to be put in place to deal with that. on the other hand, he's trying to say, but that doesn't mean there'll be more refugees than there were before. i think it's hard on the face of it to square those. yeah, we need to see some detail about it, but in general, he's right . the difficulty is that right. the difficulty is that and that's why it should be specific , by the way, because,

specific, by the way, because, you know, refugees coming from it's a sort of countries in the world that are not dangerous to live in. we wouldn't count them as refugees anyway, so we wouldn't have a legal for wouldn't have a legal route for refugees coming from the united states for example. why would you have a legal route for people from canada? people coming from canada? that's not sort of it's not a dangerous place to be. so it will be specific. certain locations . so i think that's locations. so i think that's that must be right. locations. so i think that's that must be right . what really that must be right. what really worries people, think , is in worries people, i think, is in fact, not the refugees . the fact, is not the refugees. the people are coming under real threat . people are threat. the people who are displaced , the people whose displaced, the people whose lives risk . but an awful lives are at risk. but an awful lot of people who appear to be getting here, who are looking for life, simply . and for a better life, simply. and what is they're what they're doing is they're queue because don't queue jumping because we don't keep people out who are looking for a better life. let lots for a better life. we let lots of them in. we allow a lot of immigration into this country for people, for people for skilled people, for people who are going to come and work in really important things like the nhs, carers and things like that. allow these people to that. we allow these people to come upsets come in and what i think upsets people partly is the fact that

these people are queue jumping, which fair to us. which doesn't seem fair to us. and is, as everybody and then there is, as everybody acknowledges , there's acknowledges now, there's tremendous on local tremendous pressure on local authorities and whether or not you put them because they've got to put somewhere decent or to be put somewhere decent or the courts will have a go at you, you end up in you, that means you end up in hotels god knows and hotels and god knows what and it's just tolerable to. it's just not tolerable to. well, i mean, what's so frustrating about the conversation, it was conversation, i think it was last the week before last week or the week before when protest in when that was that protest in knowsley outside the asylum seeker hotel , where asylum seeker hotel, where asylum seekers were staying. was that a lot of the debate in the media and among politicians was about how suella braverman rhetoric about an invasion would be the reason behind this little was said about the fact that local authorities under are under such severe pressure that many people living in communities around this country may well be thinking , this country may well be thinking, well, hang on, there are hundreds of thousands of people who are homeless in this country. there are many who are

at the bottom of the social housing list, the waiting lists waiting for their own accommodation. it's hardly accommodation. and it's hardly surprising there's surprising that there's a resentment brewing. is it ? well, resentment brewing. is it? well, i think we have to be very careful not to condone in any way the actions of the violent thugs who attacked police in thugs who attacked our police in knowsley. i think what's more powerful and more interesting andifs powerful and more interesting and it's the first thing that jacob rees—mogg has said for agesi jacob rees—mogg has said for ages i agreed with today, where he said, you know, the he said, well, you know, the last 13 years, you know, the house and we haven't got a grip on we haven't dealt on housing, we haven't dealt with and mate, you've with it. and yes, mate, you've beenin with it. and yes, mate, you've been in government. okay, you said on this channel, this said it on this channel, this very channel 2 hours ago, hosted by know, people by indeed, you know, by people we i thought, we know well. and i thought, yes, that's why it can breed resentment, frustration, people who've been waiting on the list for years , who perceive they've for years, who perceive they've been queue they want been queue jump, they want to they up. well quite and they get fed up. well quite and you say this is government you could say this is government failure. they haven't ploughed aheadin failure. they haven't ploughed ahead in how much ahead in terms of how much housing they should how housing they should have, how much need . but then it does much we need. but then it does beg the question also , is it

beg the question also, is it possible for a country to build as many houses as we need ? yeah, as many houses as we need? yeah, it is possible to build it and the select committee i chair in the select committee i chair in the house of lords had a report on the obstacles of that that haven't been addressed. it is possible to build more housing, but there are lots and lots of structural problems. they don't all lie with the government. and one of them, of course, is that people don't want housing in their . they don't want their backyard. they don't want new housing in their backyard, even it's, know , for even if it's, you know, for their and grandchildren their children and grandchildren . they they wouldn't . they wouldn't they wouldn't necessarily want it. so they haven't bought that argument . haven't bought that argument. and kevin seems confident when i speak to him privately that that's going to be a labour government. and the way he thinks that, but he thinks from be a labour government and good luck to labour because they can come and us if we come out and tell us if we haven't solved the housing problem, they're to problem, who they're going to annoy housing annoy by solving the housing problem. well, one the problem. well, one of the reasons daniel is that he reasons i like daniel is that he he's done many he's he's actually done many he's done real big jobs in politics

right before losing the house of lords. he very, very lords. he was very, very important in governments. important in london governments. he's there and done that. he's been there and done that. he's been there and done that. he's housing schemes he's got housing schemes through, he's made difference. through, he's made a difference. and labour, they did and yes, labour, if they did have privilege of governing have the privilege of governing after election. they after the next election. so they have unlock housing in this have to unlock housing in this country. a future politician of all say if you try and all sides say if you try and build anywhere the people are build anywhere so the people are normal incomes, they're families can live in the same area up come objectors. it's a come the objectors. it's a nightmare, so nightmare, you know. it's so different. i will say, because a lot of people sitting at home will i don't want will be thinking, i don't want more housing going up regardless of it . who? it's their house. of it. who? it's their house. there are a lot of people in this country who are fed up of development after development. they're fed up of the pressure on infrastructure. be it on the nhs or local transport and whatnot. there are so many pressures , school places, etc, pressures, school places, etc, etc. and constantly local councils are being asked to house, feed , school , transport house, feed, school, transport people who have who have arrived

without them even knowing. this is the reality of being a local councillor. wow is, is that you're told by the home office you're told by the home office you're getting x amount of people the next day they arrive and suddenly they're supposed to fund it all. but on the housing question, which is where you start it, okay, it, it would be the challenge for the next government of whatever party to do and not just talk about do it and not just talk about it. well, there's a of it. okay. well, there's a lot of that government as a whole. that in government as a whole. i mean, of us actually mean, the chances of us actually having cap are probably slim having a cap are probably slim to but i do think it would to none. but i do think it would be it would focus attention on a matter that is. well hugely frustrating, as we can see from the inbox here. christopher has said if the government was serious about illegal immigration , it would have taken immigration, it would have taken the uk out of the all four years ago. a cap is yet another meaningless gimmick floated for pr reasons. i it is pr reasons. i think it is because, as daniel said , we are because, as daniel said, we are part of the un refugee convention and that means that we can't really simply have a

cap on numbers, an arbitrary cap . anyway, peter says to cap immigration need to be able to control the numbers at the moment we have no control over the numbers, so capping is just rhetoric . it seem, daniel, rhetoric. it does seem, daniel, that no one trusts anything the government says on this issue. all labour for that all the labour party, for that matter , politicians, politicians matter, politicians, politicians . i mean, obviously they trust what people in the house of lords say. that's another matter. of course, respect for that. matter. of course, respect for that . but no, it matter. of course, respect for that. but no, it is very difficult out of our hands. i'm surprised that i haven't seen the government actually do something more dramatic. i mean , we're now six weeks on. is it since rishi made his great speech setting out the five goals, one of which was to deal with small boats. but i think it's important to separate these issues anyway. small boats is one thing. genuine refugees is another thing. we should have legal routes for genuine refugees to come here . but of refugees to come here. but of course, the purpose of what we do when they come here is to establish they're genuine refugees . i establish they're genuine refugees. i mean, and establish they're genuine refugees . i mean, and that needs

refugees. i mean, and that needs to be established . and then we to be established. and then we have some responsibility for. no, i think you're right. we don't a responsibility for don't have a responsibility for them not genuine them if they're not genuine refugees. we don't. but refugees. legally, we don't. but because of what's because of the state of what's going on in the channel, it's hard to separate the issues in people's minds. i know because people's minds. i know because people feel like the well, the borders are completely porous at the anyway, thank you the moment. anyway, thank you very for sending in all of very much for sending in all of your comments. lots of you have been telling me will, perhaps what could be. so please what the cap could be. so please do you do keep them coming. do you think there be a cap think there should be a cap on the number asylum seekers the number of asylum seekers britain accommodates every year 7 britain accommodates every year ? coming we're going to be ? coming up, we're going to be talking about the london mayor. he's to free school he's going to give free school meals every primary school meals to every primary school child. should go further, child. but should we go further, perhaps it in nation perhaps and bring it in nation wide ? me know .

all right . welcome back to jus

all right. welcome back to jus and k with me emily carver this evening. now lots of you have been getting in touch. the inbox is very much full on the question of whether we should have a cap, an annual cap on the number of asylum seekers. britain accommodates . we have britain accommodates. we have joyce here , joyce says. these joyce here, joyce says. these people coming across the channel are not asylum seekers. they are in fact illegal immigrants, which is very different. please do not try to mislead us. these people have not applied for asylum. well, once arrive in asylum. well, once you arrive in this can legally this country, you can legally apply asylum . but of course apply for asylum. but of course we daniel was saying, we we do. as daniel was saying, we do differentiate between do need to differentiate between economic migrants and asylum seekers and genuine refugees . as seekers and genuine refugees. as richard says, no need for a cap. rishi is going to stop all the boats. that will be a natural cap. well, richard has faith in the prime minister to do so. he has promised to do that. so the proof will be in the pudding or whether boats continue to whether those boats continue to come channel angela come across the channel angela says the government should have called time on immigration years ago. we have no control and we are at government for

are angry at the government for putting at risk. call putting our safety at risk. call time on all immigration. that sounds bit a little bit sounds a little bit a little bit of authoritarian. angela the and cameron says the question is totally irrelevant. the government will never listen to us if we were 100% in us even if we were 100% in favour . well, there you go. favour. well, there you go. stuff now we're going to be moving on to sadiq khan, who i, i do love to hate . sadiq khan i do love to hate. sadiq khan has searched down the back of his or your sofa and found £130 million school million to provide free school meals school meals for every primary school pupil in london in the next academic year. i don't think there's any surprise that this comes after all the heat he's been taking over the ulez expand in which of course will take £12, out of everyone's £12, 50 out of everyone's pockets if they choose to drive in greater london. anyway, this one off funding will begin in september and help families save about £440 per child . now, some about £440 per child. now, some people have been calling for us to go even further and roll out such a scheme nationwide. let me know what you think. but first i want to know what daniel thinks . well, it's a fantastic distraction , isn't it, from his

distraction, isn't it, from his current difficulties , as you current difficulties, as you rightly say. it's also it's for one year only in an election yean one year only in an election year, because, of course, it'll start september it goes start in september and it goes he elections halfway he has elections halfway through the starting the academic year starting i think in september is probably what it sounds it'll be what it sounds like and it'll be right in the middle there. and he's trying to buy he's basically trying to buy your he's obviously your vote. he's obviously desperate. obviously desperate. he's obviously terribly worried about holding on third term, a third on for a third term, a third term. we have him for 12 term. so we have him for 12 years and obviously even he realises that it's a very, very hard sell. may i just interrupt you just he says it's one you just to say he says it's one year only, but once you give a benefit so very hard to then take it back without seeming well , evil take it back without seeming well, evil and heartless. well he'll just have to seem evil and heartless once he's re—elected. it depends, i suppose, whether he wants a fourth term or not. but at the moment it's for one year only. and he's absolutely clear about that . so i'm so clear about that. so i'm so cards on the table. i don't have children , so i wouldn't actually children, so i wouldn't actually benefit from this. people if i comment it, but i worry about

comment on it, but i worry about it because of the cost. of it not because of the cost. of course there's a cost and it's coming out of our pockets, not because that, but because it because of that, but because it it's further shift the it's the further shift in the balance between responsibility to responsibility for to fit in responsibility for children, between the state and the parent. and i think we have to live in a free society . to live in a free society. parents have to have a sense of responsibility for their own children, and they have to be able to feed them. we give free school meals to people who are entitled to them as a result of their circumstances . i don't see their circumstances. i don't see why they should be given to people who we don't assess as being entitled to them because of their circumstances and i think it really is really worrying, undermining, warning of parental responsibility . of parental responsibility. well, i mean, i understand that argument, but do you, kevin, do you think there is a moral hazard in expecting the state essentially to pay for your children to eat? no, essentially to pay for your children to eat ? no, no, essentially to pay for your children to eat? no, no, i don't. and let me just know what led to us things. first of all, inoficed led to us things. first of all,

i noticed you opened the programme today and which shows how much we listen to the host nation. you said sadiq khan robbing drivers and then you've just said, i love to hate him. what's the problem with siddiq? yeah, yeah . well, i mean, i yeah, yeah. well, i mean, i could mention many things. one of the things, for example, that i despise was his commission for diversity in the public realm, which was essentially gave sadiq khan the right to judge the statues that we have in our capital and deem whether they are diverse and inclusive enough. and i found that ever so slightly orwellian . i also don't slightly orwellian. i also don't like the fact that taxes seem to rise every month on the city. khani rise every month on the city. khan i hate the ulez greater london expansion is totally undemocratic. he has public consultations and then doesn't listen to the answer unless it's the one he wants. i could go on. okay. so i don't like the way he pontificates about trump . well, pontificates about trump. well, i think i know, sadiq. i

pontificates about trump. well, ithink i know, sadiq. i i dealt i think i know, sadiq. i i dealt with him a lot when i was elected in london. he's been a he's a great mayor i think what he's a great mayor i think what he said on trump was fantastic. it was i saw you and daniel enjoying seeing president biden today compared to what we used today compared to what we used to have leading the leader of the free world, sadiq khan, on ulez . i think the free world, sadiq khan, on ulez. i think he's having to listen. and i think there's a big debate there. and i think people are starting to have an impact. and i think they might extend the compensation for that scheme . and i have no issue scheme. and i have no issue there are kids going to bed hungry in the capital as well as elsewhere . this is a very, very elsewhere. this is a very, very progressive move. you are right say, well, how won't it be difficult to take away this free school funding? well you know, let's see how it goes . it's let's see how it goes. it's designed to have a big hit and over the long term policies on free school meals. i agree. you don't want well—off families getting this money. but i had free school meals. they were really important when my family

was poor . and really important when my family was poor. and so i think this is a great thing the mayor has done and he should be applauded for it. so you don't want sorry you don't want well—off families to get this money, but that's the whole point at the moment . they whole point at the moment. they don't. and poorer families do or they get not the money, the free school meals they get the commission and this is giving it to everybody, including millionaires. now, you you just said you don't want to see that happen. do you understand what quite what you're talking about? kevin read the article, kevin when i read the article, yes, have. so the issue is, yes, i have. so the issue is, over the long if you want to do something quickly, sometimes you do risk those who don't need it getting the money. but there's a there's emerging sea going there's an emerging sea going on. are hungry. on. there are kids hungry. i mean, unless like to mean, unless you would like to disagree there are kids who disagree with there are kids who are whose parents can are hungry whose parents can afford to them. and there afford to feed them. and there are some who are hungry whose parents can't do. yeah, but they would free school would get free school meals already. question is, are already. so the question is, are we focusing because what this is aboutis we focusing because what this is about is giving free school meals not to every primary

school kid, but giving free school kid, but giving free school meals to every primary school meals to every primary school kid whose parents can afford them, that is, who are well—off enough. it's a middle class benefit . you understand class benefit. you understand that this this is a middle class benefit. it is not for the poor, the poorer taste, for already. are you really comfortable with that? i mean, you may be you are . you are. what? maybe . maybe you are. what? maybe this islington speaking. this is islington speaking. well, well. islington well, no, i mean well. islington i but thank you for i barely know, but thank you for that. you see what i mean? you don't prefer it to remarks means tested ideal world, but tested in an ideal world, but there's an emergency going. which reacting to which is why he's reacting to emergencies from three kids. because yes, i think i think you townhouse was my theory. oh i think. okay, i think it is in sadiq khan interests to go in the media and say that every child in this great nation's capital is struggling to eat. every family out there is unable to afford to feed their child

lunch because then he can go into the pockets of every londoner , pinch them more taxes. londoner, pinch them more taxes. he says this is going to be paid for by business rates . and then for by business rates. and then peter , great. b, santa claus . peter, great. b, santa claus. and every time you do something like this, people become more and more dependent on the government. and the money doesn't come from anywhere. it comes from taxpayer . well, comes from the taxpayer. well, this measure comes from this specific measure comes from a surplus in business rates. and the way i think in all due to fairness, did you characterise it kind of some pantomime villain hopping around. you know, i don't think that's particularly fair and i think it tributes a cynicism to him which is his motive. you know, of is not his motive. you know, of course all candidates for mayor and said was was it and daniel said was was it crucial to boris johnson's success in london ? you know, and success in london? you know, and forgive me , but for daniel to forgive me, but for daniel to point out that this is a stunt in the run up to election is probably because he's got experience from experience of seeing that from the working with the other side, working with boris. right? no idea boris. no idea, right? no idea what yes what i'm talking about. yes right. so this is just a stunt.

it's a bribe. well, of the middle class. and this this british guys should stand. why you keep going on about this emergency . but the money is emergency. but the money is going to well—off families. is that how it is ? so one is a one that how it is? so one is a one year set to be specific. one is a one year measure designed to reflect the fact that there are families where children are going hungry who are not the traditional people on the poverty that, know , we poverty line that, you know, we agree that that's happening in london. don't i don't think london. we don't i don't think sadiq saying for one sadiq khan is saying for one moment every child in moment that every child in london hungry. that would be, london is hungry. that would be, i humbly suggest, ridiculous . i humbly suggest, ridiculous. well, i think it's very easy for him to take with one hand and give with another, because some people seem to think that money grows on trees and it doesn't actually. well get recycled around for all of these causes from our pockets, from our tax bills to others . anyway, lots of bills to others. anyway, lots of you have been getting in touch with this, whether we should have school for every have free school meals for every primary across the primary school child across the nation, says . why should nation, valerie says. why should children get any free meals?

families receive family allowance. they should used allowance. they should be used if get free meals, then if they do get free meals, then family allowances should, which is we all sort of at is what we all sort of at approaching conversation . approaching this conversation. and without mentioning that of course, there are many benefits available to parents, stewart says.i available to parents, stewart says. i genuinely do not understand why the taxpayer has to now stump up even more to feed at school. why do parents get child benefit if not to go towards feeding their children again? making that point ? and again? making that point? and who i want to go to now? tim who do i want to go to now? tim says no free school meals, governments want to make us more dependent on so they have more control. more control bit by bit. i do genuine. they feel like there's a bit of truth to that. you know, if you can look like the superhero . yeah, i know like the superhero. yeah, i know it is. it's very much it's the gordon brown view of politics, which many labour politicians have bought into and followed. they grew up in whose shadow they even speak warmly of him, but it was very much the gordon brown thing that the state is really responsible for

everything. and we'll let you get on in the little bit of your private life that we don't want to intervene and intervene in. i mean, i think a lot of middle mean, i do think a lot of middle class would prefer to class people would prefer to have less taxes than welfare. well, school meals are horrible. anyway, i want to . well, that's anyway, i want to. well, that's a good point. school meals are horrible. people in the middle class. i think the beneficiaries of this i own at the moment also socio economic groups in our country have the same priorities and they come to , down you know, and they come to, down you know, health, education, defence and high school meals and yes, children not going hungry is very popular . children not going hungry is very popular. this this policy, by the way . okay. well, we're by the way. okay. well, we're going to have to move on, but please do keep getting what's happening in your view. some of these are very amusing indeed. but coming up, labour again is getting tough with a new and improved. asbo the famous improved. asbo is the famous anti—social order to anti—social behaviour order to the to petty crime .

yes. welcome back to dewbs& co with me, emily carver. let me reintroduce my wonderful panel. daniel hoyland is a conservative peerin daniel hoyland is a conservative peer in the house of lords and kevin craig , former labour kevin craig, former labour councillor and the ceo of communications company p. r and i would . cyclist yes, which is i would. cyclist yes, which is what i found out. so we were getting so many comments on the free school meals. i just want to read out one before we move on to the next topic . darren on to the next topic. darren says yes , let's give free school says yes, let's give free school meals to every child for the next 20 years. throw in breakfast as well. in fact, let's buy lunch for everyone up to the age of 28. yes, well, it does seem like the government and politicians like state con are very willing to splash the cash. but do they remember that it's not their cash to splash? i'm not so sure . anyway, labour i'm not so sure. anyway, labour is continuing to make its pitch to the electorate time with a

familiar idea a toughened up asbo . the anti—social behaviour asbo. the anti—social behaviour order was introduced by tony blair, if you remember, in 1998, to clamp down on petty crime. keir starmer and of cooper's proposed respect sounds a bit nicer, doesn't it? they framed it in a in a in a nicer way, but have stronger enforcement powers though, and if violated , could though, and if violated, could lead to the culprits arrest . lead to the culprits arrest. daniel, i think you're a bit soft on this one, aren't you? think they're a bad idea? i've always thought asbos are really badidea always thought asbos are really bad idea because they're a terribly, say, gordon terribly, as i say, gordon brown, all them. you don't brown, all over them. you don't have to bother proving that somebody has done anything wrong. to bother wrong. you don't need to bother with a trial. you don't need to bother with evidence or anything with a trial. you don't need to botithat. th evidence or anything with a trial. you don't need to botithat. th e\can1ce or anything with a trial. you don't need to botithat. th e\can just r anything with a trial. you don't need to botithat. th e\can just slap'thing like that. you can just slap orders on people and then if they contravene them, you can put jail. i don't what put them in jail. i don't what it say you. it comes at it means to say you. it comes at the power arrest at the the power of arrest at the moment. if somebody breaches in asbo, actually arrest asbo, you can actually arrest them. don't the first one them. so i don't the first one they're very and they're offering very much. and secondly, i is regrettable secondly, i think is regrettable that doing knee that all they're doing is knee jerk doesn't work jerk stuff that doesn't work when should be doing.

jerk stuff that doesn't work vihave should be doing. jerk stuff that doesn't work vihave hope should be doing. jerk stuff that doesn't work vihave hope fromhould be doing. jerk stuff that doesn't work vihave hope from the ld be doing. jerk stuff that doesn't work vihave hope from the labour)ing. i have hope from the labour party with its strong tradition of thinking carefully about social issues would actually come some ideas that come up with some ideas that might forever . body, might work forever. body, including people who are including the people who are committing these. yes, it does , committing these. yes, it does, because they might be diverted from them . it feel like from them. it does feel like essentially a rebrand of something. we've already already had. but i must say, kevin, i've been had the displeasure of walking in the evening around a certain area of london. i won't name where. and it felt lawless . there were groups of essentially yobs, louts , essentially yobs, louts, hooligans, even just standing around, loitering, breaking out into fights. i wouldn't surprised if someone had got seriously harmed . london and seriously harmed. london and other city centres around the country. town centres can feel incredibly scary, frightening places . yeah, and this policy places. yeah, and this policy announcement is partly a response to that. and to reflect that people feel increasingly unsafe. they feel there's an issue about police numbers . they

issue about police numbers. they feel that, you know, lawlessness , lawbreaking is higher than it used to be. and i like this policy and i like what yvette cooper does because the crime in my personal experience, disproportionately affects the poorest . the working class is poorest. the working class is this like the estates i grew up on in lambeth, in south london, where people suffer the most from lawlessness, a lack of respect , and asbos, the from lawlessness, a lack of respect, and asbos, the bigger the big picture is from 1995 to 2010, you know, violent crime, for example, went down by 49. the british crime survey measures this every year. so there is and i'm trying not to make political point. i'll just sound labour does feel very strongly about law and order and how it affects our poorest communities . are you talking communities. are you talking about crime, kevin , or are you about crime, kevin, or are you talking about what you mean what you refer to as lawlessness? because if people commit crimes , normally do is them , what we normally do is them and punish them . yeah asbos are and punish them. yeah asbos are not about crime . they're about

not about crime. they're about what emily was talking about. she went down a street and she sees a bunch of poor kids. they're mostly poor kids standing around in groups. now, is that something poor kid standing there breaking out into fight that you should be in, but that you should want to say, i can go around slapping orders on those people not to stand around in the street because i find it threatening is that in a free society ? well, because that's society? well, because that's what this is about. well just like before you were to go all muddled up, i'm trying to help you clarify your thinking. oh, i know what this is about. it's not about crime. we a not about crime. we have a policy here for dealing with crime. well this is about because. well this won't look, if we don't catch a criminal and convict him, we're not going to catch him with an asbo. so this isn't about that. this is about what call antisocial behaviour. it says it on the can. it's what you call lawlessness. and kevin has talked crime and has talked about crime and lawlessness he acknowledges lawlessness and he acknowledges that different. that they're different. this is about lawlessness that

about lawlessness now often that comes down to people from housing estates hanging around on the streets. is that something that we should be your all happy to put it well, are you kevin? let me stand on. no, no. now i'm going to suggest that possibly i might have more of an affinity with that group than you do. daniel and i might have been one of those kids hanging around in groups on occasion have slapped minus occasion have been slapped minus this, nobody to take them out. nobody talking about slapping . nobody talking about slapping. with the laws. hang on. we got back. people hanging around, not doing anything threatening anybody. but that is an issue over time in this country about the small things that, you know, the small things that, you know, the anti—social behaviour, threatening behaviour , you know, threatening behaviour, you know, throwing litter on the street, a lack of respect for litter. now i got so it has so i feel that this policy strikes a chord with people because people , you know, people because people, you know, this country is a fabulous place and people want to feel safe.

this is not about persecuting young people from hanging around, playing out, being together, but it is about law and order and safety, which is predominantly about young people, isn't it? but i think i think it is predominantly about young people. asbos predominantly given young people, poor young people , poor people, poor young people, poor people, poor young people, poor people, people. that's people, black people. that's okay with that's the target okay with you. that's the target audience . but i'll just clear audience. but i'll just clear up. but does that matter if those groups are. doesn't those groups are. it doesn't matter disproportionately matter. disproportionately represented anti social represented in anti social behaviour does are they disproportionately represent it as receiving asbos and that's why we know that there are i kevin needs to really in his conscience here what the effect of this is he knows that this is recycled recycled nonsense doesn't work and he's doing a job trying to defend it, but it doesn't go on. kevin, i'll give you one more shot. well, i don't need a shop because i think, you know, a neutral person knows that the people in this country are worried about right. are worried about crime. right. and recycled. it's in and it's not recycled. it's in response to escalating crime rates and people not thinking

that the police have got the resources to do their jobs . and resources to do their jobs. and it a party who from it comes from a party who from 95 to 2010 reduced violent crime by 49, said the british crime survey is based on a track record . well, well, there we go record. well, well, there we go . let's let our viewers at home decide whether they think the asbos decide whether they think the asbos should make a comeback. i'm not sure if people believe it will do much good. it might be even might be even worn as be even it might be even worn as a of honour by some a badge of honour by some loughton hooligan eyes. loughton and hooligan eyes. anyway, break, we'll anyway, after the break, we'll reveal figures from reveal which famous figures from britain's are in the britain's history are in the police's contentious police's list of contentious statues in central london . stay statues in central london. stay tuned .

yes. welcome back to dewbs& co with me, emily carver. now we're going to be having a little look at history of the metropolitan police , who have made a list of police, who have made a list of so—called contentious statues in

central london. and whether this is on british history is an attack on british history or whether we're seeing an attack on british history, why are these statues being included in a content just list that requires the police to. well treat them especially and look at them. we've got lots of statues here. statues of winston churchill is included oliver cromwell. oh mountbatten of burma nelson's column and even the cenotaph , which of course is the cenotaph, which of course is the cenotaph, which of course is the centrepiece of many . a the centrepiece of many. a remembrance sunday. now, daniel , this is a pretty well example of how british british history has so contentious and the police are having to draw up lists as well. it's proper that police lists of places that are being or things that are being targeted by these violent left wing characters, what's so unpleasant , though, is unpleasant, though, is participate in this rewriting of thatis participate in this rewriting of that is always determined to cast britain and britain's

history as being evil, that we have always benefit from white privilege, that we should be ashamed of our history , when in ashamed of our history, when in fact, like most countries , fact, like most countries, there's most of what we did . there's most of what we did. like many countries, much of what we did is something to be really proud of . and although really proud of. and although people always make mistakes, there are things you would you would have done better. and this is a very deliberate campaign by people who want to eradicate our history and change the way we see ourselves. and in the course of it depresses and make us miserable, if nothing else. so we should stand up and actually say it's wrong the police checked our own statues . the checked our own statues. the police have made the police have made the mistake not simply of giving a list of places that typical pr disaster, not in not simply by making a list of vulnerable places, which is a perfectly legitimate thing for them to do. you should know in advance, if someone is going to be targeted, but actually adding quotes try and explain why, quotes to try and explain why, as they to believe you

as if they to believe that, you know , gandhi, for example, was know, gandhi, for example, was rude about black people. so why do they have to explain why you just say this statue is under threat? we need to give a special protection? well, i'm sure you remember that in the heat of the black lives matter movement, there were lists being drawn up by people of statues and monuments across the country that should be targeted . so that should be targeted. so i guess it's right for the police to highlight, at least in their own books. of course, this came out because of a freedom of information request, but to highlight which statues need extra protection . yes, but extra protection. yes, but i think it's important that to say, you know, people that i know left and right wing in politics, when they saw winston churchill's statue being defaced by protesters , you know, i was by protesters, you know, i was outraged. okay that that happenedin outraged. okay that that happened in the past by people without that that man we wouldn't all have the freedom to be sitting here tonight and disagreeing with each other. but the reality is, and we have to

be careful sometimes the number of actually to of people who actually want to pull is pull down these statues is a minority in our country, because i think most people appreciate , i think most people appreciate, you know, this fantastic nation is product of its past. my are all from ireland originally. they're all catholics . every they're all catholics. every time i go in and out of parliament for work or politics, i see oliver cromwell up there. you know, i don't want to tear him down. he's part of how we got here. you know, get your torch out, your pitchfork. precisely. you know, history's bigger and think bigger than that. and i think the this is a pr the you know, this is a pr disaster. you are sensible disaster. you are very sensible , man, kevin. but i worry about what? well, what children are being taught in schools . i'm being taught in schools. i'm terrified because i worry about having children . worry i'll be having children. worry i'll be going down to the school every day to complain about what i see on their curriculum because it seems constantly the being taught well that british history is much negative so always is very much negative so always seems to be taught in a negative light . talking about decolonise light. talking about decolonise izing curriculum, which to me

means getting rid of anything written by a white man . all written by a white man. all sorts. the list could go on. i'm terrified about what children are being taught and there's this huge disjunction that exists now between the graduate university graduate middle class types who of course university graduates supply our teaching profession . that's where they profession. that's where they come from. university the university graduate teaching types. and what the vast majority of ordinary people in this country and i think that many parents would be horrified if they realised what johnson says. dangerous nonsense . their says. dangerous nonsense. their children are sometimes being taught and i think it's only going to get worse. but i have no solution for it because i don't know what. apart from saying children should just stop going because it's too going to school because it's too dangerous for that for their upbringing . and that would be upbringing. and that would be a bit dramatic . even even i admit bit dramatic. even even i admit that would be a bad look. see you looking a it but this is apart from that i can't think what is but is this just the

consequence and something we have to accept that in a diverse country multi ethnic more multiracial and with people from every background under the sun that people are going to get upset and offended by what they see or by britain's history or by the history of the person living next to them, and that somehow you need to just say the government or whoever needs to say, well , yes, you might be say, well, yes, you might be offended . so what is important ? offended. so what is important? i inject a slightly different perspective . you too on your perspective. you too on your worries and fears about what your school is like in schools across the country . there there across the country. there there is some great education being delivered over time curriculums, curricula whatever the plural is in latin , they develop and in latin, they develop and change to reflect, evolving . we change to reflect, evolving. we i think sometimes i fear that we over blow the fear . critical over blow the fear. critical teaching of our history because this is a magnificent country. i'm really proud of it in our

journey to be here , some bad journey to be here, some bad things happened and now they're talked about more openly in curriculums than they were 100 years ago. and i fail. i say you're much more sensible than some of the people who are activists in the teaching industry . activists in the teaching industry. industry, you call industry. industry, if you call that teach the teaching profession , they some of them profession, they some of them really do want to infiltrate young minds with marxist nonsense. anyway i must read we've only got what minute? less left, less than a minute left. michelle says all statues will be fine . labour are bringing be fine. labour are bringing back scary asbos. well, there you go. that will stop people attacking our wonderful statues, david says, simply, leave all statues alone. thank you very much. that is all we have time for this evening. i've had the wonderful daniel moylan with me today and kevin maguire with me kevin maguire. kevin craig, that's crazy. sorry no problem. susan, what a terrible finish to a wonderful show. thank you very much . hello. my name's rachel

much. hello. my name's rachel ayres and welcome to your latest weather update from the met office. well, tomorrow is going to be a dry day for many, with a few sunny spells around and still quite mild . and most still quite mild. and most of the settled is due to the settled weather is due to this high pressure that's still around across of england this high pressure that's still arouwales.yss of england this high pressure that's still arouwales. they're of england this high pressure that's still arouwales. they're looking and and wales. they're looking further north. we got some further north. we have got some weather fronts that try push weather fronts that try to push in monday and into in through to monday and into the of tuesday, just the start of tuesday, just bringing us outbreaks of bringing us some outbreaks of rain drizzle to the day rain and drizzle to end the day . be some outbreaks . there will be some outbreaks of light and drizzle mostly of light rain and drizzle mostly over western up slopes as well through evening . otherwise through this evening. otherwise it's to be night, it's going to be a dry night, quite low quite cloudy. those low temperatures are going to be remaining pretty once remaining pretty mild. once again with little to no frost for the start of tuesday. it's going another cloudy start going to be another cloudy start to day tomorrow . little in to the day tomorrow. little in the way of brightness to start the way of brightness to start the day with outbreaks of rain continuing across far north continuing across the far north of scotland and these could be heavy with a freshening heavy at times with a freshening breeze as well. it's going to be fitting pretty cool here in the wind there the cloudy skies wind there with the cloudy skies elsewhere brightness

elsewhere and limited brightness . will quite a mild day . it will be quite a mild day elsewhere with temperatures generally in the generally sticking around in the double . but looking to double figures. but looking to tuesday evening and into the start of wednesday and it's all with this band of rain making its way south and eastwards . and its way south and eastwards. and this marks a change to some slightly air conditions. so slightly cool air conditions. so that rain will make way that rain will make its way southeast was tuesday southeast was through tuesday night the start of night and into the start of wednesday so remaining wednesday. so remaining generally start but generally dry to start but cloudy ahead of this with some rain the rain building in towards the early of wednesday behind early hours of wednesday behind this showers and this so blustery showers and clear spells moving which means we could just see a patchy grass frost to start wednesday here. that rain will to make its way south and east was throughout the start of wednesday bringing some outbreaks of rain . these some outbreaks of rain. these will mostly be light. we could just see the odd moderate one in there as well. behind this, they brightening freshening brightening skies, freshening breeze, some breeze, though, with some showers could wintry over showers to could be wintry over high ground continues through the rest of the week so that we'll some bright spells we'll see some bright spells and some of but some outbreaks of rain. but temperatures cooler .

joining me tonight here on gb news is lee anderson, the new deputy chairman of the conservative party . talk about conservative party. talk about london based snob free. i guess anybody that comes from north of watford and the current state of the party that he's deputy chairman of. we'll talk about ukraine's and really big escalate version of talk today about the possibility of world war iii. yet no one seems to care. well, i got to tell you, i do. we'll talk about that hotel in liverpool more protest took place last friday night. they've been almost unwrapped , sorted. been almost unwrapped, sorted. and me on talking points and joining me on talking points , mursi, an immigrant , mohammed mursi, an immigrant to done to this country, he's done really rather well , involved really rather well, got involved with politics, not with conservative politics, not without a little bit of controversy. he he's got controversy. he thinks he's got a plan to clean it