well, hello there. it's 6:00 michelle dewberry and this is dewbs & co. have you seen the dewbs& co. have you seen the latest news .7 it's only just latest news? it's only just recently happened . take a look recently happened. take a look at this. do you fear getting suspended? no well, vega, that was gary lineker. suspended? no well, vega, that was gary lineker . did you see was gary lineker. did you see his tweets earlier on this week? he was referring to germany in the 19 instances. in response to the 19 instances. in response to the government's plans about how to manage the small budget crisis . well, i'll tell you crisis. well, i'll tell you what, he was absolute adamant that he was going to be presenting much of the day this weekend . but guess what? he is

weekend. but guess what? he is now no longer he's been asked to step back by the bbc. so gary lineker that said that they did edit that figure because that is what you will not be hearing this weekend. well, should it be having it weekends going forward? should the guy be fired? oh not. i want all of your thoughts on that great panel for you tonight. i've got the founder of the free speech union. knows a thing or two union. he knows a thing or two about speech and i've got about free speech and i've got paul embery, the fellow that's been quite outspoken, got himself for it as himself into trouble for it as well. cannot wait to get into all of that. and let's not overshadow fact that rishi overshadow the fact that rishi sunak in paris having a sunak is in paris having a conference with macron and apparently get this about £500 million of your taxpayers money and mine will be sent to the french to try and help the migrant crisis. will it make a blind bit of difference? we'll have all of that and more. but first, let's get ourselves up to speed with tonight's latest headunes.

speed with tonight's latest headlines . michelle, thank you . headlines. michelle, thank you. your top story on gb news this evening, the bbc has reportedly told gary lineker to step back from presenting match of the day until an agreement has been reached on his social media usage. it follows comments he made on twitter criticising the government's newest policy. he likened the language used to that of 1930s germany. in a statement , the broadcaster said, statement, the broadcaster said, we have never said that gary cannot have a view on issues that matter to him , but he that matter to him, but he should keep well away from taking sides on party political issues or political controversy . well, football commentator ian wright has said on twitter that he's told the bbc he won't be joining the saturday show in a move of solidarity with mr. lineker . in move of solidarity with mr. lineker. in other move of solidarity with mr. lineker . in other news, rishi lineker. in other news, rishi sunak has agreed to give france almost half a billion pounds over the next three years in an attempt to end the channel migrant crisis. attempt to end the channel migrant crisis . the prime migrant crisis. the prime minister held talks with french president emmanuel macron in

paris today before announcing the landmark deal, which will see a new detention centre established in france . the joint established in france. the joint news conference followed the first bilateral summit between the two countries in five years. mr. sunak says the new illegal migrant legislation introduced this week supports this new deal . we're announcing a new .we're announcing a new detention centre in northern france , a new command centre france, a new command centre bringing our enforcement teams together in one place for the first time and an extra 500 new officers patrol in french beaches all underpinned by more drones and other surveillance technologies that will help ramp up the interception rate and the legislation the uk has introduced this week supports this because it's designed to break the business model of the criminal gangs and remove the pull factors, bringing them to the channel coast. the french will also contribute significantly to funding with president macron's saying this

isn't simply a deal between france and the uk . i do believe france and the uk. i do believe that's the right way to approach this migrations is a bold space. western beckons european union and not just france and uk have to work closely together in order precisely to dismantle these groups and to be more efficient. regarding this phenomenon and the uk economy grew by 0.3% in january. the latest data from the owners shows a bounce back from the fall seen in december last year. the chancellor says the return to growth proves the economy's more resilient than many had expected ahead of his spring budget on wednesday , he added budget on wednesday, he added there's still a long way to go . there's still a long way to go. there's still a long way to go. the labour leader has discussed his plans to prioritise scottish innovation to boost the economy. sir keir starmer is in glasgow with shadow chancellor rachel reeves. he says scotland's creativity has been held back by

governments at holyrood and westminster. what i want is an economy in scotland that is bursting forward . we have a bursting forward. we have a mission from labour government to have the highest sustained growth in the g7 for scotland and that would take us hugely forward with the jobs of the future, the skills of the future. at the moment the problem we've got is the productive t is low living standards are low start ups in scotland are failing and a greater rate than elsewhere in the uk. this is in a scotland has a great history when it comes to our economy. so we want to turn that around . heavy to turn that around. heavy snowfall left drivers stranded for hours this morning with people now being asked to only travel if necessary . storm travel if necessary. storm lansa travel if necessary. storm larisa the uk overnight causing flights to be suspended and rail services delayed as fallen trees blocked some lines. the met office has yellow warnings for snow and ice in place for parts of the uk over this weekend .

of the uk over this weekend. hamburg police have named the man behind a mass shooting at a jehovah's witness hall in the city as germany national philipp f. at least eight people died include a woman and her unborn baby. include a woman and her unborn baby . police say the include a woman and her unborn baby. police say the gunman acted alone and later took his own life . his motives are still own life. his motives are still unknown . they say the 35 year unknown. they say the 35 year old was a former member of the jehovah's witness community, had no criminal record and possibly suffered from mental illness . suffered from mental illness. and prince edward has been named as the new duke of edinburgh. the title has been granted by his brother, king charles. on the prince's 59th birthday. and who hold that title for his lifetime . his wife, sophie, lifetime. his wife, sophie, becomes the duchess of edinburgh . tv online and tv plus radio. this is gb news not back to do you think .

you think. thanks for that, tatiana. well, i'm michelle dewberry and i'm keeping you company right through until 7:00 tonight. alongside me, the writer , alongside me, the writer, broadcaster and fireman paul embery. and so beyond the director of the free speech union, great evening for you to join me. it's almost like we planned it . you know the drill, planned it. you know the drill, don't you? on dewbs & co it's not don't you? on dewbs& co it's not just about wall street. it's very much about you guys at home. get in touch with me. let me know your thoughts on the days going on. lots happening, i have to say. did you see the news? of course. that's what i'll be leading with tonight. gary . i was just about gary lineker. i was just about to read something, but then i decided actually probably not to take time. so i'll move on. gary lineker lots of you telling me exactly what you think too. gary lineker can't read stuff of lineker can't read stuff out of the language. not tea time the language. is not tea time suitable? so you know, i do suitable? just so you know, i do see comments. hence i was see your comments. hence i was pro i can't read pro and them but i can't read anything out that's not clean.

so and i'll get so keep it clean and i'll get through to as many of your messages possibly can. messages as i possibly can. so gary , have you seen gary lineker, have you seen everything unfold this week? pretty much feels like a lifetime long story lifetime ago now. long story short, in case you've just switched on, you know what switched on, you don't know what i'm of course, the i'm going on of course, the small budget crisis is the is the hot topic for so many people today and has been for a very long time. but gary lineker caused of a storm. he caused a bit of a storm. he tweeted it a few days ago in response to some of this conversation and that there is another huge influx, i'm quoting directly . his tweet here, he directly. his tweet here, he says, would take far fewer refugees than other major european countries. this is just an immeasurably cruel policy directed at the most vulnerable people in a language that is not dissimilar to that used by germany in the thirties. it created quite a big response from loads of people, many of them basically saying that he should be fired from his role on the bbc and that has divided opinions. lots of them. he then responded. gary lineker then responded. gary lineker then responded with another tweet saying , well, it's been an

saying, well, it's been an interesting couple of days . how interesting couple of days. how could ridiculously as could it this ridiculously as proportion to be proportion story seems to be abating and i'm very much looking forward presenting looking forward to presenting much day on saturday. much of the day on saturday. thanks again for all your incredible support. it has been overwhelming . well, that was overwhelming. well, that was yesterday by the way, and he was asked outside his house and regret your tweets . he says, no, regret your tweets. he says, no, he doesn't balls as is the way in life. it moves on, doesn't it? and now the news is broke this week. sorry, this afternoon he will not be on much of the day at all. he's been asked to stand back and it is really divided opinion . i can tell you, divided opinion. i can tell you, john has said, michel, this is great news and if anyone wants to stand in for saturday, i am available. i will charge £300 and travel expenses from north hampton. it's worth saying as well, the ian wright, he said that he will stand down as well this weekend in solidarity with gary lineker . david says, gary lineker. david says, michelle, you are full of

hypocrisy . i michelle, you are full of hypocrisy. i am michelle, you are full of hypocrisy . i am disappointed michelle, you are full of hypocrisy. i am disappointed in you. you are calling for cancel culture. the very thing that you're supposed to be against. i don't know, david. i give my view on it. yeah, i'm simply explaining the story, but the man that will give me his view is toby young, founder of the free speech nation. what do you make all? yeah, well, i'm not make to all? yeah, well, i'm not sure it's a free speech issue yet . he sure it's a free speech issue yet. he hasn't sure it's a free speech issue yet . he hasn't been sure it's a free speech issue yet. he hasn't been fired . oh, yet. he hasn't been fired. oh, what he said in his tweet, he's just been told by the bbc , you just been told by the bbc, you can't come back and present match of the day until we've agreed what your social media use and what the policy governing will be in future. so he hasn't yet been punished, or at least not exactly for what he said . the bbc have simply said said. the bbc have simply said we need to reach an agreement before you come back. now there's a further question about well , what should that there's a further question about well, what should that agreement be? how should to what extent should an employer be able to place the speech of one of their employees or one of their

contractors outside the workplace? and i think that that is a free speech issue. and i think the bbc standard that it wants to impose on gary lineker and what he's been accused of breaching the agreement, he's been accused of breaching , is been accused of breaching, is that if he says something or tweet something that brings the bbc into disrepute , then they're bbc into disrepute, then they're entitled to punish him. that's a breach of their social media use policy . but i think that's breach of their social media use policy. but i think that's in some ways to nebulous, too vague a standard . the free speech a standard. the free speech union, we've certainly come to the defence of plenty of people who've got into trouble for saying something outside the workplace, often on a private social media channel like their private facebook account , which private facebook account, which their brought their employer says has brought their employer says has brought the employer into disrepute and we've defended them. we think that too vague lower that is too vague to lower standard . employers shouldn't be standard. employers shouldn't be able willy nilly place able to just willy nilly place what employees say on the what their employees say on the grounds that it might have brought into disrepute. we brought them into disrepute. we think should be has think the standard should be has it caused the employer financial loss ? that i think is the loss? that i think is the critical question and in this case has what gary lineker has

said. if he says things like this in future when it caused the bbc financial loss and i think may be i mean if people who are right of centre who disagree with him about brexit about mass immigration if they withhold that bbc licence fee as a consequence if they conclude the bbc is full of liberal lefties, my views aren't represented. it's not really an impartial organisation. and for that reason i'm not going to pay the licence fee. then i think the licence fee. then i think the bbc could legitimately place what he says if he wants to stray into this sort of really content, just political territory. but i think it's, it's difficult, nuanced issue it's a difficult, nuanced issue . i think i would . yeah. and i think i would agree what you're saying in agree with what you're saying in terms of if it was a private business, surely there's a business, but surely there's a difference here and that this is business, but surely there's a diverynce here and that this is business, but surely there's a divery publicly and that this is business, but surely there's a divery publicly fundedit this is a very publicly funded organisation that has impartiality , apparently at its impartiality, apparently at its core . so doesn't that make core. so doesn't that make a difference ? well, i mean, you difference? well, i mean, you could say you could say that about other public sector organisations, about civil servants, about police officers

and, you know, even gb news is even though it's not a taxpayer funded news organisation and it still has to abide by various impartiality rules. so would you be happy if gb news wanted to punish you for saying something and what you felt was a purely personal capacity about a particularly contentious issue ? particularly contentious issue? i mean, i think i think the standard be the standard should be that the company, whether a public company, whether it's a public or company, they're or private company, if they're going an employee for going to punish an employee for saying outside saying something outside the workplace, enough to be workplace, it's not enough to be able to show or claim that it's brought the company into disrepute. they have to be able to financial so to show financial loss. so i think the bbc are going to think if the bbc are going to punish gary what he or punish gary for what he said or similar in future, they similar things in future, they need to be able to show that these things are actually causing financial loss, causing the bbc financial loss, not impossible test to meet, not an impossible test to meet, but be interesting see but it'll be interesting to see whether meet that whether this would meet that test. embery think test. paul embery i think i would. i i would would. i mean, i would instinctively defend people's right to voice an expression , right to voice an expression, whether it's in the workplace or beyond the workplace, and instinctively we would want to come to the defence of gary

lineker for so many of the reasons that toby says. i do think we need to recognise that this case is not quite so clear as a case as any other normal case in the workplace, because as you alluded to, michel, the truth is that the bbc is the national broadcaster and it is required by charter to uphold impartiality. required by charter to uphold impartiality . and i think that impartiality. and i think that there's an argument to say that if you are employed by the bbc , if you are employed by the bbc, you're contracted by the bbc , you're contracted by the bbc, particularly in the area of news and current affairs. i think there's a legitimate argument to say, look, we can't have people in news and current affairs going out of peace and declaring particular views on certain contentious topical political issues . i think there's an issues. i think there's an argument probably to say that in terms of news and current affairs and possibly a bit more widely in terms of people who could reasonably be seen as

significant figures within the bbc, even if they're not necessarily in news and current affairs. might be seen affairs. so people might be seen as, know some as, you know, in some way. ambassadors the bbc , ambassadors for the bbc, representatives of bbc , i representatives of the bbc, i think lineker probably falls into that category . okay. he's into that category. okay. he's the man he spoke . he's a tv the man he spoke. he's a tv presenter. match of the day. but nonetheless, when people look at him, when people listen to him, they do understand there's they do understand that there's a strong bbc thread running a real strong bbc thread running through him . so i think there's through him. so i think there's an argument for extending it arguably to, to people like him. i think the difficult which really is i think the bbc have acted do face these acted because they do face these accusations regularly , not accusations regularly, not without justification that they are a very kind of left leaning , certainly culturally liberal institution. i mean, this was something andrew marr said in an interview a few years ago. i mean, he's pretty much a man who's on the liberal left, but he said, look, there's no doubting the bbc is a culturally, culturally liberal institution which doesn't speak for of britain. for a large parts of britain. and the are now

and i guess the bbc are now thinking that that was stop that accusation stuck. and if we don't do something about lineker , then arguably it's just going to reinforce that idea in people's minds, i don't think, to be honest. lineker helps himself particularly because when he came out of his house the next he was very the next day, he was very dismissive, actually, the dismissive, actually, of the controversy well , of controversy and said, well, of course i stand by. but i said, of course i'm not worried about suspension. i that suspension. and i think that probably today. probably upped the stakes today. it cocky, wasn't it? it was a bit cocky, wasn't it? and that was the bbc's end. and in case you've not any of in case you've not seen any of the media today, i mean, the print media today, i mean, look, pressure on. just look, the pressure was on. just hold can you see it's so hold on. can you see it's so this a front page of the this is a front page of the mail. lineker's playing bbc mail. lineker's playing the bbc for fools. that's the mail today. you got the express so well a blast. lineker now will the bbc make him say sorry, you could say that. so the pressure has been on from various different camps. you guys are getting in touch a lots of you are saying, you know, you're quite happy at this news because then you will be able to now go

on and watch the match of the day this weekend. are you telling me that you didn't use to watch previously? because to watch it previously? because he was on bring back des lynam and hansen? what and alan hansen? that's what i say. people are offering say. lots of people are offering up services. i've got to up their services. i've got to say the objections to say where are the objections to his mark writes of centre. why are they objections to his hosted? one of you say that he's anyone criticising or pushing backis anyone criticising or pushing back is it must be right of centre that as i am not you i don't know who he is. i mean, one of us has said that apparently i don't know who it is. lots of celebration here, lots of people asking as well aboutis lots of people asking as well about is there some form of bias here? because my old boss, alan sugar people say, well, he's a bbc presenter , but he's made bbc presenter, but he's made various comments. i remember a comment that he made. he got into a bit of criticism for where he had a black football team and then the black sellers , you know, the sellers of the what i would say fake stuff on the beaches. and he compared the two, but he wasn't fired for

that. so people are saying is there a double standard, the hypocrisy ? well, gary lineker hypocrisy? well, gary lineker hasn't been fired yet either , hasn't been fired yet either, but he is getting at the very least a risk slap. but maybe that's what i'll attribute. so maybe there's not a double standard there. but i agree with the point paul made. one of the reasons is such live wire reasons this is such a live wire for the bbc is because whenever football, for the most part , 75% football, for the most part, 75% of the time, if not more , when of the time, if not more, when a bbc presenter , someone who is bbc presenter, someone who is the face of the bbc , says the face of the bbc, says something on social media, enters the political fray , they enters the political fray, they come at it from the left, and that creates the impression that the bbc has a bias to the left. and the reason, which i think is broadly true , i mean, if there broadly true, i mean, if there were more right of centre people associated with the bbc taking the other side in the immigration debate, for instance , if they were tweeting alongside gary lineker saying this, then what? gary lineker has said wouldn't pose such a threat to the bbc. it would just be of the broad church of

be part of the broad church of opinion within the state broadcaster. but because so much of this stuff, whenever it kind of this stuff, whenever it kind of comes out on twitter or on other social media platforms , other social media platforms, is, is, is expressing a left of centre point of view and that's the point of view that people associate with the bbc . and associate with the bbc. and that's it's difficult for that's why it's difficult for the to preserve their the bbc to preserve their reputation impartiality. reputation for impartiality. and i debate around i think the whole debate around brexit, be threw that into brexit, i'd be threw that into sharp certain degree sharp relief to a certain degree because certainly because i certainly got the impression the that impression from the bbc that inherently always regarded inherently they always regarded brexit as something that was really illegitimate . okay, it's really illegitimate. okay, it's happened. you know , we at happened. but you know, we at the you know, shouldn't the bbc, you know, it shouldn't really happened. and one of really have happened. and one of the stats in the interesting stats was in terms of the question time panel over recent years since brexit, now considering that 52% of the country voted for brexit and only a minority and a distinct minority of panellist in the years that followed on question time, which is of course, the bbc's flagship political debate programme , were people who who programme, were people who who openly supported brexit. i sort

of reduced by an external production company, but nonetheless it goes out on, on the bbc and i just think there's this kind of sense among people that the bbc is very much a kind of inside the m25 organisation, very much. and those of us, and i'm sure we all have at various points of sort of the corridors of television centre will know exactly the sort of people that we're talking about all very nice, but we're quite middle class, all kind of graduates , class, all kind of graduates, mainly sort of london. some of them are in salford and all them are in salford now and all have kind of progressive let's call it liberal world view and however much they might argue that that doesn't filter through the truth in terms of the output , it does. and i think people out there in provincial britain and small, small town britain see that every day through the bbc. i'm bbc man, by the bbc. and i'm a bbc man, by the way. like bbc and support way. i like the bbc and support the i'm on left, but the bbc and i'm on the left, but nonetheless, it's impossible to argue against proposition argue against the proposition that left leaning that it is a left leaning organisation. it plainly is. yeah, is. and i mean, i've

yeah, it is. and i mean, i've done lots and lots of bbc current affairs debate programmes and all the rest and i've always felt that, i've always been like the kind of the token brexiteer. so there's, there's me with a panel of remainers , or there's me kind of remainers, or there's me kind of saying that, i don't know, you should control your borders against among, you know, among a group of people saying, absolutely not. that's kind of racist. and all the rest of it. so, yeah, i've felt so, yeah, i've always felt whenever had on the bbc that whenever i had on the bbc that my perspective definitely my perspective was definitely the minority perspective among the minority perspective among the show. what do you think think's the criticism of the bbc 7 think's the criticism of the bbc ? do you feel it is perhaps biased towards the left ? you biased towards the left? you think that's fair? your thoughts on gary lineker i want them coming in as well. i've got these guys on lineker watch on twitter to see whether or not he tweets anything because gary lineker has blocked me 40. lineker has blocked me on 40. i think he's kind of living his life back once. gary lineker because when i was when i was a kid, so growing up and was kid, so growing up and i was quite obsessed football, quite obsessed about football, he very straight he was always this very straight laced non—penalty very

laced non—penalty score, very respectable , kind of straight respectable, kind of straight down the line kind of guy, and never got involved in anything contentious. he's contentious. but the older he's got, he's kind of got, the more he's kind of become radical. i mean, i'm half expecting him to join the socialist workers party. you never mohican. next never have a mohican. the next time on television, time he pops up on television, it's quite odd and okay, you know, entitled to his know, he's he's entitled to his opinions. course i opinions. of course he is. but i do think there needs to be a debate about to what extent you don't overstate where don't want to overstate where i sent you before we came on air. michel where some young production assistant working on songs is told you songs of praise is told you cannot voice and any political opinion about any issue whatsoever on social media that would be ridiculous. but the anything when comes is would be ridiculous. but the a|sense] when comes is would be ridiculous. but the a|sense of when comes is would be ridiculous. but the a|sense of news/hen comes is would be ridiculous. but the a|sense of news and comes is would be ridiculous. but the a|sense of news and current s is a sense of news and current affairs significant affairs and the significant other within the bbc. other figures within the bbc. perhaps the rules because of the charter requirement in of charter requirement in terms of impartiality be bit impartiality should be a bit difficult to be. one of my view is raises an interesting point, she none of this she says, michel, none of this is anything to with politics. is anything to do with politics. it's about is a boring it's all about is a boring comparison the holocaust is comparison to the holocaust is despicable bull he is an arrogant obnoxious individual

says debbie. i think you make an interesting point now about the actual the content of the message, the comparison . was message, the comparison. was that something that offended you?i that something that offended you? i think debbie , i get the you? i think debbie, i get the vibe there from you that yes, it did. your thoughts keep those coming in. and also, i've got a question for you that you can ponden question for you that you can ponder. so one's asked me, could you paul at some point in you ask paul at some point in your programme whether or not he's happy with the pay deal that's offered the that's been offered to the fireman? try and get to fireman? so we'll try and get to that before the end of that as well before the end of the programme. for get the programme. but for now, get your thoughts coming in because the programme. but for now, get yalso houghts coming in because the programme. but for now, get yalso want|ts coming in because the programme. but for now, get yalso want to coming in because the programme. but for now, get yalso want to take ng in because the programme. but for now, get yalso want to take a] in because the programme. but for now, get yalso want to take a look ecause the programme. but for now, get yalso want to take a look atause i also want to take a look at what's all of this, this what's caused all of this, this plan the government as to plan from the government as to how deal with the how we should deal with the small budget crisis. what is in that, going that, what's been going on in paris today with that summit? what was outcome and what what was the outcome and what are hundreds of millions are these hundreds of millions of pounds that we're going to be sending the sending over to france over the next it's going to be next few years? it's going to be spent a at that .

there's help for households. are you over state pension age? if your weekly income is below £182.60, or £278.70 if you live with a partner, you could be eligible for pension credit, even if you own your home or have savings. it's worth, on average, £3,500 a year and you could get help with heating bills and more, plus up to £900 in cost of living payments.

hello. that i'm michelle dewberry and i'm keeping you company right through until 7:00 tonight. lots and lots of you getting in touch about the situation with gary lineker broke this afternoon that he's been asked by the bbc to step back from presenting match of the day this weekend . and that the day this weekend. and that is, of course, if you're just tuning in, i'm wondering what's going on in response to tweets that he wrote about the government's handling of the small crisis, ian writes , small book crisis, ian writes, he subsequently tweeted as well as said that in solidarity he is not going to present match of the day either. i think that's a little bit ridiculous, by the way, what do you think to that? no, i don't necessarily think he is. i think if you're close minded to someone, i mean, don't forget ian wright gary forget ian wright and gary lineker, think played for lineker, i think played for england a short england together for a short penod england together for a short period other period and have known each other for long time. and if you feel for a long time. and if you feel as a mate or even if you don't feel that, you might, it's been hard by just as a basic

hard done by just as a basic show solidarity. i wouldn't show of solidarity. i wouldn't look that, i'm not look down on that, and i'm not particularly by it, to particularly surprised by it, to be i wouldn't condemn be honest. i wouldn't condemn him. are all for the him. are you all for the solidarity survey? well i'm waiting where alan waiting to see where alan shearer fall. is he shearer is going to fall. is he going express solidarity going to express solidarity this may? to say, see, may? is he going to say, see, this a potential opportunity this is a potential opportunity to over gary's but to take over gary's chair, but just so any bbc producers are just so if any bbc producers are watching, i'm pulling both watching, i'm pulling on both football fans. he's wolves. i'm here. are available fill here. we are available to fill the slot. i won't be cheap. i was just say i am much cheaper than the 1.35 million that you get for a little less. yeah that reopens the negotiation these boys then they go what you can is their politics. i fall argues that of their phobias i use a cheap is a cheap one in say someone's just got in touch and said michelle you're confusing me you've got these sitting me you've got these two sitting in complete wrong chairs . in the complete wrong chairs. yes. and that is one of my it's walking around in the order because normally you're very keen the norm is that keen viewers. the norm is that in they also as in that way aren't they also as well? you much, by well? thank you very much, by the to everyone. let's just the way, to everyone. let's just pointed out the little typo at the bottom of the screen. i'm

working, it changed working, getting it changed as we a look. we speak. let's have a look. gary, family love watching gary, my family love watching yours. show , michelle, a yours. your show, michelle, a yean yours. your show, michelle, a year, good old straight year, a good old straight forward northern last so they getting say getting in touch to say that gary should disappear off our screens forget good shame on the bbc if they keep him but what about the pushback that the people are saying about? well what about cancel culture? because you can't, on the one hand say , you know, don't cancel hand say, you know, don't cancel people for whatever. and then on the other hand, just because someone's either a said something that you don't like or b is somebody that you don't like, all of a sudden jump up and go, yeah, yeah, cancel them, cancel them. because that does make you a bit of a hypocrite, right? if i dare be so bold. anyway, should we get into the details what's kind of caused details of what's kind of caused this storm, if you will, this little storm, if you will, because it's to do with because it's all to do with a small book crisis. you will be aware this week that the government announced their government has announced their plan they can do, or plan as to what they can do, or they reckon that they're going to do if the lawyers have their way, they not succeed. but

way, they might not succeed. but anyway, seems to believe anyway, richie seems to believe in for moment, so that in it for the moment, so that kind it all off. and kind of kicked it all off. and today sunak has been in today rishi sunak has been in paris talking to macron. it's the first time these guys have had summit together had this kind of summit together for years. and now for about five years. and now rishi sunak has offered to hand france nearly half £1,000,000,000 of your money. my money, taxpayers money to try and stop these. but so it'll be broken down over the next three years. and the figure is £479 million. it's going to be spent on things like building a new detention centre in france, helping to deploy extra border patrols, use drones and so on and so far, 4% in the french, by the way, a million is a millions. and they've only managed to stop, apparently 40 odd% people crossing those odd% of people crossing those channels in the first place, turning . there's so many angles turning. there's so many angles that i could go on with this . if that i could go on with this. if you were macron and someone saying to you , you know, i'll saying to you, you know, i'll give you all this money to stop

these people leaving your shores. i get it. i get why you don't hold both hands up and say yes, please. half a billion pounds. it. but why? pounds. i'll take it. but why? what's his motivation for actually stopping people leaving his country ? why would he his country? why would he actually want to do that ? yeah, actually want to do that? yeah, well, suppose that's why the well, i suppose that's why the british will have to british government will have to pay british government will have to pay because he pay him to do it, because he doesn't want them to remain in calais . creating problems for calais. creating problems for the french authorities. he'd much prefer it if they came here for the telling that, you know, these people who've gone to enormous lengths to leave their countries and find a safe haven don't want to stop in france. they want to come here and, you know, what does that tell you about the quality of life in britain? we may think the country is falling apart and going to the but actually going to the dogs, but actually it's more desirable place it's a much more desirable place to turns out if you are to live. turns out if you are if you're a migrant, than france, i mean, i'm slightly i'm slightly worried this policy worried about this policy of paying worried about this policy of paying macron try and police paying macron to try and police his shores and keep why in his own shores and keep why in france. well, first of all, i think it's very difficult for us

to be able to make sure that money is actually being spent on what we're paying for. i mean, how you how do you how do you how do you how do you how do you make that the french navy make sure that the french navy or coastguard or i or the french coastguard or i mean, up french mean, that's up to the french authorities to enforce. you can easily you know, easily imagine them, you know, pocketing on pocketing it, spending it on goolwa and, know. yeah, but goolwa and, you know. yeah, but you that they're you just assume that they're not, you idiots. and if not, you know, idiots. and if you're going to hand this money oven you're going to hand this money over, one would like to think so, as as i've so, albeit as soon as i've started the sentence now i'm thinking, all right. but thinking, yeah, all right. but anyway, going anyway, i'm going to be optimistic. hope that optimistic. one would hope that into you built in into the contract you built in checks balances make sure checks and balances to make sure that actually you're delivering what you would be. what you say you would be. i think the problem is that think the second problem is that should really be trying to should we really be trying to induce country keep people induce a country to keep people within its borders? that to me , within its borders? that to me, it makes me slightly uncomfortable . i mean, i visited uncomfortable. i mean, i visited east berlin back in 87 when the berlin wall still existed . and berlin wall still existed. and as i left east berlin went back to west berlin . they put these to west berlin. they put these the border guards put these big mirrors under the car to make

sure no one was leaving east berlin because it was illegal for people to leave of the soviet bloc. eastern europe, those sorts of totalitarian countries . i don't think it countries. i don't think it should be macron's business, any states business, to try and prevent people leaving their countries. to me, that smacks of totalitarianism, does it? isn't it just basic border controls because you can't have just a one way border control? so yeah, i'm going to control my border, but only on an inward direction. surely if you believe in border controls, it's a two way thing. i do believe in border control and that's why i think the money that sunak agreed to that rishi sunak agreed to give to should actually to france should actually be spent own border spent on boosting our own border defences, boosting our own royal navy and our own coastguard to stop the small boats crossing the channel and entering our territorial waters. what are you doing tonight at to tell doing tonight at to home tell a story? is for the story? and is there for the french try and stop people french to try and stop people leaving their shells? do you agree that perspective, do agree with that perspective, do you , you know, i you think actually, you know, i don't to rude or don't mean to be rude or anything, do you think you anything, but do you think you can actually french to can actually trust the french to deliver because they don't

can actually trust the french to delivia because they don't can actually trust the french to delivia massively|se they don't can actually trust the french to delivia massively good ey don't can actually trust the french to delivia massively good trackn't have a massively good track record of it so far, we record of doing it so far, we just seem to be perhaps for a good money after bad . your good money after bad. your thoughts, please? paul embery know we need to we need to break the business model. that's the that's the crucial thing . i am that's the crucial thing. i am not convinced there's any way to do that other than some sort of offshore processing system . i offshore processing system. i know the government in our in the migration bill are saying, well, no, people won't be able to claim asylum if they arrive by boat. they'll never later be able to claim full citizenship . able to claim full citizenship. i'm a bit uncomfortable with that. i'm a bit uncomfortable with that . i think i'm a bit uncomfortable with that. i think the danger is that you within that net potentially a number of people who do have genuine claims. i mean, we have to accept that we have to have an honest debate and say that a number of them are not genuine asylum seekers, they are economic of economic migrants, but some of them genuine asylum them will be genuine asylum seekers. i'm uncomfortable seekers. and i'm uncomfortable with saying a nation, if with are saying as a nation, if you get here, not even you get here, we're not even going to judge your claim. look at the merits of it. you know, we're to send you to

we're going to send you to another country and that's it. you're never going be able to you're never going to be able to claim citizenship later. i claim the citizenship later. i think sort offshore think some sort of offshore system in of processing is system in terms of processing is not and not unfair not unreasonable and not unfair . and then giving the individual, if they're asylum claim, the claim, is granted the opportunity to come to this country. i do think there's an argument that actually argument to say that actually the in terms of the asylum system, in terms of the asylum system, in terms of the applications process lax. the applications process is lax. and me that we as a and it seems to me that we as a as a country in europe way through more claims through far, far more claims than many other countries do, they be more rigorous in they seem to be more rigorous in terms of crisis area that terms of the crisis area that they apply to but i do they apply to it. but what i do know is the current situation of having over the course of a yean having over the course of a year, thousands, tens of thousands of what are mainly young men arriving on our shores, often undocumented , is shores, often undocumented, is simply not sustainable. now you can be my view. you can be the most pro—immigration person in the world, and i am pro immigration as long as it's managed properly have managed properly but still have a problem with that. still have a problem with that. still have a problem with that. still have a problem that spectacle of a problem with that spectacle of thousands of young men just

turning up without documents on your shores every year that is a real problem. and what it does, i think it just undermines people's in system. people's faith in the system. and really annoyed at the and i get really annoyed at the fact we're depicted fact that we're often depicted as being some sort of hostile and bigoted nation when it comes to immigration and to the question, immigration and actually we're anything but i think we can easily compare ourselves to any other country in europe and around the world in europe and around the world in terms of our openness in terms of our tolerance, in terms of our willingness to take a reasonable number of refugees. but think people good but i just think people good faith abused, people faith has been abused, people just feel, look, i'm open to the idea taking refugees. i'm idea of taking refugees. i'm open to idea immigration. open to the idea of immigration. but to see the thing but i want to see the thing controlled want to see the controlled and i want to see the thing i don't to see thing and i don't want to see this scenario of boats turning up with thousands of people every people's every year. that's people's genuine belief. i schools and i think there's a few issues get conflated it when you have conflated say it when you have the conversation people the conversation about people trying asylum because trying to seek asylum because i don't any of minded don't think any of right minded decent want to you decent person would want to you know you see what's going on in places you see the awful

places iran you see the awful ness of the taliban in afghanistan. of course, any right thinking person would look at those people suffering and 90, at those people suffering and go, we can help you, go, yeah, if we can help you, let's help but what let's help you. but then what happens is they main happens is that they main country of origin currently for these small boat crossings as we will all be familiar with by now, is albania. so then when you people coming from a safe country , it feel a little country, it does feel a little bit like our system is having the michael taken out of it, but if you even dare point that out , you get accused. as paul was saying , of be this awful, saying, of be this awful, heartless race , this individual, heartless race, this individual, because these poor people from these war zones are fleeing persecution and how dare you be so heartless? the two for me doesis so heartless? the two for me does is we get separated. why can't we declare albania a safe country as they did in sweden , country as they did in sweden, just literally say, right, safe country . nobody with that country. nobody with that country. nobody with that country of origin will be even having that. you know, the idea of a kind , a chance of getting of a kind, a chance of getting into this country, define it as a safe country and move on from

there. do you think that is the answer to that? i also ponder because it's easy criticise all of this, isn't it? but what are the alternate solutions that if you someone say you disagree with these policies , what what's with these policies, what what's the alternative? and i'm going to ask pola and just a couple of minutes he represents. minutes because he represents. oh call yourself oh well you call yourself a laboun oh well you call yourself a labour, call yourself a left labour, you call yourself a left leaning fascinated leaning guy. i'm fascinated because criticise lot so do because they criticise lot so do the labour party. but what are their solutions ? do you actually their solutions? do you actually think you understand them? i don't. hear people go around don't. i hear people go around in i don't seem to in circles, but i don't seem to be clearer as what they be any clearer as to what they would cast. dion do you would actually cast. dion do you give me thoughts so you're give me your thoughts so you're into .

hello the michelle dewberry. this is dewbs& co so we're with you till 7:00. tonight's the founder of the free speech to union be young keeps me company as does paul embery . well, it's

as does paul embery. well, it's all going on, isn't it? because at the start of the programme was explaining to you that gary lineker has been asked to step back from presenting match of the day this weekend. ian then announced that he is not going to present this weekend either. i quote in solidarity . and now i quote in solidarity. and now it turns out alan shearer, he is just tweeted and said, i have informed the bbc i won't be appearing on match of the day. tomorrow night's , i'll tell you, tomorrow night's, i'll tell you, is waded into it as well jeremy corbyn. he is just i know he's not on match of the day so for the avoidance of any doubt, he was never a match. and of the day. presenter jeremy corbyn bidding for it. yeah, i'm blending a couple bits here, blending a couple of bits here, but on the same theme, but it's all on the same theme, so with me. he is jeremy so stay with me. he is jeremy corbyn tweeted saying , well corbyn tweeted saying, well done. gary lineker for standing up for refugees and well done at ian wright's showing the meaning of solidarity . now let's of solidarity. now let's mobilise against a politics of

cruelty and defeat this inhumane illegal, immoral legislation. oh god, there's so much i can get into about that. but paul, there'll be people watching this, right? that don't even watch match of the day. they think it was cher. i was just. give us a heads up, please. okay so right. and toby will so this. right. and toby will know about. you know who i'm talking about. you may michelle with the may not michelle with the greatest so right, greatest respect. so this right, i that's a bit i think. well that's a bit misogynistic. going to misogynistic. they're going to be bringing back des lyneham as the presenter think alan the presenter and i think alan hansen brooking is as hansen and trevor brooking is as the pundits, possibly bobby charlton even dragging him out of but as things of retirement, but as things stand at the moment, gary lineker is the presenter on lineker is the main presenter on match day and you have a match of the day and you have a kind of rotating pool of pundits, the main ones really are people like alan shearer and ian wright. so i'm gary lineker and you two share toby is alan shearer for this . he's got the shearer for this. he's got the same hairstyle. danny murphy could be. danny murphy yeah , could be. danny murphy yeah, danny murphy's another one. so, so there's a crop of pundits as well . the two, arguably the two

well. the two, arguably the two main pundits are shearer and m riot over big mike's with gary lineker as you would expect. and there were obviously pulled out as well. so i suspect at the moment the is now going moment the bbc is now going down, its way down the down, working its way down the pecking and no one pecking order and if no one comes for it, it's either comes up for it, it's either going me and toby. are going to be me and toby. are they going to scrap the programme in its entirety? one interesting question you interesting question is you know, alan know, ian wright and alan chapman if ian wright chapman isn't if ian wright was actually be on this actually scheduled to be on this saturday, may just be saturday, he may just be grandstanding. and grandstanding. but if he was and if shearer scheduled to if shearer was scheduled to be on, imagine he are they on, i imagine he was. are they not breach of contract? not in breach of contract? i mean, they're paid enormous sums of bbc to, you of money by the bbc to, you know, to, their punditry. know, to, to do their punditry. when if they can just drop when asked if they can just drop out like this, not because they're ill or they've got a family emergency, but out of solidarity with someone who's broken this policy . solidarity with someone who's broken this policy. i mean, broken. this bbc policy. i mean, i would have thought that they might be disciplined as a consequence. i mean, i as you can imagine, i don't mind can imagine, toby, i don't mind a of workplace a little bit of workplace solidarity , so going to solidarity, so i'm not going to i'm going to condemn i'm not going to condemn them for mean, i guess it for that. i mean, i guess it turns in a in a technical and

turns on in a in a technical and legal sense, it probably turns on details their on the details of their contracts. do contracts. they freelancers do they certain amount they have a certain amount of flexibility , they're flexibility, if they're freelancers, kind and freelancers, to kind of pick and choose when they want to do it? are they on the books at the bbc? they actually bbc? are they actually employees? by employees? in which case by pulling they pulling out, i think they probably have created problems for that respect, probably have created problems f

speech you and all the rest of it. do you think it's ever made this point at the start of the programme say it's not about politics this is not about impartiality. this is about the fact that referencing the holocaust by way of holocaust ever by way of comparison is just wrong. where do you stand on toby? you know, i think that some a difficult issue . i i think that some a difficult issue. i think it's a mistake for to reasons. first of all, it's just grotesque hyperbole to compare this government's policy on small boats that they announced earlier this week to what happened in germany in the 19305. it what happened in germany in the 1930s. it seems like just you're just trying to score political points in a kind of ham fisted way. but it's also, i think , the way. but it's also, i think, the real difficulty with it, though , is it's trivialising the holocaust to invoke the holocaust to invoke the holocaust to invoke the holocaust to score a political point, to try and besmirch your enemies. that's why i think it really upsets and offends people . but as a defender of free

speech, i don't want gary lineker to be cancelled because he said something that offended large numbers of people. i mean, i think it's a tricky issue because where you stand whether you think gary lineker should be defended and whether it's a free speech issue or not, turns on whether or not you agree with him. for most people. but i think we ought bear in mind think we ought to bear in mind that in some circumstances we have to defend the right people to things which we to say things which we profoundly disagree with. and for issue here is to for me, the issue here is to what extent does an employer have the right to police their employees speech outside the workplace? and if we're too quick to take bbc's side, quick to take the bbc's side, it's going to difficult in it's going to be difficult in future take the side of future to take the side of employees say things we employees who say things we agree with. but who are punished by their employers for saying things outside the workplace, which haven't caused their company financial loss. company any financial loss. right. is right. okay, good. that is $1,000,000 question. to what extent does your employer have the right of police? what you say of work , ponder it. give me

say of work, ponder it. give me your thoughts .

hello there. i'm michelle drew , hello there. i'm michelle drew, keeping you company right through tall, 7:00 tonight alongside me, founder of the free speech union to be young alongside him as well . writer, alongside him as well. writer, author, fireman paul embry. lots going on tonight most you guys are talking about the fact that gary lineker has been asked to step back from hosting match of the day . tonight, alan shearer the day. tonight, alan shearer has come out in solidarity. he's not going to present ian wright come in solidarity . he's not come out in solidarity. he's not going to present. i don't think that means many of them that means there's many of them left. quite frankly, it has divided opinion and i'm divided your opinion and i'm interested . are you someone that interested. are you someone that is anti cancel culture? and if you are, do you actually apply that principle irrespective of

who the person and what the opinion is? or are you somebody who is very much against cancel culture but if it's someone they don't really like, then defers. you want to kick him out and get rid of him? i been running a twitter poll. i've been asking you, do you think gary lineker should sacked? he hasn't been should be sacked? he hasn't been sacked. step sacked. he's been asked to step back. 75% of you on that poll say yes. you think that he should be sacked? 25, therefore, obviously said , no, you don't. obviously said, no, you don't. david says michel never , minds david says michel never, minds about what? his opinions. but why is it that people think that everyone to hear their opinions? why do people think that they are just so important to comment on that one? got to be honest, not going to lie. he is one of the first to criticise professional footballers for talking back to the referee and having to set an example to others that stephen is in a privileged place with lots of influence which he has wandered . to one bias. what does that

mean? he's wanted to one bias, charles says. lineker is a pubuc charles says. lineker is a public figure and cannot be compared to the average employee of the bbc or any other business. is it right that the bbc has taken this action? i also notice that gary has not apologised for his remarks. should he apologise, toby? i don't think he should apologise , but i do think that if he wants to go back into the match of the day chair, then he should probably agree to abide by the same social media that applies to all the other employees . do to all the other employees. do you think he should apologise? paul not if he doesn't really believe that he's done anything wrong. i'm completely against the idea that people should be compelled to apologise for things they things where they believe they were then were in the right because then the becomes the apology just becomes meaningless. think meaningless. frankly, i do think there's argument to say whole there's an argument to say whole thing is a bit of a mess and to a certain degree in lineker's defence, are not any defence, if there are not any clear around clear guidelines around freelancers , around people freelancers, around people outside and current outside of news and current affairs, and that debate has been a certain been going on to a certain degree , then he could argue,

degree, then he could argue, well , know, i wasn't subject to well, know, i wasn't subject to these rules . clearly something these rules. clearly something needs to be set stone now so needs to be set in stone now so that everyone , everyone that everyone, everyone understands what understands that the bbc what the going forward the situation is going forward when people are cancelled or threatened cancellation . threatened with cancellation. michel free speech union, michel at the free speech union, the give them the advice we usually give them is apologise if you think is don't apologise if you think it's going to make things better, if gary better, you're wrong. if gary lineker fired for this, lineker got fired for this, would you stand up and aim to represent him and take a case against the bbc ? i think we against the bbc? i think we probably would, yes would you. and what on what grounds? on the grounds that we don't think that even if the bbc can show that this tweet has the bbc into disrepute , that's a sufficiently disrepute, that's a sufficiently we think that's too easy a test. and we that you know it's let's suppose somebody says something right of centre an outrage mob spnngs right of centre an outrage mob springs up on social media and they can and then the company can claim, well, look, this outrage mob sprung up. it's brought the company into disrepute. it's too easy to game that standard by people who want

to people. think to cancel people. i think a company should have to show that what the person has said doesn't just cause them reputational loss , it's caused them financial loss, it's caused them financial loss. can show that, then loss. if you can show that, then if could show that in if the bbc could show that in this if they could point this case, if they could point to millions pounds, tens of to millions of pounds, tens of millions , millions of pounds, millions, millions of pounds, lost licence fee revenue as a lost in licence fee revenue as a result of gary lineker has said then yes, they'd be justified in getting rid of him, particularly if he refuses to abide by that. so what about standards in pubuc so what about standards in public officer? because i seem to recall the mp andrew bridgen, he had his whip removed and yes, i know it was politics and not the bbc, but he made a reference to holocaust. the outrage so to the holocaust. the outrage so many people and they lost his whip for that. yeah. he whip for that. yeah. and he shouldn't and i think shouldn't have done and i think what he wilfully what he actually he was wilfully misinterpreted preceded by some of his opponents. i mean, they suggest that was anti—semitic suggest that it was anti—semitic because think he said it had because i think he said it had been, you know, the worst attack on humanity since the holocaust. that clearly isn't, in my view, trivialise in the holocaust

itself or be an anti semitic anyway. it was certainly clumsy and. it isn't something that i would have said. but no, we need to be sensible about this. right. tell you, right. well, i'll tell you, someone's that am someone's opinion that i am always interested to hear. it is the former owner of crystal palace , the legendary sports palace, the legendary sports broadcaster on rights , and broadcaster on rights, and jordan on talksport and. he gets to live with me, which is an added bonus, i'm sure. simon jordan joins me down the line on the telephone as we speak. simon, your thoughts on what's been going on? well, i think on the balance of probability, i think probably think it's probably the appropriate . we're appropriate decision. we're using broadcaster using the national broadcaster the the national the same way we use the national health as a political health service as a political football. gary is football. but gary lineker is well aware political well aware of the political persuasion. he comes from well aware sentiments aware of the sentiments he's trying well trying to deploy. so he's well aware of the policies of the bbc . so whilst he can make arguments about the balance of in his process, maybe he's a private contractor , he's only a private contractor, he's only a private contractor, he's only a private contractor, he's only a private contractor because he thinks to go on the thinks it suits him to go on the air. 35 tax benefits. one might. everybody knows that with the bbc is an ideal and it may

bbc there is an ideal and it may well be just an ideal. the impartiality and observations of one political decisions and policy is i'm not. that

good evening, team. 7:00 and i'm tonight i am looking at drag queen story hour you've probably heard something about it recently as as a parent i want to make sure that children are safe and not exposed to content or performances that also central or i might just overreacting i'll be talking to people on a using ofcom compliant slides about it and then you can get to put fox on then you can get to put fox on the spot and ask me anything you want. never worked out well