we've got to the full story. we've got to work how moves work out how britain moves forward from is the best forward from this is the best country in the world. the establishment had their chance. now we're here to represent your views . britain's watching. views. britain's watching. britain's watching. britain's watching. we're proud to be gb news. the people's channel, britain's news. channel good evening . britain's news. channel good evening. i'm britain's news. channel good evening . i'm live from good evening. i'm live from scampton in lincolnshire . i'm scampton in lincolnshire. i'm right next door to the former raaf base that had been a business plan to do something really exciting . with that piece really exciting. with that piece of land. but now it would appear for the home office wanted to become a migrant detention centre. i'm going to be debating and tonight. the question and asking tonight. the question can scamps often be saved? because think the home of the because i think the home of the dambusters raid should be saved for future generation . and i for future generation. and i feel very strongly indeed with all of that. let's get the news

with polly middlehurst . nigel, with polly middlehurst. nigel, thank you and good evening to you . the top story tonight on gb you. the top story tonight on gb news. the dup in northern ireland says it's going to vote against the in this week's first parliamentary vote on the new brexit deal. the prime minister agrees the new windsor framework with the eu last month aiming to resolve some of the concerns unionists have had about the northern ireland protocol . also northern ireland protocol. also in the news today, the home secretary told mps she is set aside the provisions of the government's illegal migration bill are capable of being applied. compatibly with the human rights convention . that human rights convention. that comes after suella braverman said migrants could be sent to rwanda by as early as this summer. the agreement between the two countries has been expanded now to include all illegal migrants and not just asylum seekers . speaking in the asylum seekers. speaking in the house of commons, today's suella braverman told mps the uk is now going to work with france more

to secure cross—channel cooperation. and she criticised labour for announcing that immigration policy on twitter. shadow home secretary said on twitter she's very good on twitter. she tweeted in the last days labour's paltry excuse for a plan. half of it stuff we're already doing. the other half is that plan for open borders and unlimited migration . what unlimited migration. what i suggest they do is get off twitter, get her rwanda and i'll show them how to stop the boats . strike news and members of the rmt union in network rail have voted to accept an offer covering pay jobs and conditions. staff will receive a pay conditions. staff will receive a pay rise of between 9.2% and 14.4, as well as increased back pay- 14.4, as well as increased back pay. the union says its 20,000 members vote is 76% in favour of the new deal . and in the united the new deal. and in the united states, local , state and federal states, local, state and federal security agencies are preparing for the possible arrest of the

former president donald trump. security fences are currently being erected around the manhattan criminal court, we're told, as a precautionary measure. the district attorney has presented evidence to a new york grand jury related to allegations that a trump associate is said to have paid $130,000 in hush money to the actress stormy daniels . during actress stormy daniels. during the final days of the 2016 presidential campaign . and presidential campaign. and lastly, the former rugby league player, bryn hargreaves, his body has been found more than a year after he vanished in the united states. that's to according family. the 37 year old former wigan player moved to the united states about ten years ago and was reported missing in january 2020 to after. he didn't show up for work. the cause of death is not yet known . you're up to date on yet known. you're up to date on tv, online and dab, plus radio,

plus the tunein app on radio with gb news is the people's channel. time for fast . channel. time for fast. good evening from scampton in lincolnshire . well, as anyone lincolnshire. well, as anyone who watches this show or listens to this on the radio knows, i've been campaigning for the last three years saying that the flood of young men that crossed the english channel was beginning put intolerable beginning to put intolerable pressures on our communities. what we know is that over 450 hotels have been filled up with these all over the these young men all over the country . and part of the country. and so part of the government's plan , along government's new plan, along with scheme for with its ambitious scheme for a landen with its ambitious scheme for a lander, along with hoping the european court of human rights allow to us deport people who i don't think should have come here in the first place. part of the new plan was to have migrant detention centres in former military bases that the government believed would be far less controversial . until we

less controversial. until we learned just a few days ago that this would affect a f scampton. now scampton. for those that don't know , it was opened up by don't know, it was opened up by the royal flying corps in 1916. but in world war ii, this became the home. and in fact, 80 years ago this week. guy gibson established 617 squadron, an elite squadron that on the night of the 16th and 17th of may 1943 launched the raid on the dam's operation chastise . of course, operation chastise. of course, in our immortal memory , mostly in our immortal memory, mostly because, to be fair , the because, to be fair, the dambusters film and the same music, it is very, very much a rich part of our cultural history. worth noting that 617 after that went on under leonard cheshire later in the year to do some very remarkable things . but some very remarkable things. but all of this was flown out of r.a.f. scampton and even in the post war world. scampton was a very very important place.

vulcan flew from here, including one that went down and bombed the runway at port stanley in the runway at port stanley in the falklands war of 1982. and of course , this has been for of course, this has been for many, many years. the home of the red arrows. but all of you know, we're running down the size of our armed forces. and that has meant that in 2022, scampton stopped being an raaf base. scampton stopped being an raaf base . that had been, i think base. that had been, i think a very good local plan to keep the runway open and to build hotels to have a heritage centre. remembering those incredible deeds that those men did back in the 1940s. and indeed that men and women have done ever since to have a big tech park built it, a plan that said maybe up to £300 million of investment could come into an area, an area that needs levelling up . but to find needs levelling up. but to find out that the home office actually want this to become a migrant detention centre, they've advertised for jobs already that they're quite happy to kick it to touch the business plan. i think this is dreadful

for this local community and frankly an act of cultural desecration . and i do not desecration. and i do not believe this should be allowed to happen. i put my name to a petition over thousand people have and this is cross—party because actually the petition has been put forward by somebody who intends to stand for the labour party at the next election . so there is no party election. so there is no party politics in this whatsoever . politics in this whatsoever. this is about jobs and money for a local community in rural lincolnshire and it's about preserving our historical and cultural heritage for generations to come. so my question, my debate tonight with my guests is can scampton be saved ? now, earlier on today , saved? now, earlier on today, christina curtis, one of our producers, went out into the village of scampton to ask local people for their reactions . a people for their reactions. a bit of a shock to everybody , bit of a shock to everybody, actually. i think people were looking forward to a lot of investment in a what is now an empty area. and there are a lot

of people bought houses in the area and people are looking forward to new developments and new money coming into the area. and then to have suddenly hear that one of three that we're one of three possibilities asylum seekers possibilities for asylum seekers is, think, scared . quite a lot is, i think, scared. quite a lot of people . obviously, these of people. obviously, these people have to go to a place and they have to be looked after until whether they're going to end up can be found for them. but at the same time, there's a lot of heritage at scampton and i think it has to be thought about very carefully whether this is the place for them this is the right place for them with possible new with that possible new investment the area, in investment into the area, in an area that really need a lot area that really does need a lot of development and a lot of of new development and a lot of new investment. i spent ten years airforce there years my airforce career there and part of it comes from and a good part of it comes from seventh yeah , i'm seventh down. so yeah, i'm pretty familiar with it up there . so 6.7 and the lancasters that's nominally based something would be sort of farmed out to satellite airfields . but satellite airfields. but gibson's office , his dog drives gibson's office, his dog drives up there . there are two wartime

up there. there are two wartime listed up there , a hell of a lot listed up there, a hell of a lot . many people , the local area . many people, the local area have a personal connection to the airfield, including tom, whose whole family relocated to the village because his love for raaf scampton . how much of a raaf scampton. how much of a shame would it be if they did it? turn it into a museum or some of people to go and visit the world and not go where they wanna . and you . i think it's wanna. and you. i think it's very hard to put yourself in the shoes of the asylum seekers obviously they're fleeing their own countries for a reason which obviously we've been put in obviously we've been put in obviously as much you feel for them , you know for what they're them, you know for what they're going through and things like that. i think. going through and things like that. i think . so somewhere like that. i think. so somewhere like ah, we have some tomb which has got loads of history which is very close to where people live. and obviously people live on the

base still and things like that. and personally i can't see how it's possible and how it can work, but you know, just straight after announcing and pumping in, what is it, 300 million of investment and then obviously to announce that which then obviously the investment company then straight away pulled out of . i just i can't pulled out of. i just i can't understand the council's thinking . so can scampton be thinking. so can scampton be safe. give me your views barrage at i believe it absolutely must be now at 7:30 in a few minutes time up the road at poly primary school, there was going to be a pansh school, there was going to be a parish council meeting, a couple of hundred of local village residents are expected attend. there is deep concern about these within . the these proposals within. the community. who joins community. one man who joins me before that meeting is councillor roger patterson, conservative councillor for scamps and you of course west lindsey district council which is the relevant authority you're the deputy. and roger from , what the deputy. and roger from, what you told me earlier , this has

you told me earlier, this has been an ambition of yours years to do something when they are appued to do something when they are applied first i got involved was 2008 will be said the base was closing we fought to keep the base open and then obviously we couldn't. so it was all about getting until we sort the middle to other communities around here. there's three of them and they completely ripped the heart out of the communities and we would determined not to get our way . and then so when the way. and then so when the council said , they were going to council said, they were going to do something about and they ianed do something about and they invited bidders and people at skelton holdings along, i just knew that we were going to a good deal, but it didn't mean is the amazing deal that we got was skelton holdings. yeah the thousand jobs to invest but the. and you were on the verge as i understand it you as the local council were on the verge of this all being signed off. as far as i know , it was just far as i know, it was just basically dot the i's far as i know, it was just basically dot the 1's and cross the t's from the motty and obviously with skipton holdings

and just out the blue. i heard on monday night that scanlon holdings had got the deal and he was just euphoric. it the best deal we've ever had . i just deal we've ever had. i just couldn't it. and then suddenly out of blue i got told by joan in a haste. yeah. about scampton. yeah we learned that. we learned that jobs are being advertised. yeah. to work in the migrant detention centre we learned that artefacts even guy gibson's office has been packed into box and sent to rdf into a box and sent back to rdf handling. i mean at the moment it looks like they intend to do this it i've always an optimist and i've always believed from day one that we would get a deal . i didn't realise how good we were , but i've always been an were, but i've always been an octopus and i'm an optimist now. ihave octopus and i'm an optimist now. i have worked at scampton and i do know what the accommodate and the plots are like. they're not fit for purpose and these people have got complex needs and they deserve to be treated with dignity , respect held dignity, respect and held properly and secure in decent

accommodation. you haven't got those too. there's no decent accommodation . they can't cope accommodation. they can't cope with 1500 scouts, let alone immigrants . with 1500 scouts, let alone immigrants. it's just not the place. we haven't got the infrastructure to the transport, the doctors, education. we haven't got any of it here. it's the wrong place at the wrong and it's a choice. now between the right thing, which secures a thousand jobs or more and gives us. i think there is also , us. i think there is also, rogen us. i think there is also, roger, there is also the historical side of this. i mean i mean, this site is of huge import into our national psyche, isn't it? yeah. i mean, i was i was in the army and i love military history. i mean, you are surrounded by here and so important that we keep the memory of these people alive . we memory of these people alive. we tell their story for futures generations . and, of course , generations. and, of course, they still will do that and more. but if a way this story

dies, nobody tells anything, which i think will be awful. we've obviously been out and you know spoken to some local residents today . how would you residents today. how would you how would you sum up local reaction to the proposed migrant detention centre. i think people would devastated more than anything more than i think the devastated because we you know monday night was absolutely brilliant. we had this still people saw a bright future . they people saw a bright future. they know what the other future is , know what the other future is, seen it around lincolnshire when empty. it just ripped the hearts out of people's communities. on monday night we went not. we were the ones that have got the best thing and all of a sudden tuesday we could have our hearts beat out and we could be left with absolutely. and this monday, roger, you're off the party primary right now. party primary school right now. hotfoot going be 200. hotfoot you're going to be 200. i think, quite concerned people. yes we're just going to tell them we know because we them what we know because we don't know a lot, but we know we're going to tell them about the deal. we've got to them the deal. we've got to tell them what and listen to their

what we know and listen to their views and fight. what we know and listen to their views and fight . and we're going views and fight. and we're going to fight and we're going to win . scampton be saved? yes . can scampton be saved? yes there we but a positivity there we are. but a positivity that from west lindsey district council , the representative for council, the representative for scampton in a moment. when i come back , i hope to be talking come back, i hope to be talking to sir edward lee, who the local conservative mp for this of gainsborough . he's just been gainsborough. he's just been speaking in the house of commons. his way to commons. he's on his way to a microphone speak .

so your reactions to this flooding in and somerset to be earlier? well nigel, why are you here? this is a issue know this is a national issue. the boats crisis has come to lincolnshire in a big, big way. crisis has come to lincolnshire in a big, big way . some of your in a big, big way. some of your responses to the question of can scampton be saved ? one viewer scampton be saved? one viewer says immigrants shouldn't be put in detention centres or hotels,

they should be deported without exceptions . shame on the exceptions. shame on the conservative party for not stopping the boat crossing as well they've been warned and warned and warned they had gone down and down in the polls suella in the last 48 hours has started to sound more optimistic . and later on in the show, we'll have a clip an we'll have a clip of an exclusive interview gb news did with her in rwanda yesterday . with her in rwanda yesterday. joe it's a disgrace face if joe says it's a disgrace face if it must be turned into housing, it must be turned into housing, it should be for our veterans and our own needs, not economic migrants. one viewer says a stain on the memory of people who fought, who fought for country. i promise you that , country. i promise you that, lineker , you know, who thinks lineker, you know, who thinks all of this absolutely fine and dandy , i promise you, gary dandy, i promise you, gary lineker represents in a recent poll about 16% of the country. there is a clear majority , not there is a clear majority, not happy with the whole situation . happy with the whole situation. i think once this story of

scampton gets out and becomes bigger, i believe that there is a genuine prospect this can be. and interestingly, over the last 8 hours a letter has been sent to suella braverman the home secretary from a lift list . very secretary from a lift list. very distinguished public figures and historians, particularly military historians. so what's the big plan? what's the big regeneration all about ? is it regeneration all about? is it real? well scampton holdings ltd was set up in 2018 when they announced that they would be pulling out in 2022. and peter hewitt is the chairman of scampton holdings and honorary group captain of 601 squadron. so peter here, is this all a pipe so peter here, is this all a pipe dream or two scampton holdings actually have a plan there there is a real plan and it's a it's a very plan it's heritage but it's more just heritage but it's more just heritage it's about it's about jobs , it's about space. it's jobs, it's about space. it's science, it's about education. all of these things that are so

important. and we have a number of we think we'll be creating over a thousand jobs. there is an immediate need for a little bit, about 250 jobs that will be creating in next year. if the plans go through. so earlier morning, i was talking to the minister and he was very receptive . he said that's mr. receptive. he said that's mr. jenrick is it? that's mr. generation minister. yes. so he was i think he there were a few points he didn't, hadn't realised and one of the things is from scampton point of view, this is absolutely binary. we cannot have the immigrant centre there and our plans to carry on in particular a continuing active runway . absolutely. so if active runway. absolutely. so if you imagine sort of 1500 people loosely but not contained , you loosely but not contained, you can't have the red be doing low flying there and you cannot have an operational airfield. we wouldn't just never get permission it from the caa . have permission it from the caa. have you got the money? yes. yes, we

have wealthy backers, right . so have wealthy backers, right. so as i understand it, you were very , very close ndas had been very, very close ndas had been signed. you were very, very close to this deal with west lindsey district council actually being signed, sealed, delivered and announced and sort of, you know right at 11th of, you know right at the 11th hour we hear of this alternative plan. do you do you think perhaps it was a lack of knowledge, a lack of publicity about , what you were knowledge, a lack of publicity about, what you were doing knowledge, a lack of publicity about , what you were doing that about, what you were doing that caused the problem. i can't help thinking it's left hand and a right hand issue, because on the one hand we've got the chancellor last in chancellor talking last week in the about levelling up the budget about levelling up and been mentioned , scampton and as been mentioned, scampton and as been mentioned, scampton and lincolnshire are very important part that levelling important part of that levelling up are sort of £300 million up and are sort of £300 million regenerate planned over ten years or so is a core part of that. and on the other hand, there's the home office, the talking about immigration and they're talking about 15 migrants here. and that will be will it will completely scupper

our plans for regeneration. and, of course , scampton, what we of course, scampton, what we think about it, i mean, it represents, of course, courage. it represents sacrifice , but it it represents sacrifice, but it also represents engineer , ity also represents engineer, ity and technology. i what 617 were formed to do was to use incredibly revolutionary new bouncing bomb as it was called that had been developed by bonds wallace later on. noted in a sense part of your plans are it to be a high tech of looking to the future totally totally about the future totally totally about the future totally totally about the future about entrepreneurship of a satellite arts in particular. yeah, definitely sort of dual use type satellite. so one of the first things that will will probably the drone port come into play using one of the existing buildings. so satellite applications catapult one of the government quangos are hugely supportive and are very, very keen to get on site. so that would be one of our first projects. well i have to say, peter, here, you know, my as a presenter on an ofcom regulated channelis presenter on an ofcom regulated channel is to provide balance.

i'm not even going to try to i wish you every luck with what you're trying to do. i really do mean that know now we have got so rapidly joining me down the line live from west sir edward you've had a pretty busy day , i you've had a pretty busy day, i think, meetings with the minister , speeches in the house minister, speeches in the house of commons i've just been talking to peter hewitt about the plans of the west lindsey council was enthusiastic . how on council was enthusiastic. how on earth did we get to a situation where the home office seemed to want to override all of this ? want to override all of this? well, i've just been speaking in the chamber, which was why it was a bit later , nigel, coming was a bit later, nigel, coming on with you, and i asked a today and as heard, i took peter west lindsey to see the immigration minister only this morning i mean, we are just gobsmacked by this because one the government is saying that we want to give regeneration to the gainsborough

constituency. i £10 billion from michael gove for that but another part of government, michael gove for that but another part of government , the another part of government, the home office is danger of scuppering growth . £1,000,000 scuppering growth. £1,000,000 worth investment led by peter and as i said in the comments a day to tomorrow, it's the worst timing. tomorrow is the eighth anniversary of the founding of 617 dambusters squadron . so 617 dambusters squadron. so i may just defies that you should put it risk free hundred billion pounds of inherited investment heritage offices, hotels eating the wrong way open and a migrant centre. that doesn't make sense sense . you know, i agree with sense. you know, i agree with you. it doesn't make sense to me but you know, of course have another 500 young men across the channel the course of the last couple of days and when we get the next clear spell of whether many, many more will come somewhere between 450 and 500 hotels are filled already. i mean, the government are getting bit desperate for places to put people to about . you're

people to about. you're a veteran of many political , some veteran of many political, some that you've won and some that you've lost. let me ask you , can you've lost. let me ask you, can scampton be saved can it be saved for this commercial? can it be saved for our cultural heritage? and so that future generations can come and see and the extraordinary things that happened there. i think that if the home office insists on putting in 1500 migrant eyes next to a village of 1300 people, next to a nursery school, as peter hewitt told, the minister this morning, it will almost certainly scupper the i think the runway will be lost. runways very sensitive things in the modern world. it's miles long. there's a of security. there's 100 buildings security. there's100 buildings there. we had nuclear armed bombers there . there will be no bombers there. there will be no security around migrants. i think it'll be difficult. it'll be impossible for any private sector investment investor to come in while the office is there. now, they say they'll be in and out in two years. do we believe them as you yourself,

nigel said, to the companies tearing the hair out, by the way? i mean, i'm with you. i think they be much tougher from the should the beginning. we should have resorted in the resorted to push back in the channel. should have arrested channel. we should have arrested people years they will people two years ago, they will not and this is the point not come. and this is the point behind the migration bill. migrants not come if they migrants will not come if they know when land on our know that when they land on our shows, they will be arrested . shows, they will be arrested. they will stay arrested until they are deported . nobody's they are deported. nobody's going to pay £6,000 to a people smuggler to come over. but i agree the government's got a crisis. i support the migration bill and i understand that all the hotels being full up and all the hotels being full up and all the rest of it and we've offered again again we'll try and find them another site lincolnshire but you should not scupper £300 million worth of investment . no, million worth of investment. no, i absolutely get the logic of all of that. i will have to see whether the bill works. we'll have to see what the role of the eci is. but even if it was to stop now we have the problem of, those tens of thousands that are here already. finally, i want to

ask again you ask that question again to. you if answer edward. you if i can answer edward. you fought many battles over the years, and this battle would be one dont years, and this battle would be one don't know the who told us one i don't know the who told us that they have not made up their minds and yet we hear that they have alerted serco , the police have alerted serco, the police and local health authority . so and local health authority. so i can't honestly put my hand on my heart. nigel and say whether we are going to stop this, but i can tell you that i am moving heaven on earth. every contract i've got with the home secretary, robert jenrick i'm using every contract i've got with west lindsey. standing with west lindsey. i'm standing virtually parliament is virtually daily in parliament is a . local people can a local. the local people can ensure that we have done everything to try and convince the home office to come in here. the problem is , is that the problem is, is that everybody screaming them, everybody is screaming them, that hotels are full and that the hotels are full and you've got to put them in a military bases. and i suppose the office will say that there aren't military aren't that many military bases left in which they still own, but i say that may a fair point. but this is the wrong military

base, the home of red arrows and the dog busters do not scuff up £300 million worth of investment , sir, sir edward, thank you very much for coming on and joining us. thank you. from the chamber of the house of commons. in a moment and a moment we'll show you a short extract of an interview, an exclusive interview, an exclusive interview mark white, our interview that mark white, our home in rwanda, home affairs editor in rwanda, yesterday suella braverman yesterday with suella braverman

my my white gb news is home affairs and security. ed has been in rwanda over the weekend . he had rwanda over the weekend. he had an exclusive sit down with the home secretary suella braverman critics have accused the home secretary of indulging nothing more than a glorified op . and more than a glorified op. and yes , of course, these are

yes, of course, these are powerful images . but suella powerful images. but suella braverman visit here is not just the eye catching symbolism . the the eye catching symbolism. the uk government desperately needs. the agreement with rwanda to succeed without a third country willing to take relook sheeted asylum seekers , the government's asylum seekers, the government's illegal migration bill is almost certain to stumble at the first hurdle . so a meeting with the hurdle. so a meeting with the rwandan president paul kagame, was the agenda as the uk's strengthens its partnership , the strengthens its partnership, the home secretary certainly packed a lot into her two day schedule, visiting new housing developments and other support services being geared up to accommodate thousands of asylum seekers who may end up here in the months ahead . the plans the months ahead. the plans still have their critics, of

course, tv presenter gary lineker, opposed and politicians and others but suella braverman me no one should judge unless they've been here. would you encourage actually to come here and see for themselves what rwanda has offer those who would come here and settle ? come here and settle? absolutely. i think there has been too much prejudice . it's been too much prejudice. it's frankly snobbery amongst the critics who most of most of whom haven't even rwanda . this is my haven't even rwanda. this is my third visit to rwanda. this is a welcoming country. it's a dynamic economy . so to all of dynamic economy. so to all of those critics who display a gross prejudice against rwanda, i tell them to visit first and then judge an important stop off for was this huge tech hub in the capital, kigali, home to one hundreds of start ups and

companies from around the rwanda is home to a burgeoning tech sector. and also in kigali house in particular, has over 200 companies start ups that are stationed out of here. also organisations that support start—ups and we have more than a thousand members now , 55% of a thousand members now, 55% of these are from other african countries . the keppler academy countries. the keppler academy high in the hills over kigali . high in the hills over kigali. another example says the home secretary of the many education services can provide, is silence . there's well—established , . there's well—established, well—respected local universities . she has already universities. she has already committed to ensuring up to 25% of the students here will be refugees . but like the many refugees. but like the many housing complex cases around this capital city, they have absolutely no idea just how many people there will eventually be asked to accommodate for. in truth , home secretary doesn't

truth, home secretary doesn't even know how many asylum seekers may eventually have to be sent . it could be seekers may eventually have to be sent. it could be many thousands, but home office officials are quietly hoping that just like the australian against the small boats , once against the small boats, once they finally start relocating asylum seekers , the people asylum seekers, the people smugglers business model will be broken . yes it's a big gamble broken. yes it's a big gamble and this country is a vital component component . well, component component. well, i don't doubt for one moment the determined insincerity of the home secretary suella braverman what i doubt is the role that the strasbourg court play in this and indeed our own judges as well. all will revealed. but back to lincolnshire, back to scampton , let me just show you scampton, let me just show you some pictures of me arriving at the dambusters in earlier today

. well, i'm here at the terrific dambusters in in scampton. i've got to confess, i have been here before. i'm here with greg algar, the governor what's it all about ? the pub? yeah the pub all about? the pub? yeah the pub is a homage to bomber command. some particularly 617 and 130 through aircrew , in particular. through aircrew, in particular. coming from imo. yeah . this is coming from imo. yeah. this is 133 aircrew, 19 aircraft that the dambusters . personnel . so the dambusters. personnel. so 133 when 53 were killed i think. is that right. yeah the pub saver. most people's favourite lincoln city football club's favour is johnny johnson. johnny johnson johnson , who died under johnson johnson, who died under one december last year. yep just didn't quite because it's the

80th anniversary this week isn't is this thursday of the formation of 617 so yeah literally just gone the last pilot was less monroe five in ten years ago. yeah so under ward four is just they're brilliant. yeah we've got a family of the crew coming in this thursday geoff rice his daughter coming see is johnny's grandson . will opening the grandson. will opening the stained glass window that we've got open this thursday and his coming fantastic . it's a hell of coming fantastic. it's a hell of a tribute it really is this is the honours board as it is used to hang in our if cranwell they kindly gave it to the embassies in only two months ago. so this is the victoria cross obviously that gibson got to get for the squadron really .

that gibson got to get for the squadron really. i mean, if you know the story that work that he did on the on particularly on the mon the dam is incredible going in second third aircraft to take away the flak so that they could do their mind on target incredible what's interesting to me about this is that those that came back got awards but it seems that those that didn't make it back. yeah no no posthumous medals no what is an amazing this and it is like a living museum and i to tell you if you ever in this part of lincolnshire pop into the dambusters in. oh no it really is a great pub it's well worth a visit in a moment greg, i've got the man behind this amazing collection will join me on talking points and we'll talk about history. we'll talk about heritage and talk about his passion , the extraordinary passion, the extraordinary things that happened here all those years ago .

it's time for talking points here live in the dambusters end with these commemorative pint glasses they've had made. i'm wearing indeed the because it is of course this week the 80th anniversary of the foundation of 617 squadron. and indeed i'm here with the governor, greg algar . there's a window going to algar. there's a window going to be opened this new stained window that we showed earlier in the church. and you helped raise a of for, money by the way, a bit of for, money by the way, cheers. great thank cheers. cheers. great pub. thank you. to back. yeah . you. good to be back. yeah. yeah. the newest stained glass windows in the church to go . windows in the church to go. they're twin windows. yeah, there's one window that's commemorating over 100. well hundred years of royal air force scampton . and that was such a

scampton. and that was such a success, i thought they'd do another one and it's 80 years this thursday . yes, yes. the this thursday. yes, yes. the formation of 617 squadron that's going to be quite event is going to be quite an event. it's this place. i mean the living museum, it's fantasy . i, you, you've it's fantasy. i, you, you've been here. what years? 14. and again , having spent years in again, having spent years in column and in london running, restaurants and pubs and what was interesting in your story about you here and taking the dambusters in, doing stuff with it is that from what i read you didn't fully understand what your own father had done in the second world war until he came here. is that right? second world war until he came here. is that right ? well, if here. is that right? well, if your dad's a bus driver, you don't exactly go. he screaming malta as a bus driver. my dad in the royal air force and he came out when i was eight years old. and that's a job. it was just a job. the significance of bomber command and my father and my

grandfather , 111 were aged grandfather, 111 were aged between my father and, my mum's dad is something that i'm very very proud of. i mean, it's a huge not because roughly, yeah , huge not because roughly, yeah, bomber command lost 3% with each raid and so that was it. after 30 raids, he was given the chance to sort to get a get a ground job if he did a tour that was to age the average lancaster lasted eight rides and they thought that was economic interest they if a lancaster did two raids that was economically sound and how many missions of your grandfather 86. so the odds against that were huge . and against that were huge. and 56,000 and yeah men died on those missions of the australian air lost even more men during the daylight raids. i mean you must think to yourself your father and grandfather were in incredibly fortunate . my dad incredibly fortunate. my dad always that grandad was a hero

and now look at dad's medals which are modest wartime veterans medals and i'm so proud and we so forget all the way back to churchill that they wanted to forget bomber and i'm not here to forget bomber command this is lincolnshire . we command this is lincolnshire. we are in a. county and it's everything that i can do to run possible one of the most successful pubs in lincolnshire. whilst just pushing a little bit of interest in that. that is our well, there's plenty and yeah. and you're phenomenally busy 400 meals over the weekend you bring your own beer doing all sorts things very successful pub you've got to hear the log books course that these are very very collectable things you've got these for both your father and

grandfather. yeah. and the, the uniqueness . father and uniqueness. father and grandfather of the year. it's my dad signed up the 16 year old couldn't be any younger. my grandfather signed up as 35 year old with an eight year old daughter and bless mum's nearly upstairs and she's only 87 that died last aged 98. so we were all at the very end remembrance. i don't know the crime war, but i don't know the crime war, but i promise you i know a lot about. yes, a world war. and that's what we're to. here and you've got some medals here. these are your grandfather's granddad's medals. dfc involved? yep. yeah that's a very, very good medal group indeed. phenomenal absolutely phenomenal . how do you feel ? i mean, . how do you feel? i mean, clearly the raf leaving, i'm sure quite a blow. it had been trialled. it's happened it's not going to be reversed but how do you feel about the buildings up

there, about the artefacts being guy gibson's artefacts being. well star gibson's office was reinstated ten or 12 years ago. it was always gibson's office. yeah but it went to iraq and ruin and someone had the forethought for it all back and the heritage centre was an active base was quite hard to get on to. so now with everything gone from nearby, it we can clearly have a massive opportunity to do the decks for the north. yeah. and then i like that and then. yeah. and then all the other elements that you're quite guess just mentioned in your i didn't really know too about it just sounds like a complete it's no starter to ever consider to know that actioning this. i do wonder people in some people in home office of just hate the country and hate our history. it would be an act of complete act and

cultural desecration to do that to it wouldn't it, to turn into a migrant detention centre. well the important for me is the important thing for me is that and we all say not that heritage and we all say not in my yard , i'm not interested in my yard, i'm not interested in my yard, i'm not interested in that. of course interested in that. but what i'm interested in is the preservation of my father juuan is the preservation of my father julian in 82 years ago . and i'm julian in 82 years ago. and i'm sitting here questioning the sanctity of just giving those veterans away , just not caring veterans away, just not caring about them because we've got something better to do. well, somebody else using an issue to overlook what the hell they are, though . no, i've got something though. no, i've got something special to show you. never been seen before . one of those pilots seen before. one of those pilots who was lost was john hoppy hopgood. yeah. and we had a chat abouti hopgood. yeah. and we had a chat about i haven't seen none of the like well no one actually has

this that's quite a famous picture of him . now the story picture of him. now the story the story of him and the dad is astonishing, isn't this? is it about 20 to 30 minutes out from a. yes. the plane hit. he's got a. yes. the plane hit. he's got a bad head injury yet. he's got one of the guys with him is sort of applying press is to try and stop the bleeding. one of the gunners has been killed outright and he turns around to the crew and he turns around to the crew and says, what we've come this far. yeah. and in fact, i even think having spoken with family members that he kept something secret he didn't tell the front gunner was dead . yeah. and i'm gunner was dead. yeah. and i'm not even sure that we knew that. nonetheless you're bleeding. you're bleeding through blood. and john was never giving up. john was always going on, and john was always going on, and john always it in his mind it was a suicide mission. so having that in your thought and you still press when you're bleeding

and then is there gibson goes first to the dads surprises him. yeah doesn't get that much flak it all good gets lot so the again very very heavily then what happens about hopkins aircraft could take they yeah were hit 50 minutes sure the moment that we pressed on you need five crew members to cause an eight to say drop that mine they didn't quite get that right there's absolute chaos in the aircraft the bomb was dropped light it bounced over the time into a smashed up the power below which took out the rear part of the plane . john managed part of the plane. john managed to get to 200 feet elevation and tell people to get out he successful only saved two people's lives. yeah yeah. and of course died himself when the plane crash. an amazing story. what i've got here i'm going to let you have a look at this,

greg, off the show. thank you. it's his last letter to his brother where he describes how excited because he's coming excited is because he's coming to buckingham palace. yeah where he's going to get awarded the dfc which won earlier . dfc, which he'd won earlier. i've got the last letter here. my i've got the last letter here. my dearest mother , that he wrote my dearest mother, that he wrote and this this is astonishing, i think and the letter is that the letter says 617 squadron are f scampton lincoln and it's dear mrs. hopgood it is with much it was with deepest regret that i have to inform you that the telegram you've received about your son flight lieutenant j.b. good was killed in action on the night of the 16th. 17th. and he goes on to say, with deepest sympathy from the all the lads it squadron, yours sincerely guy gibson. so it's a remarkable private collection and here is his dfc involved which he himself went to collect at buckingham . it is a remarkable .

buckingham. it is a remarkable. and i have to say the one thing i do think about it all is those are the those that survived the raid came back. many got darker ated, none of them got posthumous medals. so there was no extra a war. but it is a remarkable private collection. i thought you as an enthusiast yet for all of this like to see it. i also thought perhaps it was worth reflecting that it's very easy to watch the bastards film. i watched many war films and to think how amazing everything is. but actually, perhaps it is just worth us reflecting on loss the terrific loss of life, the terrific loss of life, the terrific sacrifice that took place . i've got friends in place. i've got friends in holland , i've got friends in holland, i've got friends in germany , i've put people in germany, i've put people in holland in touch with friends of the mon them the mayor of the mona dam . my dutch friends are mona dam. my dutch friends are going to germany to on on the on

the edge of town, to visit the raid, to say we to be friends. and we need to remember these occasions. we can't just throw all these occasions . so that's all these occasions. so that's happening because of the success of aviation in this county and the diligent work the international bomber command said to do. for example , and a said to do. for example, and a number of other establish , since number of other establish, since we're just a little a and we take ourselves very seriously . take ourselves very seriously. well, greg, i want to say a huge thank thank you for looking after me. i did come here a few years ago. i it was the right place to come back to was absolutely right. but i want to say again, what i said at the start of this programme, it is really important, i think, for this local community to keep that runway . it's been made that runway. it's been made clear by the local mp, the local council and indeed by scampton holdings that if you have 5000 migrants there on that site. it

is impossible for that to continue as an operational runway . there needs to be runway. there needs to be a proper , not just heritage site proper, not just heritage site at raaf scans of the heritage trail all the way through this part of lincolnshire . there are part of lincolnshire. there are some extraordinary things to go and see indeed the church that was at earlier with the stained glass window and so much else can scampton be saved ? well, all can scampton be saved? well, all i would say to this is that scampton absolutely must be saved not to do so , to turn it saved not to do so, to turn it into the home office. this plan would be actually an act of cultural , absolutely derelict cultural, absolutely derelict devastation. let's go and find out what the all important weather is. back you tomorrow. hello, i'm alex deakin and this is your latest weather update from the met office. plenty of wet weather around through this week, but drier and brighter in between. a huge amount of between. well, a huge amount of brightness out there today. a lot of cloud but it is lot of cloud around. but it is pretty mild because between these systems , this these two weather systems, this is warm sector. so some is called a warm sector. so some warm in here and we've seen warm air in here and we've seen a bit of brightness temperatures

have jumping up into the have been jumping up into the mid and high teens in a few places. but we do have weather from weather fronts from those weather fronts pushing across scotland in through northern ireland. and another through northern ireland. and anothein the southwest, a few wales in the southwest, a few showers east, many places showers east, but many places dry evening. this rain dry this evening. so this rain band works way to the east overnight . behind that, there'll overnight. behind that, there'll be a few breaks in the clouds, some clear spells. but the mild air overnight. so air persists overnight. so temperatures staying at nine or ten celsius in some towns and cities. as for tomorrow , cities. as for tomorrow, overall, it's a similar of day, but should be a bit brighter. i suspect some early rain across eastern england staying pretty down the northern isles down because the northern isles for much of the day and then we'll see some showers for south of scotland northern england spreading to the east, could even see one or heavy ones, even see one or two heavy ones, maybe thunderstorm, most maybe even thunderstorm, most likely pennines likely over the pennines further south though not too south and west, though not too many showers better tomorrow of seeing sunshine some blue seeing some sunshine some blue sky and the air is still mild. so temperatures will be up into the teens once more. 5016 is possible cooler as the breeze

starts to pick and more rain pushes into northern ireland come the afternoon. that is a spell. wet and windy weather that areas during that swings across areas during tuesday . some bright colours tuesday. some bright colours there in the west will be some heavier bursts of rain , at least heavier bursts of rain, at least for a time. this rain then around on wednesday morning, away scotland or the away from scotland or the lingering in shetland and clearing away from southeast clearing away from the southeast by the afternoon to many places, then brightening up again through wednesday with some spells but a few spells of sunshine. but a few showers are likely develop showers are likely to develop through quite a gusty through the day. quite a gusty wind wednesday, a blustery wind on wednesday, a blustery boisterous kind of day and not quite mild, but still quite as mild, but still temperatures 10 to 13 or 14 celsius. good bye .

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