welcome to gloria meets two conservative mps . i'm welcome to gloria meets two conservative mps. i'm britain's longest serving political edhon longest serving political editor. first up, it's army veteran sarah atherton . you're veteran sarah atherton. you're the military is fantastic . the the military is fantastic. the opportunities are endless. but what i did find is when it went wrong, it went very well . wrong, it went very well. britain's longest serving political editor, nigel nelson , political editor, nigel nelson, certainly got a few tales to tell . margaret thatcher tell. margaret thatcher absolutely terrified me when i met her. she yeah, absolutely. its leader of the scottish tories, douglas ross. i look forward to seeing huge success

will and he will be facing at first ministers question all of us after your news . hello us after your news. hello i'm radisson in the gb newsroom. tensions have heightened between russia and ukraine with russian state media alleging that a blast in the country's tula region was caused by a ukrainian drone packed with explosives. three people were reportedly injured when they were struck by shrapnel. however, ukraine has not claimed responsible bility for the alleged attack. it follows pleas from the european union for russia to halt the stationing of nuclear weapons in belarus . keefe's foreign belarus. keefe's foreign ministry has called the decision provocative and is calling for a session of the un security council . well, england is facing council. well, england is facing ukraine right now in the european qualifiers. both teams joined for a photograph before the match as players clutched a ukrainian flag with peace written across it. dfa has given

1000 free tickets to ukrainian refugee and their british hosts to attend the game. arsenal player oleksandr zinchenko and chelsea attacker nicolo modric are among the ukrainian players competing in the qualifier against the three lions. offenders who commit anti—social behaviour will be forced to clean up their communities. behaviour will be forced to clean up their communities . as clean up their communities. as part of the prime minister's new immediate justice scheme , under immediate justice scheme, under the plans to be announced tomorrow, local authorities will be given new powers to quickly and visibly punish criminals. those who spray graffiti or commit other vandalism. we'll have to fix the damage within 48 hours. other penalties include picking up litter, washing police cars or doing unpaid work in shops , while as part of that in shops, while as part of that crackdown . and the government crackdown. and the government has also announced a ban on the sale of laughing gas. levelling up secretary michael gove telling broadcasters that nitrous oxide canisters are helping to fuel anti—social

behaviour and turning public spaces into , quote, drug taking spaces into, quote, drug taking arenas . the spaces into, quote, drug taking arenas. the us spaces into, quote, drug taking arenas . the us president spaces into, quote, drug taking arenas. the us president has declared a state of emergency and mississippi after a tornado killed at least 26 people there. the twister swept through the state and on into alabama , state and on into alabama, cutting a path of destruction. 170 miles long, around 11,000 residents there are still without power. they say there was no safe place to hide . we're was no safe place to hide. we're on tv , online, dab plus radio on tv, online, dab plus radio and on tuned in as well. this is gb news. now it's time for gloria meets . gloria meets. sarah atherton, conservative mp for wrexham . you conservative mp for wrexham. you were elected in 2019. tell me a little bit about your upbringing. yes. well my mother

was a mum, as we say in wales, is from caernarfon . she didn't is from caernarfon. she didn't speak english until she went to school. she's from a very well known coffee family , the string known coffee family, the string of family. my father was a methodist, came from a family of builders, and i was brought up in chester. but like everyone who lives in wrexham, in chester, in north—east wales , chester, in north—east wales, you know , we live in a wide you know, we live in a wide geographic area, so we dip in and out of england with different amounts of wales. so i had a lovely upbringing. i went to school in chester, spent all my holidays in a caravan, either in carnarvon or porthmadog every saturday child i used to go saturday as a child i used to go to the local swimming pool in wrexham whilst my went to wrexham whilst my mum went to the market. so i don't love a childhood. goodbye. you are the first female mp to have served in the armed forces. first female mp to have served in the armed forces . you left in the armed forces. you left school at 16 and signed up. tell me what you did in the army. i was in the intelligence corps. so i actually walked into a recruitment office and we don't have too many of them anymore. but walked into recruitment

but i walked into recruitment office with office a little bit lost with life. worked in boots when life. i'd worked in boots when i left school. i travelled a bit round. europe had gone to berlin and had really pricked my and that had really pricked my imagination military. imagination about the military. and i came back and i wanted to be cap once, get to royal be red cap once, get to royal military so i did my military police. so i did my assessments no, assessments and they said, no, no, you to go to no, no. now you got to go to intelligence corps, which delighted my parents massively. intelligence corps, which delljhted my parents massively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined ny parents massively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined upparents massively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined up and its massively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined up and is massively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined up and i was|ssively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined up and i was inively. intelligence corps, which de|i joined up and i was in the i. so i joined up and i was in the army for four years in july 2021, and this is going to form the bulk of the interview. you chaired the defence subcommittee on in the armed forces . it on women in the armed forces. it produced a report into the experience of women in the military . you heard from women military. you heard from women who serve and who have served. you heard cases of serious sexual assault, rape , gang rape sexual assault, rape, gang rape and cover up. is there a case or perhaps to that particular stick in your mind .7 yes, i went to in your mind? yes, i went to meet some serving personnel, some veterans at a charity in

the northeast called salute , the northeast called salute, which out of the 1800 veterans charity is one service charities. we have . that's the charities. we have. that's the only one that specifically dedicated to supporting women. and that was the only charity that would help me whilst i was collecting this evidence for the subcommittee and i met a lady there who had been gang raped with an implement. there who had been gang raped with an implement . and she had with an implement. and she had really poor experience of trying to complain , poor experience of to complain, poor experience of support , poor experience of support, poor experience of victim support . so she victim support. so she eventually left the military and her life is in tatters because she's now dipping into the nhs system. can't get the right level of support there for the rest of her life has been impacted by what happened during that time . that was probably the that time. that was probably the worst case and i will remember it going forward . but i have to it going forward. but i have to say most women have really good

experiences in the military . and experiences in the military. and in fact, our report said nine out of ten women enjoyed their experience as i did . and what experience as i did. and what i didn't want to do when i'm booked on this report was to turn women off a career in the military . and i think that military. and i think that hasn't happened. so you know, the military is fantastic. the opportunities are endless. but what i did find is when it went wrong, it went very wrong . i wrong, it went very wrong. i think that story will stay with all of us forever. you found 64% of female veterans , 58% of of female veterans, 58% of currently serving women report is experiencing bullying, harassment or discrimination dunng harassment or discrimination during their careers. harassment or discrimination during their careers . were you during their careers. were you shocked at those figures ? i was shocked at those figures? i was shocked at those figures? i was shocked with the whole report. we had no idea what we were going to find on the scope and the sheer quantity of evidence that came forward . i was asked that came forward. i was asked to do it by tobias ellwood, who was the chair and the clerk also at the time, because women had

consistently been overrepresented in the complaints system and recruitment was consistently down. we encourage the emoji to give us access to serving women, which is not usually done . and which is not usually done. and we had a two week offer to community do a questionnaire which the mod were going to promote on their internet site . promote on their internet site. but that was two weeks before christmas. we thought we'd get about 600 returns we pulled on our own networks, we pulled on our own networks, we pulled on our own networks, we pulled on our own veterans networks and our own veterans networks and our own veterans networks and our own survey women's networks . we got 4000, and in a two week penod . we got 4000, and in a two week period , we had no idea what was period, we had no idea what was coming down the tracks and what we didn't ask , which we would we didn't ask, which we would have done now, is all those 62% that had experienced abuse , how that had experienced abuse, how many had experienced sexual abuse , how many were alleging abuse, how many were alleging that experienced rape ? we didn't that experienced rape? we didn't ask that because, quite frankly

, we had no idea what we were heading into. we use object to bullying , harassment heading into. we use object to bullying, harassment or heading into. we use object to bullying , harassment or worse bullying, harassment or worse when you were serving, i was in the army in the eighties and it was tough. absolutely tough. you were sworn at. you'll be shouted at. but that was a different social context. in the eighties , i didn't actually see any abuse or anything that i thought of as abuse at the time. i look back now and think , yes, they back now and think, yes, they used to drop medicine balls on your stomach to make sure the firm muscles up actually , firm muscles up actually, medicine balls have heavy sports balls, right ? medicine balls have heavy sports balls, right? is medicine balls have heavy sports balls, right ? is show my age balls, right? is show my age now. and they said drop them on your stomach to try and tighten your stomach to try and tighten your muscles up. well, that would seen as abuse. now but would be seen as abuse. now but it in the eighties. it wasn't back in the eighties. so hindsight, so with hindsight, i'm reflection back 40 odd years probably did, but it didn't register at the time and it wasn't significant enough to make an impact. you have referred to a misogynistic culture and the armed forces does not mean the armed forces

are institutionally sexist . the are institutionally sexist. the chief of defence staff at the time, nick carter , certainly time, nick carter, certainly really didn't help with his comments about laddish behaviour. do you want to just explain those? yes. so the chief of defence staff is the top person in the military and when all this evidence was started to come out, he was in his position then. come out, he was in his position then . he's now left and he said, then. he's now left and he said, well you know, it's laddish behaviour sort of what you expect , that doesn't help . and expect, that doesn't help. and actually that reaffirms to me that there's a culture, there's a culture or a problem here in the military and it's an old institution, male dominated . i institution, male dominated. i would expect nothing else but that doesn't mean we don't try and change it now, because times have changed. 50% of the population are women , you know, population are women, you know, and recruitment is low. recruitment is around 12% of women. this target is now to increase that recruitment to 30% by 2030. | increase that recruitment to 30% by 2030. i think we already have gone further to 40% by 2030. so

we really need to change that culture if we women are going to be encouraged to go into this what is a fantastic career where all opportunities are open, but more importantly to stay and make it a lifelong career, not just stay four years or eight years is the average . so we need years is the average. so we need to change that. there is a misogynistic culture, but but it's changing . why did you it's changing. why did you leave? i left because i married a soldier . a lot of people are a soldier. a lot of people are dual serving , as you might dual serving, as you might expect. and in the eighties, there was no way that two careers could have been followed whilst a marriage pursued. so you the coalition is to you said the coalition is to change. it's going to change. how it's not going to change. how it's not going to change overnight and it needs to be not just a top down approach. it needs to be a bottom up approach . there was training approach. there was training going on as we had 34. i'd recommend asians. most of those were taken on by the military, ranging from body armour to something else. another story that really will stick in my

mind is that a woman phoned up and she said, because we spoke to most and met quite a few of the people submitting evidence. and she said she was out afghan and she was in a foxhole, she was in a firing position and she had body armour on, which is made for a man. so it didn't fit across the boobs. it didn't fit across the boobs. it didn't fit across the boobs. it didn't fit across the hips. it was up on one side. she had a gap here. she was exposed she was fire she was exposed and she was fire and she had a bone in her hair, and she had a bone in her hair, a helmet was tipped and she was completely compromised. and no one ever thought say , one had ever thought to say, well, that body armour well, why is that body armour not for a woman, is it now? not made for a woman, is it now? yes as a result of the report, another one was on operation women were quite often being caught short for sanitary products and although there was a box there for emergencies, you have to ask the commanding officer for the key to the box, which commanding officers usually a man, yeah. oh, you know what's going on? so i think what my report did was really jolt the mod and say, come on guys and girls , wake up, wake

guys and girls, wake up, wake up. amazing achievements . up. amazing achievements. there's one thing that you couldn't achieve . you disagreed couldn't achieve. you disagreed with ministers of whether the most serious charges facing troops, including rape and sexual assault using those cases should be removed from military courts and put through into the civilian system. first of all, why is that important ? if you why is that important? if you look at the statistics and we did some number crunching as part of this report that you are 4 to 6 times less likely to get a conviction for rape in a military court than you are in a civilian court 4 to 6 times less likely . that's using emoji data. likely. that's using emoji data. that's using the better data . that's using the better data. cps data is actually worse . i'm cps data is actually worse. i'm doing a bit of number crunching now to see whether things have changed. i don't think they've changed. i don't think they've changed that much . so that in changed that much. so that in itself speaks volumes. what's going wrong there ? couple that going wrong there? couple that with all the evidence we had about chain of command,

about cover up chain of command, the perpetrators , people being the perpetrators, people being sent home or told to have a bath , being sent home on a better leave for a few weeks, coupled with the evidence that only 16% of women who had accepted sexual assault were having forensic evidence taken within the 14 day window. well is no surprise that you can't get a conviction when you can't get a conviction when you haven't got the evidence because people commanding officers are saying, well , officers are saying, well, perhaps go home and have a bath or take some paracetamol and see how you feel. so criminal . also how you feel. so criminal. also as well that women weren't out in the middle of this process. there was no support for victims. so you'd face your perpetrator in the cookhouse , perpetrator in the cookhouse, you'd be working alongside your perpetrator. they often were males in a network, you know, this sort of gang up on you. so you then became the perpetrator. there was counter—claim and countersuing. so all that together, which is the evidence

we found in our report . no, together, which is the evidence we found in our report. no, i'd really still believe to this day it should be removed from the military justice system into the civilian justice system. just so women can have justice. and it's about this is all about not working at the military , which working at the military, which is what i've been criticised for doing on the most least woke person you'll ever find . it's person you'll ever find. it's about british values of justice and fairness and equality. how are you going to make it happen when next for the campaign? well there's a couple of things. i still this is this is what i do in parliament. this is my niche. this is my duty as the first female in parliament to ever had a military background. according to library records . there's no to library records. there's no one else on the there's 4106 women. i have a duty towards because of the position i found myself in. so i'm going to continue to pursue this. i voted against the government on the armed forces bill over this . i armed forces bill over this. i was stood down as a piece for the foreign secretary at the

time . i'll continue to do this time. i'll continue to do this because this is why i'm here. we're going to have a review of progress with the defence select committee towards christmas . a committee towards christmas. a few days ago i set up an appg and all party parliamentary group for women in defence. this is another avenue in which i can keep this going. i was a minister for a short while. that was great because i really had and since then to really press the mod used to say what are you doing? you know, what's your timescale, who's delivering what and when ? i'm not in that and when? i'm not in that position anymore. so i've got to find different avenues to do that. i will just keep going that. so i will just keep going for as long as i can. you're tough . you're no nonsense . you tough. you're no nonsense. you speak your mind . part of the speak your mind. part of the job, part of the territory of being an mp often abuse comes alongside it because i wouldn't try to mess with you . i look at try to mess with you. i look at abuse all the time, all the time. so wrexham didn't get the levelling up fund bid for the

second time, you know, and i had extra security for around six days because of the abuse. yes, please . security. police please. security. police monitoring . we had to get monitoring. we had to get parliamentary police involved because of death threats . sadly, because of death threats. sadly, it is part of the territory, particularly for a woman . and particularly for a woman. and you work hard, you know, chloe, you work hard, you know, chloe, you work hard, you know, chloe, you work really, really, really hard for your constituency , as hard for your constituency, as do my team. you know , none of us do my team. you know, none of us want to do anyone any harm. we always want to better what we're doing better, wrexham, make it better . help the people of better. help the people of wrexham . and then when you get wrexham. and then when you get death threats you just think why so the strategy is from day one that i knew it would demoralise me over time. even someone as strong as myself, you know, i've been a nurse and social worker for 27 years, so i'm not easily offended and i've got quite thick skin. other women haven't , the other people haven't . so , the other people haven't. so i put i put a strategy in place from day one that i would not look at my social media. i

transmit , but look at my social media. i transmit, but i look at my social media. i transmit , but i don't receive . i transmit, but i don't receive. i have someone else to do that for me and they will give me threads of what's going on to see whether i need to do anything. i'm a missing anything that wrexham needs that i haven't picked up on. but i do read those messages . so if you just those messages. so if you just had police, parliamentary security, a company you for, did you say six days? it was six days, four days and two days. given what threats and that was a few months ago, a few months ago . is that the worst it's ago. is that the worst it's been? have have you had to take any other security measures to keep yourself safe? yes i have. ihave keep yourself safe? yes i have. i have quite a few security measures. i have had death threats at the house post posted, someone banging on the windows. want to kill me? what yeah. yeah. i've never. i don't think i've ever heard of any mp having someone actually come to your home, bang on your window. well i thought, to be honest, i thought i could do escalate it. being a social worker, it didn't go well. so we had to call the

police. yeah, i was there alone as well. the police come quickly . they were fantastic. north wales police hats off to them. they are really supportive . you they are really supportive. you i think you're brilliant. i think you're a breath of fresh air to parliament. thank you. sarah atherton . thank you . sarah atherton. thank you. coming up, britain's longest serving political journalist , serving political journalist, nigel nelson, i think was the most shocking thing i've ever heard in politics. certainly the most surprising coming up, leader of the scottish conservatives , douglas ross. why conservatives, douglas ross. why would young people, anyone get involved in politics if they think at some point while they're trying to represent their constituents, they're going life .

nigel nelson , britain's longest nigel nelson, britain's longest serving political editor. i've

worked on a range of newspapers the day after this interview is broadcast on monday, we formally become colleagues. you are gb news as senior political commentator. i'm going to ask you a question which i have been asked so many times . why is asked so many times. why is a lefty like you coming to john gb news? because the one thing that gb news actually really believes in is free speech. so i've made plenty of appearance . is there plenty of appearance. is there often i don't get on with the presenter or we don't agree on the same thing applies to the panellists, but at no point has anyone ever stopped me having my say so. i'm really looking forward to joining . joining gb forward to joining. joining gb news to continue having my say so. you throughout your career, you have covered many prime ministers you're now on your ninth prime minister of medals on medals, yeah. i mean, you you sort of managed to ratchet up in the last couple of years because we've had we've had an awful

lot. yeah. yeah. who stands out for you? one or two people. the two who really stand out . two who really stand out. margaret thatcher and tony blair. and i think that the what they show is that to be a successful prime minister, you need an underlying political philosophy which they both had. margaret thatcher was the free market. tony blair, his cherry picking from left and right. market. tony blair, his cherry picking from left and right . and picking from left and right. and that sort of stood me in good stead to actually to stay there for three election was so they they come as top of my list of course they both then disappear because of major mistakes . tony because of major mistakes. tony blair obviously because of iran like margaret thatcher was a poll tax , but they were poll tax, but they were successful for the time that they were in in power. is it fair to ask if you have liked any particular prime minister more than any of the other eight? it is probably fair to ask that that i certainly like tony blair, i enjoyed his

company. i like john major very much. i think that he was traduced as the grey man, which i don't think he actually was . i i don't think he actually was. i also enjoyed david cameron's company. i think that david cameron was a bit like like tony blair. margaret thatcher. absolutely terrified me when i did see. yeah absolutely. that she'd hit you as a laser blue eyes would melt . but i watched eyes would melt. but i watched cabinet ministers melting too, so i wasn't alone. and of course, you've seen prime ministers rise and fall, as you said, other any anecdotes you can share with us which give us an insight into how they feel? well i mean, one example would be the fall of margaret thatcher, which was the nearest thing to may, the mayhem of last year. thing to may, the mayhem of last year . so i was thing to may, the mayhem of last year. so i was at a party conference, cecil parkinson was then transport secretary and he was dining at a table next door to me in the conference hotel .

to me in the conference hotel. he got louder and louder as the evening went on and began attacking the entire cabinet at his most memorable phrase was if the cabinet was a racehorse , i the cabinet was a racehorse, i wouldn't put a bet on that . and wouldn't put a bet on that. and then he rubbished individual cabinet colleagues . and you cabinet colleagues. and you could hear i could hear all this going on. so a notebook came out under my table jotting down all these various phrases. it made a splash in the sun. people that that someday . and then there was that someday. and then there was a big question about whether i'd acted ethically . my view is it acted ethically. my view is it was in the public interest. he was in the public interest. he was talking in a public place . was talking in a public place. he wasn't talking to me on any kind of lobbying terms. so i think it was ethical, but i certainly got in the nec for doing it. that's really interesting. i mean, i'm assuming that drink had been taken by cecil parkinson. indeed it had . do you think that our it had. do you think that our politicians used to drink more than they perhaps do now? yes,

absolutely . that when i joined absolutely. that when i joined the house of commons in 1986, the house of commons in 1986, the place floated on a sea of alcohol and there were employees who had too much time on their hands and spent most of it in the bars. i mean, you even had situations where employees were being propped up by colleagues to go through the voting lobbies. that's gradually changed. and i think that that is now much better . they drink is now much better. they drink much more responsibly. they still drink, but anything still drink, but not anything like they used to. and certainly the lunches where you might see three bottles of wine go down. now it's a couple of bottles of water. really depressing . i used water. really depressing. i used to enjoy those lunches with them. bottles of wine, but i could see it was on its way, on its out during my time. so its way out during my time. so it's interesting what you said about damage, because we have in our minds as voters, we ascribe personalities to the various prime ministers so margaret thatcher, strong , john major

thatcher, strong, john major boring. but you say he he wasn't bonng? boring. but you say he he wasn't boring? not at all. no. i was at a private dinner with him during a private dinner with him during a party conference , whereupon he a party conference, whereupon he got incredibly drunk and. really? yeah, absolutely. he was very lively and he got hugely drunk and started singing the theme song from the 1950s radio show, much binding in the marsh. and he was singing that to the table . he was then chancellor table. he was then chancellor and he was making his big economic speech the following day. he was chancellor. he was chancellor at the time, and i was sitting next to his wife, norma, and she be very snippy to him through the whole evening . him through the whole evening. and i thought, well, these two don't seem to get very well. don't seem to get on very well. what didn't know at that what i didn't know at that particular time was that only a couple of weeks previously she'd found out about his affair with edwina currie . must have edwina currie. you must have been. we were all really shocked by that. i think. what's the most shocking i've ever most shocking thing i've ever heard politics? the heard in politics? certainly the

most when we first most surprising. when we first heard about it, we had a different party conference and i was dining with a few journalists, colleagues and the moment of the news came through. we all rushed out of the restaurant to try and get a signal. our mobile phones to go into a london . my editor thought into a london. my editor thought i'd been drinking was he didn't believe it . i'd been drinking was he didn't believe it. coming up, more tales from nigel nelson after the break. but i was right. the story about a used condom being found near the speaker's chair. and i was then hauled in by the sergeant at arms , which is sergeant at arms, which is a very odd experience to be to have a rollicking from the sergeant arms, man wearing sergeant arms, a man wearing women's tights with a sword on the front of you.

you know . you mentioned that you know. you mentioned that norma major, that you think the rule of the prime minister's spouse has changed in your long

tenure ? probably it changed a tenure? probably it changed a bit. i think , with david cameron bit. i think, with david cameron that in the sense that a spouse who decided to actually try and take much more of a back seat, i think after that, i think , yes, think after that, i think, yes, that they that they play a much lesser role. and a lot of that is to do with protecting families, which i can understand the it's the prime minister who is the one who was elected and understandably, they don't want too much scrutiny on their family , which i think probably family, which i think probably is fair enough political journalists are subject to some quite unique and stress rules about how they work because they have offices in the palace of westminster , the lobby team, as westminster, the lobby team, as it were. you were expelled for tracks. the rules? yes to help me through it. well this was in betty boothroyd stay when she was speaker. she been progressively not liking things. i was writing and what were you writing? well i mean, one

example was that i was writing a story about a use condom being found near the speaker's chair. and i was then hold him by the sergeant at arms, which is a very odd experience to be to have a rollicking from the sergeant arms, a man wearing women's tights with a sword on the table in front of you. but the table in front of you. but the that was that was just a telling off the next time there was a story that came through about mps receiving booby trapped mail from animal rights activists, the police thought it might have been contaminated with anthrax . i wrote the story. with anthrax. i wrote the story. betty boothroyd objected to it. expel me from the house of commons for 20 sitting days. i moved into the red lion pub nearby and had six weeks in a pub to go and work in, which was great. you talked about how the drinking culture has changed, has the booing and bringing the images in, the house of commons that voters see every week at

premises, question time, has that stayed about the same ? has that stayed about the same? has it got worse? has it got better in your speech? no, that's been about the same. right. the last two. it is such a bad image to put. it is which i think they can't help themselves, but know thatis can't help themselves, but know that is actually that has been a consistent all through the 36 years i've been there . the years i've been there. the biggest change i've noticed is i think that the quality of debate is much less and this is something that in fact happens in the in the whole country . in the in the whole country. we've now got to a stage, i think partly because of the division caused by brexit and still still causing division is partly to do with social everything. now seems to have to be black and white. you are a brexiteer or you're remainer. there's no kind of grey or in between. and people are very sort of certain about their position on transgender issues colonialism, slavery , covid, colonialism, slavery, covid, vaccines . and that is, in fact, vaccines. and that is, in fact, of the house of commons. so you

find them rather similar and the whole point of debate is to listen, to learn, even change your mind during it and that's what's lacking at the moment . what's lacking at the moment. final question, your best political or your best scoop ? political or your best scoop? choose. choose which one you like best. it's got to be cecil parkinson eavesdropper. going to have no question of that. did you ever speak to you after that? yes but not in a terribly friendly way. well, i will always talk to in a friendly way . viewers is looking forward to seeing even more of you than they have already. and i'm certainly looking forward to formally being colleagues come tomorrow nigel nelson to thank. coming up , tomorrow nigel nelson to thank. coming up, leader of the scottish conservatives douglas ross of invite you to say something nice . her yeah something nice. her yeah absolutely. for one very good reason that we had to be on together and she still got to pick up. i bet that she wouldn't be the leader. they speak in the

next election. so i want to make sure i get my money over before she leaves . there's help for households. are you over state pension age? if your weekly income is below £182.60, or £278.70 if you live with a partner, you could be eligible for pension credit, even if you own your home or have savings. it's worth, on average, £3,500 a year and you could get help with heating bills and more, plus up to £900 in cost of living payments.

douglas ross , leader of the douglas ross, leader of the scottish conservative mp for morrisons, 2017. you have a normal job before you entered politics, you were a family. so will you indulge me in asking you this question? i can't think of anybody else. i would ask it . how many cows you reckon you've milked for? many, many. i

mean, i loved it. i did it for years, eh? my dad was a farm labourer, so i was brought up in the farm that he worked at and from the earliest years i can remember. that's all i want to do. when got home from school do. when i got home from school or at the weekends, an older sister and a twin sister and a twin. and my two sisters just wanted do stuff around the wanted to do stuff around the house or homework and i just wanted to get the so yeah, wanted to get the farm. so yeah, i couldn't begin to calculate how i that you how many and i right that you sometimes clips of cows to sometimes watch clips of cows to relax. yeah. my wife doesn't really like it, so i've eaten. i was big into shoeing, so i had pedigree cows myself . i dunno, pedigree cows myself. i dunno, judging in the past. so i like to see these big american or canadian shoes where you've got the creme de la creme of the holstein world. that was the type excuse i like, but it seems a bit boring when you see it like that. you shouldn't repeat that. so let's about the that. so let's talk about the snp leadership contest, which is going to conclude the day after this interview is broadcast.

going to conclude the day after this interview is broadcast . you this interview is broadcast. you must know the candidates personally . could you be friends personally. could you be friends with any of them? well i'm not friends with nicola. a i think that's been well reported. ted and i have a very frosty relationship. i think it comes from both sides. i know all the candidates probably better than i knew. nicola humza yousaf is obviously the current health secretary and done a lot. secretary and i've done a lot. we've a big issue, murray, we've had a big issue, murray, with services , with the maternity services, which my own family which has affected my own family and of many meetings and the use of many meetings with me and discussions about that and who. kate forbes quite well, because we came into the scottish parliament together in 2016 and when i was a minister in scotland office, she was a junior minister , the scottish junior minister, the scottish government. we had a number of meetings don't know meetings together, i don't know quite well. obviously she quite so well. obviously she resigned from government. it seems i did on nicola sturgeon's get our bills so the three of them will all be very different and see who's announced and we'll see who's announced tomorrow. imagine tomorrow. could you imagine having with event having a drink with an event possibly ? you know it said it. possibly? you know it said it. it'll be interesting cause it would be a different style of

politics than we've seen from nicola the last nicola sturgeon over the last eight so years. tell me which eight or so years. tell me which one. the of the one. as the leader of the scottish tories, tell me who you're hoping. not to win because that will be really successful. well don't think any because that will be really su them ul. well don't think any because that will be really su them williiell don't think any because that will be really su them will be. don't think any because that will be really su them will be successfulk any of them will be successful because they're because they've all said they're going independence front going to put independence front and simply to. and centre. they are simply to. but everything but the problem is everything else health else gets ignored. the health service yousaf is in service humza yousaf is in charge the economy that kate charge of the economy that kate forbes is in charge of it. all of these issues are more of these issues are far more than independence, that's than independence, but that's all about. all they're speaking about. douglas believe when douglas i don't believe when you're chats with you're in private chats with your colleagues, you don't say , your colleagues, you don't say, oh gosh, i hope x doesn't win because they're a bit more formidable . this isn't formidable. this isn't a politician trying to be a voice of reason that they're all very different. so for different reasons, they will bring challenges and opportunities for the opposition parties . i look the opposition parties. i look forward to seeing who's successful and who will be facing it. first minister's question and you do a feisty relationship with nick nicola sturgeon, you said. in fact , sturgeon, as you said. in fact, just of weeks ago , she just a couple of weeks ago, she said you would never reach said that you would never reach the dizzying heights of

mediocrity . yeah. does that sort mediocrity. yeah. does that sort of language, does it hurt any way? is that part of it's an acceptable source of know bitter banter ? well, in politics banter? well, in politics interestingly , that question interestingly, that question came about because i was quoting kate forbes back at the first minister and kate forbes and said that nicola sturgeon's government had been pretty mediocre over the last few years. and we couldn't continue with more of the same. so i agree with kate forbes on that, but no, i often see nicola sturgeon just deciding to ignore the question asked and the question i've asked her and just for the personal attack just go for the personal attack . that normally me . and that normally tells me i've underestimated, i've got underestimated, which is from my is to say successful from my point and you're not point of view. and you're not standing general election standing at the general election to be elected as an mp again next time. yeah you want to focus all your efforts on as a member of the scottish parliament. yeah. so when i became a leader of the scottish conservatives i was, had just been re—elected to westminster in the 2019 election. this was august 2020. so i a commitment that i'd survive the race. my

time as mp for motty it's my whole media. the only place i've ever lived and worked my own family or the or no. and i wanted to give that commitment. and at the next election i said i would step down and will i would step down and i will continue as an msp for the highlands and islands party leader, what will you, if anything, will about anything, will you miss about those green benches, about westminster? it's the history. say, if thing that surrounds you. you know, i've had the great privilege of being a minister speaking at the despatch we prime despatch box. we are prime ministers decades before ministers and for decades before have stood up and given very important statements and speeches and on the backbenches, you remember when i came you know, i remember when i came in 2017, king clarke was , the in in 2017, king clarke was, the father of the house, and i remember watching when i remember watching budgets when i was he was was younger and he was delivering these budgets, obviously, on our benches at the moment. more former moment. we've got more former prime than prime ministers than ever before. know, there's before. so you know, there's a lot of history on those benches andifs lot of history on those benches and it's you know, it's an amazing place to call your workplace. i you want mr. workplace. i bet you want mr. the though. i wouldn't the commute though. i wouldn't you know we're filming this and it took me five and a half hours

to door to door. hey, last to be door to door. hey, last week it was seven and a half hours. a bit for hours. there was a bit for getting ac report today. so getting an ac report today. so yeah, there's a lot of challenges, even, know, challenges, but even, you know, edinburgh, and edinburgh, holyrood, three and a half hours from home well. so half hours from home as well. so there's, you know, if we could get up they get parliament up and they all get parliament up and they all get i'd be happy get our money, i'd be very happy with don't think that's with that. i don't think that's going happen any time soon. going to happen any time soon. so we talked about you being a farmer you entered farmer before you entered politics. you've also got other interests. football interests. you are a football referee . talk to me about how referee. talk to me about how you felt during the scottish cup tie when you were an assistant referee during that game and a banner was unveiled. it was aimed at you. it was sufficiently offensive that ? i sufficiently offensive that? i won't read exactly what it said , but it's douglas ross is , a , but it's douglas ross is, a four letter word is how did that make you feel? well, interestingly , before that, interestingly, before that, there's a bit before the button that says v. our decision confirms douglas ross as a four letter word and, you know, the ironic thing was it was just

after the vr for a google that had celtic and not had awarded to celtic and not that i would excuse the language or the botnet in any way, but if i got decision wrong and i got the decision wrong and i needed vr, then i could understand it. it just seemed understand it. so it just seemed a strange. they did a bit strange. they did obviously well prepared to unfurl immediately unfurl it and didn't immediately nofice unfurl it and didn't immediately notice it. i this huge cheer a going right in celtic park. i didn't know what it was about. sometimes if there's simultaneous games it can be a school, not of the game. but i knew we were the league kick—off that night and then i caught out the eye, saw it, the corner of my eye, saw it, and just got on with my job and i just got on with my job because i was there for 90 minutes to support referee minutes to support the referee in that case, stephen mclean, to make sure the refereeing team got and got our decisions right. and thankfully that day. i got thankfully i did that day. i got through the match with no controversy that. but controversy apart from that. but on the pitch, i had on the pitch, you know, i had a job and i did it. no hurt, job to do and i did it. no hurt, no, not really. really. i suppose for me, it's more how it impacts family. you know only impacts my family. you know only about you. do about your family, do you. do you yeah. so my wife's you have. yeah. so my wife's a police officer. am, you know, she has an extremely stressful job. and i want to go

job. and at times i want to go home, unburden my job and things that have happened in refereeing. think, well, refereeing. and i think, well, she's with some she's been dealing with some pretty herself. pretty serious stuff herself. she's in elgin. and she's a sergeant in elgin. and so it's the areas so it's one of the areas i represent . and we've got two represent. and we've got two boys. and i think for me , boys. and i think for me, thankfully, the attack needs a quick . you know, my quick new idea. you know, my oldest is four. my youngest be two in june. so they don't know, you the only thing, you know, the only thing, alister, news that alister, my oldest news is that , know, the line and when , you know, on the line and when i i'm to football, he i say i'm off to football, he starts running sideways and down the house, which is great. so i think maybe destined for think he's maybe destined for a refereeing role a leading refereeing role in a leading role. but yeah, you know, my parents, see stuff parents, you know, see stuff on social media me about it social media and ask me about it . so it's more the impact it has on my family. do they feel hurt when ask you about it? can when they ask you about it? can you can you give me an insight into how they put it to? is it worth it? do they say, oh, why do these people say this about you? yeah, i think i mean, you know, i've been in politics for a locally and on a long time locally and on nationally now. so, you know, i think they understand things are

going about me, going to be said about me, reported me, that reported about me, that hopefully with . i hopefully they disagree with. i think do . but i tend to be think they do. but i tend to be you know, i don't get to wind up about these things if they ask me. i just brush it off and move on to the next thing. so maybe i should open up a wee bit more, but yeah, you know, the court but yeah, you know, in the court like you don't want anything like it, you don't want anything like it, you don't want anything like that written about like that to be written about yet. think i would see, you yet. i think i would see, you know, sfa, the scottish know, the sfa, the scottish football association been football association have been very refereeing very supportive. my refereeing deputy refereeing got in deputy head of refereeing got in contact very quickly and what i don't want see trade and don't want to see is a trade and being you know, if somehow being say, you know, if somehow think it's acceptable to see that a game, i'm that about me in a game, i'm officiating because my officiating out because of my job, game, it's going job, the next game, it's going to about another referee of to be about another referee of a decision, that would be decision, and that would be completely and completely unacceptable. and i don't understand the rules of football you because football like you do because there was written there are laws was written presumably like would have presumably like it would have been possible to detect who was holding up that banner. does anything happen to. i do. you know, i got an update from the scots uefa last week that there that are ongoing discussions about it it's a signifier kim

bonner so there were people aware of it before it got unfurled. but that's totally out of my remit. you know, i go to my games, you know, i officiate them to the best of my ability. you know, i'm fortunate to be, you know, officiating games at celtic park, at premiership grounds across scotland. it's something very proud of that something i'm very proud of that idea. fishy at the highest level domestically and i've done it for a long time and i want to continue to that despite what continue to do that despite what some fans might think some of the fans might think that you last year, you got a horrible email . why not do the horrible email. why not do the honourable thing and end your petty existence? that was the content of an email you received . who was it from ? what happened . who was it from? what happened to them? how did you feel when you got that? yeah, it was from a constituent who'd been in touch about a number of things, and i was going back and forward and i was going back and forward and to to his and trying to respond to his correspondence and he was just becoming increasingly erratic with what he was asking about and seeing in his emails. with what he was asking about and seeing in his emails . and i and seeing in his emails. and i remember it was very early one

morning, i think, you know, from the top of my head it might have been like a monday morning. and i sat in the airport at 5:30 waiting for my flight. and i saw this had sent at two the this had been sent at two in the morning or something. and he said what said. then i said what you said. and then i think you went to on see something like if don't something like and if you don't do and wiser, do it, someone older and wiser, a do it for you. and to me a will do it for you. and to me that just went beyond what i've accepted as, know, and accepted as, you know, rough and tumble of politics and people disagreeing with you in the past. just you past. and i just decided, you know, genuinely think know, he may genuinely think that are people out there that should against should take that action against me? i spoke to my office me? so i spoke to my office manager, who's a former chief inspector in the police and money and we reported it. inspector in the police and money and we reported it . and money and we reported it. and again suddenly i think i'd say again i suddenly i think i'd say to him he started work it out for seven, 8:00 or something. and then i thought, well .

and then i thought, well. douglas ross, leader of the scottish conservatives mp for morrisons 2017, and you have a normal job before you entered politics, you were a farm labourer. so will you indulge in asking you this questions ? i asking you this questions? i can't think of anybody else. i would ask it. how many cows you reckon you've milked for? many, many. i mean, i loved it. i did it for years. a my dad was a farm labourer, so i was brought up in the farm that he worked at and from the earliest years i can remember, that's all i want to do. when i got home from school or the weekends, i've school or at the weekends, i've got older and a twin got an older sister and a twin sister. a twin and my two sister. i'm a twin and my two sisters just wanted to do stuff around the house or homework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajustd the house or homework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajust wanted>use or homework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajust wanted toe or homework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajust wanted to get homework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajust wanted to get in>mework and sisters just wanted to do stuff ajust wanted to get in the work and i just wanted to get in the farm. so yeah, i couldn't even begin to calculate how many. and i you sometimes watch i write that you sometimes watch clips relax. yeah clips of cows to relax. yeah wife doesn't really like it, so i've eaten. i was big into shoeing, so i had pedigree cows

myself. i dunno, judging in the past. so i like to see these big american or canadian shoes where you've got the creme de la creme of holstein world. that was of the holstein world. that was the covid that i like. the type of covid that i like. but seems bit boring when but it seems a bit boring when you i that you you see it. i like that you shouldn't repeat that. so let's talk about the snp leadership contest, which is going to conclude to the day after this interview is broadcast . you must interview is broadcast. you must know the candidates personally could you be friends with any of them? well, i'm not friends with nicola . i them? well, i'm not friends with nicola. i think them? well, i'm not friends with nicola . i think that's been well nicola. i think that's been well reported. ted and i have a very frosty relationship . i think it frosty relationship. i think it comes from both sides . i know comes from both sides. i know all the candidates probably better than i knew nicola humza yousaf is obviously the current health secretary and i've done a lot. we've had a big issue in murray with maternity murray with the maternity services my services which has affected my own family and humza yousaf has had many meetings with me and discussions about that and who? kate forbes well because kate forbes quite well because we scottish we came into the scottish parliament together 2016 and

when i was a minister in scotland office, she was a junior minister in the scottish government. we had a number of meetings together and i don't know quite so well obviously she resigned from government to the same i on nicola same position i did on nicola sturgeon of our bill. so sturgeon instead of our bill. so the three of them will all be very different see very different and we'll see who's announced could who's announced tomorrow. could imagine having a drink with i never possibly say it'll be interesting cause it will a interesting cause it will be a very different of politics very different style of politics than seen from nicola than we've seen from nicola sturgeon last eight or sturgeon over the last eight or so . tell me which one. as so years. tell me which one. as the leader of the scottish tories tell who you're tories, tell me who you're hoping win because that hoping not to win because that will be really successful. well, i don't think of them will i don't think any of them will be because they've i don't think any of them will be they're ecause they've i don't think any of them will be they're ecauseto |ey've i don't think any of them will be they're ecauseto put'e all said they're going to put independence front and centre. they speaking. but the they are speaking. but the problem else gets problem is everything else gets ignored. service ignored. the health service humza charge of the humza yousaf is in charge of the economy kate forbes economy that kate forbes is in charge all of these issues charge of all of these issues are more important than are far more important than independence that. independence for that. so they're speaking douglas . they're speaking about douglas. i that when you're i don't believe that when you're an private chats with your colleagues , don't oh colleagues, you don't say, oh gosh, i hope x doesn't win because they're a bit more

formidable . this isn't formidable. this isn't a politician trying to be a voice of reason that they're all very different. so for different reasons , they will bring reasons, they will bring challenges and opportunities for the opposition parties . and i the opposition parties. and i look forward to seeing who's successful who be successful and who will be facing it. first minister's question do have question and you do have a feisty relationship with nick nicola said. in nicola sturgeon, as you said. in fact, just a couple of weeks ago, she said that you would never reach the dizzying heights . mediocrity. yeah. does that sort of languish . does it hurt sort of languish. does it hurt in any way? is that part of it's an acceptable source of bit banter? well, in politics, it interestingly that that question came about because i was quoting kate forbes back at the first minister and kate forbes had said that nicola sturgeon's government had been pretty mediocre over the last few years, and we couldn't continue with more of the same. so i agree with kate forbes on that, but i see nicola but no, i often see nicola sturgeon just deciding to ignore the question i've asked her and just go for the personal attack.

and normally tells i've and that normally tells me i've got rush in, which is, got a rush to get in, which is, i successful from my point i say, successful from my point of you're not standing of view, and you're not standing at general election to be elected as an mp again next time. yeah. you want a focus all your efforts on hollyrood as a member of the scottish parliament. yeah. so when i became leader the scottish became a leader of the scottish conservatives was had just conservatives i was had just been re—elected to westminster in the 2019 election. this was august 2020. so i made a commitment that i'd serve the rest of my time as mp for motty. it's my whole media, the only place i've ever and worked place i've ever lived and worked my are there now and my own family are there now and i give that i wanted to give that commitment. at next commitment. and at the next election i step election i said i would step down and will continue as an down and i will continue as an msp for the highlands and islands and party leader. what will if anything, will you will you, if anything, will you miss those benches , miss about those green benches, about the about westminster? it's the history . say everything that history. say everything that surrounds you . i've had the surrounds you. i've had the great privilege a great privilege of being a minister at the minister speaking at the dispatch are prime dispatch box. we are prime ministers and for ministers currently and for decades before have stood up and given very important statements and speeches and on the backbenches you know, i remember

when i came in in 2017, king clarke was the father of the house. and i remember watching budgets when i was younger, and he delivering these budgets, he was delivering these budgets, obviously, the obviously, on our benches at the moment. we've more

prime good evening. i'm radisson in the gb newsroom. tensions have heightened between russia and ukraine with russian state media alleging that a blast in the country's tula region was caused by a ukrainian drone packed with explosives. three people were reportedly injured when they were struck by shrapnel. however, ukraine has not claimed responsibility for this alleged attack . it follows pleas from attack. it follows pleas from the european union for russia to halt the stationing of nuclear weapons in belarus . cave's weapons in belarus. cave's foreign ministry has called the decision provocative and is calling for a session of the un