setback for the government's stop the boats pledge, which is one of prime minister rishi sunak's five key policies as people in scotland and wales could soon be able to access nhs treatment in england . health treatment in england. health secretary steve barclay has ianed secretary steve barclay has invited his welsh and scottish counterparts to discuss different approaches that could be taken to tackle the backlog . be taken to tackle the backlog. more than 73,000 people in wales and more than 21,000 people in scotland have been waiting for more than a year for treatment . more than a year for treatment. pubsin more than a year for treatment. pubs in england and wales will be allowed to continue selling takeaway pints after the government decided to keep covid licencing rules they were due to expire in september. but it's understood the prime minister has listened to the industry loud and clear. as first reported in the sun , pubs were reported in the sun, pubs were allowed to sell alcohol through allowed to sell alcohol through a hatch during the pandemic and the move is set to help the hospitality sector boost its sales to recover from the pandemic relative lives of those who died in the omagh bombing. 25 years ago have held a special

service to mark the anniversary . 29 people, including a pregnant woman with twins, died in the car bomb attack by the real ira. it was the greatest single loss of life in the history of the troubles. no one's been criminally convicted of carrying out the attack . 93 of carrying out the attack. 93 people have now been confirmed dead from the wildfires on the hawaiian island of maui. it is the deadliest us fire in more than a century. that number, though, is expected to rise significantly in the coming days as authorities continue the painstaking task of identifying the bodies search teams with sniffer dogs have been sifting through the remains of the historic town of lahaina. but as of last night, just 3% of the affected area had been covered. support centres have been set up across the island, providing respite at and helping families reunite with a lot of families that were stuck and had to swim like i couldn't imagine my son swimming and my grandma swimming in the water.

>> i think in my in my life, what i have imagined that we would have something like this, a qatar atrophy of and unequal disaster . disaster. >> our entire island is been devastated by this. but none more so than the individuals who are still looking for loved ones or know that they've already lost their loved ones . lost their loved ones. >> this is gb news. i'll be back with more in about an hour's time . time. >> the mother of an autistic teenager arrested for hate speech is set to sue the west yorkshire police. a tudor warship is subject to reinterpretation through a queer lens and a lesbian speed dating eventis lens and a lesbian speed dating event is cancelled because it refuses to admit men . this is refuses to admit men. this is free speech nation . welcome to free speech nation. welcome to

free speech nation. welcome to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. this is the show where we take a look at culture current affairs and politics and of course, we'll have the latest from those lovable culture warriors. they tried warriors. what have they tried to this week? well, to cancel this week? oh, well, coming show tonight, coming up on the show tonight, we're going to hear about how a successful event successful lesbian social event was down after a campaign was shut down after a campaign of intimidation and harassment following of intimidation and harassment follnot|g of intimidation and harassment follnot to allow a trans >> not to allow a trans identifying male to attend. i'm going to be speaking to sharon davis, one of britain's greatest ever swimmers. she's become a fearless campaigner for women's rights has written rights and has written a brilliant book, mary brilliant new book, the mary rose museum is at the centre of a row after putting an lgbt spin on some of their exhibits. historian david starkey will be here that . and of here to discuss that. and of course, and my fantastic course, me and my fantastic panel to answer panel will be here to answer questions our beautiful questions from our beautiful studio my comedian studio audience. my comedian panellist this evening are cressida wetton and frances foster, who . so how are you both foster, who. so how are you both this week? >> are you happy? very well. very joyful. a joy, frances. >> yeah, indeed, mate. delighted

to be here. wow. >> it sounds so insincere when you say it. >> thanks, mate. >> thanks, mate. >> it'sjust >> thanks, mate. >> it's just something to do with accent. i don't know with your accent. i don't know what is anyway, but look, what it is anyway, but look, we're going to get into the audience we've such audience because we've got such audience because we've got such a big crowd here today. a lovely big crowd here today. we're start with we're going to start with joel. joel, what's your question? hello. >> should the police be >> i do. should the police be arresting children? yeah. >> this been the big story >> this has been the big story of week. really you'll of the week. really and you'll you'll viral video you'll have seen the viral video that online where there's that went online where there's police officers. well, one police officers. well, one police officers. well, one police officer heard apparently this year this autistic teenager, 16 year old, her as looking old, referred to her as looking like lesbian nana. like her lesbian nana. the police pushed into the police then pushed into the house arrested the girl . the house and arrested the girl. the video very disturbing because video is very disturbing because she's own head. she's hitting her own head. she's screaming . the mother is she's screaming. the mother is trying that she's trying to explain that she's autistic isn't autistic and that this isn't appropriate. police officer appropriate. the police officer saying this is homophobic and it's the has got to it's got the arrest has got to happen. held her in cell happen. they held her in a cell for 20 so what the for 20 hours. so what the interesting development is interesting development now is that family to sue that the family are going to sue west police . what do west yorkshire police. what do you think about this, frances? >> they're absolutely >> i think they're absolutely should sue and yorkshire yorkshire deserve yorkshire police do deserve to be absolutely be sued. it's absolutely disgraceful. who any disgraceful. anybody who has any experience children

experience of autistic children will that they say things will know that they say things in a way that is, quite to put it mildly, blunt, simply because they don't have the filters that neurotypical people do in social situations . situations. >> evans yeah, well, you and i both have taught autistic children, yes, we're fully aware of that. maybe the police are not, they surely should be. not, but they surely should be. we actually have got a clip of what happened. if we can have a look come away my teenage look come away from my teenage daughter , is something wrong daughter, is something wrong with you, mate? >> she didn't aim it at the police remarks at my police officer remarks at my mother. it's not a homophobic remark, she said. i think she's a lesbian. like like nana. i think if you want to bully people, you just. you'll just get one of them badges there. that's what you do. yeah, exactly . right over there. she's exactly. right over there. she's autistic. she don't like people touching her. she will have a meltdown . she won't come out. meltdown. she won't come out. she's got autism . i'm leaving how. >> now. >> krista, what's interesting about this is that you know, we had harry miller from fair cop on the show talking about how

this was effectively breaking and entering. this was effectively kidnap on the on the base of the police. now, the police are saying that there's more to this story than we know. they're there's body they're saying that there's body cam further cam footage. there's further context if context that changes. but if that's the case, they really should that information, should release that information, shouldn't should release that information, shoyeah, they should at least >> yeah, they should at least get a social manager. get a new social media manager. >> it's been like, >> yeah. i mean, it's been like, what, or days now? where's what, 2 or 3 days now? where's the footage? guys? show us what you've got. mean, it's you've got. yeah, i mean, it's appalling. also, don't you appalling. and also, don't you think you're police, think if you're in the police, you should strong enough to you should be strong enough to take a teenager? that take a cheeky teenager? if that is although it's is what happened? although it's sounding the teenager sounding like the teenager wasn't even trying be wasn't even trying to be abusive. mean. well abusive. i mean. well also, there's this there's the issue of this happening someone's home, happening within someone's home, someone's happening within someone's home, someon know, cannot be a >> you know, it cannot be a pubuc >> you know, it cannot be a public order offence. whatever someone's horrible someone's however horrible the thing says their thing that someone says in their own private dwelling, there is a defence within defence against that within the law. the law. so what is the justification in here? >> there is no justification. what to happen is what actually needs to happen is something common sense. something called common sense. yeah. the officer yeah. where the police officer would little girl aside would take the little girl aside or aside and go, look, or the girl aside and go, look, i understand what you're i do understand what you're saying. that you saying. i understand that you may autistic, you also

may be autistic, but you also need what is and isn't need to think what is and isn't appropriate an adult. appropriate to say to an adult. and this isn't appropriate. all that. needs a that. it just needs a conversation. that. it just needs a con but ation. that. it just needs a con but ationisn't that. it just needs a conbut ationisn't it an >> but why isn't it an appropriate like for girl to appropriate like for a girl to say that looks like my say that she looks like my lesbian there's no lesbian nana there's no homophobia that. homophobia within that. >> her grandmother is gay and lives with another it's lives with another woman. it's not place of not coming from a place of homophobia. and i think it's weird. find odd, actually. weird. i find it odd, actually. anyway the police are anyway that the police are arresting people for they arresting people for what they say. that? say. how about that? >> well, completely agree with >> well, i completely agree with you, number two you, number one. but number two as well, it also needs a conversation because when you're going in life, can't going around in life, you can't just say what you think and feel because i have both because as you and i have both found out to our detriment. andrew that. andrew people get upset by that. >> do, don't they? yeah. >> they do, don't they? yeah. i don't really understand why that is. >> no, neither do i. i think maybe we might be autistic, mate. >> it's certainly not going to stop is it? yeah. no. stop you, is it? yeah. no. >> well, think again, frances, because you often cross red because you often cross the red line. you're to line. anyway, you're going to get question now from alex. get a question now from alex. where hello alex. hi. where is alex? hello alex. hi. >> the banned the 1975, >> should the banned the 1975, should damages for the should they pay damages for the contract which they broke? >> yeah. contract which they broke? >> soah. contract which they broke? >> so this group, 1975, i haven't heard of before until

this because i'm this story but they because i'm not really on the pulse but they they've pay £2 they've been asked to pay £2 million because they million in damages because they breached these when they were performing malaysia. there performing in malaysia. there was reason was a contract. and the reason why is that i why they breached it is that i think the lead singer, matt healy, kissed his healy, kissed one of his bandmates as protest against bandmates as a protest against the country's anti—gay laws. the malaysian the country's anti—gay laws. the malaysia in saying, owe stepping in and saying, you owe us all the money because the event had be cancelled event had to be cancelled because law now. because you broke the law now. but cressida, you know, in a country where is country where being gay is illegal, isn't this rather a good thing that they this? good thing that they did this? >> is we're always >> well, this is we're always moaning that all the pride celebrations on here celebrations that go on here might be unnecessary because it's be gay. it's not illegal to be gay. yeah. so it's often said, why don't you take your protest to a country it matters? well, country where it matters? well, they've they? they've done that, haven't they? right. guess we could give right. so i guess we could give them a pat on the back. >> mean, we just read this >> i mean, we just read this week taxpayers have week that the taxpayers have basically £1 million basically paid half £1 million this year on rainbow lanyards in the sector. and rainbow the public sector. and rainbow merchandise and paraphernalia. what money. but in a what a waste of money. but in a country where being gay is illegal, for protest illegal, i'm all for protest of this absolutely. this kind. no, absolutely. >> that you need

>> and the thing that you need to understand as well, andrew, is that the malaysian government are collection are the biggest collection of grade ever grade a wet wipes that have ever existed. is that right? yeah, it is. there very comedian is. so there was a very comedian called chia, called jocelyn chia, a singaporean comedian, and she made a joke about missing made a joke about the missing malaysian right yes, i malaysian airline. right yes, i remember this. it went viral. yeah. malaysia had a meltdown , yeah. malaysia had a meltdown, went to singapore, went you've got to do something about this. they're making fun of and they're making fun of us. and then when the singaporeans didn't do something, they reported interpol. you reported her to interpol. you make them sound like infants . make them sound like infants. >> they are infants. this is, i think somebody should go out directly outside the government and have sex and see what they think about it. >> that needs to happen. that's the way freedom is going to the only way freedom is going to be . the only way freedom is going to be francis . the only way freedom is going to be francis family show. so let's >> francis family show. so let's kind dial kind of talk kind of dial that kind of talk down. but that happens in families. i think issue families. i think the issue here, though, is very much that they did something which i thought was quite an interesting protest. >> i spent a lot of time in cornwall, sorry, no. one as a west country person. >> now do. exactly. i don't >> now you do. exactly. i don't want row break here.

want a row to break out here. >> this what we were talking >> this is what we were talking about. much. you about. you say too much. you need a filter. francis. you need a filter. >> i'm neurodivergent . not my fault. >> by the way. this is this is interesting about the nature of the malaysian government. yes. being tyrannical being basically quite tyrannical when ideas. when it comes to these ideas. you know, it's the same with it's the with president it's the same with president erdogan turkey. he can't erdogan of turkey. he can't take a when that satirist a joke when that german satirist made about him having made that joke about him having sexual with a goat, he sexual congress with a goat, he tried to get that person extradited from germany. and angela said yes, angela merkel almost said yes, right . so is so basically right. so this is so basically tyrants deserve to be mocked, don't they? >> absolutely. and you'll >> yeah, absolutely. and you'll get can't get mocked the more you can't laugh yourself , won't you? laugh at yourself, won't you? that's it works. yeah. that's how it works. yeah. >> i think >> yeah. okay. well, i think it's. think it's quite a good it's. i think it's quite a good thing for the band to do, but that's just me. okay, we're going to move on now to a question from neil. where's neil? question from neil. where's nei hi. question from neil. where's neihi. hello, question from neil. where's nei hi. hello, andrew. are the >> hi. hello, andrew. are the pubuc >> hi. hello, andrew. are the public out of going public being priced out of going to the theatre? >> yeah, this is an interesting one. tennant, who one. so, david tennant, who you'll doctor who, you'll know from doctor who, he's said he's he's basically said that he's really because the really worried because the theatre are really theatre prices are now really what as what he describes as prohibitive. says, you

prohibitive. and he says, you know, theatre should be know, that theatre should be something everyone go know, that theatre should be som they g everyone go know, that theatre should be som they just everyone go know, that theatre should be somthey just can't, eryone go know, that theatre should be somthey just can't, can ne go know, that theatre should be somthey just can't, can they? go and they just can't, can they? i mean, have to say so mean, i have to say so i recently bought some theatre tickets. there were some like £80 each and they weren't even the know, for the best seats, you know, for that. think the best seats that. i think the best seats were something this is were something like 150. this is nuts, right? >> completely nuts. >> no, this is completely nuts. and it shows as well is and what it shows as well is i actually, despite appearances and i actually like and my voice, i actually like and my voice, i actually like and the andrew, and enjoy the theatre. andrew, do i believe you. yes. do you? yes, i believe you. yes. i actually did a degree in theatre because not academic theatre because i'm not academic now, i going to say, the now, but i was going to say, the problem is, that theatre problem is, is that the theatre is obsessed diverse city. is obsessed with diverse city. yeah, but actual working yeah, right. but actual working class people who want to go and watch the theatre , they can't go watch the theatre, they can't go because they've been priced out of it and it's completely disgraceful. >> yeah, that is a real point, isn't it, about young people as well? >> mean, you can go robbing on >> i mean, you can go robbing on oxford street for free now, can't you? that's very entertaining. >> robbing street. >> robbing oxford street. >> robbing oxford street. >> do that's how >> why not do that? that's how you make money doing that. so why to go? why would you pay to go? >> expect that to be >> i would expect that to be your kind of thing, you know the kind of. no, no, no, i'm not.

no. >> all right. i'm not allowed to reference sex. but just because i a london accent. i have a south london accent. yes. i expected you to that. yes. i expected you to be that. that's your thing, isn't it? i'm not. >> no, i'm not being offensive, francis. i hear your francis. just. i hear your voice, you're the voice, and i think you're the sort person who wants to sort of person who wants to smash in jd sports. is that not youn >> no. i've grown out of that, and i've paid my debt to society. >> g sensitive. p— g sensitive. it's just >> socially sensitive. it's just the way you look. >> he's moved on. he goes to see the fools horses the only fools and horses musical. but musical. now it's different, but that's the only fools and horses musical be an expensive show. >> y- y" @ well, the shows in >> yeah, well, all the shows in the end are expensive. so the west end are expensive. so what do about that? you what do we do about that? you know, do we subsidise? does the government step in subsidise government step in and subsidise theatre? is, you theatre? the trouble is, as you say, become almost say, the theatres become almost like captured. say, the theatres become almost lik

>> so they should pride >> so they should take the pride budget give it to kids >> so they should take the pride bugozt give it to kids >> so they should take the pride bugo to give it to kids >> so they should take the pride bugo to the give it to kids >> so they should take the pride bugo to the theatre. it to kids >> so they should take the pride bugo to the theatre. how kids >> so they should take the pride bugo to the theatre. how about that? >> yeah, that would be good. yeah, exactly. make it a yeah, i think exactly. make it a class it's class issue. yeah, it's interesting. we're going interesting. okay, we're going to to ryan. where's to move on to ryan. where's ryan? are you? ryan? hello ryan. how are you? >> yeah, good. you. good >> yeah, good. thank you. good evening. do you agree that prince charming is a creepy stalker? yeah >> so this version >> so this so this new version of starring rachel of snow white starring rachel zegler. is that how you pronounce zegler so don't pronounce it? zegler i so don't know about pop. anyway, know anything about pop. anyway, she's main she's been cast as the main character, whoever she and character, whoever she is, and she receiving big she is receiving this big backlash because said backlash because she said she thought prince charming was a kind ryan, do you kind of stalker. ryan, do you think charming think prince charming is a stalker character? >> well, i don't remember ever wanting of wanting a woke disney reboot of snow wanting a woke disney reboot of snc no, i don't think any of us >> no, i don't think any of us did. prince charming did. really? is prince charming a creepy? a bit creepy? >> mean, he did kiss her >> well, i mean, he did kiss her when she's unconscious. no, that's sleeping. that's no sleeping. that's sleeping beauty. >> before. >> i checked this before. no, exactly. did he do then? >> so what did he do then? >> so what did he do then? >> she's charming. into >> she's charming. she's into it. yeah, into it. it. oh, yeah, she's into it. >> can't say that in a >> so you can't say that in a court law. love so when the court of law. love so when the judge something, you can't judge said something, you can't go, she it. it's fine. >> cressida is snow white, then an ironic name. is she a bit loose? >> wow. >> wow. >> no, i don't know the story. i

can't remember. there's something some something about some short people . people singing. >> she's. >> she's. >> there is some unconsciousness . yeah, but as she has some unconsciousness as she awakens because it's quite complicated, i recommend you go and read the wikipedia article. there's a terrible, poisonous apple in her throat. magically becomes throat. it magically becomes dislodged trips dislodged because somebody trips up it sounds like a horror film. >> it sounds like a horror film. well, it is. >> is pretty. you see what >> it is pretty. you see what happens to the queen at the end. i you said family i know you said it's a family show. dark. it's show. it's very dark. it's brothers. isn't it? okay. brothers. grimm isn't it? okay. >> happens to the queen >> so what happens to the queen >> so what happens to the queen >> just we're not going >> we just said we're not going to oh, okay. and don't to say, oh, okay. and we don't want provide plot do want to provide a plot twist, do we? okay. >> no, no. >> no, no. >> spoiler beauty. i >> spoiler sleeping beauty. i always disturbed, but always did find disturbed, but she is unconscious and that shouldn't happening. shouldn't be happening. >> there's shouldn't be happening. >> readings there's shouldn't be happening. >> readings of there's shouldn't be happening. >> readings of that, there's shouldn't be happening. >> readings of that, isn'tere's other readings of that, isn't there, where say her there, where they say that her consciousness these consciousness is. well, in these old stories, conscious is represented old stories, conscious is repreit?|ted old stories, conscious is repreit? soi old stories, conscious is repreit? so it's a male isn't it? so it's when a male comes in that she's she comes back to life. no. right. okay. well, apparently , yeah. yeah. well, apparently, yeah. yeah. but anyway, back to snow white. come she's in her come on. no, she's. she's in her glass coffin, so lucky that they did it with glass. imagine if it

hadnt did it with glass. imagine if it hadn't been. yeah and she magically comes to life because this apple pops out. kind of heimlich manoeuvre. thing happens. lucky happens. it's all just so lucky . and then she. she comes . and then as she. she comes back to life, she sees prince charming , back to life, she sees prince charming, and course, charming, and he, of course, proposes because why proposes immediately because why wouldn't you? don't, don't, don't waste any time. >> no. and it all out >> no, no. and it all works out brilliantly them. so is he brilliantly for them. so is he creepy or not? >> i don't think so. no. >> well, i don't think so. no. he's doing the right he's he's doing the right thing. he's taking it dead? isn't taking her. is it dead? isn't it? father's it? body back to her father's house. castle where are house. yeah. castle where are they going? to do the right thing. he's to thing. so no, he's trying to help and punished. you help and getting punished. you know think? know what i think? >> anyone who >> i think anyone who calls themselves charming, that themselves prince charming, that sounds charming i >> -- >> yeah, if you see that, you know, a used know, it's like a used car salesman themselves know, it's like a used car salesmidave. themselves honest dave. >> a bit like that, >> yeah, it is a bit like that, isn't it? >> yeah. >> yeah. >> well, anyway, look, next on free speech nation, we're going to the shocking to be talking about the shocking story a long running and story of how a long running and successful event successful lesbian social event was shut down because the organiser allowed, organiser said no men allowed, do not anywhere . whoa, whoa (tannoy) this is the final call for all long—distance lovers. i'm flying round the world

to marry a man that i've never met. how do i know that you're even the person you say you are? please fasten your seatbelts... maybe we're not actually supposed - to be in this relationship.- ..as we expect turbulence ahead. can you not see my insides breaking? how far would you go for love? brand—new 90 day fiance uk, available to stream only on discovery+. watch at no extra cost. say, "get discovery+" into your voice remote to activate.

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radio. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle, jenny watson had been running a very popular lesbian speed dating event at a pub in for london over four years. recently a male who identifies as a trans woman and as a lesbian approached jenny and asked to attend. she politely refused, explaining that this was a social event for women. since then, jenny has been subject to threats and intimidation and the new manager of the pub has seemingly colluded trans seemingly colluded with trans activists to get the event shut down. i'm joined now by jenny watson herself and also kate barker, the ceo at the lgb alliance. welcome both. thank you , kate. you, kate. >> jenny, i want to ask you first about the event itself, the speed dating event. >> yeah. why did you set it up? what's the event about? >> so five years ago i actually attended a lesbian speed dating event myself and it was run by two heterosexual men and i. and

i find this a bit strange. so i did a bit of digging online, and inoficed did a bit of digging online, and i noticed that there wasn't a dedicated lesbian organising section. so i thought if it doesn't exist, i'll create it myself . myself. >> absolutely. >> absolutely. >> and then for the first event, i thought , no one's going to i thought, no one's going to turn up. but actually we sold all the tickets and it was a great night. and then from that point forward , yeah, it was point forward, yeah, it was absolutely . absolutely. >> and you ran it for four years? >> for four and a half years, almost five. yeah. >> yeah. and i imagine you ran it better than heterosexual men would. we were would. yeah yeah. so now we were in this situation where all of a sudden you're told by the venue, the college arms, where you've sudden you're told by the venue, the c yeah. >> now, this came about because a trans identified male who calls himself a lesbian , that's calls himself a lesbian, that's it approached you actually turned up to one of the speeches? >> yeah. what happened there? >> yeah. what happened there? >> so there was some

inappropriate conduct in. in the toilets. he was getting very close to one woman in particular. there was some touching involved . and i spoke touching involved. and i spoke with him and he wasn't very happy about that . and it all. happy about that. and it all. yeah it all and i'm i think you said that this is a women only event. >> yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. >> yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. >> now , now i understand, kate. >> now, now i understand, kate. of course, this individual identifies as as female identifies as as female identifies as a lesbian, but is clearly male. i think we actually have image blurred clearly male. i think we actlimageave image blurred clearly male. i think we actlimageavethe image blurred clearly male. i think we actlimageavethe individual'red clearly male. i think we actlimageavethe individual ind out image of the individual in question. know can question. i don't know if we can show we can, we'll have show that. if we can, we'll have a . so when, kate, you have a look. so when, kate, you have people who are biologically male, as this individual clearly is attending lesbian event and is attending a lesbian event and behaving inappropriately , behaving inappropriately, irrespective actually of the behaviour, kate , isn't it within behaviour, kate, isn't it within jenny's right to say, look, this is a lesbian event, this is for women only? >> i mean , to our >> yeah, sure. i mean, to our mind, it's the only thing more absurd than a man saying he's a lesbian the fact that the lesbian is the fact that the people that these venues

people that own these venues have decided that that jenny is bigoted and unkind . and for bigoted and unkind. and for calling out this obvious untruth. yes. and i think it's very much being framed as by the activists, as as being , i activists, as as being, i suppose, anti—trans. but in essence, it's nothing to do with trans people. we just don't want men to come because trans people are entitled to live their lives, of course. >> and absolutely, absolutely . >> and absolutely, absolutely. you know this, you know, but you are an event are running an event specifically women are specifically for women who are attracted and we want lesbian >> exactly. and we want lesbian to be safe in those events. and that's there is to it. that's all there is to it. there's yeah, but it's no hatred. >> it's interesting if people interpreted as hatred. exactly >> yeah. which is crazy . >> yeah. which is it's crazy. >> yeah. which is it's crazy. >> and presumably you would have called kind of called out that kind of behaviour it had a woman behaviour if it had been a woman or as well, behaviour if it had been a woman or course. as well, of course. >> so course, yeah. >> so of course, yeah. >> it's interesting. this, >> it's very interesting. this, this and makes this this case and what makes this particularly interesting, i think, we now know think, kate, is that we now know that new manager the that the new manager of the college arms has come in and we know because there was someone that, know, who was in a that, you know, who was in a whatsapp yeah who saw

whatsapp group. yeah who saw messages there was a whatsapp group of activists wasn't it ? group of activists wasn't it? and this manager entered the whatsapp chat to explain to the activists that he had a let's say, some spicy views about this event and wanted it to stop. is that right ? that right? >> absolutely. i mean, far too spicy , probably most of them to spicy, probably most of them to actually to say here. but but it's really interesting because it's really interesting because it's so difficult anyway for people like jenny to set up an event like this in the face of so much real hostility from people . and then to find out, as people. and then to find out, as we did, that somebody from the organisation that actually owns the pub . yes. is in that group the pub. yes. is in that group trying to making it their mission to shut down an event held in their own by their own employer. so, so it's a really, really peculiar situation and even more frightening when you know that it's behind the scenes. this is happening. >> the manager of the pub is >> so the manager of the pub is saying that this is a purely business saying that business decision, saying that that's why wants this shut that's why he wants this shut down, not successful down, that it's not successful enough. what you

enough. yeah. what do you make of that? >> well, he's saying that now. yeah but the whatsapp messages don't all. don't show that at all. >> do have some of >> well, we do have some of those. have a look at those. so you can have a look at one the whatsapp so one of the whatsapp messages. so here, message he's here, this is a message he's sent other sent to the other trans activists. actually in activists. i'm not actually in the venue yet, so my power is limited, but be seeing the limited, but i'll be seeing the area and make area manager today and can make it their bookings it clear i want their bookings cancelled hopefully he'll do cancelled and hopefully he'll do it in other group. it for me in the other group. when aware of this, when i was made aware of this, i've discussing maybe i've been discussing maybe replacing in—house replacing it with an in—house set nights with set of speed dating nights with inclusive heart . and inclusive city at its heart. and if we want to know what this manager's attitude food we do have other messages and he refers to terfs yeah. >> me a terf . i think i we do >> me a terf. i think i we do have to apologise for the language there. >> we're not allowed to say that before the watershed, but pardon me, terf a hole. yeah so in other words, very colourful language. >> that is absolutely against women who wish to gather with other women for all there is to it. >> there is no hatred. it's yes , but it's quite interesting

that this manager is denying that this manager is denying that there's any kind of prejudice on his part, because the messages prove that there is absolutely the messages show that there is. >> and the messages even show some discussion because i was going in with jenny to meet with him with the manager and a senior person . so they were senior person. so they were saying, well, when come in, saying, well, when they come in, we'll it's we'll tell them it's a commercial decision. you know , commercial decision. you know, rather than it's anything to do with our personal beliefs. so it's clear nonsense. yes. and commercially, it's been very successful. it wouldn't have been running for so many years if a event. and if it wasn't a good event. and it's and people love it's popular and people love it. and been of lovely and there's been lots of lovely success from it's success stories from it. it's purely simply me. the idea purely and simply me. the idea of a lesbian event is of running a lesbian event is deemed offensive to be a lesbian and to have a women only event is seen to be bigoted and exclusion free. and when we when we had our meeting , because we we had our meeting, because we went in wanting solutions, we had our meeting and we said, look, we've seen these whatsapp messages. they're really hostile , they're really discriminatory

. but but how can we move forward? so why don't we keep the lesbian event and why not have a have a trans event as well? right. yeah. they they rejected that because they said that he rejected that. he said he couldn't have an event in his pub which excluded anybody . and pub which excluded anybody. and when pressed on that, i said that this is a lesbian event. do you mean you could not exclude rude men from it? and he said, yes, that's right. so it's an absolutely absurd third position that that in order to be inclusive, it means you can't run a lesbian event. >> but it's not just a lesbian event. it's a lesbian event specifically relating to dating . exactly right. so surely of all the events where you could exclude men and all lesbian dating event would be the top of the list, i would have thought. >> yeah, yeah. >> exactly. yeah, yeah, yeah. >> exactly. yeah, yeah, yeah. >> and of course, this isn't the only time, jenny, we've had sal grover in australia, who's currently facing court action because like kind of because she has a like a kind of dating app for women only and

that's deemed to be a problem in tasmania. it's now illegal for lesbians to assemble by themselves, so it is important , themselves, so it is important, isn't it, that you have the right to do this? >> absolutely. yeah, yeah, yeah i >> -- >> and -_ >> and why 5mm m >> and why is it under threat at the moment, kate? why is this happening from people who claim to be progressive? why gay to be progressive? why are gay rights fight rights activists having to fight the old battles again? the the same old battles again? the right assemble, to right to assemble, the right to organise? right to assemble, the right to organis so frustrating . and i >> it's so frustrating. and i think it is, that think what it is, is that institutions and businesses somehow feel vaguely that if a trans identified male wants something, then he must have it because something, something, something. the equality act and they're not quite sure what that fuzzy bit in the middle is, but somehow they feel that that's kind of the way it should work. but they really have a poor understanding the law. and understanding of the law. and i think that's been driven by lobbying and lobbying organisation laws and it's interests for it's in their interests for these organisations to have a poor understanding of the law. but who sex but it's people who are same sex attracted and who are attracted and women who are really suffering because of this. >> it's happening with gay men

this. >>well.|appening with gay men this. >>well. ippening with gay men this. >>well. i mean,g with gay men this. >>well. i mean,g witspoken nen this. >>well. i mean,g witspoken tor as well. i mean, i've spoken to as well. i mean, i've spoken to a of gay men they a number of gay men who they don't such as don't go on sites such as gfindn don't go on sites such as grindr, where they meet grindr, places where they meet other they say other men because they say there's too many women there. other men because they say the now,)o many women there. other men because they say the now, 11 many women there. other men because they say the now, i know women there. other men because they say the now, i know it's men there. other men because they say the now, i know it's just there. other men because they say the now, i know it's just a1ere. other men because they say the now, i know it's just a very >> now, i know it's just a very odd where gay individuals odd thing where gay individuals can't individuals can't meet other gay individuals in spaces . in those own spaces. >> it's very strange. >> it's very strange. >> it's very strange. >> i it's tragic in a lot >> i think it's tragic in a lot of ways. you know, especially if you're thinking about the gay men. lots of letters men. we've had lots of letters and emails from gay men saying they uncomfortable. they felt super uncomfortable. they've to an event where they've gone to an event where they think is going to be men only. there they think is going to be men onlj some there they think is going to be men onlj some women there there they think is going to be men onlj some women there who ere are some women there who identify men . and so the identify as gay men. and so the men feel horribly awkward and uncomfortable navigating, navigating this unpleasant situation . and the girls situation. and the girls heterosexual girls. you've been told, if i take some hormones and have a mastectomy , i will be and have a mastectomy, i will be and have a mastectomy, i will be a gay man. and those men will be attracted to me. so that's just tragic as well. yes, of course. and i think people are being misled by this sort of it's almost as if we've been tipped into a into a bizarre upside down world where words have no

meaning and it obscures truth and reality . and reality. >> yeah, that's right. and you keep hearing activists say things genital preferences things like genital preferences are transphobic and people aren't attracted. >> course, individuals as >> but of course, individuals as a is attracted to people a lesbian is attracted to people who biologically female, not who are biologically female, not people identify being people who identify as being female . that's should be quite female. that's should be quite obvious. i have thought. obvious. i would have thought. so you going do so what are you going to do next, jenny? i mean, what's the next, jenny? i mean, what's the nexi next, jenny? i mean, what's the nex i hopefully next, jenny? i mean, what's the nexi hopefully find a new >> i mean, hopefully find a new venue, i think that's going venue, but i think that's going to be a problem because the activists , they're targeting activists, they're targeting venues and they're saying they're going to distribute literature and we're literature and say, we're transphobic, don't don't have these people, you know , they're these people, you know, they're a hate group. so it's going to be a struggle to find a new venue. >> venue. >> and it just talks to you now, it's quite clear you're not a hateful individual. >> this isn't about of course not. of course. >> about right to >> it's about your right to organise in way that you organise in the way that you want to. >> of course. >> of course. >> yeah. yeah. i mean, yeah. dufing >> yeah. yeah. i mean, yeah. during my university days, i lived with trans people , so, you lived with trans people, so, you know, and i'm still close to them, so i'm in no way

transphobic not at all. it's a horrible accusation . it is. it horrible accusation. it is. it is. it's insulting . yeah. is. it's insulting. yeah. >> completely insulting. absolutely >> well, i should say we did get in touch with stone gate. they own the venue in question. it's a very big company. of course, they and lettuce they also own slug and lettuce and saying they are not and they're saying they are not commenting story . and they're saying they are not commenting story. but i commenting on this story. but i want to just say that it is an open to stone gate . a open invitation to stone gate. a stone gate representative will always come and stone gate representative will alwato come and stone gate representative will alwato me come and stone gate representative will alwato me about come and stone gate representative will alwato me about this come and stone gate representative will alwato me about this issue; and stone gate representative will alwato me about this issue on|d talk to me about this issue on this show. so i hope that someone up on that someone will take us up on that . but in the meantime, jenny and kate , thank you both much for kate, thank you both so much for joining yeah thank you. joining me. yeah thank you. thank . thank you. >> i tell you about the nice stories that we have. no, sorry, jenny. jenny sorry. >> we have we have lots of lovely stories. we've had two weddings. we've got one engagement coming up . so i've engagement coming up. so i've been to two of the weddings and it was you know, it was a lovely experience . and knowing that we experience. and knowing that we made that happen , you know, and made that happen, you know, and had some success, we've had lots, yeah. you know, friendships , relationships,

friendships, relationships, weddings , engagements and, you weddings, engagements and, you know , it's been taken away from know, it's been taken away from us. and it's a really it's a beautiful thing . beautiful thing. >> and, you know, it's such a shame it's been taken away now. >> but hopefully something will be. >> i hope so. i really do. i really do. >> jenny, thanks so much for joining us. but next on free speech going to be speech nation, we're going to be heafing speech nation, we're going to be hearing sporting great hearing from the sporting great turned campaigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis campaigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis. campaigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis. she's campaigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis. she's goingipaigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis. she's going toigner hearing from the sporting great turned davis. she's going to be er sharon davis. she's going to be talking brilliant new talking about her brilliant new book. get your book. but first, let's get your latest . latest weather. >> looks like things are heating up. boxed boilers, proud sponsors of weather on . gb news. sponsors of weather on. gb news. >> hello there. i'm greg dewhurst and welcome to your latest gb news news weather forecast. we've got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. pressure in charge the week. low pressure in charge at moment, but that moves at the moment, but that moves out way we head towards out the way as we head towards wednesday. and pressure wednesday. and high pressure replaces settling our replaces it, settling our weather down this evening . we

weather down this evening. we have outbreaks of heavy rain pushing in across the west country, wales spreading north and move through and eastwards as we move through into the early hours. this turning heavy at over turning heavy at times over parts northern wales , parts of northern wales, northern england and metoffice warning here. clear warning in force here. clear skies for northern ireland, scotland, some showery rain in places and temperatures generally in double generally remaining in double figures. so a wet start across england and wales monday morning . heavy across trans . heavy rain across trans pennines routes in particular. if you're travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through the day. sunshine showers for sunshine and showers for northern and scotland northern ireland and scotland again some these heavy at again, some of these heavy at times too , and temperatures times too, and temperatures generally teens to low generally the high teens to low 20s quite a muggy feel where we do see any sunshine across centre and western of centre and western parts of england and wales later on tuesday day, a much calmer picture , high pressure starting picture, high pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way, still fairly unsettled. so a day of sunny spells and scattered showers as some of the showers on the heavy side . and then it on the heavy side. and then it

settles down wednesday into thursday. plenty of sunny spells and temperatures starting to rise . rise. >> looks like things are heating up. boxed boilers, proud sponsors of weather on

>> you're listening to gb news radio . welcome back to free radio. welcome back to free speech nation with me andrew doyle former swimmer sharron davies . davies. >> she is a british icon and role model. after an outstanding career winning medals for great britain at the olympics and other major events, she went on to have a hugely successful career as a broadcaster, and she now stands centre as now stands centre stage as a forthright women forthright advocate for women in sport. new book is unfair sport. her new book is unfair play , and she joins me now. play, and she joins me now. sharron davies, welcome to the show . show. >> thank you . >> thank you. >> thank you. >> so, sharron, tell me about your book. hello. tell me about your book. hello. tell me about your book. hello. tell me about your book. why have you written this book and what is it about?

>> well, it's about the battle for women's sport. >> and it's not just about the battle we have right now. it's about battle that we've about the battle that we've always even qutubuddin who, always had, even qutubuddin who, you , up modern you know, set up the modern olympic women olympic games, didn't want women in the olympics. so it's all these years of battling and still we have nowhere near parity. of course don't. parity. of course we don't. we're we're we're working on it. we're getting better. but for example , in the uk, there's 1000 women that their living from from that earn their living from from sport. 11,000 men and sport. there's11,000 men and american advertising terms. and the uk is pretty similar. women get 1% of the us sponsorship dollar in the states from sport and 4% of the airtime. so we have this tiny piece of the cake already and now we're supposed to move over for mediocre male athletes who identify as being female and my issue is nothing to do with not wanting them involved in sport. i want everyone involved in sport. i spent my whole life promoting sport and wanting people to be sporty and fit and healthy. however, believe that however, i really believe that females are worthy of our sport just the same as males, and they should own spaces.

should have their own spaces. >> sharron , >> and of course, sharron, you've experience of >> and of course, sharron, you unfairness experience of >> and of course, sharron, you unfairness that xperience of >> and of course, sharron, you unfairness that comes ce of >> and of course, sharron, you unfairness that comes about the unfairness that comes about from drug enhanced participation in sport. so could you do you want to tell us a bit about that? >> yeah, i mean, that's probably the biggest reason why i'm so outspoken. for 20 years, my generation and in fact the generation and in fact the generation afterwards as well had against east had to compete against east germans filled of germans that were filled full of synthetic testosterone during the 70s and the 80s. and for 20 years the ioc did absolutely nothing to stop this. to the extent where they totally and utterly dominated women's sport in track and in swimming, rowing, track and field in particular. i mean swimming, the dominance was so ridiculous. 92% of all ridiculous. they took 92% of all the women's medals during that pefiod the women's medals during that period at the european championships . at my olympics, championships. at my olympics, they podiums, one, two, they had six podiums, one, two, three, where they won practically no medals in the men's whatsoever . and they would men's whatsoever. and they would have, athletes have, you know, female athletes that at that would turn up at competitions that never competitions that we'd never seen would break seen before that would break a world we'd see world record. and we'd never see again. was so obvious. it again. so it was so obvious. it was ridiculous. and nothing was done. and so i had friends that

came fourth behind three east germans whose whole lives would have been different if they'd been olympic champions. and i just not back and just could not sit back and watch the same thing potentially happen again . happen all over again. >> and elite sport, of >> and in an elite sport, of course , know those course, you know those few seconds there that seconds here and there that people endlessly to shave people train endlessly to shave off their time that makes all the difference, doesn't it? it's really, really important athletes. >> absolutely . i mean, we >> yeah, absolutely. i mean, we win. you know, we win olympic titles hundredths of titles by hundredths of a centimetre. length of your centimetre. the length of your fingernails. training, fingernails. and we're training, you six a you know, five, six hours a day for ten, 12 years of our lives for ten, 12 years of our lives for that. and it's insulting for that. and it's so insulting to should just to say that women should just train know, train harder. you know, i was doing those years ago, six doing all those years ago, six hours a day, was training as hours a day, i was training as hard, not harder anyone. hard, if not harder than anyone. i pool with when i was in the pool with when i was 11. fell of a tree and was 11. i fell out of a tree and broke arms. were in broke both my arms. they were in plaster three months. my dad plaster for three months. my dad just wrapped them plastic just wrapped them in plastic bags on and bags and i carried on and i trained you know, we worked trained so, you know, we worked very, hard. was very, very hard. it was extremely frustrating. i mean, we are different. you know, we're made differently. females and males are made to do different small might, and males are made to do differimight. small might, and males are made to do differimight. there's|ll might, and males are made to do differimight. there's no night,

and males are made to do differimight. there's no human in large might. there's no human in history that's both . history ever that's had both. the human hermaphrodite does not exist, athletes that are exist, even athletes that are dsd, is the insulting dsd, which is the insulting term, intersex is constantly used by trans activists as some form of gotcha , a still male form of gotcha, a still male and female. so you know, i would like to see sex screening come back again, which was removed by the even though 98% of the ioc, even though 98% of females they wanted it to females said they wanted it to carry you think, though, that >> do you think, though, that things are improving insofar as when we leah the when we saw leah thomas, the swimmer , a trans identified male swimmer, a trans identified male who decided to compete against women suddenly towering over these other women on the podium, that image , i think, woke up that image, i think, woke up a lot of people to the problem, didn't it? >> yeah. that was what i was >> yeah. and that was what i was trying a way, you trying to avoid in a way, you know, i was trying to stop there having to be a leah thomas in every single before people every single sport before people went, what? males are went, oh, guess what? males are stronger know, went, oh, guess what? males are strc have know, went, oh, guess what? males are strchave we know, went, oh, guess what? males are strchave we have know, went, oh, guess what? males are strchave we have every know, went, oh, guess what? males are strchave we have every single ow, we have we have every single record ever set from the, you know, from the last hundred years to show that there's a difference of between 10 30% difference of between 10 to 30% in olympic sport. so 30% being explosive events like weightlifting , 10% being things

weightlifting, 10% being things like middle distance running and swimming is usually about and swimming is usually about 11 and 12. stayed pretty much 12. and that stayed pretty much the whole time . the the same the whole time. the only where there was only glitch where there was a little got little glitch where that got a little glitch where that got a little bit closer was during that east german era. surprise, surprise. that's gone surprise. and now that's gone back it's back to the same again. it's gone 12. so, you gone back to 11, 12. so, you know, phelps was not know, michael phelps was not beating rivals 11. he was beating his rivals by 11. he was beating his rivals by 11. he was beating them by less than 1. and he's still he now holds no world records whatsoever, which is another . you know, and another gotcha. you know, and that and that last world record went by six foot frenchman went by a six foot frenchman who's half so who's about half his size. so males and females are just built extremely differently. and we have be able to use have to be able to use the equipment we've got. and equipment that we've got. and every study we've got every piece of study we've got the world over shows we the world over shows that we can't male puberty can't remove male puberty advantage know, that advantage, you know, and that doesn't talk about things advantage, you know, and that doesangles talk about things advantage, you know, and that doesangles theight�*ut things advantage, you know, and that doesangles theight and1ings advantage, you know, and that doesangles theight and the; like angles or height and the size of hands and feet. you know? if you look at the in know? and if you look at the in the uk for the moment, we've got 50 trans identifying males in the women's game and a large proportion of those are in goal because advantage proportion of those are in goal be being advantage proportion of those are in goal be being in advantage proportion of those are in goal be being in goal advantage proportion of those are in goal be being in goal. advantage proportion of those are in goal be being in goal. they'reantage to being in goal. they're explosive, they have the height and the hand size. so

and they have the hand size. so it's just basically unfair because what's happening is we're including these people we're not including these people . females from . we're excluding females from their own sport. so you know, either we have to add categories or we have to create an open category, which is what world aquatics has done. it's quite astonishing, isn't it, because the 99% of people will automatically understand what you're saying and automatically see this is grossly unfair. see that this is grossly unfair. >> here are, you've >> but here you are, you've written a book about it. you're having it. you having to talk about it. do you ever frustrated that you're ever get frustrated that you're having these having to make these these arguments to people really arguments to people when really it's common sense ? it's just common sense? >> yeah, i get very frustrated that governing bodies are that our governing bodies are not standing for females. you not standing up for females. you know, that's the thing i just cannot understand. and all cannot understand. and after all of time and all the work of this time and all the work we've had equality, they just we've had on equality, they just have no backbone with regards to doing right thing. so if doing the right thing. so if they their we get they pull their members, we get huge , huge support. so huge, huge support. so for recently british rowing pulled their members eventually after a lot of cajoling and you know , a lot of cajoling and you know, a lot of cajoling and you know, a lot to get them to do lot of trying to get them to do that for many years. and 80% of

their members came back and said, want facebook. you said, no, we want facebook. you need fair sport, need to prioritise fair sport, you and then need you know, and then we need to find be inclusive . find ways to be inclusive. everybody inclusive, everybody wants to be inclusive, but they want fair first. they want safety. you in want safety. you know, in contact sports absolutely contact sports is absolutely vital young female is going vital or a young female is going to life potentially to lose their life potentially or up in or certainly end up in a wheelchair or something horrendous where contact horrendous where the contact sport rugby. um, then we sport like rugby. um, then we need fairness and then sport like rugby. um, then we nee need fairness and then sport like rugby. um, then we neeneed find mess and then sport like rugby. um, then we neeneed find ways and then sport like rugby. um, then we nee need find ways t0|d then sport like rugby. um, then we nee need find ways to be hen we need to find ways to be inclusive we be inclusive and we can be inclusive. you know, i was listening to your conversation earlier other issues earlier and we have other issues as you know, we have, as well. you know, we have, for example, six example, leah thomas is six foot four, male with full male four, a male with full male genhaua four, a male with full male genitalia who for months forced these girls to change next to them. having announced that they were a lesbian. you know, and these girls were instructed these girls were then instructed to psychologists when these girls were then instructed to had psychologists when these girls were then instructed to had a psychologists when these girls were then instructed to had a problem.ogists when these girls were then instructed to had a problem with s when these girls were then instructed to had a problem with this.an they had a problem with this. and when they said they had and then when they said they had a problem together , they were a problem together, they were then told they would be struck off. to me, that's off. the team. so to me, that's a of abuse to make a young a form of abuse to make a young teenage girl change next to a six foot male for months on end. >> yeah, it's a very serious issue. well, your book is called

unfair play. it's out now available for people to buy. sharon thank you ever so sharon davies, thank you ever so much us on the much for joining us today on the show . and next on free speech show. and next on free speech nafion show. and next on free speech nation historian david starkey will be here to help us answer why the mary rose museum has decided to give some of its exhibits a queer reimagining. see you .

soon >> welcome back to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. curators at the mary rose museum have attracted criticism this week after a blog post appeared on the museum's website entitled queering the mary rose's collection, a selection of items which were found on the famous tudor warship have been given speculative lgbt re—imaginings , speculative lgbt re—imaginings, which has led to much mockery. a collection of 82 nit combs

recovered from the sea bed have even been deemed significant because hairstyling is associated with gender. so here to discuss this , get this right to discuss this, get this right with this absolutely david starkey everyone . as plainspoken starkey everyone. as plainspoken as ever. i think two gay men are allowed to use that term. >> we are indeed. >> we are indeed. >> so, david, you were. >> so, david, you were. >> but but and let's go back again. yes. the what this post did was complete written by a woman, course, two called woman, of course, two called hannah, two para d gay men . do hannah, two para d gay men. do you know what it consisted of saying? gay men spend all their time looking at a mirror dear and doing their hair. and this is the great problem with these alleged liberationist movements. and again, it's with trans. why do all trans men look like a parody of a woman? um, it's a very good question . it is an very good question. it is an entirely parodistic notion. >> so. well, i mean, i mean, certainly some of the prominent activists certainly seem that way. there are there are some trans completely trans people who completely want to lives as

to live their lives and pass as the other sex and just be left alone. and then you've the alone. and then you've got the militant who always militant activists who always seem grotesque seem to adopt extreme, grotesque stereotypes for some reason, which is don't think it's an accident. >> i think i think, again, it's one of the things that makes it so ultra, i mean, ultimately damaging. it's a parody. it's also something going on in people's heads . the whole of the people's heads. the whole of the woke movement is a triumph of language over reality. i always say trans is very closely related to transubstantiation. what happens in the high catholic church? the notion that a priest pronounces a magic word hocus corpus . and you know what? hocus corpus. and you know what? suddenly the bread becomes flesh and the wine becomes blood. it's mystical , it's nonsense, sublime mystical, it's nonsense, sublime mysticism and nonsense. so how does a museum do this? >> well, i was going to ask you about that because, i mean, the mary rose, it's such a wonderful thing to go to see. and then you've got this blog sort of which actually does not elucidate history. >> on contrary, what it >> on the contrary, what it does, personal riff . does, it's a personal riff. hannahis does, it's a personal riff. hannah is doing a personal riff.

she is saying, hannah is doing a personal riff. she is saying , these objects she is saying, these objects speak to me now in the 21st century. yes, of course . this is century. yes, of course. this is and the tragic thing is, you know, she's actually doing i mean, i've got a lot of skin in this game. i used to be the historian, trustee of the mary rose. the course that she's doing at royal holloway public history. that's history and the marketplace, not history in the in in the academic world. it's founded by one of my former students by anna whitelock, for whom i've got great affection. so there's a terrible sense of good things having gone wrong. yes, i adore the mary rose. it is if that's if that's too gay, it is. it is. it is. the english tomb of tutankhamun. it's not just the load of old wood . it is just the load of old wood. it is the most astonishing collection of tudor objects , real things. of tudor objects, real things. but what we need to be doing is explaining what is really there. so if you want to talk about real sex, everybody were a little bit i'm a great believer in real sex as opposed to sex in flesh rather than sex on the

brain. if we're going to do that, the mary rose has got the most extraordinary witness to the fact that there were 400 men who were all cooped up together. and the moment they got on shore, they went whippy . and i'm shore, they went whippy. and i'm afraid there were consequences because the 16th century is the beginning of venereal disease. and one of the most extraordinary objects which this woman should have been talking about on the mary rose. and can we see it now? the famous syringe, because extraordinary things survive on the mary rose, the complete instrument chest of a barber surgeon and in other words, the medic on the mary rose. we've even got his skull cap is velvet. skull cap all there and all the equipment the same way. the master carpenter . same way. the master carpenter. but and many of the tools are the same, of course, the saws and the drills are pretty much interchangeable between the between the surgeon. where does the syringe go? me. no, no, the syringe go? let me. no, no, no , no. just building. come no, no. i'm just building. come on. i'm building up to this

gently . look at it. gently. look at it. >> time is limited, though . >> time is limited, though. >> time is limited, though. >> this perfect beak >> it's got this perfect beak end. and we found a little drop of mercury inside it, and it fits into the urethra of the penis every man who goes by and you see, she wanted to talk about sex. she could have then really sort of fanned out from that mercury venereal disease. she wanted to talk about henry the eighth and legislate under henry the eighth. the evidence of the use of mercury in the tudor navy. in other words, bluntly, for the lowest of the low. it shows that henry the eighth did not have veneers disease because we've actually got his complete not his medical record, but there is pharmaceutical record, the record of all the drugs administered to him. and he wasn't given mercury, ergo, he doesn't have venereal disease. it's an osteomyelitis ulcer. see, that's what you do. >> unlike the poor sailors on the mary rose, the poor who are riddled , who were absolutely riddled, who were absolutely riddled. >> least , at least they'd >> but at least, at least they'd had a bit fun .

had a bit of fun. >> but you're there's so >> but you're right, there's so much and fascinating much exciting and fascinating aspects the artefacts that aspects about the artefacts that were the mary rose. so were found on the mary rose. so to impose these kind to to, sort of impose these kind of ephemera voguish ideas , of very ephemera voguish ideas, it's boring actually. >> it's boring , it's patronising >> it's boring, it's patronising . again, you know, one of the things that might be good about woke, it emphasises we should treat different cultures according to their own values. right then we need the past is the most different culture of all and instead we treat the past simply as an opportunity to show virtue or to show we are better than they are. and it is the silliest idea of the world to apologise for something in which everybody doing it, to apologise for something in which everybody doing it , both which everybody doing it, both the victim and the victor, is dead. what can possibly be done? who can possibly gain? >> absolutely david starkey really , i wish we had more time, really, i wish we had more time, but thanks so much for joining me today. a pleasure. thank you. >> and that is all for our first hour on free speech nation on please don't go anywhere. >> we've got an awful lot more to get through. we're going to

be talking we're going to be reviewing current cultural news and the and arts affairs with the historian david oldroyd bolt . we historian david oldroyd bolt. we also have details of a mexican former congressman who has been convicted of gender based political violence for posting a tweet in which he allegedly misgendered a trans individual. we're going to also have some fantastic questions from our wonderful studio audience . so wonderful studio audience. so please do not go anywhere . whew. please do not go anywhere. whew. >> the temperatures rising. boxt solar, proud sponsors of weather on . gb news. hello there. on. gb news. hello there. >> i'm greg dewhurst and welcome to your latest gb news weather forecast. we've got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. low pressure in charge at the moment, but that moves out way as we towards out the way as we head towards wednesday and pressure wednesday and high pressure replaces our replaces it, settling our weather down this evening . we weather down this evening. we have outbreaks of heavy rain

pushing in across the west country, wales spreading north and as we move through and eastwards as we move through into this into the early hours. this turning heavy at times over parts northern wales , parts of northern wales, northern england metoffice northern england and metoffice warning here. clear warning in force here. clear skies for northern ireland, scotland, some showery rain in places and temperatures generally remaining in double figures. so a wet start across england and wales monday morning . rain across trans . heavy rain across trans pennines routes in particular. if you're travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through the day. sunshine showers for sunshine and showers for northern ireland and scotland again heavy at again, some of these heavy at times too , and temperatures times too, and temperatures generally teens to low generally the high teens to low 20s quite a muggy feel where we do see any sunshine across central and parts of central and western parts of england and wales later on tuesday, a much calmer picture, high pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way. still fairly unsettled. so a day of sunny spells and scattered showers. some of the showers on the heavy side. and then it settles down wednesday into thursday . plenty

wednesday into thursday. plenty of sunny spells and temperatures starting to rise . the starting to rise. the temperatures rising . temperatures rising. >> boxt solar proud sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> there's plenty more still to come on free speech nation this week, including some more questions fantastic questions from this fantastic studio audience. but let's get a news update from aaron news update first from aaron armstrong . hi there. armstrong. hi there. >> i'm aaron armstrong in the newsroom at 8:00. the government is facing renewed criticism of its immigration strategy after six migrants died when their vessel sank off the french coast yesterday . 509 people crossed yesterday. 509 people crossed the english channel in ten small boats on saturday, bringing the total for the year to more than

16,500. campaign groups have described it as an appalling and preventable tragedy. it is a further setback for rishi sunaks stop the boats pledge one of his five key priorities as people in wales and scotland who are suffering because of lengthy nhs waiting lists could soon request care in england. health secretary steve barclay says he's open to requests and will consider appeals from people caught up in the backlog. he is set to discuss different approaches with ministers from the devolved administrations as more than 73,000 people in wales have been waiting for treatment for more than a year, around 21,500 in scotland have been waiting for the same amount of time for an initial appointment .pubsin time for an initial appointment . pubs in england and wales will be allowed to continue selling takeaway pints after the government decided to keep covid licencing rules they were due to expire in september. but it's understood the prime minister has listened to the industry loud and clear. has listened to the industry loud and clear . according to loud and clear. according to a

report in the sun, pubs were allowed to sell alcohol through allowed to sell alcohol through a hatch during the pandemic and this latest move is set to help boost the hospitality sector , boost the hospitality sector, which has been struggling to recover from the pandemic . the recover from the pandemic. the victims of the worst single atrocity in northern ireland's history have been remembered dufing history have been remembered during a poignant memorial service . the families of the 29 service. the families of the 29 people killed in the 1998 dissident republican bombing of omagh were among those who gathered in county tyrone ahead of the 25th anniversary. michael gallagher , whose son aiden was gallagher, whose son aiden was among those to die , described it among those to die, described it as powerful testimony to community spirit and cohesion . community spirit and cohesion. 25 years after our small town was ripped apart, the anniversary is on tuesday. no one has been criminally convicted of carrying out the attack . the search for victims attack. the search for victims of the wildfires in hawaii is continuing , but questions are continuing, but questions are being asked about the state's response . s 93 people have now response. s 93 people have now been confirmed dead on the island of maui . however, the island of maui. however, the state's governor says that will rise significantly as up to 1000

people remain unaccounted for. one local restaurant owner has questioned the speed of the response on social media, saying we are 100 miles from the largest military in the world, 72 hours later, where's the navy, the hospital ship, the helicopters , the natural helicopters, the natural disaster relief infrastructure that should have been here by now. and stargazers were out in their droves last night as the annual summer proceed meteor shower reached its peak . some shower reached its peak. some fragments, some the size of grains of sand , hit the grains of sand, hit the atmosphere and exploded , added. atmosphere and exploded, added. they're travelling at around 130,000mph and that lit up the sky. of course, it depended where you were in the country as to how well you could see it, but it's considered one of the best of the year because of the shooting stars at one of the most active times. they will continue until the 24th of this month . well, this is gb news on month. well, this is gb news on tv, on radio and on your smart

speaken tv, on radio and on your smart speaker, too. but now it's back to free speech nation . to free speech nation. >> welcome back to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. let's get some more questions from our lovely studio audience. we've got a question from roger. where is roger? >> hi, roger. >> hi, roger. >> hello. do you solution >> hello. do you have a solution to people? problem to the migrant people? problem >> oh, blimey. roger that's not a big question at all, is it? all right. okay. well, you know, we've had a horrible week. there have been six migrants died crossing the channel. 49 were rescued. and at and, you know, it's really horrible. survivors include children mostly from afghanistan. there was an article in the mirror which said that the government had blood on its hands. lot of people its hands. a lot of people saying the government needs saying that the government needs to are to be doing more. are they right? what think, cressida? >> well, they do need to do. clearly, needs clearly, something needs to be done. wouldn't want the clearly, something needs to be don know wouldn't want the clearly, something needs to be don know myrouldn't want the clearly, something needs to be don know my dadin't want the clearly, something needs to be donknow my dad didwant the

clearly, something needs to be donknow my dad did suggest this job know my dad did suggest this week that they could extend the ulez was ulez zone to calais, which was an idea. i mean, the an interesting idea. i mean, the point being, it's. it's impossible. yeah >> what do you do? >> what do you do? >> well, i mean, this is the tficky >> well, i mean, this is the tricky thing, isn't it? because, i mean, i know stephen kinnock from of said, from labour has sort of said, look, tories just look, if the tories just implemented on implemented labour policy on this, all be over. you this, it would all be over. you know, they would able to know, they would be able to clear backlog, they would know, they would be able to clearpeople cklog, they would know, they would be able to clearpeople trafficking, would know, they would be able to clearpeople trafficking, theyd stop people trafficking, they would sort out the migrants coming true that coming up. is it true that labour magically make labour can just magically make thisyes. okay >> yes. okay >> yes. okay >> there we go. there we go. >> there we go. there we go. >> no, no. the reality is, is this is a deeply complex, tragic problem. it problem. um, and what it actually needs is an immigration system, first of all, that is fit for purpose actually fit for purpose that actually works. we need to work with the french government and we these gangs profit from these gangs that profit from these people's misery and suffering need to be prosecuted and they need to be prosecuted and they need to be prosecuted and they need to be. and they need to be put in prison where they belong. >> not the case? >> is it not the case? >>— >> is it not the case? >> is it not the case? >> i mean, like the >> i mean, it feels like the french government not doing >> i mean, it feels like the french (to ernment not doing >> i mean, it feels like the french (to dealent not doing >> i mean, it feels like the french (to deal with not doing >> i mean, it feels like the french (to deal with these doing enough to deal with these people. enough to deal with these peowell, french mates, okay. >> there is, you know that's true. >> that's true. you know, for those of booing, you

those of you booing, why are you booing? you all voted brexit. >> get lost , cressida. >> get lost, cressida. >> get lost, cressida. >> don't boo me . >> don't boo me. >> don't boo me. >> you didn't vote. >> you didn't vote. >> brexit? no, i didn't know you've gone. >> really right wing in your old age. yeah, of course i might. >> you know, you cross a expands, your mind shrinks. that's mate. that's how it works, mate. >> think the thing about >> i just think the thing about this is this focus. what can the tories do? because they, they get, when they try and get, you know, when they try and do they get do something about it, they get accused of being anti migrant. >> they, they do >> well when they, when they do do know so what. do some you know so what. >> think i think >> well i think i do think there's a problem with it clearly there's something attractive coming here. attractive about coming here. >> nice country. >> so there is a nice country. >> so there is a nice country. >> yeah. yeah it >> yes. yeah. yeah i think it is. >> is. right wing. >> that's right wing. >> that's right wing. >> it a right wing opinion? >> is it a right wing opinion? >> is it a right wing opinion? >> changed me being >> gosh, it's changed me being here, hasn't it? >> these these >> but, you know, these these people are being exploited. >> these these are some of these people destitute. know, people are destitute. you know, they've given everything to cross dangerous circumstances. >> oh, breaks heart when >> oh, it breaks my heart when you and the idea you see the footage and the idea of being in the middle of of being stuck in the middle of the going to somewhere the night to going to somewhere you don't really know where you're they can't really you're going. they can't really know you're going. they can't really knoand these people, the >> and these people, the traffickers, >> and these people, the traff human misery like. >> and these people, the trafsojman misery like. >> and these people, the trafso it|an misery like. >> and these people, the trafso it does isery like. >> and these people, the

trafso it does have like. >> and these people, the trafso it does have lik be >> so it does have to be resolved for the sake of the people dying. people who are dying. >> as as gets once >> but as soon as it gets once it like the longer you it stopped, like the longer you take to stop it, the more people are week in week out. i are dying week in week out. i mean, vile. is. mean, it's just vile. it is. >> it horrible. okay. so >> it is horrible. okay. so we'll a question now, we'll get a question now, ishmael, we have ishmael? ishmael, do we have an ishmael? >> yeah. >> yes, ishmael is here. yeah. >> yes, ishmael is here. yeah. >> hello . >> hello. >> em- em— e ban saying the >> should we ban saying the grace before meals? >> yeah, this is an interesting one. so this is the society for barristers at lincoln's inn and they've outlawed saying grace before meals because they say that this is outdated. this is stereotyping people. they're going to use a non christian form of thanks instead. well, isn't that fair enough francis? because they won't not all lawyers are christian. >> no , no. i would say looking >> no, no. i would say looking at how lawyers behave, i think very few of them are. yeah, most of them. >> most of them are satanists. >> most of them are satanists. >> exactly. you know, they should sacrifice a goat . yeah, should sacrifice a goat. yeah, they should a goat. they should sacrifice a goat. and then before that. and after that sacrifice in your bank account, when you involved account, when you get involved with them, they most certainly do it's on brand. do that. so look, it's on brand. >> all i'm saying.

>> that's all i'm saying. >> that's all i'm saying. >> the >> well, apologies to the lawyers often have on lawyers that we often have on the show because they're wonderful. those ones are wonderful. but those ones are good. think saying good. yes. do you think saying is look, people is this i mean, look, people complain sort of complain about this sort of stuff say what stuff and they say this is what pc gone whatever do you pc gone mad or whatever do you think is? or you think think it is? or do you think it's i don't know. it's okay? i don't know. >> i mean, yeah, people get upset traditions, upset about losing traditions, don't like don't they? i mean, that's like a topic, isn't it, in a very hot topic, isn't it, in the these days various the uk these days for various reasons. so i can see why people get up about it. the get wound up about it. and the word outlaw a bit heavy, word outlaw is a bit heavy, isn't i mean, can't have isn't it? i mean, can't we have it for and not others? it for some and not for others? can an in, opt out, can it be an opt in, opt out, sensible compromise? can it be an opt in, opt out, senit'se compromise? can it be an opt in, opt out, senit'se com|ofmise? can it be an opt in, opt out, senit'se com|of story. i find >> it's a sort of story. i find it difficult to get too it very difficult to get too exercised about this kind of thing, honest. but like thing, to be honest. but like you maybe that's of you say, maybe that's a lack of sympathy for lawyers. i don't know. yeah. okay. know. yeah exactly. yeah. okay. right we're going to get a question from paul, where where is paul. is paul? hi, paul. >> why would any women support the far left? >> well, yeah. or indeed, the far right. i mean, there's been this research this week and they've apparently exposed that they've apparently exposed that the far right in the us is basically being well let's put it being driven chris skudder by

women or a lot of women are getting very involved in that movement. i don't know how it is in the far right and far left. well, i don't know people from far left or far right. so i don't really know. >> but it's humanity, isn't it? it ever it's lady it was ever thus. it's lady macbeth. we're the background macbeth. we're in the background encouraging you. i that encouraging you. i mean, that is women's evolution women's role in in the evolution of the species. >> i'm. absolutely. >> i'm. yeah, absolutely. >> i'm. yeah, absolutely. >> adam. adam and eve >> this is adam. adam and eve all over again. yes, it was you people. it was us with the apple. >> it was all along, >> it was us all along, colluding with the serpent, aren't we? >> coming here. >> do coming over here. >> do coming over here. >> over here. >> we coming over here. >> we coming over here. >> look. >> em- em— >> two halves of the same species . yes. all right. we. we species. yes. all right. we. we sit at home going. coming up with then we send with the ideas and then we send you out to do something like that. i know. i read this that. i don't know. i read this article i thought, yeah, that. i don't know. i read this article do ithought, yeah, that. i don't know. i read this article do adminght, yeah, that. i don't know. i read this article do admin behindah, women do admin behind the scenes. know why . scenes. duh. i don't know why. it's no, but i mean, also , like >> no, but i mean, also, like any political movement, far right, for whatever is right, far there for whatever is going women in going to have men and women in it. absolutely. do we it. absolutely. so why do we need to of say, is need a study to sort of say, is it it this sort of stereotype it is it this sort of stereotype or misogynistic or is it this misogynistic stereotype that women can't possibly possibly possibly be bad, can't possibly do bad of course they can. >> i don't think that's a

misogynistic stereotype. i'm going to be with you. going to be honest with you. >> well, with i'm with lady >> well, i'm with i'm with lady macbeth . >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiieth . >> well, i'm with i'm with lady mail think just man >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiwould just man >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiwould who just man >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiwould who hast man >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiwould who has gone man >> well, i'm with i'm with lady maiiwould who has gone through who would who has gone through a particularly you particularly bad divorce. you know, able clarify know, we'll be able to clarify that for you. >> although maybe it's >> but although maybe it's because far you because in the far right, you know, there's a lot of tradwives women themselves believe know, there's a lot of tradwives wom shouldn'temselves believe know, there's a lot of tradwives wom shouldn'temseithe believe know, there's a lot of tradwives wom shouldn'temseithe right ve know, there's a lot of tradwives wom shouldn'temseithe right to vote. >> they should stay home and >> they should stay at home and just and wash and all that just knit and wash and all that sort of thing. >> while they're knitting, >> but while they're knitting, they could still be, you know, do knitting, get on do a bit of knitting, get on facebook, a few i facebook, spread a few ideas. i don't maybe. don't know, maybe. >> anyway so we've >> who knows? anyway so we've got a final question in this section. this is from rahul . section. this is from rahul. where's rahul? i pronouncing where's rahul? am i pronouncing that right? >> you're right. yeah, >> yeah, you're right. yeah, it's rahul. fine. it's rahul. but that's fine. >> so wrong . yeah. thanks it's rahul. but that's fine. >> sparing wrong . yeah. thanks it's rahul. but that's fine. >> sparing my'ong . yeah. thanks it's rahul. but that's fine. >> sparing my feelings, h. thanks it's rahul. but that's fine. >> sparing my feelings, buthanks it's rahul. but that's fine. >> sparing my feelings, but it nks for sparing my feelings, but it was wrong . was wrong. >> 90% right. but that's not the question . so. so the question question. so. so the question is, is it wrong to compare napoleon to the likes of hitler and stalin? >> ridley scott ridley scott, the great director who directed alien and gi. jane, maybe we should say less about that, but he he has faced criticism because he's got a new film

about napoleon bonaparte. >> and during the promotion season of this biopic, he's compared napoleon to hitler and stalin and lots of napoleon fans are upset. >> well , look, i are upset. >> well, look, i agree that it's wrong because obviously napoleon is french and therefore he's incompetent. you really are. >> oh, my goodness, francis, you really are down on the french tonight. has something happened tonight. has something happened to you? what happened to you with to you? what happened to you witino, they don't do any work . >> no, they don't do any work. you know, they're always. >> put a stop to >> i'm going to put a stop to this xenophobic diatribe. >> xenophobic. >> he's not xenophobic. >> he's not xenophobic. >> the french. i love >> i love the french. i love baguettes. >> are you going live >> then what are you going live there? because nothing works. >> i might go and live there just spite you. now that's just to spite you. now that's what going i'm what i'm going to do now. i'm going for sensible going to go for a more sensible perspective the non perspective from the non xenophobic cressida wetton. well although you were banging on about the welsh earlier, but we'll forget. >> we'll forget about bristol. i can't it . so you don't hear can't help it. so you don't hear german people generally, passionately celebrating hitler. do you ever i mean, so well okay. in general, the germans

i've spoken to are very embarrassed about hitler and they're not they don't celebrate him. whereas french people, there's a lot of stuff from napoleon that they do . napoleon that they do. >> but he's a bit more ambiguous, isn't he? depending on perspective . on your perspective. >> good point. >> that's another good point. it's longer ago, isn't it's a lot longer ago, isn't it? >> ago. even people >> a lot longer ago. even people at were sort some at the time were sort of some people william is really people william hasn't is really pro people were pro napoleon. other people were you they were you know, they there were debates time. it debates going on at the time. it wasn't quite simple that's wasn't quite as simple that's true. know ridley true. but you know but ridley scott suppose just scott really i suppose is just trying film. you trying to plug his film. you know, more exciting if know, isn't it more exciting if he's more of a kind of hitler stalin figure, you know? >> i mean, yeah. and >> well, yeah, i mean, yeah. and hitler forceful person, hitler was a forceful person, wasn't that was wasn't he? yes. that was somewhere wasn't he? yes. that was sonwowere wasn't he? yes. that was sonwow .e wasn't he? yes. that was sonwow . that's quite statement. >> no, i think i forget the phrase he used now, but he was he's making the point that the character he wants of napoleon is to like this, this is to be like this, this extremely . yes. extremely forthright. yes. what's the word? >> he wants him to be dominant. tyrannical. yes. really? >> yes, exactly . >> yes, exactly. >> yes, exactly. >> so that's the choice that he does. choice. does. and that's his choice. artistically, can do artistically, i think you can do that. that in that. they do that in

productions caesar. productions of julius caesar. they make him out to be a complete tyrant, whereas the play's bit ambiguous play's a bit more ambiguous about of isn't it? >> yeah, absolutely. yeah, absolutely. >> won't to shakespeare >> we won't go to shakespeare now. like it's like now. i know. it's like it's like your isn't yeah. your old job, isn't it? yeah. >> be english teacher. >> to be an english teacher. yeah, exactly. >> really. scott, i'll >> but i can really. scott, i'll forgive because just forgive anything because i just think really great director. >> he is. gladiator is a masterpiece. >> gladiator, of course. it's a great we're going to great film. okay we're going to move a final question. great film. okay we're going to move got a final question. great film. okay we're going to move got a a final question. great film. okay we're going to move got a question al question. great film. okay we're going to move got a question via|uestion. great film. okay we're going to move got a question via emailn. we've got a question via email from sarah should from sarah. sarah says, should the house pub be rebuilt the crooked house pub be rebuilt now, this now, you'll know about this story it's been all story because it's been all oven story because it's been all over, all over the place this story because it's been all over, (thisfer the place this story because it's been all over, (thisferine place this story because it's been all over, (thisferin dudley, this week. this is in dudley, this iconic crooked house pub. i don't you've got an don't know if you've got an image but it's the image of it, but it's the wonkiest in the country. wonkiest pub in the country. well, was until till burnt well, it was until till it burnt down other day . now police down the other day. now police are treating treating it as arson. and i have to say, cressida, there's a lot of i'm not an investigative type, but the diggers that that cleaned up the diggers that that cleaned up the debris were there the day before it burnt down and antique grandfather clock was removed , grandfather clock was removed, allegedly from the pub in the

days leading up to the thing. and they booked a band on the night of the fire called gasoline and matches. now now i'm just now they say that's just coincidental . i don't want just coincidental. i don't want to cast aspersions because i haven't done the investigation. i don't know . but the police i don't know. but the police have got a point. >> i think they have. i think for all the criticism of the police, of late, this is something they should be looking at and they are. >> but the outrage in dudley is in country . >> but the outrage in dudley is in country. this >> but the outrage in dudley is in country . this is a in the black country. this is a real black country icon. well, it and the question was, should >> and the question was, should it be rebuilt? and fortunately, i think it can be, because i don't think it can be, because the it was the way it came about, it was a farmhouse 1700 and something. farmhouse in 1700 and something. and mining and then subsequently the mining caused subside and to caused it to subside and to become the crooked building that it was . so how do you rebuild it was. so how do you rebuild that , even if it was. so how do you rebuild that, even if you wanted to? >> yes , there was a statement >> yes, there was a statement from sort of this local group of black folk saying, we're black country folk saying, we're not going to forget this, this matters and the people who matters to us and the people who did people this, we did this. if people did this, we should we don't for should say we don't know for sure. forgiven sure. they'll never be forgiven , basically. >> i mean, that does sound like a does little bit,

a threat. it does a little bit, doesn't it does sound doesn't it? yeah, it does sound like it does sound like a threat, but it does sound incredibly it's just like a threat, but it does sound incre sady it's just like a threat, but it does sound incre sad because it's just like a threat, but it does sound incresad because this it's just like a threat, but it does sound incresad because this iss just very sad because this is obviously an ancient building, which meant a lot to people in the black country . you were the black country. you were saying it's an icon of the black country. got about country. they've only got about two i've been two of them. i've been there. that's not not that's true. it's not it's not the best. so so what? >> you're making so many enemies tonight. the french, the black country folk, of these country folk, but none of these people country folk, but none of these peoso�* fine . but it's just >> so it's fine. but it's just sad about the building . it is sad about the building. it is very sad. >> and there's a kind of like i hate the idea of just of demolishing historical landmarks. anyway, i hate the idea, particularly that people who are after money, if that's the case in this case, they don't about sort of don't care about sort of trashing heritage. trashing these. the heritage. you know, it's not. >> it's very sad, sad >> and it's very sad, very sad indeed. >> next on free speech >> okay. so next on free speech nafion >> okay. so next on free speech nation , it's news nation, it's our arts news roundup . and we're going to be roundup. and we're going to be examining concerns the examining concerns over the future teaching and future of music, teaching and a worrying decline in modern languages . learning don't go languages. learning don't go anywhere . earlier

>> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. so it's nation with me, andrew doyle. so wsfime nation with me, andrew doyle. so it's time for a semi—regular feature when i'm going to be discussing news stories regarding the arts. and here to help me do this, i'm joined by the writer broadcaster and the writer, broadcaster and historian david oldroyd bolt, who thanks for joining me , who thanks for joining me, david. so i want you to start by talking about the concerns over the scholarly study of music. what's happened? >> well, this is off the back of an article in the times, higher education supplement by professor . professor ian paice. >> paice a pianist of >> ian paice is a pianist of great renown, specialising in the modern repertoire, and he's also professor of music at city university he's written university london. he's written a says that now less a piece that says that now less than 20% of music degrees taken in this country actually study music . that is to in this country actually study music. that is to say, in this country actually study music . that is to say, they music. that is to say, they study harmony , they study study harmony, they study theory, they study all the

things that make up what you might call grammar and the might call the grammar and the literature music and serious literature of music and serious performance practise. and that nearly 80% of it now is in pop based music studies or in ethno musicography or in other areas that essentially , i would that are essentially, i would say, a branch of sociology, not really serious musical study i >> right? so why has that happened ? this another happened? is this another example kind of way that example of the kind of way that this of ideology relating this sort of ideology relating to group identity has sort of crept into various academic disciplines? >> well, i think it's happened for two reasons. one is that since the 1990s, there has been a of what's called the new a rise of what's called the new musicology, a rise of what's called the new murold ogy, a rise of what's called the new murold fashioned as they would the old fashioned as they would put it, study of the basics of minims and crotchets and semiquavers and quavers and how you chords how you make chords and how you write melody was formalism was write a melody was formalism was essentially an old fashioned white way of thinking about music. and alongside this rosy idea that all music, such as they insist on pluralising everything are equal. that is to say that there is no difference between the banging on a stone that might find in a in that you might find in a in a prehistoric society and a

symphony beethoven or symphony of beethoven or a nocturne chopin. and it's nocturne of chopin. and it's drawing of false equivalence, drawing of a false equivalence, i say , that is at an i should say, that is at an academic become now mania. >> well, is it a mistrust of this this idea, a kind of mistrust elitism? i suppose, mistrust of elitism? i suppose, because, you know, i like pop music as much as anyone else. but recognise that the pop but i do recognise that the pop music i enjoy is not brahms, you know, know, i know know, i know, i know the difference don't think difference and i don't think that's pop music to that's offensive to pop music to say it's not high art. say that it's not high art. >> i thank god for >> well, i think thank god for p0p >> well, i think thank god for pop it's not brahms. pop music that it's not brahms. one dreariest one of the dreariest composers ever but actually i ever to write, but actually i think it's more that they're trying the worst of trying to say that the worst of knowledge of the basics of music is in fact no worth at all, and that a great many music degrees over recent have been over the recent years have been towards vocational like towards vocational things like teaching school teaching primary school instruments, which requires practically no knowledge of either the instrument or of theory and towards theory or practise and towards basically things that actually require no testable, no provable knowledge . these are all sort of knowledge. these are all sort of ideas based but not knowledge based , which we see in a great based, which we see in a great many human subjects now. yes. >> i mean, it's also creeping

into schools, into even at primary school level . katharine primary school level. katharine birbalsingh, the headmistress of michaela school, was talking about her concern when there was this that a music courses this idea that a music courses the should study stormzy the kids should study stormzy rather mozart because they rather than mozart because they were suggesting that black children couldn't possibly enjoy the a white composer. the work of a white composer. and that's quite patronising and, dare i say, a little bit racist . racist. >> y- y— @ it's quite a lot >> i think it's quite a lot racist suggest given racist to suggest that given that over the prom season, that we over the prom season, we've heard work of samuel we've heard the work of samuel taylor coleridge, who's a really rather wonderful black composer and of others, by the way, and of many others, by the way, who being discovered who are being discovered and promoted proms. promoted by the bbc proms. i know everybody's know it's not everybody's favourite proms a favourite thing. the proms is a great season i encourage great season and i encourage everybody go , no, the point everybody to go, no, the point is there soft is that there is this soft bigotry of low expectations that people deprived people from deprived backgrounds, whether that be white that people from white or black, that people from different traditions couldn't possibly to classical possibly listen to classical music. to use a broader term and enjoy it's not enjoy it because it's not something they something with which they relate. nobody comes relate. well, look, nobody comes out to out of the womb relating to anything . we are a tabula rasa. anything. we are a tabula rasa. we are a blank slate. you relate to because you find it

to it because you find it emotionally moving and then if you're minded, you go on and you're so minded, you go on and study is what happened study it. this is what happened to as a three year old to me as a three year old pianist. i heard beethoven and thought, this is wonderful and went equally went and studied it. and equally when pop, when i hear something of pop, for , whether it's for instance, whether it's whether garage, whether for instance, whether it's whedrill, garage, whether for instance, whether it's whedrill, whetherje, whether for instance, whether it's whedrill, whether it'svhether for instance, whether it's whedrill, whether it's rock,ar it's drill, whether it's rock, whether it's blues, if i like it, find out more it, i'll go and find out more about that is, regardless of about it. that is, regardless of age, of sex, age, regardless of sex, regardless of race. and i think what's happened in lot of what's happened in a lot of universities and this was happening my at happening as my time at an undergraduate between zero seven and 11 was that this intense specialisation , this idea that specialisation, this idea that you to move towards an idea you had to move towards an idea that was essentially, as i said earlier, sociological rather than musical, was gaining pace. and seems, as we see from and now it seems, as we see from the statistic, the the latest statistic, to be the majority, it's so reductive. >> idea that i can i can >> the idea that i can i can connect to mozart because of the colour of my skin makes no sense. nothing sense. i've got nothing in common with mozart. >> don't even speak >> well, you don't even speak german. >> oh, exactly. we go. so >> oh, exactly. there we go. so now there was now let's move on. there was another that wanted another story that you wanted to talk to arts talk about relating to arts developments moment. developments at the moment. what's this? >> well, is sunday

>> well, this is the sunday times story times running with a story this morning the numbers morning that the numbers of children a—levels children studying gcse a—levels sorry, french german has sorry, french and german has dropped in the dropped precipitously in the case it's dropped case of german, it's dropped half what that half in recent years. what that story failed to point out was that language study in schools at gcse and a—level is at a higher number than it's been forever . the higher number than it's been forever. the number of children studying mandarin in the past three years has quadrupled . the three years has quadrupled. the numbers studying urdu and punjabi and spanish have gone through the roof . so it's just through the roof. so it's just these specific languages and there was a rather boring and utilitarian slant to this that well , you know, maybe utilitarian slant to this that well, you know, maybe it's utilitarian slant to this that well , you know, maybe it's not well, you know, maybe it's not such a bad thing because we've got google translate who got google translate now, so who needs languages? and needs to study languages? and i think typical of think it's rather typical of the debate on, debate that goes on, particularly, afraid it's particularly, i'm afraid it's the under tory governments about language, learning, about the humanities in general. from a dull utilitarian point of view . dull utilitarian point of view. why? with it? why? why bother with it? >> the >> why is that that so often the conservative party and conservative politicians have this tendency of sort of dismissing the arts or at least playing the arts down the playing the arts down on the bafis playing the arts down on the basis they're kind of basis that they're a kind of luxury. not going to luxury. they're not going to earn money and

earn you much money and therefore not therefore they're not as important stem subjects. important as stem subjects. >> might say >> well, a pessimist might say it's their children are it's because their children are having an independent schools anyway, else might anyway, and somebody else might say, it's because they're say, well, it's because they're constantly with constantly at war with the with the sector, with the arts sector, with the humanities a body. and humanities as a as a body. and therefore, if they can reduce therefore, if they can reduce the number people going into the number of people going into it the study it, it by reducing the study of it, you to me again, you know, that to me again, is a rather view. rather pessimistic view. i simply a lot of people, simply think to a lot of people, a people on the right, a lot of people on the right, that what matters is the economy. matters growth economy. what matters is growth because people's because that makes people's lives yes, fine. lives better. yes, that's fine. but you've made people's but when you've made people's lives if they have lives better, if they have nothing to enjoy, what has been the it? and this is the point of it? and this is a rather argument rather ruskinian argument from the century yes, as the 19th century that, yes, as you as you have more you get better, as you have more money, should able money, you should also be able to have hinterland to to have a broader hinterland to be able to enjoy arts and culture. meaning culture. and to me, the meaning of learning to be of language learning is to be able how other able to understand how other people . people think. >> well, we don't have a great reputation internationally when it did . it comes to, well, we did. >> used to i mean, >> we did used to i mean, we had. you think anthony eden, had. you think of anthony eden, who got a double starred first in fluent in languages, was fluent in arabic fine . arabic and persian, fine. churchill rudimentary churchill spoke rudimentary french, but still managed to

make understood . it make himself understood. and it was requirement foreign was a requirement of the foreign office relatively recently office until relatively recently that speak perfect that you had to speak perfect french plus french and german, plus a classical language plus an eastern what went eastern language. so what went wrong? what went wrong was on the hand, the closing the the one hand, the closing of the foreign office language school in east. yes. so in the middle east. yes. so basically, that knowledge basically, all of that knowledge of arabic persian went and of arabic and persian went and it's now it's very difficult now to find people the foreign who people in the foreign office who have grasp of arabic, have a good grasp of arabic, persian, , mind persian, mandarin, never mind more languages like more tricky languages like kyrgyzstan, for instance . yes. kyrgyzstan, for instance. yes. the other thing that's happened , i think, is that it's become a rather combative political football. as you mentioned earlier, that people on the left say, well, we should have more of sort of thing because it of this sort of thing because it produces people us and produces more people like us and people right, the knee people on the right, the knee jerk say, no, we shouldn't. it'll people it'll produce more people like them. yes, is there is there them. so, yes, is there is there anything the elimination of anything in the elimination of greek latin at schools greek and latin at schools as well? greek and latin at schools as welno. compton mackenzie wrote >> no. compton mackenzie wrote that was the that that he thought was the signal the british empire signal that the british empire would did would decline and it did coincide. >> of course. but this was >> yes. of course. but this was something about something that was argued about . late 19th . don't forget, in the late 19th century, particularly with . don't forget, in the late 19th cen'passage particularly with . don't forget, in the late 19th cen'passage of|rticularly with . don't forget, in the late 19th cen'passage of thejlarly with . don't forget, in the late 19th cen'passage of the 1878 with

the passage of the 1878 education which made education act, which made everybody up to 13 go to school, there was the idea, well, fine, keep it in the public schools because turning because know they're turning out diplomats and people like that, but rarely do. everyday people need learn greek and latin, need to learn greek and latin, which i think is inculcate a respect for the past , a respect respect for the past, a respect for a different way of life. well, than just well, more than that, it's just good brain. if you can good for your brain. if you can construe a sentence of greek, i mean latin, it's slightly easier because works on formal because it works on more formal structures. greek is extraordinarily difficult. if you do to, however you can do that to, however rudimentary degree , your brain rudimentary a degree, your brain has greater plasticity , and has a greater plasticity, and your i think, is more able your mind, i think, is more able to think in linear, in non—linear ways, in lateral ways. but aside from that, these are some of the most extraordinary works of literature ever produced in greek would you literature ever produced in gre

cutting yourself off from half of what makes that beautiful and none to elitist. >> this can be something that can be open to all it should be and this is if we had and i think this is if we had a truly brilliant education movement country, the movement in this country, the people education people who cared about education in broadest not in the broadest sense, not merely narrow, merely in the narrow, technocratic, utilitarian sense merely in the narrow, te> okay. well, david aldridge, boy, really boy, that's really, really great. come we boy, that's really, really greétalk come we boy, that's really, really greétalk more come we boy, that's really, really greétalk more aboutne we boy, that's really, really greétalk more about these we boy, that's really, really greétalk more about these kinds�* can talk more about these kinds of issues. forgive you for of issues. i'll forgive you for your hate your brahms comment. you hate him. know? him. do you know? >> find him tedious. it's >> i just find him tedious. it's really turgid. >> i just find him tedious. it's reaieven turgid. >> i just find him tedious. it's reaieven the turgid. >> i just find him tedious. it's reaieven the german requiem. >> even the german requiem. >> even the german requiem. >> yes. there is one piece of

brahms, which is wonderful. the the handel variations of just 22 for piano. there we go . for piano. there we go. >> we've reached a compromise. david boult, thank you very much indeed. david boult, thank you very much indeed . and next on free speech indeed. and next on free speech nafion indeed. and next on free speech nation , former mexican nation, former mexican congressman rodrigo ivan cortez has been convicted of gender based political violence. so i'm going to be joined by two more excellent guests to discuss this. but first, let's get the latest weather . latest weather. >> looks like things are heating up . boxed boilers proud sponsors up. boxed boilers proud sponsors of weather on . gb news. hello there. >> i'm greg dewhurst and welcome to your latest gb news weather forecast . we've got rain coming forecast. we've got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. low pressure in charge at moment, that moves at the moment, but that moves out as we head towards out the way as we head towards wednesday. high pressure wednesday. and high pressure replaces it, settling our weather down this evening. we have outbreaks of heavy rain pushing in across the west

country, wales spreading north and move through and eastwards as we move through into hours . and eastwards as we move through into hours. this into the early hours. this turning heavy at times over parts of northern wales, northern england and metoffice warning here. clear warning in force here. clear skies for northern ireland, scotland , some showery rain in scotland, some showery rain in places and temperatures generally remaining in double figures. a wet start across figures. so a wet start across england and wales monday morning . across transpennine . heavy rain across transpennine routes in particular. if you're travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through the day. sunshine and showers for northern ireland and scotland. again, some of these heavy times too , and heavy at times too, and temperatures the high temperatures generally the high teens quite a muggy teens to low 20s quite a muggy feel where we do see any sunshine across central and western parts of england and wales later on tuesday, a much calmer picture, high pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way. still fairly unsettled. so a day of sunny spells and scattered showers. some of the showers on the heavy side and then it settles down wednesday into thursday. plenty of sunny spells

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don't see that whatsoever anymore. >> you're listening to gb news radio . welcome back to free radio. welcome back to free speech nation . speech nation. >> an unusual court case in mexico apparently reached its conclusion last week when former congressman rodrigo ivan cortez was convicted of gender based political violence . this was political violence. this was because of social media posts made by cortez, which referred to transgender identifying mexican congressional representative salma luevano as a man sorry, quote man who self—describes as a woman . now, self—describes as a woman. now, last wednesday, mexico's highest court for electoral issues upheld the lower court's guilty verdict . cortez must pay upheld the lower court's guilty verdict. cortez must pay a fine and publish the court ruling and

and publish the court ruling and an apology drafted by the court on twitter and facebook daily for 30 days. so to discuss this, i'm joined by lawyer herman saucedo and writer lara lecuona. thank you both for joining saucedo and writer lara lecuona. thank you both forjoining me thank you both for joining me very much . herman, thank you both for joining me very much. herman, i'm going to come to you first. about this. this is a very scary case when it comes to the idea of freedom of speech. and i think a lot of people assume that mexico hasn't been infected by the culture wars the way we wars in the way that we have over here. wrong . over here. are we wrong. >> well, yes, we can see right now very, very infected by them . sorry i can come to either first. >> but herman, can i come to you first? yeah yeah, sure. >> as we can see, this case is radical. not only in that it punishes free speech. it makes compelled speech part of the punishment . and we can see that punishment. and we can see that this global ideological infection is not only part of the united states and of britain, it's also part of mexico and many other countries. so people tend to think of

mexico and other latin american countries or maybe some asian countries or maybe some asian countries as exempt from this ideological virus . but that's ideological virus. but that's not true at all. the culture war is raging not only in the united states and great britain and in europe. it's raging in the entire world. it has consequences around the entire world. so as we can see, it's going to it's going to trickle down to the rest of the world. >> lara, i want to bring you in because you've had direct experience with your experience of this with your book, called when book, which was called when trans not transgressive. trans is not transgressive. could tell us about that? >> yeah, sure. i was invited by an established publisher house, siglo veintiuno, which is a very , very renowned publisher to write this book because the, the editor saw that this was this was an important subject to discuss at society level . so discuss at society level. so i wrote it. and and, and it was going to be presented in the largest book fair in latin

america, which is the guadalajara book fair. but trans activists, as they do , started activists, as they do, started harassing the fair and long story short, my book wasn't presented, but it wasn't even published by siglo veintiuno , published by siglo veintiuno, because some trans activists didn't want it to. so self—published and i can say it will be published in english in november by spinifex press, a radical feminist publisher. but yes, i have been constantly silenced . well, they tried to silenced. well, they tried to silenced. well, they tried to silence me , but but i don't silence me, but but i don't allow myself to be silenced. and since 2017, right . and yes, so since 2017, right. and yes, so we have this situation where your books cancelled. >> it's not so it is going on. and specifically around this issue of gender identity, this sort of silencing of any kind of debate around around it. herman, can i ask you your you made a point about compelled speech and in this particular case with cortez, the fact that he has to pubush cortez, the fact that he has to publish an apology which was

composed by the court, that is compelled speech, isn't it . compelled speech, isn't it. >> yes, of course it's compelled speech. and the thing is, they have no legal basis to compel the speech. but of course, who gets to decide what laws apply and what laws don't? don't apply in each moment? well, the courts do . and this court that has been do. and this court that has been radically taken over by the gender ideologues and is not willing to have a conversation with anybody who disagrees with them so they can do basically whatever they want. there's been a lot of discussion as to whether the legality of this punishment is correct or not. well in the end, you can throw articles all around, but in the end, who cares ? who cares? it's end, who cares? who cares? it's if it's permitted legally because the people who have the power are just going to do whatever they want through the power of the court. so here we go. we're talking very specifically here about someone who someone. who misgendered someone. >> someone , you >> it's not about someone, you know, perpetuating harassment or abuse or anything like that. it's very specifically about

someone recognising biological sex rather than gender identity. am i right ? am i right? >> yes, of course . and, well, of >> yes, of course. and, well, of course, the mexican constitution is supposed to protect free speech. and the article six of the constitution that would be like our first amendment, so to say . and it protects free say. and it protects free speech, except in the cases where it interferes with human dignity. the thing is , who gets dignity. the thing is, who gets to interpret the law and decide what interferes and what damages human dignity? well the courts do. so the courts decide that misgendering somebody is an act that defies the dignity of this transgender person. well. well, they can get to decide a fitting punishment for them. >> so , lara, what what can >> so, lara, what what can people do about this? because it's particularly disturbing. i think, when it starts being politicians criminalised for effectively expressing an opinion. and if politicians are criminalised for that opinion, what message that what kind of message does that tend to the general public about what permitted and what isn't ? >> exactly 7 >> exactly that. that's what worries me. and let me let me mention another case related to

this one, that of theresa castile, who is currently a congresswoman . and she was also congresswoman. and she was also accused by this same man, salma luevano of political gender based political violence, because she referred to him as a trans person, a biology magical man. that's what she said . and man. that's what she said. and the courts sustained that. that was gender based violence . and was gender based violence. and now she is equally registered in this national register as rodngo this national register as rodrigo cortez . and this is a rodrigo cortez. and this is a woman being being condemned of committing of committing supposed gender based political violence for referring to a man as a violence for referring to a man violence for referring to a man as a man . as a man. >> so this isn't the first time as a man. this has happened and this is not new. >> no, this is a very recent cases, both of them . yes. but cases, both of them. yes. but yes . what is the message? they yes. what is the message? they are trying . to the message is, are trying. to the message is, if you are a woman and you want

to refer to a man as what he is, beware her because we can condemn you and yeah, that's absolutely . absolutely. >> so from a legal perspective , >> so from a legal perspective, herman, what can people do about this now that this precedent appears to have been established legally? it's not going to be easy, is it, to fight back for free speech? >> no, it's not, because the people in power do not care about having a conversation with people they disagree with. and this goes for everybody across the political spectrum, be they conservatives, be they liberal, be they feminists, be they catholics , whatever the courts catholics, whatever the courts are basically telling us, warning us, do not step over the line. so i think this is a very important place for two things. first of all, for people of different political persuasions to come together and to fight against this together, even though we may not agree on the specifics . and secondly, we have specifics. and secondly, we have to realise conservative gives

and liberals alike that that the state is antagonise towards free speech. so so once we know that and once we know that we are not deaung and once we know that we are not dealing with people that are playing in good faith, then we can make decisions according to that. because as you can see in this whole debacle , the thing this whole debacle, the thing that going on is, oh, we're that is going on is, oh, we're going to appeal to a higher court and we're going to appeal to them, a higher court. there are higher courts are no longer any higher courts to going to to appeal to. nobody is going to impart once you impart justice. so once you realise you can act and realise that you can act and make accordingly. realise that you can act and ma lara accordingly. realise that you can act and ma lara , accordingly. realise that you can act and ma lara , do accordingly. realise that you can act and ma lara , do you�*dingly. realise that you can act and ma lara , do you share'. realise that you can act and ma lara , do you share that view >> lara, do you share that view that actually this is a >> lara, do you share that view dispiriting situation and when the high courts themselves are captured , there's nowhere left captured, there's nowhere left to go . to go. >> yeah, yeah. i'm there's a little despair . but anyway, we little despair. but anyway, we should keep fighting against this because even though we won't win in the short term , uh won't win in the short term, uh , what can we do if not keep fighting against this ? and yes, fighting against this? and yes, there are several, several signs

that the courts are are are captured by transgenderism . um, captured by transgenderism. um, and it is very worrying because some activists, some transgender activists are telling the society at large that we have to believe in gender identity . we believe in gender identity. we they are enforcing a belief in us and the court is doing also they are dictating what the court says, what the court decides , what we have, what we decides, what we have, what we have to believe, who is right, who is wrong. and it is very worrying. >> so not just compelled speech, but compelled belief is very disturbing. herman salcedo and laura la corona, thank you so much. both forjoining me tonight . so much. both forjoining me tonight. so let's much. both forjoining me tonight . so let's see what tonight. so let's see what cressida and francis think of this. your latin american half latin latino. >> yes. yes. >>- >> yes. yes. >> so i'm going to come to you first and ask, which surprises me with your rampant xenophobia. but anyway, mate, when you grow up but anyway, mate, when you grow up with a latin american mother , you just look and you know, it's the optimum. it's not the optimum. >> you what i mean? >> do you know what i mean?

well, your xenophobic even well, so your xenophobic even against your mother. >> so . so what do >> okay, so. so tell me, what do you about mexico? you think about this in mexico? >> because they >> so it's ironic because they said gender based violence, but where i come from, that's a where i come from, that's just a bit mate. number one. >> okay . >> okay. >> okay. >> and >> okay. » and >> and number two, i find it ironic that a bloke talking about gender ideology is called her man together . her man together. >> okay, i don't think you're really engaging with the issues, francis. so i'm going to go to cressida. what do think cressida. what do you think about is about it? because it is disturbing, it, when you disturbing, isn't it, when you know a politician can be criminalised, express criminalised, forced to express an the courts are an apology and the courts are what happened to free speech? >> what's this is why i'm so proud work for this channel. proud to work for this channel. i a kid, we all i mean, when i was a kid, we all just knew speech was just knew free speech was brilliant. let's all go for that. seems to that. and it just seems to have disintegrate it's disintegrate dated. i mean, it's so horrifying. like a sort so horrifying. it's like a sort of the idea of being compelled to something facebook to write something on facebook for it's like for 30 days. to me, it's like being the stocks in being put in the stocks in mediaeval times. it's it's mediaeval times. it's just it's i can't mediaeval times. it's just it's icant head mediaeval times. it's just it's i can't head around it i can't get my head around it and i'm horrified it. and i'm horrified by it. >> well, rightly >> absolutely. well, rightly so. okay free speech okay well, next on free speech nafion okay well, next on free speech nation running riot nation youths running riot on oxford hancock gets oxford street. matt hancock gets in the barbie movie spirit and a

lady reacts with mild disappointed when her flight is cancelled. it's almost time for social sensations. so do not go anywhere . you

welcome back to free speech nafion welcome back to free speech nation . so it's time for social nation. so it's time for social sensation . this is the part of sensation. this is the part of the show we devote to clips that have been going viral on social media. first, there's this video which made national news. it's hundreds of youths descending on oxford street after a tiktok video encouraged them to turn up and commit crime and disorder. let's have a look . let's have a look. so it's a strange sort of thing, this tiktok trend now of basically criminality, not just

pranks . and this started with pranks. and this started with that mizzi guy who was breaking into people's houses and filming, it. and now filming, filming it. and now we've got thing of tiktok we've got this thing of tiktok influencer and rob jd influencer saying, go and rob jd sports , gather acts sports, gather and commit acts of crime . so what's on here? >> what is going on? it's chaos, isn't it? right it's so far from anything i would have done when i was a kid, you know, we used to go up the quarry and have a little of cider and think we little bit of cider and think we were being outrageous, and now it's the it's amazing. it's just off the it's amazing. it's i think they like it's like i think they feel like there's no consequences. presumably they presumably right? or maybe they don't in their life don't have enough in their life that about that they're worried about losing. well, is there anything new this almost new about this this almost nihilism, it? nihilism, isn't it? >> yeah , it is almost nihilism. >> yeah, it is almost nihilism. >> yeah, it is almost nihilism. >> mean , but reality >> i mean, but the reality is we've gang culture for many, we've had gang culture for many, many hundreds and hundreds of years, particularly in london. the thing is, that is really depressing about it's just depressing about it is it's just rubbish. it's, you know, there's no strategy involved. if you're going to rob a joint, at least case it. firstly look where you're going to where the escape routes are. you know, maybe work with somebody on the inside, do

you know, and then get a nice healthy profit speaking as a seasoned criminal. >> . wouldn't you say that >> yes. wouldn't you say that strategically it's unsound to sort of post your plans on tiktok first? >> it's yeah, it is. it is. not only is he unsound, it's just terrible. and it gives criminals a name . a bad name. >> the issue here, >> exactly. so the issue here, cressida, is about technique rather than anything else, isn't it? yeah. okay well, next, we've got the former health secretary it? yeah. okay well, next, we've got tihancock. health secretary it? yeah. okay well, next, we've got tihancock. healthe'>ecretary it? yeah. okay well, next, we've got tihancock. healthe used ary it? yeah. okay well, next, we've got tihancock. healthe used to be matt hancock. now, he used to be a bit of a regular in this section. he hasn't featured lately, but now released lately, but he has now released a himself passionate a video of himself passionate dancing to barbie's boy friends. ken solo song . so welcome back, ken solo song. so welcome back, matt. let's have a look . and matt. let's have a look. and just there where i see love she sees a friend what will it take for her to see your man behind the ten and five for me ? why the ten and five for me? why would you do that ? i don't would you do that? i don't understand . understand. >> because, you know i'm not a psychiatrist know. >> but i really. unless he's trolling us all or whatever. because it's like, you know, we

all like a bit of a sing song, but we don't post that of but we don't post that sort of thing online, do we? >> that you were >> just imagine that you were the minister during the the health minister during the pandemic? yes. you made, all pandemic? yes. you made, by all accounts a pretty bad accounts of it, a pretty bad job. yeah. this is this what you would do as a way to try and redeem yourself with the public? >> it is that the point? it's >> is it is that the point? it's meant to be endearing . meant to be endearing. >> that is what women call swipe left it's i just think left energy. it's i just think he's grotesque . and the more he's grotesque. and the more i see of him, the worse it gets. >> wow. >> wow. >> you didn't pull any punches there with mr hancock, but what can you do? okay, well, look, finally, no one acts their best when flight gets cancelled. when a flight gets cancelled. but something else . but this is something else. crazy okay, well, crescent , how crazy okay, well, crescent, how do you react like that when you apply ? apply? >> it gets cancelled. >> it gets cancelled. >> if there's cctv. i mean, is that person okay? >> that's my worry, actually . that. >> that doesn't. >> that doesn't. >> yeah, it seems like there's some sort of issue there going

on beyond just mere distress. >> like some more context >> i'd like some more context for that. >> yeah, maybe more context is required . required. >> what do you think? that was probably after some >> what do you think? that was pr> what do you think? that was pr> what do you think? that was pr> what do you think? that was pr> it is the most frustrating thing, though, isn't it? when a flight cancelled, it's not flight gets cancelled, it's not the thing. flight gets cancelled, it's not the well, thing. flight gets cancelled, it's not the well, it's thing. flight gets cancelled, it's not the well, it's one thing. flight gets cancelled, it's not the well, it's one of thing. flight gets cancelled, it's not the well, it's one of them. >> well, it's one of them. >> well, it's one of them. >> been teacher. you've >> you've been a teacher. you've worked oh, worked with children. oh, yeah. >> that. >> no, there is that. >> no, there is that. >> there is. >> yeah, there is. >> yeah, there is. >> there is just like, you know, there are worse things when you look and realise look at a child and you realise that will ever come from that no good will ever come from this. i know. yeah. >> you don't fool >> look, you don't fool me. >> look, you don't fool me. >> you've never done it. so did you just not bother with those ones? well, you know, ones? well well, look, you know, it's evolution, mate. you know, there's going to be winners and there's going to be winners and there's going to be winners and there's going to be losers. yeah and to the ones there's going to be losers. yeah and you to the ones there's going to be losers. yeah and you can to the ones there's going to be losers. yeah and you can weed the ones there's going to be losers. yeah and you can weed out. the ones that you can weed out. >> survival of the fittest. exactly i'm very right wing. all of sudden. of a sudden. >> it'sjust of a sudden. >> it's just facts . >> it's just facts. >> it's just facts. >> all right, well, look, this is where we is the part of the show where we talk unfiltered talk through your unfiltered dilemmas. sending dilemmas. thank you for sending them our first dilemma is them in. our first dilemma is from freddie and freddie says, i've up my i've just broken up with my girlfriend. big deal, right? girlfriend. no big deal, right? she she's my housemate .

she catches she's my housemate. oh, what have i got myself into? well will it ever be able to have over? surely if you have people over? surely if you break up with someone, you should make you're not should make sure you're not cohabiting, yeah cohabiting, right? yeah >> spare room, mate. that's over >> oh, not even in the same room, but in the same house. >> wouldn't you move out and spare room is a website where people look for new places to live. what they do? live. is that what they do? >> just got go. could >> he's just got to go. could you live that? you live with that? >> well, unless sort of >> well, unless he's sort of suggesting maybe there can suggesting that maybe there can be to sort say, be mature enough to sort of say, well, you know, we've had this relationship up, but now we should on as should be able to just get on as acquainted aces. >> not? acquainted aces. >> why?rot? acquainted aces. >> why? on you can think ambitiously and a new girl ambitiously and bring a new girl over and then go for the magnificent double. >> francis , i'm really >> oh, francis, i'm really worried about you. >> psychologically >> it's just psychologically from over there , i think. >> i'm just saying what they're all thinking . all thinking. >> i think you have a very dark soul. >> i think you have a very dark soul . okay, we're going to move soul. okay, we're going to move on dilemma from on to another dilemma from samantha . samantha says, i am samantha. samantha says, i am into this guy, but he's really right wing and i am not. can you date across the political

benches? do opposites attract or are you just bound to have arguments? that's an interesting one, isn't it? do you think that's possible to date across the benches? i don't know. >> you've argued with me about this, it this, frances thinks it definitely i think. this, frances thinks it def canly i think. this, frances thinks it def canly see i think. this, frances thinks it def canly see rishii think. this, frances thinks it def canly see rishi sunak with >> can you see rishi sunak with angela rayner? >> could that happen? no, but that's . that's fantastic. >> reality tv. >> reality tv. >> let's it. isn't it? >> let's make it. oh, isn't it? let's make happen. let's make it happen. okay. >> specific think this is >> you specific think this is absolutely fine, don't you. >> you specific think this is abssaying fine, don't you. >> you specific think this is abssaying oh, , don't you. >> you specific think this is abssaying oh, they 't you. >> you specific think this is abssaying oh, they love j. >> you specific think this is abssaying oh, they love it. >> saying oh, they love it. >> saying oh, they love it. >> you say there's one. >> you say there's one. >> yes . >> yes. >> yes. >> it's just you >> yes. >> it'sjust you and her >> yes. >> it's just you and her are able to just put to the. able to just put that to the. >> well, i think we >> well, listen, i think we should get along should all just get get along and across the and we should move across the political. are the world. political. we are the world. right. let's do it anyway, thank you us free you for joining us for free speech nation. was the week speech nation. this was the week when fought when residents of dudley fought back of back against the destruction of their pub mexican their favourite pub and mexican congressman was punished for expressing and expressing his opinions and lesbians were punished for not being men. thank lesbians were punished for not beirto men. thank lesbians were punished for not beirto my men. thank lesbians were punished for not beirto my panel, men. thank lesbians were punished for not beirto my panel, cressida thank lesbians were punished for not beirto my panel, cressida wetton you to my panel, cressida wetton and frances foster and to all of my week. and you my guests this week. and if you want live in the want to join us live in the studio part our studio and be part of our wonderful studio audience, you can do that. just go to ww dot

sro audiences.com. the address is on the screen right now. come along. there's been a lovely audience tonight. we have lots of beer and snacks and of wine and beer and snacks and treats. we're basically bribing you but come treats. we're basically bribing yotjust but come treats. we're basically bribing yotjust apply but come treats. we're basically bribing yotjust apply and but come treats. we're basically bribing yotjust apply and come come treats. we're basically bribing yotjust apply and come along.�* in, just apply and come along. stay tuned for mark dolan tonight. that's next with the fantastic leo kearse standing in for mark. and please don't forget the headliners is on later 11:00 the late night paper preview show with comedians thanks joining me. see you thanks for joining me. see you next week . next week. >> the temperature's rising . >> the temperature's rising. boxt solar proud sponsors of weather on . gb news. weather on. gb news. >> hello there and greg dewhurst. and welcome to your latest gb news weather forecast . we've got rain coming up .we've got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. low pressure in charge at the but that moves out the moment, but that moves out the moment, but that moves out the way as we head towards wednesday. and high pressure replaces settling our replaces it, settling our weather down this evening. we

have outbreaks of heavy rain pushing across the west pushing in across the west country, spreading country, wales spreading north and as we move through and eastwards as we move through into the early hours. this turning at times over turning heavy at times over parts of northern wales, northern england and metoffice warning force clear warning in force here. clear skies northern ireland, skies for northern ireland, scotland, some showery rain in places and temperatures generally remaining in double figures. so a wet start across england wales monday england and wales monday morning. heavy rain across transpennine routes in particular. if you're travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through the day. sunshine and showers for northern ireland and scotland . northern ireland and scotland. again, of these heavy at again, some of these heavy at times temperatures times too, and temperatures generally teens to low generally the high teens to low 20s quite a muggy feel where we do see any sunshine across central western parts of central and western parts of england and wales central and western parts of england and wales later on england and wales later on tuesday, a much calmer picture, high pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way. still fairly unsettled . so a day of sunny unsettled. so a day of sunny spells and scattered showers. some of the showers on the heavy side and it settles down

side and then it settles down wednesday into thursday. plenty of sunny spells and temperatures starting to rise . starting to rise. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar proud sponsors of weather on .

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can you not see my insides breaking? how far would you go for love? brand—new 90 day fiance uk, available to stream only on discovery+. watch at no extra cost. say, "get discovery+" into your voice remote to activate. gb news. >> it's 9:00 on television and on radio and online in >> it's 9:00 on television and on radio and online in the on radio and online in the united kingdom and across the world. this is mark dolan tonight. in my opinion, it tonight. in my big opinion, it was the glorious 12th yesterday, the start of grouse hunting season . i'll be explaining why season. i'll be explaining why it's a good thing i'll be talking to a conservationist who rewild lions. she'll be joining me in the studio, hopefully with a lion in my take at ten. why can't the use the word woman? they've got so many euphemisms . they've got so many euphemisms. so a busy two hours to come. so

put something cold and fizzy so a busy two hours to come. so put something cold and fizzy in so a busy two hours to come. so put something cold and fizzy so a busy two hours to come. so put fridge or|g cold and fizzy so a busy two hours to come. so put fridge or|g cc up and fizzy so a busy two hours to come. so put fridge or|g cc up and kettle the fridge or fire up the kettle and a night of it. the fridge or fire up the kettle but first, the headlines with aaron armstrong . aaron armstrong. >> very good evening to you, aaron armstrong here in the gb newsroom. the government is facing renewed criticism of its immigration strategy after the deaths of six migrants in the engush deaths of six migrants in the english channel yesterday . 509 english channel yesterday. 509 people made the crossing on saturday, bringing the total for people made the crossing on the year to more than 16,500. it is a further setback to the prime minister rishi sunaks pledge to stop the boats , one of pledge to stop the boats, one of his five key priorities is campaign groups have described the deaths as appalling and preventable relatives of those who died in the omagh bombing 25 years ago have held a service to remember their loved ones. 29 people died in the car bomb remember their loved ones. 29 attack by the real ira . it was attack by the real ira. it was the greatest single loss of life in the history of the troubles . in the history of the troubles. no one has been criminally convicted of carrying out the