has been arrested at the man has been arrested at the erasmus medical centre . the erasmus medical centre. the other attack, we understand, took place at a nearby flat . took place at a nearby flat. it's unclear if the two incidents are linked . dutch incidents are linked. dutch police are saying the suspect was a student at the university where the shooting took place . where the shooting took place. there were fires as the incident progressed . also in the news progressed. also in the news today, tributes are pouring for in liliane andam after she was stabbed to death in south london. the 15 year old was attacked while she was on her way to school in croydon yesterday morning. her family say their hearts are broken by the senseless death of their daughter . she was the light of daughter. she was the light of their lives. they say. a 17 year old boy who police say knew the victim remains in custody after being arrested yesterday . roads being arrested yesterday. roads and local minister transport transport minister richard holden told gb news earlier what is being done to tackle knife crime . crime. >> no new legislation has been brought in. sentences are being strengthened, which is vitally

important as well. but overall i think this is about us as a society. really ensure that we get across to people that there is no place for possession of a knife and that yes , the knife and that yes, the government will act with tougher sentencing. we've got extra police , 20,000 plus now, extra police, 20,000 plus now, extra since when? i was elected in 2019. out on the streets . 2019. out on the streets. >> gb news understands that tunisian people smugglers have now begun preparing small boats to launch into the sea tomorrow, strong winds in the mediterranean have prevented any crossings to the southern med for more than a week. more migrant boats are expected to arrive on the italian island of lampedusa tomorrow , though, as lampedusa tomorrow, though, as weather conditions improve. this morning, a group of human rights lawyers and other officials visited the island to understand the impact of the crisis. there some michael gambon has been remembered as a magnificent trickster and the loveliest of

legends following his death at the age of 82. the dublin born star of the stage and screen who won four tv, baftas died peacefully in hospital last night after a bout of pneumonia. he's best known for playing hogwarts headmaster dumbledore in a number of the harry potter films, as well as being one of the original members of the royal national theatre alongside laurence olivier. his family say he was a beloved husband and father . and lastly, a 16 year father. and lastly, a 16 year old boy has been arrested after one of the most photographed trees in the country was felled. the tree at sycamore gap next to hadrian's wall and close to north cumberland, was made famous in the 1991 film. robin hood.the famous in the 1991 film. robin hood. the national trust says it's shocked and saddened to see the iconic tree cut down with gb news across the uk on tv in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker by saying play gb news. this is britain's news channel .

news channel. >> well, a very good evening and welcome to farage on gb news this evening. but maybe it's not a good evening. frankly, maybe it's not a good day at all, because tragically , yesterday because tragically, yesterday another teenager in london is dead , stabbed me , murdered, left dead, stabbed me, murdered, left home, going to school. parents waving her goodbye, expecting to see her in the evening. she didn't even make it to school . didn't even make it to school. i'm sick of it. i suspect you're sick of it. the country is sick of it. we can't just keep going on like this. it's not good enough for a minister there just to say we've got to change and we've got to have words and we'll have tougher sentences . we'll have tougher sentences. what about this, though ? what what about this, though? what about sentencing? actually just for carrying a knife , not just for carrying a knife, notjust for carrying a knife, notjust for using one, but actually for carrying it. it's time to do something different . carrying it. it's time to do something different. if carrying it. it's time to do something different . if you something different. if you always do what you always did,

guess what? you'll always get what you always got. and that's why my question to you, watching and listening at home should people be jailed? just for carrying a knife ? and then also carrying a knife? and then also a second question. if so , for a second question. if so, for how long? email me farage. gbnews.com or tweet the hashtag farage on gb news. well, i'm delighted to have two fantastic guests to debate this in the studio . norman brennan, well studio. norman brennan, well known to the channel, retired, met police officer and director of law and order foundation , and of law and order foundation, and also ken haynes , former chair of also ken haynes, former chair of haringey's, independent shouldn't stop and search monitor string group. these are two great guests who know this subject as well as anybody. i'm going to turn first to ken. thank you for being with us. look you know the subject well , look you know the subject well, ken, we can't keep going on like this. we've got to do something different. surely we've got to think, okay, sentence thing, it's not working. stop and search the current levels . it's

search the current levels. it's not working. we've got to do something radically different. ken, if we're going to get radically different results, we've got 13 teenagers this year alone. ken dead . alone. ken dead. >> yeah. i would just like to say i give my condolence to the to the young girl's family and the community and that's been affected by what took place. and yes, you're saying is right because the things that we're doing has not been working. you know, we're mentioning. yes in the combination you may get a better result. but what i find does work better is, first of all, we've got to bring the schools in because these youngsters are spending a lot of time in schools. and so they've got the most kind of influence on these youngsters. i don't want to know what are they doing about growing their emotional resilience or building that building their intelligence. my thing is just simply this. if we don't do a triage of different things coming in where we've got mental issues, but i won't call

them mentors because that's got a stigma to some youngsters, i call them aunties and uncles , an call them aunties and uncles, an extended family, people that can work with these young people and win and get their win their trust and get their confidence so that we can get in there early. >> mean, you've got lot of >> i mean, you've got a lot of experience with this. you've negotiated you've negotiated with gangs, you've worked you've negotiated with gangs, you've work awards you've negotiated with gangs, you've work awards this, you've negotiated with gangs, you've work awards this, which u've negotiated with gangs, you've workawards this, which ise negotiated with gangs, you've workawards this, which is all won awards on this, which is all fantastic clearly of fantastic. and clearly part of the whole process. but but it's not enough on its own, is it, ken? >> oh, not at all. and we've got to get tougher. let me say this much here. i'm sorry to say, like in i get i'm more triggered by what takes place because , by what takes place because, again, it's a black young girl and another black man that's a youngster that's involved . so as youngster that's involved. so as both as victim and perpetrators, i would like to see people in my community showing their rage and their anger and disappointment when people in my village take do this to another another

youngster. we need to step up. we need them out there. we need them showing their disapproval in public. the same way that they do with the police . we need they do with the police. we need to more people coming out to have more people coming out and doing it. >> anybody in my view who >> but anybody in my view who carries knife , frankly, we've carries a knife, frankly, we've got say, if you're carrying got to say, if you're carrying a knife, you're caught carrying a knife, you're caught carrying a knife , norman, that's it. you're knife, norman, that's it. you're off the streets. you're taken away . okay. and you could be away. okay. and you could be away. okay. and you could be away quite some time. we can away for quite some time. we can debate the length of sentences, as i have spoken this as you and i have spoken on this before, where are you now on this issue? >> i agree. clear up a >> i agree. just to clear up a point, here representing point, i'm here representing protect is protect the protectors, which is a police a voice for the whole police service, met. service, not the met. >> but what i will say is this, is that 20 years ago, as a serving police officer, after i was stabbed, myself and i saw so many stabbings around, i went up to number 10 and i handed a letter in to tony blair and i said that we need to crack down on knife crime . and i said, what on knife crime. and i said, what we need to do is have mass stop and search. i know it's unpopular between certain communities, but it was important. was effective. it

important. it was effective. it wasn't tool in the wasn't the only tool in the book. and the most important thing that we needed thing there was that we needed to send out a very strong message to anyone that walked on the highway with a knife the public highway with a knife without authority or without lawful authority or reasonable excuse. and if you were with that knife, were found with that nice knife, it a minimum of five it would be a minimum of five years and in the 20 years imprisonment and in the 20 years imprisonment and in the 20 years since i handed that letter in and have campaigned tirelessly . lee nothing tirelessly. lee nothing whatsoever. richard holden just said there that there were more police officers. we do not have any officers and no any more police officers and no sentences any more police officers and no sentencsick of this sort of >> i'm sick of this sort of waffle ministers. i really waffle from ministers. i really am. want action. i mean, just am. i want action. i mean, just look at this graphic the look at this graphic on the screen of who are screen for those of you who are listening. this showing from listening. this is showing from about 2011 and 12. this is knife offences that have increased . offences that have increased. they've almost doubled over about a six year period until 2020 when obviously we had covid. and i think that coincides with a reduction. ken, in in stop and search. i know it's a very controversial issue, but is there a link between the

increase in knife offences and the reduction in stop and search until i think about 2018, 19? >> i'll tell you what, there's a link. there's a link between how the police carry out their function around stop and search and the lack of trust and confidence that we find in the black community. now just remember, even if we are disproportionately stopped and searched, we are probably disproportionately represented as both victims and perpetrators of knife crime. that's the biggest tragedy. and my thing is, is that we've got to find they've got to find a way of reaching out to that community to get the intel, because people would be associated by those who's carrying knives give up who's carrying knives to give up the you're not going to the intel. you're not going to get when you are are using get that when you are are using force and excessive force on innocent people going about their normal duties because you can't tell between the good guy and the bad guy. all you see is the black boy. right? so the black boy. right? and so therefore, that's to step and therefore, that's to step up and to put handcuffs and to and to and to disrespect them. you've been saying this for years and

you've got experience of it, but it's not sorting it. >> i mean, i'm looking at what should we do? should we have a sort of similar policy to the sort of similar policy to the sort of similar policy to the sort of broken windows policy in new early 90s where new york in the early 90s where actually you've got to right at the grassroots, to the grassroots, you've got to make to everybody of make it clear to everybody of whatever skin colour, if you carry right, unless carry a knife, right, unless frankly you're a chef, then we'll have a i mean, treble quadro will stop and search for a year. you get caught carrying a year. you get caught carrying a knife, you're off the streets , you're gone. >> let me this much . the >> let me say this much. the current of stop and search current level of stop and search and this has been this has been for the last ten, 15 years has shown less than 3. actually, we around around weapons and particularly around knives . so particularly around knives. so they've got a low return on hit rate on a positive hit rate around getting knives . and my around getting knives. and my thing is simply this. if there could justify intelligently stop and search, which would give us and search, which would give us a better result that the public can see, get the public a better result, i'd be all in favour.

but right now they've got the met police are in crisis. and my thing is it's a lack of confidence, not only the black community, but all communities. >> but ken, of course, it's not actually just the met police. unbelievably, we all think it's really in london. but really bad in london. but actually the statistics are much, much worse in the in the west midlands . west midlands. >> in what regards with regard to knife crime, knife offences per 100,000 of population. >> i think it's about 20% worse in the west midlands knife offences than here in london. so it's not just the met police, it's not just the met police, it's other forces and therefore it's other forces and therefore it may be in london. >> they concentrate on the on the disproportionality with black that may carry black youngsters that may carry a knife. but in the midlands that be case in the that can't be the case in the midlands you'll find it's a midlands and you'll find it's a different thing altogether. midlands and you'll find it's a diff norman ng altogether. midlands and you'll find it's a diffnorman you'ngether. midlands and you'll find it's a diffnorman you'd haveer. midlands and you'll find it's a diffnorman you'd have mandatory >> norman you'd have mandatory sentences for just carrying a knife. it'll be interesting. after the break just what the audience think and if. sir, hello. >> can i have a say, please? richard right. let me just correct some narratives. since 2009, there were 1.5 million

stop and searches because of the outrage by certain sections of the community. 80 normally black sections of the community that reduced last year to 500,000 knife crime, gun crime has gone through the absolute roof during the let me just correct a narrative and it's about time someone from within policing told britain the truth . black told britain the truth. black people are not stopped because of the colour of their skin. they are stopped because police follow the statistics . alex the follow the statistics. alex the statistics state that in london some 70% of all murders are normally committed by young black men on other black men. so the reason why police stop and search so many black suspects is because 70% are responsible , because 70% are responsible, either the victim or the offender for those crimes. so who does the black community expect us to stop? it's not a point of will go 5050 with a white community. we follow the statistics and it's about time

the black community took some responsibility for the appalling behaviour of some in their community. rather than blame the police and frustrate us because the families that have had somebody murdered plead with us to do something about it. when we do. and it's the communities as well that want us to do something about other sections of the community frustrate us by accusing us of doing something that doing . that we're not doing. >> how long would you have as a mandatory >> how long would you have as a ma norman for five years, >> norman for five years, minimum if happened, minimum. and if that happened, i promise you, this knife crime, which i've been leading which i've been a leading campaigner on for 35 years, having nearly been murdered myself stabbed in the myself on duty, stabbed in the chest by an armed burglar, i promise you it would be reduced by possibly up to 75. a strong message has to be sent out. it's never been sent out. and these ministers that promise you we've got more police, we haven't got more police, need more police i >> -- >> i'm i'm with you. i think we've got do something we've got to do something different. we'd just different. othennise, we'd just get the same waffle and get always the same waffle and the desperate results. come get always the same waffle and the ken. desperate results. come get always the same waffle and the ken. butsperate results. come get always the same waffle and the ken. but tryrate results. come get always the same waffle and

the ken. but try something. come different. >> no, listen, what norman is saying about hate crime and if so, i'm in. i'm in favour of that. but what i've got to put it straight is very few black youngsters are involved or carrying knives. so why are you stopping? you can't have a fishing expedition on stopping. the greater goods and getting and getting any results and not getting any results because you're you're shooting yourself in the foot when you do that, because you've got to do it let about it all. but let me say about this, ken, i've been a policeman. i'm been policeman. i'm i've been a policeman. i'm i've been a policeman years, 70% of policeman for 31 years, 70% of all robberies on the streets when i was a serving robbery squad officer were young black men . men. >> you've got to take responsibility . you can't keep responsibility. you can't keep blaming police for some of blaming the police for some of theissues blaming the police for some of the issues that the black community has. >> it's only a small proportion of people, black of black people, black youngsters are involved in it. people still dying. people are still dying. >> do something >> we've got to do something different. question , different. that's my question, folks. a bit warm and folks. it's got a bit warm and heated because is heated in here because this is such a desperately important and emotional issue. what do you think? sentences just think? mandatory sentences just for carrying a knife? and if so , for how long? i want your

answers on that. and also the next issue , we're going to be next issue, we're going to be talking about something completely different, working from home productivity collapsing. but maybe people are saving a load of money. we'll get your thoughts views get your thoughts and your views with debate here on farage. with that debate here on farage. on

listening to gb news radio. >> welcome back to farage on gb news. well, that was a feisty, fiery debate about such a desperately important issue. so sensitive, so difficult. but it's just not good enough. we cannot, cannot go on like this . cannot, cannot go on like this. teenagers lying on slabs . it's teenagers lying on slabs. it's just completely unacceptable , just completely unacceptable, kenny says. and thanks for all your comments coming in, kenny says caught a knife says caught with a knife instant. five years and you do the years. nothing shorter the five years. nothing shorter if you use the said knife, instant life sentence and life means life. kenny is not mucking about do then don't do with the

time. don't carry, don't use a knife. you won't end up in jail. allison says instead of sending knife carrying kids to prison , knife carrying kids to prison, maybe make them do national service. this would turn out disciplined, respectful , useful disciplined, respectful, useful members of society. rather than providing them with further criminal training in prison. providing them with further criminal training in prison . a criminal training in prison. a very thoughtful observation there, allison, but really , will there, allison, but really, will it really stop? it is it enough? claire says. london is completely out of control with sadiq khan. he, of course, has been mayor for the last seven years. knife, crime, rioting , years. knife, crime, rioting, looting, shops, murders, drugs and all he seems to care about is climate change and ulez. but let's remember lunch . ian's not let's remember lunch. ian's not the worst. the data is actually worse in the west midlands for me . i think we've got to do me. i think we've got to do something different. we have to be brave enough to try something different. for heaven's sake , if different. for heaven's sake, if you just keep doing the same thing , you'll always get the thing, you'll always get the same results . for me, i think same results. for me, i think it's got to be a mandatory. you're straight the you're taken straight off the streets you have very instant

streets. you have a very instant trial hearing and then you are taken away for a number of years. norman brennan there he was saying five years. i'm with him . i think it's got to be him. i think it's got to be significant. i think you've got to take people off streets to take people off the streets and then actually their friends, colleagues, learn. they colleagues, they'll learn. they don't to be taken away for don't want to be taken away for five topic, difficult five years. big topic, difficult subject , five years. big topic, difficult subject, something that hopefully is a little easier , hopefully is a little easier, but also caused a little bit of controversy in recent months. in the last couple of years since covid is , of course, the whole covid is, of course, the whole issue of work from home, which became well, it was obligatory. basically, if you could , during basically, if you could, during the whole lockdown the whole covid lockdown process. and then actually it seems to have carried on in many, many firms, particularly in the public sector. and actually for some people it works . some office workers are works. some office workers are actually saving a huge amount of money if they if they stay at home in commuting costs and childcare costs . but what about childcare costs. but what about productivity? well, i'm delighted to be joined in the studio by amanda lennon, employment and hr advisor

employment lawyer and hr advisor amanda , great to see you amanda, great to see you effectively in our office talking about this issue . but talking about this issue. but tell us about yourself , because tell us about yourself, because actually you're an hr director , actually you're an hr director, so you primarily work from home. >> yes, i do. i'm now self—employed, so i have a little more flexibility than i might do if i worked in a permanent role with an employer. but because i'm able to pick the work that suits me and when i'm doing that, i can decide, is it to going fit around my childcare committee ? com m ittee? >> absolutely. committee? >> absolutely. so you're saving on childcare costs , which which on childcare costs, which which is understandable if children are at school and things. but if the kids are at home, does that then feed into the concerns about productivity? you've got noisy kids in either in the same room or the room next door, then that ain't help your that ain't going to help your output, is it? >> can see that. i think it >> i can see that. i think it depends they are. so the depends how old they are. so the younger the child. i think the more disruption. more potential for disruption. if a zoom call, if you're on a zoom call, perhaps. but but i think it depends on the employer's culture, how much flexibility

they're willing to give in that sense. and i do that sense. and i do think that a feature we have in our workplaces now that we didn't have pre—covid is hybrid working. so i think yes. >> okay. so hybrid working and your particular speciality echr. now, i could argue there's both ways. maybe as hr you should be actually sort of front of house knowing all the team , talking to knowing all the team, talking to people face to face. i get all that. or maybe it's the opposite. maybe actually sort of the faceless person at the end of the computer where, you know, the tough hr director, which do you favour? >> i favour the providing support and guidance , the face support and guidance, the face of hr, not the tough that sounds like a hybrid solution . you like a hybrid solution. you know, a client wants me to be know, if a client wants me to be at office, then i can make at an office, then i can make arrangements that work . arrangements to make that work. i when you do work from i think when you do work from home, it's really important to work extra hard to build relationships with people at work, which you may not have if you know, if everybody's working from home. so opportunities to

go into the office, i think are still important. >> and what about the difference between the private sector and the sector? my the public sector? my understanding adding that understanding adding is that particularly places like the particularly in places like the city businesses that city of london, businesses that are sort of owner managed entrepreneur driving it, actually, they've been very keen to people back into the to get people back into the office. they saw productivity collapse , but in the public collapse, but in the public sector , still many, i think 40% sector, still many, i think 40% of all public sector staff from whitehall are still working from home. and actually the data shows that productivity is substantially lower and that's ons data. >> yeah , and i think that's the >> yeah, and i think that's the risk . so it depends on how risk. so it depends on how closely they're managed, what the relationship is like with their manager, what the culture of the employer is like, and i think where you've got lots of people working from home, you do have to work harder to keep those relationships going and therefore the productivity up. >> absolutely right, because stanford university, they actually even more than actually are even more more than the office for national statistics, which says about 8.5% less productive of i think it's at least that stanford

university says it's between 10 and 20% less productive. i mean, that's the difference between profit and loss for many firms. >> i see that that can be an >> i can see that that can be an issue in some employers . from my issue in some employers. from my own perspective, if i go to the office with the client that i'm currently working with, it takes me at least an hour to get there and get back when i'm and an hour to get back when i'm working from home. those hours are spent working. addition are spent working. in addition to the other hours in the day, and interested that and i'm interested in that hybnd and i'm interested in that hbeut also, what about the >> but also, what about the responsibility amongst older workers who might have the benefit of a slightly larger house? have a spare house? they might have a spare bedroom or they can turn into an office or a study, whatever, but actually they've got a responsibility to younger workers who want to get into work. they experience work. they want to experience that creative brainstorming, the mad ideas , the bad ideas, the mad ideas, the bad ideas, the good ideas , and also the social good ideas, and also the social interaction . that's an important interaction. that's an important part of this, isn't it? >> i think it's really important, particularly the earlier you in your career, earlier you are in your career, because i've built my career working in offices, travelling around the country, meeting

various different people at work. but if you are new to your career, straight out of university or school, you need that interaction in order to understand what it's like to work in a business environment. so i would say that it's more important for those who are starting out in their careers to be in the office, but they need guidance . guidance. >> they've got to have they've got boss they look got to have that boss they look up great up to, they hear that great sales pitch just the experience of how you close deal or how of how you close a deal or how you how you say, yeah, we've got that just got that wrong, or we've just got to make sure we do that. the project it all, i project management of it all, i mean, is what drives mean, this is what drives the business and makes it successful. that . successful. you can't do that. stuck bedroom as a 22 stuck in the bedroom as a 22 year old in in clapham, year old in a flat in clapham, and i would wholeheartedly agree with think there is a >> and i think there is a responsibility on more experienced to be experienced managers to be present provide those present and provide those experiences that would have experiences that we would have had earlier our careers in an office. >> so amanda, just to finish, where does this look? what does this months this look like in 12 months time? where debate on time? where is this debate on this subject going? businesses need productivity. need maximum productivity. be everyone's under pressure. how

do they get more people back to the work for a longer week? >> think it's about looking >> so i think it's about looking at in experience, at both sides. in my experience, on employers are asking on average, employers are asking their back in 2 their people to come back in 2 to days a week. i think that to 3 days a week. i think that will continue. i think hybrid working a model here to working as a model is here to stay then it's about as stay and then it's about you as an individual . if it's not an individual. if it's not working for you, what can you do with manager and with your manager to try and make work? bearing in mind make it work? bearing in mind that or she has have that he or she has to have consistency among the whole team? definitely team? so it's definitely a tricky. you've 2 to 3 days tricky. you've said 2 to 3 days a week. >> me, that's not quite >> for me, that's not quite enough. to 4 day a week enough. i'm a 3 to 4 day a week person. i understand. look, a day, a week, you've got a really bonng day, a week, you've got a really boring read write boring report to read or write and just got to put a and you've just got to put a cold head and cold towel over your head and just your through just plough your way through it. that's a dead that's fine. that's a dead weight. i people have weight. but i think people have got the office. that's got to be in the office. that's that's my view. amanda brilliant. great to see you. thank fascinating thank you very much. fascinating debate. coming debate. thank you for coming into the studio, into work. well, that's fantastic . coming well, that's fantastic. coming up after the break, we're going to be talking about the support from number 10 to the home secretary suella braverman about

the threat of leaving the european convention on human rights. again, the status quo is not good enough. we need change. it's farage.

>> you're listening to gb news radio . radio. >> welcome back to farage on gb news. well, the home secretary has certainly been in the news this week with some very strong words and tough action and indeed possibly tough, serious threats. and now it turns out that number 10, the prime minister is actually supporting her in the potential threat to leave the european convention of human rights. if they actually meddle with our plans to deport illegal asylum seekers, illegal migrants from the uk to rwanda . migrants from the uk to rwanda. this is, of course, the case that's coming going to the court on october the ninth. the ruling may not be until all november, but it does seem it's a bit of a

warning shot from the home secretary to the judges in strasbourg to say we're the united kingdom, we've left the european union, please don't meddle in our sovereign affairs. well it's a big topic and it's very controversial and delighted to be joined down the line by richard young, senior solicitor at osborne pinner solicitors. thank you for joining at osborne pinner solicitors. thank you forjoining us at osborne pinner solicitors. thank you for joining us this evening, richard. so this is a it's quite a significant moment , actually. the home secretary has been very strong this week. the prime minister obviously saying he's going to stop the boats . the solution, one boats. the rwanda solution, one of was stopped by of the solutions was stopped by the original court hearing . the the original court hearing. the government under a lot of pressure on on this and many in the country, i think has said we've had enough of this. we don't need overseas court don't need an overseas court telling do. we're telling us what to do. we're a sovereign nation. we've got great courts, great judges. we should do ourselves. should be able to do ourselves. isn't enough? richard isn't that fair enough? richard >> well, many cases , of >> well, in many cases, of course, we do do it ourselves . course, we do do it ourselves. and you've indicated that the court of appeal was with the government terms of the government in terms of the

outcome on rwanda. and we'll find out next month what the supreme court decides . but i supreme court decides. but i think the key point here is that very, very few cases make it as far as the european court of human rights and there is a filter before cases can go to that court whereby we unmerited cases are filtered out. i mean, this court's been in existence since 1959 and since that time. so period of time, a decade , 563 so period of time, a decade, 563 uk cases have been admitted and in only 327 of those have been found to have been a violation of human rights at any point. so i think the concern about the court are more apparent than real and practical . real and practical. >> those stats are all well and good , but we've got a seriously good, but we've got a seriously strategic issue issue of national importance . we've got a national importance. we've got a crisis on of illegal migration

across the channel. the government is mandated by the people to stop this and the government is being stopped by a foreign court. and the british people are saying enough , we're people are saying enough, we're done. we don't want foreign judges telling us what to do . judges telling us what to do. and i think that's fair and reasonable, isn't it? i mean, we should rely on own supreme should rely on our own supreme court. know, we had that court. you know, we had that judge they made the judge when they made the decision literally overnight to essentially to prevent the rwanda scheme going ahead . and rwanda scheme going ahead. and that's essentially completely derailed the government's strategy . strategy. >> well, no , the government's >> well, no, the government's strategy is on track. as i said , it won in the court of appeal will remain to see what happens in the supreme court. and even if it if the decision was in favour of the government, those representing the claimants in this case would have to persuade the european court of human rights to take the case if it was to have any chance of

flourishing there. so that's that.in flourishing there. so that's that. in terms of the point about public opinion, i'm not sure that's quite right. i checked the government website this morning and it's right that there is a petition they're advocating that the uk should withdraw from the european convention on human rights. it's only signed by about 20,000 people. and because it passed the 10,000 threshold, there is a government response. and that response confirms despite going on today, that it remains policy of the government to remain part of the government to remain part of the government to remain part of the european convention on human rights. >> yeah, but i reiterate the point and indeed a supreme court judge of ours, lord sumption , judge of ours, lord sumption, who wanted to find a way to stay in the echr even he now says he's written in, i think it's the spectator magazine that actually the time has come. we've got to leave. we've got to take back control of our own legal system. and it's all very well saying, you go through the

court process, but actually the rwanda would have would rwanda scheme would have would have started many people might say it's not a deterrent. i think i probably one of those anyway. but that would have started months ago. but as it is , it's been on the back burner. many other things have been trialled. we're going nowhere at the moment and again , it's one the moment and again, it's one of things we've to do of these things we've got to do things can't be things differently. we can't be held back by overseas courts, overseas judges that may or may not be politically biased. surely richard yes, and i mean the but the position is it's not i mean, it is being held back by legal challenges. >> but the government said at the outset when it introduced this legislation that it fully expected to be challenged and there was no way that that wasn't going to happen . the wasn't going to happen. the groundbreaking and very figure of what the government's proposing. so it is going through due process . that's to through due process. that's to be expected to happen. and of

course, the government has won in the court of appeal. and the reason why it's been successful is because it has put in in the way it negotiated this agreement with rwanda, safeguards , it with rwanda, safeguards, it says, is sufficient to allay any concerns of the european court of human rights might raise if it got to that stage . and it got to that stage. and indeed, to allay any firms that domestic courts, which also have to enforce this protected rights under the convention as a matter of domestic law, allay any concern that they raise to and of course, as the outcome in the court of appeal has shown, the government by and large won and you you're a lawyer, you've got a legal mind, put yourself in the shoes of one of the judges in the in the european court of human rights. >> if you sort of hear this threat coming from the united kingdom and you've got this case in front of you , would that in front of you, would that influence your decision at all?

would you say, well, this could undermine the whole process? if i if i rule the wrong way or would you actually think the opposite? no, that's going to wind me up. i don't want to be threatened. i'm the top of the top legal tree. no of top of the legal tree. no of course, judiciary will deal course, the judiciary will deal with unfairly. with it unfairly. >> in relation to this sort >> but in relation to this sort of whole foreign court point, i wouldn't entirely sort of agree with that because the uk was very much in the vanguard of framing the convention in the beginning of the 1950s and our whole human rights legal culture goes back to the time of the magna carta . so this isn't new. magna carta. so this isn't new. and indeed , in terms of the and indeed, in terms of the european court of human rights, how it functions if cases do pass that filter, get into it in the first place, and very few do, it operates a legal doctrine, what's called a margin of appreciation. so when deciding where the balance has been, state and private,

individual because that's what stokes most of the controversy calls it, gives significant weight to what the states position is as regards to where that balance should fall. >> and just just, just, just just a final point before i go , just a final point before i go, richard. even the former secretary of state for defence, ben wallace , he said that ben wallace, he said that actually the echr held back the military forces from carrying out essential special forces operations overseas . he's we operations overseas. he's we can't do what the states does . can't do what the states does. and that surely is the point . i and that surely is the point. i mean, things like the united states , australia, new zealand, states, australia, new zealand, japan, they're not in the echr. why should we be? well those countries, with the exception of japan, but the other ones you mentioned, they all have different human rights arrangements . arrangements. >> in terms of the judiciary. there are particular concerns very much to the for there and that can be dealt with by

introducing, for example , introducing, for example, legislation to deal with how judges deal with the balancing exercise in terms of the rights of the state and private individuals that dealt with that. and of course, as i was saying in the context of rwanda, the government was very aware of the government was very aware of the need to ensure that what it does, how the military operates is done in a human rights compliant way. so actually think that's one of the good things that's one of the good things that the european convention and the incorporation of it. okay human rights has done because it makes the state more alert to avoiding these difficulties. >> i think we're plenty alert, thatis >> i think we're plenty alert, that is for sure. and i think we're alert to the dangers of it. but richard young, thank you so much forjoining me on so much for joining me on farage. on gb news. it is a big topic. it's a very controversial topic. it's a very controversial topic be a lot of topic that seems to be a lot of controversy around at the moment. talking of controversy , moment. talking of controversy, you're not going to believe this. the what the farage moment this. the what the farage moment this week. i'm so glad nigel is

not here. he might explode at this literally . yes. the this literally. yes. the european court of justice, another european court that frankly, i thought we'd left the european union. they've decided to find the uk. ,332 million over some very marginal minor they call sort of technical infringement in northern ireland. and they increase the size of the fine to cover the whole of the uk to set an example. thanks a bunch. unbelievable i mean, just that's why we got so cross about all of this. we shouldn't be three years later. subject to the ecj. this is even more unbelievable . this is even more unbelievable. will the snp bless them? they want to leave the united kingdom . they want to go back into the european union. they've now had to come to westminster rather tongue in cheek excuse me, westminster , where we've been westminster, where we've been over fined by brussels that we want to go back and join. could you sue brussels on our behalf to reduce the degree of the

fire? i mean, this is just absolute complete and utter madness . absolute complete and utter madness. this is to do absolute complete and utter madness . this is to do with farm madness. this is to do with farm thing fines and the farming industry and the snp think that they've been over fined completely extraordinary. there we are too unbelievable what the farage moments that drives me mad i suspect if you're a brexiteer it'll drive you mad. and as for nigel, you know what he'll do? absolute lutely. well, coming up after the break, we're going to be talking about another big, spicy, fiery debate in in america, the republican debate, the primaries and the response of donald trump. here we are

welcome back to farage on gb news. well, over in the united states of america, we've just had yesterday day the second of the debates between the hopeful republican nominee candidates,

seven of them, they did battle. let's just hear a few of the special clips before we debate this with donald trump's pollster, john mclaughlin. watch this. >> and i want to look in that camera right now and tell you, donald, i know you're watching. you can't help yourself if i know you're watching. okay and you're not here tonight , not you're not here tonight, not because polls and not because because of polls and not because of your indictments. you're not here because you're here tonight because you're afraid made of being on this stage and defending your record. you're ducking these things. and let tell you what's going to let me tell you what's going to happen. doing that. no happen. you keep doing that. no one is going to call you one up here is going to call you donald trump anymore. we're going donald duck. going to call you donald duck. >> one of most >> tiktok is one of the most dangerous media apps that dangerous social media apps that we what you've we can have. and what you've got, honestly every time i got, i honestly every time i hear you, i feel little bit hear you, i feel a little bit dumber what you say because dumber for what you say because i can't believe that . here's i can't believe that. here's a tiktok situation because last debate , he said we were all debate, he said we were all bought and paid for. >> and i thought about that for a said, you a little while. and said, you know, imagine how you know, i can't imagine how you can say that knowing that you were just in business with the

chinese communist party and the same people that funded hunter biden, millions of dollars was a partner of yours as well. it's not nonsense . so here's what i'm not nonsense. so here's what i'm that i want to respond. >> these these are good people who are tainted by a broken system. and it's not the fault of anybody who's in. some of us here's. excuse me. excuse me. thank you for speaking while i'm interrupting . literally, while interrupting. literally, while i'm speaking, you boom. >> wow. that's unbelievable . you >> wow. that's unbelievable. you thought politics is brutal here in the uk. and i know a bit about that. i mean, it is seriously spicy in america. i think they've got very different libel laws as well, which means you can say lot more. but i'm you can say a lot more. but i'm delighted to be joined here by donald pollster, ceo donald trump's pollster, ceo mclaughlin and associates . john, mclaughlin and associates. john, what did you think of last night's debate and if is donald trump going to join any of these debates and how many of them are they to going be? >> um, you know , it's >> um, you know, it's interesting. at the end of the day , that's up to donald trump.

day, that's up to donald trump. but but, you know, that's been the crazy part. we've had two debates now, and if you look at the two debates, both democrats and republicans have been saying post both debates that the real winner of the debates is donald trump. i mean, he's the one that's come out far and away on top. and we have something what i always call , you know, when i always call, you know, when we're trying to elect a president . and you have that president. and you have that commander in chief test and none of the other candidates are passing that commander in chief test here. i mean, unfortunate really, it kind of degraded into a food fight at times. so and a lot of people are saying, you know, they're fighting for second place right now. they're fighting to be maybe the vice presidential candidate, john, if you try and be impartial, who do you try and be impartial, who do you think came out best out of that second debate? oh, that's that's a tough question . that's a tough question. >> that's my job, because

because yeah . because yeah. >> and you do a good job of it. i don't think anybody really shined. but i thought vivek ramaswamy had a good debate. and i also thought nikki haley also probably had a had a good debate . but it's one of those things where, look , the vast majority where, look, the vast majority of republican primary voters think donald trump did a really good job as president and 90, give or take give him high marks , give him a strong approval rating when it comes to his job, what he did as president . so what he did as president. so it's really tough for these candidates to try and outshine john, how many of these debates do you think there will be? >> i mean, are they going to get bonng >> i mean, are they going to get boring if they just go on sort of one every month from here until next next spring? >> yeah, you it's to >> yeah, you know, it's going to be interesting because the first debate, ratings, debate, the television ratings, about what they were about half of what they were last time and they were a fraction what donald trump

fraction of what donald trump got with his interview with tucker carlson. so i think it'll depend upon what's going on in terms of the ratings and whatnot. but look, i think what you're seeing here, the guy who's been on offence, the whole time in the republican primary is donald trump, and it's been really, really hard. none of these candidates have been these other candidates have been able to break the able to break out from the field. and that's the irony is many times in these primaries, they hurt the frontrunner. they hurt the candidate who's out in front where donald trump seems to be getting stronger in both the republican . the republican. primary and the general election as a result of the primary. >> just just to finish, john, if the democratic candidate is anybody but joe biden, do they almost certainly beat donald trump the nomination trump if he gets the nomination in your mind? i disagree in your in your mind? i disagree with that totally first with that totally because, first of all, whoever democratic of all, whoever the democratic primary candidate is going to be, be saddled

be, they're going to be saddled with joe biden. be, they're going to be saddled witiand�* biden. be, they're going to be saddled witiand�* bidtruth the >> and the truth is, the majority of americans give donald trump a positive approval rating. did a good rating. they think he did a good job president and the job as president. and even the exit polls, four years ago when donald trump didn't win, he had a 51% job approval rating with those voters. >> yeah, jim , thank you so much >> yeah, jim, thank you so much indeed for your thoughts. sorry for calling you john earlier. jim mclaughlin, that's great. donald pollster, his donald trump's pollster, his thoughts fascinate thoughts on that fascinate thing. what's going to happen over the coming well, over the coming months? well, from spicy, fiery from a fairly spicy, fiery republican debates over there, another issue which is extraordinary here in the extraordinary back here in the uk the football uk is the rise of football hooliganism. yes, there's a hooliganism. yes, there's been a significant increase . significant increase. piece in it's the worst for nine years. i

think it's gone up some some 10% or more. and you've got to say, why? what's going on? well, i'm delighted to be joined by none other former football other than a former football hooligan, author hooligan, carlton leach, author . carlton, very good evening to you. you're a west ham supporter. you've enjoyed supporter. you've you've enjoyed football for decades and you were of of the were a member of one of the firms involved football firms involved in football hooliganism. firms involved in football hoo|know;m. firms involved in football hoo|know this better than most you know this better than most people. why is the increase people. why why is the increase in in the football in the in the football hooliganism disorder. hooliganism and disorder. for me personally, my thought on the matter is, um , i think it's the matter is, um, i think it's the what's going on in the world today and especially in england i >> we live in a society now where there's so much violence on the streets with gangs, knife things, violence. there's youngsters frustration . they've youngsters frustration. they've got no money. they're angry . and got no money. they're angry. and i think they've gone back to the terraces to, to extract that terraces to, uh, to extract that angen terraces to, uh, to extract that anger. and. and they're using the as, as .

the terrorist violence as, as. an expression to get rid of the anger of what's going on. >> that's so left behind. >> that's so left behind. >> yeah . >> yeah. >> yeah. >> so you're really linking it to politics in this country. >> and then now showing their anger on the and my statement . anger on the and my statement. >> so you're linking it very much to people feeling worse off. of living. and also off. cost of living. and also obviously the covid obviously i guess the covid process , everybody being being process, everybody being being blocked , blocked up, all of that, everything the thing is, we got to understand now . to understand now. i'm 64 from from my days . from my days. >> but these some of these kids now are fighting on the terraces. they've got no money. they're struggling. they go to football. they're not in gangs. everywhere on on the everywhere you go on on the streets now , there's streets of england now, there's gangs on street corners. there's violence, the violence, there's stabbings. the violence, there's stabbings. the violence increased intensely violence has increased intensely and that their anger in

and i think that their anger in having no money, no jobs and everything and they're taking to the football matches and they're expressing the expressing himself on the terraces once again. >> carlton, a proper >> carlton, we need a proper deterrent. you're blaming deterrent. yeah, you're blaming the . the politicians. thank you. carlton leach, their author and former football hooligan for his thoughts on why on earth football is on the football hooliganism is on the rise. it does seem to be particularly significant in west ham, most arrests ham, which has the most arrests and actually brings to and that actually brings me to jacob imagine you jacob now, i can't imagine you were hooligan, were a former football hooligan, but you ever been to a but have you ever been to a football match? i have. >> to a football >> i've been to a football matches in paulton and in matches in both paulton and in keynsham my constituency, keynsham in my constituency, watching and watching paulton rovers and keynsham cheered on. >> on. >> you haven't been to >> okay, so you haven't been to one the main premier games. >> are saying that the >> are you saying that the paulton rovers . and keynsham paulton rovers. and keynsham town are not? i'm sure they are aspiring premier leagues. they are great teams . are great teams. >> uh, what's on the show? what's show?

what's on show? >> now look at look >> well, now look at this. look at 50 piece. at this. i've got a 50 piece. the european court has demanded every one of us in this country hand what? even hand this over. what? even though because though we've left because we don't tax our diesel going into pleasure correctly and we pleasure boats correctly and we left. and isn't this what we're pleasure boats correctly and we left. fito isn't this what we're pleasure boats correctly and we left. fito isrtalkingnhat we're pleasure boats correctly and we left. fito isrtalking about,5're pleasure boats correctly and we left. fito isrtalking about, these going to be talking about, these dreadful courts that dreadful european courts that keep telling keep on bullying us, telling us what going to what to do and are going to pinch money? and they're pinch our money? and they're basically to basically pickpocketing us to take every single take £0.50 off every single one of and but the snp, jacob of them. and but the snp, jacob now to . sue the sue the now wants us to. sue the sue the european union. >> it's unbelievable have a great show. i've enjoyed being with everybody. next up it's the weather. >> good evening i'm alex deakin . this is your latest weather update from the office for update from the met office for gb of us will get wet gb news. most of us will get wet overnight. some heavy downpours moving some moving from west to east. some gusty also picking up for gusty winds also picking up for a to this a time. all thanks to this little pressure little area of low pressure could some very heavy could provide some very heavy rain parts of south wales rain over parts of south wales in so we do have rain over parts of south wales in office, so we do have rain over parts of south wales in office, yellowe do have rain over parts of south wales in office, yellow warning e met office, yellow warning in place also parts of place here, but also parts of the midlands extending the midlands and extending up towards across towards lincolnshire and across towards lincolnshire and across to norfolk to cambridgeshire and norfolk in line heavy .

line for some quite heavy. downpours, especially through the early hours further north and west. it will turn a little drier with the exception being north—west scotland, where it'll stay blustery further stay blustery with further showers as skies, clear temperatures to single temperatures may dip to single figures, most and figures, but most towns and cities in double figures, but most towns and cities friday in double figures, but most towns and cities friday is,1 double figures, but most towns and cities friday is,1 dnande figures, but most towns and cities friday is,1 dnand large, digits. friday is, by and large, a but early on there a fine day. but early on there will be some rain still over east anglia in the south—east of england. away england. should scoot away fairly packing in over the showers packing in over the highlands, and showers packing in over the higinorthern and showers packing in over the higinorthern isles, and showers packing in over the higinorthern isles, where and showers packing in over the higinorthern isles, where it'llmd the northern isles, where it'll stay or showers stay blustery. 1 or 2 showers will feed in on the breeze elsewhere. but for it's elsewhere. but for most it's a bnght elsewhere. but for most it's a bright breezy good bright and breezy friday. good spells sunshine

>> hello . good evening. it's me, >> hello. good evening. it's me, jacob rees—mogg on state of the nafion jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation tonight. in june last yean nation tonight. in june last year, echr blocked the year, the echr blocked the democratically elected british government's deportation government's rwanda deportation flight government's rwanda deportation fligi is government's rwanda deportation fliins five minutes but is it five minutes to midnight membership midnight for the uk's membership of court? of the convention and court? well, minister has well, the prime minister has authorised braverman authorised suella braverman to threaten uk's threaten the court with the uk's departure. as we await the forthcoming rwanda forthcoming supreme court rwanda showdown month. showdown early next month. and speaking courts, who speaking of european courts, who could known would still could have known we would still suffer european suffer the woes of the european union? more than three and a half leaving it? the half years after leaving it? the european has european court of justice has had to the had the audacity to find the united kingdom million, united kingdom £32 million, even though britain though we've left it. as britain faces from faces an horrific story from south london, a young named south london, a young girl named euan south london, a young girl named elian way elian arade dam was on her way to school when she was brutally stabbed we be stabbed in the neck. we will be asking crime and asking how knife crime and indeed crime broadly indeed crime more broadly became

out of control across britain's cities. now cities. the girl up until now only owing only known as street, owing to draconian sadiq restrictions. sadiq shah thermalis after thermalis died last week after a failed battle to pursue potentially life saving treatment. and finally, the courts have allowed her to be named to tell its named and her family to tell its story. we'll from story. and we'll be hearing from her shortly. her brother shortly. and finally, as the westminster bubble with bubble lost touch with rural britain, one seems to bubble lost touch with rural britai so. one seems to bubble lost touch with rural britai so. new e seems to bubble lost touch with rural britai so. new politicaleems to bubble lost touch with rural britai so. new political party.o think so. a new political party. rural reaction. ian has been set up give up to combat eco wokery and give a to britain's forgotten a voice to britain's forgotten farmers amidst the countryside amidst the increasingly metropolitan countryside amidst the increas political tropolitan countryside amidst the increas political sphere,in countryside amidst the increas political sphere, state centric political sphere, state of starts its now . of the nation starts its now. you know i want to hear from you. it's a crucial part of the programme. email me mail gbnews.com. but now it's time for the news of the day with polly . jacob thank polly middlehurst. jacob thank you and good evening to you. >> well, we can bring you some more details about what's happening the netherlands more details about what's hap|afternoon.he netherlands more details about what's hap|afternoon. wedetherlands more details about what's hap|afternoon. we heard .ands more details about what's hap|afternoon. we heard earlier more details about what's ha|there'doon. we heard earlier more details about what's ha|there'doon. va heard earlier more details about what's ha|there'doon. va shooting. �*lier on there'd been a shooting. well, from well, we're now getting from police people police that three people are

confirmed to