and somehow i'm not sure the sums add up. we'll get stuck into that. all of that to come tonight on dewbs& co with me, emily carver. but first, let's get the latest news headlines with polly . with polly. >> emily, thank you and good evening to you. well, the top story tonight is that the hamas terror group has launched renewed rocket attacks on israel throughout the day today, particularly targeting the southern city of ashkelon . the southern city of ashkelon. the missiles were fired after the terrorist group warned residents to leave the city by 5:00. local time. israel's iron dome anti—missile system was used to intercept many of the rockets that came raining down on the suburban area. air raid sirens were heard elsewhere across israel today. its defence forces claiming more than 4500 rockets have been launched by hamas since saturday. the israeli

embassy to the us says more than 1000 of its citizens have been killed in the violence . well, killed in the violence. well, the attacks come in response to an unprecedented barrage of israeli airstrikes on gaza , israeli airstrikes on gaza, forcing nearly 200,000 people to flee the territory . israel is flee the territory. israel is continuing as well to bomb the enclave. these pictures from a short time ago from the port city of gaza on the coastline , city of gaza on the coastline, apartment blocks, schools and even a united nations building. among those hit by hundreds of attacks today. and the united nafions attacks today. and the united nations warning the israeli government that its siege of gazais government that its siege of gaza is illegal under international law. but adding the abduction of hostages by hamas is forbidden . and israeli hamas is forbidden. and israeli soldiers have been clearing the kfar aza kibbutz. that's one of the hardest hit areas of hamas attacks. troops have been retrieving the bodies of civilians killed when hamas breached the border from gaza. the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu, describing

hamas fighters as savages , akin hamas fighters as savages, akin to isis terrorists . it's well to isis terrorists. it's well here at home. the prime minister, rishi sunak , says the minister, rishi sunak, says the uk will continue to support british israeli families . british israeli families. >> as we stand in solidarity with israel and the people of israel in the face of these barbaric acts of terrorism and last night i went to visit a synagogue in london to express my support for the jewish community in the uk. i was unequivocal with them that we will make sure that they feel safe at this time. and the police have been given very clear guidance and advice from the government to do everything that they can to keep the community safe. they will clamp down on any behaviour that falls foul of the just remind foul of the law. just remind everyone hamas is a everyone that hamas is a proscribed terrorist organisation . organisation. >> well, speaking at the labour party conference in liverpool today, sir keir starmer condemned the hamas attacks and said labour believes in a two state solution . state solution. >> i am shocked and appalled by

the events in israel. i utterly condemn the senseless murder of men, women and children, including british citizens, in cold blood by the terrorists of hamas. this party believes in the two state solution a palestinian state along side a safe and secure israel . but this safe and secure israel. but this action by hamas does nothing for palestine liens, and israel must always have the right to defend her people . her people. >> well, just before that, sir keir starmer was heckled by a protester who came on stage and threw glitter over his shoulders as he tried to start his speech. take a look . take a look. >> true democracy is citizen led politics needs an update. we demand a people's house. >> you can hear the voice of the protester there saying his little piece before he was wrestled to the ground by. i have to say, first of all, female security officers before

the men , the 28 year old, then the men, the 28 year old, then arrest did the labour leader quickly moving on, taking off his jacket and addressing the whole promising a day decade of national renewal if labour got elected at the next general election? sir keir starmer warned the way back from 13 years of conservative government would be hard, but the country could recover and he pledged to build a better britain and announced plans to create new towns and build more homes. he also focussed on the uk's economic growth as he laid out labour's plans for britain's future . future. >> we do not out that the fire of change still burns in britain. the question is whether it lives on inside labour and today we show it does . today we today we show it does. today we turn the page, answer the question on why labour with the plan for a britain built to last with higher growth , safer with higher growth, safer streets, cheap british power in your home, more opportunity in

your home, more opportunity in your community, the nhs off its knees a britain with its future back now away from politics. >> the government says it's now safe for asylum seekers to return to the bibby stockholm barge without confirming , barge without confirming, though, a date just yet . it's though, a date just yet. it's been vacant since legionella bacteria were detected on board back in august. but local mayor carolyn parks is set to challenge the home office on behalf of local residents who've objected to the barge being parked in portland port. she said she believes the government is planning permission to site it. there now the tv presenter holly willoughby has announced she's quitting itv's this morning programme after 14 years hosting the show . in an hosting the show. in an instagram post today . she said instagram post today. she said it had been an honourjust to be part of the this morning story and she's made the decision for her and her family last week, a shopping security shopping centre security officer was charged and remanded in custody over an alleged plot to

kidnap and murder the . star with kidnap and murder the. star with gb news across the uk on tv, in your car, on digital radio and now on your smart speaker by saying play gb news this is britain's news channel . britain's news channel. >> thank you, polly . yes. >> thank you, polly. yes. welcome to dewbs & co with me , welcome to dewbs& co with me, emily carver. it's just gone six. so joining me until 7:00 is my panel. i have the deputy leader of reform, ben habib. that's a new job, a promotion . that's a new job, a promotion. well, well done. and we have journalist and author, ella whelan. thank you very much indeed for joining whelan. thank you very much indeed forjoining me. now, you indeed for joining me. now, you can get in touch with us about everything we're going to be discussing this evening, gb views cbnnews.com.we're discussing this evening, gb views cbnnews.com. we're on views at cbnnews.com. we're on twitter, media at gb twitter, social media at gb news. now, we're going to start with the ongoing war in israel , with the ongoing war in israel, in gaza. it's continuing for a fourth day and we have our gb news reporter charlie peters, who live from tel aviv. i who is live from tel aviv. i believe he's with us now.

charlie thank you very much for joining us at the top of the show. what have you learned since you've been in tel aviv ? since you've been in tel aviv? >> well, today has been an extraordinary day of death and destruction on the casualty figures now hurtling into the thousands on both sides. and this has definitely become a complex and multi fronted war in northern lebanon , in southern northern lebanon, in southern lebanon, sorry, northern israel, in the south of israel , on the in the south of israel, on the border with gaza, and even up to tel aviv where we are there have been attacks, both small arms fire and rockets. there's been artillery from the idf back into hamas controlled areas and air strikes into gaza. but there have also been more disturbing reports in the south of israel where this morning the government claimed it had secured its border with gaza. that now appears to have not been the case in the last hour or two. terrorists were killed in mefalsim and another was killed in sderot. areas that the

idf claimed they had cleared with paratroopers. it now seems that that might not be the case as more violence continues in the last half hour, meeting with troops, defence minister yoav galant said that he had released all restraints and that israel was now going into a full offence. now for people in gaza, this will obviously be extremely concerned as the number of people killed there approaches 1000 as targeted airstrikes are launched. but when some of the atrocities become made aware and some of the information coming out of southern israel reaches the ainnaves, the reason for that kind of statement will become more clear , i think, to become more clear, i think, to onlookers in the last hour, we have heard reports of up to 40 babies being killed in a kibbutz in southern israel. i think this is the most shocking development of all of the shocking developments we have heard today. it goes beyond and the standard massacre and murder that has become commonplace since saturday. it is a new level of depravity. many of the people that i've spoken to today

fleeing from southern israel, fleeing from southern israel, fleeing from southern israel, fleeing from those kibbutzes is reflecting in great misery and shock at that news. the reports there from the israeli ambulances and indeed the idf soldiers who cleared out that kibbutz. it's a it's a devastating development . devastating development. >> thank you, charlie. yes, extreme devastating reports. if they turn out to be true , you they turn out to be true, you say that israel will be launching a full offence . what launching a full offence. what does that mean? what is that likely to mean? we're already seeing targeted airstrikes onto the gaza area . what else could the gaza area. what else could we . see we. see >> well, in the last 24 hours, as the hamas side, they have launched many targeted rocket attacks into israel , reaching attacks into israel, reaching ashkelon, where they offered a warning an hour before they sent rockets in there. the palestinian islamic jihad in southern lebanon also launched rockets into northern israel and the israeli side have reacted

with with dozens and hundreds of airstrikes into gaza, especially along the coastline. but the development that is likely now over the next 24 to 48 hours is a ground assault into the gaza strip . this hasn't happened by strip. this hasn't happened by israeli defence forces since 2014, but it's understood that with the restraints being removed, as the defence minister says , as and as more israeli says, as and as more israeli troops amass on that southern border with gaza, which appears porous, with terrorists crossing over and that a more direct ground invasion is likely into the strip . and this will of the strip. and this will of course mean more death and more destruction and much more conflict . conflict. >> thank you very much indeed, charlie peters there, our reporter live from tel aviv, israel , reporter live from tel aviv, israel, bringing us the very latest on what is escalating between israel and hamas . is between israel and hamas. is bringing in my panel on this. ben, i'll start with you . just ben, i'll start with you. just reacting to what charlie has said. huge numbers of deaths now, rumours, reports of babies

being killed . what is your being killed. what is your reaction to how this is unfolding so well , the first unfolding so well, the first thing to identify is that this has all the hallmarks of a massive order terrorist attack . massive order terrorist attack. >> hamas may be ostensibly the government of gaza, but they have perpetrated this attack in the manner of a terrorist. one. they haven't had any specific grievance that they've aired. they haven't targeted any military installation in israel. they've gone in they've gone in big and they've killed innocent women and children. they've targeted that party. they've taken a human wall of defence back with them into gaza. so that if israel attacks, they've got i think they've threatened to behead people in public if israel attacks them without warning in gaza and they're continuing to target civilian populations. all of this is terrorism. none of this is, you

know, what you might regard as a genuine war. and so the question that we have to ask ourselves, i think, is why would hamas suddenly go out for this full frontal terrorist assault of israel now, which they know is going to result in a massive reprisal and a rightjustified , reprisal and a rightjustified, completely supported by the west reprisal? and i think the answer to that, we can't know for sure what the answers are. but i think i suspect the answers to that lie outside palestine. and really in the relationship that israel was so close to getting with saudi and saudi and israel for the first time were going to well , saudi was for the first time were going to well, saudi was going to recognise israel as existence. there was a promise of more armaments, uranium development, nuclear development for saudi if it did recognise israel and i think iran saw the sort of proxy battles that they've been having with saudi through the middle

east for hegemony of the middle east for hegemony of the middle east moving decidedly in saudi's favour and over the last 24 hours, not surprisingly , saudi hours, not surprisingly, saudi has now cancelled its arrangements with israel and i think it's been a big geopolitical victory for iran. so we have to look very carefully at iran and of course, we know iran is very closely allied with russia . so i suspect allied with russia. so i suspect russia has a hand in all of this as well . as well. >> ella, i think william hague wrote in the times this morning that he thought the motivation on the part of hamas would be to provoke such a strong response from israel that israel might lose on the side of public opinion, essentially for retaliating in such a deemed harsh way way. could that be what we see happen ? it's i mean, what we see happen? it's i mean, it's terrible. we look at the bloodshed that is now on both sides . how do you bloodshed that is now on both sides. how do you think bloodshed that is now on both sides . how do you think israel

sides. how do you think israel can respond while keeping public opinion on side? >> well, i think it's really important to think carefully about how we in the west respond to this. and i don't think it's possible or reasonable to compare the two what the actions of israel and the actions of hamas and the you know, the reactions of israel, because we have to be pretty clear that hamas is involved in an and interested and invested in the mass destruction of jews. this isn't any longer. you mass destruction of jews. this isn't any longer . you know, mass destruction of jews. this isn't any longer. you know, i think clearly related to palestinian liberation movement. it's not you know, it's the questions of sovereignty and things like that which are very relevant and important to debate in that region . have have, you in that region. have have, you know , kind of been put by the know, kind of been put by the wayside by the recent actions, you know, and a group interested in liberating people doesn't go around allegedly beheading babies. >> well, this is this is the problem. and we're going to be talking about how this has

played out on our own streets, unfortunately. and they do seem to many people this to be many people in this country that hamas country who believe that hamas are freedom fighters . and i are freedom fighters. and i think people need remind , adding think people need remind, adding that hamas does not want does not want freedom for the palestinians. it wants the destruction of the jewish state and ergo the jewish people. >> hamas is a classifier , a >> hamas is a classifier, a terrorist organisation by the british government. so there's no doubt about how we see hamas in this country. no doubt about how we see hamas in this country . and i do find in this country. and i do find it quite disturbing that anyone, frankly, in this country would support hamas. i can understand i'd sympathy for the 2.3 million people in gaza who live who have lived for many , many years lived for many, many years effectively in a kind of semi siege environment. but that doesn't forgive for a second. hamas his actions and the way hamas his actions and the way hamas goes about about its business. and i would urge anyone in this country who has anyone in this country who has any support for hamas to think very carefully . again, hamas very carefully. again, hamas does not equate to palestinians

. palestinians are not represented by hamas and the other thing to point out, i suppose just moving slightly on is wasn't suella braverman speech on multiculturalism in this country not working? prescient you know, she made that speech a couple of weeks ago. she reiterated it at the she made that in washington. and she made that in washington. and she reiterated it at the conservative party conference. and here we have clear evidence of people on the streets of london who don't see this problem the way they i would expect british people with british values to see it, which is an outrageous attack on a peaceful nation that was minding its own business. there's a kind of anger and it's an anger that's being expressed not from a british perspective, but from a british perspective, but from a non—british one, which means these people are here not feeling british. >> do you think what we've seen on the streets is evidence that multiculturalism is failing ? multiculturalism is failing? >> uh, i don't think it's right

to call israel a peaceful nation that was minding its own business. >> well, it was at this point in time, but but think this is time, but but i think this is the important thing, being able to untangle part of the problem of anti—semitism of the rampant anti—semitism that in west as that we're seeing in the west as of in particular, in of actually in particular, in rising the west, is rising levels in the west, is because inability of because of the inability of people to untangle all what is been happening in relation to whatjake been happening in relation to what jake wallace simons, the editor of the jewish chronicle, labelled israel a phobia. >> yeah, but but, you know, there are debates to be had about sovereignty and important ones. i mean, you know, i don't think anyone would stand here and say that palestinians have no that there is nothing no gripe that there is nothing wrong with the way in which israel is acting and has acted historically . but at the moment, historically. but at the moment, the actions of an islamist force, which hamas is and in the context of what we've seen with islamist terrorism , the things islamist terrorism, the things that have happened in syria, things that have happened on our own doorstep here in the the own doorstep here in the uk, the question basically comes down to people, what are

people, which is what side are you on in the battle over islamism and islamist terrorism? and it's pretty important to be unequivocal condemnation unequivocal in condemnation of hamas. think that hamas. and if you think that that means giving, that's giving israel then you israel a free pass, then you have to look at yourself and try and understand why you can't disassociate jews and jewish people and antisemit ism from a criticism of a nation and its actions. >> well, you sound entirely sensible, ella, and unfortunate . the conversation doesn't always go in that direction when this matter when this subject matter comes our politics matter comes into our politics discourse in this country, we're going to be talking about in just one moment about suella braverman. and she wrote a letter to chief constables essentially re reiterating that hamas is a proscribed terrorist organisation in this country and that they must take this seriously in terms of protests, in terms of celebrations , in in terms of celebrations, in terms of criminal activity . she terms of criminal activity. she and she's also set out a few ways in which this might show itself in this country. so we'll be discussing that. the ramifications of this war here in the uk and what the response

has been from different sections of our society. in just one moment. stay with

, gb news radio. >> welcome back to dewbs& co with me, emily carver. keeping me company this evening is the deputy leader of reform. ben habib and the journalist and author, ella wheeler. thank you very much for joining author, ella wheeler. thank you very much forjoining me author, ella wheeler. thank you very much for joining me this evening. now, before the break, we spoke to charlie peters, who was live from tel aviv , to bring was live from tel aviv, to bring us very latest from the us the very latest from the conflict. and hamas. but conflict. israel and hamas. but we're going to talk now about what's been happening in this country and some of the ways is the reaction essentially to the conflict. now, there have been scenes , as in british cities, scenes, as in british cities, mainly over the weekend and also last night directly after the terrorist attacks and also now today and last night. so on sunday, there were hundreds of pro—palestine activists there marching through manchester. one one said she was full of joy and

pride immediately after the hamas terrorist attacks. there was a similar demo in in brighton. was a similar demo in in brighton . a woman described brighton. a woman described hamas attacks as beautiful and inspire ing. we've also seen in central london huge numbers, thousands, i would say, of protest posters waving palestinian flags. also outside the israel embassy in london. huge, huge crowds. there's also been chanting and flares and fireworks and drums as all sorts that you could say protest or celebration. and that's the difficulty. and also we've seen in golders green, for example, a kosher restaurant was broken into, vandalised . and then there into, vandalised. and then there was also graffiti nearby saying free palestine and other such things. so the suella braverman has got in touch with all the chief constables in england and wales, and she wrote an open letter from the government , wales, and she wrote an open letter from the government, from the home office to them based

hinckley, reiterating that support for hamas , the terrorist support for hamas, the terrorist group, is a crime and reiterating that the police should deal with this very seriously and she also said, which was interesting, she also said that chants such as from the to river the sea could also be seen as a public order offence depending on the context. so i imagine if you were to chant that outside a synagogue or a jewish school or near jewish people that could be considered a public order offence because it implies the destruction of israel. the state of israel. ben on this, how have you felt about looking at what's there have been protests, but also celebrations? yeah and i think it's too early for protests. >> israel actually hasn't struck back in any major meaningful way. i know there have been bombing. >> people have died. >> people have died. but >> people have died. but you know, they haven't actually gone in and committed atrocities of

the that might justify , you the kind that might justify, you know , but they would point know, but they would point demonstrators of siege, blockade . well, yeah, but that doesn't open air prison and the mistreatment of palestinians. but that hasn't been prompted by this recent i mean the recent event can only be described as an attack as far as i'm concerned right now on israel. and it's too early for the palestinians to be coming out in numbers and saying, well , numbers and saying, well, israel's acted. you know , high israel's acted. you know, high handedly or in a draconian manner or not, you know, without proportion. i think it's way too early for that. and frankly , for early for that. and frankly, for celebrations, that is unaccept able. and that goes back to the heart of the speech that suella braverman was making that we're practising multiculturalism in silos. we haven't got a homogeneous society . culture is homogeneous society. culture is being broken down on and so on and so forth. and we've got to be very, very careful that we don't become a country which is divided between lots of

different cultures. and we're seeing it frequently nowadays , seeing it frequently nowadays, aren't we? we saw it in leicester the other day, you know, over a cricket match in which england wasn't even playing and you had ethnic pakistanis kicking off against ethnic indians . and you know ethnic indians. and you know that sort of thing. you just wouldn't expect that in the united kingdom and it shouldn't happenin united kingdom and it shouldn't happen in the united kingdom. well, this is difficult and it's quite distressing for a lot of people see how people watching to see how foreign conflicts can play out through protest and celebration and also vandalism in british towns and cities. >> what's your reaction? >> what's your reaction? >> it's incredibly morally dubious to take to the streets to cheer and to celebrate and let off flares after news that , let off flares after news that, you know, 250 young people dancing at a festival have been killed? yeah that's disgusting. whether or not it should be illegal is , i think, illegal is, i think, a completely other question. and we can have our we can have our criticisms of it. but, you know,

if ben. ben, if we want to have which i agree with you, universal values in a nation those you know, if i was prime minister i would those minister i would make those democracy freedom , freedom of democracy freedom, freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom to protest and some of the you know, okay, hamas is a proscribed terrorist organisation and there are rules around that. and we could have a whole nother debate about about those laws as there some those laws as there are some things that i am uncomfortable with, her with, like for example, her email about wearing email talked about wearing clothing carrying articles in clothing or carrying articles in pubuc clothing or carrying articles in public reasonable public which arouse reasonable suspicion individual's suspicion that an individual's a member of hamas. i mean, does that mean that. >> yes, i think can bring up >> yes, i think we can bring up onto screen the sort of the onto the screen the sort of the six points that she raised. >> we that does that >> can we does that does that mean that every dumb student of which there lots at, you which there are lots at, you know, particularly london know, particularly in london universal cities wearing a palestinian scarf, does it also mean if you don't wear something thatis mean if you don't wear something that is so if you don't wave the hamas flag or wear something, a hamas flag or wear something, a hamas badge , you'll be you know, hamas badge, you'll be you know, disregarded, perhaps you could be a supporter of hamas.

>> but this is the point. >> but this is the point. >> the response to the attacks on freedom and attacks and, you know, attacks on liberty shouldn't be censorship. and as much as there's actually the writer and author daniel ben—ami is really wonderful on this in terms of the fact that he outlines the problem of anti—semitism, but says quite strongly, which is actually not a lot. it's quite unique that the solution to it is not censorship . and the solution to censorship. and the solution to it is not to crack down on even the most disgusting response is to attacks like this , because by to attacks like this, because by doing so one, you drive it underground and two, you are not celebrating and inspiring people with the universal value of freedom . protesters i completely freedom. protesters i completely see your point. >> but what if some of these people have values that are completely at odds with what you're saying there? what if they don't subscribe to the belief of freedom of speech? what if they don't subscribe to the belief of liberal democracy ? >>i ? >> i think it's at the very least disgusting, organised thing and expressing, i think i

mean , i agree with you about the mean, i agree with you about the protection of freedom of speech and i agree with you for the right to protest. absolutely core parts of the value system that make up the united kingdom . quite . but there's something quite disgusting about people celebrating and of course the death of these 250 illegal. yeah. and but that's not my point. my point is something has gone terribly wrong in british society. if we've got swathes of people coming out celebrating the death of 250 young people having a party in israel, and that that's not a legal thing, something culturally is going wrong with our nation state. >> and but so the point that i would make is it's disappointing that this government's response to a cultural issue of which you've outlined very clearly is always to smash it with a legal hammer and for the development of universal values in a nation that cannot happen by a kind of top down state oppression of think you're right. >> but i agree with pretend that this is just a problem that britain is facing. no, no, this

is this is the western world, the entire western liberal democratic world are facing exactly the same problems. >> and as awful as this sounds, it is unbridled. and migration both legal . both legal. >> and you had pro—palestine protester reportedly chanting, gassed the jews . sorry for that. gassed the jews. sorry for that. outside sydney opera house. yes, but this is why i think to just disagree with you slightly and i think we have to be really specific about what's happening at the moment, because this isn't just about migration, ian. >> this is about jews and jewish people anti—semitism, people and anti—semitism, and it's unique it's a particularly unique phenomenon in there has phenomenon in that there has been left to fester. i mean, obviously anti—semitism, the oldest hatred has been around for very long time. it's for a very, very long time. it's nothing new about it. but the new expression of it, you know, among the far right, in the small minority of society, that they still exist in among small sections, very small but vociferous sections of muslims who support islamism , but also who support islamism, but also

among my side of the political divide, among a lot of lefties, there is a at the very best, a kind of wilful blindness to anti—semitism. and this sort of mix of groups has meant that there has been, you know, for many, many years a sort of blind eye turned to this problem. i mean, i live up the road from stamford hill, and there have been security guards outside jewish schools for years, for years. >> i'm glad you raised the experience of jewish communities in country because, of in this country because, of course , after hamas attacked course, after hamas attacked israel , well, initially, the israel, well, initially, the police were quite quick to put out a statement saying, well, attempting to reassure jewish communities that they would have a higher police presence. now, we already know a lot of jewish areas have often had their own security outside synagogues , security outside synagogues, outside jewish schools in in in highly populated jewish areas . highly populated jewish areas. having spoken to jewish friends, there's a fear there is fear.

>> absolutely fear. >> absolutely fear. >> and it's been a long time. but this has increased it. yeah i was texted by a number of jewish friends on saturday as i was heading towards reform was heading towards the reform party conference and i had no idea what was going in idea what was going on in israel. you know, frantically >> and, you know, frantically trying read news. trying to read the news. but they worried and, of they were worried and, of course, a lot of them have family in israel, too. you know , jewish people who live in the united kingdom have family and a very friend of mine has very close friend of mine has two sons in israel in the area that being attacked on that was being attacked on saturday so it's very saturday morning. so it's very visceral . well, for jewish visceral. well, for the jewish community in the united kingdom, they feel it. but what i find disturbing thing is that we have imported ella . you're absolutely imported ella. you're absolutely right. there's a kind of lots of different pockets of anti semitism. and, you know, one doesn't want to too be binary in the way that you describe it. but we have imported in a way , but we have imported in a way, into this country. did roots from across the world, which hitherto hadn't expressed themselves in the manner they are now expressing themselves in

the uk because of the speed at which we've had migration happen. because at because we can't evolve as a society fast enough to accommodate these people as suella said, you know, we've had more migration to the united kingdom in the last 25 years than we've had in all of history until that point in time. and it's just massive. it's just massive. ella i just don't i think there's a debate to be had about migration. >> and i take your point that there is particularly with, you know, clash of cultures, there is a lack of understanding of a universal set of values in this country. mean, you know, country. i mean, you know, whether it's the labour party conservative party, one can conservative party, no one can come a sort of come up with a sort of a manifesto of what this country should and actually, manifesto of what this country stthere and actually, manifesto of what this country stthere was and actually, manifesto of what this country stthere was bitind actually, manifesto of what this country stthere was bit watered ally, manifesto of what this country stthere was bit watered down, if there was a bit watered down, it's a bit being but it's all a bit being nice. but but, but think the important but, but i think the important thing to note when discussing what's happening the moment what's happening at the moment in and in gaza and what in israel and in gaza and what we the west, because we can say is the west, because obviously, know, the obviously, you know, the sovereignty of people living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of people living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is people living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is upeople living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is up forle living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is up for is living obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is up for is , ving obviously, you know, the s0'those1ty of is up for is , you in those areas is up for is, you know, up for them to decide not for them to envision the future,

but from our homes in the uk or us or wherever it is across the west. the question is what's happening in our own nations in relation to anti—semitism? what's happening in our own nations, about discussions, about conflict. about israel and the conflict. and want to have, i mean, from and i want to have, i mean, from the academy of ideas , i want to the academy of ideas, i want to have and most have open debate. and most people the history of people do about the history of that about the that region, about the considerations for geopolitics of what will happen in the middle east. i mean, maybe even our role that historically, our role in that historically, if everyone were like you , if only everyone were like you, ella, you know, wanting to hear all sides of the debate and not taking, you know , offence that taking, you know, offence that even having these difficult conversations, i mean , i think conversations, i mean, i think it's worth just highlighting what the government have said on this. >> i mean, chris philp, the policing minister, he said jews are feeling frightened and unnerved and he is warning that harassment and intimidation will not be tolerated , are working not be tolerated, are working closely with the police to ensure their safety. now, of course, rishi sunak did address a 1700 odd people strong prayer

service at a jewish synagogue in finchley . that's in north—west finchley. that's in north—west london. james cleverly has also said the safety of the jewish community is an absolute priority. the shadow foreign secretary as well, david lammy, coming out very strongly as well, and also keir starmer mentioned in his speech today that he defends the right for israel to defend itself and stands with them . and which stands with them. and which bnngs stands with them. and which brings me on very nicely because next we're going to be a bit of a change, a change of vibe this evening . we're going to be evening. we're going to be talking about keir starmer because to the stage because he took to the stage today. the glitter, but today. he had the glitter, but where pizzazz as we'll where was the pizzazz as we'll be back .

news radio. >> welcome back to dewbs& co with me, emily carver, keeping me company this evening as the deputy leader of reform, ben

habib and the journalist and author ella wheeler. now, it's been a big day at labour conference. the stage was set for six big speech , but let's go for six big speech, but let's go straight to gb news political correspondent olivia utley . correspondent olivia utley. she's been up in liverpool today. olivia, thank you very much for joining today. olivia, thank you very much forjoining me. how did the speech go in your mind ? speech go in your mind? >> well, i think the first and most important thing to say was it was probably only the best speech that anyone had ever heard keir starmer make . now, heard keir starmer make. now, make that what you will. you make of that what you will. you might think that's with faint praise, but he very much the praise, but he very much had the room were, i think, 17 room there were, i think, 17 standing the hall, standing ovations. the hall, which was absolutely enormous, was completely packed out . and was completely packed out. and it really felt as though he had the labour members very the loyal labour members very much on side. as for the substance of the speech, there was very little new. we were sort of expecting that we haven't heard much in terms of new policy from any of the labour frontbenchers over the over the last few days. but what he did do was steal the tories

clothes on quite number of clothes on quite a number of issues. about issues. he talked about reforming nhs , something reforming the nhs, something which conservatives always which the conservatives always sort even sort of shy away from even mentioning. talks about house mentioning. he talks about house building, is incredibly building, which is incredibly important because are lots important because there are lots of tory minded voters who are getting really, really fed up with rishi sunak never talking about house building, but he did have a few problems . yes, he had have a few problems. yes, he had the labour loyal with him, but just after the speech there was a savanta poll of 2000 ordinary people, as in people who were not in liverpool, not not labour party members , and the vast party members, and the vast majority of them , when asked for majority of them, when asked for one word to describe keir starmer, called him boring. he is really, really struggling to shake that off. the other issue is that, yes, seeing the tories clothes is sort of all very well up to a point and i've heard lots of tory minded people the adam smith institute are really right wing one think sort of think tank has essentially endorsed keir starmer in the next election. but the issue is

that keir starmer very much defined himself in that speech by not being a tory. that the central message of his speech will. i was i will fix 13 years of tory failure. well, right now that might seem like enough but a year down the line when we're expecting the next general election, it is just possible that the tories will have done just enough to restore their reputation and by that point, will it be possible for keir starmer simply not to be a tory? so it was a strong speech. it had the support of the room. it very much felt as though keir starmer was confident. he felt like a prime minister in waiting. everyone was was pretty impressed by the delivery from a man who's been accused of being wooden before but there wooden before now. but there were few issues with the were a few issues with the substance there which might begin show bit further down begin to show a bit further down the line. >> you go. thank you >> well, there you go. thank you very indeed, utley very much indeed, olivia utley political reporter. she's been up watched the up in liverpool, watched the whole speech from the conference room itself . well, ben, olivia room itself. well, ben, olivia

seems to think it was a decent speech. >> was it? well, if you set a very low bar for yourself , it's very low bar for yourself, it's quite easy to get over it . no, i quite easy to get over it. no, i mean, you know, the labour party fundamentally is not about reform . forgive the pun , nor is reform. forgive the pun, nor is the conservative party about reform , is it? but it's all reform, is it? but it's all about reform . we know everything about reform. we know everything we need to know about keir starmer through to declan stations. he's made the first, which is emote , perhaps, but he which is emote, perhaps, but he said he'd rather be in davos than westminster. that tells you where his ideological mind is . where his ideological mind is. and then he confirmed that in his declaration in montreal , and then he confirmed that in his declaration in montreal, an inadvertent declaration that he would not diverge from eu regulations . so what we know for regulations. so what we know for sure with keir starmer is that we won't get a new economic or social setup for the united kingdom as a result of his party winning the election. if they winning the election. if they win the election, what we're going to have is much more of the same large state intervention in high taxation , intervention in high taxation, big borrowing, big government

interventions. and in fact, the only policies, tangible ones that i picked out today from his speech was the taxation of non—doms, which arguably made drive into investment in and capital offshore . and then the capital offshore. and then the other thing was effectively the double taxation of people who send their children to private school. well, i wanted to get on to the tax because he also suggested what that might pay for. >> and this is where i'm a little bit sceptical because in my mind, these types of tax policies get scrapping the non—dom status , putting vat on non—dom status, putting vat on private school fees. they're, you know, they accuse the tory party of being populist with their rhetoric. i think this is left wing populism because i don't think it's going to achieve what they are saying it is in terms of bringing money into the treasury in fact, i think it could be a net negative . ella, i'll let you give . but ella, i'll let you give your your reaction to what you heard today. >> well, i wish there was a bit of if indeed you watched it. >> well, yeah, i wish there was a bit of left wing populism.

>> but unfortunately, when you look the you know, the sort look at the you know, the sort of spectre that continues to haunt know, in a way that haunt, you know, in a way that they sort of all enjoy the labor party blair and he's not dead party is blair and he's not dead yet, but he you know, he's he . yet, but he you know, he's he. keir starmer has made a point of continuously referring to blair yvette cooper in her speech, got her loudest applause for talking about surestart. you know, there is a there is you know, he's even in the way he talks about the economy. he says, you know, fiscal responsibility is a priority, is non—negotiable, which is not to say that there's anything good about being sort of reckless with money, but there is just no there's no real oomph to this. when he talks about the cost of living crisis, he says that people should be should live free from anxiety. that's a pretty low bar in my there was a lot about feeling and things and this might go down just this might go down well with some people, but it does seem a bit wishy washy to me it's not that it's not that, you know, it's not that mental

health all these things health or all these things aren't important. and it's not that the cost of living crisis isn't having a genuine effect, that the cost of living crisis isrcourse,|g a genuine effect, that the cost of living crisis isrcourse,|g apeople,e effect, that the cost of living crisis isrcourse,|g apeople, butiect, that the cost of living crisis isrcourse,|g apeople, but there, that the cost of living crisis isrcwknow,g apeople, but there, that the cost of living crisis isrcwknow, when ople, but there, that the cost of living crisis isrcwknow, when he a, but there, that the cost of living crisis isrcwknow, when he talks there, you know, when he talks about things that i would get excited about, building new towns, things that i would get excited athink building new towns, things that i would get excited athink that'sjilding new towns, things that i would get excited athink that's a.ding new towns, things that i would get excited athink that's a reallyiew towns, things that i would get excited athink that's a really exciting s, i think that's a really exciting prospect. it's something that parties very parties should take very seriously. that's seriously. it's something that's necessary. houses or necessary. 1.5 million houses or whatever. is wonderful . but whatever. it is wonderful. but in to be able to achieve in order to be able to achieve that, can't just fiddle that, you can't just fiddle about with and private about with tax and private schools like that . schools and things like that. you have to have some you can't you have to have some very ideas for growth. it's very big ideas for growth. it's got to be radical. there has to be you know, you can't use the word change without using it with a capital with some kind with a capital c with some kind of to it. and haven't of oomph to it. and we haven't seen any the substance seen any of the substance of that yet. no. >> we'll be digging into >> well, we'll be digging into this some more in just one moment. but the big moment. but one of the big talking day was talking points from the day was immigration. have a look talking points from the day was imwhat|tion. have a look talking points from the day was imwhat keir have a look talking points from the day was imwhat keir starmerve a look talking points from the day was imwhat keir starmer had look talking points from the day was imwhat keir starmer had took talking points from the day was imwhat keir starmer had to say. at what keir starmer had to say. oh, nothing. oh, he didn't he didn't actually say anything on the subject. nothing at all. we'll getting ben habib and we'll be getting ben habib and ella's reaction to that in just one moment .

welcome back to dewbs& co. with me, emily carver. now, before the break, we were well , i the break, we were well, i spotted that keir starmer didn't once mention the rather large issue of immigration legal immigration and also illegal immigration, which i thought was rather odd for someone who's giving a pitch to be the prime minister of this fantastic country . now we're going to i'm country. now we're going to i'm going to get the response from ben and, of course, ella in just one moment. but someone wrote to me saying you shouldn't refer to liverpool as being up there because that's rather rude . it's because that's rather rude. it's not on the moon, joe said. and i will apologise for that. i actually have visited liverpool actually have visited liverpool a couple of times and i did enjoy my time there. so sorry if i'm referring to the north as being miles and miles and miles away when in liverpool really isn't that far away. it's about three in the car. i think.

three hours in the car. i think. anyway, back on to keir anyway, moving back on to keir starmer's glaring omission with immigration. starmer's glaring omission with imn because course, the you because of, of course, the reform party conference was banging on about immigration. well, it is a centrally important point. >> you can't talk about housing without talking about immigration. you can't talk about the health service without talking about immigration. >> can't talk all >> you can't talk about all these towns. what's the problem? >> well, three, 300,000 houses a yean >> well, three, 300,000 houses a year, which is roughly what i think promising, 1.5 think he was promising, 1.5 million his year term million over his five year term is a rate of building that we haven't the haven't experienced in the united the 1960s. united kingdom since the 1960s. no government's done it, and we only did it then because we absolutely state doing absolutely had the state doing radical going in and radical things, going in and taking charge of the building programme . taking charge of the building programme. but again, there was nothing radical the way that nothing radical in the way that he set it out, employing a few more planning officers part more planning officers was part of the drill. need much, of the drill. you need much, much reform the much more radical reform of the planning if you want to planning system. if you want to build 300,000 houses. >> well, he said he wants to bulldoze. it was this a sign of the party adopting some, the labor party adopting some, you know, free market ideas,

scrap the regulations, get building? well i mean, the labour party has , you know, in labour party has, you know, in terms of the way in which they talk about the nhs, use the talk about the nhs, they use the word when they talk about word reform when they talk about , it's interesting , you know, it's interesting that about not the that he talked about not the green belt but the grey belt and you this is kind of the you know, this is kind of the easy option say, well, easy option to say, well, there's sort of derelict there's lots of sort of derelict places and golf courses and why don't on that talked don't we build on that talked about marshland. >> of >> i'm not aware of lots of marshland in the united kingdom. >> it is small fry. but on >> it is it is small fry. but on the question of, you know, ben is have to talk is right, you have to talk about planning. you have to do you have to make some quite serious changes around this changes to the law around this in order to be able to get that match. in the ground, match. bricks in the ground, all of which i think should be a priority should be priority and should just be done, and done, no questions asked. and sort of like screw the nimbys and just on it. but in and just get on with it. but in relation to immigration, i think the why starmer is the reason why keir starmer is unwilling make deal out unwilling to make a big deal out of because the labour of this is because the labour party and the conservative party, despite backbiting party, despite their backbiting at very at each other, are actually very similar this. similar in relation to this. there big plans for there isn't any big plans for there isn't any sort of

certainty about their ideology around it. are like pro around it. are they like me, pro more liberal immigration, but up for a debate about how we change the are they maybe the system? or are they maybe like others who are who want to have fewer numbers and are more crackdown? there's no sense of where party really stands . where each party really stands. all rowing has been about all the rowing has been about important things like the system not able work and not being able to work and whether not there's whether or not there's legionella bibby legionella on the bibby stockholm assumption from stockholm the assumption from people and who people watching that and who noficed people watching that and who noticed that he didn't talk about immigration will be that he doesn't about the levels. >> and i think that's the truth. he thinks it's sustainable and he'll continue on as it is whilst that he's going to whilst saying that he's going to build more in to build a few more towns in to order house people. and i think that's the truth. keir starmer and indeed rishi sunak are both europhiles at heart. they they both want to be part of the eu. they both want borderless states. they don't believe in nafion states. they don't believe in nation states. and i would say it's almost sinister. they couldn't care less about immigration because they don't really care about the united kingdom as an independent,

sovereign country. and it's as fundamental as that . fundamental as that. >> we're running out of time, ben. so i just want to get your final thoughts on is it a duplicitous, perhaps not duplicitous, perhaps not duplicitous, perhaps not duplicitous, perhaps that's not the right word, but the labour party pretending that these tiny tweaks in tax policy are going to fund the nhs and its modernisation and reform, which is what they seem to suggest and they seem to that was with the non—dom. and then he seemed to suggest that the vat on private school fees would fund expert teachers and mental won't do anything in each school. >> i think at most it would raise 1.7 billion, assuming parents paid all up and parents paid it all up and schools didn't close as schools didn't close down as a result of it. look, the fact is the country can't be taxed anymore . we're at a post—world anymore. we're at a post—world war ii high. we can't borrow any more money. the whole regime has to change the whole economic model has to change. and that's not going to change if you follow the european union set up sorry, ben , we just running out sorry, ben, we just running out

of time imminently. >> butjust of time imminently. >> but just on that, of time imminently. >> butjust on that, do you >> but just on that, do you think they're being a little bit disingenuous there is going to have to be a higher tax burden across the board, not just these tweaks. >> i know that tax is important and i know some people care a lot about tax. i'm so sick of talking genuinely sick of talking genuinely sick of talking tax, whether talking about tax, whether it's incentives or you incentives. liz truss or you know, to keir starmer, everyone is obsessed with the idea that you tweak here or there you just tweak tax here or there and sun comes up and and the and the sun comes up and everything's there has everything's perfect. there has to be a much bigger conversation about british economy about how the british economy is going talks about going to grow. he talks about clean energy, what does clean british energy, what does that mean? he has to start saying what that actually means in understand in order for us to understand where country is heading. in order for us to understand wh(well, country is heading. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, ntry is heading. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, itry is heading. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, i dids heading. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, i did wantding. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, i did want toig. in order for us to understand wh(well, ella, i did want to get >> well, ella, i did want to get on to gb energy. this is gb news after all. but unfortunately , after all. but unfortunately, that's all we've got time for. thank you very much to ben habib. thank you very much to ella tonight ella whelan. that's all tonight on dewbs& co. with me, emily carver. stay tuned for nigel. >> hello again. aidan >> hello again. it's aidan mcgivern met mcgivern here from the met office. gb news office. with the gb news forecast rain moving south into northern england , northern northern england, northern ireland wales overnight .

ireland and wales overnight. clearer, but staying blustery for scotland. whilst remains for scotland. whilst it remains warm in the far south. there's a significant temperature contrast across the uk at the moment. warmth the south—east chilly warmth in the south—east chilly in and northwest and in the north and northwest and in the north and northwest and in between a band of rain finally easing across central and western scotland, pushing into southern scotland during the evening, northern ireland and later on across parts and then later on across parts of northern england and wales . of northern england and wales. the rain pepping up by the end of the night in these areas as well. now it stays dry further south, but there'll be a lot of low cloud and mist to begin things on wednesday, a mild start but a start start here, but a chilly start for scotland, especially central belt single belt northwards, mid single figures strong wind, figures and a strong wind, in fact, through fact, gales blowing through exposed northern and northwestern coasts with frequent here. so a frequent showers here. so a fairly unpleasant day to come here, even if it has stopped raining further south. we've got spells of rain through wales , spells of rain through wales, the midlands and east anglia continuing through the day, staying largely dry after the early clears in far early mist clears in the far south still warm, south and southeast. still warm, but warm as has been. but not as warm as it has been. and then it's in the south where

the rain comes to a stop on thursday . the rain does ease, thursday. the rain does ease, but it stays fairly drizzly along some of these southern counties england, brighter along some of these southern countfurtherngland, brighter along some of these southern countfurther north. i, brighter along some of these southern countfurther north. in righter along some of these southern countfurther north. in fact:er along some of these southern countfurther north. in fact, r along some of these southern countfurther north. in fact, a skies further north. in fact, a nice day for north wales, nice sunny day for north wales, northern england, much of scotland and northern ireland. and then friday, wet and then on friday, further wet weather before that weather in the south before that clears weather at the clears to colder weather at the weekend

well . well. good evening. >> tonight on farage, we talk about the utterly disgraceful scenes on the streets of london last night and we ask , should last night and we ask, should our police be doing more? we go to tel aviv with charlie peters from gb news to get the latest on what's been happening in israel and gaza today and demoted down the running order today of the news agenda, of course, is keir starmer's big speech to the labour party

conference where he was covered by a protester in glitter. what that says about labour party security, i just don't know. but before all of that, let's get the news with polly middleton . first >> nigel thank you and good evening to you. well, the top story tonight, the hamas terror group has launched renewed rocket attacks on israel throughout the day today, targeting the city of ashkelon in the south. the missiles were fired after the terrorist group warned residents to leave the city by 5:00 local time. israel's iron dome anti—missile system protecting most residents and being able to intercept many of the rockets . air raid sirens of the rockets. air raid sirens were heard elsewhere across israel . its defence forces israel. its defence forces claiming more than 4500 rockets have been launched by hamas since saturday. the israeli embassy to the united states says more than 1000 of its citizens have been killed in the