of brutality and was an orgy of brutality and torture against innocent people. people were chased around and the rooms in their houses and shot. now there's a difference between that and what the israeli soldiers are now trying to do in gaza. soto your your point, mark, about what the international community needs to remember is the difference between what israel experienced, the terrorist attack and what they're trying to do now . what they're trying to do now. what they're trying to do now. what they're trying to do now is make sure that never happens again. >> and you can see more of that exclusive interview with boris johnson tomorrow from breakfast at six. and throughout the day on gb news. now, humza yousafs in—laws have arrived back in scotland after being trapped in gaza for more than three weeks. the first minister posted a photo on x and said he's glad they're back home safely. the foreign office is pressing for the rafah crossing to reopen to allow uk nationals to escape

gaza. egypt announced the suspension of evacuations following a deadly attack on an ambulance as well . the prime ambulance as well. the prime minister, rishi sunak and home secretary suella braverman have expressed concerns about further pro—palestine protests during armistice day . the met police armistice day. the met police commissioner, sir mark rowley, has promised to take a robust just approach and to use all the powers available to ensure commemorate live events are not undermined . and deputy prime undermined. and deputy prime minister oliver dowden says armistice day should be about honoufing armistice day should be about honouring the sacrifices made by previous generations . previous generations. >> i have really grave concerns about this and i think that certainly representing a large jewish community as i do, but it's broader than the jewish community. we should be honoufing community. we should be honouring and respecting the sacrifice made by previous generations, and we certainly shouldn't have the kind of intimidation that you see in those marches . and thames water those marches. and thames water has declared a major incident as

thousands of homes in godalming, in surrey have been left without water due to the effects of storm kieran. >> the bad weather conditions have caused issues at shalford water treatment works. thames water saying that they're working to restore supplies to the area. in the meantime , the area. in the meantime, they're providing bottled water. but gb news understands some stores locally have started to sell out as residents go to buy their own . this is gb news their own. this is gb news across the uk on tv in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker by saying play gb news now let's get straight to free speech nation . free speech nation. >> a pro—palestine protest is scheduled for armistice day. marks and spencer upset everyone with a christmas advert. and the simpsons ditches one of its most famous jokes. this is free speech nation . welcome to free

speech nation. welcome to free speech nation. welcome to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. >> with me, andrew doyle. >> this is the show where we take a look at culture, current affairs and politics, and we'll be covering some of the usual antics from those culture warriors who have really outdone themselves this week, even by their standards. themselves this week, even by their up standards. themselves this week, even by their up the standards. themselves this week, even by their up the showndards. themselves this week, even by their up the show tonight, coming up on the show tonight, feminist writer film maker and activist vaishnavi sunder will be here to discuss her upcoming documentary behind the looking glass. we'll discuss a worrying case in which a trans police officer hounded a free speech campaigner with abusive messages before eventually being dismissed. week . freedom in dismissed. last week. freedom in the arts. that's a new organisation designed to help artists who themselves and artists who find themselves and their cancelled . well, i'm their work cancelled. well, i'm going to be speaking one of going to be speaking to one of the rosie kay and going to be speaking to one of the campaigner rosie kay and going to be speaking to one of the campaigner billboard./ and going to be speaking to one of the campaigner billboard. chris will here to us about will be here to tell us about his work travelling the world, exposing gender, identity, ideology and of course, i've got a wonderful panel here who are going answer questions going to answer some questions from attractive from our rather attractive studio audience. guest studio audience. my guest tonight are cressida wetton and josh howie. welcome both . so i

josh howie. welcome both. so i like the contrast between you two because you've dressed up for the event and you've gone kind of ghetto. i've gone. i mean, look at that. >> i represent the street that i've always thought that about you. >> the poshest voice possible. >> the poshest voice possible. >> i've always and you. and you look very well turned out. >> thanks. thanks. and you? >> thanks. thanks. and you? >> dare you ? yeah. >> how dare you? yeah. >> how dare you? yeah. >> no, that's all there is to say about that. let's talk to the audience instead, because i'm bored of my panel already. we've got a question from edward. edward hi, edward. >> our white supremacist to >> our white supremacist is to blame palestinian deaths . yes. >> okay. so that's quite a heavy start show . but i know start to the show. but i know what this is about, edward. this is organisation sisters is women's organisation sisters uncut. now they are claiming that the same white supremacist patriarchy oppressing feminists is also a, quote, murdering palestinian owns. josh, this is one of these you would describe as intersex groups that sort of find these connections all over the place, sort of lump it together in a very unnuanced way, don't they? >> the idea is that, yeah, until

we're all nobody's free until we're all nobody's free until we're all nobody's free until we're all free, right? so they're banding together. trans ideology , which includes, i ideology, which includes, i guess, queer gay people and women as well . yes. and they're women as well. yes. and they're going and they're banning that with the palestinian cause . and with the palestinian cause. and the irony is, of course , that in the irony is, of course, that in a place like gaza with hamas, a terrorist organisation and islamic terrorist organisation, all of those things would be banned. all of those things would be banned . they would be murdered banned. they would be murdered for. so, i mean, it's ridiculous. and the other thing is when they say white supremacy or whatever, it's an american idea that they've tried to transpose across the world, israel, it doesn't apply to the majority of israeli jews are from middle east and they from the middle east and they look palestinians. so it's look like palestinians. so it's a idea. look like palestinians. so it's a yes. idea. look like palestinians. so it's a yes. so idea. look like palestinians. so it's a yes. so it'sea. look like palestinians. so it's a yes. so it's like you say , >> yes. so it's like you say, the americanism, i think is exactly this exactly right. but this is a group that gathered in group that have gathered in london lot to sort of london quite a lot to sort of put this together. but this group already got in group have already got in trouble they, trouble before, haven't they, kristen? have they? >> they're i mean, first >> they're very i mean, first of all, when the name all, when you hear the name

feminism, what's it feminist sisters don't you think? sisters uncut, don't you think? what fgm charity? what what's an fgm charity? excellent. and excellent. well done then. and then turns not that then it turns out it's not that at they've all these at all. they've got all these other as you just said, other things, as you just said, grouped together. >> well, they actually defended that called that trans activist who called on women. right. on people to punch women. right. they isn't they defended that, isn't it? >> i mean, standard feminist >> i mean, the standard feminist now saying, let's now is currently saying, let's have be women have women's prisons be women only. so quite only. yes. so it's quite a departure from that. >> it sort of disturbs me with this all of these protests this with all of these protests that a lot of the that i've seen. a lot of the people to reducing people seem to be reducing everything very simplistic everything to a very simplistic binary it looks everything to a very simplistic birme it looks everything to a very simplistic birme like it looks everything to a very simplistic birme like a it looks everything to a very simplistic birme like a lot it looks everything to a very simplistic birme like a lot of it looks everything to a very simplistic birme like a lot of them looks everything to a very simplistic birme like a lot of them justs to me like a lot of them just don't understand what the issues. not even a little bit. no, no, not at all. >> and they're absolutely unwilling to learn. once unwilling to learn. and once they they're they feel like they're comfortable on comfortable in their space on the right history, god the right side of history, god forbid comes along and forbid someone comes along and says, what this fact says, well, what about this fact that why that? that why is that? >> because seems to be the >> because this seems to be the case political or case with every political or ideological these days. ideological dispute. these days. everything. reduced everything. it has to be reduced to versus evil. and there's to good versus evil. and there's nothing in between because my theory the the theory is that the left or the far left don't like reading. >> maybe i genuinely think that. i like reading. i think they don't like reading. i think they don't like reading.

i lazy. i think i think they're lazy. i think they just want to tell they just want someone to tell them yes. just them you're good. yes. and just like trans thing, like, like with the trans thing, like, you you see the same you know, you see the same pattern repeated over and over again. everybody goes, yeah, of course want equal rights course we want equal rights for everybody. and of course everything fair. and everything should be fair. and we great. then they we go, yeah, great. then they stop thinking because they made their but as their position and that. but as soon someone says, well, soon as someone says, well, actually might equate actually that might equate to, you know, female might be you know, female rights might be affected. then in this case, affected. and then in this case, they're a feminist they're meant to be a feminist organisation. guess organisation. well, guess who got murdered, right, got raped and murdered, right, on october 7th in israel. >> exactly. i this all the >> exactly. i find this all the time. had andrew boff on the time. i had andrew boff on the show and he was talking about gender identity, ideology, saying and saying it wasn't a thing. and i explained him what he's meant explained to him what he's meant by the phrase and had by the phrase and he had never heard clearly heard it before. he clearly didn't first thing didn't know the first thing about it. and i was genuinely surprised by he doesn't watch free watch free speech. he doesn't watch free speech. he doesn't watch free that's the most free speech. no, that's the most egregious story. egregious aspect of that story. but i don't mind people disagreeing, but i'm always shocked haven't done disagreeing, but i'm always shocknbasic haven't done disagreeing, but i'm always shocknbasic reading haven't done some basic reading on the subject, basic reading and subject, any basic reading and then confident that you then be so confident that you start organisation. start an organisation. >> that's extraordinary. >> i mean, that's extraordinary. >> i mean, that's extraordinary. >> that's it. absolutely >> well, that's it. absolutely okay. another

okay. we'll move on to another question from roderick question now from roderick roderick. hello. hello >> simpsons retiring? roderick. hello. hello >> of simpsons retiring? roderick. hello. hello >> of its simpsons retiring? roderick. hello. hello >> of its best simpsons retiring? roderick. hello. hello >> of its best gags?)ns retiring? roderick. hello. hello >> of its best gags? yes. etiring? one of its best gags? yes. >> now, a fan of the >> now, are you a fan of the simpsons? roderick? yes. you are. and you know, simpsons. no, i totally with because i totally agree with you because the they have the late simpsons, they have lost it, haven't they? but in the early days, homer to the early days, homer used to grab throat. he used grab bart by the throat. he used to are you little and to say, why are you little and grab the child by the throat. and i never took that as inciting violence against children. i don't know. children. i mean, i don't know. you've children. i mean, i don't know. youthe joke children. i mean, i don't know. you the joke was children. i mean, i don't know. youthe joke was he was a bad >> the joke was he was a bad parent. there we go. now parent. right? there we go. now he sort of says, oh, i'm not like that anymore. well, the point was, it came out 30 point was, when it came out 30 years not weren't years ago, not people weren't just strangling kids. the just strangling their kids. the point was a terrible point was, he was a terrible parent. joke. and parent. that was the joke. and he oh, things have changed he says, oh, things have changed now. changed is now. you know what's changed is the a joke about the ability to make a joke about bad yeah. bad parenting. yeah, yeah. that's changed. that's what's changed. and that's thing. that's what's changed. and tha is thing. that's what's changed. and thai mean, thing. that's what's changed. and thai mean, there'sthing. that's what's changed. and thai mean, there's allg. that's what's changed. and thai mean, there's all sorts of >> i mean, there's all sorts of ways that the simpsons has sort of its act up, sanitised of cleaned its act up, sanitised its according its act according to modern sensibilities, become not sensibilities, and become not funny funny. they sensibilities, and become not fun|rid funny. they sensibilities, and become not fun|rid the funny. they sensibilities, and become not fun|rid the characterfunny. they sensibilities, and become not fun|rid the character apu,'. they got rid of the character apu, for instance, and they've done all but look at all sorts of stuff. but look at south is just south park, which is just absolutely still absolutely killing it, still being totally relevant.

>> a genius >> this week had a genius episode which just totally blew >> this week had a genius episoiideology just totally blew >> this week had a genius episoiideology out totally blew >> this week had a genius episoiideology out oftally blew >> this week had a genius episoiideology out oftallywater. woke ideology out of the water. yes, been on it. yes, they've always been on it. >> a good. yes. >> they had a good. yes. >> they had a good. yes. >> south park try to answer the questions. they say questions. do they always say that to hold that we're here to hold up a mirror? yeah tell you mirror? yeah not to tell you what do? yes exactly. we what to do? yes exactly. we won't you strangle won't tell you not to strangle your kids. >> but was anyone seriously thinking that was to thinking that that was risky to have his kid? have homer strangle his kid? >> they weren't. i don't >> i hope they weren't. i don't think marge's think anybody copied marge's hair although they hair either. no although they probably have. actually hair either. no although they probablsaid have. actually hair either. no although they probablsaid tblue actually hair either. no although they probablsaid tblue actu.isy having said that, blue hair is in good in now. it's a good look. >> good. but like >> it's a good. but like roderick the point that roderick makes the point that the early simpsons much the early simpsons are much better. true, you know, better. and it's true, you know, they've just lost. definitely. >> yeah. time to just >> yeah. maybe it's time to just retire show. quite retire the whole show. quite a violent to quite extreme. >> but yeah, you know, fair enough. we're going enough. okay. we're going to move a question alan. move on to a question from alan. where is alan? hi, alan. >> are we winning the >> hi there. are we winning the battle cancel culture in battle against cancel culture in the yeah, this a this >> yeah, this is a story this week, 100 academics british week, 100 academics at british universities. formed a universities. they formed a new council freedom. council for academic freedom. and here is they're and the idea here is they're going combat culture. going to combat cancel culture. now to greg now i was speaking to greg lukianoff recently, who's written good with written a really good book with ricky about the problems ricky schlott about the problems of particularly of cancel culture, particularly in he makes

in universities. and he makes the they make the the point they both make the point book that you'd point in the book that you'd have to go back to mccarthyism to bad as the to have anything as bad as the number getting number of professors getting fired at the moment on university campuses us. university campuses in the us. and in their research has and in fact their research has shown more professors have shown that more professors have been within this era been fired within this woke era than during mccarthyism. people don't believe that, but it's true. so that's a right? true. so that's a worry, right? >> absolutely. mean, i look >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnard reading book >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit reading book >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit comes ing book >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit comes out book >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit comes out in book >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit comes out in like ok >> absolutely. i mean, i look fonnalit comes out in like comic when it comes out in like comic book yeah, exactly. book format. yeah, exactly. >> read my book >> we haven't read my book yet, so i'm for comic book. >> the comic book's out, but yes. and this is i actually think this ties into much larger picture of society where we picture of our society where we see people where we see these marches on. know marches going on. i know we're going about going to talk about that in a bit, but it's because the far left ideology , whatever you left woke ideology, whatever you want call identity want to call it, identity politics, hasn't been properly challenged as people challenged because as people have been afraid and the people who stood up have lost who have stood up have lost their they that's their jobs. they have. that's why been to rise to why they've been able to rise to such prominence and go unchecked . what i believe the . yes. and what i believe the next now to just for next step now to just for getting out this getting ourselves out of this quagmire we find ourselves quagmire that we find ourselves in having this in the west is having this robust ability to challenge

those ideologies and to show them to be incredibly stupid. >> well, this is the point. i mean, i hear really offensive opinions all the time, sometimes directed at me. i never think to myself, person fired myself, i want that person fired and want person to shut and i want that person to shut up. rather expose that up. i'd rather expose that person's arguments person's stupid arguments for what rather what they are. i mean, rather than kind of than give them a kind of dignity, know, silencing. absolutely. >> mean, weird, isn't it? >> i mean, it's weird, isn't it? oh take the floor more, please. carry completely. completely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me completely. completely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me armpletely. completely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me a job.etely. completely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me a job having ompletely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me a job having t0|pletely. oh take the floor more, please. carry me a job having to explain save me a job having to explain why you frustrate me. carry why you frustrate me. just carry on.but why you frustrate me. just carry on. but how do we get to >> but i mean, how do we get to this point? because now in universities, case universities, it is this case all studies show this, all of the studies show this, that there's of that there's a kind of groupthink on that groupthink going on and that actually people more actually people who have more traditionally conservative views, to views, they tend to keep them to themselves views, they tend to keep them to themsgetes views, they tend to keep them to themsget promoted if they won't get promoted if they even i that's for i mean, that's a lot for university. what's going on? >> isn't it? >> it's terrible, isn't it? i mean, it's 20 years since i was at university and we just didn't i like i don't remember it being like that read philosophy. that at all. i read philosophy. i time. we used to i had a good time. we used to kick an idea around. we kick an idea around. no we panicked. went into a dark panicked. if it went into a dark corner that was you have to go into corners to find corner that was you have to go intowhere corners to find corner that was you have to go intowhere your)rners to find corner that was you have to go intowhere your limitsto find corner that was you have to go intowhere your limits are. 1d corner that was you have to go intowhere your limits are. don't out where your limits are. don't you? absolutely. if you don't

have opportunity to thrash you? absolutely. if you don't have out,opportunity to thrash you? absolutely. if you don't have out,oppc never/ to thrash you? absolutely. if you don't have out,oppc never/ to ttwhat. ideas out, you never know what. >> bad >> you're making me feel bad that didn't go to any of my that i didn't go to any of my lectures. >> well, you should feel bad. josh maybe if you did work josh and maybe if you did work a bit you'd have read my bit harder, you'd have read my book by now. did book by now. yeah, you did develop good develop the skills a good time. well going move well okay. we're going to move on question from jonathan. on to a question from jonathan. where's jonathan? hi, jonathan. hello. should ban gender >> should france ban gender inclusive >> should france ban gender inc|yeah, was interesting. >> yeah, this was interesting. the senate in the french senate voted in favour a new proposed law, favour of a new proposed law, which is to ban gender inclusive language from official communications in france. that's the idea. and they say, and i know macron has made this point a lot that he's he's worried about culture being about french culture being disrupted . and disrupted by woke ideology. and this is a good example because they're having to force in language isn't natural. in language that isn't natural. in other hasn't other words, the language hasn't evolved. activists evolved. there are activists trying impose changes to the trying to impose changes to the language. and that's the difference, it? difference, isn't it? >> that is the difference. and if you read of the if you read some of the examples, it just examples, it's like it just makes they've added examples, it's like it just makeslike they've added examples, it's like it just makeslike dot they've added examples, it's like it just makeslike dot e they've added examples, it's like it just makeslike dot e dotey've added examples, it's like it just makeslike dot e dot to ve added examples, it's like it just makeslike dot e dot to make ed examples, it's like it just makeslike dot e dot to make the these like dot e dot to make the feminine of masculine feminine at the end of masculine words is the idea of it. but what's also interesting in the grander scheme here is that

you've seen what happened here where suella braverman not always a big fan of, but she has tried these tried to implement these policies and told like the police to stop , you know, police to stop, you know, following through on some the following through on some of the stuff been doing stuff that they've been doing and haven't done it. and then they haven't done it. and what it's the same thing in france couple years france like a couple of years ago. stop it. ago. they said, stop doing it. yes. didn't so now yes. and it didn't stop. so now they've had to make it they've literally had to make it law. seems that's law. and it seems like that's the to really fight the only way to really fight this is to take it to that level. >> i mean, what do you think about this? because i mean, this idea of activists trying to change language that change the language that we use and all the time. and and they do it all the time. and the trouble the media in the trouble is that the media in this takes on board. the trouble is that the media in this you takes on board. the trouble is that the media in this you everkes on board. the trouble is that the media in this you ever haven board. the trouble is that the media in this you ever have you ard. the trouble is that the media in this you ever have you tried have you ever have you tried recently an article recently reading an article about the singer smith about the singer sam smith because most articles, most articles they articles will use they them pronouns. time you pronouns. and by the time you get second paragraph, it get to the second paragraph, it doesn't anymore. doesn't make any sense anymore. i'm like, what are they talking about? now do i'm like, what are they talking abouthey're now do i'm like, what are they talking abouthey're talking now do i'm like, what are they talking abouthey're talking about do i'm like, what are they talking abouthey're talking about who do i'm like, what are they talking abothey y're talking about who do i'm like, what are they talking abothey talkingiing about who do i'm like, what are they talking abothey talkingiing atnow? ho do are they talking about now? and everyone everyone everyone knows this. everyone knows no one knows it's incoherent and no one speaks that. it just hasn't speaks like that. it just hasn't caught on. >> know? i was >> who doesn't know? i was absolutely week. absolutely crushed this week. i saw miriam margolyes. saw a clip of miriam margolyes. yes graham yes saying this on graham norton. know how old the

norton. i don't know how old the clip but she was saying, clip was, but she was saying, now harm does it do? and now what harm does it do? and i was we know it was thinking, oh, no, we know it does it just doesn't does harm. it just doesn't make sense. doesn't sense. sense. it doesn't make sense. it's verging on compelled speech. >> but this is the problem, you see, language see, because if the language naturally the naturally evolves so that the word a singular word they becomes a singular pronoun, whatever. i will pronoun, then whatever. i will accept it really accept that. but it really hasn't. the vast majority hasn't. and the vast majority of people on board people just can't get on board with they're still with it, but they're still trying they're trying to impose it. they're trying to impose it. they're trying it. trying to impose it. they're tryi and it. trying to impose it. they're tryi and it it. trying to impose it. they're tryi and it doesn'tt. trying to impose it. they're tryi and it doesn't make logical >> and it doesn't make logical sense. it's actually sense. no. so it's actually making extra sets, sense. no. so it's actually making it extra sets, sense. no. so it's actually making it harder. extra sets, sense. no. so it's actually making it harder. and sets, sense. no. so it's actually making it harder. and lets, sense. no. so it's actually making it harder. and i think that macron, thinking of that macron, he's thinking of all those poor students all those poor gcse students out there he's he's implementing. >> what about people learning the language abroad? the language from abroad? i mean, it must be it's a nightmare enough it is. nightmare enough as it is. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> good luck. it's un problem. may we be, sir? and we can all do that. all right. we're going to on now to a question to move on now to a question from armin to move on now to a question frorgood armin to move on now to a question frorgood eveningn to move on now to a question frorgood evening . do you think we >> good evening. do you think we should be able to trust keir starmer his flip flop starmer with his flip flop backwards and fonnards and he can't even wear his poppy all the time? well, yes. >> i mean, he is known as a bit of a flip flopper, but this poppy of a flip flopper, but this poppy issue. so i saw this

onune i poppy issue. so i saw this online i sure whether online and i wasn't sure whether to believe it or not, there to believe it or not, but there was image various labour was an image of various labour mps speeches with their mps doing speeches with their poppies was poppies on and then that was juxtaposed with pictures of them doing islam or doing speeches about islam or islamophobia . and the poppy islamophobia. and the poppy wasn't couldn't wasn't there and i couldn't decide , oh, has that been, you decide, oh, has that been, you know, digitally know, modified digitally or is it case that starmer just it the case that starmer just forgot to wear his poppy ? what? forgot to wear his poppy? what? go. chris. do you give me go. go on, chris. do you give me a then? like i'm very naive. >> i find that very hard to believe. and i mean, they have thought not josh thought that they're not josh they've of thought thought that they're not josh they'they of thought thought that they're not josh they'they look of thought thought that they're not josh they'they look like if thought thought that they're not josh they'they look like if tithese. what they look like on these programs. they've experts programs. they've got experts advising them no, come come advising them no, come on, come on. no . well, it is the case >> no, no. well, it is the case that he says he forgot, right? he to during allegedly. >> yes. if it isn't the >> yes. okay. if it isn't the case, if it's a cynical ploy to win over the muslim vote by not wearing a poppy, i think it's disgusting. >> but why would that win over the vote? the muslim vote? >> well, that's there. >> i mean. well, that's there. you have to ask, isn't that quite a prejudice, prejudiced approach if he approach for him to take if he if assuming that for his if he's assuming that for his advisors assume advisors or whatever, to assume that be down with the that to not be down with the poppy ? that to not be down with the poppy ? yeah, it's that to not be down with the poppy ? yeah, it's ridiculous poppy? yeah, it's a ridiculous thing it's a genuine mistake

thing if it's a genuine mistake andits thing if it's a genuine mistake and it's blown up by the and it's been blown up by the people just want to attack people who just want to attack keir starmer yeah, then it's like , who knows? flip flop on like, who knows? flip flop on this one. >> i know you are, because i think you do struggle, josh because you do want labour to get the next election, but get in at the next election, but you're not sure about starmer, are you? >> no, no. i it's >> no, no, no. i think it's almost the other round. almost the other way round. i actually i think actually think this. i think starmer a clever person. starmer is a clever person. i think do anything get think he'll do anything to get in is what i think has in and this is what i think has happened the larger picture. happened in the larger picture. again, is i'm thinking again, this is what i'm thinking a i've just learnt a very macro. i've just learnt macro, other macro, by the way, the other day, trying to implement day, so i'm trying to implement it as much as possible, i it as much as possible, but i think they've the numbers think they've done the numbers and we've and they've gone. we've got 4 million voters or million muslim voters or whatever it 90% of that. we don't want to alienate them. but at the same time, if we don't if we if we seem to be too much trying to appease that that that. yeah the group for them, then i think the majority will go wait a minute. >> is it that calculated. >> is it that calculated. >> is it that calculated. >> i think they've absolutely run and they'll they run the numbers and they'll they thought we'll lose more viewers by forget the morality of it

by and forget the morality of it like of course when he put out a good position with israel , he good position with israel, he stood his ground. he hasn't sort of kowtowed he hasn't flip flopped because of pressure flopped because of the pressure he other he has he has on other issues. he has on but on this he on other issues. but on this he hasn't. and that that's hasn't. and i think that that's i'm that it's part i'm hoping that it's part morality is the right morality because it is the right thing do. yes. but i thing for him to do. yes. but i am i wouldn't be surprised am also i wouldn't be surprised if they run the numbers. >> be fair to keir >> and to be fair to keir starmer, has recently starmer, he has recently said that admits that 99.9% of that he admits that 99.9% of women don't have penises , which women don't have penises, which is step fonnard because is a good step fonnard because up until recently he was he was saying that saying he couldn't answer that question , although he's been question, although he's been able that succinctly . able to say it that succinctly. >> gwynne actually, >> andrew gwynne well, actually, it's if you actually look at the >> if you actually look at the maths of that, it still up maths of that, it still ends up with women with about 37,000 women with penises. of penises. penises. so a lot of penises. >> he's trying to make himself go woman . he's go through every woman. he's just checking. go through every woman. he's jusihe's:king. go through every woman. he's just he's justj. go through every woman. he's jusihe's just checking. he >> he's just checking. is he okay? he's okay? well, at least he's thorough. we're going to thorough. okay we're going to move to question from move on now to a question from dave. is dave? hi, dave. dave. where is dave? hi, dave. all yeah dave. where is dave? hi, dave. all now yeah dave. where is dave? hi, dave. all now and|h dave. where is dave? hi, dave. all now and then, is it a true >> now and then, is it a true beatles song? >> yeah, i watched the video for now then. this new now and then. so this is a new beatles track . well, i say new. beatles track. well, i say new.

it's they've taken like an it's been they've taken like an old demo with john lennon old demo tape with john lennon singing, cleaned it up digitally . added a bit . paul mccartney's added a bit anyway have a look. we've anyway, let's have a look. we've got a little clip now and then . got a little clip now and then. i want you to be there for me. so it's interesting what they do because in the video they digitally bring in john lennon and george harrison, but they also like old versions also bring in like old versions of mccartney next of paul mccartney standing next to paul to the new version of paul mccartney. sorts of mccartney. and all sorts of interesting. actually quite interesting. i actually quite like i it's like the song and i think it's an interesting thing to do. i don't see. what do you think? i mean, die hard beatles mean, i'm not a die hard beatles fan, i don't know. mean, it fan, so i don't know. i mean, it is interesting. fan, so i don't know. i mean, it is iii:eresting. fan, so i don't know. i mean, it is ii| mean,g. fan, so i don't know. i mean, it is ii| mean, whether people >> i mean, whether some people would their canon would add it to their canon or not, at same time , every not, but at the same time, every song that you hear is manipulated right. manipulated nowadays. right. exactly you're not hearing the 100% true voice of anybody really anymore . really anymore. >> mean, every song is >> no. i mean, every song is produced to a and sort of produced to a degree and sort of modified during the process. i mean, is it case that people mean, is it the case that people are it? i didn't mean, is it the case that people are about it? i didn't mean, is it the case that people are about that. it? i didn't hear about that. >> don't know if they're

>> i don't know if they're annoyed. i mean, he wrote it, didn't he? was there before didn't he? he was there before they finished the project didn't he? he was there before theythen finished the project didn't he? he was there before theythen heished the project didn't he? he was there before theythen he inconvenientlyct didn't he? he was there before theythen he inconveniently died. and then he inconveniently died. and john lennon's dead. >> i'm sorry about that. >> yeah. i'm sorry about that. oh, >> yeah. i'm sorry about that. 0h, , >> yeah. i'm sorry about that. oh, , ringo . anyway, but you oh, josh, ringo. anyway, but you are fine. >> yes, because he wrote it. >> yes, because he wrote it. >> okay. because he did write it. okay fine. do we have any more questions ? no, we don't. so more questions? no, we don't. so we're going to take a break. but next up on free speech nation, the writer, filmmaker the feminist writer, filmmaker and sundar the feminist writer, filmmaker and be sundar the feminist writer, filmmaker and be here sundar the feminist writer, filmmaker and be here to sundar the feminist writer, filmmaker and be here to discussiundar the feminist writer, filmmaker and be here to discuss her ar will be here to discuss her upcoming documentary behind the looking glass. please don't go anywhere .

radio. welcome back to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle, vaishnavi sundar is a feminist writer, activist and acclaimed filmmaker. her upcoming project is a documentary called behind the looking glass , which is the looking glass, which is about the lives of women whose

partners have or want to transition . it's the first film transition. it's the first film ever made about this topic. let's take a look . let's take a look. >> get out . get yourself out of >> get out. get yourself out of this . this. >> do not allow yourself to be persuaded or influenced by blandish agents and manipulative arguments. >> try to extricate yourself. figure out the finances. >> there is nothing you can be or do that will make you the object of his affection. >> he is the object of his affection. >> it's like my dad died when i was 11, but i didn't realise . was 11, but i didn't realise. and i've been mourning him . for and i've been mourning him. for 40 years . 40 years. >> and vaishnavi sundar joins me now . thank >> and vaishnavi sundar joins me now. thank you forjoining me. a lot of people will see that and not understand the idea of trans widows. what does that mean ?

widows. what does that mean? >> well, thank you so much for having me. trans widows basically is a term that was coined after a group of women decided that it was suitable to call themselves that because their husbands or their partners have decided to leave them to become a woman. yes, i understand. evidently left their family behind, their children behind . and these women feel behind. and these women feel widowed by their husbands. >> and you've been speaking to a lot of these women for the for the new documentary , but not in the new documentary, but not in india, elsewhere here. yeah. >> i mean, i've been speaking to women , to anybody who would women, to anybody who would speak to me, to be honest. yes. and the challenge about speaking on this subject in india is the language, because we speak hundreds of languages and it is very difficult to unite women together for them to understand what trans widow means in the first place. yes. and there are so many different socio cultural communities that these women might coming to might not be coming fonnard to speak they speak about this. and they probably don't think that they can speak about this divorce . can speak about this divorce. these are being granted on the

grounds of the husbands getting cross sex surgeries. yes, but that's not because they care for the women . but that's just the women. but that's just because the court believes that he is no longer a man. therefore, the marriage is not valid. >> so that's very interesting because i think a lot of people make the assumption that gender identity ideology has only make the assumption that gender identiispreadogy has only make the assumption that gender identiispread iny has only make the assumption that gender identiispread in thes only make the assumption that gender identiispread in the anglo really spread in the anglo sphere and that it's really sphere and that it's not really happening in many other countries. from countries. but you say from india, from an indian perspective , actually it really perspective, actually it really has taken hold there . has taken hold there. >> things have taken hold and things very fast things are moving in a very fast direction for the worse because now trans identified males are directed towards female prisons, female only prison estate men with their preferred gender identity are allowed to participate in any sports of their choice and there are puberty blockers and cross—sex hormones as part of training manuals for teachers who teach primary school children in school. >> and this is happening in india because all of those things you've described are happening here, and we've discussed a lot on discussed them a lot on the program. me program. it's a surprise to me to hear it's so it's so

to hear that it's so it's so widespread india. widespread in india. >> is surprise lot of >> it is a surprise to a lot of people well. consider us people as well. consider us being about five years behind you and more people you right. and with more people going through this process , going through this process, maybe resisting it at some point would probably create some awareness amongst people. yes but within this demography . but within this demography. right. you can imagine that these men, when they trans, identify the wives and the children that these men leave behind have absolutely no voice. they no voice here. they they have no voice here. they definitely don't have voice back they have no voice here. they definitandion't have voice back they have no voice here. they definitandion't difficultce back they have no voice here. they definitandion't difficult forjack home. and it is difficult for people to take this into consideration because you wouldn't about it. you wouldn't hear about it. you wouldn't hear about it. you wouldn't hear about general domestic violence cases in the first place. nobody cares about what happens to the wife, even in the generic domestic violence, not the neo domestic violence, not the neo domestic violence . we have about 470,000 violence. we have about 470,000 pending cases in the supreme court. we heard that is under domestic violence act 2005. but now trans identified males can claim recourse under this act, which is meant exclusively for females. and the chief justice

of india considers male and female not to be absolute concepts . concepts. >> absolutely fascinating. so you've made this film or are making this film. you're in the process of raising money to complete the film, but you yourself , complete the film, but you yourself, an acclaimed film maker in india , you've done all maker in india, you've done all this work, but you yourself have sort of been cancelled, haven't you, for taking interest in you, for taking an interest in this topic ? this topic? >> yeah, it happened because i apparently she wrote some tweets on twitter back when on my personal twitter back when nobody even aware that i nobody was even aware that i exist in the internet web sphere . but i exist in the internet web sphere . buti basically exist in the internet web sphere . but i basically made tweets about not wanting safe, safe spaces for women and how men shouldn't participate in women's sports . absolutely basic stuff. sports. absolutely basic stuff. boilerplate fairly standard views, just yeah, just, you know, standing up for women. you know, standing up for women. you know, classic feminism . but that know, classic feminism. but that was apparently absolutely horrible of me to say that. so there was a screening that was supposed to happen in new york by this organisation called polis project , by this organisation called polis project, and they

cancelled it, i think or cancelled it, i think 2 or 3 days before it because of my transphobic views. and they did not allow opportunity to not allow me an opportunity to speak it. they did not get speak about it. they did not get back persons who asked back to media persons who asked for comments. they just shut me out completely and that drove me to finding out about how deep it is in india, actually. and i doubled down on my activism to be honest. since then it was as if they shut me down and i just came out screaming out of it. >> well, i mean, i hear a lot of stories from from women who've beenin stories from from women who've been in that position where they've of they've been accused of transphobia bigotry transphobia or hatred or bigotry or even fascism even or even fascism for even expressing a view, a view or an interest in this area. but their response isn't to shut up. and i suppose that's the intended outcome people outcome, that it shuts people up, intimidates them. right. but not the in your case. well. not the case in your case. well. >> well, they tried, but because . because i. i'm by i don't know , by principle. i don't like bullies and misogyny is i just don't like listening to them . don't like listening to them. and if they try to shut me down, i will only scream further. yes.

and i used to write for a lot of indian media companies, but they've just stopped commissioning gigs to me they've just stopped comnnowyning gigs to me they've just stopped comnnow .|ing gigs to me they've just stopped comnnow . my gigs to me they've just stopped comn now . my filmsjigs to me they've just stopped comnnow . my films used) me they've just stopped comn now . my films used t0|e they've just stopped comnnow . my films used to be right now. my films used to be platformed in so many different places, but they don't even respond to my emails anymore. well, that not hinder my well, that does not hinder my you know, promotion of the films and everything . what i have and everything. what i have gained by losing these erstwhile friends is that i've gained a global sisterhood from around the world who have helped me to promote all my work. they champion all my work, and i'm truly grateful for that. it's as if was the if this cancellation was the best thing that happened to me. >> really? >> really? >> yes. >> yes. >> that's very interesting. so do you think that the way through and a lot of through all of this and a lot of people in your position and people are in your position and are but are worried about speaking is it going be speaking out, is it going to be global? going to be sort global? is it going to be a sort of network people resisting ? of network of people resisting? >> me, people are >> oh, trust me, people are afraid about this. afraid to speak out about this. even that's why there even in india. that's why there are very people challenging are very few people challenging this ideology. they are against it in principle , but they can't it in principle, but they can't put their name and their face out saying that they are

standing against it. and these people could be, you know, working organisations that working in organisations that promote in way promote gender ideology in a way that insurance companies provide full coverage for all sorts of gender ideology , surgeries like gender ideology, surgeries like double mastectomy , hysterectomy double mastectomy, hysterectomy and everything, and they provide you paid holidays to recuperate from these surgeries and things like that in american and british companies who have offices back home. also have this culture of having gender neutral toilets and things like that. so you have the forstater case here. you can say you are being discriminated for having jk views. we don't have that back there, so i can't oppose to wanting to use not wanting to use a mixed sex toilet because is because here we've got the legislation behind it. >> but, but it's not there in india. not yet. so what next for the film? you know, you want to complete film. what else do complete the film. what else do you have do? oh i want to you have to do? oh i want to finish this and i want to finish this film and i want to screen everywhere and want screen it everywhere and i want to scream at of my voice to scream at the top of my voice because have to take into because they have to take into account children account the wives and children of you hear of these men, because you hear the brave stories

the stunning and brave stories of men non—stop every day, of these men non—stop every day, all every channel all day in every channel in india, well. india, as well. >> the media has been , the >> the media has been, the academia has been. law and police have been. so if you want the voices of the wives and children to be taken seriously , children to be taken seriously, ihope children to be taken seriously, i hope that this film would come in handy. and you can say that there was a film that was made on this subject. well, if people wanted donate your film, wanted to donate to your film, the on the screen the website is on the screen right vaishnavi . right now, vaishnavi. >> very much for joining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank very much for joining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you�* much for joining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you so uch for joining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you so muchrjoining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you so much .joining right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you so much . and ng right now, vaishnavi. >> thank you so much . and next me. thank you so much. and next on free speech nation, we'll be discussing a worrying case in which a trans police officer hounded a free speech campaigner with abusive messages before eventually being dismissed. don't go away .

gb news radio. >> welcome back to free speech nation. later in the show, i'll be turning agony uncle with the

help of my panel, cressida wetton and josh howie to help you deal with your unfiltered dilemmas. you've got any dilemmas. so if you've got any problems, email us at problems, do email us at gbviews@gbnews.uk .com and we will do our best to answer your problems. a trans police officer has been dismissed after calling free speech campaigner harry miller, a woman beater and a over a period of 18 months. lindsay watson sent miller, himself a former police officer, over 1200 messages, abusing both him and his campaign group, fair cop. police misconduct panel was told that miller was the victim of this campaign because his views on gender identity were in direct contradiction to those of watson . so here to discuss this watson. so here to discuss this case, i'm joined by barrister sarah phillimore ihra. now you've had a run in with this police officer yourself, right? this is it sounds incredible, the idea that a serving police officer would be sending abuse given amount of time given the amount of time that the spend tweeting, the police spend tweeting, saying anyone online saying don't abuse anyone online because offence i >> well, the whole story is incredible . about 18 months ago, incredible. about 18 months ago, harry to chief

harry wrote to the chief constable of leicester police saying got problem. saying you've got a problem. a member your force is behaving member of your force is behaving in got the in this way. and he got the brush the chief brush off from the chief constable. problem. constable. not a problem. harry did in getting did actually succeed in getting lindsay watson arrested, but they then let the offence time out. it had a six month time limit, but so then came the misconduct hearing . and the misconduct hearing. and the really astonishing thing for me that was revealed the police that was revealed was the police admitted that they'd given watson the advice to tweet anonymously to carry on. >> so they'd said that specifically. i mean, that's incredible. yeah, that's i mean, fair cop. we should explain. fair cop is a is a group that stands up and says, no, the police should be impartial when it to ideological ideas. it comes to ideological ideas. and taken and they've clearly taken a side. what offended side. and that's what offended lindsay watson. side. and that's what offended linnright. atson. side. and that's what offended linn right. atson. correct side. and that's what offended linnright. atson. correct you, >> right. i need to correct you, andrew, obviously, andrew, because obviously, according andrew, because obviously, accorwe; andrew, because obviously, accorwe are is an anti—trans what we are is an anti—trans hate group who he's reported to the anti—terrorism unit. i think 60 times and with impeccable timing. the day i was reading about his misconduct hearing and his dismissed all the bar standards board sent me an email saying, do you like to know

we've just dismissed this complaint about you. so oh, how exciting clicked on it. it was from watson referring to from lindsay watson referring to when i appeared your show on when i appeared on your show on the 11th of june. >> and sorry about that, but yeah, notably you got off scot free. >> but it we were talking about the ideology, freedom of speech . the ideology, freedom of speech. and i said something like, i have a right not merely to criticise but to mock and to be offensive about this ideology . offensive about this ideology. erg yes, because it's both mockable and offensive. now, lindsay wrote to my lindsay watson wrote to my regulator to say that watching that made him nauseous and he shook for hours watching my show i >> yes, well, at least it's a reaction, i suppose so. >> either andrew he was lying about that in an attempt to get me disbarred or that really was his reaction. and remember, in june when he did this, he was still a serving police officer. yes. now, imagine if you were a woman making a complaint that you harassed for your you were being harassed for your gender critical views. and that's sent to your that's who gets sent to your door investigate . door to investigate. >> that's what's so >> well, that's what's so worrying. i mean, i don't know what's worrying, what's more worrying, actually.

the serving the idea that there's a serving police that police officer who has that reaction to just a tv show that they just off they could easily just turn off and watch or the and not watch or or the alternative, which is that they're cynically using alternative, which is that theyto cynically using alternative, which is that theyto and1ically using alternative, which is that theyto and get ly using this to try and get you disbarred. either way, disbarred. yeah, either way, it's situation. but it's a terrible situation. but lindsay watson has been dismissed has gone dismissed now and that has gone through. goodness for through. thank goodness for that. that abuse through. thank goodness for that stop. that abuse through. thank goodness for that stop. i that abuse through. thank goodness for that stop. i will that abuse through. thank goodness for that stop. i will assumeabuse through. thank goodness for that stop. i will assume so.se will stop. i will assume so. we'll hope so anyway. now i want to talk to you about another issue, sarah, because this week there a court case there was also a court case which seems to have kicked self—id out the back door. is that right? >> yes, it's confirming the earlier judgement from the scottish court about what was meant by sex in the equality act, saying that sex doesn't just mean biological sex, it means legal sex. >> so men with a grc come under the heading of sex in the equality act. and i think there's a real link between this and the lindsay watson case, because what that's done is okay, it's been quite clear and helpful that we know if you don't have a gender recognition certificate, you remain the sex that you were born. now that seems to have come to a shock to

quite lot of people. there's quite a lot of people. there's been obfuscation around been a lot of obfuscation around that i think that's that law. so i think that's actually helpful. i actually really helpful. and i say let's the obstacle the say let's make the obstacle the way it very clear way let's make it very clear here that a grc matters . so here that a grc matters. so you're going to need to start carrying it and showing on carrying it and showing it on demand , because my understanding demand, because my understanding of is if you have a grc, of the law is if you have a grc, then prima facie you're allowed in two female spaces unless it can be shown, there's a reason to exclude you. if you don't have a grc prima facia, you are excluded. it's very tricky this because of course a grc effectively it indulges in a kind of legal fiction . kind of legal fiction. >> so for the purposes of the law, treated the law, you're treated as the opposite of it opposite sex. but of course it doesn't biological doesn't negate biological reality . reality. >> it can never do that. >> it can never do that. >> this is why i say it's >> and this is why i say it's unked >> and this is why i say it's linked to lindsay watson, because it's really interesting linked to lindsay watson, becau back; really interesting linked to lindsay watson, becau back; rethe interesting linked to lindsay watson, becau back; rethe home sting linked to lindsay watson, becau back; rethe home office going back to the home office report gra report before the gra was written the time, there was written at the time, there was i think, 4000 trans identifying men 400 men and about 400 trans identifying . and it was identifying women. and it was very much a recognition that these are poor, unfortunate people . we must do our best to people. we must do our best to allow them to live their best lives, to comfortable as

lives, to feel comfortable as the want to be. now the people they want to be. now no consideration whatsoever of the impact that that might have on women. and that's very telling. so i think what has happened and is both the equality act and the gender recognition act have been built on that foundation is our primary goal is to help these poor people who are suffering, who wouldn't want that, who wouldn't want to do that, right. there's never any discussion impact discussion of the impact on women and what it's ended up doing the number of trans doing as the number of trans identifying increase , identifying men increase, increase, think is in increase, increase i think is in powered a group of men who by definition are mentally ill . and definition are mentally ill. and lindsey watson is a very good example of that. you've got example of that. if you've got somebody narcissistic who feels entire entitled to compel everybody else to do as they say , you're going to end up with a lindsey watson . and when that lindsey watson. and when that person is in uniform , when that person is in uniform, when that person is in uniform, when that person is in uniform, when that person is a police officer , person is a police officer, yeah, that's terrifying. >> but i have seen some gay and lesbian campaigners raise concerns judgement concerns about this judgement because they're saying that associations designed , associations that are designed, say, that say, a lesbian association, that they be forced by law to they will be forced by law to accept into association.

accept men into the association. is or they got is that right, or are they got that wrong? >> i saying, i reread the >> as i was saying, i reread the judgement on the train and i was quite by least quite happily struck by at least we've clarity now. no grc, we've got clarity now. no grc, you're not coming in. >> does mean sex for the >> so sex does mean sex for the purposes the equality act? purposes of the equality act? yes. biological yes. sex means both biological and sex. and legal sex. >> if you've got a grc, you've got the sex of a woman , if got the legal sex of a woman, if you're claiming that as a man. but thing but the really horrifying thing about judgement, i think a about the judgement, i think a lot of people have up on about the judgement, i think a lot equality) have up on about the judgement, i think a lot equality commission up on about the judgement, i think a lot equality commission gavenn about the judgement, i think a lot equality commission gave an the equality commission gave an example of why this biological and legal sex was a mistake and they gave a specific example of lesbian associations because what the court has ruled is if you are a man with a grc, you claim to be a legal lesbian and you can come into this lesbian group fully intact. as we know 80 to 90% of trans identifying men are. and you are suddenly a lesbian and the courtjust lesbian and the court just didn't dismiss that argument. ant from the statutory body , ant from the statutory body, which is there to assist with understanding the equality act. it dismissed it in a really

quite contemptuous way, saying it just couldn't understand the problem. >> can not understand the >> how can it not understand the problem that quite strai ghtfo nnard. >> straightfonnard. >> back the earlier >> we come back to the earlier point if all of this is point i made. if all of this is built foundation that built on the foundation that we're all of this for the we're doing all of this for the poon we're doing all of this for the poor, mostly men, the majority of men who feel so upset with the sex were born in. there the sex they were born in. there never been a culture of never has been a culture of thinking, well, hang on a minute. what the women? minute. what about the women? what who really, what about the women who really, really penises in really don't want penises in their spaces? >> the lesbians? exactly. >> the lesbians? well, exactly. >> the lesbians? well, exactly. >> i mean, i have sympathy >> i mean, i can have sympathy with who struggles with anyone who struggles in that feels can't that way and feels they can't live they live their life unless they present have present differently. i have total but the total sympathy for that. but the kind person who would kind of person who would say, well, going to remain an well, i'm going to remain an intact male go along to a intact male and go along to a lesbian, you know, speed dating event, which is what happened to jenny i have jenny watson recently. i have less sympathy that. less sympathy for that. >> sympathy and >> i've no sympathy at all. and it's frightening >> i've no sympathy at all. and it's if frightening >> i've no sympathy at all. and it's if that's frightening >> i've no sympathy at all. and it's if that's frighte like because if that's a man like lindsay watson , i mean, i'm told lindsay watson, i mean, i'm told that maybe reason the that maybe the reason that the police so police were backing off so quickly was that this person has caused a of trouble, caused a lot of trouble, particularly for female officers, had to work officers, that he had to work alongside and so that is the problem for us women . when

problem for us women. when you're getting men who maintain their testicles, their penis, who've gone through male puberty , inevitably , they are almost inevitably bigger and stronger than we are and we don't want them in our spaces. and it's not just a matter of safety. it's a matter of dignity and for lesbians, well, it's matter their well, it's a matter of their entire it? yes. entire existence, isn't it? yes. how got this how have we got to this stage where the only people who've been deemed worthy of consideration are men with a serious mental illness and the impact of their desire to compel everyone else to go along with them is just not been thought about. >> yeah, very well put. sarah phillimore, thanks so much for joining me tonight. really appreciate it . joining me tonight. really appreciate it. and joining me tonight. really appreciate it . and next joining me tonight. really appreciate it. and next on joining me tonight. really appreciate it . and next on free appreciate it. and next on free speech nation dancer and choreographer rosie kay will be here to tell us about a new organisation. she has co—founded freedom in the arts. sounds great. see you in a moment

welcome back to free speech nation. we're now going to talk about freedom in the arts. it's an organisation which will tackle what it describes as the culture of fear and intimidation in the creative industries. the group will offer support to artists who find themselves or their work cancelled and they will also be directed towards legal advice if necessary. the organisation has been co—founded by dancer and choreographer rosie kay, who joins me now. welcome to the show . welcome to the show. >> well, say welcome >> well, i should say welcome back to the show, rosie. >> a lot of people who watch the show have seen you the show will have seen you on the show will have seen you on the show talking your show before, talking about your story this came about. story and how this came about. very us very briefly, just just tell us what happened you. very briefly, just just tell us whil happened you. very briefly, just just tell us whil hap defending ou. very briefly, just just tell us whil hap defending women's >> i was defending women's rights own home with rights in my own home with a cast of dancers from my production that was about to open and they took offence and complained. and that escalated. and in the end, i resigned my own dance company. so i've spent about the past 18 months working legally to make sure i own all my work and my name and i set up

a new company and we've already been touring the uk. >> what's great that you've >> what's great is that you've actually done something. you've set up a new company, you're producing work again. you didn't allow to be cowed, but allow yourself to be cowed, but allow yourself to be cowed, but a people, they a lot of people, they just think, you know, if you if you have own company and you have your own company and you can cancelled from it, what can get cancelled from it, what what there for anyone else? >> well, that's and was >> well, that's it. and it was it just bizarre. and it was just so bizarre. and i sort fought my way through . sort of fought my way through. but one of but actually because i've one of the that spoken out the few people that spoken out in kind of stuck to in the arts and kind of stuck to like own beliefs and my own like my own beliefs and my own sort of saying that this is important needs be important and this needs to be talked became somewhat talked about. i became somewhat of, you know, a magnet for other people in the arts to come and talk to. and what i found out was horrific. and so i started to do like case studies and build sort of over like sort of 20, 30 people and just felt, i can't do this on my own anymore. ineed can't do this on my own anymore. i need some sort of umbrella organisation. so i'm not just organisation. so i'm notjust speaking on behalf of myself anymore. on behalf speaking on behalf of myself an other“. on behalf speaking on behalf of myself another artist. on behalf of other artist. >> really important because >> it's really important because it's not about gender it's not just about the gender issue. sorts of ways issue. there's all sorts of ways that you can you can tread on a landmine these days , which means

landmine these days, which means that an artist, you're landmine these days, which means thelonger an artist, you're landmine these days, which means thelonger ito artist, you're landmine these days, which means thelonger ito artist, yowork, right? >> that's right. and right? >> that's right . and actually, >> that's right. and actually, that's really interesting that's a really interesting part about freedom the arts about this. freedom in the arts is any issue that people is about any issue that people have been told. they're not allowed to do this or their work's been cancelled or their shows have been cancelled. or we've this kind we've also found out this kind of secret rules you're we've also found out this kind of allowedt rules you're we've also found out this kind of allowed to jles you're we've also found out this kind of allowed to put you're we've also found out this kind of allowed to put thingsyu're we've also found out this kind of allowed to put things inside not allowed to put things inside your yes. so it can be your own work. yes. so it can be your own work. yes. so it can be your beliefs or it can be actually the work you make. so there's like there's an atmosphere of like extreme censorship going on on all levels . artists are doing all levels. artists are doing it, gatekeepers are doing it. producers are doing it. so the art is going to suffer. >> so, i mean, that's one of the other things about the artist is they should thinkers, they should be free thinkers, right? a healthy artistic right? and in a healthy artistic society, surely have lots right? and in a healthy artistic soldifferentely have lots right? and in a healthy artistic soldifferent types have lots right? and in a healthy artistic soldifferent types of have lots right? and in a healthy artistic soldifferent types of views lots of different types of views being represented and explored and interrogated. being represented and explored ancoh,5rrogated. being represented and explored ancoh, yes;ated. being represented and explored ancoh, yes .|ted. being represented and explored ancoh, yes. soi. being represented and explored ancoh, yes. so i wish i mean, >> oh, yes. so i wish i mean, i think the arts are also particularly vulnerable. yeah they have less security in terms of their contracts. there's also much less legislation. it's not like the universal, his free speech kind of act that's come in. we don't have that. and

actually the even the legislation around freedom of expression is unclear. we are allowed to shock , disgust and allowed to shock, disgust and offend . yes. but even under offend. yes. but even under article ten of the european convention , there are convention, there are protections around national security or protections around morality . so it's really morality. so it's really difficult. and people in the arts, artists and arts organisations don't get any kind of legal training. well, it's so difficult. >> it's not like a regular job where you go in 9 to 5 and you know, if there's a dispute then there's tribunal, etcetera. there's a tribunal, etcetera. in there's a tribunal, etcetera. in the arts, if you have an opinion that considered unpopular or that is considered unpopular or unfashionable, that is considered unpopular or unfa well, able, that is considered unpopular or unfawell,able, won't put say, well, we just won't put them just won't cast them on or we just won't cast them on or we just won't cast them or we just won't commission them. and isn't really them. and so there isn't really sometimes can council sometimes you can be council without sometimes you can be council witiabsolutely. there's a lot of >> absolutely. there's a lot of ghosting on. and ghosting that goes on. and i think, let's be honest, artists just the just don't really have the sensitivity sensibilities to deal most deal with that. i think most artists concerned artists are very much concerned with what they're doing and they're heart and with what they're doing and they'ron heart and with what they're doing and they'ron stage heart and with what they're doing and they'ron stage to heart and with what they're doing and they'ron stage to be heart and with what they're doing and they'ron stage to be judged|d with what they're doing and they'ron stage to be judged by souls on stage to be judged by the that's not the public. but that's not they're even getting their they're not even getting their work out there anymore. that's not happening. work out there anymore. that's notand pening. work out there anymore. that's notand penin you work out there anymore. that's not and penin you get work out there anymore. that's notand penin you get idea >> and then you get to the idea of self—censorship, you know, >> and then you get to the idea of self—nansorship, you know, >> and then you get to the idea of self—nans0|ofip, you know,

>> and then you get to the idea of self—nans0|of artists know, >> and then you get to the idea of self—nans0|of artists are ww, because a lot of artists are thinking, i produce because a lot of artists are tipiecej, i produce because a lot of artists are tipiece that i produce because a lot of artists are tipiece that explores produce because a lot of artists are tipiece that explores thisiuce because a lot of artists are tipiece that explores this sense a piece that explores this sense of issue, say, then it just won't get put on get a bad won't get put on i'll get a bad name. i won't be commissioned anymore. >> and you don't know what is >> and you don't know what it is that's going to explode that's actually going to explode and massive it and become this massive risk. it could actually anything. i could be actually anything. so i think what i've discovered could be actually anything. so i th that what i've discovered could be actually anything. so i th that the what i've discovered could be actually anything. so i th that the arts i've discovered could be actually anything. so i th that the arts are) discovered could be actually anything. so i th that the arts are just:overed could be actually anything. so i th that the arts are just avered is that the arts are just a place of absolute fear . fear and place of absolute fear. fear and loathing is how one senior leader described it . and so the leader described it. and so the that censoring on all aspects and all levels and it's very unpleasant. i mean, nobody's making lots of money doing this. no, they're doing it because they want to and that's being destroyed. they want to and that's being desthis�*d. they want to and that's being desthis all feels like it's >> this all feels like it's happened very quickly. >> insofar as i remember works of art. i'll an example. i of art. i'll give an example. i saw show by a company saw a show by a dance company called i'm sure you're called dv8, who i'm sure you're familiar years ago familiar with many years ago called. this, called. can we talk about this, which homophobe which was about a homophobe phobia muslim phobia within the muslim community? that's a very sensitive, hot topic , but it did sensitive, hot topic, but it did it really well. it was challenging. interesting. challenging. it was interesting. it a it was well researched. a brilliant performed. like brilliant performed. i feel like something that would something like that would struggle to on. struggle to get on. >> interesting . >> it's interesting. >> it's interesting. >> that's one of the case studies index on censorship

studies that index on censorship looked and lloyd newson studies that index on censorship looked signed loyd newson studies that index on censorship looked signed ayd newson studies that index on censorship looked signed a letternson studies that index on censorship looked signed a letter tom actually signed a letter to support freedom in the arts. he's talked me lot about he's talked to me a lot about how that actually, i think, was a warning sign that was very difficult for him to put that work. >> oh, it? i didn't realise. >> oh, was it? i didn't realise. >> oh, was it? i didn't realise. >> i think that was sort >> and so i think that was sort of around time. it's been of around that time. it's been building ten years building up for about ten years and then i think with everything that's like we've that's happened, like we've talked you've talked talked about, you've talked about different about lots of different other organisations and industries have become captured. the arts actually have gone for it absolutely full hard. you know, there has been no dissent, very little anyway. >> but with freedom in the arts, you know, there's question you know, there's the question of self—censorship, then of self—censorship, but then there's of there's also the question of people explicitly people who are explicitly cancelled. spoke to cancelled. you know, i spoke to james who james dreyfuss on this show who had image removed had his name and image removed from project from a doctor who project because his opinions, which because of his opinions, which should happen . will be should never happen. will you be able people that? able to help people like that? >> we're to try . >> yeah, and we're going to try. we don't have our own like sort of legal department, but we do know people that can help advise and we know where to signpost people think the one side people to. i think the one side is looking artists is like looking after artists and helping them. the other is kind to arts

kind of going to arts organisations and saying, should you putting out big you really be putting out big political is that political statements? is that really your role? what's in your articles memorandums? what's articles and memorandums? what's the of your artistic the purpose of your artistic organisation ? and if that is organisation? and if that is around excellence and freedom of expression, then you need to be robust in defending that and finally, rosie, do you have an optimistic view of where the arts go in the future? arts will go in the future? >> do you know? >> do you know? >> i do. i really do. and i think it's going to be around changing that like changing training so that like kind old fashioned kind of like those old fashioned skills terribly skills that are terribly unfashionable moment. skills that are terribly unfastcomele moment. skills that are terribly unfastcomele i moment. skills that are terribly unfastcomele i think nent. skills that are terribly unfastcomele i think there those come back. i think there may a renaissance after this. may be a renaissance after this. once you it down, can't once you shut it down, it can't help again. once you shut it down, it can't hel fantastic. again. >> fantastic. >> fantastic. >> rosie thank so >> rosie cave, thank you so much. you. thank you. much. thank you. thank you. >> . >> thank you. >> thank you. >> and that's the end of the first hour on free speech nation. but please don't go anywhere. there is an awful lot to come between now and 9:00. me and my panel will taken. more and my panel will be taken. more questions this lovely questions from this lovely studio we're studio audience and also we're going to hear from the activist known as billboard chris, we're also going to have your unfiltered dilemma. so if you've

got any problems, please make sure email in sure that you email in gbviews@gbnews.com and we'll do our best to solve all of your issues. so don't go anywhere. we will back shortly . will be back shortly. >> hello there. i'm jonathan vautrey here with your gb news weather forecast provided by the met office. are a few showers to watch out throughout this bonfire night, particularly for western areas. there could be still times pushing still heavy at times pushing their in across particularly their way in across particularly north—west west and north—west england, west and wales bristol wales through the bristol channel western areas channel as well. western areas of not escaping either of scotland, not escaping either into the second half of the night. just a few night. we could just see a few beginning skirt way beginning to skirt their way into kent. lot into sussex and kent. but a lot of other eastern areas will remain largely dry with some clear that, clear intervals underneath that, some possible. some mist and fog possible. it will relatively will also turn relatively chilly, so for chilly, particularly so for eastern we eastern scotland, where we can expect frost. quite a expect some frost. so quite a chilly the new working chilly start to the new working week here. but as head into week here. but as we head into monday, is a of sunshine monday, it is a day of sunshine and for many. those and showers for many. those showers most frequent in the west. perhaps a few west. once again, perhaps a few rumbles thunder, maybe some rumbles of thunder, maybe some hail heaviest ones as hail in those heaviest ones as well the afternoon, just well into the afternoon, just starting those showers starting to see those showers progressing of

progressing to eastern areas of england. with us, england. but still with us, a good amount of sunshine in between temperatures between them. temperatures around fairly around 10 to 13 c. so fairly pleasant if you are in those sunnier spots . but tuesday, it sunnier spots. but tuesday, it will again start relatively showery. but we've got this ridge of high pressure that's going its way in going to be moving its way in dunng going to be moving its way in during that will during the day that will gradually help to ease off the showers, particularly for western as we head into showers, particularly for wes afternoon. as we head into showers, particularly for wes afternoon. so we head into showers, particularly for wes afternoon. so turningi into showers, particularly for wesafternoon. so turning dryo the afternoon. so turning dry air again, some sunny air here. again, some sunny intervals out for and intervals to watch out for and enjoy are out and about. enjoy if you are out and about. the also easing off the winds also easing off throughout the day as well . as throughout the day as well. as we wednesday, though, we head into wednesday, though, there band there is a more persistent band of will be sweeping of rain that will be sweeping its the uk. then into its way across the uk. then into thursday, the showers return once again. enjoy your evening by by join us every night on gb news at 11 pm. for headlines, which is three top comedians going through the next day's news stories which is exactly what you need because when the established moment gone established moment has gone crazy, need some craziness crazy, you need some craziness to sense it . to make sense of it. >> so join us 11 pm. every night on gb news. the people's channel night on gb news. the people's channel, news channel

will. >> there's plenty more still to come on free speech nation this week, including social sensation as unfiltered dilemmas and more questions from our lovely studio audience. >> but first, let's get a news update with ray addison . update with ray addison. >> good evening. i'm ray addison in the newsroom. our top stories tonight. boris johnson has urged israel's allies to stay the course in their support for israel in its war against hamas . israel in its war against hamas. the former prime minister toured some of the communities attacked by terrorists on the 7th of october. in an exclusive interview with our security editor, mark white, he said he was horrified by what he saw and called on the international community to remember those events . events. >> look at what happened . and >> look at what happened. and remember, this was sadism. this was an orgy of brutality and

torture against innocent people. people were chased around the rooms in their houses and shot. now, there's a difference between that and what the israel soldiers are now trying to do in gaza. so to your soldiers are now trying to do in gaza. soto your your soldiers are now trying to do in gaza. so to your your point, gaza. soto your your point, mark, about what the international community needs to remember here is the difference between what israel experienced, the terrorist attack and what they're trying to do now, what they're trying to do now, what they're trying to do now is make sure that never happens again . sure that never happens again. >> and you can see more of that exclusive interview with boris johnson tomorrow from breakfast at six and throughout the day on gb news. the rafah crossing did not reopen today despite foreign office hopes that more britons could escape from gaza . earlier, could escape from gaza. earlier, first minister humza yousaf posted a photo showing his in—laws who arrived back in scotland after being trapped in the strip for more than three weeks. egypt decided to suspend evacuations following a deadly

attack on an ambulance . s the attack on an ambulance. s the met. police say six people have now been charged after 29 arrests at pro—palestine protests in central london. it comes as the prime minister and the home secretary expressed concerns about further demonstrations during armistice day met police commissioner sir mark rowley has promised to take a robust approach to ensure the commemorative events are not undermined. deputy pm oliver dowden saying that armistice day should be about honouring the sacrifices made by previous generations . generations. >> i have really grave concerns about this and i think that certainly representing a large jewish community as i do, but it's broader than the jewish community. we should be honounng community. we should be honouring and respecting the sacrifice made by previous generations. and we certainly shouldn't have the kind of intimidation that you see in those marches . those marches. >> and thames water has declared a major incident as thousands of homes in godalming and surrey

have been left without water due to the effects of storm ciaran . to the effects of storm ciaran. the bad weather conditions caused issues at shalford. water treatment works thames water say they're working to restore suppues they're working to restore supplies to the area and in the meantime they're providing bottled water. gb news understands some local stores have started to sell out as residents go to buy their own . residents go to buy their own. this is gb news across the uk on tv in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker by saying play gb news let's go back now to free speech nation . back now to free speech nation. >> welcome back to free speech nation. so let's get some more questions from our wonderful audience. our first question is from sandy . hi, sandy. hi from sandy. hi, sandy. hi >> is from sandy. hi, sandy. hi >>isjk from sandy. hi, sandy. hi >> is jk rowling right to criticise new south australian rules ? rules? >> yeah, i enjoyed this.

>> yeah, i enjoyed this. >> i was watching in real time jk rowling just going at this one and she was absolutely right to do so. so in south australia now are rules saying now there are new rules saying that system, they're that the court system, they're basically suggesting that people should preferred pronoun should use the preferred pronoun of the person, even if that's someone's attacker. this is an absolute mean, means courts absolute i mean, it means courts and judges are basically saying to two defendants, you have to lie on the i mean, you've just sworn an oath that you're going to tell the truth , the whole to tell the truth, the whole truth, and now they're telling you to lie. >> gaslighting on insane >> it's gaslighting on an insane scale. beyond that , that you scale. but beyond that, that you should to care about the should have to care about the feelings attacker . right? >> exactly. >> exactly. >> it's disgusting. it makes no sense all. buti mean, just sense at all. but i mean, just on say, it on and people say, well, it wouldn't happen it kind of wouldn't happen here. it kind of has. you know, we've already had judges should judges say, well, you should do this, making this, or at least making that statement advising, know i >> absolutely. and once we've had the isla bryson situation, men and women's prisons, i mean, that's very clearly saying that it's slightly different. but i mean, it is as josh says, it's just and it's from the just absurd. and it's from the be brigade. just absurd. and it's from the be bbut de. just absurd. and it's from the be bbut why are they

>> yeah, but why are they infecting courts? infecting the courts? why are the why it go the judiciary why does it go that far? >> you know, because i'm >> you know, because well, i'm sure person goes home. this sure this person goes home. this judge, good judge, and feels really good about yeah doesn't about themselves. yeah doesn't think about actual. you think about the actual. you expect judges, don't expect more from judges, don't you? i know you say, oh, >> i mean, i know you say, oh, they don't think properly. i really thought judges were there to thought was to think. i thought that was one of the features. >> wonder if within >> i wonder if it's within australia. part of it's australia. it's part of it's like back. there's that like the push back. there's that idea of australian as a sort of crocodile dundee sort of masculine thing. and this is their push back, you know, the swing just be further. swing just it might be further. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> like in ireland, i mean you know, they've sort of really tried leave behind their sort tried to leave behind their sort of catholic past, they've of catholic past, but they've gone the way gone completely the other way with ideology. it's with the woke ideology. it's almost need almost like they need a religious need belief religious they need belief system a little too far. system a little bit too far. anyway, we're to get anyway, we're going to get a question peter. where's question now from peter. where's peter? hi, peter. hi. >> suella braverman an >> is suella braverman an heartless . heartless. >> what a question . peter, what >> what a question. peter, what do you think? do you think she's heartless? >> i don't know. that's why i asked you. yeah. >> no. good. good good answer. >> no. good. good good answer. >> is because she's posted >> this is because she's posted on twitter suella braverman on on twitter suella braverman

has we will always support has said we will always support those homeless those who are genuinely homeless , genuinely homeless. but we cannot streets to be cannot allow our streets to be taken rows of tents taken over by rows of tents occupied many from occupied by people, many from abroad the streets as abroad living on the streets as abroad living on the streets as a lifestyle choice. i think that's the phrase has upset people. >> she might not be heartless, but got terrible way but she's got a terrible way with hasn't yeah i'm with words, hasn't she? yeah i'm a fan of mark laters youtube a big fan of mark laters youtube channel, him filming channel, which is him filming people all in who are on the people all in la who are on the streets. yes. and it's really horrific , the problem over horrific, the problem over there. see the logic there. so i can see the logic of, hey, we don't want to go that far. >> yes. what do think about >> yes. what do you think about thiswell, we've got bad weather >> well, we've got bad weather here. >> yeah. okay >> yeah. okay >> it's just not it's not going to same way, that to be the same way, though. that footage seattle, san footage of seattle, of san francisco is terrifying. it's like and like a hellscape. yeah. and i can understand. yeah. the desire to it, but the point to not make it, but the point about that legislation about that kind of legislation is, is are you actually going to provide a viable alternative if you are and you're to going be able to get people off the street, then surely that's great. not dealing great. but we're not dealing with lifestyle there with lifestyle changes. there are people. it's mental are a lot of people. it's mental health issues. well, there's that. >> but i kind of just i've

>> but i kind ofjust i've always that, you we always felt that, you know, we can't civilised can't be a civilised society where homeless where there are homeless people. i why why there i don't understand why why there should be. should ever be. >> deal with the >> they managed to deal with the problem during so it's >> they managed to deal with the proble resources. so it's about resources. >> yeah, must be a way to >> yeah, there must be a way to deal with this. i mean, surely. and understand that the and i understand that the homeless worst and i understand that the home you worst and i understand that the homeyou can worst and i understand that the homeyou can do worst and i understand that the homeyou can do give worst and i understand that the homeyou can do give moneyt thing you can do is give money to that's not to homeless people. that's not what be doing. what you should be doing. >> give them >> got to give them drugs straight away. well, exactly. >> this is the point. you straight away. well, exactly. >> thisactuallyioint. you straight away. well, exactly. >> thisactually be t. you straight away. well, exactly. >> thisactually be giving ou should actually be giving money to that's the way to the charities. that's the way that's the to do it, you that's the way to do it, you know, there a way to know, but there must be a way to solve anyway. i'm solve this crisis anyway. i'm sure back to at sure we'll come back to that at some point. we've a question some point. we've got a question now tim. tim hello, tim. now from tim. tim hello, tim. >> week, britain's >> hello. this week, britain's loneliest by loneliest sheep was rescued by local should all local farmers. should we all celebrate more? lamb celebrate by eating more? lamb tim, you are brutal. >> you're a brutal, tim, you are brutal. >> you're a brutal , brutal >> you're a brutal, brutal carnivore. i'm outraged. britain's loneliest sheep. and i saw this sheep. it was a down a mountain, right? for over two years. yes and there's the sheep on our screens now. >> couldn't be. he is not fat. >> couldn't be. he is not fat. >> it's wool. it's wool. don't fat shame the sheep. so it was there. it was at the bottom of

this cliff and apparently it was really difficult to get to the sheep. so it was there for over two years. they just had to leave in the end they got leave it and in the end they got like and it up. like a winch and pulled it up. but we don't. the but look, we don't. maybe the sheep being you sheep was happy being alone, you know, sheep was know, maybe the sheep was a loner. people enjoy solitude. >> unlikely, really. don't >> unlikely, really. i don't think being think sheeps are known for being introverts. no . they like to introverts. no, no. they like to be in group. i was so happy be in a group. i was so happy about this. i thought. fantastic it's been saved. today it's been saved. and then today it's been saved. and then today i animal rights charity i saw an animal rights charity moaning this because the moaning about this because the sheep's a farm. um. sheep's been sent to a farm. um. right. a sanctuary. right. rather than a sanctuary. and it's not even that it's going to get slaughtered. it's that it's a petting farm. >> and they think so what do they want for the sheep? >> sheep to have >> they want the sheep to have a sanctuary somewhere peaceful. where? because it has a few weeks at butlins. >> kind of thing. and >> yes, that kind of thing. and i because i was delighted. >> i thought, oh, the sheep's been rescued. how lovely. we can >> i thought, oh, the sheep's beesleepzued. how lovely. we can >> i thought, oh, the sheep's beesleep better ow lovely. we can >> i thought, oh, the sheep's beesleep better tonight. y. we can >> i thought, oh, the sheep's beesleep better tonight. yeah can all sleep better tonight. yeah apparently feel good apparently there's a i feel good for i don't know for the sheep, but i don't know what sheep that what more sheep aren't that demanding . demanding. >> think. think be >> i think. i think it'll be fine a petting fine with a petting zoo. >> mean, a >> possibly. i mean, it's a shame. loneliest sheep are the

tastiest sheep. >> honestly speaking, as a vegetarian, i'm absolutely outraged at all of you. and. and you, tim. vile creature . okay, you, tim. vile creature. okay, so let's move on. have we got another question? yes. this one is from tommy. tommy hi, tommy. hi. a&e. and your brother , hi. hi. a&e. and your brother, of course. yes. what's your question? >> will cigarette style warnings , signs on we . on the meat , signs on we. on the meat packaging save the planet? >> well, you know, this is an interesting one. the meat packaging . i read about this packaging. i read about this this week because, you know, they used to put they still do, don't they put these warnings on cigarette packets? very alarmist with and with pictures of lungs and all sorts saying sorts of stuff saying don't smoke this happen smoke because this will happen to they're saying, to you. and now they're saying, well, research from well, these are research from durham university are saying they for meat. they should do this for meat. but meat products are but images on meat products are discouraging people because it will global will say, you know, the global warming you know, warming will happen. you know, is a picture of a globe is it just a picture of a globe on fire? and this kind of is that going if you know, that going to if you you know, if got like a meat if someone's got like a meat product, know enjoy. product, which i know you enjoy. lamb lonely . lamb say lonely. lamb lonely. lamb say lonely. lamb lonely. lamb be happy would if it had a sort of graphic warning of what

you were doing planet, you were doing to the planet, would from would you be dissuaded from eating that? no . you see, eating that? lamb no. you see, this is the problem . this is the problem. >> i mean, libertarian jedward over there . but it's appreciate over there. but it's appreciate it. but yeah, whether we do have to cut down on our our our meat consumption. yes. well, it's interesting i thought was that it was the images of the planet that caused the greatest decline of meat use as opposed to your health. like if you had a picture of sort of a chicken vindaloo aftermath vindaloo and then the aftermath of, oh, josh , that might help . of, oh, josh, that might help. >> wow. >> wow. >> i mean, the thing about this is people love their meat and they, you know, and, you know, and i've got friends who shouldn't eat meat, bacon, for instance, reasons , instance, for religious reasons, but they still do really, because they just love it too much. >> i've never got i'm veggie like i'm not like you and i'm not i'm not a fan of the smell of bacon. i couldn't care less vegetarians. i don't i don't think it's going to work. so these images it's not it's like pictures from

michael jackson's earth song, isn't it? it's always that kind of scorched earth. >> yeah, that kind of thing. >> yeah, that kind of thing. >> yeah, that kind of thing. >> yeah, exactly. >> yeah, exactly. >> i mean, if you put a picture of kate moss on the fridge, you don't weight, yeah. don't lose weight, do you? yeah. >> of like that. >> it's kind of like that. >> it's kind of like that. >> don't know. >> i don't know. >> i don't know. >> i don't think it'll work >> no, i don't think it'll work either, to be honest. but, you know, as well give it try. know, may as well give it a try. we a question alan. we got a question now from alan. where's we got a question now from alan. whime; we got a question now from alan. whime again. oh, you again. i've >> me again. oh, you again. i've got all the best. >> very keen. go on. >> very keen. alan, go on. what's your question? >> something josh >> well, this is something josh actually, we touched on earlier on. yes. with of islam on. yes. with the party of islam attempting to register with the electoral commission this week. they failed , but only on a few they failed, but only on a few technicalities. when they do actually that process done actually get that process done properly, how is that going to affect labour's chance of winning the general election? yeah, i mean, interesting , yeah, i mean, it's interesting, this one. yeah, i mean, it's interesting, thiss0|e. yeah, i mean, it's interesting, thisso the party of did >> so the party of islam did have its application rejected , have its application rejected, but where does that leave labour? i mean, you were talking about labour effectively making about labour effectively making a effort to make sure that a real effort to make sure that they've the muslim vote they've got the muslim vote wrapped was wrapped up. but if there was a party of islam that would split that vote, presumably i yeah, i

believe so. >> and i'd, i think it's good that we have don't have a proportional really. >> why. >> why. >> well no , i just i it would be >> well no, i just i it would be interesting to see if people are going to vote along tribal you know there are there are left wing jewish people. i know there are right wing jewish people. i know i wouldn't vote for the jewish party, the jewish part. >> point, isn't >> but that's the point, isn't it? comfortable with it? i feel more comfortable with the , and the idea of religion, and politics of kept politics is kind of kept separate. that's because separate. yeah, that's because i believe secularism believe in secularism and i think defends freedoms. >> the question do you >> the question is, how do you define because there's define islam? because there's political islam, which is the sikh and that is sikh ing sharia law, and that is sort of one of the definitions. >> would would the party of islam pushing for sharia law? islam be pushing for sharia law? presumably i'd presumably as the spokesman, i'd like say. like to say. >> yeah, well, surely eventually i >>i >> i mean, how could be any >> i mean, how could it be any other way? >> the problem, isn't >> but that's the problem, isn't it? know. it? you know. >> i agree with >> but yes, i agree with you. >> but yes, i agree with you. >> i don't these two >> i don't think these two things should be. >> also a democrat. and >> i'm also a democrat. and i think that anyone should be allowed their allowed to set up their own political and not political parties. and i'm not threatened by multiple small

political unlike political parties. and i unlike josh, there should be josh, i think there should be proportional josh, i think there should be proporticl'm democrat. think josh, i think there should be pro need i'm democrat. think josh, i think there should be pro need tot democrat. think josh, i think there should be pro need to put)emocrat. think josh, i think there should be pro need to put amocrat. think josh, i think there should be pro need to put a caveat think josh, i think there should be pro need to put a caveat tthat we need to put a caveat on that and say. >> but based religion. >> but not based on religion. >> but not based on religion. >> because i can't say >> no, because i can't say i support political parties as long agree me or as long as they agree with me or as long as they agree with me or as long as they don't offend me, it makes easier. long as they don't offend me, it ma well, easier. long as they don't offend me, it ma well, suppose easier. long as they don't offend me, it ma well, suppose itasier. long as they don't offend me, it ma well, suppose it does. >> well, i suppose it does. >> well, i suppose it does. >> suppose it does. but it's >> i suppose it does. but it's an interesting, interesting question. we've a question. anyway so we've got a question. anyway so we've got a question now from gillian. gillian what's gillian hi, gillian. hi. what's your how the have >> how how come the wheels have completely off the completely fallen off the engush completely fallen off the english what's english cricket team? what's going on? gillian? >> you this >> i'm glad you asked me this because know , i'm a huge because as you know, i'm a huge fan cricket. if that's the fan of cricket. if that's the one with the bats, it ? one with the bats, isn't it? >> got wheels >> gillian they've got wheels now . now. >> have they got wheels well? >> have they got wheels as well? what's on? are what's going on? gillian are you going in on going to have to fill me in on this? what's. what's going wrong with cricket team? with the england cricket team? >> problem that >> maybe that's the problem that no knows what's no one in england knows what's going on. well that's right. >> know. don't. >> we don't know. we don't. are you fan, then? you a cricket cricket fan, then? i am. >> yes, i am. >> yes, i am. >> yeah. but you're australian. yes, so there yes, you are. yeah. so there aren't australia than aren't australia better than us at that how it at cricket. is that not how it works? usually. okay. so works? usually. usually okay. so why wheels ? josh, why have the wheels? josh, you're a guy. you're a sporty guy. >> wonder deliberate >> i wonder if it's a deliberate plan the commonwealth

going. >> like we send out a rubbish engush >> like we send out a rubbish english football cricket team and then the rest sophia and all these different countries just feel, oh, poor old england . feel, oh, poor old england. >> have they lost this week or something? they don't something? are they don't have they lost big game they have they lost a big game have they came last. have lost. they came last. that's bad. even i know that they got a women players they got a lot of women players after netherlands howie after the netherlands josh howie unbelievable in the women's team he's so offensive. cressida, what do you think ? what do you think? >> i've heard of cricket. i'm not familiar with its work. i thought that it happened in the summer time. maybe the game has gone on a really long time or it's somewhere else. >> hotter in australia >> no, it's hotter in australia at moment, apparently. >> no, it's hotter in australia at yeah.)ment, apparently. >> no, it's hotter in australia at yeah. good, apparently. >> no, it's hotter in australia at yeah. good luck.arently. >> yeah. good luck. >> yeah. good luck. >> in india. it's in >> oh, it's in india. it's in india. >> in india. >> in india. >> but it's in india too, >> but it's hotter in india too, i look are out i think. oh look we are way out of depth. of our depth. >> we have idea what we're >> we have no idea what we're talking in this basement. talking about in this basement. >> if there's no cricket down here, won't know about. here, i won't know about. >> something >> maybe that's something we should right. should take up. all right. anyway, free speech anyway, next on free speech nation, to be talking nation, i'm going to be talking some the some more about the pro—palestine planned some more about the pro londonine planned some more about the pro london ine weekend anned some more about the pro londonine weekend andid for london next weekend and the free speech issues concerned.

see you shortly .

radio show. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle, a pro—palestine rally has been organised for saturday, november the 11th in central london. >> estimates suggest that tens of thousands of people will assemble and the timing , of assemble and the timing, of course, is not accidental . course, is not accidental. november the 11th is armistice day. some have suggested the march has been scheduled to ensure maximum publicity . well, ensure maximum publicity. well, we're talking about it, we're already talking about it, so that's case, job done. so if that's the case, job done. but many have interpreted the choice of as a declaration but many have interpreted the ch contempt as a declaration but many have interpreted the ch contempt foris a declaration but many have interpreted the ch contempt for british :laration but many have interpreted the ch contempt for british valuest of contempt for british values and history. certainly the pro—palestine marches so far have been heavily populated by what we might call intersectional activists , those intersectional activists, those with pronouns in their bios , a with pronouns in their bios, a tendency to treat disagreement as a form of violence and a general disdain for western

civilisation and all that. it has accomplished. these are has accomplished. but these are strange bedfellows in many ways. as one activist who attempted to raise the progress pride flag soon discovered in this footage, you can see that some other protesters took offence and tore the flag down. and why? well, because same sex activity is illegal in gaza and gay people there know better than to be out and proud . and indeed, we know and proud. and indeed, we know that there is a real problem with homophobia within the islamic community. even here in the uk. a poll for channel 4 in 2016 found that a little over half of british muslims believe that homosexuals ought to be against the law, not merely that they disapprove of it, but that they disapprove of it, but that they wanted it criminalised . and they wanted it criminalised. and activists at the time were quick to brush this off, claiming there was nothing to worry about, and they were thereby, of course, siding with the most reactionary ultra reactionary and ultra conservative elements of the islamic community at the expense of gay muslims . and this has of gay muslims. and this has always been the case. while unbelievably brave women in iran

are risking their lives , are risking their lives, throwing off their veils and burning them in the street, some western commentator are claiming that the hijab is empowering and even a feminist symbol. these are what we call luxury beliefs. and this weekend , another left and this weekend, another left wing activist found himself colliding with the brick wall of reality as he tried to explain to his pro—palestine allies that kids could be trans. >> nobody is trying to propagate anti—lgbt anti—lgbtq propaganda. he's trying to tell children that they are not allowed to be trans at all, yet they're not. >> come on, bro. no, no, no , no. >> come on, bro. no, no, no, no. punish run as a man. >> stop talking religion. you can't do that. you have to respect that decision. but in legend. >> yes , an awkward situation . >> yes, an awkward situation. >> yes, an awkward situation. >> i'm sure you'll agree. but then this ideology that has infected so many on the left doesn't have for space nuance or complexities. these activists

are reading from a script not thinking for themselves, and they are baffled when the minorities they support express prejudices of their own. and so we can expect to see many of these pro lgbtq+ identity obsessed britain bashing activists, turning up at the protest on november the 11th not because they have a secure understanding of the war in the middle east, but because it's what they're expected to do. they'll chanting the usual they'll be chanting the usual slogans like the in this slogans like the people in this video london tube just video on the london tube just yesterday go to the scene. >> homicide will be free. there is only one solution on the revolution . revolution. >> intifada . can it be the case >> intifada. can it be the case that they don't understand the implications of these phrases? the term intifada is most commonly associated with the suicide bombings and other terrorist attacks committed in israel in the 1990s and early 2000. and yet activists are now pretending these connotations don't exist just as they are pretending that from the to

river the sea is a harmless phrase calling for equal rights . phrase calling for equal rights. well, here's a protester holding a banner with the phrase from the river to the sea accompanied by an image that celebrates the terrorist atrocities of hamas on october the 7th. so why does no one at that protest complain ? one at that protest complain? why does no one tell him to take it down? why is it tolerated? why or for that matter, aren't the protesters denouncing hamas publicly , given that this is the publicly, given that this is the terrorist group that boasts about using innocent palestinian as human shields ? one person as human shields? one person held up a placard pointing out that hamas, a terrorist and was attacked by protesters and was pulled away by police . pulled away by police. >> hamas terrorists . we . >> hamas terrorists. we. just so why did that happen? >> i mean, surely if the protesters are pro—palestine , protesters are pro—palestine, they would oppose hamas, given

that the group represents such a major threat to the people of gaza, of course, any decent person will be horrified by the deaths of innocent civilians in gaza and calls for a ceasefire make complete sense. but why aren't these protesters therefore calling on hamas to release the hostages and thereby thereby make a ceasefire possible? which brings us on to the question of what we can do about the protest planned on november the 11th. many are calling for the protest to be banned. rishi sunak sunak has stopped short of a ban , but has stopped short of a ban, but has called on the met police to make robust use of its powers to prevent the remembrance events being disrupted. and yet a people polling survey for gb news has found that almost half of the population believe the march should not be allowed to go ahead. other jews have been calling for deportation , but calling for deportation, but this isn't the solution and liberal values are always hard to maintain in times of crisis. it's very easy to solve our problems through authoritarian means , to resort to censorship, means, to resort to censorship, to deport those citizens we

disapprove of or yes, to ban protests. but by doing so, we effectively surrender our principles to the very people who do not value them at all. why give them that much power ? why give them that much power? some of the sentiments i've seen expressed by these protesters are genuinely disgusting and disturbing. and to see them declared on the streets of london on armistice day is going to upset a lot of people. but that's the price we pay for living in a free society. we shouldn't be banning any protests because we're better than criticism , ridicule, than that criticism, ridicule, counter—protest . these are the counter—protest. these are the tools for tackling intolerance in a free society . once we allow in a free society. once we allow our commitment to liberal values to fall away, we lay the groundwork for future tyranny . groundwork for future tyranny. and that's a mistake. we may very well live to regret . so i'm very well live to regret. so i'm going to talk to my panellists about this question because it is difficult, isn't it, josh? you know, we have this situation where, according to the poll, around half of the uk say we

should ban the marches . you i should ban the marches. you i know have many objections to these marches. do you think they should be banned? it i feel very caughtin should be banned? it i feel very caught in the middle because you have have intellectual side have i have an intellectual side and i have actually read your free speech book and i, i get it. >> i can get it. i can i can take it in on an intellectual level. as someone who's jewish, who is on the you know, when you hear people chanting for intifada and you have seen the images of pizza places blown apart, when you hear from the river to the sea, which is based on an original arab arabic saying , which is basically saying, which is basically calling for genocide and the endless hypocrisy that's going on here. and when we talk about micro , um, what is it, micro micro, um, what is it, micro aggression and stuff like that, it's like, oh, don't use that word because field hand or is a or field is a microaggression because it has field. it's like the jewish population are telling you that this is a call

for a genocide. and even if you don't though it don't believe it, even though it is , that's how it's perceived. is, that's how it's perceived. but that's okay. >> but this is why i wanted to play >> but this is why i wanted to play the clip, because i want people to understand, you know, if tube if they're on that tube carriage, jewish person carriage, if a jewish person was on carriage, how that on that tube carriage, how that would them feel, would that would make them feel, how would be. how intimidating that would be. and thing about it is, and the thing about it is, is you're absolutely right. lot you're absolutely right. a lot of activists say of these activists will say you've to ban you've got to ban micro—aggressions. to micro—aggressions. you've got to cancel people for saying offensive things. they're not like they're not like you say, they're not thinking about the offence caused like caused here. it's almost like that doesn't matter. no double standards, double standards. and them also >> and for them and also the victims 7th october victims of 7th of october don't matter. are dehumanised matter. the jews are dehumanised for them. they were not real victims as they don't want to address it. when the at these marches if they calling for marches if they were calling for genuine there was genuine peace if there was a call for the 8000 missiles that hamas have still sending over, if they were calling for the 230 hostages to be returned, including babies. and i mean, but they're not doing that. they're calling for genocide . they're calling for genocide. >> that's what i don't understand, why they won't, you know, because i believe that they hate jews.

they they hate jews. >> just that's what they do. >> i'm just that's what they do. >> i'm just that's what they do. >> so even that so >> so even in that case. so let's that take let's take that let's take that point. even people who hate jews, even who have that jews, even people who have that sinister, deeply ingrained prejudice, should they have freedom this freedom of speech. you see, this is the question, isn't it? and you're right to raise the emotional because emotional aspect, because i think trouble with all think that the trouble with all of in times of of this is that in times of heightened we forget heightened emotion, we forget about the broader principle, which all eventually. >> there are broader principles for me to be able to live freely in the city that i was born in as a jew. yeah, to not have to put away my star of david and fear, of course, to be able to take my into town on a on take my family into town on a on a know, to go a saturday or, you know, to go to shops or whatever. to the shops or whatever. >> so it's difficult. and, you know, i mentioned know, the reason why i mentioned the the the idea of laying the groundwork is groundwork for future tyranny is to example during the to give an example is during the battle street, you battle of cable street, you know, left wing parties know, you had left wing parties saying order saying we need public order acts, we need to be able to prevent from prevent fascists from assembling. those assembling. all of those laws were against were eventually used against left people you left wing groups. people you know, always happens. i know, it always happens. i see this an this absolutely on an intellectual this absolutely on an inteandtual this absolutely on an inteand i'm not calling for these >> and i'm not calling for these marches to be banned as such, although i would say it's called

remembrance day . it's the day of remembrance day. it's the day of remembrance . it's not the you remembrance. it's not the you know, they're saying, oh, we'll do hours after and down do it two hours after and down the no that's a day for the road. no that's a day for the road. no that's a day for the people who have fought and fallen so fallen for this country. so i think it should be think that it should be postponed following day. postponed to the following day. i harm of that. i don't see the harm of that. i'm not saying these marches shouldn't the thing shouldn't happen. the main thing i seen and there i think should be seen and there is of people exposing is a part of people exposing themselves, the thing themselves, but the main thing is these need to be properly policed they're just policed and they're just not being, have flags. being, you do have jihadi flags. you calls for you you do have calls for jihad. you do police making you do have calls for jihad. you do and police making you do have calls for jihad. you do and itylice making you do have calls for jihad. you do and it turns naking you do have calls for jihad. you do and it turns outng excuses and it turns out that the of advisory board the head of their advisory board is calling for the to river see themselves. yes. do your job. >> and again, there's all these language games going on, the people saying that the people saying that from the river doesn't mean river to sea doesn't mean genocide, people saying genocide, but also people saying when hizbut tahrir were calling for they just for jihad, they were just talking about an interior spiritual to say muslim spiritual struggle to say muslim armies behind muslim armies was the phrase that was used. so the problem with these activists is they word games and they play word games to try and gaslight you to sort of say, gaslight you and to sort of say, well, doesn't mean what you well, it doesn't mean what you think it means. do you think it means. what do you think, mean, the thing

think, chris? i mean, the thing is, so complicated is, it is so complicated and emotional. and josh is absolutely right to raise that aspect there's the aspect of this. and there's the actual living in actual practicality of living in safety jewish person in safety as a jewish person in london. jewish schools london. i mean, jewish schools have you know, have had to close. you know, it's isn't it? it's outrageous, isn't it? >> you start to >> that's where you start to think, well, at what point you know, a line where the know, is there a line where the protest get banned? protest would get banned? i don't i'm don't know. and i agree. i'm completely stuck middle. completely stuck in the middle. one will the one of my concerns is will the mainstream media cover it accurately? all accurately? because it's all very saying them expose very well saying let them expose themselves. but if that doesn't get broadcast to the population, then won't they won't be then people won't they won't be just as a though , or as just say, as a jew though, or as a being. a human being. >> bbc and i've always been slightly ambivalent about the bbc news and stuff like that, but were like they but no, they were like they absolute gaslighting to the population. they're like, oh was largely whatever. largely peaceful or whatever. and there were just signs calling for jewish people's death. they've that death. they're they've done that before same. yeah, before is the same. yeah, absolutely. they've on before is the same. yeah, absoandly. they've on before is the same. yeah, abso and it they've on before is the same. yeah, abso and it ,'hey've on before is the same. yeah, absoand it, it's 've on before is the same. yeah, absoand it, it's driving on before is the same. yeah, absoand it, it's driving me on before is the same. yeah, absoand it, it's driving me ism that and it, it's driving me is this feeling that's the whole point of being gaslit isn't it. yeah. you feel like you're being dnven yeah. you feel like you're being driven mad because you're, you're you're you're going online and you're seeing hateful hate seeing the, the hateful hate speech. the calling your speech. yes. the calling of your death, of your family's death.

and yet you turn on the news and it's like, oh, we're here and, oh, having a lovely day out. >> so i saw this today or yesterday was the editor >> so i saw this today or ye the:iay was the editor >> so i saw this today or ye the jewish was the editor >> so i saw this today or ye the jewish chronicle. 1e editor >> so i saw this today or ye the jewish chronicle. is editor >> so i saw this today or ye the jewish chronicle. is itiitor of the jewish chronicle. is it jake willis? simon's posted about that played jake willis? simon's posted about someone'siat played jake willis? simon's posted about someone's calling yed jake willis? simon's posted about someone's calling fori where someone's calling for intifada made point, intifada and made the point, this a call for murder, this is a call for murder, right? and then historian, right? and then a historian, some historian posted back saying, paranoia , saying, look at the paranoia, the paranoia this. it's not the paranoia of this. it's not paranoid because what he's the word intifada does have those connotations, irrespective of whether to the whether you trace it to the origins term anything origins of the term or anything like that . like that. >> of course it is. then they know then must know that and then they must know, right? course they know. >> well, as you said, we're used to having least generous to having the least generous interpretation of language possible. common at possible. that's very common at the and they're now the moment. and they're now asking most generous asking for the most generous interpretation . that's it. interpretation right. that's it. >> just because same >> it's just because these same people always on about people are always going on about dog aren't and dog whistles, aren't they? and they're suella they're saying that suella braverman talking about multiculturalism. she's sending braverman talking about mdogzulturalism. she's sending braverman talking about mdog whistle;m. she's sending braverman talking about mdog whistle;m. shrightmding a dog whistle to far right racists. know , racists. yes. you know, forgetting that she is, you know , the child immigrants herself. >> dog whistle. this is a very well documented of phrases well documented set of phrases that we're now being asked to

look at. the outside anomalous spreading , you know, germany spreading of, you know, germany star painted on star of david's painted on people's houses. >> saw a woman in france >> you saw a woman in france stabbed a 30 year old woman and a daubed on door. a swastika daubed on her door. this is all part of it. >> so this is this is the problem as well. it's not just theoretical that point. no. problem as well. it's not just thec know, that point. no. problem as well. it's not just thec know, so that point. no. problem as well. it's not just thec know, so there'syint. no. problem as well. it's not just thec know, so there's the no. you know, so there's the practical is the practical and this is where the struggle but this is struggle comes in. but this is also this where also why i think this is where i would when you get to the would say when you get to the point closed a school in point you've closed a school in the uk. >> mean, i think that's >> i mean, i think that's absolutely outrageous. >> to a place where >> we've gone to a place where a teacher this is teacher is in hiding. this is not is of a not part this is part of a process of not standing up to this ideology . this ideology. >> yeah, absolutely. but i do this ideology. >> yeit's absolutely. but i do this ideology. >> yeit's important�*. but i do this ideology. >> yeit's important that. i do this ideology. >> yeit's important that we 0 think it's important that we have difficult discussions have these difficult discussions because it's so it's so because i think it's so it's so key. anyway, key. it's so crucial. anyway, next on free speech nation, i'm going to be joined by chris elston, activist commonly elston, the activist commonly known as billboard. chris who travels the world combating gender identity, ideology. don't go anywhere .

radio.

welcome back to free speech nafion welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. >> i'm joined here by chris elston. he's the activist who's commonly known as billboard. chris who travels the world trying to raise awareness of gender identity ideology. chris, welcome to the show . welcome to the show. >> thank you so much for having me . now, you're not in the >> thank you so much for having me. now, you're not in the uk very often . very often. >> we've spoken this show >> we've spoken on this show before, i'm grateful before, so i'm very grateful for you talk about you coming back to talk about what it is you do. what is it that you do? >> i have conversations, weapons, and aim to start weapons, and i aim to start conversations in order to raise awareness about i consider conversations in order to raise a“ be ness about i consider conversations in order to raise a“ be nessgreatest i consider conversations in order to raise a“ be nessgreatest child consider conversations in order to raise a“ be nessgreatest child abuse er to be the greatest child abuse scandal modern medicine scandal in modern medicine history. business trying scandal in modern medicine hischange business trying scandal in modern medicine hischange theisiness trying scandal in modern medicine hischange the sexzss trying scandal in modern medicine hischange the sex of trying scandal in modern medicine hischange the sex of childrenj to change the sex of children and there wherever and you stand there wherever people in a billboard people gather in a billboard which says children cannot consent blockers . consent to puberty blockers. >> that's right. and people react in all sorts of ways. i mean, i've clips of you mean, i've seen clips of you being physically attacked, even when obviously have a lot of when you obviously have a lot of courage. if you're going to put

yourself situation. well yourself in that situation. well all kids are being cut up and sterilised and turned into lifelong medical patients. >> so if i have to take the odd broken bone or bruise here and there, that's not a big deal. what is the worst experience you've had? >> broken arm. broken arm? yeah >> broken arm. broken arm? yeah >> a couple >> antifa in montreal a couple of years ago , swinging a large of years ago, swinging a large traffic cone at my face, which i blocked four times with my forearm. but broke that bone. >> but broke the arm. yeah. okay now here. you're now you were here. you're obviously here this week in london. yesterday were london. yesterday you were at the , the the palestine march, the palestine rally. lots of people there . and you were asked to there. and you were asked to move away by a police officer after a female protester started jabbing you in the face with a palestine flag. was that right? yeah. >> there was a young woman who took with being took issue with me just being there i guess they think there because i guess they think that one issue in that there's only one issue in the world and so she kind of caused a ruckus. and then this other came me kind other woman came at me and kind of flag stick in my ofjabbed her flag stick in my face, . face, which. >> okay, which is obviously invading your personal boundaries. let's have a look. i think we've got a clip of that.

let's a look. are you here? let's have a look. are you here? >> why are you here? >> why are you here? >> i'm here to have conversation. it conversation. why is it offensive to move over there? >> yeah, i'm moving you over there to prevent a breach of the peace. >> if i stand peacefully and people come and get aggressive . people come and get aggressive. with me, i'm the one breaching the peace. >> if your presence at that location is causing people to do that, then yes. >> okay. >> okay. >> now, find that very >> now, i find that very disturbing, because what disturbing, chris, because what he's effectively saying is if the big enough and the mob is big enough and intimidating enough and scary enough, going enough, then they're going to blame who's upset blame the person who's upset them for of the peace them for a breach of the peace because those who are because surely those who are responsible for violent actions are people causing are the people causing committing the violence. >> what think has >> that's what i think this has happened several times, happened to me several times, especially in canada. but, you know, said and he know, he literally said and he came back to me later as well, and he said it was easier to move you is to take care move you than it is to take care of people. and that's of these people. and that's probably it but you probably true. it is. but you know, what he could do as a first action is he could just talk to three and talk to those three people and say, alone. yes, that say, leave them alone. yes, that should course of should be the first course of action. you use a little

action. and if you use a little authority officer, authority as a police officer, i've dealt with police hundreds authority as a police officer, i'vtimes.. with police hundreds authority as a police officer, i'vtimes.. wusually:e hundreds authority as a police officer, i'vtimes.. wusually works, ireds authority as a police officer, i'vtimes.. wusually works, yes. authority as a police officer, i'vtiases.. wusually works, yes. authority as a police officer, i'vtias a .wusually works, yes. authority as a police officer, i'vtias a default, ly works, yes. authority as a police officer, i'vtias a default, we vorks, yes. but as a default, we shouldn't just be removing peaceful just be removing the peaceful people to appease the violent people. encourages people. that just encourages more sets a very people. that just encourages mornprecedent, sets a very people. that just encourages mornprecedent, isn't sets a very people. that just encourages mornprecedent, isn't it?ts a very bad precedent, isn't it? >> that to me is >> but i mean, that to me is i mean , it's completely mean, it's completely unforgivable, . but then unforgivable, really. but then at same time, you were there at the same time, you were there . there's lot of people there. . there's a lot of people there. did could kick did it feel like this could kick off, could get very off, that it could get very violent, that the police may not be to control it? be able to control it? >> well, almost of these >> well, almost all of these muslim my muslim protesters support my message, 100% of message, literally 100% of them probably if we had a conversation about this, because there virtually all against child transition as well . right. child transition as well. right. but lot of them just think but a lot of them just think that, know, we shouldn't be that, you know, we shouldn't be i shouldn't be there talking about a separate issue. right. i see. whole is i go to see. my whole thing is i go to wherever people because wherever the people are because i a lot of i am to start a lot of conversations. and there are thousands taking my thousands of people taking my pictures that pictures during the day that starts of starts all sorts of conversations. know conversations. i'll never know about. but there is more than one issue in the world. that's trafalgar a lot of trafalgar square, where a lot of these and these protests go on and why upset people. these protests go on and why ups peopleile. these protests go on and why upspeople are these protests go on and why ups people are talking these protests go on and why upspeople are talking about these protests go on and why ups people are talking about that >> people are talking about that clip >> people are talking about that cup gone >> people are talking about that clip gone viral. but clip has gone viral. yeah, but you think that you know, people think that you're provocateur or that

you're a provocateur or that you're a provocateur or that you're provocative , you're needlessly provocative, that causing that you're just causing trouble. do you think they have a point? >> it's just these incidents >> no, it's just these incidents like this are the ones that get seen by most people. but 99% of the time, i'm just out there having beautiful having normal, beautiful conversations but conversations with people, but i'm not going to shy away from these events where there are a lot of people because it is important that we have these conversations are conversations because kids are being for life and we being harmed for life and we need be talk about need to be able to talk about it. so sometimes i'll go to some of or of these transgender rallies or whatever these whatever because you have these people celebrating people out there celebrating what is child abuse. and i think someone has to be brave enough to counter narrative, to offer the counter narrative, which the truth, that which is the truth, that children consent to any children cannot consent to any of altering. of this life altering. >> you've been at sort >> and you've been there at sort of activist rallies as of trans activist rallies as well. i mean, that must be well. and i mean, that must be particularly because particularly dangerous because you guarantee 100% of the you can guarantee 100% of the people there will be against what 31st of this >> yeah, march 31st of this yean >> yeah, march 31st of this year, was assaulted by a man year, i was assaulted by a man who identifies as a woman. they were screaming in both of my ears as i was giving an interview to a journalist. there were about three dozen police

there and i throat punched, there and i got throat punched, punched the face, from punched in the face, pushed from behind, guy, behind, pulled by another guy, simultaneous flee as the investigating officer . the young investigating officer. the young woman is smiling throughout woman was is smiling throughout the assault . the assault. >> did the police not do anything to protect you? nothing >> they didn't charge the person. they didn't discipline the officer . it's truly surreal the officer. it's truly surreal because there couldn't be a more clear cut case of assault and they do nothing about it. >> made interesting >> you made a very interesting point the pro—palestine point about the pro—palestine march majority of march is that the majority of people actually people there would actually support but you do support your cause. but you do have interesting have these interesting conflations of or left conflations of antifa or left wing, middle wing, normally middle class white , artists turning up white actors, artists turning up who very pro lgbtqia+ who are all very pro lgbtqia+ right ? who are all very pro lgbtqia+ right? aligning who are all very pro lgbtqia+ right ? aligning themselves with right? aligning themselves with people who fundamental disagree. we've actually got a clip of what happened when this clash occurred. have look . occurred. let's have a look. >> is trying to propagate anti lgbtq, anti lgbtq propaganda. he's trying to tell children that they are not allowed to be trans. >> yeah, they're not. come on, bro . bro. >> no, no, no. punish is a man

to kids . to kids. >> stop talking. some religions . >> stop talking. some religions. you can't do that. yeah, you have to respect that decision. but yes , now, a lot of people but yes, now, a lot of people found that hilarious because you know that guy and he had sort of fingernail paint on as well. >> and i think they started mocking him for that. he did. he just expect the just genuinely expect that the muslim protesters at that rally would about the lgbt plus would be all about the lgbt plus group . group. >> yeah, it seems like he did so i was just walking down the street and he swore at me and called me a fascist. so i stopped and i pulled out my phone have phone and i started to have a conversation with him. i'll upload my conversation later. i haven't but this is haven't had time, but this is what i talk to people what i do. i just talk to people and i was trying ask them and i was trying to ask them some and then they some questions and then they came took care the came along and took care of the job ran away. job for me and he ran away. >> mean, it is funny, but >> i mean, it is funny, but i kind of think it's so naive. >> i almost sorry for him >> i almost feel sorry for him in you know? in a weird way, you know? >> and i think he's he's >> yeah. and i think he's he's either from canada or america as well, it. well, so i just didn't get it. this the typical antifa this is like the typical antifa activist that i deal all activist that i deal with all the time. >> mean, that's that's incredible. >> when someone calls you a

fascist, your instinct is to pull your phone and film it. pull out your phone and film it. my is run a mile. my instinct is to run a mile. right. right here? right. who's right here? >> i'm not going judge >> well, i'm not going to judge you, it's important you, but i think it's important that these conversations that we have these conversations and there. obviously, and i'm not there. obviously, he's true he's not ready to receive true information. i just ask information. so i just ask questions to get them thinking , questions to get them thinking, you what is a transgender you know, what is a transgender child? can tell child? and they can never tell me. >> the point. you see, i >> that's the point. you see, i don't think when someone's screaming mind, screaming fascist in my mind, i'm someone i'm thinking that is not someone who's capable rational who's capable of rational thought. who's capable of rational thougian extremist. that's that's an extremist. that's someone who really needs to be de—radicalised than de—radicalised rather than persuaded. so but persuaded. right. right so but when i take a different approach. yeah >> capture these >> when i capture these conversations, helping conversations, it's helping to educate it's educate other people. it's helping watching. that's helping people watching. that's right. so there's two right. yeah so there's two facets to what i do. there's the conversation in the moment on the street, most of the time the street, and most of the time i'm having nice i'm just having nice conversations, helping to educate i record educate people. but i record them, them online. and them, i post them online. and those today are getting seen by 1 people. 1 million or 2 million people. so educate so it's helping to educate them how these how to deal with these conversations. it's helping to teach this because teach them about this because ultimately stop ultimately the only way we stop this through this child abuse is through educating the populace about what's and ultimately what's going on. and ultimately

it's to be parents who put it's going to be parents who put a stop to this. we've had a stop to this. and we've had fantastic in fantastic success, especially in america. 12 months. 20 america. the last 12 months. 20 states have passed legislation america. the last 12 months. 20 stistopiave passed legislation america. the last 12 months. 20 stistop this passed legislation america. the last 12 months. 20 stistop this .iassed legislation to stop this. >> so that's a really interesting idea because i went on a show once. it's called on a tv show once. it's called the big questions, and i knew i was going person with was going to be the person with the view and the unfashionable view and i knew going shout knew everyone was going to shout at commentator called at me. and a commentator called melanie some melanie phillips gave me some advice said, don't even advice and she said, don't even think about what's in think about what's going on in the think about the room. think about all the thousands at thousands of people watching at home. really helped home. and that really helped because a sudden i because all of a sudden i realised the more they realised that the more they shout at me, the more my point will proved. that's will be proved. and that's really in really what you do in a nutshell, insofar you're nutshell, insofar as you're you're all this abuse you're taking all this abuse sometimes violence, but you're thinking people when thinking of all the people when these viral and how these clips go viral and how that appear. and be that will appear. and to be honest, those activists don't come well. right. come out well. that's right. >> i tell people come >> i always tell people who come out on the street with me, i want you imagine want you to imagine that a million people are watching us and and and behave accordingly. and because that's ends up because that's what ends up happening. because that's what ends up happeningi that video has moments, i mean, that video has been 20 million been seen probably 20 million times. my job times. wow so he's doing my job for and i want to thank him for me. and i want to thank him very much. >> but it is unbelievable. and

|, >> but it is unbelievable. and i, i really do credit you with the courage of doing it because a lot of people wouldn't it. the courage of doing it because a lo you people wouldn't it. the courage of doing it because a loyou muste wouldn't it. the courage of doing it because a loyou must atvouldn't it. the courage of doing it because a loyou must at somei't it. the courage of doing it because a loyou must at some pointit. the courage of doing it because a lo you must at some point think but you must at some point think to do you know what? to yourself, do you know what? i shouldn't it's shouldn't keep doing this. it's too much. shouldn't keep doing this. it's too no, much. shouldn't keep doing this. it's too no, inuch. shouldn't keep doing this. it's too no, i never think that with, >> no, i never think that with, you know, these, i don't get worried people at all worried by these people at all anymore. beginning, anymore. at the beginning, it was bit different. yeah, but was a bit different. yeah, but honestly, in that moment, i think it's kind of funny. i'm not about what say not worried about what they say to me or them yelling at me or anything. it's interesting. to me or them yelling at me or awasing. it's interesting. to me or them yelling at me or awas talking it's interesting. to me or them yelling at me or awas talking with interesting. to me or them yelling at me or awas talking with jordanting. i was talking with jordan peterson's day. peterson's wife the other day. we i took his we did a podcast and i took his personality in personality test and i was in the second percentile for neuroticism, which basically means none of this stuff means that none of this stuff bothers me. so i guess i'm just kind this. kind of wired for this. >> what do you see happening >> and what do you see happening in the future? you're going to keep campaigning. keep on campaigning. i think things think things are changing. i think people aware. people are becoming more aware. so have that so do you have hope that eventually , at the very least, eventually, at the very least, our major institutions, nhs , our major institutions, our nhs, our major institutions, our nhs, our government will stop pushing this stuff and wake up to the problem ? problem? >> um, yes. i've never had any doubt my from day one doubt in my mind from day one that to put a stop that we're going to put a stop to simply a matter of to this. it's simply a matter of how many children are harmed

before do. nhs conducted before we do. the nhs conducted a all the a systematic review of all the evidence that of evidence and found that none of this helping children this was helping these children psychologically. they've psychologically. so they've basically it. basically put a stop to it. sweden has sweden finland. same thing has happened. nonnay happened. denmark and nonnay are putting finally, putting a stop to it. finally, the american academy of paediatrics in is paediatrics in the us is conducting review conducting a systematic review and many parents and it's because so many parents have learned what's going and have learned what's going on and all other people all sorts of other people are starting to wear their we starting to wear their hats. we now firm in texas now have a law firm in texas solely dedicated to suing for these detransitioners men, these detransitioners for men, for between for dads with 17 kids between them their law firms them left their law firms because a calling to because they felt a calling to fight these kids. so they fight for these kids. so they have all sorts of lawsuits flying now. and that's one great way put stop to this. way to put a stop to this. >> chris elston, thank you so much me. thank you. much for joining me. thank you. thank you. >> thank you . >> thank you. >> thank you. >> and next on free speech nafion >> and next on free speech nation on a controversial christmas advert, a man drives around during a major storm and some guys drink beer from big glasses. it's almost time for social sensations . don't go social sensations. don't go anywhere .

>> on marked dolan tonight, as they turn a blind eye to calls for terror on our streets . for terror on our streets. >> is british policing no longer fit for purpose? i'll be asking former home office minister ann widdecombe in my take at ten protests on armistice day are a profound insult to our war dead and an attack on the values of this country. plus my top pundits, including annunziata rees—mogg and tomorrow's papers. we're live from . we're live from. ten welcome back to free speech nation. >> so it's time for social sensations. that's the part of the show where we look at what's been going viral this week on social media. and first up, it's this video . you must have seen this video. you must have seen this. it's an advert which has caused discussion. caused a lot of discussion. let's have a look. but i won't do that . do that. >> no , i won't do that. i won't

>> no, i won't do that. i won't do anything for love. anything you'll be dreaming of. do anything for love. anything you'll be dreaming of . but i you'll be dreaming of. but i just want to that . just want to that. >> so a lot of people have said, you know, this is marks and spencens you know, this is marks and spencer's trashing christmas trashing tradition. they even burn a card with the word christmas on are you upset christmas on it. are you upset about this, christina? >> i'm disgusted. i we're >> i'm disgusted. i mean, we're a society , aren't we? if a godless society, aren't we? if we don't god, start we don't have god, you start worshipping ellis—bextor worshipping sophie ellis—bextor also, i hadn't. i hadn't heard the music until. why didn't they use the original? >> oh, well, maybe it was too expensive. oh, okay. >> lovely. well, no , but there's >> lovely. well, no, but there's actually, there's quite trend actually, there's quite a trend at moment of taking old 90s at the moment of taking old 90s songs doing like dodgy, songs and doing like dodgy, awful adverts passed awful covers for adverts passed me by. well, i find it highly irritating and i with irritating and i agree with katharine birbalsingh . katharine birbalsingh. >> well, yeah, katharine birbalsingh made this point. she said just an said that this was just an attack culture. do attack on british culture. do you that's right? you think that's right? yeah. >> it's nice >> yeah, sure. i mean, it's nice to taking the attacking to see you taking the attacking the value. the production value. >> i think think that's

>> no, i think i think that's right. it rather than the >> element of it rather than the ethos. yes, course , it's ethos. but yes, of course, it's a massive misfire . but then this a massive misfire. but then this is i think, a like these is also, i think, a like these are this is also this has become are this is also this has become a christmas tradition in itself, isn't it? >> who can annoy the most? >> who can annoy the most? >> who can make the worst advert? yeah. so really ironically, they've the ironically, they've done the most quintessentially christmas y ever. y thing ever. >> but didn't sainsbury's >> but didn't didn't sainsbury's do sainsbury's do do on m&s? didn't sainsbury's do one a few years ago where it was two tommies the trenches in two tommies in the trenches in world war i and it really world war i and it was really tasteless and was , it was tasteless and it was, it was bizarre. the problem bizarre. so the problem is because august, because they're made in august, everybody's on the beach and really happy. >> you can't imagine christmas and they don't want to get there. then. there. and then. >> well, let's let's >> all right. well, let's let's let's on. this is video. let's move on. this is a video. it's a youtuber who decided to drive around. commentator on a massive look i >> they're currently experiencing a 100 mile an hour winds . take at this. wow winds. take a look at this. wow wow. gee whiz . look at this. wow. gee whiz. look at this. >> feel that wind. jeez bring bringing you live storm care and

destruction as it happens . destruction as it happens. >> everybody . >> everybody. >> everybody. >> now, i admire that because he's used the word, gee whiz. and i think we need to bring that back. we need to bring back phrases like that. you know what else we need to bring back? shaking fist at someone. oh, shaking a fist at someone. oh, i'm so angry at you. i'm shaking my we need my fist. that's what we need to do. >> what you think of storm? >> what do you think of storm? yeah. your wind? yeah yeah. with your wind? yeah >> of that? did >> what do you make of that? did you it? you enjoy it? >> think it was riveting. >> i think it was riveting. >> i think it was riveting. >> no, no. >> i think it was riveting. >> if no, no. >> i think it was riveting. >> if he'sdo, no. >> i think it was riveting. >> if he's going to use, gee whiz, an old fashioned, you should say, ripping or spiffing. >> was very >> spiffing. yes he was very used. very sort of 1920s, wasn't it? enid blyton language. >> i a west >> it was. did i detect a west country accent there? >> it was. did i detect a west cou i try accent there? >> it was. did i detect a west coui just ccent there? >> it was. did i detect a west coui just ccent th say, as a >> i just want to say, as a bristolian, we're not all like that. don't and watch that. we don't just go and watch the fun . the weather for fun. >> yeah, well, entertaining. >> yeah, well, entertaining. >> it's difficult to come by in those parts, isn't it? all right, of right, so finally, a group of friends went out for just friends who went out for just one drink, famous last words. let's a look . let's have a look. >> are they little people . >> are they little people. >> are they little people.

>> no . >> no. >> no. >> they are regular sized human beings . but the thing about beings. but the thing about that, i mean, is that a beer ? that, i mean, is that a beer? keller what is that what they call it? a beer. keller where you have never seen anything like that before. >> want to know the >> i just want to know the address. >> well, know, there's >> well, you know, there's the old tradition of drinking a yard of that's a of ale, and that's quite a mammoth beverage. >> it ends carnage is >> and it ends in carnage is a rugby team. >> you can't do that in the eu, right? >> no, it's got to be a metre. >> no, it's got to be a metre. >> i think they've shown us the wrong should have wrong video. we should have seen an later. an hour later. >> happened? yeah exactly. >> what happened? yeah exactly. >> what happened? yeah exactly. >> every two >> okay. the toilet every two seconds. they will. seconds. i'm sure they will. they were okay. >> just got time for some >> we've just got time for some unfiltered dilemmas. thanks for sending first sending them in. our first dilemma martin dilemma is from martin. martin says , i appreciate is not says, i appreciate this is not the issue world the biggest issue in the world right it really grinds right now, but it really grinds my another interesting my gears. another interesting old phrase what should what should done with people who should be done with people who sit middle of the sit in the middle seat of the five at the back of the bus when the are empty? it the other seats are empty? it means that one person is effectively taking up five seats. look, has seats. i mean, look, that has troubled me as well. i've lost sleep what you think? >> well, you just get you >> well, no, you just get you can't past them. you can't,

can't get past them. you can't, can't get past them. you can't, can you? course you can. >> it's not. i mean, you just say, excuse me and. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> is going on? >> what is going on? >> what is going on? >> mean, think needs >> i mean, i think martin needs to get out more. i think he needs to go more buses, more needs to go on more buses, more buses, a bit more confident. >> yeah, i think we've just got time for one more dilemma. this is sarah. i've been looking is from sarah. i've been looking after while after my friend's cat while she's unfortunately, after my friend's cat while she's i unfortunately, after my friend's cat while she's i last unfortunately, after my friend's cat while she's i last went unfortunately, after my friend's cat while she's i last went to ifortunately, after my friend's cat while she's i last went to feed nately, after my friend's cat while she's i last went to feed him,y, after my friend's cat while she's i last went to feed him, he when i last went to feed him, he was longer with i didn't was no longer with us. i didn't want ruin my friend's want to ruin my friend's holiday, so i thought i'd tell her gets but now her when she gets back. but now she's picture updates. >> what do? >> what do i do? >> what do i do? >> i do sort of understand why you to tell her till you don't want to tell her till she gets back. it will ruin the holiday. are being kind, holiday. you are being kind, but you after the you should have looked after the cat, you should have looked after the catjlt's you should have looked after the cat, it's sort this you should have looked after the catjlt's sort this is a >> it's sort of like this is a sequel to weekend at bernie's weekend fluffy's or something. >> well, note, thank you >> well, on that note, thank you so joining us free so much for joining us for free speech was the week when >> this was the week when marks and spencer upset everyone. homer and homer simpson was censored and britain's loneliest sheep was rescued. thank to my panel. rescued. thank you to my panel. cressida and josh howie cressida wetton and josh howie and all of guests this and to all of my guests this evening. if you want evening. and if you want to join us live the right here us live in the studio right here in london, be part in paddington, london, be part of the audience. you can do that

just go to w dot sro audiences dot com. that website address is on the screen right now just apply there and come along and join us. stay tuned for the dinosaur that's the dinosaur hour. that's the brilliant new show hosted by comedy legend cleese and on comedy legend john cleese and on tonight's show, he's interviewing stephen fry. that's just after the break. and don't forget, headliners is on later at 11:00. thanks joining us. at 11:00. thanks forjoining us. good night . good night. hello there. i'm jonathan vautrey . vautrey. >> are you hearing a gb news weather forecast provided by the met office are a few showers to watch out throughout this bonfire night, particularly for western there be western areas. there could be still times pushing still heavy at times pushing their across particularly their way in across particularly north—west england, west and wales bristol wales through the bristol channel as well. western areas of escaping either of scotland, not escaping either into the second half of the night. just see a few night. we could just see a few beginning to skirt their way into but a lot into sussex and kent, but a lot of other eastern areas will remain largely dry with some

clear intervals underneath that, some possible. it some mist and fog possible. it will turn relatively will also turn relatively chilly, particularly for chilly, particularly so for eastern where can eastern scotland, where we can expect . quite expect some frost. so quite a chilly start new working chilly start to the new working week but as we head into week here. but as we head into monday , a of sunshine monday, it is a day of sunshine and showers for many. those showers most frequent in the and showers for many. those showeonceist frequent in the and showers for many. those showeonce again, uent in the and showers for many. those showeonce again, perhapshe and showers for many. those showeonce again, perhaps at and showers for many. those showeonce again, perhaps a few west. once again, perhaps a few rumbles thunder, maybe some rumbles of thunder, maybe some hail ones as hail in those heaviest ones as well, into the afternoon, just starting showers starting to see those showers progressing of progressing to eastern areas of england. still with us, england. but still with us, a good of sunshine in good amount of sunshine in between temperatures between them. temperatures around so fairly around 10 to 13 c. so fairly pleasant if you are in those sunnier spots . but tuesday, it sunnier spots. but tuesday, it will again start relatively showery. but we've got this ridge of high pressure that's going moving in going to be moving its way in dunng going to be moving its way in during day . that will during the day. that will gradually help to ease off the showers, for showers, particularly for western as we head western areas as we head into the so turning dry the afternoon. so turning dry air here. again, some sunny intervals out for and intervals to watch out for and enjoy are out and about. enjoy if you are out and about. the winds also easing off throughout day well . as the winds also easing off thrihead ut day well . as the winds also easing off thrihead into day well . as the winds also easing off thrihead into wednesday,ll . as the winds also easing off thrihead into wednesday, though, we head into wednesday, though, there persistent band there is a more persistent band of will be sweeping of rain that will be sweeping its way across the uk. then into thursday, return thursday, the showers return once again. enjoy your evening

by

by drunk again . drunk again. >> hello . hello hello . >> hello. hello hello. >> hello. hello hello. >> who is it? we're here for the show . show. >> what show ? we're filming a >> what show? we're filming a television show. this is a mediaeval castle, you silly man . mediaeval castle, you silly man. it's for besieging and sort fighting. it's not for some sort . so—called television programme . but we made arrangements . . but we made arrangements.

strange person. i am bored of you. you're your auntie. soiled her knickers and your mother was a vacuum cleaner who let us in? i spit on your gonads. you caught a wicked son of a cabbage hunter . is there someone else up hunter. is there someone else up there that i can speak to? go boil your bottom . can you throw boil your bottom. can you throw him off the ramparts, please ? him off the ramparts, please? all right . all right. oh right.