toa to a woman over an alleged speak to a woman over an alleged anti—semitic hate crime at victoria station . meanwhile, the victoria station. meanwhile, the home secretary who attended today's remembrance service is being blamed for stoking tensions ahead of the pro—palestinian protests during the week. suella braverman described the demonstrations as hate marchers and questioned the integrity of the police for allowing yesterday's rally to go ahead. allowing yesterday's rally to go ahead . well, the king has led ahead. well, the king has led the nation observing a two minute silence on remembrance day , honouring fallen soldiers . day, honouring fallen soldiers. the prince of wales was among the senior royals to stand behind king charles, with the monarch wearing the uniform of the marshal of the royal air force , he laid a wreath similar force, he laid a wreath similar to the one produced for king george the sixth. the prime minister and the labour leader were also at the cenotaph in central london alongside several other senior politicians and dignitaries . as hamas says, it's dignitaries. as hamas says, it's suspending hostage negotiations

because israel is targeting a major hospital . the al shifa major hospital. the al shifa hospital in gaza city has come under intense fire as israeli forces close in on the site. israel claims hamas is using the facility as cover for a command centre , which the terrorist centre, which the terrorist group denies . meanwhile, group denies. meanwhile, palestinian health officials say 13 people have been killed in an airstrike on a residential building in khan younis in southern gaza, where people in the enclave have been told to relocate to. weather warnings have been issued for northern ireland, england and parts of wales as storm debby approaches. it's the fourth storm of the season. heavy rain and gale force winds of up to 80 miles an hour are expected earlier this month. storm kieran caused widespread flooding . the yellow widespread flooding. the yellow alerts will be in place from 3 am. tomorrow morning until 6:00 a.m. tomorrow morning until 6:00 in the evening . and the prime in the evening. and the prime minister has marked the start of

diwali, the hindu festival of light. rishi sunak was joined by his wife and two daughters. lighting candles at downing street. the family placed them around the steps of number 10 for the start of the five day celebration. it's believed the placement lamps candles placement of lamps and candles outside homes protects against spirits of darkness and brings good luck . well, this is gb news good luck. well, this is gb news live across the uk . i'll be back live across the uk. i'll be back with more a little later this evening. but now it's over to free speech nation . free speech nation. >> another musician is cancelled for acknowledging biological reality. protesters are openly anti—semitic on the streets of london and the northumbria police threaten a woman with arrest for holding legally protected beliefs . this is free protected beliefs. this is free speech nation . welcome to free speech nation. welcome to free speech nation. with me, andrew doyle. this is the show where we take a look at culture current

affairs and politics. and of course, we'll have the latest from those lovable eco zealots this stop. this week. just stop. oil attempted become modern attempted to become the modern day up day suffragettes by smashing up a hammers . we're a painting with hammers. we're going get to that but going to get to that later. but coming up the show tonight, coming up on the show tonight, singer songwriter louise distras has music has been cancelled by the music industry be here in the industry and will be here in the studio live to her say. the studio live to have her say. the leader of the climate party, ed gemmell, will us to share gemmell, will join us to share his disappointing point the his disappointing point in the not environmental not so environmental friendly king's to boost king's speech as plans to boost north sea oil and gas drilling are plus hear how an are confirmed. plus hear how an ex maths teacher who was fired for not calling a child by their preferred pronouns has had his career completely stalled and what he intends to do about it. and of course, myself and my fantastic panel will be answering questions our answering questions from our studio comedian studio audience. my comedian panellist frances panellist tonight are frances foster bruce devlin . how are foster and bruce devlin. how are you both ? you both? >> good, how are you? i'm okay. >> good, how are you? i'm okay. >> you were recognised in tesco this week, weren't was? >> and you know who i was? it was a lovely. it was a clubcard

bottle of gin and it came up and said, are you from. and i went, not in here am and then do you know who i was having drinks with last night? go on. alex kingston of fame of fame, i'm afraid. >> yes. >> yes. >> oh, yes. >> oh, yes. >> that impressive. i've >> that is impressive. i've never the show, but i'm never seen the show, but i'm sure it is very impressive, isn't it nice that bruce gets recognised gb news? recognised for gb news? not. not, tesco though. >> he didn't actually say it was some gb news. >> it was though wasn't it? >> it was though wasn't it? >> it was the coffee. it was an orphan. >> no, it was from gb news. >> no, it was from gb news. >> it was from the guy came up to me and he said, i really appreciate everything you do with andrew and i went, with andrew doyle. and i went, well, him. well, i don't sleep with him. well, i don't sleep with him. well doesn't know the half of well he doesn't know the half of it. >> tricky francis, are you >> no. tricky francis, are you in tesco? no waitrose for you? >> yeah, exactly. >> yeah, exactly. >> mate. >> exactly, mate. >> exactly, mate. >> well, look, we've >> okay, well, look, we've got this here, so this great audience here, so let's on to the let's capitalise on them to the full. got questions. full. we've got some questions. our question comes from our first question comes from jason. where are hi, jason. jason, where are you? hi, jason. jason, where are you? hi, jason . hi, northumbria jason. hi, i'm in northumbria police law. yeah, police breaking the law. yeah, this interesting story. this is an interesting story. the they the northumbria police, they effectively there was a lesbian who was interviewed under caution by northumbria police .

caution by northumbria police. what she said was, is that trans women are men, which is, of course, as we know, since the maya forstater case, a legally protected belief. but what the police that they would police said is that they would arrest her she didn't come arrest her if she didn't come for interview. and of course, this is a bizarre one. what do you make of that, bruce? have you make of that, bruce? have you read into this one? >> i have read in and maybe said it before on the show. i was a similar thing after doing a gig on a train where i had to go down to cumbria. yes, i'm because of a crime was because of a hate crime was reported me. you love reported against me. you love this. yeah. sustained reported against me. you love this.aggravated ah. sustained reported against me. you love this.aggravated homophobici reported against me. you love this.aggravated homophobic abuse. and aggravated homophobic abuse. all please. and and all i said was, please. and and i think you get away with that phrase. but the they built a case and i had to go down with my friend gillian and be interviewed under caution and you know what the man said? i've never heard of you. and i said, i've not heard of you either. we got on with this. he took swabs of my dna and all that kind of stuff. >> but this was in a comedy. >> but this was in a comedy. >> this was a gig on a train. yes. >> i mean, that that is

absolute. i didn't know this about you. >> that is mentioned it before. >> that is mentioned it before. >> no, that is absolutely. >> no, that is absolutely. >> wasn't listening. >> did he just wasn't listening. >> did he just wasn't listening. >> i wasn't listening. but this >> did he just wasn't listening. >:tonight.t listening. but this is tonight. >> this is unbelievable. france. i mean, you know, the thing about with about this situation with the northumbria must northumbria police is they must know law by now. we know the law by now. we understand that a of understand that that a lot of police officers in past police officers in the past didn't know law, didn't didn't know the law, didn't quite the law. this quite grasp the law. but in this case, they know. since the case, they must know. since the maya case, it is not maya forstater case, it is not these are protected these are legally protected beliefs. arrest beliefs. you can't arrest someone for it. >> are assuming that >> why are you assuming that this officers are going this police officers are going to be competent? because to be competent? well because i want them the benefit of want to give them the benefit of the you we should the doubt. you know, we should stop giving them the benefit of the doubt these. look, these the doubt for these. look, these police love nothing police officers love nothing better than trawling the internet, something internet, finding something that really for really offends them. for instance, a limerick. yes. and then and putting bringing then and then putting bringing people in. well that's what happened miller, of course. >> he retweeted a poem which someone offensive. and so >> he retweeted a poem which som(visited offensive. and so >> he retweeted a poem which som(visited him.ffensive. and so >> he retweeted a poem which som(visited him. butsive. and so >> he retweeted a poem which som(visited him. but the and so they visited him. but the difference then was they hadn't had maya forstater ruling , had the maya forstater ruling, so they didn't know. maybe there was liking i want was you know, i'm liking i want to people the benefit of to give people the benefit of the doubt. they didn't know the

law that point, but they do law at that point, but they do know now. i've the know it now. and i've read the transcript of that interview with and with northumbria police, and it's that this does it's quite clear that this does not in any way fall into the bracket malicious bracket of malicious communications as they claim. so why some why are they doing it? some people, cop are people, i mean, fair cop are making that this just making the point that this just looks intimidation looks like intimidation and bullying. no what this bullying. no to me, what this is, actually ideology. is, is actually ideology. >> it's people believe >> well, it's people who believe in ideology, who believe in this ideology, who believe that, you know, that people can magically sex magically change their sex and that says they are that if someone says they are something, they should be something, then they should be affirmed. if you don't do affirmed. and if you don't do that, you are hateful that, therefore you are hateful and therefore you need to be prosecuted. and the long arm of the to come clamp the law needs to come and clamp down plus, it's much down on you. plus, it's much easier do that than arrest rapist. >> okay, fair enough. what about you?i >> okay, fair enough. what about you? i mean, bruce, did you end up being arrested, actually charged? you weren't charged? >> yeah, it came back as oh, no further mfa, further action mfa, because i had because obviously you had to get because obviously you have a different system in have a different law system in england do in scotland. england than you do in scotland. >> had get a lawyer in >> and i had to get a lawyer in carlisle, but the police were really at the end. we all really nice at the end. we all had a laugh. they took us to marks and spencer's. we got our

carry the train. it carry out for the train. it was all good the end. it just all good in the end. it just was all good in the end. it just was a huge waste time. is itjust a huge waste of time. is it just that the police feel they have to do this because the regulations aren't or regulations aren't clear or anything? the anything? was i'd say to the woman was dealing with me, i woman who was dealing with me, i said, i don't come? said, so what have i don't come? she went, we will send a car for you. >> wow. >> wow. >> yeah, but this is a comedy set. >> yeah. i mean, people say a lot worse on stage. you include it. actually, i've heard you say a lot worse than that. >> yes, exactly. >> yes, exactly. >> goodness me. in fact, bruce is going to be on my club on tuesday, dread think. tuesday, so i dread to think. i just keep it clean. okay rich? >> okay. >> okay. >> we know this, by the way, is a statement that was out a statement that was tweeted out by northumbria police. so we should we aware by northumbria police. so we sh commentary we aware by northumbria police. so we sh commentary on ve aware by northumbria police. so we sh commentary on social aware by northumbria police. so we sh commentary on social media of commentary on social media relating suspected relating to report of suspected malicious communications. we malicious communications. as we continue into this continue to look into this matter, would matter, it would be inappropriate comment inappropriate to comment any further. invite at further. we did invite at northumbria police to appear, but declined. next but they declined. so our next question from alan. where question now is from alan. where is alan? >> hi, guys. >> hi, alan. hi, guys. >> hi, alan. hi, guys. >> that's one of the last surviving conservatives in the tory think suella tory party. do you think suella braverman trying braverman is actually trying to get sacked? alan, get herself sacked? okay alan,

what do you think? >> i mean, do you that >> i mean, do you think that she knows she's sort knows full well that she's sort of representing the right of the party and that that's where the party's going? >> she is i think she's correct in what said. rishi in saying what she said. rishi can't of her because can't get rid of her because i think the you know, the there's probably 50 conservatives probably about 50 conservatives left party. think they left in the party. i think they may they may get may leave en masse. they may get rid you say she was rid of her. so you say she was right about what she said. >> what specifically are you referring >> what specifically are you refewell, march. the march, >> well, the march. the march, the fact that, you know, it started peacefully they started peacefully and they walked past of my road. walked past the end of my road. so i had 300,000 peaceful guys saying thing at times , saying the wrong thing at times, but walking the end of the but walking past the end of the road back, yeah, we road on the way back, yeah, we had about the police vans had about 50 of the police vans in in grosvenor place. we had a troops of police chasing these these violent guys up and down these violent guys up and down the roads. they were having fireworks fired at them. you never saw any fireworks. the police? yes so, you know, from from the balcony, i was just watching this. was like watching this. it was like a balcony seat. >> so this is kind of astonishing. i feel you want to come in here, bruce.

>> sorry. >> sorry. >> the thing happened to me on the district line. i was going into soho. know. stereotypic into soho. i know. stereotypic and was big guys and there was these big guys with, tattoos with, like, facial tattoos and whatever. with, like, facial tattoos and wha saying, you know, whatever. just saying, you know, whatever. and necessarily and they weren't necessarily doing i think the doing anything. but i think the police really scared police were really scared because one point our because at one point our carriage got blown carriage just got blown open, not by an explosive or whatever, but troops of police that but by troops of police that came armed. they came in. they were armed. they got guys off train. the got the guys off the train. the train was up because they train was held up because they were to disturb the train were trying to disturb the train and kind of thing. that and all this kind of thing. that was tensions was quite the well, tensions were high. were very high. >> i mean, so and we've got some footage of what's on footage of what's going on there. thing is, there. now. the thing is, france, this a lot of the people out protesting were doing so peacefully. really peacefully. and it is really important to emphasise that it's a of who don't. a minority of people who don't. however, deny that there were however, to deny that there were certain for example, i saw some footage of some very anti—semitic placards , anti —semitic remarks, placards, yes, disturbing anti—semitic remarks, placards, yes, disturbing things yes, some very disturbing things being chanted. now, my point about this is, yes, you can say thatis about this is, yes, you can say that is a minority of these protesters, which it is. but why aren't the majority around them saying up, stop doing that. saying shut up, stop doing that. you're bringing our movement into disrepute. why that not

happening? >> because if someone's wearing a openly a balaclava and being openly aggressive , you might think aggressive, you might think twice about confronting them. and i agree with you . you and look, i agree with you. you know, the anti—semitic abuse was so bad at one point that i thought i was watching the labour party conference. >> francis is outrageous . >> francis is outrageous. >> francis is outrageous. >> and that is the real tragic de of this, that people were being openly hateful, openly anti—semitic and nothing was done. >> so that's that's the issue, isn't it? >> i think if you're you know, if you're at a rally or a movement or something and if i was at that sort of thing and someone said me that was so someone said to me that was so egregious, i'd object, or at least i expect others to least i would expect others to object, i wouldn't along with object, i wouldn't go along with it. the issue, isn't it. so that's the issue, isn't it, to have become it, that it seems to have become normalised the movement, normalised within the movement, these extreme expressions, and they are extremes, but it's all polarised. totally polarised. >> yeah, it's totally polarised. >> yeah, it's totally polarised. >> yeah. and you know, it is difficult for the police in this situation, but they do to situation, but they do have to apply the law, don't they? >> the problem >> well, the problem is, is i was talking to somebody who is a

photo was photo journalist and he was actually working the marches and he was so many people he said there was so many people chanting not from chanting these slogans, not from the river to the sea, where there's argument could there's an argument that could be made and blah, blah, blah. but openly anti—semitic. yeah, that point, what can you do that that point, what can you do if literally hundreds if there's literally hundreds of people can't people chanting it? you can't arrest all. arrest them all. >> a difficult one. i'm >> it's a difficult one. i'm going to be to talking nadine strossen later about this idea of free speech, including for anti—semites and people like that. do in that that. what do you do in that situation? really hard. but situation? it's really hard. but just to alan's just to go back to alan's question, suella braverman do you think she's trying to get sacked? >> think it's impossible to >> i think it's impossible to know, what i think know, i think. but what i think she trying to do is she's she is trying to do is she's trying to make a name for herself. i don't understand what how would for her to how it would work for her to be sacked because reality is sacked because the reality is rishi going to stand down rishi is not going to stand down if he loses a general election. you don't think? i don't you don't think? no, i don't think remember when we think so. i remember when we interviewed david davis on my show, was show, trigonometry, he was actually know, actually saying that, you know, he rishi because he he voted for rishi because he was away the best candidate. >> it's very interesting >> right. it's very interesting to where the conservative to see where the conservative party going in the

party is going to go in the future, but we'll keep on top of that. we've a question now that. we've got a question now from hi from ryan. hi, ryan. hi >> hi. good evening. is anne frank offensive now? >> yeah, was an incredible >> yeah, this was an incredible story. a german story. so this is a german kindergarten. it's called the anne kindergarten. and anne frank kindergarten. and they've they're dropping they've said they're dropping their because want their name because they want a more diverse alternative. what what the hell is going on? >> i misread that because i think they were complaining about the fact she didn't have an open plan kitchen diner, which if you are selling a house because she lived in that house for ages, that's actually not what for ages, that's actually not whibruce no suites. >> bruce no en suites. >> bruce no en suites. >> and there was none of those facilities . facilities. >> so it's been the >> so it's you've been to the house then, you? house then, have you? >> amsterdam. >> i've been to amsterdam. i went someone else's house. went to someone else's house. >> i'm sure you did. what do you think, bruce, about this? >> i mean, you know, this is a girl died concentration girl who died in a concentration camp. name of anne. it's camp. the name of anne. it's kind of important that her story is theidea kind of important that her story is the idea that you is out there. the idea that you have to that she's offensive or how that be? how can that be? >> exactly, because, i >> well, exactly, because, i mean, was reality. so mean, that was her reality. so why denying someone's why are you denying someone's reality? do think by reality? and why do you think by expunging all this to the

history not, even history vault or not, even in the history vaults, you know, can it in the public domain? >> well, i actually don't understand what's going on here. do understand do you understand why? >> understand. do you understand why? >> howierstand. do you understand why? >> how isstand. do you understand why? >> how is that:i. do you understand why? >> how is that not diverse? the anne frank kindergarten? >> not trans >> because she's not a trans woman colour. therefore she woman of colour. therefore she wasn't oppressed. >> what? >> is that what? >> is that what? >> that what it is? it can't >> is that what it is? it can't be it? be that, can it? >> that's to just know. >> that's to just know. >> francis. >> francis. >> you see these >> look, when you see these things, you have the stupidest, the reason always the stupidest reason is always the stupidest reason is always the they go to. the one that they go to. >> really? yeah you know >> really? yeah and you know they're go, yeah, but they're going to go, yeah, but you know, she had white privilege. was really oppressed? >> mean, that is astonishing, >> i mean, that is astonishing, actually. that. actually. people have said that. >> of course you joke, but i've seen that from activists say that thing. that sort of thing. >> have no idea. i've read >> so i have no idea. i've read the diary, i don't remember the diary, but i don't remember how she was in there. how long she was in there. >> you know, there's some people who actually argue that. martin luther coconut, was racist. >> i know. heard it. yes >> i know. i've heard it. yes yeah, okay. i know. we're in that weird world, as they that weird clown world, as they call are now, call it. yeah, we are there now, so you might as well get on with it. okay. we've got a question from david. where's david? thank

you. from david. where's david? thank you hi. have young people >> hi. have young people forgotten about remembrance day? >> this is >> yeah, apparently so. this is a poll says thirds of a poll that says two thirds of young know what young people don't know what remembrance is remembrance day is commemorating. an ipsos commemorating. this is an ipsos poll. so and they're going poll. now so and they're going for millennials, but they're between people born between 1981 and 1996 and those who were gen 2 between 97 and 2012. and they don't know what is being commemorated, who are they asking? i'm sceptical about this poll because that can't be true, can it? >> well, you say that, but we've used a gig up and down this country doing comedy clubs . yes, country doing comedy clubs. yes, and there are some audiences you think you could ask them their name and they wouldn't be able to tell you that. >> so it's just mass stupidity generally. >> do think it's a young >> do you think it's a young issue? you think i mean, how issue? do you think i mean, how can you not know what the what remembrance day is about? >> it depends on how old >> i think it depends on how old their parents are. >> their grandparents had >> and if their grandparents had anything do with and if anything to do with it. and if it's that's talked it's something that's talked about family, if see about in the family, if you see what i mean. yeah. >> mean, yeah, fair >> but i mean, yeah, fair enough. its

>> but i mean, yeah, fair enough. it's still something >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis1. it's still something >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis talkedt's still something >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis talked aboutl something >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis talked about ommething >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis talked about on the:hing >> but i mean, yeah, fair en0lis talked about on the news that is talked about on the news all in papers, in magazines. >> i would have thought it would have in schools. yeah have come about in schools. yeah exactly. probably not. >> amazing. >> okay. kind of amazing. we've got just more got time just for one more question marcus. where's question from marcus. where's marcus? question from marcus. where's marcus the scottish government >> it's the scottish government trying kids. trying to indoctrinate kids. >> interesting >> yeah, this is an interesting one. government has said one. so the government has said that to and this that children need to and this is not mine. read is their quote, not mine. read woke. words, studying woke. in other words, studying books. giving books to books. they're giving books to primary schools which make these incredible racism incredible claims like racism was invented white was invented by white people because they wanted to dominate people et people of colour. et cetera. et cetera. really cetera. some of these really sort of american, as you can imagine, american books. now, frances, had imagine, american books. now, frlooks, had imagine, american books. now, frlooks, some had imagine, american books. now, frlooks, some the had imagine, american books. now, fr looks, some the quotes a look at some of the quotes from books. some of it is from these books. some of it is just crazily overly simplified, completely nuance and completely lacking in nuance and promoting this very racially divisive view of the world that the program itself was called read, woke , which is weird read, woke, which is weird because people keep telling me woke is a right wing slur or whatever. why that? whatever. well, why is that? >> there? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, there? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, the there? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, the thing there? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, the thing that|ere? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, the thing that ire? whatever. well, why is that? >> well, the thing that i find really this about really interesting in this about this is scotland. this this is this is scotland. this is the whitest nation earth. is the whitest nation on earth. yes. you're doing this yes. and you're doing this this practically no ethnic minorities in scotland. are you

in scotland. so what are you trying achieve? trying to achieve? >> yeah, well, bruce, you are the representative. scot >> apparently. >> apparently. >> thank you. >> no, thank you. >> no, thank you. >> so, joanna in the station? yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> well , she's not on the show, >> well, she's not on the show, though, bruce, so i can only talk you. talk to you. >> scottish. it's on. on a >> she's scottish. it's on. on a theme. pay attention. >> sorry. >> sorry. >> me you think about >> tell me what you think about this, you think >> tell me what you think about this, is you think >> tell me what you think about this, is a you think >> tell me what you think about this, is a risk you think >> tell me what you think about this, is a risk whenlink >> tell me what you think about this, is a risk when you give there is a risk of when you give children that have a children books that have a particular ideological slant? i mean, children mean, shouldn't children be exposed viewpoints? mean, shouldn't children be expo:think viewpoints? mean, shouldn't children be expo:think so. viewpoints? >> i think so. >> i think so. >> i think as well, i >> but i think as well, i struggle what the struggle with what the definition of book is. i understanding was understanding is that it was a 19505 understanding is that it was a 1950s term in which to call out racial inequality. >> to be. >> used to be. >> used to be. >> to be. but now it's >> yes. used to be. but now it's very you're vegan and very much if you're vegan and read and all that read the guardian and all that kind of stuff. >> it's >> that's how it's been interpreted . hemp leggings and interpreted. hemp leggings and walk . walk. >> i think what really happened was that the word was hijacked in around mid 2010s by activist s who believe in this sort of hyper divisive worldview and so therefore, the word became associated with that kind of authoritarian people authoritarian getting people censored, getting people fired. so the been through so the word has been through these evolutions , as i've spoken these evolutions, as i've spoken about many times. in fact, what

i would advise everyone who is confused definition is i would advise everyone who is co watch definition is i would advise everyone who is co watch the definition is i would advise everyone who is co watch the dinosaurefinition is to watch the dinosaur hour, which is tonight at 9:00 with john he talks to john cleese, and he talks to various in subject various experts in the subject and he clarifies what it means, how it evolved, where it originated from . and it's very, originated from. and it's very, very interesting and by very interesting show. and by pure coincidence, i was the producer that show. anyway, producer on that show. anyway, now , next on free speech nation, now, next on free speech nation, singer songwriter louise distras cancelled by the music industry, will be here in the studio live to have her say, don't go anywhere.

radio. okay, welcome back to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. louise distras is an independent musician who's been in the music industry for ten years. her career highlights include industry for ten years. her career ithe.ights include industry for ten years. her career ithe world, nclude industry for ten years. her career ithe world, performing industry for ten years. her careglastonburyd, performing industry for ten years. her careglastonbury festival�*ming industry for ten years. her careglastonbury festival and; the glastonbury festival and being kerrang star of

being named kerrang star of 2017. however for her artist profile has now been removed from streaming platform bandcamp due to comments she made about trans women. so is this a star fallen from grace or a victim of cancel culture? let's have a look at some of her work . don't look at some of her work. don't work. people out free. >> there is no demarco kwasi undennay . people are free. there undennay. people are free. there is no democracy . is no democracy. >> i'm delighted to say that louise distrust joins me here in the studio. louise, hello . hey the studio. louise, hello. hey so now, firstly, i must admire yourt so now, firstly, i must admire your t shirt. terf is the new punk with an image of pankhurst. do you want to explain what that means ? means? >> well, terf is a slur , but i >> well, terf is a slur, but i think it's a badge of honour. so i thought i'd put it on at shirt with emmeline pankhurst and my friend, the famous artist birdy rose. she designed it for us. fantastic. >> because it's interesting. >> because it's interesting. >> the terf people might >> the phrase terf people might not exclusionary, not know trans exclusionary, radical does radical feminist, really does mean just witch now, doesn't it? it's a sort of attack

it's a way to sort of attack attack women . yeah, effectively, attack women. yeah, effectively, yeah. interestingly , elon yeah. and interestingly, elon musk said it was a slur on twitter, so wasn't going to twitter, so he wasn't going to tolerate that tolerate it anyway. leave that aside. the aside. you've been in the business long you've business for a long time. you've been making a long been making music for a long time. us what when did it time. tell us what when did it all start to change? what happened ? happened? >> well, i released my new album, boot after bruises in april this year, and it's about not self censoring and about honounng not self censoring and about honouring the parts of ourselves that we look away from. and when i wrote this album and recorded it , talking about my music and it, talking about my music and talking about my own life meant being able to talk about being a woman. and nowadays everyone's asking, well, what is a woman ? asking, well, what is a woman? and everything in my life starts with me being a woman and being a woman as an adult human female, right? so i started this radical biological fact in an interview in may this year. and since then , the music industry since then, the music industry has just shut its doors on me. the platform that championed me have now denounced me as a nut

and as a transphobe . i'm being and as a transphobe. i'm being threatened by trans rights extremists . one of them tracked extremists. one of them tracked down my address and turned up at my home. wow. i had to go to court and get an injunction. the police are investigating this. there's an ongoing police investigation . and so i asked my investigation. and so i asked my booking agency, midnight mango, for help to keep me safe at my gigs . and i got an email from gigs. and i got an email from the managing director, matt bartlett , and the managing director, matt bartlett, and he didn't acknowledge that there was a risk to my safety whatsoever . risk to my safety whatsoever. >> even though someone's turned up at your house. >> yeah, that's right. >> yeah, that's right. >> yeah. what he said was >> yeah. what he said to me was he said, look , our position as a he said, look, our position as a company clear . trans women company is clear. trans women are and if you continue to are women and if you continue to publicly deny that trans women are women, your position will have a detrimental effect on your yeah but this is kind of >> wow. yeah but this is kind of astonishing because since the maya forstater we know maya forstater case, we know that that belief that you've expressed is protected law. expressed is protected by law. >> yeah . so engaged

>> yeah. so he is engaged potentially in a form of discrimination. there >> yeah. yeah, that's right. >> yeah. yeah, that's right. >> so why why is that? why is this going on? because obviously for of your critics, for a lot of your critics, they'll well, isn't they'll say, well, women isn't a biological it's an biological category. it's an identity of identity category. but of course, 99% country don't course, 99% of the country don't agree that . and we also agree with that. and we also know that the belief in biological protected. biological reality is protected. as . so why is it that this as i say. so why is it that this view in the arts has really taken hold politically in the music industry? >> um , i think it's well known >> um, i think it's well known that the music industry is very misogyny istic and i think that that's given room for these ideas to grow and for women's rights and women artists , you rights and women artists, you know, the rights of women artists to get trashed along the way. but in terms of punk, wasn't punk always about about saying things that are outside the establishment norm expressing yourself when it's not necessarily the fashionable view. >> wasn't it always about taking different stances? sure. >> but i think it's gone the other way now. and i think that it's that love the it's punks that love the government and that are doing

the government's for them. the government's work for them. >> astonishing >> that's sort of astonishing and it shouldn't matter what anyone, artists opinions anyone, any artists opinions are. whole point are. surely the whole point of art you're going to art is you're going to get multiple views, multiple world views, right? sure. multiple world views, right? suri you know, my attitude >> i mean, you know, my attitude is same as what it's is the same now as what it's always been. i'm just like, look, me, here's my look, here's me, here's my music. you don't like you music. if you don't like it, you can you know? yeah, music. if you don't like it, you can yeah. you know? yeah, music. if you don't like it, you can yeah. letu know? yeah, music. if you don't like it, you can yeah. let the|ow? yeah, music. if you don't like it, you can yeah. let the audience, sure, yeah. let the audience decide who they want to listen to and who they want to buy tickets to go see. >> a key isn't it? >> that's a key point, isn't it? let audience decide because let the audience decide because when like when you have companies like bandcamp withdrawing the option for people to make their own decisions , yeah, that's a kind decisions, yeah, that's a kind of authoritarian way to go about it, isn't it? what's happened with though? with bandcamp, though? >> well , so two ago i was >> well, so two weeks ago i was de—platformed by cartel de—platformed by big cartel and bandcamp within the space of 24 hours, banned camp didn't notify me. they didn't give me a reason why my discography and all the revenue in my artist account just disappeared into thin air. >> incredible. now >> that's incredible. now freedom made freedom in the arts have made comments about haven't they? >> yes, they have. >> yes, they have. >> the group headed by >> this is the group headed by denise farmer and rosie kay, who

i to last week. they've i spoke to last week. they've actually got a statement here from them. yeah. so what's going on there? >> well, freedom in the arts have published an open letter to ethan ceo of ethan diamond, the ceo of bandcamp , and they've asked him bandcamp, and they've asked him to freedom speech , to protect freedom of speech, reinstate account and reinstate my artist account and pay reinstate my artist account and pay me flipping money, but be on me. well, i've got bills to pay. >> well, there's the financial element, isn't there? but there's also just the principle. as of letting the as you say, of letting the people, audience decide. people, the audience decide. >> yeah . and also, you >> yeah, yeah. and also, you know, the pandemic, the, know, since the pandemic, the, the arts has really suffered. the music industry suffered a lot of live music venues have closed and i feel that closed down. and i feel that what's left of the industry is now being kicked to death by these intolerant activists who are shutting down and threatening anybody who dares to disagree with them or who won't bow down to these insane demands of compliance . and of ideological compliance. and these midnight these companies like midnight mango and bandcamp are more than happy to , you know, cut off our happy to, you know, cut off our own legs as some kind of sacrificial offering to the

rainbow gods. yeah. and yeah. and, and, you know , and destroy and, and, you know, and destroy artists careers in the process and, and it's just absolutely ridiculous. you know the music industry is supposed to be built on freedom of expression . on freedom of expression. >> yeah, it's interesting. a lot of people were shocked, think, of people were shocked, i think, about roisin about what happened to roisin murphy. know, very murphy. yeah. you know, very high artist. were high profile artist. gigs were cancelled in london. um, and there was a lot of aggression onune there was a lot of aggression online towards her for stating something private something on her private facebook which wasn't facebook page, which wasn't controversial. was the controversial. it was the position, the holds, position, the nhs now holds, which is puberty blockers which is that puberty blockers are problem. there's are have a problem. there's a problem with them. yeah yeah. >> what find incredible is >> what i find incredible is that album that richie murphy's album is actually bandcamp. actually still on bandcamp. interesting yeah. they haven't banned her from bandcamp, so . banned her from bandcamp, so. >> so is it case that lesser >> so is it the case that lesser known are the that known artists are the ones that really are risk . here really are at risk. here >> i think that it's been happening for a long time, but people aren't necessarily aware of it. yes, i, i mean, my personal belief is, is that the music industry is just so captured now. it's completely gone. and artists don't

necessarily realise that there's another way . you know, my another way. you know, my personal belief is that . yeah, personal belief is that. yeah, i justi personal belief is that. yeah, i just i just think we should just let it die. and i think we should just let all the cowardly artists go down with the ship. i mean, i'm not the only one that this happening to, and this is happening to, and there's. one of a there's. i'm just one of a growing artists are growing list of artists who are being but where i'll being cancelled. but where i'll come together to a new come in together to build a new industry a proper industry with a proper counterculture here where artists and particularly women artists and particularly women artists like myself, you know , artists like myself, you know, we'll get to have a proper say about lives our own about our own lives and our own work without the fear of violence and emotional and financial think that's financial ruin. i think that's the way fonnard. the only way fonnard. >> very well put, louise, >> very, very well put, louise, before go , can you just before you go, can you just quickly tell us about your new album we can get it? album and where we can get it? >> well well, would say is put >> well well, i would say is put louise distrust google and louise distrust into google and the good and the bad and the ugly come up. all the filth ugly will come up. all the filth and the fury i've got. louise ustranscom is you get ustranscom is where you can get alderman music. and also if you want one of these spiffy t shirts . sophia is the new

shirts. sophia is the new punk.com fantastic louise distress , everyone. distress, everyone. >> thank you very much . >> thank you very much. >> thank you very much. >> thank you . and next on free >> thank you. and next on free speech nation, the leader of the climate party joins us to discuss the not so environmentally friendly king's speech >> don't go anywhere .

radio. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. >> having previously been accused of political meddling as accused of political meddling as a green fingered heir to the throne, it's fair to say that the once outspoken prince charles adopted a neutral tone in his first historic speech as king this week. king charles iii, remained poker faced as he confirmed north sea oil and gas licences. let's take a look. oh, no, we don't have that package. apologies. let's see what apologies. well, let's see what the what ed gemmell makes of this. the leader of this. he's the leader of the climate he me climate party and he joins me now. welcome to the show. now. ed, welcome to the show. thank you. before we begin, ed, some people might not be familiar with your party because

it's where are it's relatively new. where are you at at the moment? >> well, we launched on the on the september year. so the 5th september last year. so sorry, 5th of november, the same day truss took office. so day as liz truss took office. so we've outlived prime we've already outlived one prime minister, a good start minister, so that's a good start for party. we're there for a new party. and we're there to that britain takes to make sure that britain takes advantage of the commercial opportunities of opportunities that come out of the opportunity. moving towards solving change, as well solving climate change, as well as standing very pure on the science, right? but very science, right? but it's very much about the opportunity. this is commercial is the biggest commercial opportunity is opportunity that's coming. it is so obvious that we have to be going there. it's so obvious that the rest the world is that the rest of the world is going whether we to going their whether we want to going their whether we want to go or we should get go there or not, we should get ahead and lead it. >> party stand >> where does the party stand left or right? where is where is it? >> we're very much more centre and centre, right? i and possibly centre, right? i mean, that's we're going. mean, that's where we're going. we're there for that mean, that's where we're going. we'rof there for that mean, that's where we're going. we'rof 60% there for that mean, that's where we're going. we'rof 60% of there for that mean, that's where we're going. we'rof 60% of people for that mean, that's where we're going. we'rof 60% of people thatiat mean, that's where we're going. we'rof 60% of people that sit sort of 60% of people that sit in ground of in the centre ground of politics, for those politics, but also for those that extreme that are not on the extreme right, say, of the right, let's say, of the conservative party. we're right, let's say, of the consout tive party. we're right, let's say, of the cons out tive p representinge right, let's say, of the cons out tive p representing them also out there representing them as and we think that as well. and we think that because talking because we're talking up the economic and economic opportunity and explaining that explaining it properly that they'll gravitate us. they'll gravitate to us. >> specifically >> can i ask you specifically about that? because i think a

lot of critics of net zero, they will well, you know, these will say, well, you know, these kind will invariably kind of measures will invariably impact society. so impact the poorer in society. so they to you what they might say to you what economic is. economic opportunities is. >> think it's very obvious >> i think it's very obvious when look at it and we when you look at it and we played out uxbridge played this out in uxbridge talking to a of ordinary talking to a lot of ordinary people actually, talking to a lot of ordinary pe0|explained, actually, talking to a lot of ordinary pe0|explained, look, actually, talking to a lot of ordinary pe0|explained, look, fortually, talking to a lot of ordinary pe0|explained, look, for thely, and explained, look, for the last we've been going last 40 years we've been going rowing back on all of our manufacturing opportunities. we've making everything china's making everything now. but china. very many but not just china. very many other around the other countries around the world. making world. and we're not making things. used to have 25 to things. so we used to have 25 to 30% of our gdp was created from manufacturing. under manufacturing. it's now under ten. have massive ten. we now have massive deficits and our balance of payments between what we import from and we export . from others and what we export. i china's one i mean, china's just one example, speaking, example, roughly speaking, we import 70 billion worth of from china and we export about half that. we've got this awful that. so we've got this awful balance now because balance of payments now because we manufacture anything. we don't manufacture anything. so saying it's so what we're saying is it's absolutely don't absolutely happening. you don't have to believe in the climate change issue. you have to believe in the climate change opportunity. are more. opportunity. there are more. almost have set almost 150 countries have set net whether that's net zero targets. whether that's the right thing to do or not, actually, it doesn't matter.

we're going that direction. we're going in that direction. and where money and that's where all the money is going made in the is going to be made in the coming years and the coming decades. we've two choices. decades. we've got two choices. stay pay everybody decades. we've got two choices. stay it, pay everybody decades. we've got two choices. stay it, which pay everybody decades. we've got two choices. stay it, which isry everybody decades. we've got two choices. stay it, which is currently)dy else for it, which is currently what we're doing or get at the front, our sleeves up , make front, roll our sleeves up, make it our mission and it our national mission and start making of it and start making money out of it and make here rather than make the money here rather than other of the world. make the money here rather than oth so of the world. make the money here rather than oth so can the world. make the money here rather than oth so can the the.d. make the money here rather than oth so can the the emphasis >> so we can see the emphasis that you're going for here. but do you actually have view on do you actually have a view on whether, groups whether, for example, groups such just oil right, such as just stop oil are right, that complete that we are facing a complete armageddon in the near future? >> if you're looking >> i think if you're looking at the science, when 99.99, 99.9% of the scientists say that we've got a massive problem, we have to get on and act on it. and it's like a gentleman it's just like i see a gentleman actually shaking head. it's actually shaking his head. it's people there who don't believe their you went to their gp. i mean, if you went to your gp out 100 gp your gp and 99 out of 100 gp told you had a problem, told you you had a problem, you'd go get action you'd go and get the action taken on it and gps are scientists. so we've got to accept and on with accept that and just get on with it. we don't even need to it. but we don't even need to accept it because commercial accept it because the commercial opportunity we opportunity is so high and we should that. anyway. opportunity is so high and we shoulwould that. anyway. opportunity is so high and we shoulwould be that. anyway. opportunity is so high and we shoulwould be interesting|yway. opportunity is so high and we shoulwould be interesting to �*ay. >> it would be interesting to hear in the

hear what the gentleman in the audience say about it, audience has to say about it, but who is it? who's shaking his headin but who is it? who's shaking his head in a in a way? head in a in a grumpy way? do you want to anything? you want to say anything? i didn't they were grumpy. didn't say they were grumpy. >> head. didn't say they were grumpy. >> yeah, head. didn't say they were grumpy. >> yeah, well, head. didn't say they were grumpy. >> yeah, well, do head. didn't say they were grumpy. >> yeah, well, do you ad. didn't say they were grumpy. >> yeah, well, do you have any do to grab the mic and do you want to grab the mic and say what you think about that? come would come on. what would your objection let's our net zero >> well, let's drop our net zero and manufacture things for the rest of the world. you know , rest of the world. you know, china is increasing their output of while we're of pollutants while we're dropping ours. we are very obviously shooting ourselves in the foot. you know, net zero was never voted on by us or anyone in parliament. it was pushed through. it was never costed. it's still can't be costed because the technology required to do doesn't exist yet. you to do it doesn't exist yet. you know, it's a pipe dream which is damaging , know, it's a pipe dream which is damaging, right? 99.9 is just thank you for that contribution. >> let's hear ed's response to that. >> 25 different things added into one there. so can't really respond to every single one of them. minutes on here. them. in a few minutes on here. i the first thing about it i think the first thing about it is, know the is, is that we know the direction travel, as i said, direction of travel, as i said, and we've got to get ahead of it. now, we can either allow

china, to china, as you alluded to, to keep doing. it's keep doing what it's doing. it's making something like 57% of the evs moment. it's doing evs at the moment. it's doing more 50% solar more than 50% of the solar panels. doing more than 70% panels. it's doing more than 70% making the pollution second, making the pollution one second, let one second. it's making more than of the wind turbines. than 50% of the wind turbines. it's the batteries than 50% of the wind turbines. it's moment. the batteries than 50% of the wind turbines. it's moment. it'sthe batteries than 50% of the wind turbines. it's moment. it's controllings at the moment. it's controlling 90% processing the 90% of the processing of the rare metals. making rare earth metals. it's making shedloads by us all shedloads of money by us all getting zero. okay and getting to net zero. okay and we're not doing it because we're at we're prepared at the back and we're prepared to cheap prices to just pay cheap prices to china than innovate china rather than innovate here and what is very, and get ahead. and what is very, very i lot of very different and i do a lot of speeches in city when you speeches in the city when you talk people who've got the talk to people who've got the money, they're looking for the opportunity to invest in decarbonisation. see decarbonisation. here. they see it's it's it's coming. they know it's coming and can as coming. and we can either, as you're suggesting , saying, let's you're suggesting, saying, let's slow let's let's not go slow it up, let's let's not go there so quickly or we can accelerate it and we can get the innovation and the finance here. >> so we've got two very different views there, which is very interesting. but let's just bnng very interesting. but let's just bring the king's bring it back to the king's speech now. how did you feel about happened there? about what happened there? >> obviously, was >> well, obviously, the king was was the was presumably chomping on the words and words when he came out and talked about the oil and gas licences. mean, know

licences. i mean, well, we know what he we know where what he feels. we know where he's for the last decades he's been for the last decades and not commenting of it. and not commenting on all of it. let's oil gas let's comment on the oil and gas licences. obviously very disappointing, licences. obviously very di was ointing, licences. obviously very diwas coming and particularly it was coming and particularly disappointing when back disappointing when you go back to the september when to the 20th of september when our minister his our prime minister made his speech rowed back speech where he rowed back on some net policies, some of the net zero policies, but in that he he was but in that he said he was unequivocal making that unequivocal in making sure that we agreements to we fulfilled our agreements to stay 1.5 degrees, stay under 1.5 degrees, unequivocal oil. so we absolutely committed us said we are definitely doing this. there is no question whatsoever . and is no question whatsoever. and then after telling us that he goes out and suddenly rows back on on oil and gas licences and things, i mean, so the, the optics of it is he's out there saying one thing, presumably trying section of trying to capture one section of the voter and then he's the of the voter and then he's out there doing another thing, trying another one. trying to catch another one. i think was spineless, selfless think it was spineless, selfless political manoeuvring just done think it was spineless, selfless polhim. manoeuvring just done think it was spineless, selfless polhim and noeuvring just done think it was spineless, selfless polhim and hisjvring just done think it was spineless, selfless polhim and his party'sust done think it was spineless, selfless polhim and his party's own one think it was spineless, selfless polhim and his party's own self for him and his party's own self interest, not thinking about us and the opportunities that come for fonnard and for us in driving fonnard and leading industrial revolution. >> what saying that >> from what you're saying that you that there you seem to believe that there isn't a principle at the isn't really a principle at the heart of the tory policy, that isn't really a principle at the heareallyhe tory policy, that isn't really a principle at the

hea really about] policy, that isn't really a principle at the hea really about harvestingat it's really about harvesting votes yeah. votes at this point? yeah. i think all about harvesting votes. >> i wu- votes. >> i also because >> and i mean also because there's much they can do in >> and i mean also because the|course much they can do in >> and i mean also because the|course of uch they can do in >> and i mean also because the|course of the they can do in >> and i mean also because the|course of the next can do in >> and i mean also because the|course of the next yeardo in the course of the next year anyway. so i think i mean, i think that would be obvious to pretty in pretty much everybody. but in fact, the effect of this fact, even in the effect of this oil row back oil and gas licence row back over the 50 years that we've been issuing oil and gas licences, rounds of licences, we've had 33 rounds of licences, we've had 33 rounds of licence actually saying licence ing. so actually saying it's happen year it's going to happen every year isn't anything it's going to happen every year isn't much, anything it's going to happen every year isn't much, but anything it's going to happen every year isn't much, but it's anything it's going to happen every year isn't much, but it's providinging it's going to happen every year isn't much, but it's providing an very much, but it's providing an optic. so going there optic. so it's going out there and saying what he thinks he's about line about creating a dividing line rather than changing anything. hugely rather than changing anything. hugokay, haven't got much >> okay, we haven't got much time but what would you time left, but what would you like to happen now? like to see happen now? >> i the oil and gas >> i think on the oil and gas licence, if can just come in licence, if i can just come in on i'd like to actually on there, i'd like to actually see say see them doing what they say they're they're they're going to do. they're talking these oil and gas talking about these oil and gas licences helping us the path licences helping us on the path to zero we all want to net zero like we all want to have more in our pockets have more money in our pockets in country and a better in this country and a better economy. all want have economy. we all want to have energy security and in fact, we'd pollution as we'd all like less pollution as well. why we the well. so why don't we get the authority that's the authority that's issuing the licences we'll let licences to say, fine, we'll let you and do the oil and you go out and do the oil and gas, but zero carbon. okay. so get it out of the and get it out of the ground and don't have emissions because

don't have any emissions because we're the energy. we're not against the energy. we're not against the opportunity, we're against the emissions. get out emissions. and then you get out there sure it's there and you make sure it's zero we start zero carbon when we start burning and of this burning it and instead of this rather carbon capture rather pathetic carbon capture and where we're and storage thing where we're saying to bring 30 saying we're going to bring 30 million the million tonnes out of the atmosphere clusters atmosphere in our main clusters by let's ramp that up 10 by 2030, let's ramp that up 10 or 20 let's lead the or 20 times. let's lead the world, innovation world, let's get the innovation done here. let's make it get done here. let's make it get done. done here. let's make it get done . let's get the city done. let's get the city financing let's start us financing it and let's start us positively benefiting . positively benefiting. >> very interesting. ed, i would love have you back the love to have you back on the show of a debate love to have you back on the show these of a debate love to have you back on the show these issues. of a debate love to have you back on the show these issues. but debate love to have you back on the show these issues. but we're:e about these issues. but we're out of time. thanks so much for joining ed gamble, everyone. joining us. ed gamble, everyone. thank still on thank you. and still to come on free speech nation , why the free speech nation, why the career a former teacher career of a former maths teacher is hanging in the is now left hanging in the balance on balance because of his view on pupil pronouns. see you in a few minutes .

>> who is it? we're here for the show . welcome to the dinosaur show. welcome to the dinosaur houn >> with me . john cleese . ha ha.

>> with me. john cleese. ha ha. that was married to a therapist. >> and you survived . >> and you survived. >> and you survived. >> i thought we were getting hugh laurie second best. i'm alive. at least you interviewed saddam hussein. what's that like? i was terrified. i'm playing strip poker with these three. oh no, thank you . three. oh no, thank you. >> cds need to be put in alphabetical order. >> oh, are you going to be problematic again ? problematic again? >> the dinosaur hour , sundays at >> the dinosaur hour, sundays at 9:00 on gb news. choose . 9:00 on gb news. choose. >> welcome back to free speech nation. >> welcome back to free speech nafion.a >> welcome back to free speech nation. a former maths teacher who found himself sacked for refusing to call a child by their preferred pronoun is still unable to get a job in teaching . unable to get a job in teaching. more than a year later. kevin lister taught maths for 18 years before he was dismissed for gross misconduct . x maths gross misconduct. x maths teacher and bad law spokesman kevin lister joins us now to explain what happened. welcome to the show.

>> thank you, andrew. kevin you've been on the show before and you told your story, but a lot of people watching won't know about it. >> happened to you? so >> what happened to you? so yeah, just just a quick summary. >> a student, she was >> so i had a student, she was 17 years old. she tells me that she name. she wants to change her name. i raise as safeguarding raise it as a safeguarding change. her name obviously to a male name. i raised a safeguarding concern in the college, completely ignored the safeguarding ing concern, then took series of actions to took a series of actions to encourage the risk that i was warning . so i then warning about. so i then obviously did not support her desire to be referred to as a as a boy . things kind of quietened a boy. things kind of quietened off there and eventually a friend subsequently decided to have a go at me and told me that i had to call her a boy and then put a complaint in against me. at the same time, i raised a second safeguarding concern that related to a member of staff who boasted in a training session how many students that she had directly supported to transition. so i raised that as a safeguarding concern that was

ignored. and then for all of that, i was then branded as transphobic and then dismissed. >> so a lot of people would say that if you're not affirming that if you're not affirming that chosen gender, that that pupils chosen gender, that you are causing that pupil emotional and psychological harm . correct. >> and what's basically happened is the college then referred me to the ladder and then from the ladder to the dbs, the disclosure and barring service part of that justification was that i was right wing because i did not confirm her then it makes me right wing. >> i wasn't aware that being right wing was against the law anyway. >> apparently so. okay but. >> apparently so. okay but. >> but this issue has >> but. but this issue has nothing with or nothing to do with left or right, as happens. of course. right, as it happens. of course. >> that was the >> but that was the justification when. >> but that was the jusisorry,)n when. >> but that was the just sorry, kevin, n. >> but that was the jusisorry, kevin, just to >> sorry, kevin, just to clarify, you that you clarify, when you say that you raised safeguarding issue, raised a safeguarding issue, what you mean by that? what what do you mean by that? what where is risk here? yeah. where is the risk here? yeah. >> as a teacher, if you have >> so as a teacher, if you have a safeguarding concern, you have a safeguarding concern, you have a right duty and obligation to raise that concern. and for that concern to be investigated formally . my concern is that if

formally. my concern is that if i was to support her belief that she is a boy and encourage her to adopt a male persona, it then then starts that social transition. the next stage is easy for to move on to, which is to start self medicating, perhaps with testosterone . this perhaps with testosterone. this is all easily available stuff . is all easily available stuff. now you can buy it in any gym, so as soon as you encourage somebody you somebody down that route and you you reinforce that view of them that they are in the wrong body and that she should be a he. you open the gateway then for that really fast, smooth transition . really fast, smooth transition. and that's well documented in the cass review. and elsewhere. well, that's very interesting. >> mentioned cass >> you mentioned the cass review. the interim review. this is the interim cass report, the it report, which made the made it clear that actually social transition where they say you just affirm the gender through pronouns that in pronouns and names but that in itself is not a neutral correct . itself is not a neutral correct. yeah. so you have backing for this. yeah that's right. >> yeah. under section 100in >> yeah. so under section 100in the act, what i'm, the employment act, what i'm, what arguing is that i have what i'm arguing is that i have acted in a way to try and ensure the safety of the child by not

doing the affirmation that you for this and i was fired for this. >> and where's your claim going now? because presumably you're taking a stand. >> course. so it's due >> of course. yeah. so it's due in employment tribunal on in the employment tribunal on the 18th of march next year. yes. but in parallel to that, i've also been referred to the dbs, as i was saying. so there is a danger, for example, now that i could win in the employment tribunal, but the dbs could still accuse me of a safeguarding violation. >> now, we will both know because we've been in the teaching profession, a lot of people won't know the dbs, the disclosure barring service. everyone this if they everyone has to do this if they apply job. apply for a teaching job. correct. but all sorts things correct. but all sorts of things can flagged even by can be flagged on that. even by the way, non—crime hate incidents , which nothing. incidents, which are nothing. that's someone that's just when someone makes a complaint, usually for ideological and ideological reasons. and what happens, the happens, i suppose, is the school will see that and just not risk on that not take a risk on that candidate. exactly. >> this last week, >> so just just this last week, iappued >> so just just this last week, i applied to another school and i applied to another school and i get an interview i didn't even get an interview because i confess to them because i had to confess to them that i am currently under review by the dbs . they haven't yet by the dbs. they haven't yet

confirmed , but the process of confirmed, but the process of review is taking so long that no school is ever going to recruit me . at the moment, that review me. at the moment, that review process has been has lasted ten months, so i was referred in february this year , ten months. february this year, ten months. this review has been been ongoing in 10s. this review has been been ongoing in 10s . you could have ongoing in 10s. you could have seen that this was just malicious nonsense . malicious nonsense. >> this is the problem because your critics will say, yes, but your critics will say, yes, but you are legally allowed to work. this you from this doesn't bar you from working. reality it working. the reality of it is, is that when headmaster or is that when a headmaster or headmistress gets this application the dbs thing application and the dbs thing flags something they just won't bother with. the interview is that chance? >> exactly. >> exactly. >> got your letter >> you've got your your letter on you've this >> you've got your your letter on exact you've this >> you've got your your letter on exact point. (ou've this >> you've got your your letter on exact point. yeah, this >> you've got your your letter on exact point. yeah, that's this this exact point. yeah, that's right. so it is a kind of pre—emptive punishment, right? >> make >> it is, yeah. they make the process the punishment. so process the punishment. yes. so fundamentally , the dbs have got fundamentally, the dbs have got two options. option one is that they is that they agree me with they is that they agree me with the with the accusation against me with all its absurdities is opfion me with all its absurdities is option two is they say, well, actually we can't agree with this. it is so absurd. i mean,

things like i cause emotional harm to a transitioning child. absolute rubbish things like i referred to the fact that transitioning is irreversible, which is one of the accusations against me, which we know it is. but that was a safeguarding accusation against so the accusation against me. so the opfions accusation against me. so the options , the second option for options, the second option for the that look the dbs is that they look at that they think, actually, the dbs is that they look at thacan't they think, actually, the dbs is that they look at thacan't support nk, actually, the dbs is that they look at thacan't support this. ctually, the dbs is that they look at thacan't support this. there's we can't support this. there's no we can uphold this no way we can uphold this safeguarding concern. if they do that, have , i would have that, they have, i would have thought, moral obligation to thought, a moral obligation to say this is so ridiculous and the child been harmed that the child has been harmed that the child has been harmed that the school should now be the school itself should now be under the under the dbs cosh. >> so. so what is it you hope will happen at this point, that firstly, the tribunal will go your way? >> i the tribunal will go >> i hope the tribunal will go my way, then the dbs my way, but then could the dbs be forced to a position where they can scrub they they can scrub it effectively? don't effectively? i honestly don't know relationship know what the relationship is between the dbs and the tribunal. i don't think anybody between the dbs and the tribuseemsion't think anybody between the dbs and the tribuseemsion knowik anybody between the dbs and the tribu seems ion know either. ody between the dbs and the tribuseemsion know either. this else seems to know either. this seems be in uncharted seems to be in an uncharted territory. yes i think the thing now is , is to expose this in its now is, is to expose this in its maximum publicity and spotlight so that we possibly can. it was

interesting, actually, earlier on, you had the discussion about anne frank. yes. which i think has got incredible parallels to this . so in has got incredible parallels to this. so in holland, the has got incredible parallels to this . so in holland, the dutch this. so in holland, the dutch were extremely socially progressive, and one of the things that they did was they decided that they could best manage social equity in the country by getting the best records possible. when the germans took over , the first germans took over, the first thing that they did was got the records and then they found the jews and anne ended up jews and anne frank ended up dead many others. and dead along with many others. and this kind of thing this is the same kind of thing that with this dbs that we end up with this dbs system as a response to the to the murders of jesse jess, jessica chapman and holly wells. yes. and we've built this system up, which is now perfectly at risk of being abused in the way that it's being abused just now. >> but that's an important point, that this was a well intentioned thing. you know, that man should not have been employed in school like he employed in a school like he was a yeah. we do a risk. yeah. yeah. so we do need sort of safeguarding. need some sort of safeguarding. >> of course. i'm 100% >> yes, of course. i'm 100% behind that. and i've used the

safeguarding process forces. but what i'm highlighting here is that well—intentioned data collection that the dbs was meant to be is something in this environment that our society is moving towards, is a tool that can be used effectively now to suppress free speech and to cause safeguarding harm. so when is the tribunal? so the tribunal is the tribunal? so the tribunal is 18th of march. next year. >> so in the interim, you're justin >> so in the interim, you're just in limbo. >> i'm in complete limbo. yeah >> i'm in complete limbo. yeah >> and this is affecting a lot of teachers , isn't it? of teachers, isn't it? >> that's right. and if i go the whole way, if i get done by the dbs on the safeguarding accusation , it says to the rest accusation, it says to the rest of the country , we don't raise of the country, we don't raise your head above the parapet on this at all or in fact, on any other issue. you know, this is a this is a complete tool where we can we can see any kind of free speech, any kind of debate, any discussion in schools completely and utterly destroyed . and utterly destroyed. >> and yes, i mean, that's the issue. is it intimidates other

people and they feel they can't speak anymore . yeah, very speak anymore. yeah, very interesting. we're be interesting. we're going to be keeping case. keeping an eye on your case. kevin everyone, thank kevin lister, everyone, thank you . that is the end of the you. that is the end of the first hour on free speech nation i >> don't go away. >> don't go away. >> there's a lot to come between now 9:00, including the now and 9:00, including the topic israel hamas topic of the israel hamas conflict. don't go anywhere . conflict. don't go anywhere. yeah . yeah. >> thank you. thank you again. >> thank you. thank you again. >> hello there . good evening. >> hello there. good evening. i'm jonathan vautrey here. your gb news weather forecast provided by the met office. many of us will be waking up to a very unsettled start to the new working week that is due to working week and that is due to storm. low storm. debby this area of low pressure quickly pressure that is very quickly going overnight and pressure that is very quickly gointomorrow overnight and pressure that is very quickly gointomorrow , overnight and pressure that is very quickly gointomorrow , producing: and pressure that is very quickly gointomorrow , producing some into tomorrow, producing some very strong particularly very strong winds, particularly directly the southern flank directly on the southern flank of northern areas of of that for northern areas of england. areas the england. coastal areas of the irish throughout irish sea. throughout this evening, we do have band of evening, we do have one band of rain its across rain sweeping its way across scotland, but it's this rain in the southwest that is associated with debby. very with storm debby. some very heavy england wales with storm debby. some very heayinto england wales with storm debby. some very heayinto northerningland wales with storm debby. some very heayinto northern ireland wales with storm debby. some very heayinto northern ireland wheres with storm debby. some very hecould northern ireland wheres with storm debby. some very hecould beyrthern ireland wheres with storm debby. some very hecould be very'n ireland wheres with storm debby. some very hecould be very persistent,'heres it could be very persistent, some flooding is some localised flooding is possible the early hours

possible during the early hours of morning. temperatures of monday morning. temperatures around 7 to 9 c for most of us, but frost is but some patchy frost is possible the very far possible across the very far north of scotland. but a very disruptive hour disruptive morning rush hour penod disruptive morning rush hour period of us. some period for a lot of us. some very strong winds, severe gales up to 80mph along coastal areas of the irish sea. very blustery up to 80mph along coastal areas of the pennines very blustery up to 80mph along coastal areas of the pennines and! blustery up to 80mph along coastal areas of the pennines and northern' of the pennines and northern areas england as well. the areas of england as well. the rain sweeps up into rain sweeps its way up into eastern of scotland where, eastern areas of scotland where, again, and again, it could be heavy and produce flooding produce some localised flooding in spells in places, some brighter spells for of england for southern areas of england and northern and wales and into northern ireland the ireland later on in the afternoon. but it is still going to a very day here. to be a very windy day here. nonetheless temperatures between 9 and 15 c. tuesday looks less disruptive than monday, but it is still be on the is still going to be on the unsettled side with a mixture of showers there. those showers in there. some of those heavy and showers in there. some of those heav as and showers in there. some of those heav as well. and showers in there. some of those heav as well. a and showers in there. some of those heav as well. a lot and showers in there. some of those heav as well. a lot of and showers in there. some of those heav as well. a lot of cloud|nd showers in there. some of those heav as well. a lot of cloud for hail as well. a lot of cloud for northern england into scotland, but northern ireland, southern areas england and wales may but northern ireland, southern areesome ngland and wales may but northern ireland, southern areesome sunshine1d wales may but northern ireland, southern areesome sunshine in wales may but northern ireland, southern areesome sunshine in between. y see some sunshine in between. some showers as well, some of those showers as well, remaining unsettled the remaining unsettled into the second week well second half of the week as well with further and

by the way . there's plenty more

the way. there's plenty more still to come on free speech nafion still to come on free speech nation this week, including social sensations, unfiltered dilemmas and more questions from our live studio audience. >> but let's get a news update first from . aaron first from. aaron >> thanks, andrew. very good evening to you. i'm aaron armstrong in the gb newsroom. the home secretary has criticised what she's described as , inflammatory and as sick, inflammatory and criminal behaviour during the armistice demonstration in armistice day demonstration in london, saying further actions necessary hundreds of thousands of pro—palestinian protesters marched peacefully through the capital yesterday , but the met capital yesterday, but the met police says it's actively investigating a number of possible cases of hate crime. suella braverman says anti—semitic chants, placards and paraphernalia openly on display marks a new low . she display marks a new low. she praised officers for their professional ism, though after far right counter protesters who were trying to confront the rally clashed with police . nine

rally clashed with police. nine officers were injured. a police have confirmed the vast majority of the 145 arrests on the day were counter—protesters. seven have been charged with various offences as well. police have released photos of four men. it's trying to identify in relation to a racially aggravated altercation at waterloo station . they also want waterloo station. they also want to speak to a woman over an alleged hate crime alleged anti—semitic hate crime at victoria station . meanwhile, at victoria station. meanwhile, the prime minister is facing calls to sack his home secretary after she was accused of inflaming tensions ahead of the pro—palestinian protests . this pro—palestinian protests. this suella braverman described the demonstrations as hate marches and questioned the integrity of the police for allowing yesterday's rally to go ahead . yesterday's rally to go ahead. the labour leader, sir keir starmer, has accused her of sowing of hate. well, sowing the seeds of hate. well, the king led the nation earlier , the king led the nation earlier, observing a two minute silence on remembrance day, honouring fallen soldiers . the prince of fallen soldiers. the prince of wales was among the senior

royals in attendance. he stood behind king charles, the monarch, wearing the uniform of the marshal of the royal air force. the prime minister labour leader. they were both there at the cenotaph in central london alongside other senior politicians and dignitaries . politicians and dignitaries. hamas says it's suspending hostage negotiations because israel continues to target gaza's biggest hospital . the al gaza's biggest hospital. the al shifa medical facility in gaza city has come under intense fire as israeli forces close in. israel says hamas is using the hospital as cover for a command centre, which the militant group denies. meanwhile palestinian health officials say 13 people have been killed in an israeli airstrike on a house in khan younis in southern gaza where displaced people have been ordered to flee to people in northern ireland, england and parts of wales are being warned to batten down the hatches as storm heavy

storm debbie approaches heavy rain and winds of up to 80 miles an hour are expected. it comes as parts of the country are as some parts of the country are still recovering from the effects of storm ciaran . yellow effects of storm ciaran. yellow alerts will be in place from 3 am. tomorrow morning to 6:00 in a.m. tomorrow morning to 6:00 in the evening . and the prime the evening. and the prime minister has marked the start of diwali, the hindu festival of light . rishi diwali, the hindu festival of light. rishi sunak was joined by his wife and two daughters. lighting candles at downing street. the family placed them around the steps of number 10 for the start of the five day celebration . it's believed the celebration. it's believed the placement of lamps and candles outside homes protects against spiritual darkness and brings good luck . and on that note, good luck. and on that note, that's all we have for the moment. back with more a little later. now it's over to free speech nation . speech nation. welcome back to free speech

nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. let's get some more questions from the audience. our first question is from armin. armin where are you? hello. >> good evening, gentlemen. evening. praising adolf hitler be illegal. >> yeah. it's a going very heavy early on, but this is obviously protest from the armistice day yesterday. so one of the marchers said the phrase hitler knew how to deal with these people. incredibly disturbing stuff. let's have a listen . stuff. let's have a listen. >> hitler knew how to deal with these people. they probably made a program so they can create a state of israel in the expense of palestinian . of palestinian. >> so again, francis, we come back to this point. you know, thatis back to this point. you know, that is not the norm. that's not what the vast majority of those protesters would have approved of like but of or anything like that. but again, we come back to this point of someone saying point of when someone saying something that openly something like that so openly and there's no comeback from anyone, seems be upset anyone, no one seems to be upset or disturbed. is that or disturbed. my view is that that means that something very

disturbing and dark has been normalised within normalised. and within that movement, well , the thing that movement, well, the thing that people don't want to address is this. >> hamas is an extremist terrorist organisation. and like all extremist terrorist organisations , they want to organisations, they want to establish a global islamic caliphate, which means that they want to abolish nation states and they want to institute shana and they want to institute sharia law . these people are sharia law. these people are extremists . unfortunately, what extremists. unfortunately, what we have is a situation in our country where people are very, very worried about addressing certain elements of this of this particular group or community, because they know that they have a high propensity for violence and people will say, you can't say that, but it's true. look at the 2018 man sister bombings. look at the 2019 london terrorist attack . look at the terrorist attack. look at the murder of sir david amess >> muslims in britain >> but most muslims in britain would abhor those. >> absolutely . but like i just >> absolutely. but like i just said, there is a small percentage of that community who are incredibly anti—semitic, incredibly violent and are

extremist. so what do we do about that? >> you know, as francis says, i'm hamas in their charter, say they want to eliminate jewish people . they're openly people. they're openly anti—semitic. can't reason anti—semitic. you can't reason with people like this, can you? no, i don't think you can. >> and look at the case of the designer john galliano. there is a to this. when was a point to this. when he was designing for dior, made designing for dior, he made anti—semitic remarks a cafe anti—semitic remarks in a cafe in remember and in paris. i remember this. and natalie portman, who happened to be the perfume , she be the face of the perfume, she said, , i'm jewish. he said said, well, i'm jewish. he said this, whatever . i mean, he was this, whatever. i mean, he was drunk and off his head. it's still not the point. all the alcohol loosen your alcohol does is loosen your tongue. i know . and tongue. believe me, i know. and that's i've got sore throat. that's why i've got sore throat. i'm anyway, we'll move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but anyway, we'll move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but yeah,|yway, we'll move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but yeah, i'm y, we'll move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but yeah, i'm not e'll move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but yeah, i'm not for move that's why i've got sore throat. i'm but yeah, i'm not for that'e on. but yeah, i'm not for that to say that's niche is. well you know, you don't hear many people saying extreme things like hitler new. what do you think it's the case then? when people are saying such extreme stuff, they know they're not going to be challenged because it is so outrageous. >> well, that's what i'm interested in. he was interested in. i mean, he was doing to someone with a doing that to someone with a camera, with a mic. he obviously felt shame

felt no compunction, no shame about doing and that about doing so and knew that the people fine people around him would be fine with i mean, that with it. so, i mean, that is i mean, that's the most extreme form of anti—semitism. anti —semitism. anti—semitism. i mean, once you're invoking hitler in a positive light, how can that be happening? i just don't i'm genuinely that genuinely baffled to see that openly streets openly expressed on the streets of london. >> you say that. but if you >> but you say that. but if you support a hamas who who are quite about wanting to wipe quite open about wanting to wipe jewish people from the face of the middle east, i mean, really, what is the difference? yeah. is there any difference? >> but then there's the free speech now i'm going to speech issue. now i'm going to be to nadine strossen be talking to nadine strossen about this, because are about this, because where are the free speech? the limits to free speech? yeah. where stand a where would you stand on a statement that? statement such as that? >> i always believe that >> well, i always believe that it's incitement to violence . it's incitement to violence. that line for me. do you that is the line for me. do you think that qualifies ? is that an think that qualifies? is that an incitement to violence? i don't think it is. it's tricky, isn't it? >> where do you stand on that, bruce? would you say that that that sort of speech ought to be criminalised or he should be able to say it? >> well, i think if because >> well, i think if you because you all time, if you say it all the time, if you're a free speech absolutist, then you can't be seen to be

quashing someone else's. whether you align with their beliefs and values that kind of values and all that kind of stuff. i really wouldn't values and all that kind of stuff. it's i really wouldn't values and all that kind of stuff. it's tricky.y wouldn't know. it's tricky. >> are going get to >> we are going to get on to that in bit, though. in my that in a bit, though. in my interview nadine strossen. that in a bit, though. in my intwdo ew nadine strossen. that in a bit, though. in my intwdo stick nadine strossen. that in a bit, though. in my intwdo stick aroundine strossen. that in a bit, though. in my intwdo stick around for strossen. that in a bit, though. in my intwdo stick around for that.;en. so do stick around for that. let's get a question now from michelle. hi. the abbas >> hi. does the cerne abbas giant represent display toxic masculinity? i should say so. >> hope got a picture of >> i hope we've got a picture of the cerne abbas giant because there quite a well there it is now, quite a well endowed is obviously, endowed chap. he is obviously, as we all know, very famous image. now they're suggesting he dates from the anglo saxon era . dates from the anglo saxon era. people thought it was a it was a pre—medieval. but this is anyway , wherever he comes from, some people want to cancel the image of this giant and his and his member from a magazine . and they member from a magazine. and they claimed specifically the critics claimed specifically the critics claimed it was a symbol of toxic masculinity . now, this is no, it masculinity. now, this is no, it sounds like i'm making this up. so this is the campaign for real. ale branch uses an image of on the front its of this on the front of its magazine. the magazine is called the dongle, think magazine. the magazine is called the allowed)ngle, think magazine. the magazine is called the allowed to |le, think magazine. the magazine is called the allowed to say think magazine. the magazine is called the allowed to say . think magazine. the magazine is called the allowed to say . and think

magazine. the magazine is called the allowed to say . and but nk i'm allowed to say. and but people say this is people, people say this is people, people have complained, said this is immature masculinity. i mean, what it looks like a halloween costume from ann summers. >> i mean, grow up and the people that are complaining about it are their doodles smaller? is that what it's coming from? you think it's envy?i coming from? you think it's envy? i think it might be doodle envy. i don't know. >> yeah. the thing about this is it's monument. it's a historical monument. i think. whatever. come on. it's anglo—saxon think. whatever. come on. it's anglo—saxmot. let's have a >> no, it's not. let's have a look the image right. look at the image again. right. let's at that image let's have a look at that image again. right. okay bruce, it's before watershed . there you before the watershed. there you go. you saw a man like that go. if you saw a man like that erect with a club over his head, you would say that's toxic masculinity. andrew well, yeah. >> if i saw that , if i saw that >> if i saw that, if i saw that in waitrose, yeah , maybe. oh on in waitrose, yeah, maybe. oh on the hill. but i mean, what's the difference between waitrose and the hill? >> because what goes on up the hill. yeah >> well exactly. >> well exactly. >> i think it's getting very silly now. >> the fact that erect >> and the fact that he's erect as well is even more problematic because it's clear that he's enjoying might be. >> well, he might be. >> well, he might be.

>> thing. no one's >> that's the thing. no one's picked on the that picked up on the fact that nipples weird, right? nipples are weird, right? >> well, yeah, but you would do that, bruce. >> no. i'm sorry. that, bruce. >> because 'm sorry. that, bruce. >> because you're. y. that, bruce. >> because you're. you're a sucker detail honest. sucker for detail to be honest. >> the whole thing. >> yeah, that's the whole thing. >> yeah, that's the whole thing. >> i just think it looks ridiculous. is he in coffin? ridiculous. is he in a coffin? >> in a coffin. >> no, he's not in a coffin. >> no, he's not in a coffin. >> he's not. >> no, he's not. >> no, he's not. >> on a rampage anyway. >> he's on a rampage anyway. >> he's on a rampage anyway. >> okay, we're going to move on. we're on. we've we're going to move on. we've got from carol. got a question now from carol. where's carol? hi, carol. >> hi. where's carol? hi, carol. >> why did just oil >> why did you just stop? oil always works of art. yes. always attack works of art. yes. >> so now and this one of >> so now and this is one of bruce's bugbears. we're bruce's bugbears. i know we're going a minute going to get to this in a minute because do this often. you because they do this often. you know, they poured that that know, they they poured that that black into trevi black liquid into the trevi fountain for instance. fountain in rome, for instance. they themselves. they glued themselves. what was it frame van gogh's it to the frame of van gogh's sunflowers was the sunflowers that was in the national now just national gallery. so now just stop they've been national gallery. so now just stop took they've been national gallery. so now just stop took some they've been national gallery. so now just stop took some hammers been national gallery. so now just stop took some hammers and n national gallery. so now just stop took some hammers and they they took some hammers and they smashed in smashed at the rokeby venus in the national gallery. i don't know if got images of know if we've got images of that, it might be worth that, but it might be worth seeing let's have seeing if we have. let's have a look the images then. let's look at the images then. let's have a look . women did not get

have a look. women did not get the vote by voting . the vote by voting. >> it is time for deeds and not words. it is time to just stop oil . politics is failing us. oil. politics is failing us. poor politics failed women in 1914. if millions will die due to new oil and gas light forcing millions . if to new oil and gas light forcing millions. if we to new oil and gas light forcing millions . if we love history , if millions. if we love history, if we love art and if we love our families, we must just stop oil >> okay, so this is 17th century painting by velazquez . what's painting by velazquez. what's interesting about it, i always find with these things why is no one dragging them away ? or why one dragging them away? or why do them us do they just let them lecture us in accents? in their posh accents? >> on? >> what's going on? >> what's going on? >> posh. she was from >> she wasn't posh. she was from the she was the one the north. just she was the one that was on the flight when the just oil shirt take just stop oil t shirt take a hammer i've said that hammer to them. i've said that before they really, before on the show. they really, really pepin. they really get on my pepin. they really get on my pepin. they really me. really annoy me. >> i don't understand >> but what i don't understand why they're just rastafarian freaks.

>> know they're doing >> you know what they're doing time on their hands. >> what they're doing is >> what they're doing there is because the image. that because that is the image. that is painting was slashed is the painting that was slashed by richardson, the by mary richardson, the suffragette so suffragette back in the day. so i they're trying i suppose they're trying to emulate they always i suppose they're trying to em after they always i suppose they're trying to em after artworks? they always i suppose they're trying to em after artworks? because always go after artworks? because that's the climate crisis. >> is that right? yeah, that's what you do. you find a piece of van gogh? yeah, you van gogh? yeah, exactly. you find work of art, find a priceless work of art, you it in gunk. then you cover it in gunk. and then before you it, the ccp will before you know it, the ccp will come to table go. you come to the table and go. you know you're right. need come to the table and go. you kn amend you're right. need come to the table and go. you kn amend whatj're right. need come to the table and go. you kn amend what we'rejht. need come to the table and go. you kn amend what we're doing need come to the table and go. you kn amend what we're doing in eed come to the table and go. you kn amend what we're doing in our to amend what we're doing in our country with carbon emissions. >> because it's not hammer, >> because if it's not a hammer, it's soup. it's a can of soup. >> it's normally can of soup. >> it's normally a can of soup. the this think the thing about this is i think there is something fundamentally anti humanity about this movement, and movement, about this group, and that's for art, that's why they go for art, because art is the highest achievement of humankind. and i think kind of mis think there is a kind of mis anthropy a kind anti anthropy or a kind of anti humane. think part humane. i think that's part of it, don't you think? >> i think because >> i think it's because genuinely, think genuinely, genuinely, i think it's because they have found this is the best way to garner attention . this is the best way attention. this is the best way to get people talking about them and the tragedy of this movement actually is they say just stop

oil and then they get on an aeroplane. yes and you think to yourself, okay, you're saying just oil. fair enough . just stop oil. fair enough. what's your idea? >> yeah, don't live by >> yeah, but they don't live by their own principles, do they? and they also interrupted the end act one of les miserables end of act one of les miserables live . live. >> so it's not all bad news for goodness i think. >> so it's not all bad news for gooi ness i think. >> so it's not all bad news for gooi think i think. >> so it's not all bad news for gooi think that'sk. >> so it's not all bad news for gooi think that's an absolute >> i think that's an absolute travesty. i think it was one day more and it was yeah, it's almost like you're a gay man there, andrew, with your love of musicals. let's musicals. okay. let's get another from another question now from miranda. where's miranda? hi, miranda. >> hi. good evening. did alison rose get what she deserved? yeah this is really interesting. >> so obviously, the ex—boss of natwest, dame alison rose, she's losing out a £7.6 million bonus is because she admitted that she'd discussed the closure of nigel farage's bank account. so but she is going to receive 2.4 million fixed pay package . so million fixed pay package. so she's still she's still okay. i think, isn't she? >> i think she's going to scrape by and know. >> do you know , i don't think >> do you know, i don't think the cost of living crisis is going bite too deep into going to bite too deep into alison rose's pockets.

>> yes , i'll be i'll be honest >> yes, i'll be i'll be honest with you. i am delighted cited that has left. need to that she has left. we need to get these people out of get more of these people out of our institutions. >> i the thing is, the >> i mean, the thing is, the freedom information . freedom of information. >> sort of a round of applause. there you go for that. >> i mean, freedom of >> i mean, the freedom of information did did information request did did reveal the bank reveal explicitly that the bank was de—banking ing nigel farage because disagreed with his opinions. >> what was . right? so >> that's what it was. right? so we you can't live we can't you can't live in a society that's not a free society. >> but she didn't get what she deserved because shouldn't >> but she didn't get what she desergot because shouldn't >> but she didn't get what she desergot anything shouldn't >> but she didn't get what she desergot anything that'souldn't >> but she didn't get what she desergot anything that's right.t have got anything that's right. she been sacked for. have got anything that's right. she respond. been sacked for. have got anything that's right. she respond. okay.| sacked for. have got anything that's right. she respond. okay. that'sd for. have got anything that's right. she respond. okay. that's the'. gross respond. okay. that's the bottom line. and we were discussing friday. discussing that on friday. and this rips knitting this really rips my knitting £60,000 to help her find a job again. what is she worth? >> 60 grand thousand pounds to find a job? >> is she in cahoots with donatella versace? really? >> is she in cahoots with dona does versace? really? >> is she in cahoots with dona does sheiace? really? >> is she in cahoots with dona does she need really? >> is she in cahoots with dona does she need much? why does she need that much money? boot . money? she's a boot. >> well, bruce, very clear where he stands on this . i didn't he stands on this. i didn't realise. yeah, she's getting money, too. >> she's getting 60 grand to help fund. yeah, it's difficult. it's difficult. francis go down the job centre. >> love . why does she need 60

>> love. why does she need 60 grand for that? >> you use some of the 60 grand on broom on your hair, on that broom on your hair, alison your is like alison because your hair is like a box. conditioner on it. >> she %m it. >> she need the bus fare. >> she might need the bus fare. that's. don't know. i'm just that's. i don't know. i'm just trying by the trying to make excuses by the bus yeah, that's true. bus with 60g. yeah, that's true. miranda, you about miranda, what do you think about it? she should get it? do you think she should get any at all? any bonus at all? >> think she should pay >> i think she should pay compensation everyone who has compensation to everyone who has been affected. >> so for people who can't hear, miranda should pay compensation. >> listen, i've been affected by it . it. >> yeah, so have i, bruce. definitely he's. he's very upset about this. >> okay , let's move now. >> okay, let's move on now. >> okay, let's move on now. >> got ptsd now from nick. >> okay, let's move on now. >> where's ptsd now from nick. >> okay, let's move on now. >> where's nick? now from nick. >> okay, let's move on now. >> where's nick? hiv from nick. >> okay, let's move on now. >> where's nick? hi nick.1 nick. >> okay, let's move on now. >> where's nick? hi nick. hi. ck. >> where's nick? hi nick. hi. >> where's nick? hi nick. hi. >> you suggest an >> can you suggest an alternative name for or alternative name for or alternative for caramac ? alternative for caramac? >> do you like caramac? nick to be honest, i've never tried it. >> no, but. >> no, but. >> no, but that's fair. >> no, but that's fair. >> i've never tried caramac. but it's in the news at the moment. this. it's type of this. this it's a type of chocolate bar. nestle they've discontinued always chocolate bar. nestle they've discvery|ued always chocolate bar. nestle they've discvery|ued when always chocolate bar. nestle they've discvery|ued when theyways chocolate bar. nestle they've discvery|ued when they haven't get very upset when they haven't gone wurly , though, gone for curly wurly, though, have no. that's still have they? no. that's still okay. no, you're fine. fine okay. but caramac. okay. so. but. but caramac. i don't. i haven't tried caramac

people are really upset about this. >> people are really upset about it. but haven't tried it either. >> has anyone in here actually tried caramel ? alan, you've. tried caramel? alan, you've. >> had it nice ? caramac. >> it is. >> it is. >> it's sweet, but all these things but it's a chocolate things are. but it's a chocolate bar. it's really thin . it's. it's. >> well i'm not going to get too exercised about the, the loss of caramac. >> do you have any views on this bruce. >> i like cheese. >> i like cheese. >> cheese. yeah. as long as they don't descants you wensleydale cheese . cheese. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> then you're absolutely fine. okay well, look, that's all we got in this section. got time for in this section. but on free speech nation , but next on free speech nation, i'm be speaking to i'm going to be speaking to nadine strossen , going nadine strossen, who's going to be to why everybody be here to explain why everybody deserves speech, even deserves freedom of speech, even when they have intolerable views . don't go anywhere .

news radio. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me andrew doyle. the israel—hamas war has brought

about a plethora of questions and debates , including a and debates, including a discussion around freedom of speech. nadine strossen along with her co—writer pamela paretsky, have published an article entitled even anti—semites deserve free speech. nadine strossen , who is speech. nadine strossen, who is senior fellow at the foundation for individual rights in education and the author of free speech what everyone needs to know is here now to explain more. nadine strossen, welcome to the show. >> so happy to be here, >> i'm so happy to be here, andrew. hello, nadine. >> for your can i ask you first and foremost about your article l, which is a rather provocative title , the idea that even title, the idea that even antisemites should be entitled to free speech. >> can you explain your thinking there? >> yes, and most importantly, it is not only my thinking , andrew, is not only my thinking, andrew, but it is the unanimous thinking of the entire united states supreme court going back to the middle of the 20th century, because laws defending freedom , because laws defending freedom, even for the thought that we hate to quote a famous supreme

court justice, is less dangerous than giving government the latitude to pick and choose which ideas are hateful and deserving of suppression. after all, this is a very subjective concept. today, in the united states, and i'm sure the same is true in britain as well, people tend to use the epithet of hate speech toward any idea that they disagree with or find hateful. so that epithet hate speech has been hurled at the phrase black lives matter that's been attacked as hate speech against police officers and against white people . and the phrase white people. and the phrase blue lives matter in support of life of police officers has been attacked as hate speech against black people. indeed, the phrase all lives matter has been attacked as insufficiently respectful of the special

challenges to equality for black people. andrew really, sadly, because you're such a great free speech defender as well. and by the way, i really enjoyed your performance of your book about free speech on audible , but i'm free speech on audible, but i'm sure you will share my horror that on a number of college campuses in the united states, the phrase free speech has been attacked as hate speech . so, you attacked as hate speech. so, you know, in another problem i was listening to your fascinating discussion about pro—hitler rhetoric in london, which i could not find more abhorrent as somebody who is the daughter of a holocaust survivor who could not be more critical of anti—semitic speech. and yet, if people have those hateful , people have those hateful, anti—semitic ideas , it really is anti—semitic ideas, it really is important for us to know that, you know , hopefully they might you know, hopefully they might be open to persuasion and

education, punishing somebody is not going to change their minds. but at the very least, law enforcement will be able to monitor them and make sure that they do not actually engage in any violent or discriminatory conduct to carry out their hateful ideas. it's very interesting you mentioned that, nadine, because there is obviously this situation that we're at war now. >> there is a war going on. obviously between israel and hamas. people would say that in such have such conditions, you have to have speech have limitations on speech because inflame some because it might inflame some issues. that there issues. do you accept that there are situations where are some times situations where you restrictions . you do need these restrictions. >> you know , somebody used the >> you know, somebody used the phrase free speech absolutists. ihave phrase free speech absolutists. i have never met one. the difference between those of us who strongly support free speech and others is that we and i include the united states supreme court in that we insist that before government may restrict speech, there must be a compelling import and justification. it is often

described as the emergency standard that when speech directly and imminently causes or threatens certain specific, serious harm and there's no other way to prevent that harm . other way to prevent that harm. short of punishing the speech , short of punishing the speech, then government may punish the speech and that is not an impossible standard . but it is impossible standard. but it is sensibly a difficult standard. so once earlier, one of your commentators was talking about incitement . the us supreme court incitement. the us supreme court has said that even advocacy of violence or law , lawless conduct violence or law, lawless conduct is protected. the only thing thatis is protected. the only thing that is not protected is intent . that is not protected is intent. national incitement of imminent violence that is likely to have happen imminently. violence that is likely to have happen imminently . so if happen imminently. so if somebody is more loosely using red brick, that might at some

future point potentially lead to violence . that simply gives the violence. that simply gives the government too much latitude and discretion. and what it is inevitably does is use that discretion to punish dissenting voices, voices that are critical of government policies in the united states. before the supreme court adopted that emergency standard. andrew, the voices that were repressed included all advocates of equal rights, including civil rights. that speech was seen as as dangerous and as threatened to the status quo. and insulting to the status quo. and insulting to the dignity of people who were supporting jim crow and racial segregation. so the point is, if you want to have freedom for the thought that you love, then you have to tolerate freedom for the thought that you hate and by the way, the most effective way to counter that hateful idea is

through hearing it, refuting it, ignonng through hearing it, refuting it, ignoring it, persuading against it, lobbying against it, making sure it does not translated into actual, hateful, discriminatory violence or other conduct . violence or other conduct. >> that's very interesting to hear you say that, nadine. i think people forget that a lot, that when you clamp down on free speech, setting speech, you're setting a precedent, to precedent, a legal precedent to enable government censor enable the government to censor whatever likes in the whatever speech it likes in the future. think such an future. i think that's such an important about important point. but what about some the critics the some of the critics of the marches had in london marches we've had in london recently, what they have said is what about the safety of jewish people in london at the moment, many of whom feel they can't even walk down the streets of their own native city? what do you that ? their own native city? what do youi that ? their own native city? what do youi certainly hat ? their own native city? what do youi certainly support that >> i certainly support that government provide safety and protection against actual physical assaults , as well as physical assaults, as well as removing member andrew said, not all speech is protected. another category of speech that

satisfies this emergency standard , in addition to standard, in addition to intentional incitement of imminent violence, is threatening speech when the speaker intends to instil a reasonable fear on the part of particular targeted audience members that they will be subject to violence even if the speaker doesn't intend to carry out the violence. the mere fact that you reasonably fear violence means not only is your own free speech violated because you then don't dare speak up, but even your freedom of movement as you say, if you're afraid to go out because you're afraid to go out because you're afraid that you're going to be subject to an assault, that government has a responsibility to protect you against that kind of reasonable fear. and appropriately here in the united states, just a week or so ago, we had a student on a college campus, a university campus . campus, a university campus. cornell arrested and subject to federal criminal prosecution because of threats that he put

out on the internet that were specific targeting the jewish community at cornell that was appropriately seen as a punishable true threat, subjecting him to arrest . but subjecting him to arrest. but when we're talking about hateful rhetoric that simply makes you, you know, abhor the idea, but not feel that you are going to be subject to an immediate physical attack , it is not physical attack, it is not appropriate to punish that speaker . and i would also argue, speaker. and i would also argue, andrew, it's not an effective way to counter the actual attitude . dude, you know, there attitude. dude, you know, there are many, many case studies of people who formally supported hateful ideologies who have repudiated those beliefs and who are now devoting their lives to trying to stop other people from going in that direction. in the united states , we have a whole united states, we have a whole organisation called life after hate and all of these people say that what worked was when people

not punishing them, not even shunning and shaming, shaming and cancelling them, but reaching out to them to try to get them to criticise us and question and revisit , fit their question and revisit, fit their own views , to get to know people own views, to get to know people in the groups that they believe that they hate, to break down those prejudices and stereotypes , you know, that kind of educational approach is not guaranteed to work in every situation . but history shows situation. but history shows that punitive censorship is guaranteed to fail . guaranteed to fail. >> well, nadine strossen, thank you. ever so much for joining >> well, nadine strossen, thank you. ever so much forjoining me tonight. really appreciate it. and nadine's book, which is called free speech what everyone needs to know is out now. i would thoroughly recommend it. do check that out. i'd like to bnngin do check that out. i'd like to bring in bruce and francis now to get their thoughts on this. francis, interesting francis, it's very interesting hearing. was president of francis, it's very interesting hea aclu was president of francis, it's very interesting

hea aclu in was president of francis, it's very interesting hea aclu in the was president of francis, it's very interesting hea aclu in the 90s president of francis, it's very interesting hea aclu in the 90s andiident of francis, it's very interesting hea aclu in the 90s and early of the aclu in the 90s and early 2000 and the aclu very famously defended the right of neo nazis to march in skokie in chicago in the late 70s and a man called inaya wrote a book about that who was the president of the aclu at the time called defending my enemy. you know, he's man saying the he's a jewish man saying the reason them to have reason why he wants them to have the to march is so they the right to march is so they can expose those horrendous views. that point views. nadine made that point that hearing that man that actually hearing that man on praising hitler. on the street praising hitler. well, least we know that well, at least we know that these views being held. at these views are being held. at least something least we can do something about it. agree with that? it. do you agree with that? >> look, i completely it. do you agree with that? >> withaok, i completely it. do you agree with that? >> with that. completely it. do you agree with that? >> with that. and pletely it. do you agree with that? >> with that. and it'sely it. do you agree with that? >> with that. and it's always agree with that. and it's always nice to see jeremy corbyn interviewed, you what interviewed, you know what i mean? >> it's a foster. he's not to here defend himself. >> right. but no , but i really >> right. but no, but i really do believe that because it's it is vitally important that when there is this undercurrent of hatred , that it gets the hatred, that it gets the daylight that it so clearly needs because if we just force it more and more underground, it will be festering there and you will be festering there and you

will give these people a legitimacy and a glamour. they simply don't deserve . simply don't deserve. >> so that's the point, isn't it, bruce? i mean, what do you make of this? like it is horrible hearing these people praising hitler, saying openly anti—semitic things, but is nadine actually the nadine right that actually the fact know they're fact that we know that they're there helpful ? there is kind of helpful? >> i think the most interesting thing was thing that she said to me was she doesn't know a free speech absolutist you absolutist in its entirety. you know, i mean, you get these people preach being people that preach being puritanic not all puritanic and they're not at all like know, know that like you know, and i know that people views on this people have views on this channel us participating and channel and us participating and all that kind of stuff. they don't watch it. there's no discussion. that's bad discussion. it's just that's bad . like, you . and you're like, right. you can't just come from there, you know? it's bit like the snp know? it's a bit like the snp screaming about tories. screaming about the tories. >> you've got to hear more. >> you've got to hear every side more honey. well he more flies with honey. well he always a lovely, beautiful always has a lovely, beautiful phrase but look, always has a lovely, beautiful phra to but look, always has a lovely, beautiful phra to come but look, always has a lovely, beautiful phrato come freet look, always has a lovely, beautiful phra to come free speech still to come on free speech nation, welcome or unwelcome nation, a welcome or unwelcome dose biological reality . dose of biological reality. we're about impact we're talking about the impact that gender identity ideology is having society in just having on our society in just a couple of minutes. don't go anywhere .

radio. welcome back to free speech nation. >> my next guest is author and journalist james >> my next guest is author and journalistjames esses. he is journalist james esses. he is the co—founder of the declaration for biological reality , who describe themselves reality, who describe themselves as a group of concerned citizens who have concerns about the impact that gender identity ideology is having on our society. so here to explain more is the himself . james, is the man himself. james, welcome show. thank you, andrew. >> i should say welcome back to the show. >> james, tell us a bit about what for what the declaration for biological reality is all about. >> look, myself and these >> so look, myself and these signature have signature organisations have simply had enough gender simply had enough of gender ideology, society. ideology, infiltrate society. we've got children being medicalized and left infertile . medicalized and left infertile. we've got students being taught that it's been it's possible to be trapped in the wrong body. we've word woman being we've got the word woman being erased from our dictionary. we've got women's sports and safe spaces being infiltrated .

safe spaces being infiltrated. we've got gay children being taught that actually they might be straight, but trapped in the wrong body. and we've got people losing courses , jobs and losing their courses, jobs and livelihoods for daring to say that cannot become that a man cannot become a woman. so as far as we're concerned, it is simply gone too far . we had to say something. far. we had to say something. >> it does feel out of control, i say, for transparency >> it does feel out of control, i i say, for transparency >> it does feel out of control, i i amiay, for transparency >> it does feel out of control, i i am a, for transparency >> it does feel out of control, i i am a signatoryiparency >> it does feel out of control, i i am a signatoryipaithey that i am a signatory of the declaration the declaration as well. now, the reason i've signed it is for all of the reasons you've just outlined there, but i've also i also get very frustrated and i think, why have we reached the point where we need group of point where we need a group of people come up with a people to come up with a declaration biological declaration of biological reality in order to get this message the message across to the government? hell government? what the hell is going on? >> it's crazy. this >> oh, it's crazy. this shouldn't at all. shouldn't be required at all. and you how far we've and it tells you how far we've sunk as a society this sunk as a society because this should quo we should be the status quo that we understand binary understand that sex is binary and but and immutable. but unfortunately, the last few unfortunately, over the last few years, groups like stonewall have infiltrated our public sector our media, our sector, our media, even our private corporations , and have sector, our media, even our privfonnard orations , and have sector, our media, even our privfonnard thisons , and have sector, our media, even our privfonnard this kind and have sector, our media, even our privfonnard this kind ofd have put fonnard this kind of dangerous and divisive ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold s and divisive ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold aand divisive ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold a myth ivisive ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold a myth and'e ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold a myth and a ideology put fonnard this kind of dangsold a myth and a lieology put fonnard this kind of dangsold a myth and a lie to gy and sold a myth and a lie to those out there. i mean , i take those out there. i mean, i take the james, because a

the view, james, because i'm a liberal believe that liberal and i believe that people able to have people should be able to have whatever they right whatever beliefs they want right up to the point that it impacts on people's rights. up to the point that it impacts on so people's rights. up to the point that it impacts on so thinkle's rights. up to the point that it impacts on so think if�*s rights. up to the point that it impacts on so think if�*s rigdoi. up to the point that it impacts on so think if�*s rigdo believe >> so i think if you do believe that there multiple sexes or that there are multiple sexes or genders, you believe genders, and if you do believe that you can change sex, and if you believe you have you do believe you have an innate gendered which innate gendered soul, which doesn't innate gendered soul, which dofree: innate gendered soul, which dofree have belief. but to free have that belief. but once you start saying women can no have their single—sex no longer have their single—sex spaces, be spaces, gay kids need to be targeted heterosexual targeted and fixed. heterosexual ized i think we ized medically, then i think we need step in. that a fair point? >> that's the cut off point. but we've just yesterday we've seen even just yesterday we've seen even just yesterday we publicised online we saw it publicised online this lesbian under lesbian being interviewed under caution by the police for daring to miss gender someone and dare to miss gender someone and dare to say that a man cannot become a woman. lesbian speed dating events cancelled because events been cancelled because they're allowing biological they're not allowing biological men is infiltrating men there. this is infiltrating infringing the rights of infringing upon the rights of all the rest of us. i mean, it's crazy. >> and when you say it like that, it does sound insane. but this people don't this is happening. people don't understand how widespread is. this is happening. people don't uthinktand how widespread is. this is happening. people don't uthinktand this widespread is. this is happening. people don't uthinktand this widtgonerd is. i think now this has gone around. number of around. there are a number of parliamentarians looking at this declaration. going make parliamentarians looking at this dndifference? going make parliamentarians looking at this dndifference? is going make parliamentarians looking at this dndifference? is itjoing make parliamentarians looking at this dndifference? is it because nake a difference? is it because i wonder i if you can wonder and i wonder if you can

help me on this, i getting help me on this, i keep getting the impression actually the impression that actually a lot don't understand lot of mps don't understand the issues. that issues. i really do feel that it's done rounds. it's done the rounds. >> you know, we've had >> i mean, you know, we've had a range of signatories from across left right. mostly left and right. it's mostly conservative mps that have signed fair . conservative mps that have signed fair. but to be signed it. to be fair. but to be honest, quite few honest, quite a few parliamentarians have messaged me that me privately and said that they're afraid to sign it, they're too afraid to sign it, which is which concerning which is which is concerning given actually given their position. actually if speak out in if they can't speak out in favour reality who favour of reality and truth, who can? we've even had can? well, we've even had conservative that conservative mps saying that they're rebel against conservative mps saying that thejgovernment rebel against conservative mps saying that they government because ainst conservative mps saying that thejgovernment because they the government because they dropped conversion dropped the ban on conversion therapy , what they call trans therapy, what they call trans conversion therapy. >> of course, as >> but of course, as i as i spoke to dennis kavanagh about this on this the problem this on this show, the problem is that if you oppose a ban on trans conversion therapy , you're trans conversion therapy, you're effectively promoting gay conversion therapy in a way. and this is well explicitly, but this is well explicitly, but this is well explicitly, but this is not understood by the parliamentarians , and that is parliamentarians, and that is the real conversion therapy and selling myth to children selling this myth to children that if hate a part of that if you hate a part of yourself, should undergo yourself, you should undergo irreversible treatment irreversible hormonal treatment or become the person or surgery and become the person that you were destined to be. >> the conversion >> that is the real conversion therapy. conversion

therapy. but the conversion therapy. but the conversion therapy off the therapy bill is not off the cards. come top of cards. it's come top of the table the house lords. table for the house of lords. private member bills they private member bills so they could and force it could still try and force it through scary stuff. through the scary stuff. >> you've mentioned >> now look, you've mentioned there that a lot of conservatives , people have conservatives, people have signed document that's signed the document that's caused problems, hasn't it? caused some problems, hasn't it? it has. >> had people messaging me >> i've had people messaging me saying it saying they won't sign it because many right because there's too many right wing signing wing people signing the declaration . i've had people declaration. i've had people saying won't it saying they won't sign it because disagree with one because they disagree with one of signatories. and i've of the signatories. and i've even message and even had people message me and say won't sign it say that they won't sign it because a bloke i because i'm a bloke and that i should leave it to the women to sort out. >> but but this is something that everyone. that affects everyone. it affects everyone society. >> i've said time and time again, in this again, we all have skin in this game. single one of is game. every single one of us is impacted whether it's impacted by this. whether it's women's rights, children's safeguarding, free speech. but actually even just upholding reality. know, we as human reality. you know, we as human beings flourish embrace beings flourish if we embrace reality, if we embrace delusion, we all as a result. we all suffer as a result. i mean, that's very dispiriting to hear for this hear that, because for me, this is of and is not an issue of left and right. is not an issue of left and rigithis be non—partisan . >> this should be non—partisan. this should be something where sensible from sides sensible people from all sides of political spectrum can of the political spectrum can

agree. going on in agree. so what's going on in society, therefore, where people think, guilt think, oh, there will be guilt by association who by association if someone who disagrees me some other disagrees with me on some other issues signs declaration , issues signs this declaration, we're living in a world of cancel culture. >> andrew you know, in some ways i people because i don't blame people because they fear that, you know, people will for jobs and will come for their jobs and come reputations. come for their reputations. it's true. come true. like people may well come for them. i've tried for them. you know, i've tried to people that to emphasise to people that we're all public we're anonymizing all public signatures, then people signatures, but even then people are that people have come are scared that people have come to what about if the to me saying, what about if the system gets hacked? is how system gets hacked? this is how terrified of terrified people are of simply saying men become saying that men cannot become women. crazy. women. i mean, it's crazy. >> so the solution is >> so the solution then is through through law, through parliament, through law, through the judiciary. i mean, this solve isn't it? >> it's through law. the equality act needs to make it clear that biological clear that sex is biological sex. with the gender sex. similarly, with the gender recognition act, we need to make sure this is out sure that this is out of schools. make schools. we need to make sure that banning men from that sports are banning men from competing against we need competing against women. we need to people are not to make sure that people are not being their jobs for being fired from their jobs for believing reality. believing in biological reality. and upholding lgbt and we need to be upholding lgbt rights attraction rights and same sex attraction in there's in society. so there's various different avenues to go through. but mean, not going to be

but i mean, it's not going to be easy. was just easy. you know, this was just trying the dialogue up. trying to open the dialogue up. but, we've a long but, you know, we've got a long way go. so is itjust that way to go. so is itjust that people understand the people don't understand the issues that they're issues or is it that they're scared because there's a bit of both scared because there's a bit of bot isn't there? scared because there's a bit of bot ismean are? scared because there's a bit of botlsmean ,'e? scared because there's a bit of botlsmean , i? scared because there's a bit of botlsmean , i think if you were >> i mean, i think if you were to ask your average person on the you know, can man the street, you know, can a man become think they become a woman, i think they would clearly, no, they would say very clearly, no, they can't. i'd most people, can't. i'd say for most people, they see as they don't see it as particularly relevant themselves. they try and keep themselves out of the debate because, know, become because, you know, it's become quite toxic at the end of the day. you know, people have lost friendships even romantic relationships disagreeing, friendships even romantic relationshi|points. disagreeing, friendships even romantic relationshi|points. disagthinkg, over these points. so i think people themselves people try and keep themselves to we to themselves. so i think we need society to need to encourage society to appreciate this affects all appreciate that this affects all of yes know, me, of us. yes you know, for me, this is actually the issue of our time. this is actually the issue of our it's e. this is actually the issue of our it's a this is actually the issue of ourit's a huge issue and i think >> it's a huge issue and i think people don't recognise the impact various impact this has on various minority rights. gay minority groups rights. gay rights in particular is worry minority groups rights. gay rigime.1 particular is worry minority groups rights. gay rigime. the'ticular is worry minority groups rights. gay rigime. the fact.ar is worry minority groups rights. gay rigime. the fact that worry minority groups rights. gay rigime. the fact that as worry minority groups rights. gay rigime. the fact that as youy for me. the fact that as you mentioned, a lesbian speed dating event shut down dating event can be shut down because refuses have because it refuses to have men there . i because it refuses to have men there. i mean, because it refuses to have men there . i mean, it's so it's so there. i mean, it's so it's so absurd , but there is a kind of absurd, but there is a kind of demonising of gay people now going on which needs to be addressed. >> but i mean, it's crazy to be

accused of being transphobic for being sex attracted , you being same sex attracted, you know, because you're not attracted somebody else's attracted to somebody else's genden its attracted to somebody else's gender. it's madness. gender. i mean, it's madness. >> say that that >> but people say that that phrase same sex phrase is transphobic. same sex attracted. heard that. attracted. i've heard that. >> but but, you know, thought >> but but, you know, i thought we a kind of we were becoming a kind of tolerant but tolerant liberal society. but actually, back in the actually, we're way back in the bad days. bad old days. >> it is. we are going >> yeah, it is. we are going back by decades, aren't we? anyway thanks much anyway james, thanks very much for really forjoining me today. really appreciate . so still to come appreciate it. so still to come on free speech nation , we're on free speech nation, we're going to be bringing you the videos gone viral videos that have gone viral this week and plus, we'll be answering unfiltered answering your unfiltered dilemmas you've got any dilemmas. so if you've got any problems, emailing in. problems, do keep emailing in. see a moment

on mark dolan tonight from ten. >> as we remember our fallen heroes from two world wars, what would they make of the hate playing out on britain's streets? did they give their lives in vain and as pressure grows on, the home secretary should suella braverman stay or go ? i'll be asking former home go? i'll be asking former home office minister ann widdecombe. plus, prince harry pays the

ultimate price and mrs. remembrance sunday reaction from fearless royal journalist angela levin, who has harsh words for the prince. we're live . at ten. the prince. we're live. at ten. welcome back to free speech nation. >> with me, andrew doyle. and it's time for social sensations . it's time for social sensations. that's the part of the show where we look at what's been going week on social going viral this week on social media. up, media. exciting stuff. first up, a new social media phenomenon capturing moment football capturing the moment football club in with the club mascots join in with the minute's silence at a football match. here's a here's video match. here's a here's a video of . of. that's sweet, isn't it? >> francis, do you think that's respectful or. i think it's very respectful. >> yeah, i like it. things >> yeah, i like it. things >> you can't do anything dressed like that without looking a bit stupid. >> no, you can't. no, my favourite is when mascots fight. have no. have you seen that? no. >> that happen? yeah >> does that happen? yeah >> does that happen? yeah

>> there's >> there happens. there's a couple of them that get really aggressive with one another and they having punch up they start having a punch up like a disneyland. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> no. the opposition >> no, no. the opposition mascots the football game. mascots in the football game. no. you do. get, like no. yeah, you do. you get, like a beating the hell of a hammer beating the hell out of a hammer beating the hell out of a swan. great. a swan. it's great. >> never seen bruce >> i've never seen that bruce have you that kind of thing? >> i don't think that's where we hang. think any of that. hang. i don't think any of that. >> no sporting is >> no sporting stuff is necessarily aimed at us. >> no, i mean. >> no, i mean. >> well, you're missing bruce. >> elephant. can imagine that >> elephant. i can imagine that getting shuttlecock. okay , next up, we've got this video. >> this is a woman declaring her love for her boyfriend by tattooing his name on her forehead. let's have a look . forehead. let's have a look. yeah . okay let's see. yeah. okay let's see. >> okay . oh my god. i love it.

>> okay. oh my god. i love it. oh wow . okay. oh wow. okay. >> he's gonna love it. >> he's gonna love it. >> now, wait a minute. that's got to be henna, right? that's not permanent. >> i didn't think so. the funny thing not only thing was, i thought not only have you been stupid enough to do that because she was really, really i really creasing her forehead, i thought, get some thought, please go and get some botox. offensive look botox. this is offensive to look at. has her. at. now, kevin has left her. >> kevin left already? >> has kevin left already? left her? that ? her? yes. because of that? >> i think so. >> i think so. >> well, i don't blame him. >> well, i don't blame him. >> i think it's >> well, i think it's ridiculous. know what ridiculous. but you know what i don't understand? why would you? if real, why would you if that is real, why would you disfigure in way? disfigure yourself in that way? but she thought but then i suppose she thought it to be for life it was going to be for life and that was always going to that kevin was always going to be i'm lying. >> i'm lying. >> i'm lying. >> don't know, kevin. >> i don't know, kevin. >> i don't know, kevin. >> i don't know, kevin. >> i don't know how. >> i don't know how. >> i don't know how. >> i just she's a fool. >> i just think she's a fool. >> i just think she's a fool. >> think mean, what >> do you think i mean, what happens, does leave? >> going to be awkward, >> it's going to be awkward, isn't awkward? >> it's going to be awkward, isn' anyway, zward? >> it's going to be awkward, isn'anyway, how ? >> it's going to be awkward, isn'anyway, how do you it's >> anyway, how do you know it's not? >> you just get another boyfriend called kevin. >> way to do it. >> that's the only way to do it. that's only way to deal with that's the only way to deal with it. do you get a job? how do that's the only way to deal with it. toy you get a job? how do that's the only way to deal with it. to avou get a job? how do that's the only way to deal with it. to a job get a job? how do that's the only way to deal with it. to a job interview�* how do that's the only way to deal with it. to a job interview with' do you go to a job interview with with your head? ask with kevin on your head? ask rules from natwest.

with kevin on your head? ask rules frorr get twest. with kevin on your head? ask rules frorr get tvijob. with kevin on your head? ask rules frorrgettvijob. yeah. >> she'll get a job. yeah. >> she'll get a job. yeah. >> mean that fines for that. >> i mean that fines for that. yeah, but that's ridiculous. >> thought of that >> i always thought of that whenever george clooney in whenever i saw george clooney in from dawn. know, from dusk till dawn. you know, he's very sexy he's got that very sexy neck tattoo. thought, like, he's got that very sexy neck tatt0(are thought, like, he's got that very sexy neck tatt0(are youthought, like, he's got that very sexy neck tatt0(are you going t, like, he's got that very sexy neck tatt0(are you going t, ido? go what are you going to do? go into a job interview with that? >> george, such >> i suppose, george, such a conservative. i just it's unbelievable. saw george unbelievable. you saw george clooney a neck tattoo clooney with a neck tattoo who you admitted sexy. and you just admitted was sexy. and the thing that you thought the first thing that you thought of is he of was i thought, how is he going a job? well, going to get a job? well, yeah. >> george clooney going >> how is george clooney going to because i wouldn't to get a job? because i wouldn't employ that. employ him looking like that. >> what any and who was >> what also any and who was i with yesterday? alex kingston. so all linked. >> we do that on this show. lots of linked themes. >> cohesion. yes. >> cohesion. yes. >> it's >> so much depth. it's like peeung >> so much depth. it's like peeling onion. anyway >> so much depth. it's like peeoh, onion. anyway >> so much depth. it's like peeoh, finally,)n. anyway >> so much depth. it's like peeoh, finally, we'verway >> so much depth. it's like peeoh, finally, we've got�* >> so much depth. it's like peeoh, finally, we've got a >> oh, finally, we've got a woman on tiktok. woman now on tiktok. >> what's tiktok switched >> now, what's a tiktok switched manifesting for being delusional? what delusional? i don't know what that i'm that phrase means, but i'm excited out. let's have that phrase means, but i'm e) look. out. let's have a look. >> i truly believe the easiest way to become confident is by gaslighting yourself. this is how i gossip myself into becoming number becoming a confident, bad number one, doesn't like me, one, if a man doesn't like me, i just gay. like just assume they're gay. like i'm coolest, i'm literally the coolest, hottest, the hottest, prettiest person in the entire quite entire world. there's quite literally other reason to literally no other reason not to be number two,

be obsessed with me. number two, stop criticising others what you criticise and others is what you hate yourself . if you're hate about yourself. if you're always others for always criticising others for their bodies, you're probably insecure about your body. if you're criticising you're constantly criticising others their intelligence, others about their intelligence, you're probably a little insecure your intelligence i >> -- >> it's okay. she's got the most annoying voice in the world, but also, honest with you, also, to be honest with you, i prefer the woman who had the kevin tattooed on her end. >> more . >> yeah, much more. >> yeah, much more. >> this about this genre >> what is this about this genre of people on tiktok sort of young people on tiktok sort of young people on tiktok sort of hectoring and lecturing people like they know everything. >> it's really it's really annoying. >> yeah. and it's also it's not even that. it's just she is the most repellent person i what's just narcissism . just narcissism. >> there's a lot of narcissists about these days. >> i'm looking at right >> yeah i'm looking at one right now aren't you. i'm not narcissist . no. narcissist. no. >> i know you're stupid, though. >> i know you're stupid, though. >> now let's move on to your unfiltered dilemmas. this is where you've sent in all of your personal problems. i'm very grateful. dilemma grateful. our first dilemma came in beth has said, in from beth and beth has said, my housemate has found my friend's housemate has found bedbugsin my friend's housemate has found bedbugs in their room. we're due to see each other in a few weeks

time. is it wrong of me to cancel now? these have cancel now? you know, these have been in france. been popping up in france. apparently a lot of concerns about bedbugs. there's a bedbug infestation about bedbugs. there's a bedbug infestatin over about bedbugs. there's a bedbug infestatinover here. they're to come over here. they're grotesque creatures, aren't they? they're horrible . would they? they're horrible. would you if you knew someone you cancel if you knew someone had bedbugs? you cancel if you knew someone hacyeah, ugs? you cancel if you knew someone hacyeah, ugwouldn't go around to >> yeah, i wouldn't go around to someone's house if you knew it. >> just even there. >> they were just even there. >> they were just even there. >> then i'd like that. >> and then i'd be like that. that's not for me, really? >> they're not >> yeah. because they're not microscopic, are they? you can actually see them. >> half >> they're about half a millimetre they're little millimetre and they're little red. sort of red. they're little sort of little when little red creatures when they're blood. but also. >> oh well they colour >> oh well they change colour when they filled them. >> they fill with blood they when they filled them. >> tit's fill with blood they when they filled them. >> tit's horrendous. od they when they filled them. >> mobilenrrendous. od they when they filled them. >> mobile haemorrhoids. they when they filled them. >> mobile haemorrhoids. yeah,( >> mobile haemorrhoids. yeah, exactly . exactly. >> they are , they are. >> they are, they are. >> they are, they are. >> but i'm not saying that. >> but i'm not saying that. >> don't. yes good. francis, finish your sentence. >> i was going to say i can't match that now, can i? >> but what do we do about them? but what should beth do? you know? >> well, it depends . so is it. >> well, it depends. so is it. so we're due to see each other? no, you only do it if you know you're going to get some nookie.

and it's going to be great. >> well, not just in the >> well, it's not just in the beds, though, it? beds, though, is it? >> can travel. >> the bugs can travel. >> the bugs can travel. >> the can travel everywhere. >> yeah. no, that's absolutely horrendous. think awful. horrendous. i think it's awful. anyway on another anyway let's move on to another dilemma. from carla. dilemma. this is from carla. that's haven't that's a name we haven't heard in while. in a while. >> like that name. carla >> no, i like that name. carla >> no, i like that name. carla >> a pipe burst near me yesterday, was water yesterday, and there was water everywhere. guy everywhere. i drove past a guy walking puddles his walking in puddles up to his ankles to give him a ankles and stopped to give him a lift. when i saw how filthy lift. but when i saw how filthy his got, i drove his jeans had got, i drove off instead . form. bruce. instead. bad form. bruce. >> all, never >> first of all, that never happened, know. well done, happened, you know. well done, carla. hysterical. carla. that is hysterical. i think delusional one think she's the delusional one from tiktok. right but i wouldn't blame her if she saw someone's jeans someone's manky jeans and thought, don't give thought, you know, i don't give people lifts. i don't want them manky plush. manky epidermis on my plush. exactly yeah. >> if they've got mobile haemorrhoids. >> well exactly. that's the whole thing. >> like to think that we trust >> i like to think that we trust the people who in. i like the people who email in. i like to think she's telling the truth and telling the and given that she's telling the truth. do you think? truth. bruce, what do you think? frances my name is bruce france, having at him doubting having a dig at him for doubting her veracity. having a dig at him for doubting herokay. ty. having a dig at him for doubting herokay. got having a dig at him for doubting her okay. got you. so you know, >> okay. got you. so you know, i'm with bruce. no

>> okay. you wouldn't you wouldn't pick up someone with manky jeans? >> no, disgusting. >> no, no, it's disgusting. okay, fair enough. >> no need. >> no need. >> be presentable if you >> yeah. be presentable if you want have wash. absolutely. want to have a wash. absolutely. absolutely hygiene advice. absolutely good hygiene advice. that's program that's what this program is all about. move on to our about. now, let's move on to our final this from dave final dilemma. this is from dave . says, younger . dave says, my younger colleagues keep sending me voice notes , meaning i have to find notes, meaning i have to find then untangle all my earphones before you say it. i know i'm ancient for not having airpods , ancient for not having airpods, so about to say that. but so i was about to say that. but how making them send how do i stop making them send voice i have voice notes? i don't have a problem voice notes. problem with voice notes. >> i love a voice note because i am disliked. leave am so disliked. sick. i leave you notes the time. you voice notes all the time. >> yes, i appreciate it. no i do. >> i think it's just it's so much easier. >> i think it's just it's so mu yeah.;ier. >> i think it's just it's so mu yeah.;iecall him and never >> yeah. i call him and he never gets back me. gets back to me. >> oh, she's rammed my gaff all the time, frances. >> get back. look this >> i do. get back. look this isn't forum to resolve isn't the forum to resolve henrietta haemorrhoid , what do henrietta haemorrhoid, what do you make of this? >> you voice notes? >> do you like the voice notes? >> do you like the voice notes? >> it is sometimes >> i mean, it is sometimes quicker, isn't it? >> you know, if you're going to type a big, message, it type out a big, long message, it depends on voice note. type out a big, long message, it deplflds on voice note. type out a big, long message, it de|: if it'san voice note. type out a big, long message, it de|: if it's short voice note. type out a big, long message, it de|: if it's short and:e note. type out a big, long message, it de|: if it's short and concise, >> if it's short and concise, brilliant. it's one of these brilliant. if it's one of these

long rambling that you see, long rambling ones that you see, you're minutes. you're like three minutes. what are doing? you're going to are you doing? you're going to give me a shakespearean monologue for three minutes. >> times two in >> but you do on times two in the same way. that's how you listen to an audiobook. that woman that with woman didn't admit that with your listening to it. yeah, you loved listening to it. yeah, you were on at the time, were they? >> they put me on times two. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get in my voice. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get no, in my voice. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get no, you in my voice. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get no, you do, ny voice. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get no, you do, do voice. yeah. yeah. but then you don't get no, you do, do you? >> oh, no, you do, do you? you don't any speed. bruce devlin. >> this is why we have him for on outrageous comments. on these outrageous comments. yeah, i'm appalled. i don't know where can go from that. bruce where we can go from that. bruce so just to bring the so i'm just going to bring the show a close on that i could show to a close on that i could guess if you like. well, show to a close on that i could guess maybef you like. well, show to a close on that i could guess maybe somelike. well, show to a close on that i could guess maybe some otherilell, show to a close on that i could guess maybe some other week. maybe, maybe some other week. anyway, thank you so much for joining us for free speech nation. the week when nation. this was the week when we saw very disturbing scenes on the london. the the streets of london. the king's wasn't as king's speech wasn't as environmental many environmental friendly as many people and a well people had hoped, and a well endowed anglo—saxon giant came under fire. thank you so much to my lovely panel, bruce devlin and frances foster. and to all the guests that you've seen on tonight's show. and by way, tonight's show. and by the way, if join us live in if you want to join us live in the studio, be part of our

wonderful studio audience. it's easily there's a website easily done. there's a website on screen right now. it's on the screen right now. it's w—w—w audiences.com. so do w—w—w dot audiences.com. so do come along. we've got wine, we've got food, we've got sausage rolls, all kinds of things. do stay tuned for the dinosaur hour. that's coming up next. john is talking to next. john cleese is talking to various about notion various people about the notion of lot of people of wokeness and a lot of people don't understand it. so do watch that show because it will clarify issues. clarify a lot of your issues. and forget that headliners clarify a lot of your issues. aron forget that headliners clarify a lot of your issues. aron everyorget that headliners clarify a lot of your issues. aron every nightthat headliners clarify a lot of your issues. aron every night att headliners clarify a lot of your issues. aron every night at 11:00.iliners is on every night at 11:00. that's our paper preview show with you with comedians taking you through next day's top news through the next day's top news stories. thanks so much for watching. speech nation. stories. thanks so much for watchingnext speech nation. stories. thanks so much for watchingnext weekech nation. stories. thanks so much for watchingnext week .h nation. stories. thanks so much for watchingnext week . hello on. stories. thanks so much for watchingnext week . hello there. see you next week. hello there. good evening and jonathan vautrey here. >> your gb news weather forecast provided by the met office. many of will be up to of us will be waking up to a very unsettled start to the new of us will be waking up to a very unsweek start to the new of us will be waking up to a very unsweek andt to the new of us will be waking up to a very unsweek and thatthe new of us will be waking up to a very unsweek and that is> new of us will be waking up to a very unsweek and that is duev of us will be waking up to a very unsweek and that is due to working week and that is due to storm debby. this area of low pressure that is very quickly going overnight going to deepen overnight and into tomorrow, producing some very particularly very strong winds, particularly directly southern flank directly on the southern flank of northern areas of that for northern areas of england, of the england, coastal areas of the

irish throughout this irish sea. throughout this evening, have one band of evening, we do have one band of rain its across rain sweeping its way across scotland, this rain in rain sweeping its way across sco southwest this rain in rain sweeping its way across sco southwest that1is rain in rain sweeping its way across sco southwest that is rain in rain sweeping its way across sco southwest that is associated the southwest that is associated with very with storm debby. some very heavy england , wales heavy pulses for england, wales and ireland, where and into northern ireland, where it could be very persistent, some localised flooding is possible early hours possible during the early hours of . temperatures of monday morning. temperatures around 7 to for most of us, around 7 to 9 c for most of us, but some patchy frost is possible the far possible across the very far north a very north of scotland, but a very disruptive morning rush hour penod disruptive morning rush hour period for lot of us. some period for a lot of us. some very winds, gales very strong winds, severe gales up to 80mph along coastal areas of the irish sea. very blustery over and northern over the pennines and northern areas well. the areas of england as well. the rain its into rain sweeps its way up into eastern areas scotland eastern areas of scotland where again, heavy and again, it could be heavy and produce flooding produce some localised flooding in brighter spells in places, some brighter spells for southern england for southern areas of england and into northern and wales and into northern ireland on in the ireland later on in the afternoon. is still going afternoon. but it is still going to be a very windy day here. nonetheless us temperatures between tuesday between 9 and 15 c. tuesday looks less disruptive than monday, it is still going to monday, but it is still going to be unsettled side with a be on the unsettled side with a mixture of in there. mixture of showers in there. some those heavy with some of those heavy with thunderstorms as well. some of those heavy with thlotierstorms as well. some of those heavy with thlotierscloud as well. some of those heavy with thlotierscloud for as well. some of those heavy with thlotierscloud for northern well. a lot of cloud for northern england into scotland, but northern ireland, southern areas of wales see of england and wales may see

some in some some sunshine in between. some of showers well, of those showers as well, remaining unsettled the remaining unsettled into the second the week second half of the week as well with wet and with further wet and windy weather

>> and welcome back. very good evening to you. i'm aaron armstrong in the gb newsroom. the home secretary's criticised what she's described as sick, inflammatory criminal inflammatory and criminal behaviour during the armistice day demonstration in london, saying necessary saying further actions necessary hundreds thousands of hundreds of thousands of pro—palestinian protesters marched peacefully through the capital yesterday , but the met capital yesterday, but the met police says it's actively investigate a number of possible cases hate crimes. suella cases of hate crimes. suella braverman says anti—semitic braverman says anti —semitic chants, braverman says anti—semitic chants, placards and paraphernalia openly on display marked a new low. she praised officers, though, for their professionalism . after far right professionalism. after far right counter—protesters who were trying to confront the rally clashed with police. nine officers were injured . police officers were injured. police confirmed the vast majority of the 145 arrests were counter protesters . seven have been

protesters. seven have been charged with various offences.