>> it's 7:00. very good evening to you. i'm alan armstrong in the gb newsroom and the international red cross says 17 hostages are now in israel after being released by hamas in gaza . being released by hamas in gaza. israel's prison service has confirmed the release of 39 palestine prisoners . in palestine prisoners. in exchange, it is the third of a four day pause in fighting in total, the two sides have agreed total, the two sides have agreed to swap 50 israeli hostages for 150. jailed. palestinian says a four year old israeli american girl was among those released earlier . us girl was among those released earlier. us president biden has welcomed the news and says he hopes the truce will be extended i >> -- >> so i'm hopeful this is not the end. it's going to continue , the end. it's going to continue, but we don't know and but i get a sense that . all the players in a sense that. all the players in the region, even the neighbours who aren't, have been directly involved. now we're looking for a way to end this.

involved. now we're looking for a way to end this . so the a way to end this. so the hostages are all released and hamas is completely. how can i say it , no hamas is completely. how can i say it, no longer in control of any portion of gaza. meanwhile israel's prime minister has been meeting security forces inside northern gaza . northern gaza. >> benjamin netanyahu was given security updates and visited one of the tunnels, discovered by his troops. the prime minister told his soldiers, we have three goals for this war. eliminate hamas, return all are abductees and ensure gaza does not become and ensure gaza does not become a threat to the state of israel again . an irish israeli girl who again. an irish israeli girl who was initially feared dead has been reunited with her father following her release by hamas late last night . following her release by hamas late last night. nine year old emily hand was among 17 hostages freed by the terror group yesterday . she spent 50 days in yesterday. she spent 50 days in captivity. a 13 israelis, along with four thai nationals, were transported out of gaza through the rafah border crossing to eqypt the rafah border crossing to egypt. the rafah border crossing to egypt . emily the rafah border crossing to egypt. emily was kidnapped from

a kibbutz on the 7th of october. she a man has been arrested on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence in london. as tens of thousands of people marched against anti—semitism, police say he was heard shouting at crowds. towards the end of the day , it towards the end of the day, it was the second of two arrests earlier in the founder of the engush earlier in the founder of the english defence league, tommy robinson, was detained after he tried to join the march . it tried to join the march. it comes amid concerns over a rise in hate crime in the uk sparked by the conflict in gaza. former prime minister boris johnson, who was at the march, described anti—semitism as a virus which lurks beneath the floorboards of western civilisation . western civilisation. >> what we're all doing here and the only thing we're really doing is showing solidarity with jewish people. and that's necessary because 7 jewish people. and that's necessary because .7 because since necessary because? because since october the 7th, i'm afraid there's been a very peculiar response in many parts of the world, including i'm sad to say, in london at and what we've seen

is a i'm afraid that the re—emergence of anti—semitism and a failure to focus on the appalling terrorist acts of hamas. >> we're live across the uk, on tv, on digital radio. if you want us on your smart speaker you can say play gb news now it's you can say play gb news now wsfime you can say play gb news now it's time for free speech nation . riots in dublin, the netherlands turns to the far right and doctor who takes care not to misgender an alien. >> this is free speech nation . >> this is free speech nation. on. welcome to free speech nafion on. welcome to free speech nation with me andrew doyle. this is the show where we take a look at culture current affairs and politics. we have a very busy night ahead on the day of the first national march against anti—semitism, we're going to be speaking to two members of a new campaign designed to campaign group designed to defend jews after

defend british jews after a shocking stabbing in dublin this week was followed by violent riots . we're going to be hearing riots. we're going to be hearing about how the reporting of the situation implications situation has major implications for speech. and we'll have for free speech. and we'll have two guests debate whether two guests on to debate whether the president elect of the new president elect of argentina is a libertarian who can usher in a new age of prosperity or an extremely dangerous crank. prosperity or an extremely dangerous crank . and of course, dangerous crank. and of course, myself and my fantastic panel will be answering questions from our wonderful studio audience tonight . my our wonderful studio audience tonight. my comedian panellists are wetton and jonathan are cressida wetton and jonathan cogan. are cressida wetton and jonathan cogan . welcome, both. thank you. cogan. welcome, both. thank you. >> looking very dapper. >> looking very dapper. >> you normally dress down for this show, but that's a nice corduroy top. >> i think you have the exact same one i have. >> yeah, i know you're trying to copy every respect. copy me in every respect. >> yeah. well, i can't >> well, yeah. well, i can't read as well as you, but, you know, at the same time, it looks kind nice. kind of nice. >> wonderful. you were >> wonderful. cressida, you were out anti anti anti out on the anti anti anti semitism today. march semitism march today. the march against against the march against march against the march for and how for anti semitism. and how was it? >> very peaceful. i was >> it was very peaceful. i was there for a couple of hours.

yeah >>i yeah >> i think the story behind the story is you're trying to find a nice jewish single doctor, weren't that's what weren't you? that's that's what i so cynical anyway. i heard. well so cynical anyway. >> you downloaded szipe. >> well, you downloaded szipe. >> well, you downloaded szipe. >> what is that? oh, >> carry on. what is that? oh, it's dating app forjews. it's like a dating app forjews. >> you making that up? >> are you making that up? >> are you making that up? >> no, a thing. so, >> no, it's a real thing. so, szipe. there's are szipe. yeah. there's also are willing to convert the jarang it down. i'll set you up. know. >> i'm giving her tips. okay. we're going get some we're going to get some questions from the audience. we're going to get some qu> now he's talking about >> well, now he's talking about some behaviour. problem some poor behaviour. the problem is are a member of the is if you are a member of the far right, it's a brilliant week is if you are a member of the far you, , it's a brilliant week is if you are a member of the far you, isn't a brilliant week is if you are a member of the far you, isn't it?»rilliant week is if you are a member of the far you, isn't it? because /eek for you, isn't it? because you've got lots of other behaviour to hide in. if people who are upset general are who are upset in general are being far right, yes, being called the far right, yes, it's same thing of what it's the same old thing of what exactly do we mean by far right.

>> the trouble is that does >> the trouble is that that does not accurately was not accurately reflect what was going now, there were going on there. now, there were some shops, as some people who looted shops, as far concerned. as soon as far as i'm concerned. as soon as you're looting shops, you're not really that protest really part of that protest anymore. an opportune anymore. you're an opportune east, got nothing anymore. you're an opportune ea do got nothing anymore. you're an opportune ea do with got nothing anymore. you're an opportune ea do with the got nothing anymore. you're an opportune ea do with the situation. >thing to do with the situation. >> you've lost your political cards you? cards there, haven't you? >> that was >> exactly. but that was a minority there were a lot of minority and there were a lot of people are very upset about people who are very upset about what migration this what the migration policies this was, we don't was, this stabbing. we don't know full details of did know the full details of who did it motives behind it, but it or the motives behind it, but but the person interest to but the person of interest to the was an algeria. an the police was an algeria. an algerian. yeah. and so people are raising are they've been raising concerns. hasn't concerns. the discussion hasn't been so there's been a been had. and so there's been a lot tension. i'm not for lot of tension. now i'm not for a second justifying riots and looting because i don't think that's but to that's right at all. but to just dismiss all as a bunch of dismiss all this as a bunch of far right activists is actually factually wrong, i think. >> no, think you're right. >> no, i think you're right. there i think the reaction that we yesterday pretty we saw yesterday was pretty extreme. to be a extreme. it seemed to be a generalised displacement of anger which generalised displacement of ar never which generalised displacement of ar never you which generalised displacement of ar never you just/hich is never okay. you can't just tie everyone the same brush tie everyone with the same brush and attack a group. and then attack a group. exactly. but at the same time, you people's is you can't ignore people's is

legitimate we see legitimate anger. when we see such a horrific event. legitimate anger. when we see suc well,)rrific event. legitimate anger. when we see schell, irific event. legitimate anger. when we see schell, i mean,ant. and >> well, i mean, again and again, the far right do seem to benefit from that benefit from the fact that sensible, centrist politicians won't discussions won't have sensible discussions about won't have sensible discussions aboyeah, absolutely. if there's >> yeah, absolutely. if there's if there's no discussion going on in the middle, then people have legitimate concerns, have got legitimate concerns, feel and they're more feel unheard and they're more likely, if you likely, aren't they, to if you push something down, it'll pop up ugly. push something down, it'll pop up yeah. ugly. push something down, it'll pop up yeah. yeah.ugly. push something down, it'll pop up yeah. yeah. pretty grim >> yeah. yeah. pretty grim stuff. okay. well, we've got a question from roger. hello, question now from roger. hello, rogen question now from roger. hello, roger. to need pronoun roger. hello to who need pronoun lessons ? well well, doctor who's lessons? well well, doctor who's come back ? david tennant's come come back? david tennant's come back into it for some reason, i thought he'd been killed off or something. i don't watch it. i don't know. but he's come back and there's a thing's gone viral because the first episode had him discussing an alien's pronouns. so well, let's a pronouns. so well, let's have a look. let's a look at this. look. let's have a look at this. >> promise can help him get >> i promise i can help him get home. and then you'll never see me again. >> you're assuming as >> you're assuming he as a pronoun. true? >> yes. sorry point. are >> yes. sorry good point. are you or she? you he or she? >> well, my chosen pronoun is the definite article . i am the definite article. i am always the me .

always the me. >> i think it would have worked , >> i think it would have worked, to be honest. jonathan, what's annoying about that clip? i think you . you seem a bit think you. you seem a bit baffled by this . baffled by this. >> the special effects have not got any better. no, they haven't, have they? >> is annoying about that >> what is annoying about that is much. i mean, it's is not so much. i mean, it's stupid, right? the doctor asking an alien for its pronouns. anyway, stupid. anyway, that's stupid. anyway, on of but it's the on the face of it. but it's the assistant getting all haughty, saying assuming saying what you're assuming the pronouns massive pronouns of this massive gremlin or whatever the hell it is. pronouns of this massive gremlin or \that'sar the hell it is. pronouns of this massive gremlin or \that's a the hell it is. pronouns of this massive gremlin or \that's a good ell it is. pronouns of this massive gremlin or \that's a good points. pronouns of this massive gremlin or \that's a good point. i pronouns of this massive gremlin or\that's a good point. i mean, >> that's a good point. i mean, as as long as they as long as as long as they change the name to doctor who. them. exactly. them. yeah, exactly. >> will be all right. >> then it will be all right. >> then it will be all right. >> yeah. mean, they were just >> yeah. i mean, they were just sort i guess they were just sort of, i guess they were just showing like, hey, we're on side. that's what that was. >> no, it's hectoring. >> no, but it's hectoring. i mean, i'm a bit sick of this from bbc, this constant sort from the bbc, this constant sort of it's like it's of hectoring. it's like it's been religious been taken over by a religious maniacal group. >> like that. and i don't >> it is like that. and i don't know who it's i don't know. know who it's for. i don't know. i think the youth will be irritated by the kind of the irritated by it. the kind of the young, hip people, if they exist, the people who watch doctor you? doctor who are you? >> they don't

>> yeah, they don't they don't watch who. the hip watch doctor who. no, the hip ones don't watch. >> so who's it for then? it's just to annoy middle aged doctor who i think. just to annoy middle aged doctor whwell i think. just to annoy middle aged doctor whwell i i think. just to annoy middle aged doctor whwell i think k. just to annoy middle aged doctor whwell i think it's sort of >> well i think it's sort of upper millennials upper middle class millennials who seem progressive to who want to seem progressive to their well i feel seen. so do you feel seen? yeah. >> my experience with >> well, my experience with doctor is song that you doctor who is a song that you introduced to the doctor doctor who is a song that you introdlallj to the doctor doctor who is a song that you introdlall i to the doctor doctor who is a song that you introdlall i know the doctor doctor who is a song that you introdlall i know ofe doctor doctor who is a song that you introdlall i know of doctor»r doctor who is a song that you introdlall i know of doctor who. that's all i know of doctor who. >> all you know it. >> that's all you know of it. >> that's all you know of it. >> my said that when >> also, my mum said that when she laughing gas the she had laughing gas at the dentist as a kid, she used to have who dreams. have doctor who dreams. that's all know it. have doctor who dreams. that's all okay,v it. have doctor who dreams. that's all okay, that's it. have doctor who dreams. that's all okay, that's the limit. well, >> okay, that's the limit. well, i'm come on the i'm glad you've come on the panel i'm glad you've come on the panel. because clearly panel. yes. because clearly you're i just. i just you're an expert. i just. i just think one. think it's boring for one. i mean, it's just. it's like slipping a little bit of slipping in a little bit of marxist ideology or little marxist ideology and or a little bit hyper conservative ideology. >> wink. just oh, >> wink. it's just like, oh, we're as that's we're doing it as well. that's what is. we're doing it as well. that's whtl is. we're doing it as well. that's whtl think very sensitive we're doing it as well. that's withat, nk very sensitive we're doing it as well. that's withat, aren't very sensitive we're doing it as well. that's withat, aren't we?ery sensitive we're doing it as well. that's withat, aren't we?ery sfeeltive we're doing it as well. that's withat, aren't we?ery sfeel it.e to that, aren't we? we feel it. it's moving the story along. it's not moving the story along. it's not moving the story along. it's being over it's just being beaten over the head it. head with it. >> but actually, the alien didn't alien was like, >> but actually, the alien did|i'm alien was like, >> but actually, the alien did|i'm just alien was like, >> but actually, the alien did|i'm just the alien was like, >> but actually, the alien did|i'm just the meep. vas like, no, i'm just the meep. >> alien. no, i'm just the meep. >> yeah. alien. no, i'm just the meep. >> yeah. based en. no, i'm just the meep. >> yeah. based alien. we >> yeah. based alien. there we go. move on to question go. let's move on to a question from where's daniel? hi, from daniel. where's daniel? hi, annie. an oppressed >> so our four is an oppressed minority. are?

minority. we are? >> n minority. we are? >> yeah. furries now, i don't know you have heard of know if you guys have heard of furries. are people who furries. these are people who enjoy animals, enjoy dressing up as animals, usually so show usually for kinks. so the show doctors, which is this terrible soap had soap on bbc, and they had a whole episode about a furry someone being someone coming out as being a furry. let's the clip. furry. so let's watch the clip. if we if we can have a look. oh, yeah. i love it. yeah. yes, i love it. >> . yes, go valen. woohoo >> okay. yes, go valen. woohoo >> okay. yes, go valen. woohoo >> you look awesome . i'm going >> you look awesome. i'm going to get a bespoke suit . well, as to get a bespoke suit. well, as soon as i can scrape the cash together. does your seamstress do feathers? oh, i see. >> why not? what are you wearing tonight? >> well, i've borrowed some things from the drama department, so we'll see how that goes . that goes. >> check that rubbish off. i don't want it in the house. it's perverted . oh, so , i mean, look, perverted. oh, so, i mean, look, let's leave aside the terrible acting and script. >> they use the same special effects team as doctor who. they did, didn't they? there's no way that's a bespoke suit. that's like some halloween like some cheap halloween costume from claire's accessories. but the thing accessories. yeah but the thing about that is right, so basically, episode had to basically, this episode i had to watch quite a lot of it to get

the take the gist. they basically take all tropes of a typical gay all the tropes of a typical gay coming story and apply to coming out story and apply it to a who to dress as a bloke who wants to dress as a bean a bloke who wants to dress as a bear, ends taking his bear, and he ends up taking his granddad, old granddad, this bigoted old granddad, this bigoted old granddad wants to throw him granddad who wants to throw him out as a bear to out for dressing up as a bear to a furry club and there's a bunch of don't know you've a furry club and there's a bunch of the don't know you've a furry club and there's a bunch of the image,|'t know you've a furry club and there's a bunch of the image, butnow you've a furry club and there's a bunch of the image, but there's'ou've got the image, but there's a bunch this bar bunch of people in this bar sitting there. are sitting around there. they are dressed rabbits and dressed up as like rabbits and pigs, dressed up as like rabbits and pigs, got cows. pigs, and he's just got cows. >> just gets double teamed by couple. >> jonathan, a family >> jonathan, this is a family show family show. show. beg pardon? a family show. >> debate. this >> that means a debate. this after the watershed . after the watershed. >> after the watershed. >> it's not after the watershed. jonathan but jonathan was talking teams of talking about to teams of backgammon players. yes. anyway, the point is, here he was gammon all right. the point is here they've taken him to what was it's actually it feels like a satire of the gay experience of coming out . it's guy who coming out. it's like a guy who wants dress up a the wants to dress up as a bear. the grandfather him grandfather wants to throw him out, the out, but then he brings the grandfather to the club grandfather along to the club full people bears full of people dressed as bears and the grandfather is like, actually, fine. it's actually, this is fine. it's really actually really mean, isn't it? actually the homophobic, anti the kind of homophobic, anti anti gay satire you would have got from in the 1970s, isn't it? >> well yeah, very

>> well, it's yeah, it's very laboured . i don't know who isn't laboured. i don't know who isn't offended. mean gay people offended. i mean gay people probably furries if they're watching, shout out to ben henley, our friend eddie and actual i'm not sure i actual furry. i'm not sure i think so. up. anyway the think so. stand up. anyway the point is that a friend point is, is that a friend of yours dresses bear? as yours who dresses as a bear? as a a bear. yeah was it a dog, not a bear. yeah was it as dog? as a dog? as a dog? >> let's not get. let's not dwell on this. >> don't get waylaid. dwell on this. >> but.t get waylaid. dwell on this. >> but.t get 'honestly think >> but. but i honestly think that satire because that could be satire because i think is too bad. think the acting is too bad. no, i think i don't think so. >> you're giving the too >> you're giving the bbc too much credit there. that'd be too funny. that'd be far funny. that'd be. that'd be far too funny. funny. that'd be. that'd be far too yeah,unny. funny. that'd be. that'd be far too yeah, it'sy. funny. that'd be. that'd be far too yeah, it's funny, but don't >> yeah, it's funny, but i don't think it's intentional. you dont? think it's intentional. you don't? is. i'm don't? maybe it is. maybe i'm just maybe i'm just missing the joke. maybe i'm just missing the joke. maybe i'm just forest for just missing the joke. maybe i'm justtrees. forest for the trees. >> but. if it is serious, >> but. but if it is serious, then it does suggest a real problem at the bbc. doctor who asking yeah asking aliens for pronouns. yeah grandfather wants to throw someone out because he dresses as bean someone out because he dresses as bear. that's meant to as a bear. and that's meant to be rights issue. mean , be a civil rights issue. i mean, rosa parks wouldn't have been up in arms that, she? in arms about that, would she? >> i would have said >> i what would she have said about no it's not. about that? no it's not. >> my time. >> stop wasting my time. >> stop wasting my time. >> time. >> stop wasting my time. >> got time. >> stop wasting my time. >> got actual�*ne. >> stop wasting my time. >> got actual issues to >> i've got actual issues to deal with. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to your convention. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to

youit's convention. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to you it's justonvention. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to youit's just aivention. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to youit's just a it'stion. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to youit's just a it's an. >> yeah, absolutely. go go to youit's just a it's a nightmare. >> it's just a it's a nightmare. anyway, got question now anyway, we've got a question now from omicron? from omicron. where's omicron? hiya >> what's bubonic plague ? >> what's the bubonic plague? racist well, there are some academics who think that it was right. and this is at the museum of london, and they they've dug up all these old skulls and bones and stuff , up all these old skulls and bones and stuff, and up all these old skulls and bones and stuff , and they. they bones and stuff, and they. they think roughly nine of the think that roughly nine of the skulls or the bodies they dug up were of african origin. but then that's been contested . people that's been contested. people have said that might not be true because based on shapes because they based it on shapes of bones rather than anything else. itself. else. so that's dodgy in itself. yeah, said that maybe yeah, but they said that maybe they'd be. how did they describe it? systemic. pre—modern racism that within the virus, within the virus was racist. yeah. the plague was racist. racist? >> no. they're very careful to say not virus . it was >> no. they're very careful to say socioot virus . it was >> no. they're very careful to say socio stuff virus . it was >> no. they're very careful to say socio stuff going . it was >> no. they're very careful to say socio stuff going on. was the socio stuff going on. i mean, it's nonsense , isn't it? mean, it's nonsense, isn't it? >> well, half of london got killed by this, right? so this isn't wasn't a racist disease. >> no, it wasn't . but also, >> no, it wasn't. but also, would we be all that surprised to hear that people had different values that maybe different values and that maybe

by , i imagine by today's standards, i imagine things racist, right? things were quite racist, right? >> well, there weren't many people of african origin in london at the time. there were some, weren't many, some, but there weren't many, certainly. queen certainly. i mean, queen elizabeth wrote she was elizabeth wrote about she was getting by the mean, getting annoyed by the i mean, she racist. elizabeth, she was a bit racist. elizabeth, the first. but the fact that she mentions this a problem the first. but the fact that she menti(suggests a problem the first. but the fact that she menti(suggests that�*roblem the first. but the fact that she menti(suggests that there n the first. but the fact that she menti(suggests that there were firstly suggests that there were black people london the black people in london at the time, but that there time, but but also that there weren't many. right. so weren't many. right. right. so this bubonic this idea that the bubonic plague people that plague and these people that they've done and also to find that small sample that from a such a small sample size just seems to size as well, it just seems to be very quite you're looking for the just fell the i think someone just fell off their chair. just wonder off their chair. i just wonder why this helpful, jonathan? >> why? helpful. >> why? it's not helpful. >> why? it's not helpful. >> badenoch >> i know kemi badenoch has criticised that criticised this and said that this is completely unsubstantiated and is going to heighten gets clicks, heighten well, it gets clicks, doesn't it? >> it gets clicks and it gets people and that's what >> it gets clicks and it gets peo media and that's what >> it gets clicks and it gets peo media is and that's what >> it gets clicks and it gets peo media is so and that's what >> it gets clicks and it gets peo media is so you're at's what >> it gets clicks and it gets peo media is so you're saying at the media is so you're saying that by that i've fallen for it by getting riled now? no, but getting riled up now? no, but we're its flaws we're showing it for its flaws and exactly we're just and it's exactly we're just exposing in clinical way. >> we are the truth bringers and not getting remotely upset. >> upset. >> yes, i'm a little bit upset. i'm about . >> yes, i'm a little bit upset. i'm about. didn't i'm a bit upset about. didn't make a joke when the guy make a bad joke when the guy came that came out. i missed that opportunity.did. but it's gone

>> oh, you did. but it's gone too we're going to too late. anyway, we're going to move ivan. where's move on now to ivan. where's ivan? hi. >> ivan has the netherlands got its own donald trump? well, that's what people are saying, isn't you think, ivan? do >> what do you think, ivan? do you know about geert you know about this geert wilders been around for a >> yeah, he's been around for a long has. >> yeah, he's been around for a lon i has. >> yeah, he's been around for a loni mean, has. >> yeah, he's been around for a loni mean, a has. >> yeah, he's been around for a loni mean, a lot;. >> yeah, he's been around for a loni mean, a lot of people are >> i mean, a lot of people are upset. >> i mean, a lot of people are upset . what do you say? sorry upset. what do you say? sorry use the mic . use the mic. >> so socially liberal. yeah but anti—muslim. >> well, he is anti—muslim . i >> well, he is anti—muslim. i mean, he's specifically said that he wants to get rid of he wants to ban quran . he wants to wants to ban quran. he wants to ban mosques . that's dodgy. so ban mosques. that's dodgy. so this is not someone who. so, you know, i think this this phrase far right is really misused a lot of the time. but i think those are far right principles, aren't they ? aren't they? >> yeah. so you could say that some right. some of his ideas are far right. yes. doesn't necessarily mean yes. it doesn't necessarily mean that he in all of his ideas is. yeah, definitely. >> isn't interesting? >> but isn't this interesting? because that because people always said that when the netherlands, when it came to the netherlands, you were you know, that those people were always very sensible, liberal after brexit, they said that sort of thing could never happen there. actually because

there. but actually because again, it comes back to this point , again, it comes back to this point, people again, it comes back to this point , people not again, it comes back to this point, people not having sensible discussions about migration extreme migration leads to extreme reactions, right? and i think that's happened here. that's what's happened here. >> well, absolutely. and if you're a place that really you're in a place that really pndes you're in a place that really prides itself tolerance, prides itself on tolerance, it's not maybe you not surprising that maybe you you shy away from what you might shy away from what looked like difficult discussions . you might not have discussions. you might not have them until until you are having them. >> well, i mean, i do feel this because was in sweden recently because i was in sweden recently and they have real problems with gang crime and they've had real problems with assimilation from really reckless levels of migration , actually. and no migration, actually. and no attempt to implement assimilation . and so a lot of assimilation. and so a lot of the people i spoke to very sensible, often leftwing, often liberal people saying we just can't deal with this. right. you know, it is about trying know, so it is about trying to find moderate, sensible solutions to these problems . solutions to these problems. >> anytime when the discussion is off the table , that's when is off the table, that's when there's a problem. that seems to be sort of be ideology is overcome, sort of rational debate. you need to be able to discuss things because you need everyone to be playing the otherwise

the same game. otherwise society doesn't my concern is that >> and my concern is that i think there are racist groups who will capitalise on this . who will capitalise on this. absolutely. i mean, that makes me someone me really uncomfortable. someone like want to ban mosques. >> i believe in freedom of religion. absolutely you can't i don't should be able don't think you should be able to tell people they pray or to tell people how they pray or what or, you know . what they read or, you know. >> not a free society >> well, it's not a free society if agree, you know. it if you do agree, you know. so it is is a problem. so is a it is a problem. so sensible discussion. surely the way would have way forward, i would have thought. well, thought. okay. all right. well, we're to move on now. next we're going to move on now. next on though, on free speech nation, though, thousands of people have taken part in britain's first part today in britain's first national march against anti semitism. i'm going to be semitism. and i'm going to be joined are joined by two guests who are involved a new campaign involved in a new campaign group, which is there to defend british do come back british jews. so do come back and join us in a moment.

radio. >> welcome back to free speech nation. with me, andrew doyle. now thousands of people joined a march in london today against

anti—semitism , including former anti—semitism, including former prime minister boris johnson . prime minister boris johnson. the march follows an increase in anti—semitic incidents as a consequence war between consequence of the war between israel now a new israel and hamas. now a new group, our fight uk , has been group, our fight uk, has been set up to combat anti—semitism aimed at convincing non—jews that it's time to speak out. mark birbeck and daniel ben—ami are both involved in the group. i'm delighted to say they join me now. welcome to the show . me now. welcome to the show. thank you. so, mark, i'm going to come to you first because the this group are fight uk. this is your brainchild yes. is your brainchild. yes. this is something created something you've you've created did yeah created with other concerned individuals. >> well what's the origin >> yes. well what's the origin of the concern? >> where this start? >> where did this start? >> where did this start? >> the first step >> so for me, the first step personally after october 7, on october the 8th, the sunday afterwards, more news was filtering through about what had happened. filtering through about what had happened . and then i heard about happened. and then i heard about a vigil on october the ninth on the monday and i have a number of jewish friends and i just couldn't bear the idea that i would a week later and would see them a week later and say hadn't been to say that i hadn't been to the vigil. i just thought,

vigil. yes i just thought, you know, to go. and know, it's time to go. and i went expecting to see lots of other people there who were non—jewish . and i just expected non—jewish. and i just expected maybe a trade union banner. i expected just people to be so shocked by the events that they witnessed and the news reports on october the 7th. i just expected lots of people there. naive. i was naive. i turned up on this vigil outside downing street. i bumped into one of my neighbours who's jewish, and he actually asked me, what are you doing here? and it was like a real surprise because it became clear over the following weeks and the various vigils that jewish people did not expect that support. they genuinely did not expect a lot. >> but that's a very sad . it not expect a lot. >> but that's a very sad. it is state of affairs. it is incredible. i mean, are you heartened, though, by today's march? i mean, that was a huge march? i mean, that was a huge march . march. >> it a huge march. and >> it was a huge march. and i think it is very impressive. but there of people who there were lots of people who knew words to the israeli knew the words to the israeli national anthem . you know, it national anthem. you know, it was great. there were a lot more people. we had a banner there .

people. we had a banner there. so intervening weeks so in the intervening weeks since october the 7th, it became clear that needed to do clear that we needed to do something just simply something more than just simply turn i mean, set up campaign. >> it feels like a time for action, doesn't it? i mean, daniel, you your daniel, can i ask you your perception because one perception on this? because one of has really of the things that has really horrified open horrified me is the open declarations anti—semitism. declarations of anti—semitism. and i'm not saying for minute and i'm not saying for a minute that everyone on those pro—palestine is an pro—palestine marches is an anti—semite or is doing that. no, not. but but the no, no, they're not. but but the fact there are people no, no, they're not. but but the fact feel there are people no, no, they're not. but but the fact feel that; are people no, no, they're not. but but the fact feel that they people no, no, they're not. but but the fact feel that they can people no, no, they're not. but but the fact feel that they can openly e who feel that they can openly express anti—semitic views in a pubuc express anti—semitic views in a public surrounded by public space surrounded by thousands and no one thousands of people and no one does about it , that to does anything about it, that to me quite shocking . do me is been quite shocking. do you feel way as well? it is you feel that way as well? it is quite shocking, although , i quite shocking, although, i mean, i set up a website after the last conflict in gaza and it's now forgotten. >> but some of these trends that have become very, very clear now. yes. will already beginning to apparent in may 2021, to be apparent in may 2021, where obviously after the second world war, open anti—semitism was very much unacceptable. yeah, but now it's becoming more acceptable . i don't think it's acceptable. i don't think it's the majority of the british

population then, there's population then, but there's a significant minority kwasi who feel comfortable now about expressing anti—semitism openly, which is quite shocking . which is quite shocking. >> what i what i feel is that it's a sign of normalisation that if hizb ut—tahrir can stand there and call forjihad on the there and call for jihad on the streets of london and no one else and the else does anything and the police them, police don't arrest them, that suggests within suggests the problem within that movement, not that movement, doesn't it? not that everyone it, but that everyone endorses it, but that they're willing to let that go on in their midst. >> i think there are two different related things . so different related things. so there's which there's islamism, by which i mean as mean islam, islamism as a political movement . so i'm not political movement. so i'm not talking about the religion, but political hizb political movements are hizb ut—tahrir and ut—tahrir is one example. and they have no inhibitions about being anti—semitic . they're very being anti—semitic. they're very clearly anti—semitic, also clearly anti—semitic, but also so i would say those movements in a way, they kind of give permission to the kind of woke identitarian , some of identitarian people, some of them yeah to be more them anyway. yeah to be more openly anti—semitic because they think, well, if the oppressed this is their thinking that if the oppressed muslims are being openly anti—semitic, then maybe it's okay for us to talk about

jewish privilege and how bad jews are . so there is a jews are. so there is a relationship between the kind of woke anti—semitism and islamism. so both i think are apparent at the moment. >> so how have got into this >> so how have we got into this position? because as daniel says, the war, the idea of says, after the war, the idea of being openly anti—semitic was just considered appalling because of what the jews had gone through in the in the second world why have we gone through in the in the secoreachedi why have we gone through in the in the seco reached this why have we gone through in the in the seco reached this position? ve we now reached this position? i mean, obviously , the conflict mean, obviously, the conflict is something with it. but do something to do with it. but do you have any thoughts? well i think you say after the think the when you say after the war, world war. war, the second world war. >> i think it's >> yes. yes. so i think it's kind interesting because the kind of interesting because the slogan again is i think slogan never again is i think it's a very powerful slogan in and i think we need to sort of re—establish that promise. so after the second world war, everyone says never again. but but it's kind of we've got complacent it and nowadays people are saying never again is now some people object to that slogan. understandably they're worried that it creates the idea that we're now in the midst of kristallnacht again or the day

before , which i completely before, which i completely understand . but i do think we understand. but i do think we need to remake that promise that was made. so if you talk to older people , it goes without older people, it goes without saying that you would stand alongside jews. it goes without saying that october the 7th was a pogrom. they they call it out. they say it like it is. they haven't this kind of haven't got this kind of language we see today where language that we see today where a kidnapped child was lost, you know, and found and we saw that today. >> who is that ? who? >> who is that? who? >> who is that? who? >> you know, the. oh, yeah, the t shirt did it. >> yeah. yeah. saying that this person just though it was person was just as though it was an exactly. person was just as though it was an yeah. exactly. person was just as though it was an yeah. ithe tly. kind >> yeah. it's the same kind of language all language that's used all the time. bbc talk about, time. the bbc talk about, you know, hamas gunmen, you know, so constantly, like daniel says , constantly, like daniel says, the it gives license to people to have these kind of anti—semitic tropes. i think it's been very eye opening because it's not something i would have ever expected. >> the response to this in particular, the denials of what went on, hamas filmed a lot of their atrocities and boasted about tell us what about them. hamas tell us what they're views are about jewish

people. tell us that people. they tell us that they're genocidal, that they want jews they're want to wipe jews out. they're very so why very clear about that. so why i mean, people denying what we're being told and what we see with our own eyes something new, our own eyes is something new, isn't is. ithink our own eyes is something new, isn't is. i think it relates to >> it is. i think it relates to what written about quite what you've written about quite extensively terms, what you've written about quite extespecifically terms, what you've written about quite extespecifically in terms, what you've written about quite extespecifically in relation 1s, what you've written about quite extespecifically in relation to not specifically in relation to anti—semitism, because you anti—semitism, because if you have the this idea of identity politics where what's really important individuals is important about individuals is the their identity, what group they belong to, and then there's this this kind of hierarchy of privilege. yes. when you think of being kind of hyper of jews as being kind of hyper privileged, then then you can say, well, this terrible pogrom on the 7th of october doesn't really count because , you know, really count because, you know, these privileged jews these were hyper privileged jews were slaughtered. in were being slaughtered. so in this from warped this from this warped identitarian perspective , it identitarian perspective, it doesn't count. it doesn't matter . it'sjust doesn't count. it doesn't matter . it's just the oppressed people rising up. >> isn't that revealing even >> and isn't that revealing even when mass murder, when it comes to mass murder, these ideas can imposed. these ideas can be imposed. these ideas can be imposed. these sort of identitarian ideas. it's as though people just turn a blind eye. >> it's very revealing. so as you well know, the idea is they

present themselves as being really on the really kind of humane and on the right but then really kind of humane and on the rightend but then really kind of humane and on the rightend being but then really kind of humane and on the rightend being but to en really kind of humane and on the rightend being but to the they end up being blind to the worst kind of brutality worst possible kind of brutality imaginable . imaginable. >> and there's also this point that, you it's perfectly that, you know, it's perfectly possible the possible to be critical of the israeli government and way israeli government and the way in they're approaching in which they're approaching the conflict without being anti—semitic. that is a perfectly possible , consistent perfectly possible, consistent thing so is it so thing to do. so why is it so difficult so many people ? difficult for so many people? >> , i think the for us, the >> well, i think the for us, the big issue now is to almost put aside all of the history and all of the people were backwards and forwards with you on you know, who did what, when and call continually return to october 7 because what we're finding is that particularly young people today have lost their moral compass on this whole thing. they've kind of said, well, what do you expect with the, you know , with context? what do you , with the context? what do you expect? you expect these expect? what do you expect these people that's people to do? and i think that's kind because if you kind of crucial because if you try up on the try and take that up on the sense of the argument, this sense of the argument, will this happen happened happen this year that happened then and in fact , then you can't win. and in fact, actually, that isn't the point

of argument . you want to say of the argument. you want to say to people, look, that was a pogrom. out. like i said pogrom. call it out. like i said before, exactly was. before, say exactly what it was. make people and make sure people and particularly people particularly young people realise the scale of what we witnessed and to realise that israel is fighting effectively isis . yeah. in the modern way. isis. yeah. in the modern way. and i feel that's really important for us. older people in relation to our kids because i think what happens, what tends to happen is people don't want to happen is people don't want to get into the argument, well, because of the woke stuff. because of all the woke stuff. >> a of those because of all the woke stuff. >> people a of those because of all the woke stuff. >> people a tiktok|ose to young people on tiktok seem to be framing hamas as some of be framing hamas as some kind of resistance movement. they are genocidal and anti—semitic terrorists. yeah, i mean, that's what they are and that's what they say. they are. yeah, exactly. >> so we need to reorient them and say reorient our young people, not hamas . yeah. people, not hamas. yeah. >> yeah, that's not possible. yeah >> yeah. at point. >> yeah. at this point. >> yeah. at this point. >> but a real moral >> yeah. but that's a real moral failing, failure failing, isn't it? the failure to between the to distinguish between the tragedy of civilians dying in war, which happens in every war and absolutely and and is absolutely horrible and nobody to be to be nobody likes that to be to be failing to distinguish between

that and the deliberate targeting rape , torture, targeting rape, torture, brutalisation and murder of civilians by a terrorist group. these are not moral equivalents . these are not moral equivalents. >> they're not moral equivalence. and on one level, i find it hard to understand because they have hamas covenants. kind of covenants. they're kind of founding has founding document which has never rescinded and is very never been rescinded and is very openly . and openly anti—semitic. and genocidal. it's available in english. you don't need to go and learn arabic to read it. translated yale university, translated by yale university, their leaders make statements all the time about how they want to repeat the 7th october massacre again and again and again. completely again. so they're completely transparent . it's not transparent about it. it's not it's hidden. you don't need it's not hidden. you don't need to israeli media to get to read the israeli media to get that impression. their that impression. you read their own hamas's own propaganda . and own hamas's own propaganda. and but people are blind to it. >> very strange sign of the times , really. okay. so, mark, times, really. okay. so, mark, before you go, because we're out of time, can you tell us a bit where we can out more where we can find out more information our fight? where we can find out more infc i mation our fight? where we can find out more infci would our fight? where we can find out more infci would love our fight? where we can find out more infci would love 0|yeah.|t? where we can find out more infci would love 0|yeah. so >> i would love to. yeah. so we've got website, our fight we've got a website, our fight .uk not co uk. our fight .uk that was already taken, was it?

yeah, it was indeed. yeah. and the twitter account is our fight uk. >> fantastic. okay, well , mark >> fantastic. okay, well, mark birbeck and danielle ben—ami, thanks very much . thank you. so thanks very much. thank you. so next on free speech nation, we're going to be discussing a week of shocking violence in dubun week of shocking violence in dublin and how the reporting of the situation has implications for may have for free speech and may have exacerbated the situation. don't go anywhere .

>> you're listening to gb news radio . on mark dolan tonight. radio. on mark dolan tonight. >> in my big opinion, 20% of voters haven't decided who they're going to vote for at the next election , which means it's next election, which means it's all to play for in a year's time. my mark meets guest is family values conservative presidential hopeful dr. taylor marshall . plus, full reaction to marshall. plus, full reaction to nigel farage's first week in the jungle with former stars of the show and detailed analysis. a packed programme. we're live .

packed programme. we're live. at nine. welcome back to free speech nation. >> so later in the show, i'm going to be turning agony. uncle with the help of my panel, cressida wetton and jonathan kogan. we're going help kogan. and we're going to help you unfiltered you deal with your unfiltered dilemmas. if you've got any dilemmas. so if you've got any problems don't shy. problems at all, don't be shy. just email at gb views. just email us at gb views. gbnews.com. and i promise we'll do our best to answer your problems. it's been terrible problems. it's been a terrible week in dublin with the shocking stabbing of three children and a school outside school care assistant outside a primary school, followed by rioting and violence across the city. 34 arrests made. city. 34 arrests were made. several garda officers were injured in the riots and the commissioner, harris, said , commissioner, drew harris, said, and this is a quote, people have been radicalised through social media the internet. so was media and the internet. so was that the cause of the violence? and did the reporting the and did the reporting of the incident situation? incident worsen the situation? so here to discuss this, i'm joined journalist and joined by journalist and broadcaster ella whelan . thank broadcaster ella whelan. thank you along . you for coming along. >> so firstly, i suppose we

should address why this has happened. >> what are the origins? what are the here? well the are the tensions here? well the idea it's simply an idea that it's simply an organised far right outburst is a total misunderstanding of the complexity of what's been going on. >> anyone who looks at what these people did in that evening looting foot locker setting things on fire as cressida said at beginning of the show, at the beginning of the show, you is just you know, a lot of it is just idiot behaviour. you know, a lot of it is just idiot behaviour . that's idiot behaviour. that's opportunism. it's yeah, it's the idiot behaviour. that's oppoof nism. it's yeah, it's the idiot behaviour. that's oppoof thing, it's yeah, it's the idiot behaviour. that's oppoof thing, it's yeah, itthe 1e kind of thing, you know, the kind of thing, you know, the kind that happened in kind of thing that happened in the a few years the london riots in a few years back here where take an back here where people take an opportunity and they do stupid things and there's not necessarily anything too dramatic political about that, but , but there dramatic political about that, but, but there is something that happened and there's a kind of a boiling sort of pot thing going on here, which is that the way in which the incident was reported of the two little girls being stabbed and the care worker and the whole thing that happened and the irish media, the irish times leapt on the opportunity to say this was somebody who was a naturalised

citizen and he'd been here for 20 years. you know, there was almost you could almost feel the sort of tension in the irish media elite saying, don't go there on the immigrant question. don't there. even though don't go there. even though dubun don't go there. even though dublin a small town city and dublin is a small town city and word had spread that what this person looked like . and so there person looked like. and so there quite quickly became this sort of tension of there not telling us the truth. right. they're not they are they're they're lying . they are they're they're lying. you know, they're going to spin this a certain way. and i think that been large part of that has been a large part of what the outbursts of what fed into the outbursts of angen what fed into the outbursts of anger. there's also the case that, you know, a dublin has had a lot of problems. well, the whole of ireland has, but in particular housing particular dublin with housing and, you know, whether you want to call them the left behind, sort of working class, whatever, there's a section of people still living in dublin and on the who are extremely the outskirts who are extremely destitute, extremely poor and extremely ticked off with the sort of dublin faucet and pretend like nothing is nothing is wrong . there's real tensions

is wrong. there's real tensions in that city. and that has also fed into it sort of spilling out. so it's a complicated thing to try and assess. out. so it's a complicated thing to try and assess . and for me to try and assess. and for me anyway , i think it's telling anyway, i think it's telling that the irish media has got more het up about a it's imagination of a far right attack. yes. than it has the stabbing of two children. >> well, there's two things, isn't it? i mean, firstly going on a riot and setting things on fire. that's a sensible fire. that's not a sensible response anything . that response to anything. and that should but also, if the should be said. but also, if the media and the police are going to be smearing the entire group of people far right, won't of people as far right, won't that resentment? of people as far right, won't tha yeah resentment? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , resentment? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , it resentment? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , it will.antment? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , it will. and ent? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , it will. and int? of people as far right, won't tha yeah , it will. and i mean, >> yeah, it will. and i mean, brendan o'neill wrote for spiked a few days ago talking about the fact these were fact that these people were called lunatics, know, so called lunatics, you know, so which is, you know, it might have been just a throwaway word by gardai, but i don't by the gardai, but i don't think it it was kind of, you it was it was a kind of, you know, you have to be sort of mentally not along mentally ill to not go along with official of. and with the official line of. and it nauseating actually it has been nauseating actually listening particular listening to in particular british media coverage of what, you know, getting all these

people from disinformation units in ireland, academics or. yes, leo varadkar also sort of defining this as sort of a saying it's us and them. in fact , actually, fintan o'toole wrote an article over weekend an article over the weekend saying commentators saying saying irish commentators saying there's the us, are we love there's the us, who are we love immigrants , there's no problem. immigrants, there's no problem. we're immigrant we're a nation of immigrant lovers don't talk about lovers and just don't talk about it. and then there's them these awful oiks who hate immigrants. and mean , you wish that and again, i mean, you wish that they'd outside of their the they'd get outside of their the little in dublin and know little area in dublin and know that actually there are some tensions in relation to immigration no , they're not immigration and no, they're not not is not right . not everybody is not far right. but are there have been but there are there have been incidents in ireland in which the about immigration the discussion about immigration has been much like it has here, just totally clamped down on. >> to a mirroring >> there seems to be a mirroring here. there's a lot this >> there seems to be a mirroring here.of there's a lot this >> there seems to be a mirroring here.of an there's a lot this >> there seems to be a mirroring here.of an eliteiere's a lot this >> there seems to be a mirroring here.of an elite political)t this >> there seems to be a mirroring here.of an elite political classy idea of an elite political class who of touch who are completely out of touch with going on, with what's actually going on, and projecting and they're just projecting this idea like and they're just projecting this idea to like and they're just projecting this idea to be. like things to be. >> well, take a very >> yeah, well, to take a very small example, you know, in a town my parents live town near where my parents live called bolton us, there was a, you sports hall that was you know, a sports hall that was meant built planning meant to be being built planning permission takes a million years

in ireland. it was a big rigmarole. and, know, rigmarole. and, you know, for a small community, was going to small community, it was going to be a great resource. and you know, war was in know, after the war was in ukraine, happened almost overnight. it was turned over to for housing ukrainian refugees. now, you can have an argument about whether not provide about whether or not you provide housing ukrainian refugees. housing for ukrainian refugees. and lots of people and i'm sure lots of people would, you know, particularly in ireland, were ireland, they will they were quite but ireland, they will they were quit don't but ireland, they will they were quit don't get but ireland, they will they were quit don't get to but ireland, they will they were quit don't get to undert you don't just get to under democratically and unfairly snatch a resource from a community that had was invested in it and that kind of thing keeps happening and it causes tensions in people who are not anti—immigrant, not they're not sort of what the irish media paint them as sort of foaming at the mouth, far right types there are people who want to have some kind sense fairness kind of sense of fairness and a nuanced discussion about immigration. and the problem is, the pushed the more that this gets pushed underground, it will the more that this gets pushed undeand und, it will the more that this gets pushed undeand there it will the more that this gets pushed undeand there problem vill the more that this gets pushed undeand there problem with get. and there is a problem with anti—immigrant sentiment in certain parts of ireland, and there are far right people who would take an opportunity. and i think who are think that those of us who are on or you know, liberal

on the left or you know, liberal on the left or you know, liberal on immigration need to take this very and let very seriously and not let the sort faucet set the sort of dublin faucet set the agenda on discussions about immigration. i mean, one of the things that's really worrying is that this is pretty much given the political elite, the the irish political elite, the green for an incredible green light for an incredible bill around hate speech, which is one of the i mean, really, it's one of the worst. >> well, we've covered it quite a this show because they >> well, we've covered it quite a reallyhis show because they >> well, we've covered it quite a really pushing because they >> well, we've covered it quite a really pushing thisause they >> well, we've covered it quite a really pushing this through. are really pushing this through. and seem incredibly and it does seem incredibly draconian. i i'd say it's probably worse than scotland's hate speech, bill. and it will be weaponized. i mean, haven't didn't the irish government even say that they couldn't really define no. yeah they define hatred? no. yeah they define hatred? no. yeah they define circular terms . define it in circular terms. hatred is hatred. >> hatred is anything that inspires. hatred sort of. inspires. hatred is sort of. yeah, that's great. >> i'm glad that's on the statute books. >> clear a very kind >> nice and clear in a very kind of irish way as well. the way in which they've the bill which they've discussed the bill is a line is by saying they have a line where you can be where they say you can be offensive, which is which is, you know, irish people have spoken doublespeak, which is you can't the can't be offensive because the next anything next line says, but anything that possibly incite hate ,

that could possibly incite hate, incite hate, not incite violence or incite action, incite, you know , but incite hate. this know, but incite hate. this nebulous term , yes. will be nebulous term, yes. will be outlawed. so you absolutely can't be offensive because most people don't like , feel hatred people don't like, feel hatred towards things that are offensive . so you end up in just offensive. so you end up in just this horrendous sort of quasi intellectual soup of words that actually really means that the there is going to be no free speech in ireland, political or otherwise . and the thing that otherwise. and the thing that you just get so depressed about is that this won't have the outcome of a lovely cup entry, which is sort of tensionless and everybody gets along. it will do the opposite. the exact opposite. >> well, i mean, that's i mean, you've spoken many times about censorship of censorship and the history of censorship, and we know that if you you try you do this, if you try and clamp people's right to clamp down on people's right to free speech, bad ideas do not disappear. >> they just well, they >> no, they just well, no, they don't >> no, they just well, no, they don�*lose people who have a sense you lose people who have a sense of principle on an issue, which is that you you know, if you are take the issue of immigration. if you are liberal about it and you think that you want to have a sort of nuanced discussion

about have a load of about it and you have a load of people who disagree with people who might disagree with you are saying are you but who are saying we are just to about just not allowed to talk about this. getting called this. we keep getting called racists. getting called. racists. we keep getting called. all nuance lost and you all the nuance gets lost and you end ends up with an us and end up it ends up with an us and them mentality, which the internet this world are internet tools of this world are very with because very comfortable with because they look their very comfortable with because they at look their very comfortable with because they at people.( their very comfortable with because they at people. but their very comfortable with because they at people. but the heir very comfortable with because they at people. but the rest of, nose at people. but the rest of, you normal citizens who nose at people. but the rest of, you see normal citizens who nose at people. but the rest of, you see thatyrmal citizens who nose at people. but the rest of, you see that having tizens who nose at people. but the rest of, you see that having arens who nose at people. but the rest of, you see that having a concern can see that having a concern about immigration not make about immigration does not make you tommy robinson you a sort of tommy robinson type. i think they just lose type. yes i think they just lose all hope of any kind of nuanced outcome discussion outcome for the discussion >> but is it partly that the commentariat type commentariat and the type of commentators that you're describing feel very describing there, they feel very comfortable because comfortable with this because they opinions, comfortable with this because they their opinions, comfortable with this because they their of opinions, comfortable with this because they their of values nions, their their set of values are currently on the same side as the irish government and as what's considered the right opinions the overton opinions to have the overton window , i suppose. whereas, window, i suppose. whereas, you know , how can they not be sure know, how can they not be sure that this is laying a precedent for censorship of their own opinions down the line? opinions later down the line? >> well, they're just i mean , >> well, they're just i mean, it's in a very neat, it's all tied up in a very neat, neat bow in ireland. i mean, if you different issue you take a different issue discussion about ideology discussion about gender ideology and trans issues with the

teacher enoch burke, i think his name was who was eventually ended up in jail for a long saga of refusing to use different pronouns for a child in a school that he taught , religious school that he taught, religious school that he taught, religious school that he taught . and the you that he taught. and the you know, there was such a clampdown of the way in which it was discussed in an rti in ireland. so much so that a one radio show, that kind of had a really nuanced, open discussion about this immediately petitioned this was immediately petitioned and supported politicians support petition to be taken support the petition to be taken off so there just is such a off air. so there just is such a maybe it's to do with the maybe it's to do with the fact that the kind of history of ireland and which of and the way in which sort of social work social social tensions work there are completely new, there that are completely new, sort religious oppression, sort of religious oppression, which you've written about in the puritans. ireland is the new puritans. ireland is such a great example of that of sort don't boat sort of don't rock the boat mentality a kind of keep your mouth shut mentality within the political elite has just allowed mouth shut mentality within the pireally. elite has just allowed mouth shut mentality within the pireally repressivejust allowed mouth shut mentality within the pireally repressive culturalwed a really repressive cultural attitude to kind of prevail. and but the important thing to know thatis but the important thing to know that is that normal people are

aren't going along with it. that is that normal people are aren't going along with it . and aren't going along with it. and there's a lot of bubbling tension and it could go one of two ways. it could go in a kind of you hope. and i think we should for it to go in should push for it to go in a sort free speech, pro sort of pro free speech, pro freedom, pro democracy, open debate but if there's too debate way. but if there's too much clampdown, then it could go to quite dark territory . to quite dark territory. >> ella whelan, thank you very much joining me. >> ella whelan, thank you very much joining me . and next on much forjoining me. and next on free speech nation, we're going to be hearing about a new council for academic freedom , council for academic freedom, which been to which has been designed to fight, cancel culture at universities. see you in few universities. see you in a few minutes .

welcome back to free speech nation. >> more than 100 academics at major universities in london have decided to set up a new council for academic freedom in an attempt to combat cancel culture. >> the london university's council for academic freedom has

been inspired by a similar movement in the united states based around harvard. it will encompass all the universities in the capital with the priority being to defend the principles of inquiry, intellectual, of free inquiry, intellectual, diverse and civil discourse . diverse and civil discourse. john armstrong, a lecturer in financial mathematics at king's college london, is one of the co—founders, and he joins me now. welcome to the show . thanks now. welcome to the show. thanks for coming . for coming. >> so free inquiry, intellectual diversity, civil discourse , all diversity, civil discourse, all of that sounds fairly reasonable, but it also sounds like the default expectation for higher education. >> but is that not the case anymore? well one of the surprising things that happened this week, our launch this week, we had our launch event on monday. >> as you say, the fairly >> and as you say, the fairly innocuous sounding principle, principle was principles. but the we had demonstrators, we had demonstrators , and some of them demonstrators, and some of them were actually in tears really . were actually in tears really. >> they're very upset. so there were demonstrators against free inquiry, free inquiry , inquiry, free inquiry, intellectual diversity and civil

discourse. yeah. >> i mean, they didn't they didn't make it clear which of the three of them are the most problematic . problematic. >> but if they're crying, if they're actually in tears, i mean , what exactly what exactly mean, what exactly what exactly do they want? censorship intellectual homogeneity and uncivil discourse? yeah. >> i mean, i think i think the starting point is probably intellectual homogeneity. right i think that people are uncomfortable all with disagreement and they find it difficult being challenged and to me , that goes against the to me, that goes against the purpose of academia for me being challenged is the absolute essence . s of academia. yes and essence. s of academia. yes and then i think the other aspects really just just follow from that. if you if you're not willing to be challenged and if you're not willing to debate, then try and shut then then you'll try and shut people down. so you lose the free and that free inquiry and that intolerance , that's what leads intolerance, that's what leads to the breakdown of civil discourse. >> so there's a recent book by greg lukianoff and ricky schlott called the cancelling of the

american this american mind. and this they've studied, they've looked into the statistics of cancellations in american universities. and they found that in terms of professors, academics being fired opinions , you'd fired for their opinions, you'd have to go back to the mccarthy era for anything comparable. in fact, what we're living through now statistically now is far worse statistically than mccarthyism . um, and people than mccarthyism. um, and people still tell me there's no problem with free speech on campus. why do they denying the do they keep denying the observable truth ? i haven't. observable truth? i haven't. >> i have no idea. i think the, the i really wish that we could get the leadership of universities to acknowledge the fact that there is a problem with academic freedom . and i with academic freedom. and i think the only way at the moment that we're likely to succeed in that we're likely to succeed in thatis that we're likely to succeed in that is through the courts, right? so there are various cases. right? so there are various cases . the that are right? so there are various cases. the that are going through the employment tribunals at the moment. and i think that's going to wait universities up . and the other universities up. and the other thing that is going to wake universities up is the new higher education freedom of speech think that's speech bill. so i think that's going acknowledge

going to make acknowledge there's a problem. >> but don't you think when you have high profile cases such as that kathleen stock the that of kathleen stock at the university and you see university of sussex and you see that students that and you see students dressing masks , setting dressing up in masks, setting off flares, scrawling threats, basically driving , being off flares, scrawling threats, basically driving, being a member of staff to the point where she has to resign . how can where she has to resign. how can people then deny i mean, that's just so high profile people are now their now seeing it with their own eyes it seems to be in eyes and yet it seems to be in the interest of certain people to that's not real. to just pretend that's not real. yeah i mean, i think it's just very difficult because it opens up to university management. >> there's a really challenging problem. they have to face that and they've got a real difficulty. they've got to work with teams that actually five seconds ago were supporting the cancel ation. i've only just recently realised that actually, i mean there was a point when an employment tribunal said that holding gender critical beliefs wasn't worthy of respect in a democratic society. yes. and everybody in university went great at in that case, we can do

what we like with those people because their views are not worthy of respect . there was an worthy of respect. there was an appeal and suddenly they became protected beliefs . yes. and the protected beliefs. yes. and the teams had to, you know, turn on a dime and start protecting beliefs and a few seconds. >> well, they haven't done a very good job, to be honest. so this is the problem really. you've got these equity, you've got these bodies, equity, diversity and inclusion, edi embedded into various administrative roles throughout higher education in the uk . and higher education in the uk. and this is a group effectively whose job it is to censor , to whose job it is to censor, to clamp down, to drive people away , and in fact to exclude in the name of inclusion. well i wouldn't say i wouldn't say that's their job. i would say that's theirjob. i would say i would say it's the upshot of what they do. >> yeah. mean, on other >> yeah. i mean, on the other hand, is a need within hand, the there is a need within universities , i think, for universities, i think, for because we do need to, for example , maintain civil example, maintain civil discourse . discourse. >> we do need to help people get along together when they have different views and different backgrounds . so there's a need backgrounds. so there's a need for edi, but i think that's the

opposite of what edi does well, i think that's true at the moment. i hope moment. but this is where i hope that groups like ours can come in because we're hoping to try and provide sort of policy guidance to universities that we really hope will actually provide a sensible way forward to navigate these these issues because universities are going to have to navigate this and they are going to have to find a way to both support their trans staff and students and their gender critical staff and students. and they're going to have muslim have to support their muslim students and their jewish students and their jewish students we've learn students. and we've got to learn to together . to live together. >> nobody against all of >> but nobody is against all of that. like every that. i mean, like every student, every viewpoint should that. i mean, like every stuprotected y viewpoint should that. i mean, like every stuprotected y viesupported. uld that. i mean, like every stuprotectedy viesupported. the be protected and supported. the problem be protected and supported. the probleof people who claim to be group of people who claim to be promoting they promoting diversity, when they do opposite, wouldn't do the exact opposite, wouldn't it easier just to fire it be easier just to fire everyone who doesn't do their job properly? everyone who doesn't do their job well, rly? was a question >> well, that was a question that was asked at our launch event on monday , and i think event on monday, and i think there's quite a few people in there's quite a few people in the room who rather like the idea of getting rid of the teams i >> -- >> but but the one has to work within the framework of the law

and edi does need to exist first. and so we've got to work with the people there and find a way forward. you can't do things like retrain people and you . can like retrain people and you. can explain to people the importance of academic freedom and i'd say, for example, i'm not aware of any training courses at our university on academic freedom , university on academic freedom, but we could introduce something like that. and i think those kind of practical steps would really , really help. really, really help. >> but when academics like you speak out about this, do get speak out about this, do you get any i mean, there's lot any flak? i mean, there's a lot of who the of academics who who have the fashionable opinions, who quite like the current censorship that goes it's good for them goes on. it's good for them because they're not ones who because they're not the ones who get censored and they don't have to people. to bother arguing with people. they you they disagree with. so do you get from those types? get any flak from those types? >> relatively >> well, i'm relatively lucky because seem to get because as a man i seem to get less than women. less flak than women. >> to get bit more >> they seem to get a bit more abuse me. but abuse targeted than than me. but i everybody involved in i think everybody involved in this of this gets some some level of abuse, of abuse, some level of discrimination . an and the more discrimination. an and the more one speaks out on it, the more discrimination one receives. >> armstrong , thanks very

>> john armstrong, thanks very much joining me. >> john armstrong, thanks very much joining me . so there's much for joining me. so there's lots more to come on free speech nation, including a debate on the merits otherwise of the the merits or otherwise of the president of argentina . an president elect of argentina. an interview with the director of the seaspiracy and cowspiracy movies and more questions from our wonderful studio audience . our wonderful studio audience. so please don't go anywhere

>> i'm michelle dewberry and i'm not here to tell you what to think. i'd much rather hear what you have to say , so send in your you have to say, so send in your opinions to gb views. gb news. com keep them clean and you never know . i might com keep them clean and you never know. i might read com keep them clean and you never know . i might read them never know. i might read them out with my panel here on dewbs& co we debate, we get stuck into the issues of the day on a show where all views are welcome, especially me, yours gb news the people's channel. britain's news channel.

>> there's plenty more still to come on free speech nation this week. myself cressida and jonathan are about to be grilled once again by this wonderful studio audience . but first, studio audience. but first, let's some news update from . aaron >> thanks, andrew, very good evening to you. i'm aaron armstrong in the newsroom. thousands of people lining the streets have been cheering as a convoy carrying the third group of hostages released by hamas arrived israel. the arrived in israel. the international red cross says 17 captives made the journey from gaza. meanwhile, israel's prison service has confirmed the release of 39 palestinian prisoners . in exchange, it's the prisoners. in exchange, it's the third of a four day pause in fighting . in total, the two fighting. in total, the two sides have agreed to swap 50 israeli hostages for 150 jailed palestinians in a four year old israeli american girl was amongst those to be released earlier, the us president joe biden has welcomed the news and

says he hopes the truce will be extended . extended. >> so i'm hopeful this is not the end. it's going to continue , the end. it's going to continue, but we don't know and but i get a sense that . all the players in a sense that. all the players in the region, even the neighbours who aren't and have been directly involved now we're looking for a way to end this. so the hostages are all released and hamas is completely. how can i say it , no and hamas is completely. how can i say it, no longer in control of any portion of gaza . of any portion of gaza. >> israel's prime minister has told soldiers inside northern gaza, we'll continue until victory. no one will stop us. benjamin netanyahu was giving security updates and he visited one of the tunnels, discovered by his troops. the prime minister said we have three goals for this war. eliminate hamas, return all our abductees and ensure gaza does not become and ensure gaza does not become a threat to the state of israel again , an irish israeli girl who again, an irish israeli girl who was initially feared dead has

been reunited with her father following her release by hamas late last night . following her release by hamas late last night. nine year old emily hand was amongst the 17 hostages freed by the terror group yesterday after 50 days in captivity . 13 israelis, along captivity. 13 israelis, along with four thai nationals, were transported out of gaza through the rafah border crossing. emily was kidnapped from a kibbutz on the 7th of october. a man has been arrested on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence in london as tens of thousands marched against anti—semitism. police say he was heard shouting at crowds . heard shouting at crowds. towards the end of the day, it was the second of two arrests earlier , the founder of the earlier, the founder of the engush earlier, the founder of the english defence league , tommy english defence league, tommy robinson, was detained after he tried to join the march . it tried to join the march. it comes amid concerns over a rise in hate crime in the uk sparked by the conflict in gaza . former by the conflict in gaza. former prime minister boris johnson, who was at march, described who was at the march, described anti semitism as a virus which lurks beneath the floorboards of western civilisation . western civilisation. >> in it, we're all doing here

and the only thing we're really doing is showing solidarity with jewish people. and that's necessary because since october the 7th, i'm afraid there's been a very peculiar response in many parts of the world, including i'm sad to say, in london and what we've seen is a i'm afraid that the re—emergence of anti—semitism and a failure to focus on the appalling terroristic acts of hamas . terroristic acts of hamas. >> well, this is gb news. we're on tv, on your digital radio and on tv, on your digital radio and on your smart. speaker two now, it is back to free speech nation welcome back to free speech nation. >> i'm andrew doyle. we've got a wonderful studio audience here, so let's exploit them and get some questions. so our some more questions. so our first question annika,

first question from annika, where's yeah how where's annika? hiya. yeah how have we been misgendering roman emperors ? this is my favourite emperors? this is my favourite story of the week, i think. so this is the story about a museum in hitchin. a museum in hitchin called the north hertfordshire museum. who decided that the emperor elagabalus was actually trans and had preferred pronouns of she and lady right now i know quite a bit about elagabalus and this is actually a huge misreading, but it's really funny they've . funny that they've. >> what possible argument do they that? they make for that? >> was >> because elagabalus was bisexual. there are reports sports accounts written by really hostile sources talking about how he wanted to how can i put it pre—watershed language . put it pre—watershed language. he wanted an operation to remove his genitalia. but this is actually more connected to his status as a high priest of his sun cult . and also he was too sun cult. and also he was too pure for sexual behaviours , that pure for sexual behaviours, that kind of thing. no, no, definitely not. i mean, no, he had a lot of that, but in fact he hired roman men in rome to search scour the empire for.

again, i'm going to put this delicately for men who were well—endowed men in rome where he wanted them around. and he said called said he wanted to be called a lady sort of fetishistic lady in this sort of fetishistic way when he was having congress with see, i'm doing with the men. you see, i'm doing this very well. >> well, pre—watershed yeah, there's there's a stuff there's a there's a lot of stuff about elagabalus, which is absolutely about elagabalus, which is abs butely about elagabalus, which is abs but to just simplistically >> but to just simplistically say we should respect his pronouns as she because once he said in a in the bedroom to a gentleman that he wanted to be called lady. well, and we don't even know if that's true. >> we don't know if it's true. and wouldn't want call and we wouldn't want to call jonathan called jonathan what he gets called dressed i mean, it dressed up as a bear. i mean, it just seems to be taking a teeny little bit of information and extrapolating and looking at it through present through this kind of present lens of what's fashionable now. >> was funny. it wasn't just >> it was funny. it wasn't just the museum, though. there was a local said, well, local councillor who said, well, clearly we must respect elagabalus pronouns. well, why would you respect this person anyway? tortured anyway? this person tortured infants and castrated people against their will and threw their genitals to lions and snakes in the temple. >> this sound like a good bloke,

not bloke? not a nice bloke? >> so i don't >> no. you know, so i don't think for extending think i'm all for extending courtesy people not courtesy to people. not not them, not her. them, not him, not her. >> she was very reasonable . it's >> she was very reasonable. it's >> she was very reasonable. it's >> it's a bizarre one. anyway, so we've got a question now from kathy on email and kathy has said, should tommy robinson have been arrested ? so this is now been arrested? so this is now currently going viral online. this news broke just a couple of hours ago. so it was at the march against anti—semitism or tommy robinson turned up and was arrested. there's lots of footage going around of him being arrested by the police and it like he did it doesn't look like he did anything at all, provocative or violent . now, this is what you violent. now, this is what you probably know a bit more about this , jonathan, because you've this, jonathan, because you've been speaking someone was been speaking to someone who was there when he was arrested. >> was speaking to mark, >> yes, i was speaking to mark, you had earlier? yeah, we had you had on earlier? yeah, we had him. saw the event you had on earlier? yeah, we had him. how saw the event you had on earlier? yeah, we had him. how i saw the event you had on earlier? yeah, we had him. how i understand event unfold. how i understand what happened i think the police happened was i think the police and event organisers of the and the event organisers of the march had already stated that they didn't want him there . i they didn't want him there. i think they knew he was going to going up. yes. so going to turn up. yes. and so they clear that

they kind of made it clear that they kind of made it clear that they him there. he they didn't want him there. he then as a, you know , then turned up as a, you know, saying journalist because saying as a journalist because you get more access to places. and the police having and then the police were having none just none of it and they just essentially van. essentially put him in a van. >> what i can hear from >> and so what i can hear from when the police arrest him, they used the phrase say that used the phrase they say that you the you have you you have the potential to cause alarm and distress. and therefore, we are arresting they tweeted arresting you. and they tweeted out. so the met police tweeted out today saying a dispersal. here's tweet a dispersal here's the tweet, a dispersal order under section 35 of the anti—social behaviour, crime and policing act has been in effect since after 10 am. it since just after 10 am. it covers westminster and parts of neighbouring boroughs. and here's anyone told by here's the kicker anyone told by an disperse who fails an officer to disperse who fails to do so is liable to arrest. now that seems that seems horrendously authoritarian to me. so the idea that the police can just say, we want you to leave, we don't have to give a reason if you don't go, reason and if you don't go, we'll you. this what we'll arrest you. this is what we've about the we've been talking about on the show a lot the police, show a lot with the police, crime bill and crime and sentencing bill and things through crime and sentencing bill and thincurrent through crime and sentencing bill and thincurrent tory through crime and sentencing bill and thincurrent tory government|gh the current tory government really pushing through regulations and laws, sneaking some in through before the coronation basically to clamp down on our individual freedoms.

this is really scary to me because think about this is really scary to me becauserobinson, think about this is really scary to me becauserobinson, if think about this is really scary to me becauserobinson, if he'sink about this is really scary to me because robinson, if he's notabout tommy robinson, if he's not breaking the law, if he's there at a public event now, i understand why organisers understand why the organisers wouldn't want him there because it's very easy. tommy it's very easy. once tommy robinson and the edl are present at event, very for at an event, it's very easy for opponents to smear opponents of the event to smear the as being far the whole thing as being far right or whatever they want to call but i don't care what call it. but i don't care what you think tommy robinson, you think about tommy robinson, he's be there if he's got a right to be there if he's got a right to be there if he it's a free society i >> -- >> he absolutely i mean, i sympathise in sympathise with the police in that very that it's obviously a very difficult it's a busy difficult day or it's a busy day. shouldn't say difficult. day. i shouldn't say difficult. it tension it didn't look high tension actually been it actually having been there, it wasn't but i mean, wasn't at all. but i mean, it's a when they're to be a day when they're going to be on they? they on alert, aren't they? they don't. want things to go don't. they want things to go smoothly. but i completely agree. can't say we agree. once you you can't say we want a right to protest unless and then break off. just, you and then break it off. just, you know, got to be it's got to know, it's got to be it's got to be for everybody it. be for everybody hasn't it. >> exactly. it does >> yeah, exactly. and it does feed idea that the feed into this idea that the police quite police are sort of being quite partisan they're partisan in the way they're policing things. i mean, we've seen them at sort of pro—palestine demonstrations doing nothing when people are throwing fireworks at them or calling of jewish

calling for the death of jewish people, that's okay. >> but if tommy roberts i mean, i'm no admirer of tommy robinson, despite accidentally getting haircut getting the same haircut the other like i mean, it other day. but like i mean, it wasn't deliberate, though, was it? >> it wasn't deliberate. he didn't and i tried to didn't go in and say, i tried to get a prince, didn't work. >> but yeah, mean, it does if >> but yeah, i mean, it does if he just turning up as he was just turning up as a member of public wanting to, member of the public wanting to, you as a journalist, if you know, or as a journalist, if he's not breaking the law, you should be allowed there, right? i mean, can't just be i mean, well, you can't just be banned it's bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari ed it's bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's it's bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's a it's bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's a bit bad optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's a bit bea optics. i mean, well, you can't just be bari think it's a bit bea notics. >> i think it's a bit of a no brainer. yeah. the brainer. yeah. in the independent, they were kind of implying be there implying he shouldn't be there because he's from the far right and upset jewish and he might upset the jewish people yeah . people and yeah. >> let them be the judge of that. yeah, it was bizarre. that. yeah, it was a bizarre. >> well also the organiser of the perfectly the march can are perfectly within we the march can are perfectly withirwant we the march can are perfectly withirwant there we the march can are perfectly withirwant there and'e the march can are perfectly withirwant there and even if don't want him there and even if he say we don't want he turns up to say we don't want you know say you here, you know to say that to yes they can't force to him. yes but they can't force him to leave and they certainly can't police can't weaponise the police to get rid him. way, it's get rid of him. either way, it's just dodgy, know? just dodgy, you know? anyway, look, be look, we'll no doubt we'll be covering future covering this again in future weeks ramping up weeks because it is ramping up anyway, question anyway, the next question is from christina. where's christina? from christina. where's chr hello. labour >> hello. does labour have a women problem ?

women problem? >> ha. i think definite . >> ha. well, i think definite. well, i suppose this is in relation to rosie duffield. what's happened with her and you know rosie duffield has had a terrible time as a labour mp . terrible time as a labour mp. she couldn't go to her last labour party conference because of the threats from militant activists , and all she's done is activists, and all she's done is stand up for women's rights. you know, that's all that's happened and has said women need to and has said that women need to have spaces. it's have single—sex spaces. it's really important to women's rights. i suppose i should ask a woman, but what do you think? >> i'm glad you asked . >> i'm glad you asked. >> i'm glad you asked. >> what's happened >> you know, what's happened now. so rosie duffield liked a tweet by graham linehan , which tweet by graham linehan, which was criticising , i think, eddie was criticising, i think, eddie izzard and now that has been weaponised against rosie duffield and people have said that this is anti—semitic . now, that this is anti—semitic. now, rosie duffield is one of the few labour mps that was really outspoken against saying no anti—semitism. she was really outspoken when that crisis was going labour party to going on in the labour party to pretend she's anti—semitic pretend that she's anti—semitic because you don't like her gender views. that's gender critical views. that's what's going on.

>> i so, yeah. think >> i think so, yeah. i think it's know you are. but what am it's i know you are. but what am i? absolutely she i? it's absolutely not what she was saying at all. eddie izzard was saying at all. eddie izzard was saying at all. eddie izzard was saying that he was was tweeting saying that he or she it's eddie, guess or she he if it's eddie, i guess wouldn't would have wouldn't have been would have been a hero in nazi germany. but but would have almost a martyr is he was implying and is what he was implying and lenihan, of course, has said, well , actually, you're well, actually, you're a straight blonde man . and so he's straight blonde man. and so he's kind of claiming some sort of martyrdom, which is a grief thief. right. it's a very odd thing to do anyway. and of course, then rosie it up. course, and then rosie it up. >> but interesting, but liking a tweet shouldn't be a crime. well, no. anyway exactly. am well, no. anyway exactly. why am i liking i getting into but also liking a tweet? just because some people have misinterpreted the tweet as being anti—semitic? don't being anti—semitic? i don't think they have really. actually, just actually, i think this is just a lie because. yeah. you lie because. yeah. what do you think? lie because. yeah. what do you thirwell, mean, graham linehan >> well, i mean, graham linehan was against was at the march against anti—semitism , so i think anti—semitism today, so i think yeah, clearly yeah, no, he's clearly no, that's discussion. that's not even a discussion. >> anti—semitic i >> -- >> it sounds like classic projection as well. like you like you're like this tweet. so you're anti—semitic. like, what anti—semitic. i was like, what are your own are you just putting your own kind of bias? >> mean, issue really >> i mean, the issue here really is just that rosie duffield has been labour mps

been one of the few labour mps to enough to take a to be brave enough to take a stance women's rights within stance for women's rights within a appears to be a party that appears to be hostile to women's rights. as far don't think far as i can see, i don't think that's say no. that's too far to say no. >> and it's the thing that happens now where some topics happens now where in some topics we careful we have to be extremely careful and everybody gets the least generous the generous interpretation of the language they use, and then other get extremely other times they get extremely generous interpretations . generous interpretations. >> fallen foul of >> and she's fallen foul of that. because moment that. yes, because at the moment it's she's it's looking like she's not eligible stand because eligible to stand because they're this . but they're looking into this. but again, all of these things, they constantly know, constantly weaponize, you know, 1 complain about 1 or 2 activists complain about something and the whole world has change. and i think maybe has to change. and i think maybe it has the point where it has to be the point where people particularly people just say, particularly people just say, particularly people parties have people in political parties have to say, can your to say, you can have your complaint, to complaint, but you don't get to change things. absolutely. complaint, but you don't get to change let's s. absolutely. complaint, but you don't get to change let's move olutely. complaint, but you don't get to change let's move ontely. to anyway let's move on now to a question from marcus. where's marcus? yes should we marcus? hello. hi. yes should we aboush marcus? hello. hi. yes should we abolish the home office ? well, abolish the home office? well, richard tice thinks so. so did you see this, marcus richard tice well, he tice saying that? no well, he richard he thought the richard tice said he thought the home was not fit home office was not fit for purpose now, was purpose anymore. now, there was an whistle blower an interesting whistle blower from the office. some civil from the home office. some civil servant . and this the servant. and this was in the telegraph, i think week,

telegraph, i think this week, wasn't it? saying that effectively, the effectively, whatever the government tell home office government tell the home office to the members at to do the members of staff at the office in terms of the home office in terms of immigration implement it immigration won't implement it because that they because they think that they believe in borders. but the believe in open borders. but the home office is known to be politically and is politically impartial and is meant to implement what the democratically people meant to implement what the denthem cally people meant to implement what the denthem to ly people meant to implement what the denthem to do. people meant to implement what the denthem to do. if people meant to implement what the denthem to do. if we sople meant to implement what the denthem to do. if we that's tell them to do. so if we that's a fundamentally un democratic situation we have . so is situation that we have. so is richard tice right that we should just get rid of him? >> well, are they doing that because activists because they're activists or. well, no, they shouldn't. it doesn't duty. well, no, they shouldn't. it doeyeah, duty. well, no, they shouldn't. it doeyeah, i duty. well, no, they shouldn't. it doeyeah, i don't)uty. well, no, they shouldn't. it doeyeah, i don't care their >> yeah, i don't care what their opinions yeah. i don't opinions are. yeah. and i don't care right or opinions are. yeah. and i don't care of right or opinions are. yeah. and i don't care of what right or opinions are. yeah. and i don't care of what the right or opinions are. yeah. and i don't care of what the government wrong of what the government wants to it's it's, wants to do, if it's if it's, you know, government body or you know, a government body or affiliated do you know, a government body or affili'it's do you know, a government body or affili'it's set do you know, a government body or affili'it's set up do you know, a government body or affili'it's set up to do, do you know, a government body or affili'it's set up to do, then do you know, a government body or affili'it's set up to do, then it) what it's set up to do, then it sounds pretty worthless . well, sounds pretty worthless. well, this happens again and again with this with the quangos. we had this with the quangos. we had this with policing and with the college of policing and the policing of the college of the policing of the college of the policing of the the police the body that train the police force. are captured by force. and they are captured by activists in an ideology effectively, they're kept effectively, and they're kept teaching this effectively, and they're kept teachithey'd this effectively, and they're kept teachithey'd invented this effectively, and they're kept teachithey'd invented called s thing they'd invented called non—crime incident . and, non—crime hate incident. and, you know, we had thousands of people investigate for non you know, we had thousands of peopl

they're meant to do. that's why so police believe so many police now believe that their police people's theirjob is to police people's thoughts speech. thoughts and their speech. right. unbelievable. right. it's unbelievable. but then and the priti then the and then the priti patel, home patel, who was then home secretary told you secretary told them that you can't they ignored can't do that. they ignored her. the said that the high court said that non—crime hate incidents are unlawful . college of policing unlawful. college of policing ignored well . so ignored them as well. so effectively these effectively you've got these quangos and these bodies and these non—governmental organisations that just don't care about a the law , or b what care about a the law, or b what our democratically elected represents. tell to do. represents. tell them to do. >> yes. maybe richard tice >> yes. so maybe richard tice is right on this one. >> you seem reluctant want to >> you seem reluctant to want to agree with him. >> just bit heavy, >> this just sounds a bit heavy, doesn't rid of the doesn't it? get rid of the home office maybe. maybe get a new office or maybe. maybe get a new home know. yeah, home office? i don't know. yeah, it feels yes, minister, it feels like yes, minister, doesn't it's just. doesn't it? it's it's just. >> well, it's exactly like westminster. yeah. that's what's going yeah okay, we've going on. yeah okay, well, we've got question . i think got another question. i think we've yeah. question we've got time. yeah. a question from hi. from sue. hi, sue. hi. >> when will the fa stand up for safety and fair play for women footballers ? footballers? >> yes. so, sue, i presume you're talking about this recent controversy. there's they've included it's a team that isn't

it's a younger team, isn't it? they've included a biological male player in a women's game . male player in a women's game. and this is an identified a male who identifies as female . now who identifies as female. now obviously, my view of this is very simple. we have to protect women's sports . it's not fair women's sports. it's not fair for people who've been through male puberty to participate in sports with because they sports with women because they have natural physical have a natural physical advantage, matter how much advantage, no matter how much testosterone, oestrogen or how much hormone treatment they have. >> yeah, i mean, if they are going to step in, they should do it quickly because we're on the verge women's verge of the end of women's sport. you really believe sport. do you really believe that? yeah, do, because that? yeah, i do, because i mean, covered mean, as we've covered previously, i don't personally mean, as we've covered pre�*notsly, i don't personally mean, as we've covered pre�*not for i don't personally mean, as we've covered pre�*not for me, n't personally mean, as we've covered pre�*not for me, it's3ersonally mean, as we've covered pre�*not for me, it's notonally mean, as we've covered pre�*not for me, it's not my.ly it's not for me, it's not my personal problem. >> days are over. yeah. >> what shot put my shot. put days. >> what shot put my shot. put days . i'll be shot putting you days. i'll be shot putting you later . but of course it's the later. but of course it's the end of if you're if you're a serious competitor editor and you've got to a point where you think i can win. think there's no way i can win. and these think and also now these women think that is , well, that their safety is, well, somebody's just had ankle somebody's just had her ankle broken this person because broken by this person because they're larger . yeah.

they're just a lot larger. yeah. yeah. and the female players, you're turn for you're not going to turn up for much you? these much longer, are you? and these are we're talking about. very tragic. i mean, >> it's very tragic. i mean, when started said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he started said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was started said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was a started said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was a woman arted said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was a woman andi said >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was a woman and he id >> it's very tragic. i mean, whe|he was a woman and he won that he was a woman and he won all those swim swimming races and he's towering on the podium over the other women. and you just think this is everyone knows this isn't fair. >> it doesn't feel like sport at that point, does it? no, of course not. >> and i've spoken to athletes on this show who have you on this show who have said, you know, yamauchi, know, mara yamauchi, for instance, know, as instance, who said, you know, as an elite athlete, you work for months to an elite athlete, you work for month off to an elite athlete, you work for monthoff a to an elite athlete, you work for monthoff a second to an elite athlete, you work for monthoff a second here, to shave off a second here, a second and these blokes second there. and these blokes come in. yeah, well, quite so what do you what do you think? >> i actually think it's a shame to remove this transgender player because, you know, there was the was finally a player on the pitch understood offside pitch who understood the offside rule focus on that note. let's get >> focus on that note. let's get another question. so this is from teresa on twitter. teresa says , is the israel—hamas says, is the israel—hamas ceasefire a good idea? so now this is an interesting question because, of course , we all want because, of course, we all want to see those hostages returned. and moving to see them and it's very moving to see them being returned , albeit

being returned, albeit gradually. you know , but the gradually. you know, but the ceasefire can also really benefit hamas in terms of this conflict . it will mean that they conflict. it will mean that they could potentially monitor the idf , sort of get a sense of idf, sort of get a sense of where they are regt poop, find . where they are regt poop, find. you know, it gives them it does give them an advantage at this point . what do you think about point. what do you think about this? because it is it is a difficult judgement this? because it is it is a difficultjudgement make this? because it is it is a difficult judgement make . are difficult judgement to make. are they saving the lives of these innocent will innocent people? but will it cost innocent lives in the cost more innocent lives in the long run? >> yeah, exactly. i >> that's yeah, exactly. i wouldn't as far as wouldn't trust hamas as far as i could throw it. how can you i mean, i know people often they say, what's the difference between palestinian life and between a palestinian life and an and i totally an israeli life? and i totally accept you've lost your accept that if you've lost your child , it doesn't which child, it doesn't matter which side you're on. >> of course, all life is important , >> of course, all life is important, but what i am interested person interested in is the person who's able to commit those crimes who's able to commit those crirand think what's happened >> and i think what's happened from bizarre from hamas is just so bizarre to me. know how you you me. i don't know how you how you engage with people. >> they had a previous >> well, they had a previous prisoner exchange of prisoner exchange a number of years were years ago. there were 1000 palestinian released

palestinian prisoners released just for just one palestinian prisoners released just forjust one idf soldier. just for just one idf soldier. that was what was going on back then. one of those prisoners that was released was the mastermind of the october 7th attack. so there's example of attack. so there's an example of how release these how when you release these people , end up with over people, you end up with over a thousand right. so it's thousand deaths. right. so it's serious. serious and it's serious. it's serious and it's difficult, i think, for the israeli government to make this call at the moment. yeah but, you know, see those you know, when you see those photographs you know, when you see those photindividuals who've been and individuals who've been kidnapped brutalised , you kidnapped and brutalised, you want them back no matter what. so what do you what do you do? >> don't think >> i mean, it's i don't think i've really anything any i've got really anything any wise to add, but i think in the immediate time, i think just getting those people back, getting those people back, getting the hostages back is super and just super important and then just getting defensive getting super defensive afterwards, making nothing afterwards, making sure nothing like this can happen again. like this can ever happen again. obviously, than done. >> ? i mean, the point is >> but but i mean, the point is really, aren't israel at a point where they have eliminate where they have to eliminate hamas said hamas because hamas has said they're going to keep doing this. said quite this. they've said it quite openly this. they've said it quite openljbut so then. but how do yeah, but so then. but how do they do that? yeah it's huge doses of lsd just change everyone's mind . i mean, what on

everyone's mind. i mean, what on earth are you going to do? >> okay, next up on free >> okay, so next up on free speech nation, the new president >> okay, so next up on free spee> okay, so next up on free spee> okay, so next up on free spee> okay, so next up on free spee> is he eccentric genius or >> is he an eccentric genius or a danger to democracy? we're going to be discussing that just after the .

radio. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation . so it's been a week of nation. so it's been a week of seismic political events in argentina where the right wing populist javier melaye, is now president elect after securing a decisive win after a bitter election campaign for the former tv pundit. melaye is known for wielding a chainsaw on the campaign trail in order to indicate that the cuts that he wants to make to the state. his critics say his election is a disaster for democracy in argentina and give succour to other extremists around the world. but melaye's supporters

say his libertarian policies herald a new dawn for the nation. so here to discuss this, i'm delighted to welcome virginia tuckey, chair of republican overseas argentina . republican overseas argentina. welcome to the show. do you think that javier melaye is a danger to democracy ? oh, i'm danger to democracy? oh, i'm afraid we've lost our connection. this is the perils of live television . but of live television. but thankfully i've got my panel here to step in seamlessly . here to step in seamlessly. cressida wetton is javier melaye a danger to democracy ? a danger to democracy? >> well, he's a danger to fashion, isn't he? have you seen the haircut? miaow he's quite eccentric. we say miaow. the other thing i know about him is he he's a big dog person . i had he he's a big dog person. i had this dog when it died . he was so this dog when it died. he was so upset that he cloned it. and he's got 3 or 4 dogs of the he's now got 3 or 4 dogs of the same that are descended same breed that are descended from the dog. >> can you do that? >> can you do that? >> clone dogs, >> you can clone dogs, apparently it, so apparently he's done it, so i don't apparently he's done it, so i dorand they're all also he's a >> and they're all also he's a danger to crufts. he thinks political advice from the dog.

>> well he's a tantric sex expert. >> well so you know i mean, would you rather take advice from the dog or our home office? i don't know. >> so dog cloner, tantric sex expert. hairbrush . expert. never seen a hairbrush. is there an here, jonathan? >> well, i mean, there might be an issue. don't there's an issue. i don't think there's necessarily an issue to democracy because an democracy because he won an election. got voted in. so it's >> we just got voted in. so it's interesting if people he's a interesting if people say he's a danger is danger to democracy, that is because votes . because he won more votes. >> sounds pretty >> that sounds pretty patronising of patronising to the people of argentina, guys are argentina, saying, you guys are doing i mean. argentina, saying, you guys are doiiwell, i mean. argentina, saying, you guys are doiiwell, i i mean. argentina, saying, you guys are doiiwell, i believe i mean. argentina, saying, you guys are doiiwell, i believe that i mean. argentina, saying, you guys are doiiwell, i believe that we'vean. >> well, i believe that we've got our guest back at virginia tech. are there ? tech. virginia, are you there? >> i'm here. i can hear you now. >>— >> i'm here. i can hear you now. >> wonderful. lovely to hear from you. virginia, can you tell us a lot of people are saying that javier melaye is a danger to you believe to democracy. do you believe that case? i a&e that that is the case? i a&e well, thank you for having me here. >> no, i don't think so . >> no, i don't think so. actually, he was elected in argentina because argentina was in the verge of becoming a very authoritarian country . we were

authoritarian country. we were on we are on a 40% poverty. here. 60% of children don't eat all the meals necessary in argentina. one 1 million people emigrated . so melaye only said emigrated. so melaye only said we are going to we are going to cut taxes . we are going to open cut taxes. we are going to open the market and try to live free. so that's not an extremist, is what can i say? he is quite eccentric, but but he's not a danger for democracy. but actually people voted him because he people was sick and tired of being controlled by the government . and but do you government. and but do you think, virginia, that this is a sign of desperate nation that a lot of people wouldn't normally vote for him, but they're doing it because they're desperate, because one of the because this has been one of the most the most thriving economies in the world utterly world now, has been utterly obliterate by successive policies . policies. >> do you think that this is

just a desperate act, that people are voting for him in spite his eccentricities spite of his eccentricities rather than because of his eccentricities ? eccentricities? >> that could be that could be one of the explanation is because because he got like almost 60% of the vote and he was always like he was a star on tv. he was always talking about his libertarian ideas . so his libertarian ideas. so everyone knew what he was talking about . and he's very talking about. and he's very good at explaining economics and how it works that you see a lot of young people talking in libertarian terms or classical liberal economic terms, and that you haven't seen that in argentina for 100 years. so yes, it would be a sign of desperate ation. but also people know now what they are voting, what want to add is that in cases like in argentina now in this context, you can have people, outsiders .

you can have people, outsiders. it's very normal to have outsiders who get elected and you can have someone who was promising and we had that on the ballot on the primaries, someone who was promising to take the land and share it. it was a communist, a message, and argentinians didn't go for that message . argentinians went for message. argentinians went for the libertarian message and yes, he is eccentric . uh, he was he he is eccentric. uh, he was he had a rock band . he has, you had a rock band. he has, you know, that's style. that might seem like maybe he's crazy or no , but i mean, when you listen to him in the way he talks , he's him in the way he talks, he's good at economics . people who good at economics. people who are freedom lovers. i mean , will are freedom lovers. i mean, will agree with me. javier milei of course. now he's in government. he will have to i mean, make decisions and talk to other parties and he's already doing

that. parties and he's already doing that . and the only people that that. and the only people that are angry in argentina are those that are very aligned with venezuela or cuba. and, you know , all these countries that are very tyrannical but from centre right or from the centre to the right or from the centre to the right . i mean, everyone agrees right. i mean, everyone agrees we need a change and we need to cut taxes. we need to solve inflation and we need to open the markets here. argentina is very close. i mean , you couldn't very close. i mean, you couldn't believe if you come here and the poverty rates are high to skyrocket . so. skyrocket. so. >> okay. well, virginia tucker, that's all we got time for. thanks so much forjoining me. really appreciate that. i want to bring in my panel very quickly now. making the quickly now. she's making the case from right, case that people from the right, from centre to the centre from the centre to the centre right, think this a good right, think that this is a good thing, heard the thing, that they've heard the libertarian he's libertarian message here. he's an anarcho capitalist . virginia an anarcho capitalist. virginia seemed to be saying that it's only the sort of radical left who have a problem with this

socialist country. socialist governments. is she right ? well, governments. is she right? well, she might be. >> i mean, familiar with >> i mean, we're familiar with that aren't we, that few that idea, aren't we, that a few people the left might might people on the left might might moan than the moan more loudly than than the bulk voters if they bulk of the voters if they voted. voted, haven't voted. they've voted, haven't they? mean, been they? yeah but i mean, it's been interesting watching the coverage over here because a lot of , the guardian of the newspapers, the guardian particularly, been saying particularly, has been saying that milei is far right. that javier milei is far right. >> i think they call him a far right libertarian, which i didn't realise was even possible. >> i've also seen the guardian call lamppost right. call a lamppost far right. i mean call a lamppost far right. i me yeah, i know. no, >> yeah, yeah, i know. no, everyone's according everyone's far right. according to guardian, nonetheless to the guardian, but nonetheless , right , are there any far right policies that he's espousing? i haven't any . haven't seen any. >> from seen is him >> from what i've seen is him talk and he mince his talk and he doesn't mince his words . talk very, very sort of words. talk very, very sort of negatively and comically and quite extremely about leftists. he's saying like with a lot of expletives and stuff like that, which not to which you're not going to repeat. going repeat. repeat. i'm not going to repeat. i've i've i've learned my lesson. i've been yeah. basically been fined. yeah. and basically i he's definitely an i can see he's definitely an extreme character. whether or not he's far right. not from what seen. the closest. not he's far right. not from whtl seen. the closest. not he's far right. not from whtl se look, 1e closest. >> i mean, look, he's anti—abortion, that's anti—abortion, but that's probably more coming the

probably more coming from the fact catholic fact that it's a catholic country. this you know, country. and this is, you know, by tantric sex guy. well, by the tantric sex guy. well, exactly. very confused exactly. so he's very confused on social issues. >> be on point. >> be on point. >> yeah. this is the thing. so i just think this this phrase far right is actually completely inaccurate just from what i can see, immediately see, i'm immediately suspicious in when hear see, i'm immediately suspicious in nowadays. when hear that nowadays. >> exactly. >> yes, exactly. >> yes, exactly. >> well well, that's all >> okay. well well, that's all we got time for in this section . we got time for in this section. but next up on free speech nation, filmmaker nation, the filmmaker responsible for the popular documentaries seaspiracy and cowspiracy will be here to tell us about his new project, christ , spirit. see you in a moment.

you're listening to gb news radio . radio. >> welcome back to free speech nation. film director kip anderson has become well known of late after making three of the most successful documentary films of recent times. they include what the health executive produced by joaquin

phoenix cowspiracy executive produced by leonardo dicaprio and seaspiracy about the environmental impact of fishing. and he now has a film called christ seaspiracy, in which the work, which looks at the link between animal ethics and religion . let's have a look . religion. let's have a look. >> is there any threat or danger making a film like this ? making a film like this? >> yeah, you're just waiting to see. you're just waiting to . see see. you're just waiting to. see >> they will stop at nothing to keep this truth from getting out . is there a spiritual way to kill an animal? >> um, i'll put it this way. how would jesus kill an animal? >> and film director kip anderson joins me now to tell us more . kip, thanks so much for more. kip, thanks so much for joining us here today on free speech nation. can i ask you, there's a very intriguing

trailer that you've got there. it's almost as though you're not telling us the full story. can you tell us a bit more about what the documentary explores as yeah, andrew, for yeah, thank you, andrew, for having yeah, thank you, andrew, for haers . well, as you mentioned, >> yes. well, as you mentioned, cowspiracy and seaspiracy explored the environmental impacts raising killing impacts of raising and killing billions of animals in the ocean . trillions and what the health explored, the health impacts of raising and killing so many animals. and then consuming them. this this film explores them. this this film explores the ethical impacts of raising and killing 70 billion animals per year and how that ties into religion, where did this all began? that right now we're killing equivalent of the killing the equivalent of the entire world's population ten times every single year. times over every single year. where did this begin ? and where did this begin? and there's a tie to religion, which is incredibly fascinating. >> i saw when you >> now, i saw when you fundraising for this project that rescued two baby that you'd rescued two baby lambs from a halal farm. how are they getting on? >> they're getting along great. yes. thank you. yeah, we're doing a kickstarter campaign, which you'll probably mention .

which you'll probably mention. this was a netflix original, but we've moved ways from netflix with this film , so we're doing with this film, so we're doing a kickstarter campaign, creating history, really . and your history, really. and your viewers can jump in. we have one more week left to go to fund for this . this. >> fantastic. can i ask you about that? kip was some about that? kip was there some sort with netflix ? sort of conflict with netflix? because obviously you've had such before . such success with them before. and i know that there's a lot of people who don't want to people who don't want you to make i reading too make this film. am i reading too much well i'll know much into this? well i'll know it's know, it's a i'm so it's you know, it's a i'm so grateful for netflix. >> i love netflix. grateful >> i love netflix. so grateful for this film >> i love netflix. so grateful for difficult this film >> i love netflix. so grateful for difficult one. this film >> i love netflix. so grateful for difficult one. anytimeilm is a difficult one. anytime you're bringing religion and you're bringing religion and you're bringing religion and you're bringing killing you're bringing in killing animals and ethics of eating animals and the ethics of eating and you're and consuming animals, you're bringing powerful bringing some very powerful industries in there . and we industries in there. and we wanted to tell the story in a particular way . such a sensitive particular way. such a sensitive topic, and long story short, they wanted to go one direction. we wanted to go deeper in the direction we were going, and we understand why would want direction we were going, and we unibuttand why would want direction we were going, and we unibuttancfelty would want direction we were going, and we unibuttancfelt very would want direction we were going, and we unibuttancfelt very strongly want to, but we felt very strongly this film had to be told in a certain way to have the most impact. so we stayed surprisingly very , very strong

surprisingly very, very strong and true and walked away from the original, which i'm the netflix original, which i'm not it's not sure how many times it's been boldly have been done, but we boldly have done that. >> but you wanted the >> but you wanted to tell the story in your own way and you needed freedom the needed that freedom to have the independence it. think independence to do it. i think that's a interesting that's a really interesting approach but is approach to take, but it is a very complicated issue , isn't approach to take, but it is a verandnplicated issue , isn't approach to take, but it is a verand you :ated issue , isn't approach to take, but it is a verand you ared issue , isn't approach to take, but it is a verand you are in ssue , isn't approach to take, but it is a verand you are in inie , isn't approach to take, but it is a verand you are in in verysn't approach to take, but it is a verand you are in in very murky it? and you are in in very murky ethical when it comes ethical territory when it comes to the killing of animals for fitual to the killing of animals for ritual purposes, because, of course, you're potentially course, then you're potentially opening yourself up to being accused criticising people's accused of criticising people's religious freedom. do you think that's right ? that's right? >> well, the thing with this film, along with the other films, what we do is we ask questions. we ask theologians, we ask in this film archaeology , we ask in this film archaeology, artists, theologians, oxford professors, it's actually films lot based in actually england , lot based in actually england, um, with, with the intellectual and the, the knowledge base of the history of this . but we the history of this. but we really are sensitive with this because we don't want to judge anyone's religion or anyone's beliefs. want to ask beliefs. we just want to ask questions where did this come from ? is history of from? what is the history of this? does not jesus, this? where does not only jesus,

where tie into this? where does buddha tie into this? because a direct link because there's a direct link and i can't give too much away. but we definitely very but we definitely are very respectful of for everybody's decisions. >> now, my understanding is that with the kickstarter, you've actually increased the amount that you want to try and reach. now you want up to now i think you want to go up to $500,000, that is still very $500,000, but that is still very cheap for compared to sort of how much hollywood films cost these days. but will you be hoping to make improvements to the film with greater support from from from the people who are going to be watching it? >> are, yes . are going to be watching it? >> are, yes. this is just >> we are, yes. this is just kind of the bare bones we're looking to raise as much as we can yes, these big can because, yes, these big hollywood they hollywood films, you know, they have of dollars have tens of millions of dollars in budget and to creating a theatrical release , which is one theatrical release, which is one of goals, do of our big goals, is to do a theatrical release year. we theatrical release next year. we feel a strong following and feel with a strong following and the strong the strong that the strong the strong fans that we have and everyone who's really interested in this topic, we're able to do a we're going to be able to do a viral everybody viral sensation where everybody it's one of these films like the other ones , one person other ones, when one person watches tell watches it, they tend to tell they'll they tell ten people and

it goes on and on and on. this one is going to be they tell 108 people. yeah, we really feel people. so yeah, we really feel confident that's it's going confident that's how it's going to go. >> kip, can i ask f kip, can i ask you, to go. >> kip, can i ask you, how >> so, kip, can i ask you, how do approach making do you approach making a documentary? from documentary? does it come from a place of passion, a particular theme or a topic that you're particularly interested in and you delve it ? or do you just delve into it? or do you just delve into it? or do you start not really you sometimes start not really knowing the outcome will be? >> this one more than the last previous films? i didn't know where it was going to end up. i knew, you know, cowspiracy was ten years ago at that time, that film was going be the film was going to be the environmental, and environmental, health and ethical raising and ethical impacts of raising and killing. as i said, billions, billions of animals, trillions that ocean . and i that include the ocean. and i kind knew the direction where kind of knew the direction where that going. this one a that was going. this one was a full exploration. went all full exploration. we went all around and it was, around the world and it was, you know, biggest reveals know, one of the biggest reveals when the film, that was when you see the film, that was a surprise to us. and to a surprise to us. and then to have validated by, you know, have it validated by, you know, oxford theologians oxford professors, theologians is this is a massive film beyond just genre say, animal just the genre of, say, animal ethics . this just the genre of, say, animal ethics. this is just the genre of, say, animal ethics . this is a film just the genre of, say, animal ethics. this is a film that really will rewrite what it means to be christian in early

christianity. a big one. christianity. it's a big one. >> yeah, well, it sounds very , >> yeah, well, it sounds very, very intriguing. i can't very intriguing. and i can't wait it. just remind us wait to see it. just remind us before you go, people before you go, how can people participate in donating to your kickstarter ? kickstarter? >> so yeah , so gb news viewers, >> so yeah, so gb news viewers, they have just a few more days left to be part of history. they can go kickstarter and search can go to kickstarter and search christ the whole christ seaspiracy the whole world's , the world's conspiracy, the sustainability we sustainability secret. and we have incredible for anyone have incredible perks for anyone who us. and you get early who joins us. and you get early access. that's a great thing. you get early access, even before it goes into theatres. so you'll be able to get the you'll be be able to get in the know and know before anyone else and you'll the secret you'll get to know the secret before anyone else. well kip anderson is a fascinating project. >> thanks much joining me >> thanks so much forjoining me .thank >> thanks so much forjoining me . thank you so much for having without . so it sounds very without. so it sounds very interesting and it is always an ethical minefield, isn't it? this issue of religious freedom versus animal rights, particularly when it comes to religious ritual slaughter, which can be particularly painful for the animals. and then you are in murky territory. >> yeah, i mean, yeah ,

>> yeah, i mean, yeah, absolutely. i know which side i naturally fall on. yes. i don't know whether that's the right side. what side is that on the animal side, of course . animal side, of course. >> course. >> of course. >> of course. >> yeah. softie you . >> yeah. i'm a softie like you. i don't meat and. i don't eat meat and. >> and used to have a baby >> and you used to have a baby lamb . lamb. >> i did, yeah. i did some backpacking, worked on a sheep farm, and. and raised a couple of see, that's what of lambs. you see, that's what the once you've of lambs. you see, that's what the lambs once you've of lambs. you see, that's what the lambs . once you've met lambs. >> yeah. it's very difficult to . >> yeah. it's very difficult to. to cut them and eat them. to cut them up and eat them. yeah can that about dogs yeah you can say that about dogs as and we dogs. yeah. >> and we eat dogs. yeah. >> and we eat dogs. yeah. >> you eat dogs , jonathan. you >> you eat dogs, jonathan. you are . jonathan are the norm. jonathan >> i'll stop eating dogs. no, what do i think? so basically, i learned about laws of learned about the laws of kashrut as a kid . and kashrut or kosher as a kid. and from understood , the from what i understood, the whole point was the ritual slaughter would be done in a way that respect animals. that you respect the animals. obviously, it and obviously, you're killing it and you try and kill it in the way that's as painless as possible. that's commanded. that's that's what's commanded. obviously now modern obviously now with modern technological advancements , technological advancements, you're probably doing it in you're probably not doing it in the most painless way. and it seems compared to seems really brutal compared to the other options. so i can see why there's obviously. >> would you watch kip's film?

>> would you watch kip's film? >> seemed like a rad dude. >> he seemed like a rad dude. he seemed rad dude. seemed like a rad dude. he seemed like a rad dude. he seemed a cool guy. what seemed like a cool guy. what kind phrase he's kind of phrase is that? he's obviously dude. look at him. >> don't think i've ever used >> i don't think i've ever used the rad, dude. i don't the phrase rad, dude. i don't think away with think i can get away with it. >> i don't can get away. think i can get away with it. >> heardt can get away. think i can get away with it. >> heardt that's an get away. think i can get away with it. >> heardt that's kip|et away. think i can get away with it. >> heardt that's kip is away. >> heard it. that's kip is exactly i would picture. exactly what i would picture. yeah cowabunga. et cetera. >> cowabunga. it >> exactly. well cowabunga. it sounds quite want sounds like a film i quite want to well, anyway, next to see. okay, well, anyway, next on nation, cliff on free speech nation, cliff richard causes a stir on this morning. nigel farage has a row with nella rose, and it turns out that falling asleep at work can have negative consequences. it's for social it's almost time for social sensations. do not go anywhere .

on mark dolan tonight. >> in my big opinion, 20% of voters haven't decided who they're going to vote for at the next election , which means it's next election, which means it's all to play for in a year's time. my mark meets guest is family conservative

family values conservative presidential hopeful dr. taylor marshall. plus, full reaction to nigel farage's first week in the jungle with former stars of the show and detailed analysis. a packed program. we're live . packed program. we're live. at nine. welcome back to the final part of free speech nation. >> and it's time for social sensation . that's part of the sensation. that's part of the show where we look at what's been going viral on social media. up, during an media. and first up, during an interview on this morning, this week, cliff richard week, singer cliff richard admitted he didn't want to meet elvis. let's have a look at what he said. well i did not. >> i had one chance through a journalist when i was promoting devil woman in the states. he said, oh, i know elvis because he knew that i was influenced . he knew that i was influenced. and he said, would you want to meet him? i said, yeah. at the end of the interview, though, i said, can we put it off? because

he was he'd put on a lot of weight . and i thought, if i'm weight. and i thought, if i'm having a photograph taken with him and it's going to be hanging on my refrigerator outer, he's got to look good. and i put it off. and of course then he died. oh should never have put it off just because they're a little bit heavier. no. if anybody has got you, if you're a fan of somebodies, you should if you get the chance to meet them, meet them, even if they've put on weight. >> is that why you don't want me at your house anyway ? it's an at your house anyway? it's an odd one that, isn't it? >> it's such a rich tapestry, isn't it ? he's he's being so isn't it? he's he's being so rude in the presence of a variety of body shapes that are all beautiful and i'm just. i'm stunned. but i mean, he obviously didn't think it was offensive. >> he obviously thought it was fine to sort of say, i don't want to meet fat people. it was basically what he what planet is he living on? >> that's i mean, he must be surrounded by people that say, yes, day. yes, sir, cliff, every day. >> he but also the chance

>> maybe he but also the chance to elvis presley . you don't to meet elvis presley. you don't say, when he's been on say, well, when he's been on the treadmill i'll think treadmill a bit, then i'll think about don't want fat >> you just don't want a fat person them. person next to them. >> then you look thinner. come on, well, that's a good point. >> well, that's a good point. yeah, had yeah, because he's never had weight cliff weight problems, right, cliff richard? weight problems, right, cliff richardhasn't he? do you svelte, hasn't he? what do you make of that, jonathan? >> get it . you know, i was at >> i get it. you know, i was at a wedding with my girlfriend . i a wedding with my girlfriend. i didn't want picture taken. she didn't want a picture taken. she had a starter and a main. i understand. >> jonathan kogan yeah. you're always taking the contrary view. >> this is i i'm a regular. louis schaefer no, i wish. but no, it's yeah, no, what do i think? yeah. he missed out meeting elvis fat elvis is meeting elvis and fat elvis is the us.i meeting elvis and fat elvis is the us. i not the best of us. i mean, not musically or spiritually or performance . just. it's the performance wise. just. it's the funniest elvis, that's sure. funniest elvis, that's for sure. but i mean, also cliff richard . but i mean, also cliff richard. >> i mean, he's he's an older gentleman, so it's just. >> i mean, he's he's an older geitleman, so it's just. >> i mean, he's he's an older geit isnan, so it's just. >> i mean, he's he's an older geit is itin, so it's just. >> i mean, he's he's an older geit is itin, s> i mean, he's he's an older geit is itin, s> i mean, he's he's an older geit is itin, s> i think i mean, we have to stop being stunned when extraordinary people are extraordinary people are extraordinary . extraordinary. >> yeah, that's right. well, that's is that that's the other thing is that artists and creatives sometimes say and

say bonkers things. yes. and they allowed to. say bonkers things. yes. and the that's allowed to. say bonkers things. yes. and the that's good lowed to. say bonkers things. yes. and the that's good way d to. say bonkers things. yes. and the that's good way of :o. say bonkers things. yes. and the that's good way of putting >> that's a good way of putting it. think bonkers it. i think it's bonkers from cliff. there is. cliff. there it is. >> is. but woman is >> it is. but devil woman is a great you can't around great song you can't get around that. think that. really. whatever you think of cliff. anyway, let's move on to another clip now. this was youtuber nella rose us now this is to do with the jungle show, which in at the moment, which nigel's in at the moment, and he got into a discussion about immigration on let's see what . what happened. >> what i was saying >> but this is what i was saying apparently anti immigrants >> but this is what i was saying app'wholy anti immigrants >> but this is what i was saying app'who told anti immigrants >> but this is what i was saying app'who told you 1ti immigrants >> but this is what i was saying app'who told you that? migrants and who told you that? >> oh the internet . oh well >> oh the internet. oh well there we are then. >> it must be true. >> it must be true. >> must be true. be. >> it must be true. it must be. it must okay. but then it must be true. okay. but then why don't black like you? why don't black people like you? you'd amazed they do. you'd you'd be amazed. they do. you'd be amazed, nigel, if you came with me. if you came with me . with me. if you came with me. >> who is that woman? i don't know. she's an instagram influencer or something. >> she's a tiktok girl. is she tiktok? i think so. yeah, but. >> so, that's bonkers. >> so, i mean, that's bonkers. again, it wasn't an argument. >> it was just what? the internet told me. >> therefore, it must be true. >> therefore, it must be true. >> i like that. that that i agree with. yeah. i mean, he nigel seemed to take in nigel seemed to take that in good didn't seem to

good spirit. he didn't seem to handle quite well, didn't he? handle it quite well, didn't he? he a lot he probably had a lot, a lot worse. but that what the show is? >> i haven't seen u >> i haven't seen the show. i know they eat a lot of insects, but just the but then do they just argue the rest is that you're rest of the time is that you're more of a selling sunset as more of a selling sunset guy, as i understand. >> don't know what is. >> i don't know what that is. what's that one? watch what's that one? don't watch reality tv. no, don't watch reality tv. no, don't watch reality know reality al fayed. we all know that. but no, no. >> i to the celebrity >> i used to watch the celebrity big when pete was big brother when pete burns was in with george galloway and in it with george galloway and dennis bingham. dennis rodman and traci bingham. thatlooks dennis rodman and traci bingham. that looks terrible, this looks terrible, though. >> it made me feel depressed when that. i mean, when i saw that. i mean, you can't disagreement can't call it a disagreement if one hasn't one person just hasn't heard what said, can you? >> but it is quite indicative, isn't because lot of isn't it? because today a lot of the time people just sort of the time people do just sort of believe hear about believe what they hear about political and political figures. yes. and they don't investigate don't bother to investigate or interrogate whatsoever themselves. there's spirit of inquiry >> there's no spirit of inquiry there whatsoever. the there whatsoever. that's the phrase inquiry. there whatsoever. that's the phr no, inquiry. there whatsoever. that's the phr no, no. inquiry. there whatsoever. that's the phr no, no. but inquiry. there whatsoever. that's the phr no, no. but that'sy. there whatsoever. that's the phr no, no. but that's that's >> no, no. but that's that's quite true. anyway, quite generally true. anyway, you see, back in the day when all were lefties all my friends were lefties and they that they used to tell me that there were conservatives were these evil conservatives out they're mostly out there and now they're mostly my friends. and realise my friends. and i realise they're nice they're actually all really nice and it was actually a lot of my old who evil old friends who are the evil satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an

interesting name satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an inteishame name satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an inteishame . name satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an inteishame . no, name satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an inteishame . no, not name satanic ones. yes. yeah it's an inteishame . no, not not name and shame. no, not not generalising whatsoever for. okay, let's move on now. no, you weren't demonised. no one could demonise you. you're a who i am. no no knows who you are. no no one knows who you are. that's got four that's why i've got four followers. this is followers. and now this is a video that's gone viral on x this week, which to be this week, which used to be known twitter, but we still known as twitter, but we still call it twitter. let's be honest. shows if you honest. and it shows that if you fall job, you fall asleep on the job, you never might fall onto never know what might fall onto you. over you. now, i'm going to talk over this because got some this one because we've got some radio is let's have a radio listeners is let's have a look this clip. there's a look at this clip. so there's a guy mechanical guy in some green mechanical cart falling asleep and he's colliding with, oh, oh, god. oh, wow. i can't even he's basically almost got crushed to death by various boxes and he's actually destroyed the entire warehouse from the looks of things. oh, now, how did that. that must be set up. how did that happen? he just sort of nudged into it. the whole thing collapsed. >> the whole >> it looked like the whole of ikea when you're ikea fell on you. when you're trying out. trying to get one shelf out. yeah, if that happens, yeah, but if that happens, surely problem with the warehouse. >> that's a safety issue with that, should be to that, it should be able to withstand gentle surely

withstand a gentle nudge. surely >> i completely agree. i don't know where that was. that looks that makes me pro health and safety. really somebody needs to check it. what do you make of that, jonathan? >> that was the most exciting that, jonathan? >> tii'veras the most exciting that, jonathan? >> tii've seene most exciting that, jonathan? >> tii've seen innost exciting that, jonathan? >> tii've seen in quite exciting while. >> it's definitely exciting. >> it's definitely exciting. >> squished, but >> he nearly got squished, but like i mean, why like you say, i mean, why shouldn't be able to drive shouldn't a man be able to drive a heavy vehicle into a shelf and not fall over? not expect it to fall over? quite right. >> yeah, look, should say >> yeah, but look, we should say that he did. he's perfectly fine. injured. so, fine. he's not even injured. so, you fine. you know, it's all fine. >> a of a compensation >> a hell of a compensation claim. i'm sure i'm sure. >> okay, now we're going to talk through your unfiltered dilemmas. dilemma dilemmas. and our first dilemma comes jane on jane has comes in from jane on jane has said the other day i was a said the other day i was on a busy from and busy train home from work and a lady had impolitely placed her handbag the empty seat next handbag on the empty seat next to this poor etiquette? to her. is this poor etiquette? can anyone relate to my frustration? >> jonathan? it's obvious . get a >> jonathan? it's obvious. get a handbag, unzip urinate in it, teach her a lesson. >> jonathan, for goodness sake, you're so extreme. >> i'm a man of extremes. >> i'm a man of extremes. >> you are, aren't you? >> you are, aren't you? >> got this tommy >> ever since i got this tommy robinson haircut, i've just been kicking think. kicking off. nor do i think. i don't yeah, just say

don't know. yeah, just say sorry, madam. would you move don't know. yeah, just say sorry bag?iam. would you move don't know. yeah, just say sorry bag? that'sould you move don't know. yeah, just say sorry bag? that's what'ou move don't know. yeah, just say sorry bag? that's what you've/e your bag? that's what you've got to polite. >> just be polite. >> just be polite. >> polite. yeah. and no. >> just be polite. yeah. and no. yeah, polite. yeah, that's it. be polite. >> can polite. yeah. >> you can be polite. yeah. excellent. we excellent. to good know. we don't how busy the train don't know how busy the train was, if there are was, do we? i mean, if there are any my last option would any other. my last option would always the always be to engage with the person. yes be. person. yes i would be. >> very british like >> you're very british like that. very british. >> the walls up . >> yeah. i keep the walls up. yeah. know. i wouldn't yeah. i don't know. i wouldn't be rushing to chat to her about her. no, probably her. no, no, probably not. >> got for >> i think we've got time for one this one's one more dilemma. this one's from y that's from linda with a y that's unconventional in my husband's search , he had been search history, he had been looking at female underwear. it's definitely not the sort of stuff a woman in 60s would stuff a woman in her 60s would be is he possibly be wearing. is he possibly cheating? well, i mean, it's interesting. i i don't think so . interesting. i i don't think so. maybe he's just dabbling in transvestism. >> yeah, maybe he is a bit of harmless transvestite in case the first thing i would do would be to talk to the person. really? if it's your partner, i think that's. come on, let's have what's going on? have a chat. what's going on? maybe curious, maybe he's just curious, though. >> think can assume >> i don't think you can assume from don't think what from that. i don't think what i'm i don't think i'm saying is i don't think that's sufficient evidence

cheating. >> no, absolutely could >> no, absolutely not. it could be. he's he's got be. as you said, he's he's got an alternative lifestyle. maybe she you know, she can join in. you know, i think fine. right. exactly. she can join in. you know, i thouldn'tine. right. exactly. she can join in. you know, i thouldn't be. right. exactly. she can join in. you know, i thouldn't be worried.zxactly. i wouldn't be worried. >> was googling >> well, i was googling armadillos because >> well, i was googling ajustiillos because >> well, i was googling ajustiillos just because >> well, i was googling ajustiillos just interested ecause >> well, i was googling ajustiillos just interested inause i just i was just interested in their lifestyle. it their in their lifestyle. it doesn't to get one, doesn't mean i want to get one, but my search but if you looked at my search history, who's armadillo? >> you might want to be a fairy armadillo. might get a full armadillo. you might get a full body suit but almost. body suit maybe, but almost. >> we've got time for. >> yes, it is all in good time for thankfully. >> yes, it is all in good time for thanks lly. >> yes, it is all in good time for thanks for joining >> yes, it is all in good time for thanks forjoining us >> yes, it is all in good time for thanks for joining us for >> thanks for joining us for free this was the free speech nation this was the week when dublin rioted . the week when dublin rioted. the labour on women labour party turned on women again roman emperor was again and a roman emperor was outed as trans. thank you to my panel , cressida wetton and panel, cressida wetton and jonathan cogan and to all of my guests this evening. and by the way, to join live way, if you want to join us live in the studio, be part of our wonderful studio audience. in the studio, be part of our woncan ul studio audience. in the studio, be part of our woncan ul that. udio audience. in the studio, be part of our woncan ul that. just audience. in the studio, be part of our won can ul that. just auto nce. you can do that. just go to w—w—w dot sro audiences.com. it's right there on the screen for you. and do stay tuned because mark dolan tonight is coming up next. and don't forget , the headliners is on every night at 11:00. that's late night at 11:00. that's the late night at 11:00. that's the late night pay per preview show where comedians take you through the next top news stories.

next day's top news stories. thanks ever so much watching thanks ever so much for watching free me free speech nation with me andrew see you next week . andrew doyle. see you next week. hello there and greg dewhurst. >> and welcome to your latest for gb news last, there's further rain as we move through the next 24 hours, but it does slip away . it turns brighter but slip away. it turns brighter but also colder at the same time. low pressure bringing that rain at the moment, but it does start to as head through to move away as we head through the of monday, allowing high the end of monday, allowing high pressure build in. and it pressure to build in. and it turns a little but also turns a little drier. but also colder, through . this colder, too, through. this evening and overnight, a lot of cloud around outbreaks of rain keeping the frost at bay. we could a bit of frost could see a little bit of frost through glens of scotland, through the glens of scotland, but also some wintry showers moving leading to some icy moving in, leading to some icy stretches here. generally with the cloud and rain, temperatures holding up a milder night, 7 to 8 degrees for quite a bit of the country. but it does mean a cloudy, damp, start the cloudy, damp, dull start to the day outbreaks rain, which day outbreaks of rain, which could be at times, it

could be heavy at times, but it does south eastwards does slowly push south eastwards through into the through the morning into the afternoon allowing the skies afternoon and allowing the skies to sunny spells, to brighten sunny spells, northern western northern ireland, western scotland , later western fringes scotland, later western fringes of england and wales staying quite cloudy and showery in the east. cool here, temperatures 6 or and early max in or 7 degrees and early max in the south around 10 or 11 before the south around 10 or 11 before the colder air arrives here on tuesday. a cold start to the day, some mist and fog patches, wintry showers, icy stretches across the far north. and then for most, it will be dry , plenty for most, it will be dry, plenty of sunny spells through the day. just some showers across the northern half of the uk and it stays cold through the week with an increasing risk of rain and snow as we head into thursday

late . it's 9:00 on television, late. it's 9:00 on television, on radio and online in the united kingdom and across the world. >> this is mark dolan tonight in

my big opinion, 20% of the pubuc my big opinion, 20% of the public haven't decided who they're going to vote for at the next election, which means it's all to play for in a year's time . and our labour celebrating victory too soon. i'll be giving my unapologetic verdict shortly. in the midst story, an explosive new book from harry and meghan's favourite journalist looks set to cause more chaos for king charles. we'll get reaction from fearless royal commentator lady colin campbell and doctor who goes first. >> take a listen . the pronoun true. >> yes, sorry. good point. are you he or she? well, they yeah, let's let's ask the aliens their pronouns. >> we'll get reaction from one of the stars of last night's 60th anniversary episode mode. and as an extraordinary gb news civil war breaks out between two of its biggest stars , richard of its biggest stars, richard tice and lee anderson is a vote for reform uk a vote for keir starmer ? i'll be asking one of