>> welcome back to the camilla tominey show on gb news. robert jenrick is in the house. conservative leadership candidate. the man who wants to beat kemi badenoch , also the beat kemi badenoch, also the tory mp for newark, mrjenrick, tory mp for newark, mr jenrick, lovely to see you. >> good morning. very good to be here. >> full of beans. now you're in the final two. >> no, it's very good. i'm very grateful. >> so why should the membership pick you over kemi badenoch, who is, i think , still the favourite is, i think, still the favourite among the grassroots. would you agree with that? >> look, i think it's neck and neckif >> look, i think it's neck and neck if you don't. well, if you'd asked that question three months ago when i was 66 to i. months ago when i was 66 to 1. yeah. then you would have said i was rank outsider. >> did you put any money on yourself at 66? >> i didn't no, i made that mistake. i don't believe in political betting. >> no, i think some of your colleagues have got themselves into trouble in the past over that. but why honestly be better than on a serious note, i think ihave than on a serious note, i think i have the serious answers to the big challenges facing this country. >> whether it is on our borders

where i have a very clear policy proposal that's let's cap legal migration in the tens of thousands and set it in stone by parliament. make it the law of the land on illegal migration. let's leave the european convention on human rights so that we finally end the farce of the small boats crossings. >> you are absolutely speaking gb news audience language on both of those issues, but they will rightly be cynical. they'll say to themselves, this lot of promise this before they've promised immigration caps for time in memoriam and in fact , time in memoriam and in fact, immigration has only gone up. they'll also be sceptical that you'll be able to convince a big tent shadow cabinet when in to office sign up to both a cap on immigration and indeed leaving the echr mel stride, who we just had in here, wasn't able to. i said if you were in jenrick's shadow cabinet, would you sign up to leaving the echr? oh well, this is all hypothetical. i don't really know. you're going to have a problem convincing one nafion to have a problem convincing one nation as to do these things. >> well. firstly, that is why i trade in serious pots. i don't talk in platitudes because i

want to use this leadership election to settle some of these big questions, not just say there will be a plan in months or years time. let's have a plan now, because the public, which is what really matters, are deeply sceptical about the conservative party because we failed to deliver on some of these issues in office. that's why i say not just we will bring down the numbers coming here illegally, but we will have a cap set in law. and that's why i say we have to leave the echr now. i do believe we can persuade. >> it's hard to convince other tories this is a problem. we've all we've already had . right? all we've already had. right? what i would call wets. one nafion what i would call wets. one nation is throwing their toys out of the pram because it's a genenc out of the pram because it's a generic versus badenoch final. oh, you know , they're two right oh, you know, they're two right wing. so you've now got to persuade some of these people who might be in your tent. and to be fair, both of you have got quite a curious mix of support. you've got victoria atkins, who would be considered a one nation badenoch, i believe has got he's not enough is now, but she's got the backing of somebody like

damian green, who's associated with theresa may. so i get all that. but this has been the problem for successive leaders. you can't convince everyone in the party to do what you want to do, not least if you're on the right. >> well, firstly, as you say, i have got a broad range of people from victoria atkins, john lamont, ed agar to lord david frost and bill cash and jacob rees—mogg supporting me, get on to him. so i've built a broad coalition, but where i do differ with others in this leadership contest is i think you have to use the leadership contest itself to settle some of these big issues, like the echr , let big issues, like the echr, let the members choose, then we can have a mandate and then unite around that, because unity doesn't just come about because you wish it. so unity comes about because you're uniting around something. and that's what i want to do . i want a very what i want to do. i want a very clear, specific policies , not clear, specific policies, not just on our borders, also on how we reform our nhs, how we get growth going again in our economy, a different policy on net zero. how do you get homes built for young people? i've got

the clear answers to the big challenges facing our country, and with that, we've got something the party can actually unite around. and the philosophy behind those things. i believe , behind those things. i believe, is true, enduring conservative values. >> so you can give a guarantee here today that you will not roll back on the tens of thousands cap, or indeed the departure from the echr if you become leader. i say that because you did vote for remain, and now you're in a eurosceptic. so people might rightly be cynical about whether you can stick to your positions. >> look, these are things i feel very deeply about. ultimately , very deeply about. ultimately, these are the causes that i chose to resign from cabinet about. so your viewers know that i'm willing to take a stand on the big issues that matter to this country. >> let's be honest. let's just go back in time. did you resign from cabinet over this, or did you resign because you knew you weren't going to get a big job in rishi sunak's reshuffle? you resigned a few weeks before that reshuffle. afterwards, in a few weeks afterwards, after that

reshuffle in the december of 2023. right. you didn't get the big job. you wanted to be home secretary. you gave it to james cleverly. >> no, the reason i resigned, it was a hard decision to resign. resigning from government is not easy on a matter of principle. that's the reason why i was the only person to do it in the whole of. >> because you weren't given secretary. >> i resigned because i had fought relentlessly for the changes that were needed to our legal and illegal migration system, and then i wanted to do more. and so i chose not to give up, but to go into the parliament, go onto the backbenches and to work with 60 other conservative colleagues to fight for the change we need. and the principle one, which was obvious to me then and is clear to me now, is that you have to get out of the european convention on human rights if you want to get dangerous criminals off our streets, if you want to get terror suspects out of our country, and if you want to secure our borders, and if members of the conservative party vote for me in this leadership election, those policies will be the conservative party's policies. they'll be added to the stable of our party. if we win the next

general election, we will get on and do them and end this farce once and for all. >> one thing i'm not really clear on is your economic policies. what other, say three main tenets of your approach to the economy or what will they be? >> i want to get real growth going again in the economy, by which i mean gdp per capita helping everyone in our country to earn more, not just the overall size of the pie. and i think you do that in a number of ways. let's get millions of people off welfare into the dignity of work. well, i want to do what we did in the early days of the coalition with the sicknote culture. once more, because we've got now far too many people. for example , many people. for example, medicalizing normal human experiences under the guise of mental health. we've got to help those people into work to not just sign sick notes because they've only got a ten minute appointments. >> and frankly, doing anything else is all too difficult. >> well, we have to work with them just as we did once before under iain duncan—smith. we've got to do so again with mental health. i want to give young people real skills, not just low value degrees. and i've said, we

should close the worst universities in our country, turn them into hubs for apprenticeships. you know, i in 4 of our young people are leaving university and earning less than if they haven't been to university in the first place. >> do you not believe in that blairite ambition to get as many people into university as possible? >> no, i don't, because it's because i did . i >> no, i don't, because it's because i did. i did, but my parents both left school because i did. i