of look at that. we've got all of that and more on keeping me company tonight. my panel, i've got matt goodwin, the pollster, academic and of course, gb news presenter. and alongside him i've got james schneider, the former adviser to jeremy corbyn. so before we get stuck in, let's cross live and give you your good, says the us and russia had good, says the us and russia had a positive, constructive four a positive, constructive four hour meeting in saudi arabia hour meeting in saudi arabia

about the war. lavrov added that about the war. lavrov added that the deployment of nato troops in the deployment of nato troops in ukraine is unacceptable for ukraine is unacceptable for russia. and speaking this russia. and speaking this afternoon, president zelenskyy afternoon, president zelenskyy of ukraine has reiterated that of ukraine has reiterated that negotiations should not take negotiations should not take place behind ukraine's back and place behind ukraine's back and he has delayed his visit to he has delayed his visit to saudi arabia to not give saudi arabia to not give legitimacy to the us—russia legitimacy to the us—russia meeting in riyadh. it is meeting in riyadh. it is understood. it comes as sir keir understood. it comes as sir keir starmer said at a meeting with starmer said at a meeting with european leaders in paris european leaders in paris yesterday, that any ukraine yesterday, that any ukraine peace deal would require a us peace deal would require a us backstop to deter russia from attacking ukraine again. home secretary yvette cooper discussed the situation this afternoon. >> well, we need a lasting peace for ukraine that safeguards the sovereignty of ukraine. the prime minister has met with his european counterparts and will be meeting president trump shortly as well. clearly, there can be no negotiations about ukraine without ukraine, and

there's a huge amount of work to

wrong. decision as completely wrong. the lady chief justice, baroness carr, said it's for the government visibly to respect and protect the independence of the judiciary. >> i do not agree with the decision. >> and as you've been hearing, a press conference is currently underway on the toronto plane crash yesterday. delta air lines said most passengers in that crash have now been released from hospital. all passengers and crew on a flight that crashed and overturned while landing at toronto pearson airport in canada have survived. 19 of the 21 passengers taken to hospital have now been discharged, according to the airline. an investigation is now underway and authorities said toronto pearson airport had experienced 50cm of snowfall in recent days. a total of 20 members of canada's transportation safety board are at the airport for the investigation. those are the latest dup news headlines. now let's go back to michelle. >> for the very latest gb news direct your smartphone. sign up

to news alerts by scanning the qr code or go to gbnews.com/poll. >> thank you very much for that. i'm michelle dewberry. this is dewbs& co. we're with you till 7:00 tonight alongside me. i've got my panel. if you follow me on twitter, you must think i'm losing my marbles because i was just. i was in my own little bubble. then i was just tweeting saying, come and watch the programme. joining me is. and then i realised i was literally on telly, so i didn't get to say who was alongside me. so you might be thinking i'm a bit odd, but look, here they are. i've got mike goodwin, the pollster, academic and gb news presenter, alongside him, james schneider, the former adviser to jeremy corbyn. i like you two together. >> oh yeah, yeah. >> oh yeah, yeah. >> i do, because you can strap yourselves in, ladies and gents, because i think that we've got some robust, lively updates coming up, a valentine's special. well, if that's what you two want to feel like with

each other, that's up to you. or anything goes in this day and age, doesn't it.7 ladies and gents. anyway, look, join the conversation all the usual ways. email gb views gbnews.com/win. go to the website gbnews.com/yoursay. or of course you can tweet or you can text me. just don't expect me to finish my sentence on twitter. that's all i would say. but look, lots we need to discuss tonight. that plane crash we've just been hearing about. so very, very odd, isn't it.7 we'll be following that one with interest, finding out the details as they emerge. but for now, look, let's return to matters here because we all remember the story. very, very peculiar story of the palestinian family that essentially had the right of access to the uk using the ukrainian family scheme. it was debated in pmqs. you might remember last week. let's remind ourselves of that. >> mr speaker, let me be clear. i do not agree with the decision. she is right. it's the wrong decision. she hasn't quite done her homework because the decision, the decision in question was taken under the last government, according to

the legal framework from the last government. but, mr speaken last government. but, mr speaker, let me be clear. it should be parliament that makes the rules on immigration. it should be the government that makes the policy. that is the principle. and the home secretary is already looking at the legal loophole, which we need to close in this particular case anyway. >> now, the most senior judge in >> now, the most seniorjudge in england and wales has written a letter to keir starmer, essentially saying that she was deeply troubled and that this was unacceptable criticism. she was unacceptable criticism. she was explaining that actually there's an appeals process if you don't like decisions being made, but to criticise judges decisions. and of course, the judge was named in this case. this judge is arguing puts judges safety at risk. where are you, matt goodwin? >> well, i think that's ridiculous. i think there's nothing within the rule of law that stops democratically elected politicians or citizens from critiquing decisions that are made, particularly before appeals. and i think there are

lots of people watching the reaction of that judge probably watching this show, thinking they have been deeply troubled by a lot of the things they've seen within the legal system, the constant judicial overreach, the constant judicial overreach, the judicial activism whereby lawyers and courts have become increasingly political ever since tony blair brought in the human rights act, they've been deeply troubled by the decisions we've seen over the last two weeks, michel, where we've had a number of foreign national offenders and illegal migrants allowed to stay in the country on spurious terms, and they've been deeply troubled by the two tier justice that they've seen in this country in recent years. i think fundamentally, the legal system is really in a fragile place because it has become, i would argue, overtly political. and when you become political, you're going to get a political response. so i think lawyers, judges, the courts should go back to doing what they do, remembering that they are supposed to be neutral institutions and step back from being as political as they are.

>> james. >> james. >> i think matt is right that politicians should be allowed to criticise the rulings of judges, but i think that exchange in the commons last week was one of the most shameful things i've seen to see the leader of the opposition and the prime minister basically competing in who can be more outraged at the fact that a family from a shattered land that is a demolition site, according to donald trump, where all the people are, there's a plan to expel all of them, how they can compete about how we should be unhospitable to them. i found really quite disgusting and is so far away from how we rightly deau so far away from how we rightly dealt with and supported and accepted ukrainian refugees when they their country was invaded. so i think this is it's a it's a shameful, it's really shameful

for keir starmer. it's shameful for keir starmer. it's shameful for kemi badenoch. i think it's fine for judges, it's fine for judges to be criticised. but what they were doing there, they were saying that this family of six, four children, you know, treating them with no humanity whatsoever after where they are from has been absolutely obliterated. >> well, let's, let's let's not make sweeping generalisations. the british people have shown ample humanity to nearly 400,000 refugees since 2021. so first of all, let's just let's just get this thing. >> let's get this thing. i didn't say the british people. >> the second. >> the second. >> thing said keir starmer. >> thing said keir starmer. >> and the second, the second thing. >> i don't think represent the generosity. >> the second thing is where i agree actually with keir starmer, which is a sentence i never thought i'd utter in my life, but where i agree with keir starmer and kemi badenoch is that this is about the conception of power that we have in this country. do you think that immigration policy and who comes into britain and who doesn't, should be determined by the british people, or should it

be determined the british people, or