for the cancelled. so joining me for the next few hours, political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris warrell. so coming up, can european leaders come up with a plan to end the war in ukraine as they meet in central london today amid concerns over support for u5 amid concerns over support for us president donald trump after his very public falling outwith zelenskyy in the oval office. >> the gambling with. >> the gambling with. >> the gambling with. >> the lives of millions of people you're. gambling with world war iii. you're gambling with world war iii. >> now, we�*ll urge anyone to >> now, we'll urge anyone to actually watch the full interview to get your full opinion on that one. we'll have all the latest from these crunch talks as well. so for the great british debate this hour, i�*m asking, has your view of keir starmer changed for the better? many are praising the prime minister for his meeting with the us president earlier this week, winning over trump whilst also maintaining a strong relationship with the ukrainian president. 50 what do you think? i�*ve got a poll up on gb news.

com cast your vote now. has your view changed of keir starmer for the better? and we�*ll also be the better? and we'll also be heafing the better? and we'll also be hearing live directly from the prime minister following the discussions over ending the ukraine with fellow european leaders. a little later on in my show. but before all of that, let's get your latest news with aaron armstrong. >> hello there. good afternoon to you. it is a minute past three i�*m aaron armstrong. let's three i'm aaron armstrong. let's get you up to date with the top stories. as you've just been stories. as you�*ve just been hearing, sir keir starmer, the prime minister, has urged world leaders to step up in a once in a generation moment for security in europe. the prime minister is hosting a defence summit on ukraine. its president, volodymyr zelenskyy, arrived at the gathering a short time ago, greeted by the prime minister there. it all happens just a couple of days after that explosive oval office exchange with donald trump, which threatened to spark divisions

amongst western allies. you just got a quick glimpse of european leaders there. canada's justin trudeau is also in the room, as is the turkish foreign minister, hakan fidan. there, inside lancaster house in central london. and the prime minister says the uk will work together with france and ukraine on a peace plan to stop the fighting and then that will be presented to the us. he also said a good peace outcome for ukraine is vital to the security of nations across the continent. well, today's summit follows extraordinary scenes at the white house, which i mentioned where donald trump clashed with zelenskyy, telling him to strike a deal with russia or we�*re out. a deal with russia or we're out. dame priti patel says the uk�*s relationship with the us remains firm, but she's condemned the scenes in washington. >> those scenes on friday in the white house were awful. they were absolutely awful. and, you know, i just i were absolutely awful. and, you know, ijust i genuinely say this when we look at president zelenskyy, we feel a great deal of respect towards him because of respect towards him because of the way in which he's

of the way in which he�*s conducted himself over the three years of this appalling illegal conflict and the barbarism of russia, which he and his people, his country has stood up to. and that's why we will always stand shoulder to shoulder with ukraine and the people of ukraine. >> train fares are going up, and so is the pressure on commuters who are already battling record cancellations. from today, the cost of many journeys in england and wales will rise by around 4.6%. that adds hundreds of pounds to the price of some season tickets. now, campaigners are warning it will pile further misery on hard pressed households, with rail cars also becoming more expensive for the first time in more than a decade. the transport secretary, heidi alexander, has said she knows passengers are frustrated, but says the government's cap has kept the increase below average earnings growth. israel's blocked humanitarian aid going into gaza after the first phase of the ceasefire with hamas officially expired. it follows hamas rejecting a us proposal to extend the truce by

six weeks in return for the release of hostages. israel's prime minister benjamin netanyahu, says there will be further consequences unless the group changes its position. hamas has accused israel of blackmail and has called on mediators to intervene at talks on a second phase of the deal, including more hostage releases, have barely begun. pope francis remains in a stable condition after suffering a breathing crisis over the weekend. he is battling double pneumonia and is in hospital for a 17th day live shot here from outside the hospital in rome. the vatican says the 88 year old had a peaceful night and is receiving treatment to help him breathe. he was admitted on 14th of he was admitted on fifth of february with a severe respiratory infection that led to further complications, and we are expected to get a further medical update a little bit later today. finally, a space craft. a private space craft has landed on the moon and this one is still standing. a blue ghost

built by firefly aerospace, is the first commercial lander to touch down in one piece after arrival to topple over last yeah arrival to topple over last year. now it�*s part of a new year. now it's part of a new space race, with private companies teaming up with nasa to unlock the moon's secrets. experts say it could lead to cheaper missions and could even help humans return to the lunar surface. and no one's walked on surface. and no one�*s walked on the moon since 1972. but of course, that could soon change. i said finally, i've got time for one more story. charlie x dominated last night�*s brit dominated last night's brit awards, scooping five trophies. let's show you the moment she claimed one of the top honours. >> charli xcx x. >> charli xcx x. >> i�*m living proof that maybe >> i'm living proof that maybe it takes a long time, but you don't need to compromise if you believe in yourself enough. and honestly, if you make good enough music, people will resonate with you and be right there with you. >> she won song of the year and album of the year, and was also

named songwriter of the year and won best dance act. 50 scooping won best dance act. so scooping them all up at ezra collective, sam fender and stormzy with the other big british winners. that�*s it for the moment. i'll be back with more in just under half an hour. >> for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code or go to the qr code, or go to gbnews.com/poll. >> good afternoon. it�*s fast approaching seven minutes after 3:00. this is gb news. we are live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua. welcome. now coming up, can european leaders come up with a plan to end the war in ukraine as they meet in central london today amid concerns over support from us president donald trump after his very public so—called falling out in the oval office. >> gambling with the lives of millions of people. you're

gambling with world war iii, you're gambling with world war iii. >> i�*ll be bringing you all the >> i'll be bringing you all the latest from the crunch talks today. so for the great british debate this hour, i'm asking, has your view of keir starmer changed for the better? a lot of praising the prime minister for his meeting with the us president earlier this week, winning over trump whilst also maintaining a strong relationship with the ukrainian president. 50 online on gb news. com i�*ve got a poll asking you this question. has your view of keir starmer changed for the better? and in worldview, we go ahead to the united states to find out whether nato is coming to an end that is on the way. as even to an end that is on the way. as ever, send me your thoughts, post your comments gbnews.com/poll your say. >> james matthewson james cleverly vaiews@gbnews.uk. >> now, there are of course, demands for the end of the war in ukraine, and these are intensifying today as european leaders are meeting in london

for crucial talks to end the war and for a ceasefire deal which will guarantee ukraine a lasting peace based on sovereignty and security. now the talks follow the uncomfortable clash in washington between the us president and ukrainian president, which resulted in the ukrainian delegation being ejected from the white house. and by that there was supposed to have lunch. and the meeting did not end with lunch. they left early. joining me now, gb views political editor, christopher hope. christopher. good afternoon. christopher, what can you tell us? >> hi, nana. well, the 16 world leaders have gone inside, along with the nato secretary—general, the european commission president, and of course, european council leader. they've gone in, i should say, as well as eu leaders here. we've got trudeau from canada has flown in, and also the foreign

minister of turkey. a real moment here behind me though, the coldstream guards have gone in now. they were saluting everyone as they arrived, clicking their heels, the helicopter overhead, a real feeling of tension. the summit has released what they call a family photograph. that's all. family photograph. that�*s all. the photograph. photos of the leaders standing together. they look stern, they look nervous. i think because they are facing a new world order, with the us apparently withdrawing or threatening to withdraw from providing a security backstop, is now the time for these all these leaders on the continent of europe to step up now leading the way is sir keir starmer and emmanuel macron. sir keir starmer, of course, is hosting this event. it was planned to follow on from the one in paris, but now is much bigger given what has happened in the oval office as you referred to on fhday office as you referred to on friday night. what he wants is a coalition of the willing, probably organised by the uk and france, to establish some form of security force to enforce the peace in ukraine, if it can be agreed. also, some more money. we we've offered up this country

£2 billion overnight from interest on russian assets in this country. more of that to support ukraine to bolster them. and finally, the key question is will there be a us backstop? what they want is an air cover in the form of radar support, or maybe even long—range jets to enforce a degree of peace and enforce a degree of peace and enforce a degree of peace and enforce a peace deal if it can be agreed between ukraine and russia? a lot to talk about. a lot has changed in the past two weeks, and this place feels uncertain. it feels nervous. they�*ve been arriving here with we've been shouting out questions at them. they've been ignonng questions at them. they've been ignoring our questions. later we'll hear from the prime minister, sir keir starmer, in a press conference. the other world leaders from here will go off to their respective embassies and brief their own press. but how they communicate this to a worried public back home will be part of the day. >> now, chris, everyone was commending sir keir starmer on how he's handled and managed to how he�*s handled and managed to negotiate all of this. are there is there any sense that he was unwise to offer zelenskyy a

visit to the king? and that visit to the king? and that visit would actually be before donald trump's visit? because there is talk that, you know, that seems unwise. >> i don't think so. i mean, zelenskyy is here. we don�*t zelenskyy is here. we don't know. the palace would have asked to go and see him, not the uk government. the king charles is in sandringham, and that kind of request is given by the palace to zelenskyy. it's unlikely. unlikely that the number 10, apart from being consulted, was involved. it may be that king charles wants to show or demonstrate to donald trump that we are on the side of zelenskyy, too, and it's important. while he will be in balmoral, we expect later this summer planning a state visit for next year for donald trump. we must recognise in uk we are, as a country, standing full square behind zelenskyy. i think it's completely different to a to a state. visit is a meeting. it's a chat in a sitting room in a royal palace. it's not the same as in scale as what donald

trump is being offered, but i think it�*s more this the uk, this country putting an arm around zelenskyy after a really bruising encounter in the oval office on friday night. and then that's where we are. >> all right, christopher hope, thank you very much. we will be back to you to get more updates of that meeting at downing street. but joining me now is the chair of republicans overseas uk, greg swenson. greg, thank you very much for coming in. i mean, this is quite a momentous few days really. in fact, since trump has taken power, we've had a whirlwind of changes and we're feeling that there's a change in the world order. what did you make? let's go back to the meeting with jd vance donald trump and president zelenskyy. because i watched the clips, lots of people were taken in by the clips and i thought, that doesn�*t feel quite right. so i watched the entire thing. what did you think about it? i know you're obviously chair of the republicans uk, so, you know. >> it's a great. >> it's a great. >> point you mentioned. >> point you mentioned. >> but the difference. >> but the difference. >> between watching the clips, you know, that last ten minutes,

which was a bit of a meltdown versus the entire the entire press conference, we�*ll call it. press conference, we'll call it. you know, the first 40 minutes were great. president trump was holding his tongue. you could see he was, you know, maybe frustrated with some of the things that zelenskyy was saying. and zelenskyy kept poking the bear, kept going back and harping on a couple of these topics. and itjust, i think, got to a point where he stepped too far. he didn't read the room, first of all, and great contrast to the prime minister, who went on thursday and actually did read the room. so i think it was a misstep by zelenskyy, also a missed opportunity. if he had gone in in a more diplomatic way, like keir starmer did, like macron did on monday, i think it would have ended in a much more productive way. >> now you say it like keir starmer. unlike macron, a lot of people commending keir starmer for being such a great diplomat. i didn't quite see it that way myself, only because i didn�*t myself, only because i didn't think he had any cards to play

anyway, so he respected the fact that he didn't have any cards to play anyway, which is not what zelenskyy did. did you read that as great diplomacy? >> i think it i think it was i think he did a good job on thursday. he doesn�*t, you know, have a massive military to make, but it's better than the rest of europe with the exception of maybe turkey. 50 it's maybe turkey. so it's interesting to see turkey at the meetings today. but with that exception, the western europeans have completely underachieved and underperformed, and they've had three years to increase military spending. you know, whether it's as a percentage of gdp or an absolute numbers, and they're just not doing it. the germans are the worst example. they talked a huge game in february of 2022 after the war started. and then they completely abandoned their commitment. so it's going to require keir starmer because the uk is the only country that�*s punching above its weight at 2.3% heading to 2.5. it�*s 2.3% heading to 2.5. it's inadequate. and so is the us defence spending at 3.3 also

inadequate. but at least they're spending a lot more and are a lot more committed to defence and security than the rest of europe. >> now, zelenskyy made a big deal about the fact that donald trump met putin before him. it wasn't any special visit or state visit or anything like that, but it was just a meeting. yeah. now zelenskyy has been offered a meeting with the king. right. and of course, his meeting will be before donald trump�*s meeting, even though they say donald trump's is a state visit. right. do you think it was wise of sir keir starmer? >> i don't think that's a big >> i don't think that�*s a big deal. >> i don't think that�*s a big deali >> i don't think that�*s a big deal. i mean, the big question is, will zelenskyy zelenskyy put a suit on? i don't know that you can go to the palace dressed like he�*s he's typically dressed. i think people made too big a deal out of that, frankly. but again, it was a missed opportunity. imagine if zelenskyy thought, i'm going to read the room and put a suit on. it's not like me to do that, but it will show some respect for the country that's been bankrolling me, and also the country that is the most powerful in this coalition, if you want to call it that.

>> well, i kind of feel sorry for him in a way with regard to that, because obviously he doesnt that, because obviously he doesn't want to look like he's doing fine. obviously, he's very wealthy. he�*s probably wealthy. he's probably a billionaire because a lot of that money. i�*m not saying that that money. i'm not saying that he would have taken it all. he's misappropriated it, but a lot of it's gone missing. i don't know where it went. i don't know whether he knows, but he�*s not whether he knows, but he's not short of a few bob. yeah, but he doesn't want to show off to his people that he's doing fine, does he? 50. does he? so. >> well, he could have. >> well, he could have. >> gone. >> gone. >> to, you know, to tm lewin and bought a £200 suit. you know, i mean, it's you don't have to be a, you know, a fashion designer to see the president. ijust to see the president. i just think it would have shown a little more respect. he didn't show much respect at all. i thought he was really arrogant. and i think, again, a misstep, but a missed opportunity. >> but what about the fact that he doesn't want to give away his country? the people fighting for the country don't want to give the country don�*t want to give away their country? yeah, he is doing the heroic thing as a leader to stay in many of these situations. lots of these powerful leaders will fly off in a helicopter with bags of cash. instead he stayed. >> i thought he was very brave at the beginning of the war, and

of course, the ukrainian soldiers and the people are very brave and good for them. but that was then, and this is now, and now it's really a stalemate. and people are dying every day. and people are dying every day. and this is what president trump has been arguing that, you know. yes. and president trump said it at the beginning of the of the press conference on friday. you know, he was very proud of how brave the ukrainians have been. but it's also we have to have some realpolitik here. i mean, this is time to stop the killing. and yeah, i don't think that that zelenskyy's support is still there. to the degree it was in the winter of 22. >> and finally, this meeting today in the uk, lots of european leaders getting together. i think that what i think, from what i heard from christopher, that the what keir starmer would like to achieve is actually not impossible because you get the leaders together, but america do not want to continue to bankroll this war, rig ht. >> i right. >> i mean, look, i think the

europeans, if they collaborated and actually developed a military strategy, there could be some strength there. the combined economies in europe are ten times the size of russia, but they don�*t spend any money but they don't spend any money on defence. they they rely on the us for that. and that cannot continue, partly because we have $36 trillion in debt. eight of thatis $36 trillion in debt. eight of that is freshly minted debt. 50 we have a bit of a financial crisis ourselves and can't really continue to protect europe without and also pivot to the pacific and protect the world against china. and so, you know, this is just it's common sense for the europeans to step up. president trump pointed this out eight years ago. they they improved a little bit okay. they went from four four countries meeting the 2% minimum to 21 countries. but most of those are the smaller economies. poland is the smaller economies. poland is the most well discussed at 4%, but it's poland. and while germany, france, italy, spain

are completely inadequate. so and by the way, even if they made a commitment, it would take years for that to materialise. so, so right now. and it's a shame that three years later they still haven't done they still haven�*t done anything, especially the germans. >> we saw them struggling to even to make decisions. yeah. and so i can't see how they'll and so i can�*t see how they'll all decide to agree to do this, which i think is the problem with the eu. there are too many vested interests and their interests aren't the same. interests aren�*t the same. >> three years applauding zelenskyy, which is nice, but that doesn't help, right? that doesn�*t help, right? they�*ve got to do something more, right? >> thank you very. >> thank you very. >> much for. >> much for. >> being such a pleasure to. >> being such a pleasure to. >> talk to you. >> talk to you. >> see you, greg stenson. he is the chair of republicans overseas uk. right. well it is your final week to see how you could win one of two amazing prize bundles in our latest giveaway. each one has a brand new iphone 16, £500 giveaway. each one has a brand new iphone16, £500 in shopping new iphone 16, £500 in shopping vouchers and a whopping £10,000 in tax free cash. hurry because lines close on friday. >> it's the final week to see how you could be one of two big winners in our latest giveaway,

as we have two prize bundles that have to be won. there's two lots of a totally tax free £10,000 in cash. you'll also £10,000 in cash. you�*ll also receive a brand new iphone 16, receive a brand new iphone16, along with £500 in shopping vouchers to spend at your favourite store. hurry lines close on the 7th of march for another chance to win. text cash to 632321. entry cost £2 plus one standard network rate message or text bonus to 632325 entries cost £5 plus one standard network rate message. go to gbnews.com/poll. entry start from just £2. call 0903 6813232. calls cost £2 plus your network access charge, or post your name and number to gb 11, p0 box 8690. derby de1 9tt uk only entrants must be 18 or over. lines close at 6 pm. on the 7th of march. please check the 7th of march. please check the closing time if listening or watching on demand. good luck.

>> good luck indeed. well, it's going to be a momentous day today. 21 minutes after 3:00. you're with me. i�*m nana. akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. we are the people's channel. coming up, it's time for the first great british debate of this hour. and i�*m asking, has this hour. and i'm asking, has your view of sir keir starmer changed for the better? this is

gb news. good afternoon. 24 minutes after 3:00. this is gb news. we are live on tv, online and on digital radio. and it's time now for the first great british debate of this hour. and i'm asking, has your view of sir keir starmer changed for the better? now, many are praising the prime minister for a successful trip to see the us president at the white house earlier this week, where the two had seemingly warm negotiations

over trade, the chagos islands and the ukraine war. but how did this look back home? and can sir keir starmer's handling of current world situations right now win him voters back after reaching record low approval ratings? so for the great ratings? 50 for the great british debate this hour, i�*m asking you at home, has your view of sir keir starmer changed for the better? well, joining me now, political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris warrell. i'll start with you, chris. welcome to the program. thank you very much for joining us. i've not had you on the show before, so it's great to hear your views. do you think that keir starmer has been doing a good job, in your view? has your view of him changed for the better improved in any way? >> well, yeah, i mean i. think over the last few. days we�*ve seen keir. >> starmer sort of step up to the plate. he's developing a ceasefire plan now and has increased defence spending within the last week as well, having to make some tough decisions. around aid. >> and what. >> and what. >> we have seen is that he's strengthening the uk, ukraine relations and immediately signing £2 billion worth of loans using, you know, frozen

russian assets to fund it to fund things like air defence and artillery, which is much needed oven artillery, which is much needed over, over there at the minute. as well as last month, deploying 30,001st person view drones, which are sort of lighter and more advanced to help bolster the ukrainian defence. so we know that he's committed to know that he�*s committed to freedom, sovereignty and security at the minute. >> well, you say bolster the ukrainian defence, but it sounds to me like perpetuating war. where is the real talk of actual peace? it sounds like he's prepared to fight and fight on. he's even talked about putting troops on the ground, although they will be in a peacekeeping manner. we�*ve hardly got any troops here at home. are you saying that what you're seeing from sir keir starmer, from my view, looks like he's just sitting there and it's sort of arriving around him. >> no. >> no. >> i mean, at. >> i mean, at. >> the end of the day, we've. >> the end of the day, we've. >> got to make sure that ukraine doesn't lose the war. >> we�*ve got. >> we've got. >> we've got. >> well, can we do that? >> well, can we do that? >> well, can we do that? >> well, they need to be able to fight and they need to be equipped. and at the end of the day, we can�*t be having this undeclared war on russia, on europe, towards europe, just go unabated. i mean, we�*ve seen unabated. i mean, we've seen today in the last few days, you

know, how calm this in these situations, at these high tense moments can prove to be effective, you know, and that really makes sure that that the uk staying amongst these deals. so britain's at the table and we're seeing that play out as we speak. >> all right i�*m going to bring lee harris in. he called it a war on europe i mean it's a war on ukraine. we may be stepping up, but there was a memorandum that we all claimed that we would help if there was a situation. lee harris. >> yeah, i. >> yeah, i. >> don't think my view. >> don�*t think my view. >> don�*t think my view. >> of keir starmer has changed at all. >> i think that a lot of this just fell into his lap. >> especially after what happened on friday, those. incredible scenes that we saw and. >> the fallout of that. >> the fallout of that. >> so i think he had to i think he had to. >> it was basically. >> it was basically. >> easy, an easy thing for him to do. >> so the scenes you're referring to are the argument between donald trump and volodymyr zelenskyy. >> absolutely. >> absolutely. >> but to jump forward a little bit, to touch. on what you guys are saying, i. >> do think. >> do think. >> that. >> that. >> what keir starmer did. was good. >> he obviously. >> he obviously. >> knew how to play to trump�*s. >> knew how to play to trump's. >> knew how to play to trump's. >> what did he do there? i'm

just well, i see him sitting there and he�*s not being horrible to anyone, which is fine. but what is. >> oh i�*m not giving. >> oh i'm not giving. >> oh i'm not giving. >> him any. >> him any. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> there was no strategic credit. >> for this whatsoever. >> for this whatsoever. >> but starmer did the bare minimum and he did what zelenskyy. >> didn't do. >> didn't do. >> right. 50 he went in there with a with a wonderful gift from the king to come over from a state visit. job done. he's a state visit. job done. he�*s obviously kept to the brief. he knows what he's doing and he knows what he's doing and he knows that trump's going to like that because trump loves this country more than keir starmer. so that was a good move. well. >> he would probably say i mean i�*m sure keir starmer would disagree with that. >> but that. >> but that. >> i understand. >> i understand. >> and that was again. >> and that was again. >> it fell into his lap. >> it fell into his lap. >> there's no strategic. >> there's no strategic. >> credit that i�*m going to give >> credit that i'm going to give him for that. i think literally anybody could have done that. even chris would have done that right. so. right. 50. >> well, zelenskyy didn't do it >> well, zelenskyy didn�*t do it though, did he? >> well, this is. >> well, this is. >> the point. i was a lot of people said. >> that's the point i was going to make. but zelenskyy, maybe i�*m sort of jumping a bit too far, but the way i saw zelenskyy handle that conversation with trump, that was a huge diplomatic blunder. and i think i could understand the reaction

from trump and vance. >> now, of course, today is this big meeting at downing street. lots of world leaders across europe have come together to discuss the war in ukraine. chris, do you honestly believe that this is a winnable war for ukraine? seriously. >> i think when we're talking about how do we deal with the current situation, you know, starmer is making sure that we're not falling into the good versus evil trap. i think, you know, to the point that lee was just making there about the meeting. i you know, i don't disagree that zelenskyy handled that incorrectly. who was the villain in that was jd vance? i mean, he acted like rambo, but you know, he all all he is his experience in war is actually like david attenborough with a nikon camera. >> i think because he was talking about peace. >> no, he was interjecting, pushing on zelenskyy's buttons. when zelenskyy asked him come to ukraine, he said he'd watched watched it on tv. i mean, look, you can't be looking at a google map making these sort of decisions. he came across bucha trump, to be fair. look, he�*s playing the hard ball. he�*s playing the hard ball. he's trying to like like i've said previously, there's a strategic brinkmanship approach to this and it's got to be dealt with

delicately. but, you know, vance is not suitable for high office. and i think if anyone that came across badly yesterday or the other day, it was jd vance. >> did you watch the whole thing? >> i�*ve watched the whole thing. yeah. >> i just don't know how you can come to that conclusion if you watch the whole thing. it was a 15 minute press conference up until the last ten minutes. there was absolutely no problem. >> if you score an own goal in the last 90 minutes, lee, then then it's an own goal. i like. >> your analogy, but no, the point. the point i'm saying is, is that people describe this as an ambush, and it was nothing of the sort. i mean, even that ridiculous question from the reporter about zelenskyy not wearing a suit, trump backed him up. he said, i quite like what he's wearing, you know? so there was no animosity between the two. trump was speaking very clearly about wanting peace. that�*s his. and actually the point, the reason i really disagreed with what you just said is because vance was talking to the reporters, he was talking to the reporters, he was talking about diplomacy. and then zelenskyy kicked off. essentially, he challenged him in front of the world's. media in front of the world's. media in the oval office. >> 0h, in the oval office. >> oh, look, we�*ll come back to

that because we�*re going to talk about that later on. but so between the two of you, then you have not changed your view about keir starmer? >> no, not. >> no, not. >> at all. no. you have you felt that he's really rising up. that he�*s really rising up. >> yeah. he's keeping the uk influential and making sure no matter who's in the white house, matter who�*s in the white house, you know, that the uk still got a good relationship. >> with okay. marks out of ten for his performance, then. nine and of course his domestic performance. ten in the uk. >> yeah obviously. >> yeah obviously. >> ten out of what it's going. >> ten out of what it's going. >> to be. >> to be. >> ten out of a thousand. so you think he's doing better in the uk than he is abroad. >> well look there's a lot on the table at the minute. and you know these negotiations are still going on. so he's doing the best he can. >> all right. well let us know what you think. at home there's of course, political commentator lee harris and labour activist chris wall were being very gentle. right now you�*re with me gentle. right now you're with me 31 minutes after 3:00. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. i�*m sure things will change very shortly, because coming up in my second great british debate at this hour, i'm asking, has the row with zelenskyy put you off

donald trump? but first, let's donald trump? but first, let�*s get your latest news headlines with aaron armstrong. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> hi there. very good afternoon to you. it's just after 3:30. now sir keir starmer has urged world leaders to step up at a once in a generation moment for security in europe. the prime minister is hosting a defence summit on ukraine in central london right now, european leaders, plus canada�*s justin leaders, plus canada's justin trudeau and the turkish foreign minister are in attendance, along with the head of nato. the prime minister says the uk will work with france and ukraine on a peace plan, which will be presented to the united states. and alongside sir keir starmer, was that man volodymyr zelenskyy, ukraine�*s president. and the summit comes just two days after an explosive oval office exchange with donald trump, which you've just been trump, which you�*ve just been heafing trump, which you�*ve just been hearing about. zelenskyy will meet king charles later after today's summit. sir keir starmer today�*s summit. sir keir starmer has said that a good peace outcome for ukraine will be vital for the security of nations across the continent.

well, european leaders then hoping to present a united front and persuade donald trump they have a role in shaping ukraine's future. at today's summit future. at today�*s summit follows those extraordinary scenes at the white house, where donald trump clashed with zelenskyy, telling him to strike a deal with russia or we are out. well, dame priti patel says the uk�*s relationship with the u5 remains firm, but she�*s us remains firm, but she's condemned the scenes in washington. >> the scenes on friday in the white house were awful. they were absolutely awful. and, you know, i just i were absolutely awful. and, you know, ijust i genuinely say this when we look at president zelenskyy, we feel a great deal of respect towards him because of respect towards him because of the way in which he's of the way in which he�*s conducted himself over the three years of this appalling illegal conflict and the barbarism of russia, which he and his people, his country, has stood up to. and that's why we will always stand shoulder to shoulder with ukraine and the people of ukraine. >> and we�*ll bring you details of a press conference after that summit a little later. now train fares are going up and the

pressure is on commuters again who are already battling record cancellations from today. the cost of many journeys in england and wales is rising by about 4.6%. it's going to add hundreds of pounds to the price of some season tickets, and campaigners say it will pile further misery on hard pressed households, with rail cards also becoming more expensive for the first time in a decade. transport secretary heidi alexander says she knows passengers are frustrated, but insists the government's cap has kept the increase below average earnings growth and pope francis remains in a stable condition after suffering a breathing crisis over the weekend as he continues to battle double pneumonia, the vatican has said. the 88 year old had a peaceful night and is receiving treatment to help him breathe some live shots here from rome. the pope says he feels supported by all of god�*s people, but he did miss of god's people, but he did miss sunday blessing for a third week in a row. a full medical update is expected later. we'll bring that to you here on gb news as soon as we get it. that's it for

the moment. more at the top of the moment. more at the top of the next hour. >> for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone. sign up direct to your smartphone. sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code or go to gbnews.com/advent.

to >> good afternoon. 38 minutes after 3:00 if you�*re just tuned after 3:00 if you're just tuned in. welcome. we are gb news. we are britain's news channel. i�*m nana akua. and it's time now for the second great british debate of this hour. and i�*m asking, how�*s the row with zelenskyy put you off donald trump? now, the surprising argument in the oval office, if you could call it that, between the ukrainian president and the us president, shocked many, including european leaders who are meeting today in central london to discuss ending the war in ukraine or arming ukraine, by the sounds of it, with concerns that europe may have to put it alone, go it alone if they want to end the

conflict. well, i'm not sure whether arming continuing to arm ukraine is ending the conflict. i�*d call it perpetuating, but what do you think? so the great british debate this hour, though, having seen what happened in that row, and i don't know whether you watched the entire thing, has it put you off donald trump? joining me now, political commentator lee harris, labour activist chris worrall. lee harris, i'll start with you. >> what an amazing it was incredible television. like trump said i was i was actually down the pub at the time when i, when i watched it. i think that the reason it kicked off is because what zelenskyy was doing. so bear in mind the timing of events. right? so timing of events. right? 50 vance was talking to the world's media, talking about diplomacy and what what zelenskyy did is he put a dagger straight through trump and vance's entire policy by saying, essentially, now, i�*m not saying that zelenskyy didn't have a point. he did have a point. but the way he went about it publicly just completely rubbished vance and trump's

rubbished vance and trump�*s entire strategy, which is diplomacy. now, the way i see it is, has this put me off? trump? no, not at all. because what what i like about trump is what you see is what you get. and he's a deal maker and zelenskyy. this is why i couldn't believe this is why i couldn�*t believe zelenskyy played it so badly. zelenskyy played it so badly. zelenskyy knew what he was going into and he went in there and he was disrespectful on the world stage, and he embarrassed trump and he embarrassed vance in the oval office of all places. and that effectively what you got to remember when you're speaking to donald trump, you're notjust speaking to the person. you are speaking to the person. you are speaking to the american people who elected him. and that is the height of disrespect. so it was always going to end badly because of what zelenskyy did. but i think that what where trump what trump has to do now is, is, is he is resetting, like you said a minute ago, this has been going on for three years. this something has to change. we cannot just keep feeding money into this meat grinder in

ukraine. i, i wanted ukraine to win in five minutes. that would have been fantastic. but i think that's unrealistic. it's not that's unrealistic. it�*s not going to happen. so that's unrealistic. it�*s not going to happen. 50 something needs to reset. and that�*s what needs to reset. and that's what i think trump's doing. >> of course. >> of course. >> well look i mean talking about how's the row put me off trump. let's just take our mind back to the minsk agreements that putin flouted twice. i mean, trump's response to that was weak at best and enabling at worst. and, you know, he froze military aid in exchange to try and get zelenskyy to do some digging on hunter biden. so, you digging on hunter biden. 50, you know, and then he folded quicker than a sun lounger without a screw. but the what has happened now? i�*d say i'd take now? i'd say i'd take a different approach to understanding how that meeting went. that was a deliberate attack on zelenskyy, but it is all part of the plan, i imagine, because say what you like about him, his, you know, unpredictability could be the game changer to sort of, you know, negotiations at the end of the day. and, you know, while biden stuck to the nato playbook, it doesn't really get things moving along. you know,

we've got an art of deal diplomacy, in my opinion, that he's taken with the brinkmanship approach, letting things collapse and then sort of let everyone come back around to the table. but the real thing person, as i sort of mentioned before, around what who's been put off here is jd vance. i mean, at the end of the day, that man has the authority of a traffic warden in a riot like the way he's coming across, pointing in from the side, you could have had just zelenskyy and trump, and they could have had a tete a tete without some sort of child on the side, throwing his toys out the pram, because that's what made it because that�*s what made it embarrassing at the end of the day. so while trump, in my opinion, in my estimation, is have gone up because i think it is tactical, i think it's all about having a negotiation here and getting the best out of the deal. and he's come a long way from looking weak and feeble trying to get putin around the table. and he's got to do that. table. and he�*s got to do that. he's got to be convincing to he�*s got to be convincing to putin that he actually means what he says. but you can�*t have that when you've got some sort that when you�*ve got some sort of joker public affairs bloke sitting next to you. >> i don't get this hatred for vance. he was right. he was right to say that you shouldn't litigate this in front of the

world�*s media, i think, where maybe this isn't really maybe this isn�*t really a criticism of trump, but at that point, trump could have said, right. thank you very much, everyone. let's wrap it up. and then we wouldn�*t have had seen then we wouldn't have had seen this unfold in front of the world�*s press. personally, i'm kind of pleased that we saw it. for once, we saw a little glimpse of what goes on behind closed doors. but i just don't get what this hate for vance. vance was right, and he was being directly. it was him. don't forget that, zelenskyy. don�*t forget that, zelenskyy. >> was he right? some people may not have seen the whole thing. what did vance do? >> vance was right to call out zelenskyy for trying to litigate the details of this deal in front of the world media. that's how i felt it. and he was absolutely right to call zelenskyy out for it. did he go too far? maybe. but his his instincts were right and he was right to call zelenskyy. >> well, look, from what i saw, jd vance was reacting to zelenskyy saying that, oh, well, next thing the war will be on your doors. and waltz was saying, no, don't say that. why would it be on our doors? it will be you. next is the sort of emotional play that is often used, and i don't i don't

particularly like that myself, if i'm honest, because it's the imagination of what might happen in the future instead of dealing with the here and now. and it's also a kind of emotional manipulation. >> now, what we saw was jd vance get triggered by zelenskyy raising his eyebrows, and then he's gone in talking about, oh, you've got some problems haven�*t you've got some problems haven't you. why aren't you saying thank you? he said thank you every time he's ever been. >> well hang on, why did keir starmer do so well, in your view, was it not because he was conciliatory? >> well did you say did you see jd vance get involved with those discussions. but no. >> no, but. >> no, but. >> why do what i'm saying this is the difference. >> but why are you saying that keir starmer did well, because he was conciliatory towards donald trump. you agreed with lee harris, which is what lee was saying. and now you�*re saying that. >> no, i�*m saying keir starmer takes a calm, cool, collected approach. zelenskyy not being provoked. >> you accepted that he came in in the right way and did it the right way. yeah, zelenskyy didn't do that. >> pragmatic. >> pragmatic. >> but zelenskyy didn't do that, though. >> zelenskyy did do that. he was just well, he was left, as we saw, for 30 or 40 minutes. it was all pretty, pretty good going, as we've all admitted that it was only when, after jd

vance butted in with some silly remarks that then zelenskyy made those remarks about, well, there's a there's an ocean. and, you know, you might be feeling it here soon and maybe that at that point you could say zelenskyy maybe misspoke. >> before we go on. okay. so i watched it. how many times did zelenskyy you use the word peace? >>i peace? >> i couldn�*t tell you, to be honest. >> donald trump. >> donald trump. >> well, he�*s playing the emotion. >> how many did he how many. >> how many did he how many. >> times i wasn't counting. okay. >> and jd vance okay. so i watched it. i looked at the transcript, i went back, donald trump called for peace three times. yeah, jd vance called for peace once and zelenskyy only once. >> well, if that was all that was on discussion. >> was the problem was that it didn't look like zelenskyy wanted peace. he wanted more weapons. he wanted more fighting. >> do you think he was turning up >> do you think he was turning up to the oval office because he didn't want peace? he's talking about children getting bombed. >> i think. >> i think. >> he wanted well, he needs them because they�*re getting killed at the moment. >> how about the war ends and nobody dies? >> well, you can do that without

having some sort of child on the sideline throwing fingers and butting into a big boy conversation. >> you�*re being quite unfair to jd vance on that. look, i want to come back to this, but i�*ve got to move on, because if you're in search of some winter sun, here's the forecast of some of the top european holiday destinations. >> ready to soak up that holiday sunshine. >> won't we need some cover? >> won't we need some cover? >> no worries. all sorted. >> no worries. all sorted. >> allclear travel insurance. sponsors gb news travel. destinations. forecast. >> hello there! welcome to your latest winter surr forecast. well, have you heading towards spain and the canaries? over the coming days there will be some rain and potentially some strong winds around at times, but the conditions will improve here as the week goes on. for parts of central med. generally. a fine start to the week here, maybe a few showers around and for eastern areas. certainly temperatures are beginning to climb after a cold few days and further west actually sunshine by the middle part of the week for tenerife. >> allclear travel

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>> good afternoon. you�*re with me. this is gb news. we are britain's news channel. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. it's just fast approaching 51 minutes after 3:00, let's travel over to the us and speak to the host of the politics people podcast, paul duddridge. paul. well, it�*s been a big day today, hasn't it? this is we've got all the politicians, all the world leaders, a lot of them from europe coming over. ijust leaders, a lot of them from europe coming over. i just want europe coming over. ijust want to start with this very quickly and get your take on what happened on friday and how the americans are seeing things with regard to jd vance, donald trump and of course, zelenskyy. >> i think. >> i think. >> the split is pretty. >> the split is pretty. >> much the same over here. >> much the same over here. >> as it is. >> as it is. >> over there. it's like sometimes. >> it�*s along party lines. >> it�*s along party lines. >> it�*s along party lines. >> i went back, i did what you did. i went back and watched the

entirety. >> of this in. >> of this in. >> preparation to come on today. >> preparation to come on today. >> the whole. >> the whole. >> 49 minute press conference. and i have to say, look, i�*m always biased, but honestly, i do genuinely think trump was right. and zelenskyy was slightly. look, my take on it is and i think a lot of americans are picking up on this zelenskyy resented being put in this position of having to do this mineral deal before they could talk about peace, and so that's why in that oval office, he was trying to move the conversation to get trump to commit to further military support in future. that wasn't part of this negotiation. that's why trump kept saying, no, no, we�*re going kept saying, no, no, we're going to sign this first. and lee was quite right. trump actually does say, i like what he's wearing. he's beautiful. he said that about zelenskyy. so this idea about zelenskyy. so this idea about clothing and stuff. but basically zelenskyy was trying to do a move and jd vance picked up to do a move and jd vance picked up on that, and it was jd vance that was interrupted by zelenskyy. jd vance made a perfectly banal, you know,

diplomatic comment about, hey, let's be diplomatic here. let�*s let's be diplomatic here. let's use diplomacy. he pointed to the previous administration. relevant, because zelenskyy had come and campaigned for the previous administration if they wanted to. you know, if zelenskyy wanted to wear this stuff in public. 50 a lot of people and there was the, the, the minerals deal and this is the minerals deal and this is the thing early on trump had said ceasefire. you quite rightly. peace, peace, peace, ceasefire. zelenskyy in the oval office said, yeah, we�*re not office said, yeah, we're not having a ceasefire. we�*re not having a ceasefire. we're not going to do a ceasefire. how can you take that off the table? how can you say no ceasefire when we're paying for it? is the feeling even correcting trump about we�*ve given more money now. he might. europe has given more in real terms of cash, but the united states has 3.4% of its gdp is paying nato. you've got countries in in nato supporting ukraine that are like 1.2%, 1.5%. so, you know, you can make a, in real terms, more cash from europe, but in in gdp terms, more from each individual

american. and i think that's what's resonating with americans here. and look at trump. look at trump subsequently. again, you know there's a lot of division jd vance is now his family had to go into hiding on holiday. they went for a ski break in vermont. so they�* re they went for a ski break in vermont. so they�*re being vermont. so they're being protested and they've had to be moved to a secure location. so that gives you some reaction from the opponents, but it is actually getting picked up on by more and more americans. it's like, hang on a second. this isn't some straightforward isn�*t some straightforward ambush. and kind of i think it�*s ambush. and kind of i think it�*s a bit sort of childish to describe it as an ambush, because zelenskyy decided to use a live press conference, which i think is really respectful and trusting, to try and sandbag these negotiations and to force trump's hand into committing to trump�*s hand into committing to further military action. when this was just the minerals deal they were talking about. >> we�*ve kind of run out of >> we've kind of run out of time. i wanted to talk to you about quite a few more bits on there, but this is the big topic. of course, keir starmer is hosting the european leaders

now, very briefly. is that wise. you've got about five seconds to give me your thoughts. you can squeezeit give me your thoughts. you can squeeze it in. >> well who'd have thought. starmer is now a statesman. he did a brilliant oval office. 50 did a brilliant oval office. so it's what a what a topsy turvy week. yeah. starmer now is the statesman of europe and the united states. quite extraordinary. >> all right paul thank you very much. he�*s the host of the much. he's the host of the politics people podcast. plenty more to come throughout the show. we'll be expecting to hear from the prime minister following a meeting with european leaders about ending the war in ukraine. but now let's get an update with your weather. >> heavy showers first thing will be followed by a warm, cosy day. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> good afternoon, welcome to your latest gb news weather from the met office. high pressure stays in charge of our weather across the southern half of the uk over the next couple of days, but low pressure never too far away. further north with other fronts trying to sneak their way south and eastwards as we go over the next couple of days, but generally starting to weaken as they bump into that area of

high pressure. that does mean there's going to be quite a lot of cloud around across parts of northern ireland, scotland into northern parts of england, with this weather front pushing its way south and eastwards. so perhaps some quite heavy rainfall across western parts of scotland into the early hours of monday morning. but further south, a bit of a different picture. plenty of clear spells on offer, so turning quite chilly under those clear skies. two perhaps as low as —4 or —5 in some spots, however, staying generally frost free across the northern half of the uk as we go into the start of monday morning. under those clear spells, particularly across the southern half of the uk and in particular across the southeast, there could be some mist and fog in places so that perhaps causing some travel disruption dunng causing some travel disruption during monday morning's rush houn during monday morning's rush hour, however, a different picture. further north, plenty of cloud around some outbreaks of cloud around some outbreaks of rain across northern ireland, northern parts of england, in southern parts of scotland, particularly over any high ground to blustery showers, then feeding in from the west across parts of shetland and orkney, and still remaining really quite cloudy to start the day on monday for much of scotland. as we then go through the rest of monday morning, any of that mist we then go through the rest of monday morning, any of that mist

and fog perhaps a little slow to and fog perhaps a little slow to clear in places, but will clear in places, but will eventually burn off as the sun eventually burn off as the sun comes up, leaving plenty of comes up, leaving plenty of sunshine for the southern half sunshine for the southern half of the uk as we go through of the uk as we go through monday afternoon. further north, monday afternoon. further north, still remaining rather quite still remaining rather quite cloudy across northern parts of cloudy across northern parts of england over any high ground england over any high ground temperatures, generally around temperatures, generally around about where they were on sunday. about where they were on sunday. highs of 1011, perhaps 12 highs of 1011, perhaps 12 degrees. so really feeling quite degrees. so really feeling quite degrees. 50 really feeling quite pleasant where we see that degrees. 50 really feeling quite pleasant where we see that sunshine in the south as we then sunshine in the south as we then go through monday evening, that boilers the rest of go through monday evening, that band of cloud across the central band of cloud across the central swathe of the uk does continue. swathe of the uk does continue. outbreaks of rain and hill fog outbreaks of rain fog continuing across northern parts outbreaks of rain and hill fog continuing across northern parts of england, but there is going of england, but there is going to be plenty of sunshine on continuing across northern parts of bejland, but there is going continuing across northern parts of bejland, tof there is going continuing across northern parts of bejland, tof sunshinejoing continuing across northern parts of bejland, tof sunshine on rg offer for the southern half of to be plenty of sunshine on offer for the southern half of the uk through tuesday and the uk through tuesday and wednesday. perhaps that sunshine wednesday. perhaps that sunshine a little hazier by the time we a little hazier by the time we get to thursday, but get to thursday, but temperatures are on the rise as temperatures are on the rise as we go to the end of the week. we go to the end of the week. >> expect a warm front moving >> expect a warm front moving from the kitchen right through to the rest of from the kitchen right through to the rest of the boxt the boxt boilers

boxt >> hello, good afternoon and welcome to gb news where live on tv, online and on digital radio. i�*m nana akua and for the next two hours, me and my panel will be taking on some of the big topics hitting the headlines. right now. this show is all about opinion. it's mine, it�*s theirs. and of course it's yours. we'll be debating, discussing and at times we will disagree, but no one will be cancelled. so joining me for the next few hours, political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris warrell. so coming up, i asked, can european leaders come up with a plan to end the war in ukraine? they are meeting right now in central london amid concerns over the support from the us president, donald trump, after his very public falling outwith zelenskyy in the oval office on friday. >> gambling with the lives of millions of people you�*re gambling with world war iii, you're gambling with world war iii. >> we�*ll be keeping you updated >> we'll be keeping you updated throughout the show. and so i'm

asking, has your view of keir starmer changed for the better? lots of people praising the prime minister for his meeting with the president earlier. some are saying that he�*s doing are saying that he's doing a good job maintaining a strong relationship also with the ukrainian president. i�*ve got ukrainian president. i've got a poll up on gb news asking you that question. has your view of sir keir starmer changed for the better? i�*ll bring those results better? i'll bring those results at the end of the programme and at the end of the programme, and we'll be hearing live directly from the prime minister. following the discussions over ending the ukraine conflict with following the discussions over ending the ukraine conflict with fellow european leaders leaders fellow european leaders leaders a little later on in the a little later on in the programme. stay tuned. but programme. stay tuned. but before we get started, let's get before we get started, let's get your latest news with aaron your latest news with aaron armstrong. armstrong. >> in. >> in. >> in. >> thank you. nana a very good >> in. >> thank you. nana a very good presented afternoon to you. just after afternoon to you. just after 4:00, our headlines, sir keir 4:00, our headlines, sir keir starmer has urged world leaders starmer has urged world leaders to step up at a once in a to step up at a once in a generation moment for security generation moment for security in europe. now the prime in europe. now the prime minister is hosting a defence minister is hosting a defence summit in central london. he summit in central london. he says the uk will work with says the uk will work with france and ukraine on a peace france and ukraine on a peace

plan, which will then be plan, which will then be presented to the united states. sir keir starmer says a good outcome from ukraine would also be vital for the security of nations across the continent. now the summit comes after european leaders rallied around ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy after his confrontation with donald trump at the white house on friday. and that has created a divide between the us and its european

butml’f’éii 5 sing. é—éféwfwf the summit follows those future. the summit follows those extraordinary scenes, of course, at the white house, where donald trump clashed with zelenskyy, telling him to strike a deal with russia or we are out. trump said well, dame priti patel says the uk�*s relationship with the uk with the us remains firm, but she has condemned those scenes in washington. >> those scenes on friday in the white house were awful. they were absolutely awful. and, you know, i just i were absolutely awful. and, you know, ijust i genuinely say this when we look at president zelenskyy, we feel a great deal of respect towards him because of respect towards him because of the way in which he's of the way in which he�*s conducted himself over the three years of this appalling illegal conflict and the barbarism of russia, which he and his people, his country, has stood up to. and that's why we will always stand shoulder to shoulder with ukraine and the people of ukraine. >> bad news for commuters who are already battling record train cancellations, because fares are going up. from today, the cost of many journeys in

england and wales will rise by about 4.6%. so hundreds of pounds onto the price of some season tickets. campaigners say it will pile further misery on already hard pressed household budgets. rail cars will become more expensive too, for the first time in more than a decade. the transport secretary, heidi alexander, says she knows passengers must be frustrated, but insists the government�*s cap but insists the government's cap has kept the increase below average earnings growth. israel's blocked humanitarian aid into gaza after the first phase of the ceasefire with hamas has expired. it follows hamas has expired. it follows hamas rejecting a us proposal to extend the truce by six weeks in return for the release of hostages. israel's prime minister says there will be further consequences unless the group changes its position. hamas has accused israel of blackmail and has called on mediators to intervene at talks which have been taking place in cairo for the second phase of the deal. haven�*t really got the deal. haven't really got properly started. pope francis

remains stable after suffering a breathing crisis over the weekend. he continues, though, to battle double pneumonia in hospital for a 17th day. the vatican says the 88 year old had a peaceful night in hospital in rome, and is receiving treatment to help him breathe. he was admitted back on february the 14th with a severe respiratory infection, and that has led to further complications. we�*ll update you when the vatican releases a full medical update later today. and a private spacecraft has landed on the moon. and this one is still standing. blue ghost, built by firefly aerospace, is the first mission to land in one piece after a rival mission toppled over last year. it is part of a new space race. private companies have teamed up with nasa. they're trying to unlock the moon�*s secrets and access the moon's secrets and access potentially frozen water there. experts say it could lead to cheaper missions and help humans return to the lunar surface, or indeed, travel beyond the moon. but no one has walked on the surface since 1972. but of

course, that could all change. and last night's brit awards went brat as charli xcx dominated proceedings, scooping up dominated proceedings, scooping up five trophies. here's the moment she claimed one of the top honours. >> charli xcx. >> charli xcx. >> i�*m living proof that maybe >> i'm living proof that maybe it takes a long time, but you don't need to compromise if you believe in yourself enough. and honestly, if you make good enough. >> music. >> music. >> people will resonate with you and be right there with you. >> charli there. she won. song of the year, album of the year, songwriter of the year and also took the best dance act award. ezra collective, sam fender and stormzy were amongst the other big british winners. those are your headlines. i'll be back with more at 4:30. >> for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone. sign up direct to your smartphone. sign up to news alerts by scanning

the qr code or go to gbnews.com/advent. >> malcolm grimston. >> malcolm grimston. >> seven minutes after 4:00. you're with me. i�*m nana akua. this is a gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. coming up, can european leaders come up with a plan to end the war in ukraine as they meet in central london? right now, that's what they're doing. amid concerns over the support from the us after this obviously the us after this. obviously very public falling out at the oval office. >> gambling with the lives of millions of people. you're gambling with world war iii, you're gambling with world war iii. >> now, there�*s been a bit of outrage from some politicians across the board demanding that trump's state visit to britain trump�*s state visit to britain should be cancelled. what do you think? tory shadow minister alicia kearns has called on sir keir starmer to axe donald trump�*s second state visit,

insisting that the king should not have to make up for the prime minister's diplomatic prime minister�*s diplomatic failings. now go along with the second bit, but i�*m not sure the second bit, but i'm not sure the reasoning works with what happened there. we�*ll be happened there. we'll be discussing that in the great british debate this hour because i�*m asking, should donald trump's state visit to britain trump�*s state visit to britain be cancelled? and we'll be heafing be cancelled? and we'll be hearing live directly from the prime minister. following the discussions over ending the ukraine conflict with fellow european leaders a little later on in the show. they�*re currently meeting right now at downing street. that is coming up. as ever, send me your thoughts, post your comments. >> gbnews.com/yoursay chris billam—smith gbnews.com/win billam—smith. gbnews.com/win james matthewson. >> so there are demands for an end to the war in ukraine. these are intensifying as european leaders, they are having that conversation in downing street. their talks are to end the war and for a ceasefire deal which guarantees ukraine a lasting peace based on sovereignty and security. the talks, of course, follow the uncomfortable clash in washington, dc, between the

us and ukrainian presidents, which resulted in the ukrainian delegation leaving the white house earlier than planned. prime minister sir keir starmer will also be providing an update on discussions in the press conference in around about an houfs conference in around about an hour's time. so it should be dunng hour's time. so it should be during my show. stay tuned and we'll bring you all the updates there. joining me now, former british army officer and defence analyst simon higgins. simon, thank you very much for joining me. look, simon, i'm hearing that the europeans want to keep arming ukraine in the hope that there will be some sort of european force put more money into nato. but that sounds like to me they want to perpetuate the conflict. is this wise? >> no they're not. i mean, what. >> no they're not. i mean, what. >> we�*re trying. >> we�*re trying. >> to do is find a ceasefire that's actually sustainable and turns. >> into a peace. i think the whole. >> emphasis from president trump was all about the ceasefire. that�*s probably relatively. >> easy to. >> easy to. >> achieve that what ukraine is after. >> and what europe. >> and what europe. >> should be after is a

sustainable peace. and that's. >> more hard to. >> more hard to. >> do that and will require the europeans to support ukraine. >> originally, i think the intention. >> was to ensure that they did that primarily through the arming. >> of ukraine. >> of ukraine. >> and last year. >> and last year. >> ukraine went. >> ukraine went. >> to actually went to the nato summit and talked about what he talked about a non—nuclear strategic deterrent, which you talk about things like long—range missiles and air defence to deter president putin and the russian military from there. this is more difficult. now we're in a situation whereby the that ceasefire and the peace we're after, in a sense, is being taken over by president trump's initiative. he went over trump�*s initiative. he went over the top of ukraine's head. he gave away the two key things that ukraine was, was after and then tried to bully president zelenskyy publicly. >> and humiliate him. >> and humiliate him. >> which i'm afraid is, in my view, and lots of other people's view, and lots of other people's view, frankly, disgraceful. >> i just want to correct what i

said earlier. actually, the press conference in central london, not in number 10. apologies for that. let me just get this straight. you think that that meeting there, president trump was trying trying to humiliate zelenskyy? did you watch the entire thing? >> yeah. 50 the first first 30 >> yeah. so the first first 30 minutes was looked quite normal. it looked like the kind of normal press conference opportunity. and then the last ten, it turned really, really nasty. and you had the kind of the, the insults, verbal assault on him from very disrespectfully initially from vice president jd vance and then president trump. pardon as well. i mean, we all understand protocol. you don't understand protocol. you don�*t normally have. >> sorry. are you talking about the conversation about the clothes? because whilstjd vance clothes? because whilst jd vance said, you know, made a comment about, well, which comment are you talking about? >> no, that's that's. >> no, that's that's. >> political knockabout. i mean, that's neither here nor there. we know what president zelenskyy has been doing. he hasn't worn a

suit since the beginning of the war in solidarity with his military. so it's got nothing to do with that. we're talking do with that. we�*re talking about when he started talking, accusing president zelenskyy of being of being disrespectful and frankly, shouting at him. that's not how vice president talks to a president. that�*s disrespectful. >> that's interesting that you sort of interpreted that way. i didn't see that. what i saw was actually zelenskyy actually interrupting jd vance, and i saw the emotional manipulation of the emotional manipulation of the thing. let me just tell you what i saw, which was him saying that, oh, well, it will be you will be next and all that kind of thing, which i'm not sure how helpful that is when you're on the back foot and somebody's been supplying you with weapons for a long time so that you can continue fighting, i just didn't think that that was wise. >> i think there's no question about it that president zelenskyy lost his temper and that probably wasn�*t wise. yeah, but it was under provocation. what you had was kind of frat boy pile on from president trump and jd vance. and i'm afraid that's that's not a great way to

behave. and when you're talking to somebody who has who has fought an aggressor for three years, there are some millions of ukrainians who are who are refugees and millions, literally billions of pounds worth of damage across the across the country. what you show is you show them some respect. now, you may have to be difficult with them and say, hey, look, we need to bring this to be a ceasefire. and that's to be problematic. that�*s fair enough. there may also be occasions, and i've seen also be occasions, and i�*ve seen this in my own experience as a as a defence attache, where some very strong conversations take place in private. what you don�*t place in private. what you don't do is what happened in public in the oval office. i mean, that that frankly, was shameful. >> i don't know, i didn't see what you saw. i saw something very different. and i think some people saw it my way. some people saw it my way. some people saw it my way. some people saw it. >> your way. >> your way. >> some people saw it. >> some people saw it. >> sorry. >> sorry. >> let me. sorry. let me finish. no, no, no. sorry. let me finish. simon! i'm talking. i�*m listening to what you. >> said and i'm talking. i�*ve got a question. >> for you. well, if you just let me finish, i can then address what you're saying. but, simon, the whole world didn't

see that. actually, i've got people on my panel who think differently, and i've got those who agree with your perspective as well. so just just to be clear on that. but my point is this. >> i think the majority of people, the majority of people in the world saw a president whose country has been fighting for three years publicly humiliated by president trump and vice president pence. i'm and vice president pence. i�*m sorry if you see it differently, but that's what we�*re trying to but that�*s what we're trying to do. even, even even prime minister starmer said that as well. >> i�*m notjust because he said >> i'm notjust because he said it doesn't mean i'm going to go along with it. i'm not bold enough to say that the majority, the majority, sorry, the majority of the people in the world saw this and that, because i can't say that because i don't know that. so i'm not prepared to say that. all i can tell you is what i saw, which isn't the same from your perspective. so there are two of us here, and it's 5050, and i think the split is quite similar. we�*ve done a few polls on that. as to whose side are you on? and actually zelenskyy pipped it with the same brexit vote, 5248. so it�*s same brexit vote, 5248. so it's kind of evenly split. what

people saw. >> well it's not quite evenly. >> well it�*s not quite evenly. >> well it�*s not quite evenly. >> well it�*s not quite evenly. >> well but. >> well but. >> this, this this one, this one, including the world leaders, including most of the leaders, including most of the leaders of nato, said it was disgraceful. i happen to say that i personal view i'm that i personal view i�*m prepared to listen to the leaders of nato and all the other european countries, all of whom thought that what happened in the oval office was a disgrace. the only person who thought it was not a bad thing was viktor orban of hungary and his sidekick from slovakia. and these are not serious people. they�*re going to leave nato in next couple months. but that's that�*s where we are. that's where we are. >> well, to be. with all respect, to be fair, they are backing zelenskyy. so i don't think that i would say that they were objective views. so i hear were objective views. 50 i hear that. but they are backing zelenskyy. so i would you know they're not neutral. no, no but they're not neutral. no, no but they're not neutral. no, no but they're not from a neutral perspective. so they would say that that's what i think on that. but let's let�*s just come back to the meeting today because obviously today the european leaders are talking about a ceasefire, although they are talking about weapons and arming. do you think that we are

in any position if nato were to seriously put more money behind their defence, do you think that nato would be a big enough force against russia? >> well, nato at the moment includes america. so the issue is really is can the europeans, without the americans, provide most of that force? and the reality of that is probably not. we've had years and years of defence expenditure, and the net result is we don't have the armed forces to try and do that, which is why it is going to be very hard, which is why we've also heard prime minister starmer today talking about trying to find a way back after the disastrous events on friday in the oval office. so there is a recognition that the what the europeans can do without american support is very limited, and that is a direct result of the way in which we have shamefully neglected our defence and security spending over many, many years. now, it depends really what the state of the situation is. if it's simply a ceasefire, we have a problem. if it's a ceasefire with

if it�*s a ceasefire with sustainable peace, and we have some guarantees that can be genuinely accepted from russia, that then there may be something we dependently with them, but that�*s going to be very that's going to be very difficult to do. as president zelenskyy said in the time that he's been in office. president putin has broken his word 25 times with that kind of background. it's not too background. it�*s not too surprising. erwin james of ukraine simply don't trust russia and don't trust president putin. >> all right. listen, thank you very much, simon diggins. really good to talk to you. thank you so much for your views. he's a british former british army officer and a defence analyst. arne slot his views and how he perceived it. joining me now are political commentator lee harris, labour activist chris warren. chris, did you agree with him? >> yeah, i mean, i think the quip that is a fact by paul himars was right. i mean, if we're talking about, you know, the state visit, i mean, starmer has dismissed any suggestions of it, you know, not happening. and we've seen people who had sort of desperate for attention, trying to sort of come out of their kind of was itjohn their kind of was it john

swinney from their kind of was itjohn swinney from the snp and alicia kearns there with, with kemi sort of doing a reverse ferret pretty quickly. but but at the end of the day, you know, when they're shouting from the cheap seats, you know, they've got the political weight of a helium balloon, these people and we need to be sort of getting back to recognising, as macron said, it was just a press conference. >> we'll just stop you there because we'll come back to the state visit after the break. but i want to get your views on what he was saying there. >> i mean, simon, sorry to greg dewhurst there was he was spot on. i mean, at the end of the day, we got to look at previous to trump, there was about a third of the european union that are paying 2% or nato on, on gdp for, for defence. now it's two for, for defence. now it�*s two thirds that are paying. that�*s still a third. without we cannot be taking the risk that, you know, with where russia is going that they're not going to renege on the deal. 50 the points that he's making there without the us is how people need to perceive this now. >> all right. lee harris. >> all right. lee harris. >> i thought he was absolutely complete nonsense that was

coming out of simon�*s mouth. coming out of simon's mouth. don't forget, these people that we're listening to that are being lectured, lecturing us are the same people that have been perpetuating this war for the past three years and getting three years and getting absolutely nowhere, and they all hate trump. have we found a european leader bar1 or2 hate trump. have we found a european leader bar1 or 2 that has heaped praise on president trump or any keir starmer? they all hate him anyway. well, keir starmer. >> keir starmer doesn't hate trump. >> he praised him. >> he praised him. >> yeah he did. but remember what his frontbench have been saying. let's not go back. >> they�*re not relevant. >> they're not relevant. >> they're not relevant. >> so he's getting on really nicely with macron. they look really happy. and you know all the world leaders that he's meeting so far seem very happy. >> nana that's all i see. that's >> nana that�*s all i see. that's quite superficial and that is good, don�*t get me wrong. but listening to people like that who are set in their ways, who are who think the old guard have got all the answers, well, the old guard haven't got all the answers. they have led us into a situation where we have people, you know, almost i think it's almost a million people now have died in ukraine. i want nothing more than russia to be pushed out of ukraine. it was it was absolutely horrific what they did. but it's not working. people like you've just had on

that plan doesn't work. we need something new. and i quite like the idea about trump coming in and shaking things up. let the let him cook, let trump cook. and none of these guys, they�*re just too arrogant. i actually think that they�*re partly scared that trump's going to nail this and get this sorted. and their plan, the old world order is going to be made to look stupid. >> well, i mean, i hear you, but simon is actually. >> wound me up. sorry. >> wound me up. sorry. >> defence analyst and a former british army officer. what experience have you got? >> absolutely none. i use my eyes. >> yeah, well, eyes are good. >> yeah, well, eyes are good. >> and my gut? >> and my gut? >> common sense. yes. which has grown slightly. >> i knew that was coming. >> i knew that was coming. >> let me be honest. >> let me be honest. >> right up with us. >> right up with us. >> 21 minutes after 4:00 is fast approaching. i�*m nana akua. this approaching. i'm nana akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. next it's time for great british debate. this hour i'm asking, should donald trump's state visit to

>> right. welcome. 24 minutes after 4:00. if you just tuned in, where have you been with the middle point of the show? now next time get here at three because that's when we start and because that�*s when we start and nana akua. this is gb news where britain's news channel. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. lots of you have been getting in touch with your thoughts on the conversation about the oval office. david richardson says starmer reminded me of oliver twist in the oval office. food. more food please, sir. give me some more. that's that's that's what it says there. anita says whatever you think of trump, he has got the eu in a huddle trying to think what they should be doing next. well, there you go. lots of you still getting in touch. i'll read some more of those. of course. it's time for the first great british debate of this houn great british debate of this hour. i'm asking, should donald trump�*s state visit be to britain be cancelled? top conservatives are urging the prime minister, sir keir starmer, to revoke the invitation from the king. critics argue that the king should not be forced to host the

us president, especially after his tense exchange with volodymyr zelenskyy, and that this comes as top european leaders are meeting in london. they are meeting right now, actually, and we'll have more from that. christopher hope will be bringing us more and about 5:00 we�*ll get a full a bit of a press conference there that's around about that time. so stay with me. but for the great british debate this hour, i�*m asking, should donald trump's state visit to britain be cancelled? joining me, political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris wall. chris wall, what do you think? >> well, like i said before, i mean, i think starmer�*s just it mean, i think starmer's just it shouldn't be dismissed. i think shouldn�*t be dismissed. i think cummings is sort of highlighted some of the critics and, you know, some of the joke policies of wanting to stop it. but i think the person that really would want this to be stopped is nigel farage. he's going to be sort of pressed up against the window, like like a lost dog in the rain while, you know, starmer and trump sort of, you know, try and flesh out this, this ceasefire. >> you think nigel farage would want this stopped nigel farage. >> of jealousy. >> of jealousy. >> yeah. no. nigel farage has even been prepared to work in the best interests of the country if the labour government

needed him to broker a deal. >> well, he he's been flip flopping on, on this point. you know, he's been sitting there praising putin in the past and more recently. >> he was praising putin. that�*s >> he was praising putin. that's not quite right. >> is it? that's my observation. >> is it? that's my observation. >> no, no, that wasn't quite right. and he did. he did correct what was being interpreted. he never did that. >> he found him impressive. putin while he�*s butchering putin while he's butchering kids. >> hang on a minute. that's not praising someone that is saying the obvious that that's the obvious that that�*s a leader. putin is an impressive leader. putin is an impressive leader. he has his people behind him. whether you agree with the decisions putin is making is another another. >> question. >> question. >> not the same thing. >> not the same thing. >> well. >> well. >> not the same thing. >> not the same thing. >> but at the end of the. >> but at the end of the. >> day. >> day. >> you don�*t stop a fight in >> you don't stop a fight in a pub by not talking to the biggest bloke in the room. so those people that want to stop. >> well, that's what donald trump has done. >> well, this is what i'm saying. i think starmer's doing the right thing. i mean, any nofion the right thing. i mean, any notion of him not coming over is complete poppycock. we've had the snp, you know, from the cheap seats coming out, you know what? you know, not realising that there�*s a strategic awakening going on as described by macron. >> wasn't it? the snp's foreign affairs spokesperson called trump�*s behaviour towards zelenskyy grotesque and said it amounted to bullying. >> yeah, and i thinkjohn

swinney has also come out. the first minister. you know, we've had the sort of useless conservative party. i mean, it�*d be great if they didn't keep being so useless. they might be in a position to fight for labour. but at the end of the day, we're seeing here some sort day, we�*re seeing here some sort of 4d chess going on. starmer is playing it, you know, while there's all these other lot are playing a bit of snap trying to stop this. do you think. >> starmer�*s one of the. are they the pawns or prawns. what are they. the prawns. starmer that can only do one step and they get taken. and if they get to the end they can become king. >> starmer has just. >> starmer has just. >> rolled this. >> rolled this. >> all just rolling into start. i mean, anybody can do what starmer is doing right now. i�*ll give him credit inasmuch as he is playing it how he should play it. but it's not as if he's doing anything clever right now. but should this, should this state visit? do you know what this reminds me of is? it reminds me of how excruciating it was watching david lammy and keir starmer and wes streeting and all the labour grandees protesting in the street cancel the visit. their children, student politics. and we�*ve got student politics. and we've got actually quite surprising people like dan hodges, even andrew

neil turning around and saying that we should question the state visit. i mean, how utterly ridiculous. i'm in agreement with you, chris. it�*s ludicrous with you, chris. it's ludicrous to even consider that we shouldn't have trump over for shouldn�*t have trump over for a state visit. it plays to things that he likes. we're making sure that he likes. we�*re making sure that he likes. we�*re making sure that we get the best out of trump as a nation. when we do things like that, that�*s where we're at our best as a nation. it makes me feel proud to be british when we have days like that. so no, i think all these idiots who are calling for this state visit to be cancelled, they're being childish. grow up. >> well, can we get a high chair forjd vance to >> well, can we get a high chair for jd vance to sit the toddler in the corner so he he stays away from any real debate, you know, because he can't be trusted. didn't he? well, i don't know. >> well, listen, listen, stay with us, because we are now going to outside the european summit leaders where they are right now. let's speak to our gb news political editor, christopher hope. christopher, can you tell us more? what can you tell us? >> well, the meeting is breaking

up >> well, the meeting is breaking up very shortly. behind me, all the cars are gathering. you're seeing them moving off behind me. we will see some leaders emerge from the building, and we'll see a press conference with our prime minister at 5:00. we're not expecting a huge amount of news in the press conference. the individual leaders will go away and talk to their respective broadcasters. what the uk wants to see is them all being quicker to step up and spend more money quickly on defence. and that's where the pressure i think is going to come from, because as things stand, the uk has stepped up, other countries have, but not we haven't yet seen germany, for example, and other countries do their bit. and that's where we're going next. and this idea of a coalition of the willing, that's what sir keir starmer has been pushing all day. how that's nana will that be a european union force? i doubt it, nato russia won't accept it. it might be a new name altogether, some kind of european defence force we haven't yet even thought of. with that under that badge, we'll see french, uk and other troops deployed trying to keep the peace. and the big question, though, is what will the us do?

the security backdrop is not yet not yet sorted out. we won't hear more on that today. what that means in english, though, is the use of american fighters, american radar to ensure that russia is kept on the back foot andisnt russia is kept on the back foot and isn't seen as being as taking any more incursions into ukraine than than the peace line, if that�*s agreed. so ukraine than than the peace line, if that�*s agreed. 50 lots line, if that�*s agreed. so lots of questions here. it's been very interesting day and i've never known something quite like it. there's some coldstream it. there�*s some coldstream guards welcoming the leaders earlier. helicopters overhead silence. very oppressive silence as they walked in. grim face pictures on the family photograph and world leaders that these are individuals, leaders who are used to peace, but they�*re trying to prepare for possible or certainly maybe not quite war, but conflict, or getting ready for conflict with russia. if it goes that far, no one wants that. that won�*t one wants that. that won't happen, i doubt. but even so, that feeling of we can't be sure of the peace we've had since the end of the second world war is, i think, sobering, if nothing else. >> right. well, christopher hope, thank you very much. he�*s outside the european leaders

summit in central london, just gone 31 minutes after 4:00. some breaking news. more than 500 small boat migrants arrived crossing the channel in the biggest single day of arrivals this year. so more than 500. we will bring you more on that. stay with us. it�*s a huge number of people arriving and we'll get you across all of that detail if you across all of that detail if you just tuned in. welcome. i�*m nana akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio, coming up around about 5:00. we�*ll bring you the about 5:00. we'll bring you the updates on that big summit, the press conference with keir starmer, and find out more about what was discussed today by all the european leaders. next though, time for the great british debate. i'm asking who should sir keir starmer side with the us, europe or neither? first, let's get your latest first, let�*s get your latest news headlines with aaron armstrong. >> conservative leader. >> conservative leader. >> very good afternoon. let�*s get you up to date with the top

stories. sir keir starmer has urged world leaders to step up at a once in a generation moment for security in europe. the prime minister is hosting a defence summit in london in an effort to provide security guarantees for ukraine and to try to establish lasting peace. a european leaders plus canada's justin trudeau, the turkish foreign minister, along with the head of nato, are in attendance. the prime minister says the uk will work together with france and ukraine on a peace plan, which he will then present to the united states. well, ukraine's president volodymyr ukraine�*s president volodymyr zelenskyy is there. it�*s just zelenskyy is there. it's just a couple of days since that explosive oval office exchange with donald trump. the prime minister has since said that made him feel uncomfortable as zelenskyy in the uk at the moment. he will meet king charles a little bit later today following that summit. now, hundreds of protesters have been holding a rally in support of ukraine. this is outside downing street. people carried placards that said war is not over in

ukraine. world wake up and russia captivity kills and we'll be getting more details of how that meeting has gone very shortly, because sir keir starmer will hold a news conference at around 5 pm. we'll bring you the top lines here on gb news. more train fares are going up, as is the pressure on commuters already battling record cancellations. from today, the cost of many journeys in england and wales will rise by 4.6%. campaigners say it will pile further misery on hard pressed households and rail cars will become more expensive too. it's the first time that's happened in more than a decade, the transport secretary, heidi alexander, says she understands passengers frustration but insists the government�*s cap has kept the increase below average earnings growth. and israel has blocked humanitarian aid into gaza after the first phase of the ceasefire with hamas has expired. now it follows hamas rejecting a us proposal to extend the truce by

six weeks in return for the release of hostages. israel, trying to essentially pressure hamas into accepting a change in the agreement to allow for the release of hostages without an israeli troop withdrawal. that is a key part of phase two. mediators are discussing that at talks are taking place in cairo on that second phase of the deal, although those talks have really barely got off the ground. more for me a little bit later, just after 5:00. and i'll hand you back to dana in just moment. >> for the very latest gb news, direct your smartphone. sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code, or go to gbnews.com/advent.

to >> good afternoon. 37 minutes after 4:00. in about 25 minutes, we will get the live press

conference from sir keir starmer after the big meeting with european leaders this afternoon. if this is to be news, i�*m nana if this is to be news, i'm nana akua. we are britain�*s news channel, remember. you can also stream us live on youtube. well, it's time for the great british debate this hour. i'm asking, who should sir keir starmer side with the us, europe or neither? sir keir starmer says the uk and france will work with kyiv to stop fighting in ukraine, and will discuss the plan with the us going forward. of course, stop the fighting. this comes days after the ukrainian president, volodymyr zelenskyy, and the us president, donald trump, had a fiery exchange in the oval office. european leaders are gathering in london currently. right now they are talking about the war and security. but who should keir starmer cosy up to? is he doing the right thing? he�*s offered zelenskyy a meeting with the king, but it's not a state visit. donald trump is getting a state visit. is he doing the right thing? zelenskyy is meeting the king first. although trump was offered the state visit before that. remember

zelenskyy got upset because trump went to see putin before him. will trump be upset? oh, it feels like a version of eastenders or something, doesn�*t eastenders or something, doesn't it? so the great british debate this out. i'm asking who should take a starmer�*s side with the us, europe or neither? joining me now, political commentator lee harris and labour activist chris worrall. lee harris both. >> if i put my grown up hat on, he shouldn't. i think that, you know, the one thing i did agree with keir starmer when he said that he didn't want to, you know, create a divide between europe and the us. and i get that completely now. in reality, the us are the kingmakers. kingmakers, you know, they are pivotal. so without the us this pivotal. 50 without the us this isn't going to work so if i isn�*t going to work. so if i put my big boy hat on, he shouldn't favour one over the other. he should be diplomatic. and you know, one could argue that's exactly what trump is trying to do between zelenskyy and putin. you know, so you could ask, who should who should trump side

with, you know, zelenskyy or pufin? with, you know, zelenskyy or putin? and of course, you know, he should be on the side of the country who's been invaded. of country who�*s been invaded. of course he should. absolutely. everybody should be. but what he wants to do is bring both people to the table. and if you're going to carry on calling putin names, however correct they are, you're not going to get the guy to the table. 50 in the same way that you�*re asking me about who that you're asking me about who who's keir starmer should should who�*s keir starmer should should side with, i think he should take the same approach that trump's doing. and that is to, trump�*s doing. and that is to, to get both to keep both sides to get both to keep both sides to the table. but of course, without the us, they are pivotal in all of this. so he really does have to keep trump on side. >> well, well look, this is what donald trump said in his exchange in that meeting in the oval office with zelenskyy. he said if i didn�*t align myself with both of them, we wouldn't have a deal. you want me to say terrible things about putin and then call and ask him, hey, how are you? how are we on the deal? it doesn't work that way. i'm aligned with the united states

for the good of the world. you want me to be a tough guy?! want me to be a tough guy? i can be tougher than any human being you have ever seen. chris worrell. who should starmer cosy up worrell. who should starmer cosy up to? >> well, look, i mean, you know, donald tusk made some statements today. there�*s 500 million today. there's 500 million europeans, 300 million americans, 140 million russians. and he said, if you can't, if you can count, you should count yourself. but when you sort of look fonnard beyond that, look forward beyond that, i think i think donald trump. >> so what�*s the point? >> so what's the point? >> so what's the point? >> so what's the point? >> so what�*s the point i'm >> so what's the point i'm making? well, he taking that forward, if you look at how much russia with purchase parity taken into account. 50 how much they can buy is spending on their defence. it's equivalent their defence. it�*s equivalent to about $460 billion europe currently. and that�*s where they're paying 40% of their gdp on military. right. the europe including the uk, europe plus uk is spending about 457 billion, while on average spending about 2% of gdp, the americans 915 billion, about 3.4. if the uk

and europe spent 5% of its gdp on military defence spending, we'd be at a trillion, right? if america. >> we�*d also be broke. >> we'd also be broke. >> we'd also be broke. >> we'd also be broke. >> we would not be broke. i mean, look, at the end of the day, poland are spending up to 5% and you can create industrial strategies around it. >> all right. well, listen, what do you think? joining us now, though, gb news political editor christopher hope, who is outside the european leaders summit. christopher. >> that's right. von der leyen has just left the summit here, and she's given a short statement to journalists. right now, president zelenskyy has left in a long convoy of around 6 or 7 cars heading to see the king in sandringham. you�*re seeing arrivals there about two hours ago, and she's the european commission president, and they are breaking up now. each individual leader is coming out here. there's a microphone set up. some are giving statements, some aren't. i think the all eyes now are on what happens to these leaders. will they go away and talk to their

their governments and announce increases in spending? we want the government is very keen to see germany increase its spending levels on defence. will other countries also step up because the uk and france and poland and other big spenders on defence can�*t carry the can? this is a pan—european effort here to show russia, the continent of europe, is willing to defend itself and is recognising it can't rely on america to defend us anymore post war. >> but chris, even if they agree to spend 5% or whatever the deal becomes, it takes them an incredibly long time for any of that to filter through to actual spending, doesn't it? >> it does, but you may as well start now. i mean, there�*s four start now. i mean, there's four more years of donald trump, and he is making clear that although he is making clear that although he agrees with article five, so if a nato country is attacked, all other nato countries should go to the to defend them. the question is will that how will that be an issue in the next four years? we're seeing with

with president zelenskyy on friday, there was a collective nervousness, a collective sucking of teeth amongst these leaders that you're seeing on screen now, meeting earlier with sir keir starmer. in fact, there's a premier trudeau from canada meeting with keir starmer. he flew over especially it is a major meeting here in london as the as the world recalibrates how much they can rely on america for support. and it's now more on these, these economies, many of whom cannot afford to increase spending. there's as zelenskyy arriving earlier being greeted by sir keir starmer. as i say, he�*s now keir starmer. as i say, he's now on the way to sandringham to meet with the king. i fully expect the photographs of the king with zelenskyy to be on the front pages tomorrow morning, as almost a reminder to donald trump that he is increasingly isolated with that hostile stance he took on friday against the ukraine leader. >> i�*m wondering, though, in in >> i'm wondering, though, in in their talks, do we know if they were talking about peace as well and, and actual sort of ceasefire stopping of the aggression to russia rather than

just how much money they can raise in terms of their gdp to, you know, stock up their arms. >> yeah. i mean, everyone wants peace. and that�*s where trump comes from. he wants the killing to stop, he said. in terms in the press conference i was at in in. washington dc, he said two, two, 1000, 2000 young men are dying each week on both sides. and he, i think, is driven by the fact he wants to get the killing to stop. he says he's neutral, i think in an attempt to show putin he's a fair dealer to show putin he�*s a fair dealer for a peace deal. of course, people in europe are zelenskyy this country, and others don't think that you can get a fair deal with putin given away. he invaded crimea and then kept going for ukraine back in in february 2022. so the question is who is right on this? and that's why i think it's so important that that you will see europe standing together to pressure back on donald trump. i mean, may, may well recognise, of course, that that there was some heated words said in anger

in the oval office. and, you know, he may recognise that, that if zelenskyy can somehow apologise for disrespecting the oval office to use language made byjd oval office to use language made by jd vance, his vice president and donald trump, there could be and donald trump, there could be a way back in. but i think this today has been a day of this, of this continent of europe, the leaders of this, of this continent accusing the uk come to terms with a more sober future when more money must be spent on defence, less money on things which are frankly, you things which are, frankly, you know, you don't have to spend money on aid, but you like to. the spending on things you like to is stopping is what you need to is stopping is what you need to now, which counts. >> all right, christopher hope, thank you very much. we'll obviously catch up with you and maybe a little bit later on. thank you very much. that is christopher hope. he�*s @gbnews christopher hope. he's @gbnews political editor. he�*s outside the european leaders summit. well, let's go back to my panel, chris wall and also lee harris. so there you have it. they've been meeting, they're discussing increasing their gdp or spend on on weapons and arms. my concern

on weapons and arms. my concern on this is that they are just talking about spending more money, which always takes the european leaders a long time. nato and any big organisations like this, a long time to actually action this. in the meantime, people are being killed. as trump pointed out. i�*m concerned they�*re not really i�*m concerned they're not really talking about how they're going to tackle vladimir putin right now. how. >> now. >> well, look, no, no, i mean, i kind of object to this sort of woke right, conscientious objector where we're like, we can't spend more on defence. >> no, nobody's saying they shouldn't. but but i'm. >> wondering need more weapons to. >> do we need. no. well, that�*s >> do we need. no. well, that's perpetuating the war. i wanted to know what they're going to do to know what they�*re going to do in terms of speaking to putin and actually having diplomacy, rather than just stocking up, stockpiling weapons. >> he doesn't do diplomacy. and >> he doesn�*t do diplomacy. and this was zelenskyy was trying to get across in front of president trump and jd vance maybe not in the right forum publicly to do that. i think unless europe, europe gets up to 800 billion or 1 trillion. you�*ve got to look 1 trillion. you've got to look at how when you put russia's army and spent defence spending, 460 billion and china 450 billion together, right. it's

nearly as big as america. europe at the minute has been you know, we basically to cash in on this bet that this american peace premium was going to pay off because it doesn�*t look like it because it doesn't look like it will. and the only reason we got to thank trump for waking us all “p to thank trump for waking us all up to the fact that these guys are going hard and fast, china and russia are lagging behind, but they've put their whole but they�*ve put their whole economy into their military industrial complex. and unless we get a peace deal, which i'm glad keir starmer is developing a, you know, a ceasefire plan, just so us isn't dictating all the terms of trump. this is why this is happening so quickly that we can, you know, instead of we have a seat at the table rather than just shouting through the letterbox like kemi badenoch and nigel farage would be doing on twitter. >> this has come at a very convenient time, i�*d say, for convenient time, i'd say, for keir starmer, seeing as the farmers aren't happy, they've upset the pensioners and all the other things that are going on in this country. so it's hey, look over there, which obviously we need to, but are you concerned that this all of this, whilst it is very important, is

that the expense of actual domestic policy? we�*ve just had a report there, breaking news that 500 people have just crossed the british channel. and keir starmer talked about smashing the gangs and i�*m not seeing any gang smashing happening. >> no. and you're right to say >> no. and you�*re right to say this is very convenient for keir starmer because his polling is appalling. his domestic policy is falling apart. it's nothing's working. we�*ve just i�*ve just working. we've just i've just heard literally in the last i think on the way up that rachel reeves is having to do something very, very drastic to stop her disaster budget actually crashing the economy properly this time. but what you were saying about, i mean, what gets me just jumping back to this situation with what the strategy is with the ukraine russia conflict, what really gets me is what we�*re doing isn't working. what we're doing isn't working. now, i hear what you say, chris, about when you said that, you know, putin doesn't do diplomacy. well, then do something about it. then why didn't we go in with nato? and i know the answer to this. i�*m just sort of saying the why

didn't we go in with nato and pushing back immediately within the first week of him crossing that border? the reason why we didn't is because everyone was scared of world war iii. everyone was scared of what would happen if you remember those conversations. >> we were all scared. everyone was scared. >> of nuclear war. well, if we're not going to do it, then what? >> we're just. we're just valid >> we're just. we�*re just valid thing to be scared of. >> oh, absolutely. but. but if we're not going to do that, then. okay, i'll give him. i�*ll give the benefit of the doubt. and this is why my view has changed, right? so i was like, okay, yeah, we need to give you we need to beef ukraine's arms up, and we need to make sure that they can push russia back. but we�*re still here three years later and billions of, you know, billions has gone into it and we've got almost a million people dead now. something needs to change. something needs to stop. and that's why i�*m so that's why i get so frustrated with this when i hear all these people saying, oh, you know, we need to keep rearming ukraine. we need to keep doing this. it's not working. if it was going to work, it would have worked

already. what are you going to do? just okay, we're going to fund them for another, what, 3 to 4 years and we're just going to 4 years and we're just going to have a forever war and it's just going to carry on and on. >> all right. let's quickly go >> all right. let�*s quickly go back to christopher hope. he's still outside the european leaders summit. christopher, any more updates? >> costa leaving. he's the president of the european councfl president of the european council of leaders. now that's a kind of a loose grouping of the leaders of the eu that he has said just now. there will be a meeting on thursday when they�*ll be discussing further. it looks like the european union now getting behind some form of defence force. let's see where that takes us. giorgia meloni has just left. she, of course, was earlier with sir keir starmer in number 10 downing street. she is someone who is soon to be personally close to donald trump. there we see her walking up now being greeted by sir keir starmer, the prime minister. earlier when i was in downing street, now she was out there in mar—a—lago up before there in mar—a—lago up before the inauguration. she's someone who can be a almost a trump whisperer on behalf of the european union. she's almost she's the closest leader,

she�*s the closest leader, i would say, amongst those with a personal friendship with donald trump, which i think even starmer lacks. so i think she could be have a key role. we ask her for a question just now, but she left and got into a car and drove away. we may be hearing more from her from italian media later, so i think we�*ll be watching continental press press tonight, because lots of these leaders will go back to their own audiences domestically and try and convince them of the need to increase defence spending. things are changing very rapidly, i think, on the continent of europe. >> now we know that zelenskyy is being whisked off to talk to the king. what is what are we hoping to achieve with that particular meeting? >> well. >> well. >> i�*m afraid to say that the >> i'm afraid to say that the king doesn't have any special advisers to tell him what�*s advisers to tell him what's going on in his meetings. they are very much meetings between the head of state or head of state and ukraine's head of state. in this instance, we are we're not. we are not being briefed on the politics of it. i do think, though, it is quite a political move of the king to put his arm so publicly around

zelenskyy and asking him to come to sandringham. that is a message to donald trump, who respects the king, was so pleased to receive that personal invitation to this year to, to balmoral, to scotland and then next year, probably for a state visit. it will resonate, i think, for donald trump to see an arm around zelenskyy, given the way he feels he was disrespected in the oval office as recently as friday, and he's seeing there the letter being handed over by sir keir starmer to donald trump. he opened it. i was literally two metres from him in front of him as he opened it, and the surprise and the delight on the us president's face was there to see. so pleased to have this invitation for a second state visit. and there are calls today, of course, for that state visit to be postponed. what happened to zelenskyy? i think i heard some of your panellists earlier, and it's probably right to say that that that would be an affront to all of america, not just donald trump. he is a he is a representative, elected leader of america. and that's why to of america. and that�*s why to cancel any state visit now would be to show disrespect to the entire country of america. and that's not what we want to do.

and that's why it will go ahead. and that's why it will go ahead. and donald trump will be here probably next year. >> do you think, as we just heard, that 500 migrants have nowjust heard, that 500 migrants have now just recently crossed the channel? in some ways, although this is very important that the focus has been shifted quite conveniently for keir starmer from domestic policy. >> well, you could say that, i don't think. i think i�*d be unfair to the pm. i don't think. i think i�*d be unfairto the pm. i think don't think. i think i�*d be unfair to the pm. i think that he's dealing with a crisis here and a need to step in where america is backing away from supporting ukraine. we have spent three years standing with ukraine as a country. many of us, and many people we know have taken in ukrainians fleeing that country. people have been flying the ukrainian flag voluntarily. there's a feeling around this country getting behind ukraine. yes. small boats crossings are now at 2000, i think, this calendar year. there are a lot, but they keep ticking up. i don't think you could say that. number 10 are trying to use this event behind me. this event at the lancaster house in central london, as a way to avoid coverage of the small boats

crisis. >> okay. all right. christopher. well, we'll keep talking. we'll keep finding out more. the press conference is coming up around about 5:00. so we will get back to you with regard to that. but that's christopher hope. he�*s there outside the european leaders summit. so in a matter of moments time, i will be heafing of moments time, i will be hearing the press conference. it will be quite interesting. i just can't help listening to this and thinking, i would like to hear them talking about how they're going to achieve peace. and i feel i'm hearing a lot about spending defence, spending more fighting. whereas for me, the words from donald trump. peace. peace. peace is what he's after. these guys are talking about peace. but this seems to be the only achievement will be in terms of weapons. i'm not so sure that�*s. >> i completely agree with that. what's the exit strategy? that's what they should be discussing. and that's what trump is trying to do. and that�*s why i'm not saying he might be wrong. right. no one knows. but something needs to change. and trump is trying something new now. i think he should be given the space to do that. he is the elected representative of the united states of america, the elected representative of the united states of america, the most powerful country in the world. he is the leader of the most powerful country in the world. he is the leader of the

free world, and he's trying free world, and he's trying something new. and i think the something new. and i think the reason that he was so offended reason that he was so offended by what zelenskyy did at that by what zelenskyy did at that press conference is, is when, press conference is, is when, when france was talking about when france was talking about diplomacy, zelenskyy put a diplomacy, zelenskyy put a dagger straight through that dagger straight through that entire concept, his entire plan entire concept, his entire plan to say, right, we're going to to say, right, we're going to try this. and zelenskyy was try this. and zelenskyy was saying, well, you know, he was saying, well, you know, he was right. i�*m not saying zelenskyy right. i�*m not saying zelenskyy is wrong, but what he's saying is wrong, but what he's saying is wrong, but what he�*s saying is wrong, but what he�*s saying is he's almost burning trump's is wrong, but what he�*s saying is wrong, but what he�*s saying is he's almost burning trump's plan before he's even had a plan before he's even had a chance to try it. and i think chance to try it. and i think that's why i, i personally found that's why i, i personally found it very frustrating. and i can it very frustrating. and i can see why trump found it see why trump found it frustrating because if he's going to try this, he needs to frustrating because if he's going to try this, he needs to get them both around the table. get them both around the table. and what's the exit strategy? and what's the exit strategy? what are these? you know, what's what are these? you know, what's the what are europe going to do? the what are europe going to do? what are we going to do? and all what are we going to do? and all all the europeans want to talk all the europeans want to talk about is, like you said, more about is, like you said, more money, more war. they don't want money, more war. they don't want to talk about an exit strategy. to talk about an exit strategy. now, the only thing that i will now, the only thing that i will give the europeans and us as, as give the europeans and us as, as a good strategy, is to put a good strategy, is to put

ukraine in the strongest

give the europeans and us as, as a goand lrategy, is to put give the europeans and us as, as a goand getting is to put give the europeans and us as, as a goand getting us 0 put give the europeans and us as, as a goand getting us interests. that and getting us interests. and this is what should have been signed the other day, which wasn�*t. and this is where keir wasn't. and this is where keir starmer is, you know, doing as much as he can now, immediately to not only provide those comforts to the us, that we will up comforts to the us, that we will up our defence spending and not only providing confidence to ukraine, that we will get a minerals deal agreed. >> which will give them security guarantees as well. >> and meanwhile, you know, donald trump has to make sure that he's showing to putin that that he�*s showing to putin that he's not on zelenskyy's side. but there is a bridge across this, and i think keir starmer will be able to hopefully deliver that and it will come, deliver that. and it will come, unfortunately, at the result of more defence spending, because it's necessary. >> surprisingly, i agree with. >> surprisingly, i agree with. >> you too. i can't have you on again. i'm not having this because. >> we�*re not talking domestic >> we're not talking domestic politics. >> yeah, well, i suppose that does make a bit of a difference, doesn't it? but again, though, i want to hear more talk about peace.| want to hear more talk about peace. i guess they do need better to be better armed. that should go without saying. >> more lethal. >> more lethal. >> shouldn't be. it shouldn't be >> shouldn't be. it shouldn�*t be that something like this will make them think about that. we need to be protected, however. but the bottom line is it's going to take many, many years

for all those things to come to fruition. and i again feel like they are slightly pushing and passing the buck a little bit and saying we will in a couple of years time, be ready to fight putin. but as trump pointed out, thousands of men are dying every week. now, if you are just joining us, welcome to the show. very shortly, we are expecting to hear from the prime minister following a meeting with the european leaders over the conflict in ukraine. and ahead of this, i can speak with my panel. they'll be with me now. political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris warrell. so stay tuned with us. we are discussing all things right now and it is really quite a big day here, especially in particular for keir starmer, because all of these european leaders we�*ve had zelenskyy leaders we've had zelenskyy macron from france, chancellor olaf scholz from germany, denmark, the prime minister, mette frederiksen, giorgia meloni from italy, the netherlands prime minister dick schoof. we've had leaders from

schoof. we�*ve had leaders from norway, poland, spain, canada, finland, sweden, the chechnya and romania. the turkish foreign minister and nato secretary—general and also the president of the european commission and european council are all attending this meeting. they attended this meeting and that meeting is now stopped and they are currently very shortly there will be a press conference. joining me now, telegraph columnist and former british army officer robert clarke. robert, thank you very much for joining me. robert, what do you make of this then? is this a really great show from keir starmer? and is this a very positive sign? >> yeah. no i think good afternoon. i think it is a positive show. actually from. >> sir keir starmer. look, i've been one. >> of his. >> of his. >> strongest critics over the last eight months, not least for his some of his foreign policy decisions, like the chagos islands. >> and domestic. >> and domestic. >> issues as well. but i think on this, on ukraine and more broadly, going forwards, the relationship with president trump and trying to bridge the gap with europe. i think he's

actually done quite well. it's actually done quite well. it�*s only. >> 24 hours. >> 24 hours. >> 36 hours into this, so i'm sure we'll know a lot more in the coming days and weeks ahead. but i'd say the early signs are actually really, really positive. and the optics are actually really, really good. >> do you think i mean, some people would say that he�*s just people would say that he's just sat there and it's all kind of landed on his lap, and he's just landed on his lap, and he�*s just done his neutral sitting on the fence thing, which on this occasion works a treat, because if you had somebody else like mayor boris or someone else, they would have expressed a point of view that may have got put, got them in a bit of trouble or in a bit of an icky situation. whereas he sat on the fence, which is very, very useful at this point in time. >> oh for sure. that's one of keir starmer's, you know, one of his main criticisms of him. but in terms of how he's handled the relationship with president trump, even before president trump, even before president trump was elected, he was quite careful, despite sending the labour activists last year to campaign against him, he was quite careful to cultivate a relationship with trump before he was even elected, and i think that's maintained. i�*m surprised, as anybody else, that that relationship appears to be

quite genuine. but look, it's incredibly positive and it�*s incredibly positive and it's something we absolutely need going forwards in light of this american repivot, if you like, away from europe into the indo—pacific, we�*ve known that indo—pacific, we've known that this is going to be coming for at least a year now. it's merely an extension of biden's foreign policy. just trump is hastening it slightly. so like i say, i think he's actually handling it quite well. i�*m the first to quite well. i'm the first to criticise keir starmer on many issues, but i think on this it issues, but i think on this it is broadly very positive where the detail matters, though, and i caution this is on the defence spending uplift. and i think when details on that become more clear, it's actually going to clear, it�*s actually going to appear very hollow. and that�*s appear very hollow. and that's something the americans are going to be incredibly careful. probing and analysing is, you know, this 2 to 2.5% uplift to defence, whether it's actually meaningful. personally i don't think it is. i think there's many holes in it. and that's something that could come unstuck in the relationship going forward. >> i�*ll be interested to hear >> i'll be interested to hear whether they are actually talking about peace, or whether they just really talked about

arming themselves to the teeth so that if vladimir putin comes for them, they are ready to fight. we will find out about thatin fight. we will find out about that in a few moments time in about around about quarter past. i wanted to get your take on the meeting, zelenskyy's meeting meeting, zelenskyy�*s meeting with donald trump and where you sit with what you saw. >> i mean, i think i think it >> i mean, ithink i think it was deeply uncomfortable for everyone who was watching, myself included. i think personally, president zelenskyy, not so much personally, but i think his team should shoulder some of the responsibility for how unprepared president zelenskyy was going into the meeting. he was clearly under briefed and he didn't have an interpreter with him. english is his second language, so there's going to be difficulties in that. however, it was clear for all to see that he did regrettably push donald trump president trump's button slightly. and i think the vice president really seized on that for domestic political audience. but i don't think it's i think it's i think it�*s salvageable. and i think, again, keir starmer

is going to be crucial in that going forward. he�*s trying to going forward. he's trying to salvage the relationship between ukraine and the us and however the peace or some form of peace comes to bear. you know, america are going to be absolutely critical to that. i think one of the key things going forward for keir starmer is to try and get some form of american assurance or security guarantee regarding ukraine, in what form that looks like. we don�*t know yet, but like. we don't know yet, but that�*s that's something that the that's that's something that the british are going to have their work cut out on, especially after friday's meeting. >> how do you think that the king can help in all of this? because people talk about him exerting his soft power. what do you think is the benefit that he can bring to the table for this? >> no. great question. i think his majesty is going to be absolutely pivotal. pivotal. and also prince, the prince of wales as well. we can see that obviously president trump enjoys enormously the pomp and ceremony of coming to britain and the state visit he enjoyed before in his first term. some people are

calling for that to be his second state visit to be rescinded. now, i think that's an absolutely awful decision. if it were to be made, it clearly, hopefully at this stage won�*t be made and he will still come. and i think the relationship that donald trump will enjoy with his majesty and the royal family is only a benefit. we talk about soft power all the time and soft power all the time, and personally, i don't think holds much sway in this day and age of hard military realpolitik. but here, with his majesty and the royal family, we can really see it actually being incredibly useful to britain. >> well, right now it's pretty much all keir starmer has got because his front bench have been extremely offensive against donald trump, and donald trump appears to have forgiven them for some of the words that they used, which hopefully they'll take that and see that as a lesson as to how not to do things and not to do that again. so we've got we will hear the press conference and find out what the european leaders have come up with. what do you think should be the best solution from their press conference, just from your point of view, what would you like to hear coming

out of there? >> well, i think we've already heard it. really. i think we've heard it. really. i think we've heard this renewed effort for some form of european defence and security solidarity. and that doesn�*t necessarily, and that doesn't necessarily, and hopefully won't mean closer ties with the european union, but it means closer practical relationships on defence and security, for instance, on transportation and logistics. from a military perspective, that's only a benefit to britain. and i think broadly, we can already see that happening. and i think there will be a push now behind closed doors, more than not with regards to trying to bring washington back into the fold, to provide that ultimate, that that ultimate security guarantee for, for a peacekeeping force in ukraine. we can't do that. we are incredibly hollowed out militarily. we have incredibly poor gaps in our defence and an increasing black hole in our budget, which this 2.5%, frankly, it's for the birds. so i think they'll be, like i say, i think they�*ll be, like i say, a renewed diplomatic effort now going forwards that really keir starmer is going to be leading on with europe to try and bring

president trump and washington back into the fold, you know, in a sort of medium term capacity. >> some people might say that actually what this is going what is going to ultimately happen is some form of eu army. because if they want to become a collective force without the united states, which obviously the us are part of nato and they create their own eu army, that this is another sort of slight push against brexit. >> no. sure, i can understand that argument. and personally, i�*ve publicly called out this the idea of a european army or a european union army for some time. it's incredibly time. it�*s incredibly impractical and it splits efforts with nato. however, what we can see is, like i say, the benefit of working with european partners more closely on tangible military goals. and but also, to be perfectly honest, there's not much appetite in european capitals. paris to really increase the uplift and the shared capabilities across the shared capabilities across the european union. poland as

well is a good example. poland is fast emerging as the heir apparent of a european land power, and they've got very little interest to work more, you know, to work closely with, with the european union in defence and security. so that really rules europe's 2 or3 biggest military powers out of any real sort of incentive to work within an eu framework. and it is a worry, if i�*m being it is a worry, if i'm being honest with labour and keir starmer. they�*re well known to obviously favour ties with the european union. but i think now with defence and security, it's far too fractured politically and domestically to really warrant, you know, any really any real closer worries on that guard. >> do you trust that even if there is some sort of eu or a kind of collective, whether it's an eu army or some sort of collective of european army armed forces that doesn't involve nato, that they will actually act together because vladimir putin has tested nato's resolve to see whether if there's an attack on one, there'll be an attack on on all.

and i�*m not sure that if and i'm not sure that if something happened that all those alliances would then work in each other's interests to stop aggression, they may well look at this and think, well, hang on, i don�*t wanna get involved in that. >> oh, sure. i mean, that's the worry that i share as well as forget, britain and france are a nucleethat wer. we forget, britain and france are a nucleethat i er. we forget, britain and france are a nucleethat i share! forget, britain and france are a you. this is why it's important nucleethat i share as well as worry that i share as well as you. this is why it's important to really try and get washington to really try and get washington back into the fold on the back into the fold on the back into the fold. on the ultimate backstop, some form of back into the fold. on the ultimate backstop, some form of security guarantee should things security guarantee should things go wrong. but look, there's go wrong. but look, there's enough of these, you know, like enough of these, you know, like a coalition of the willing with a coalition of the willing with britain, with france, the nordic britain, with france, the nordic countries, the baltics and countries, the baltics and hopefully poland, who i think hopefully poland, who i think quite early on in these talks quite early on in these talks ruled themselves out of sending ruled themselves out of sending forces to, to ukraine. but forces to, to ukraine. but there's other ways they can there's other ways they can contribute. for instance, they contribute. for instance, they can free up the land forces can free up the land forces across the baltics in existing across the baltics in existing nato commitments, the enhanced nato commitments, the enhanced forward presence. we run that in forward presence. we run that in estonia, for instance. so estonia, for instance. so there's ways that poland can there's ways that poland can still help, and there is enough still help, and there is enough of an incentive for these of an incentive for these countries to really have one�*s countries to really have one�*s countries to really have one's back and provide the security countries to really have one's back and provide the security guarantees to one another. don't guarantees to one another. don't forget, britain and france are a forget, britain and france are a

nuclear power. we nuclear power. we have extended our nuclear umbrella, so to speak, to all of european nato countries. france hasn't. and i think that�*s a powerful think that's a powerful reminder. you know, around a quarter of our defence budget goes towards our nuclear deterrent. this is a huge card that, you know, we quite rightly don't play too much. but i think in this

don't play too much. but i think in tare heading towards an we are heading towards an eu sort of army. it's almost getting out of brexit via the back door. i agree that there should be some sort of collaboration when it comes to the armed forces, but if we lose america and we create our own thing because obviously not at these talks at the moment, then we are going toward something european union. and i think the that a lot of people in this uk one has atoward ser european union. and i think the uk one has atoward something we are going toward something that a lot of people in this country backed against. country backed against. >> i can�*t see an eu army ever, >> i can�*t see an eu army ever, ever happening. i mean, it comes ever happening. i mean, it comes down to sovereignty, sovereignty down to sovereignty, sovereignty and national control. but beyond and national control. but beyond that, it makes nato redundant. that, it makes nato redundant. and that's the problem. and that's the problem. >> not really because america >> not really because america are in nato. but if americans if are in nato. but if americans if you're struggling with the you're struggling with the negotiations and you can't get negotiations and you can't get them in it, then you have no them in it, then you have no choice. >> but having a european army, choice. >> but having a european army, sort of it would be reflecting sort of it would be reflecting what nato's set out to do as an what nato's set out to do as an what nato�*s set out to do as an individual nation state. i mean, what nato�*s set out to do as an individual nation state. i mean, to the point your last caller to the point your last caller there, robert, i think what's there, robert, i think what's going to be coming round, i going to be coming round, i think the nuclear points are think the nuclear points are interesting because i think interesting because i think macron has come out saying he macron has come out saying he may expand the nuclear deterrent may expand the nuclear deterrent or as an umbrella through or as an umbrella through technology that is within technology that is within european union. and i think the european union. and i think the

uk one has a lot closer uk one has a lot closer link with the us. but what�*s more with the us. but what's more interesting is by putting troops on the ground and, you know, we're talking about how do we stop this war at the minute, there's 100,000 troops locked up there's100,000 troops locked up on the northern border of ukraine opposite belarus. and, you know, we've seen that article four of oh yeah, i'm

bit seeing. sorry. oh yeah, i'm supposed to disagree. >> not really. but you know. >> not really. but you know. >> it's geopolitics. slightly >> it�*s geopolitics. slightly different isn't it. different isn�*t it. >> but not really. >> but not really. >> i think the european army is never going to happen. i don't want it to happen because it dilutes the focus of nato and that i don't want to see nato fall apart. i think i think nato, i think that would be a big worry for all of us. and i think that's what putin wants. i think that's what putin wants. i think that's what putin wants. i think that that would be exactly what's not. i think that's what putin wants. he wants nato to be destroyed and not there anymore, and it to break down. and he wants to break up our, our strength alliances. yeah. and have little alliances instead. >> so but if that happens we then have to choose a side don't we. we need to decide whether we want to be aligned with america, or we want to be aligned with the eu. >> on the basis that this i just i think it's overreaction to say that europe is, is ever going to fall outwith, with the us. i just think maybe i'm being too idealistic, but i really do not

see a future with the united states and europe not being on the same side. i just don't see it. and if we do see a future like that, i think all of us should be absolutely terrified of what the future holds. why? because i just think that the at the moment the world order is, is, you know, western nations working together within a nato framework. and that is something that i framework. and that is something that! do framework. and that is something that i do strongly believe in. and if that crumbles and we have a situation where we�*re all sort of, you know, we've got the us making decisions over there, we've got the europeans making decisions with their army over there that that does not sit well with me at all. that that to me is something that potentially could lead towards world war iii in the future. i think we just i think nato is very important for that reason. it's not a, you know, it�*s not it's not a, you know, it's not a political alliance. even though i�*m very anti i voted to leave the european union. we're talking about a strategic military alliance, which i think is valuable, and i don�*t want to is valuable, and i don't want to see it change. >> but if the americans choose to leave, then there's. >> no choice. well, i think, you

know, the other thing that can be done is a no fly zone over ukraine. at the minute. ukraine doesnt ukraine. at the minute. ukraine doesn't have any air superiority. they won't do it. and i think this is the part of the reasons that. >> we want to have happened. >> we want to have happened. >> yeah. well i, i�*m thinking that these, the europeans are probably getting round the table to say we can't sort of dilly dally around. the thing is we had germany, you know, begging the russians, they got hooked on russian cheap russian gas thinking, oh, we can control russia by by taking their gas. but then their industry got hooked on the cheap russian gas. so. 50. >> well, president trump actually warned them about that, didn't he? >> he did. and i think we�*re seeing from us now a sort of, you know, a reawakening of the europeans, sort of realising that we need to buckle up here. but we also you cannot stand up. there's no diplomacy with putin. and i think donald trump's the and i think donald trump�*s the only one that can do it to play face, but we're having to see them to at least put a no fly zone across the ukraine and put some troops on the ground once that mineral agreement signed. >> do you remember when we were all discussing that when russia first invaded ukraine? we were all discussing we need a new a no fly zone. i completely agree

with that. i know the dangers of it. but everyone backed off. and that's why we're in this situation. >> because it's weak tory >> because it�*s weak tory leadership under that. >> weak tory leadership, i think a lot of them are weak, indecisive and don't really know indecisive and don�*t really know what they�*re doing at all. but what they're doing at all. but let�*s hope that the press let's hope that the press conference that we're about to go to in a matter of moments will give us some of the answers, and we'll find out exactly what's going on if exactly what�*s going on if you've just tuned in. welcome. this is gb news. we are britain's news channel. it's britain�*s news channel. it's coming up to 17 minutes after 5:00. if you�*ve just tuned in. 5:00. if you've just tuned in. the prime minister has been meeting with european leaders. those leaders include zelenskyy macron, chancellor olaf scholz in germany, the prime minister, mette frederiksen from denmark, giorgia meloni from italy, netherlands prime minister as well. let's go live to the prime minister who's speaking following a meeting with european leaders on ukraine. >> authority of this government, of any government is the security and safety of the british people to defend the national interest, particularly in these volatile times. that is

why last week i announced the biggest sustained increase in defence spending since the cold war. that's also why i met president trump last week to strengthen our relationship with america and indispensable partners in defence and security. and it's why this weekend i have been hosting european leaders here in london to work together for the security of the united kingdom, ukraine and europe as a whole. through my discussions over recent days, we have agreed that the uk, france and others will work with ukraine on a plan to stop the fighting. then we�*ll discuss that plan with the united states and take it forward together. the purpose of today's meeting was to unite our today�*s meeting was to unite our partners around this effort to strengthen ukraine and to

support a just and enduring peace for the good of all of us. our starting point must be to put ukraine in the strongest possible position now, so that they can negotiate from a position of strength, and we are douang position of strength, and we are doubling down in our support. yesterday evening the uk signed yesterday evening, the uk signed a £2.2 billion loan to provide more military aid to ukraine, backed not by the british taxpayer but by the profits from frozen russian assets. and today i am announcing a new deal which allows ukraine to use £1.6 billion of uk export finance to buy more than 5000 air defence missiles, which will be made in belfast. creating jobs in our brilliant defence sector. this will be vital for protecting critical infrastructure now and

strengthening ukraine in securing the peace when it comes, because we have to learn from the mistakes of the past, we cannot accept a weak deal like minsk, which russia can breach with ease. instead, any deal must be backed by strength. every nation must contribute to thatin every nation must contribute to that in the best way that it can, bringing different capabilities and support to the table, but all taking responsibility to act, all stepping up their own share of the burden. so we agreed some important steps today. first, we will keep the military aid flowing and keep increasing the economic pressure on russia to strengthen ukraine. now, second, we agreed that any lasting peace must ensure ukraine's sovereignty and security, and ukraine must be at the table.

third, in the event of a peace deal third, in the event of a peace deal, we will keep boosting ukraine's own defensive ukraine�*s own defensive capabilities to deter any future invasion. fourth, we will go further to develop a coalition of the willing to defend a deal in ukraine and to guarantee the peace. not every nation will feel able to contribute, but that can�*t mean that we sit back. instead, those willing will intensify planning now with real urgency, the uk is prepared to back this with boots on the ground and planes in the air, together with others, europe must do the heavy lifting, but to support peace in our continent and to succeed, this effort must have strong us backing. we are working with the us on this point. after my meeting with president trump

last week. and let me be clear, we agree with the president on the urgent need for a durable peace. now we need to deliver together. finally, we agreed that leaders will meet again very soon to keep the pace behind these actions and to keep working towards this shared plan. we are at a crossroads in history today. this is not a moment for more talk. it's time to act. time to step up and lead and to unite around a new plan for a just and enduring peace. thank you. i will now take a number of questions starting, i think, with you, beth at sky. >> thank you, prime minister. watching president trump berate a wartime president and defender of european freedom.

>> in the. >> in the. >> oval office said to many people what you've already seen people what you�*ve already seen in a way that everything has changed. given that the us has become an unreliable ally, did you, as european leaders, discuss the prospect of actually going it alone? and actually what the reality of a us pulling out of this, all of this would mean? >> do you. >> do you. >> think you really do need the us? >> and if. >> and if. >> you do. do you think the coalition of the willing will be enough to bring president trump back around? thank you. >> well, firstly, in relation to last friday, nobody wanted to see what happened last friday. but i see what happened last friday. but! do see what happened last friday. but i do not accept that the us is an unreliable ally. the us has been a reliable ally to the uk for many, many decades and continues to be. there are no two countries as closely aligned as our two countries and our

defence. our security and intelligence is intertwined in a way no two other countries are, so it's an important and reliable ally for us. the discussions we have had today, particularly the coalition of the willing, is on the basis that this is a plan that we will work with, with the us and that it will have us backing. so that is the purpose of the plan, and thatis is the purpose of the plan, and that is why i spoke to president trump last night before we develop the work on this plan. thank you. i've got robert from itv. yeah, yeah. >> hello robert peston, itv. i want to sort of put. >> to you what will be. >> to you what will be. >> on the. >> on the. >> minds of. >> minds of. >> millions of british. >> millions of british. >> people with. >> people with. >> your commitment. >> your commitment. >> in the event of. >> in the event of. >> a peace deal. >> a peace deal. >> to. >> to. >> deploy british soldiers to ukraine? >> is there now a more real prospect of britain being at war

with russia? can you rule that out? >> the whole point of a guarantee for any deal if there is a deal is to preserve the peace and if you want to peace, and if you want to preserve the peace, you have to be prepared to defend the peace. so the reason i've been forward leading on this is because i want to avoid conflict, because i do not want conflict in ukraine, in europe, and certainly not in the united kingdom. i want stability in the united kingdom. the way to ensure that stability is to ensure that stability is to ensure that stability is to ensure that we are able to defend a deal in ukraine, because the one thing our history tells us is that if there is conflict in europe, it will wash up on our shores. and already in the last three years, what's happened in ukraine has had a massive impact on many working people back here in the united kingdom. because their bills have gone up, their energy bills have gone up, their energy bills have gone up. there's been

an instability in our economy caused by that conflict, so we are not unaffected by it. and of course, our own security and defence depends on the defence and security of europe. 50 every and security of europe. so every step i am taking is in order to preserve peace, to avoid conflict, because the safety and security of the british people is my number one duty and responsibility, and i take it very seriously. thank you. chris, at the bbc. >> thank you, prime minister. chris mason, bbc news after what happened the other night between president trump and zelenskyy, do you feel a greater personal responsibility alongside president macron and others for delivering a workable peace? and on the coalition of the willing, as you�*ve described it today, as you've described it today, are you persuading more people to join it? >> thank you. on the question of responsibility, i do think the united kingdom should step up, step up and lead. we have done that historically as a nation,

and we need to do it again. and thatis and we need to do it again. and that is why we're moving forward on this. on the coalition of the willing. yes. a number of countries have indicated today that they want to be part of the plan that we are developing. i�*ll leave them to make their own statements about exactly how they want to make that contribution, but we've been contribution, but we�*ve been able to move that forward. i accept without criticism and with respect the position of other countries that may not feel that they want to contribute in that way, but i strongly feel that unless some move forward, we will stay in the position we are in and not be able to move forward, and therefore it is a deliberate plan to ensure that we get some momentum and pace here, and it is intended to preserve the peace, and it's intended to peace, and it�*s intended to ensure that we stay in lockstep

with the united states, which is my strongly held belief, the best way to preserve security and defence in europe, and security in defence of the united kingdom. well, a number indicated today that they wanted to be part of the more forward looking element. i will, rather than speak for them in terms of exactly how they�*ll make that exactly how they'll make that known and what their contribution will be, i�*ll leave contribution will be, i'll leave that to them. but i'm pleased that to them. but i'm pleased that a number did indicate that they do think that this is a plan worth backing and that they want to play a part in it. and so we have made real progress today in the course of the last few hours. thank you alex. >> thank you. prime minister. alex wickham from bloomberg. i'm sorry, on your coalition of the willing, do you think it can be bolstered by countries that aren't just bolstered by countries that aren'tjust in europe? aren't just in europe? essentially, we've got aren'tjust in europe? essentially, we've got canada represented here today. do you think you could get countries beyond europe to join the coalition of the willing, essentially make it almost a

transatlantic partnership? and also, in terms of your plan to present back to donald trump, how soon do you need to get that done?is how soon do you need to get that done? is that something that really needs to happen very quickly in days? >> thank you. on the countries beyond europe, obviously we had canada here who've traditionally taken a forward leaning role. they've been working very hard they�*ve been working very hard with us on issues like trading, and they've been a reliable and they�*ve been a reliable ally, and i�*m encouraging of that because they are already deeply vested in ukraine, as i say, they've worked on, on the training, amongst other things. so, yes, on the question of the u5, so, yes, on the question of the us, look, i spoke to president trump last night. i'm not going to go through the details of that conversation, but i would not be taking this step down this road if i didn't think that it was something that would yield a positive outcome in terms of ensuring that we move together. ukraine, europe, the

uk and us together towards a lasting peace. and so that's the way i've approached this in the last few days. hugo, from the news. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> prime minister. >> prime minister. >> hugo from the paper. >> hugo from the paper. >> obviously the other. >> obviously the other. >> party that would need to sign up >> party that would need to sign up to any future peace deal is russia. president trump has said he wants to talk to russia. you're coming up with a peace deal without russia�*s involvement, what makes you think that russia can be persuaded to sign up to this deal that's been agreed by its enemies? >> well, in the end, a deal will have to involve russia. of course it will. but we can't approach this on the basis that russia dictates the terms of any security guarantee before we've even got to a deal. otherwise we won�*t make any progress at all. it is, you know, for a deal to be done. but if a deal is done, it has to be a deal that is then defended. because what we've seen in the past is a cessation

of the hostilities without any back up. and that was readily breached by russia. and that is precisely the situation that i think we need to avoid this time round, which is why we're going down this road. antonello, please, from la repubblica. >> thank you. mr anton du beke. from la repubblica, the italian prime minister, the. >> giorgia meloni, who. >> giorgia meloni, who. >> you had a bilateral meeting earlier today, said that the west must not split on ukraine. how can you try to convince meloni and other european leaders that your plan and your coalition of the of the of the willing, sorry, it's the right willing, sorry, it�*s the right thing and to persuade them to join. and do you fear that the west might split on this? >> thank you. well, first, i had a very good bilateral meeting with giorgia this morning. we had the first bilateral brunch, i think, in the history of

british italian relations. 50 that was a first. we get on personally very well. and she's very clear in i don't want to speak for her, but i mean, i think her position is well known that europe and the us have to stand together and that bond must always be strong. so there is a huge amount of common ground between the way i see this and the way giorgia sees this, particularly the view that it is important for the security and defence of italy, of europe and defence of italy, of europe and the united kingdom, that we work as we have always worked closely aligned with the united states. thank you all very much indeed. thank you. >> gene hackman paolo.

>> that was a keir starmer. he was at the at his press conference there, the coalition of eu leaders all discussing. the zelenskyy the war in ukraine. he made lots of comments there. one big thing, we are at a crossroads in history, he called it. he actually said that he wanted to strengthen their relationship with america and they agreed. the uk, france and others wanted to stop the war, stop the fighting and unite. and one of the big things that he said was thatin the big things that he said was that in order to for peace, they needed to strengthen ukraine so that they can negotiate from a position of strength. he talked about £2.2 billion. that has

been taken from a lot of the money that was taken from russian assets that have been frozen in the uk. he also talked about 1.6 billion to create an air defence. he said that we have to learn from the mistakes of the past and he talked about keeping. he had five, four points that he made, the first one being keeping the military aid flowing to ensure that ukraine could protect themselves. he talked about sovereignty to ensure that ukraine can have sovereignty sovereignty. he also said he�*d like to continue boosting the ukraine defence. and he talked about a coalition of the willing. he mentioned uk boots on the ground and planes in the air. so that doesn't sound like, air. so that doesn�*t sound like, in my view, maybe that's a peacekeeping force, but it sounds interesting, almost as though we�*re prepared to fight. though we're prepared to fight. idont though we're prepared to fight. i don't know. but he said the effort must have strong us backing, and they had agreed with the president. but they must deliver together. leaders will meet again very soon. he

made that point, said it's time to act, time to step up and lead. interesting there, because some of the questions there, one of them asking, i mean, beth rigby from sky asked whether watching the prime minister berate zelenskyy has he become an unreliable ally? and keir starmer pushed back on that and said that he didn't accept that the us is a is an unreliable ally, he said they�*re very ally, he said they're very important and that he actually had a conversation with trump last night. he said he didn't accept that and he said, can you asked, can you rule out the uk being at war with russia? he said he wanted to preserve peace. we do not want conflict in ukraine and europe. and the way to ensure stability is to be able to defend ourselves and our problems will wash up because the problems will wash up on our shores. he was, i have to admit, i think that he was quite diplomatic in his efforts. and i�*ll bring in my panel, lee harns i�*ll bring in my panel, lee harris and also chris wall. you can see that photographs from downing street outside downing street earlier. lee harris, what

was your take on all of that? >> not bad. and i was really pleased to see him stand up and respond to that ridiculous question. from beth rigby to try and put, well, maybe, maybe, maybe she was trying to have the opposite effect to get him to say we don't see america as an unreliable ally, and i�*m glad he unreliable ally, and i'm glad he did that. i'm very glad he did that. but what seemed to be missing for me, and maybe i'm missing for me, and maybe i�*m being a bit too critical, was was yet again the exit strategy. the only sort of thing that i picked up from that was that it's more of the same. and it's putting ukraine, which again, i agree with the principle of this, about putting ukraine in the strongest position possible prior to any peace negotiation. now, when is that going to happen? when is the exit strategy, when are we bringing trump in? that�*s the bit that trump in? that's the bit that i�*m a little bit concerned about, but i hate to admit it. overall, that wasn't bad. >> well, he said europe and the us have to stick together. chris. well. >> i mean, i think the key

takeaway from that, despite the obvious question from beth rigby, which obviously keir answered properly, adequately is in the event of a peace deal. 50 in the event of a peace deal. so there's still a long way to go here, but making sure that ukraine is in its strongest position possible position now is, is encouraging. you know, an announcement that's going to be good for people in belfast who's looking for jobs good for people in belfast who's looking forjobs in in making looking for jobs in in making some air defence missiles. you know that announcement today from from the uk export finance. like you know what is evident to me is making this work for britain. and hopefully it's going to make it work for europe and hopefully it'll make it work for ukraine. >> so you're okay with us making weapons because it brings in jobs to fight, continue fighting 100%. >> we must be increasing our defence spending and we must make the uk military power. but the. >> weapons that they are making presumably are to supply ukraine, which is what we continuously do. what i was very disappointed with is that he didn't mention anything for our armed forces. i would have liked

to. that was all very well. i respect the fact that he�*s talking about keeping in lockstep with the united states, but what i didn't hear was but what i didn�*t hear was bolstering and money going into our own armed forces. but did he mention that, though? did you hear him mention. >> that he announced that two days ago when we got £13.4 billion increase? which is why, funnily enough, donald trump is seeing on a route to 3%, he is happy with the steps that keir starmer is making. he is happy that keir starmer acknowledges the rest of europe need to pull their socks up too. and you know, there�*s only one man that know, there's only one man that could have done that. could you imagine jeremy corbyn getting all of these eu people together. >> around the table. >> around the table. >> and talking about increasing defence spending? the labour party has changed for the best and the plan for peace can only be possible through increasing our military strength. >> but he talked about, i mean, his four points were keeping military aid flowing. so that to me sounds like continuing to perpetuate the war. but he�*s perpetuate the war. but he's saying to put ukraine in a strong position to defend against vladimir putin. and then

the, the one of the points that he made was that. >> you could. >> you could. >> they couldn't do this without >> they couldn�*t do this without putin, but they were doing it without putin, is what i heard. we don't do this without vladimir putin. it's a bit like vladimir putin. it�*s a bit like donald trump trying to negotiate peace and not using ukraine involving ukraine. and there was a lot of criticism for donald trump over that. >> this is why i felt it was a little bit more of the same. there was some new stuff in there like you�*ve just there like you've just discussed, but but it we are still lacking that urgency to stop it, to stop the war. and that's something that i didn't hearin that's something that i didn't hear in that. and so i�*m genuinely pleased with what he said. but like chris has just said. but like chris has just said and you we ijust think we said and you we i just think we absolutely need to up our own personal defence spending. i know we've heard that from keir starmer recently. i'm not quite starmer recently. i�*m not quite sure it's the 13.8 billion that we've heard. i think there's some some definite interesting some, some definite interesting analysis that shows it could actually end up being a bit of a cut, depending on how you view that money. he played a very

similar game to rishi sunak with his game playing with with the inventive. >> the money sounded more it sounds but yet the the, the sounds but yet the, the, the actual application of that money. if you worked it out over time and inflation and everything was actually less, it was kind. >> of if you make some assumptions. >> it's to do with inflation, >> it�*s to do with inflation, isn�*t it? >> so yeah. >> so yeah. >> it's something might well >> it�*s something might well it's a slight increase. but but we've got to do it in. you've got to look at things in perspective haven�*t you. if 13 billion or whatever they're announcing ends up being worth less than it would have been however many years ago, then it's not really an increase. so it's not really an increase. 50 that's how we work out everything, isn't it? that's how we work out. >> rishi sunak. >> rishi sunak. >> you called him out. >> you called him out. >> for that. >> for that. >> it's not the same thing as rishi sunak for. doing that. wouldn't even get to the military spending to where we're at now. i mean, what was just on your point, lee, what keir starmer did say is that we need to agree an urgent need for peace. that is, as you were saying earlier, nana and keir starmer has reiterated those words in his speech. and i think that we do need to take

acknowledgement here that ultimately the sort of elephant in the room is how putin's going to because we've heard nothing from putin. >> well, this is the problem. >> well, this is the problem. >> on all of these discussions. but the list that you've listed but the list that you�*ve listed out there of who's attended this meeting is, is encouraging. but it has to be a case that, as donald trump's defence secretary said, we need more lethal force by europe. 50 any of this we shouldn't be arming ukraine is an absolute nonsense. >> well, what about i'm not sure. it is an absolute nonsense, but what about a coalition of the willing? so this will be people who say, okay, well, we're prepared to okay, well, we�*re prepared to join. won't that simply weaken? nato. >> yeah, this is what i was worried a little bit about. i'm not sure that this happened, but what i was, i was kind of worried that he might, you know, even if he didn't do it directly, kind of indirectly undermine trump in these in with this meeting because obviously we have got european leaders coming together without trump. and like you said, without putin. and we�*re kind of doing this without without them. so and i am a little bit concerned that that because i think we all

know trump, he wants to be part of it. i think he wants to he wants his nobel, nobel peace prize. there's absolutely nothing wrong with that as a goalin nothing wrong with that as a goal in life. i have no problem with that. i'm not sure that that happened. i think, as i said, that that key question from from beth rigby. trump would have liked the answer that starmer gave, as you said, we said off camera and i said he better boot that one back. and he absolutely did. so fair play to him for doing that. but again, we need an exit strategy. i want to hear something a bit more solid. i want to hear our own defence spending increase. i mean one thing, not by much, but it has. i�*ll give him that, it has. i'll give him that, don�*t get me wrong. but let's not forget what trump was trying to do all along. he was trying to do all along. he was trying to get all of us to spend more money on defence, and he has achieved that. >> carr achieved that. >> can you give him credit for that, chris? >> yeah, i mean, look, he's been cordial. but then his intimidating stance at the same time gets us to where we need to be. some of us have always believed that, that the labour

party and the uk needs to be more pro—defense. and that's what nobody. >> was that until donald trump came along. >> well, i mean, if we go back. >> well, i mean, if we go back. >> to the guilty of this. >> to the guilty of this. >> as well. yeah, the conservatives are guilty of it, but the labour party definitely isn�*t. at the end of the day, we've got to look at i want to hear from belgium, i want to hearfrom belgium, i want to hearfrom belgium, i want to hear from i want to hear from portugal, spain, croatia. what are all these people doing? why isn�*t their defence spending not up? we've got geert wilders over there running around on a 1.4% gdp. there can't be talking gdp. there can�*t be talking tough if they're not going to put their money where their mouth is. >> you can't give labour too much credit in terms of. >> all the credit. >> all the credit. >> i�*ll give you. >> i'll give you. >> i'll give you. >> i�*ll give you exactly what's >> i'll give you exactly what's going on. >> some credit to. >> some credit to. >> be given all the credit. >> be given all the credit. >> why are we spending 20 or 30 billion on net zero if defence is so important to keir starmer, why are we wasting money on that? why are we sending. why are we spending 15 billion abroad. >> it's 0.2% of gdp. it�*s >> it's 0.2% of gdp. it's 5 billion a year. it doesn�*t make billion a year. it doesn't make a blind bit of difference. >> the defence spending is 0.5, isn�*t it. what is it, o.5%. oh no, that's foreign aid. yeah i'm talking about foreign aid but sorry. no, no. my point. let me just make this point about the

foreign aid. was anneliese dodds resigned because she wasn't happy about the fact that we'd taken, i think, 0.2 off the foreign aid budget to put it into defence spending. >> well, i�*m glad you realise >> well, i'm glad you realise that amount. it's a tiny, tiny bit. it's my point about the net bit. it�*s my point about the net zero, because at the end of the day, we do need net zero because we need to. >> get our hole in the head. >> get our hole in the head. >> we need to get away from reliance on all this russian gas, all this sort of like fossil fuels by having some reliable, you know, renewables and nuclear. if i�*m being honest and nuclear. if i'm being honest with you, that�*s the big thing with you, that's the big thing with you, that's the big thing with small nuclear reactors. >> which the labour party scrapped. >> didn't they know we put 20 billion into it? >> no. they didn't make any new reactors we. >> announced last week. >> announced last week. >> well, they are announcing it now. but the reason we're in now. but the reason we�*re in this mess is because they got rid of it in the first place. >> no, we put it back. >> no, we put it back. >> in now. well they're putting them back in thankfully. finally joining us now. gb news is editor christopher hope. he's outside the european leaders summit. so we've had the press conference from sir keir starmer. we've heard the points that he made. could you just reiterate the things that he

said? >> you�*re welcome back to >> you're welcome back to lancaster house. we can now say where we are because the leaders have been leaving £1.8 billion of export finance. that�*s loans from the from the ukraine based on assets, russian assets and interest here to buy 5000 air defence missiles made in belfast. it�*s quite a trumpian way to announce some defence spending to ensure that there are jobs in belfast from this spending on weaponry, and we heard that from in washington dc, from the prime minister. he wants to see this big push towards increasing our defence budget to 2.5% of gdp and based on the aid, the aid spending, he wants to do that to boost uk industry. and we saw the first example of that with this order for the new 5000 air defence missiles. he says he�*s got this new plan for the coalition of the willing. that's the new term the willing. that�*s the new term for this new european land force. he says it will be backed with british boots on the ground

and british planes in the air. thatis and british planes in the air. that is uk troops deployed to keep the peace in ukraine after any peace deal. but it must have, he says. strong us backing. he doesn't accept that the us is an unreliable ally. he says that the purpose of this plan is to ensure it does have us backing. and that's why he spoke to donald trump last night, saturday night and also night saturday night and also fnday night saturday night and also friday night. and that's why it's so important. asked whether he felt we are all edging towards war with russia as a country, he didn�*t deny that. country, he didn't deny that. but what he said was this the whole point is to defend the peace.| whole point is to defend the peace. i want to avoid conflict, but that is, reflect on that. asked if we�*re going to war with russia or going on that road, he says the whole point is to defend the peace we have at the moment to avoid conflict. that shows that. i think the scale of the pressure on these world leaders, so used to having a peace to deal with and yet suddenly worrying about, are we going towards war with another

country? and just finally he says he wants the uk to step up and lead. he says we've done and lead. he says we�*ve done that historically and that's why we should we should be willing to do it. he says a number of countries are backing this coalition of the willing. he won�*t say how many, but they are willing to step up. and i think we should be watching reporting from across the european union to see which other countries suddenly announce increases in defence spending. i think it will be more like several more in coming days and hours. and on thursday this week, there's a meeting of the council of europe. that's a meeting of the european union heads of state to discuss this plan further. i wonder whether sir keir starmer might be choosing to go out there. gb news wasn't called for there. gb news wasn�*t called for a question in this press conference that that's fine. we conference that that�*s fine. we are called other, other press conferences, but i would have asked had i been called nana, when might british troops be on the ground, and how are we going to pay for this? because we know that the defence spending is going up to 2.5% of gdp in 2027? well, it's 2025 right now. so

who's going to pay the bill who�*s going to pay the bill between now and then. >> we don't really have enough >> we don�*t really have enough people to create a proper army anyway. so who are we going to send?! anyway. so who are we going to send? i was going to say that the only fly in the ointment for this was the fact that there was no real mention of russia. in a way, this whole coalition of the willing and all that kind of thing, there was no real. whilst they wanted to put ukraine in a strong position, there was no real mention as to how they might negotiate with russia or bring vladimir putin to the table. >> well, currently, frankly, we' re >> well, currently, frankly, we're negotiating with america. we're not negotiating with russia, are we? we're negotiating with america to be a backstop militarily, to help enforce a peace deal. we haven't even got to talk to putin yet, or even through a proxy, in this case, ukraine. we're trying to get russia. we're trying to get the us onside, frankly, you know, a surprisingly, given the support that america has shown to the continent of europe since the second world war. but right

now that can't be guaranteed. so we've got to do a deal as a country here with the other 16 european countries, plus canada and others. we've got to do a deal with them that's acceptable deal with them that�*s acceptable to trump. if trump says, yes, it goes to russia, we're nowhere near russia yet. nana of course, sorted out with usa first. sorted outwith usa first. >> yeah. oh well, thank you very much. christopher hope really good to talk to you. and that, of course, is christopher hope. he's there outside the european leaders summit. joining me, political commentator lee harris and also labour activist chris warrell. i'll go to you, lee harris. all right. so that's i mean, i pointed out my thing. i thought that yeah, i get it. i hear that we're going to trump hear that we�*re going to trump will be kind of the middle person, as it were, to try and get on board with the russia. but again, i still come back to the fact that again, it sounds like we�*re just doing the same like we're just doing the same thing. and keir starmer literally said that we will we're at a crossroads in history. and he said that they don�*t want to make the same don't want to make the same mistake. so he said we have to

learn from the mistakes of the past. but aren't we doing exactly what we did before? i don't see any change. >> i agree that is what concerns me. is that all this is just it's nice to listen to in some respects. but, you know, it sounds like we�*ve got plans. sounds like we've got plans. we're going to we're going to do something different. but really it just sounds like more something different. but really itjust sounds like more of something different. but really it just sounds like more of the same. or there is a concern to me that it sounds like more of the same. i�*m yet to be. it's the same. i'm yet to be. it's yet to be seen. the other thing that worries me about this, and i am going to change the gears on this slightly, just to bring it in. there seems to be a lot of money for arms, for war arms, and yet we cannot spend 1.4 billion to keep poor pensioners warm in the winter. i don�*t know why that�*s funny, chris, because why that's funny, chris, because i don�*t. >> i�*ve told you, i've said this before. >> why are you laughing? >> why are you laughing? >> because it�*s the winter crew's allowance. i mean, testing, you know, elderly people for winter fuel payments is fine if you're rich and you've got enough money. the whole household support fund was set up to help those that needed it. it was an extra 2 million in

tower hamlets where i live. the fact that we were talking about rachel reeves, who's got secure mics, by the way, that's been fiscal discipline. we've seen the debt to gdp ratio come from 95% down to 93% within one year. yes, there's been difficulties with bond markets moving. but ultimately, when it comes down to our security and our sovereignty, you know, we've got to make sure that we�*re putting money in the right places. and if that means. >> we're spending more on net zero. >> if that means. >> if that means. >> if that means. >> if that�*s so important. >> if that�*s so important. >> that energy security, it's. >> that energy security, it�*s. >> that energy security, it�*s. >> all part of this ridiculous. >> all part of this ridiculous. >> cost of living crisis, bring the costs down. yes. we�*re we're. >> spending more on net zero than we are on arms to go to ukraine. if that was your if that was the case. right. and keir starmer said, right, we're going to scrap net zero and we're going to spend more on defence and put that into i�*d have a little bit of respect for him, but he's not. he�*s spending him, but he's not. he's spending more on net zero. he�*s taking more on net zero. he's taking money away from pensioners. he's got absolutely no, it's got absolutely no, it�*s absolutely bonkers, this inheritance tax on farmers. and yet we can always find this money to send abroad. and don't get me wrong, it's for a good cause. but what about the british people? >> well, look, the economic policy that's underpinning rachel reeves come from a man called philip agam. and if you

look at what they�*re talking about, if you take a u—curve of innovation right on the one end, you've got cut throat capitalism, and on the end you've got cuddly capitalism of the eu. you know, if we've got big tech companies, what they end up doing is lobbying to stifle innovation. we are going through a middle, intermediate level of innovation, and that's going to come down from creating a military industrial complex where we're going to use ai, we're going to improve our defence because at the minute we're facing a bigger threat. >> i�*m going to stop you with >> i'm going to stop you with that. that gobbledegook that i�*ve just heard. i don't really i�*ve just heard. i don�*t really know what you're talking. >> about. >> about. >> because if you are a pensioner or somebody who's watching and listening to this now, you will be hearing, hang on a minute, my fuel bills are going up. i've got extra tax. i have to find there's a national insurance hike coming through in april. there are businesses shutting down at a rate of knots. and then you hear these words, 2.2 billion, which will be taken from the russian oligarchs, the money that they've acquired from that which they've acquired from that which they could probably put some of that into the people here, 1.8 billion or 1.6 billion to create air defence and also more munitions, 5000 more missiles and so on and so forth. a coalition of the willing, which

i do believe the first job of every government is to protect their people. and then you hear their people. and then you hear the latest news at 500 more migrants have crossed the channel and they�*re going to be housed in hotels. >> put money into that. >> put money into that. >> let me finish. you hear that? i think that whilst this is all important, a lot of the people of this country might be saying, as you pointed out, lee, that if you can get money like that so quickly, why can�*t you do it for the domestic, the people in. >> their ideological? chris, you know it and i know it. there is absolutely no need for them to cut that 1.4 billion winter fuel allowance. and there was absolutely no need. in fact, it's they've said it's going to it's they've said it�*s going to cost the treasury 1 billion to put that inheritance tax in on farmers, again, counterproductive and completely pointless. and yet keir starmer can always find money for other things apart from the british people. now, i don't disagree that this is a good cause, but like i nana has just said, like i nana hasjust said, charity starts at home. >> £200 a month to rich pensioners rather than sort of just putting it. >> in pensioners. >> in pensioners. >> but if you look at the small boats, let's just take that up.

i mean, i thinkjust boats, let's just take that up. i mean, i think just yesterday i mean, i thinkjust yesterday or the other day yvette cooper was in france, right? they put £7 million with the french have just with the negotiations with the uk changing their law so they can intercept boats that's being paid for by the british public. £7 million to stop that happening. but beyond that they�*ve set up a new special they've set up a new special investigations unit in dunkirk with the french, £1.3 million there, 12 officers. so they're going to be able to stopping these gangs, sending the boats over by having moved our immigration policy more in step with the eu, because the boris boris wave has been caused by a botched brexit deal that removed any deportation agreement. and it's only taken the labour party to step in and make that happen. >> all right, listen, chris harris, it's been a pleasure as ever. it's been a very busy show, i've got to say. and keir starmer of course, had that meeting today in london and met with all those eu leaders and those from other countries. he talked about a coalition of the willing who will be willing, willing who will be willing, will it not end up dissecting and making nato less relevant? well, i�*ll be bringing you lots

more reaction to the prime minister�*s announcement over the ukraine conflict over the next houn ukraine conflict over the next hour. i've got to say a huge thank you to my panel, political commentator lee harris. thank you very much. also, labour activist chris warrell for joining me. don�*t go anywhere. i�*ll see you in the next hour, but now i�*ll leave you with some but now i'll leave you with some weather. we'll dissect all of thatin weather. we'll dissect all of that in a matter of moments time. stay with me. this is gb news. >> ooh. a chilly start will give way to a lovely warm afternoon. boxt heat pumps sponsors of weather on gb news. >> good afternoon. welcome to your latest gb news weather from the met office. high pressure stays in charge of our weather across the southern half of the uk over the next couple of days, but low pressure never too far away. further north with weather fronts trying to sneak their way south and eastwards as we go over the next couple of days, but generally starting to weaken as they bump into that area of high pressure. that does mean there's going to be quite a lot of cloud around across parts of

northern ireland, scotland into northern parts of england, with this weather front pushing its way south and eastwards. so perhaps some quite heavy rainfall across western parts of scotland into the early hours of monday morning. but further south, a bit of a different picture. plenty of clear spells on offer, so turning quite chilly under those clear skies to perhaps as low as —4 or —5 in some spots. however, staying generally frost free across the northern half of the uk as we go into the start of monday morning. under those clear spells, particularly across the southern half of the uk and in particular across the southeast, there could be some mist and fog in places so that perhaps causing some travel disruption dunng causing some travel disruption during monday morning's rush houn during monday morning's rush hour. however, a different picture further north plenty of cloud around some outbreaks of rain across northern ireland, northern parts of england and southern parts of scotland, particularly over any high ground. two blustery showers then feeding in from the west across parts of shetland and orkney, and still remaining really quite cloudy to start the day on monday for much of scotland as we then go through the rest of monday morning, any of that mist and fog perhaps a little slow to clear in places, but will eventually burn off as

the sun comes up, leaving plenty of sunshine for the southern half of the uk as we go through monday afternoon. further north, still remaining rather quite cloudy across northern parts of england over any high ground temperatures, generally around about where they were on sunday. highs of 1011, perhaps 12 degrees. so really feeling quite degrees. 50 really feeling quite pleasant where we see that sunshine in the south as we then go through monday evening. that band of cloud across the central swathe of the uk does continue. outbreaks of rain and hill fog continuing across northern parts of england, but there is going to be plenty of sunshine on offer for the southern half of the uk through tuesday and wednesday. perhaps that sunshine a little hazier by the time we get to thursday, but temperatures are on the rise as we go to the end of the week. >> a nice bright morning will generate a lovely warm day right to the boxt solar

boxt following a summit on ukraine. he has vowed to keep the aid flowing after welcoming european leaders to london after a meeting that lasted more than an houn meeting that lasted more than an hour. he announced an extra £1.6 billion of funding for ukraine. he addressed the nation a short time ago. >> of any government is the security and safety of the british people to defend the national interest, particularly in these volatile times. that is why last week i announced the biggest sustained increase in defence spending since the cold war. that's also why i met president trump last week to strengthen our relationship with america and indispensable partners in defence and security. and it's why this weekend i have been hosting

european leaders here in