breaking news tonight in the mystery surrounding the sudden death of music icon michael jackson. that mystery, intensifies as questions mount as to his sudden death. his half a billion dollar empire and more important, custody of the star's three little children. after murder charges leveled in the death on jackson, his family publicly claiming he was murdered, bombshell tonight -- the payoff. that's right. we learn a secret deal in the works wherein debbie rowe doesn't fight for custody of jackson's three children. payoff, $4 million.

$4 million. for rowe to just go away and keep her pie hole shut. rowe vehemently insists it's not true. this while law enforcement shows up on the doorstep of jackson's private doctor, demanding answers. father joe jackson does an interview with abc and he gets nearly a quarter million dollars, insisting, of course, the money was not for the sit down interview. okay. whatever. this as sources claim in a stunning twist father joe jackson reportedly set to force jackson's children on to the stage, under the name the jackson 3. actually sending them on the road. jackson often discussing physical abuse, beatings at the hands of his own father, joe jackson. always keeping his own children

far, far away. father joe also saying he himself will raise jackson's children and now put them on the stage. has jackson's worst nightmare come true? also, jackson's body moved from hiding at the family crypt of motown founder barry gordy after many question how do you lose a casket? with 20 helicopters hovering and thousands watching the casket exited the arena, but was the body ever in the casket or was it smuggled out in an unmarked van? we confirm a portion of jackson's brain missing from the body was held for testing. jackson's family infighting boils over. the jackson brothers pushing ahead with burial in the back yard of neverland for a

graceland-like michael jackson burial theme park. a second autopsy discovers four fresh needle tracks in jackson's neck. that's right. his neck. other vains riddled with track marks, many collapsing from iv use. his skin paper white, his body emashated, all in contrast to private video of a full dress he rehersal hours before his death. drugs, banned for consumer use, only find behind lcd dooocked dn an operating room, found in the home. jackson reportedly ingesting up to 10,000 pills in just six months, including 40 xanax a night. this amid reports jackson wanted to be put under with an iv drip for days on end. essentially lying there like a living corps for up to 72 hours

at a time. the lapds chief mulling criminal charges over who drugged an addict who happened to be a super star, as the vultures circling jackson's dead body, the fate of his three children unknown. >> are you ready to fight for your children. >> don't touch me. >> nobody touched you here. >> you just did. don't. >> source close to the family told us that katherine jackson's attorney is actually trying to broker a deal regarding custody. told the family certainly wants her to give up any notion of custody and any visitation rights. now as far as money, absolutely part of the deal. seems like there is quite a large payoff, actually, in the works. our source told us that rowe stands to be paid, quote, many millions if she agrees to give up any contact and any custody with her two children so the singer's mother katherine can raise them. >> to put this crudely she sold

her children once, may want to sell them again. looks like this is an opportunity to cash in for her. >> i did it for him to become a father not for me to become a mother. >> latoya jackson told a london tabloid she believes her brother was murdered for his money. >> she said people were around him that didn't have his best interest at heart. he was michael the cash cow, money making machine. >> and tonight, breaking news, a beloved couple with 16 children, 12 of them adopted, many of them with special needs, handicapped, murdered in their own home. part of it caught on video. we have the video. the suspects in full ninja garb invade the home with military-like precision. as we go to air, arrests come down as the hunt for more suspects goes on. tonight, who gunned down this beautiful couple, leaving 16 children orphans?

a tragedy occurred in escambia county with the murder of byrd and melanie billings. >> police say the billings were ambushed when two groups of men burst into their home killing them execution style. >> i think you'll find this particularly chilling and here's why. >> they were all dressed in black, all had masks on. >> dressed in ninja black garb. >> who would kill a couple who opens their home to special needs kids? >> it's my honor today to tell you we have found them and they are in custody. >> seven people, six adults and one juvenile, have been arrested in a killings of a gulf coast couple inside their home. >> the men who had broken into the house, they say made away with a medium-size safe. >> police say gary lamont sumner, fred lick lee thornton and donald ray stallworth are all in police custody.

also arrested and charged with murder wayne coldiron and leonard patrick gonzalez jr. >> the one pivotal person in this organization is leonard patrick gonzalez jr., he is the organizer. >> gonzalez jr.'s father gonzalez sr. was the getaway driver in the red van allegedly. >> the thing about the vehicle was my biological father's house. i am not guilty of the crime i am charged. >> who would want to kill these people so loving and so giving? >> there was an amount of practice that was involved. >> leonard patrick gonzalez jr. the sheriff here says he has a military background. stallworth is an active duty staff sergeant in the air force. >> it was a very well planned and well executed operation. >> good evening. i'm nancy grace. want to thank you for being with us tonight. the mystery surrounding the sudden death of music super star michael jackson intensifies. >> there is word that jackson family's negotiating behind the

scenes with lawyers for debbie rowe. >> are you ared to fight for your children? >> are you ready to get your butt kicked. don't touch me. >> the lawyer for jackson's ex-wife debbie rowe is denying there is any custody in the works. an attorney for debbie rowe calls the newspaper report false she agreed to take $4 million not to challenge catherine jackson's custody rights. >> latoya is quoted saying these are not debbie's kids. they don't know she's their mother. like everyone else in his life she was motivated by money. >> michael jackson's death really changes the whole situation. and as the surviving parent, she does have a reasonable claim to custody of these children. >> straight out to ian hallprin arthur of "unmasked the final years of michael jackson" joining us tonight in a prime time exclusive live. ian, explain to me the alleged

payoff, $4 million for rowe to give up any further claims on the children? >> nancy there's a lot of rumors being bandied about right now and i'm still reserving judgment until i see the documents themselves. right now, the jackson family, the rowe family, there's so many rumors coming out and the problem is, there's three amazing children that michael jackson doted on and they're being left just out in the open in the unknown and i strongly urge california child welfare to step in and get these children a proper stable environment asap because the way things are going right now, it's very unclear, very shady, and a lot of agreed around the jackson and rowe camp. >> to our chief editorial producer, i want to specifically address reports that a secret deal has been cut. that there will be a $4 million payoff to debbie rowe for her to go away, way and keep her pie

hole shut and never darken the doorway again with her hand out for money? >> right. "the new york post" is reporting that there is a deal that has been made between debbie rowe and the jackson family. like you said, $4 million to walk away. to never challenge custody again, whether the guardian is catherine jackson or another member of the jackson family. however, rowe's attorneys now demanding a retraction. they say there is no deal. she's not taken any money, she's not going to take any money other than the spousal support she and jackson agreed on years ago. >> mary mar get, with radar on-line.com what can you tell me about an alleged payoff for debbie rowe? >> at this point we think it's false. what we do know is the fact that the judge specifically asked that debbie rowe and the jackson family come to an agreement before the hearing, so that everyone knows and is on the same page of what's going to happen with the children. as for money she's been very clear through her lawyer that's

not what she is seeking. for now on the record, she doesn't want any more money or her kids. >> to our producer standing by there in l.a. natisha, do you know any more about the payoff? when is it supposed to go down and what prompted it? >> nancy, once again, sources are telling cnn that there is a payout that is supposed to be happening behind closed doors. we don't know the details of that. debbie rowe's attorney again is saying this is false, no payoff is going to happen, and debbie rowe is not seeking money. ♪

fourni i'm here to celebrate my son, because he was the largest entertainer in the world. >> father joe jackson reportedly set to force jackson's children on the stage under the name the jackson 3. >> a friend of debbie rowe said she's not just going to roll over and she fully intends to seek custody. >> you've heard michael jackson say countless times how joe abused him. >> i never beat mike until my life. >> she just wants to make sure that they don't wind up like michael jackson at the mercy of joe jackson's belt. >> is this about what's best for the kids or is this about money for debbie rowe? >> debbie, are you ready to fight for your kids? >> don't touch me. >> are you ready to fight for your kids? >> do not touch me. >> nobody touched you here. >> you just did. don't. >> are you ready to fight for your children? >> are you ready to get your

butt kicked in don't [ bleep ] touch me. >> are you ready to take a cash settlement for the kids? >> the payoff, allegedly $4 million. debbie rowe denying the entire thing. $4 million, once again, for her to give up claims on her children and to go away, to disappear. back to elle. what's the final price tag on debbie rowe? how much has she gotten over the years? >> nancy, according to court documents, debbie rowe got a $5 million settlement years ago from michael jackson, and then she was paid another $900,000 for several years after that. >> okay. hold on. did you say $5 million to start with? >> yep. $5 million. >> then $900,000 per year, i believe it was the next four years? >> yes. exactly. >> but elle, aren't you owe mitting another payoff after the child molestation charges rear their head on the scene? .

>> you're right, nancy. there were also reports -- rowe gave up her parental rights when the 2003 molestation allegations came up and she was confirmed about his affiliation with the nation of islam she tried again to get custody and she went away. at that time it's believed she got another payout from jackson. >> how much do we think she got then? >> don't know about that time. reports are very sketchy on that. >> okay. the reports are very sketchy, but what are the reports, elle? >> well, i've heard everything from another $5 million to as much as $7 million or $8 million. >> back to mary margaret, radaron-line.com, an alleged $9 million not including the current $4 million payoff, allegedly. that's getting close to $15 million. what does she do with all her money, mary margaret? >> that's a really funny topic of discussion. as we know she lives a quiet ranch life with her horses and

had a wonderful home michael has visited her in beverly hills, so we think she has a fat bank account right now. >> elle, isn't it true that she spends about $25,000 a month on horses? >> well, yes. debbie rowe breeds horses and she's told people that she is on an allowance, she has i guess a fixed income and she does have concerns about whether or not she is financially secure. >> i guess you're referring to the nearly 10 to $15 million as a fixed income? >> right, nancy. >> okay. $25,000 a month on horses. elle, does she ever sell any of the horses or does she just raise them? >> good question. that's not clear to me. i've seen many reports that debbie rowe has a horse breeding enterprise. it's not clear if this is a hobby of hers or whether or not she's making money off of this. >> okay. what can you tell me, back to you, elle, again, regarding

reports -- and where did we get the reports -- that within a doctor's office an assistant is claiming jackson was addicted to dermatological treatments and he would have himself put under an iv drip for up to 72 hours at a time? basically, rendering him a living corpse? >> right. this is a plastic surgery nurse who said she worked for one of michael jackson's doctors. she said that he was getting to the point where he asked for anesthesia even when he went getting any sort of medical procedure done, that he would ask to be put out for days at a time. she said he was almost like a zombie. she tells "the sun" it was something like out of a horror movie. >> live out to tracy in illinois. hi, tracy. >> caller: hi, nancy. love the show. >> thank you. >> caller: i just want to say about a week and a half ago there was a media report on this channel that miss rowe stated

that the kids were a gift to michael because she knew that he would be a good father. so how would that come into play legally? i mean a gift is a gift. you can't get those back. >> well put. let's unleash the lawyers, gloria allred, victim rights advocate out of l.a., raymond judicha out of atlanta, and renowned attorney alex sanchez joining us out of new york. what about it gloria? >> well, legally speaking, she is the parent of the older two children and that is a matter of law and if she fought for custody, she would have the legal edge and so she has leverage in settlement negotiations. >> what about it, raymond? >> that's why she keeps getting more money. she has leverage. there's a premmion in california because of her biological parenthood. >> what about the fact that she has repeatedly relinquished rights. is she in any position to really put up a fight now?

>> i think she is because michael jackson has died. circumstances have changed drastically and now that he's died she has a claim and i think it's a legitimate claim and she should go forward with that claim. ♪ ♪ ♪ for you and for me and the entire human race ♪

gosse . rowe waved her parental rights in 2001 telling a los angeles court, quote, they are his children all part of an $8.5 million settlement in which the pop star got full custody. >> a dramatic twist in the fight

for michael jackson's kids. "the new york post" is reporting debbie rowe, jackson's ex-wife, agreed to drop any custody challenge for $4 million. now her attorney denies it, says it's completely false, and rowe doesn't want jackson's money. even asking for the "post" to file a retraction. >> tonight we learn the chief investigator from the l.a. coroner's office has shown up on the doorstep of jackson's private dermatologist, demanding answers. i want to go out to dr. punchel dar board certified anesthesiologist and the author of "before the scalpel what everyone needs to know about anesthesia." explain to me on these vials wouldn't there be tracking numbers? isn't there a way to find or to track where the propofol came from? >> actually, nancy, it's very

difficult. this propofol is given from the pharmaceutical company -- >> is that the generic name? >> generic name is propofol. brand name is dip pri van. >> okay. >> both interchangeable. same drug. supplied in vials like this, draw into a syringe. >> where did you get that, doctor if. >> this is from the hospital. it is not a controlled substance, but it should be given in a controlled situation by people who know how to use it properly, such as an anesthesia provider. it is a dangerous anesthetic drug that should not be used? how can you track it if there are not numbers or serial numbers on the vile? >> it goes from the manufacturer to wholesalers to distributors. there were middle men involved in this and if they were supplying michael jackson with this diprivan in his house, there was some kind of middle man involved because you would need buckets of this to be asleep for 72 hours. >> doctor, do you have a demo

for us? >> absolutely. you can have to set this up just like this. pure diprivan being infused right into your blood. pour it in and you would be dead in a minute. that's how dangerous it can be. ♪ because they got no where to go that's why i want you to know i'm ♪

we've learned from the second autopsy about these fresh needle tracks in his neck. latoya jackson tells this british tabloid she was concerned about the circumstances of her brother's death. she wouldn't reveal what that autopsy reveals. but she did say that it is going to be a shocker, that there are bombshells in that second autopsy. >> there was no indication of any external trauma or any indication of foul play on the body of mr. jackson. >> claims from some of michael jackson's former employees about his alleged drug use. they told police back in 2004 that jackson took more than 10 xanax pills each night and at

one point used as many as 30 to 40 pills. >> we do not know what, if any, drugs michael jackson was taking for insomnia or any other reason and won't know until the toxicology reports are made public. >> a source involved in the investigation said the singer's arms were riddled with marks and veins in both arms had collapsed. >> the source would not confirm if diprivan had been found with jackson but he told us numerous bottles of prescription medication had been found in jackson's rented mansion. >> he said, i want an iv and because i know that the first drop when i look at it and i see the first drop hit my vein, i'm asleep and i sleep very well. >> shocking claims about jackson's alleged drug abuse coming from a former friend and psychic. he said this tragedy was bound to happen. >> i screamed at him and i used the words, michael, if you continue this, you will die. >> out to dr. dar. you were just saying in one minute, you're dead or you're

out. what did you mean by that? >> let me say, it has to be dosed precisely according to someone's body weight and tailored to the surgical procedure that's going on at the moment that you're under in the operating room under controlled setting. let me just explain how it's given. usually it's hooked up to this iv setup and placed in a pump and the physician dials in the amount that should be given to the patient. another way to give it is to take a syringe and put it into a saline bag and drip it in. it's hand controlled. if you open it up too wide, what happens is, patients breathing becomes shallower and to the point where they would stop breathe. if you stop breathing you would go into cardiac arrest and i would imagine that if the toxicology reports show this diprivan in his system at some point, it's really going to change the picture of everything. >> doctor dar, how long would diprivan stay in his system? >> well, it is metabolized in

the liver so we could potentially find metabolized that are existing in his body tissues, blood samples were taken i presume during autopsy, so if it's there they will find it. >> joining me right now from washington, d.c., dr. marty mccarey, physician and professor at johns hopkins. welcome. what do you make of these new reports we're just hearing tonight that he had become addicted to various dermatological treatments and would go under for -- wanted to be put under for up to 72 hours at a time. it would be like a living corpse just lying there with an iv drip for three days. >> it would be like being in a coma with this medication and people can go in comas for months sometimes. it is sort of a perfect sleep. it's horrible way to get rest, but we know that this diprivan does burn your vessels and we hear that both veins in both

sides of the arms were burnt out and when i hear -- >> what does that mean to have your veins burnt out? i've never heard that. >> this medication is caustic. it irritates the veins. >> we're just lawyers, doctor. we're just lawyers. we're jds not mds. what do you mean is a caustic medici medicine? >> the veins scar down and collapse and it is a real tip-off when somebody is using the veins in their neck because those are some of the last resort veins that addicts shoot up in. that is a sign of serious addiction. >> you know what, let me just see the lawyers again. let them back out, liz. somebody's going to jail, all right. somebody's going to the pokey. and for a long time. because if this was some addict laid up on the street on third avenue, nobody would care. but this time, it's come to light. it's come to light that some fancy doctors with nice offices

out there in beverly hills are doping up michael jackson. three days at a time, lying there like a corpse. what's your defense. >> let's see the toxicology, let's see if there are toxic and dangerous levels of any drugs in mr. jackson. all we have now is speculation. i would also say if the district attorney in the county where jackson resided or died believes in this case, he or she should impanel a grand jury immediately, start issuing subpoenas and taking testimony. let's end speculation and get to the bottom of it. >> thank you for the tutorial. sanchez? >> you know, if there is a criminal here, let them name names and so far, i've heard a lot of speculation, but if you want to prosecute somebody -- >> put sanchez up. you know -- >> there is -- >> you know that five doctors -- >> by a doctor you name a name and then you bring evidence against that person. >> under suspicion right now,

gloria allred your have a chief investigator for the coroner's office, there slung up on the front door of his private dermatologist. now, that doesn't normally happen after a cardiac arrest. after a heart attack. >> yeah. reportedly the reason that they were there at the dermatologist's office was that dermatologist had not provided all of the records that dr. klein had not provided all of the medical records that the coroner's office was seeking. nancy, i will say, that i know the district attorney of l.a. county will be cautious, will not try this case in the media, he will make sure that he has all of the evidence that he needs before he decides whether or not he's going to file a charge in this case. >> out to dr. joseph dellteeto professor of psychiatry joining us from new york. the sleep that michael jackson would get from intravenus drip of diprivan, would it be like a

regular deep rem sleep? would he wake up feeling as if he had slept and would would emotionally or psychologically lead him to this point? >> well, many drug addicts dream of a state of oblivion and that's what this basically is. some state of oblivion. it's sort of not what it is, but it's what it's not and it's not real life. many people who want to use drugs to get into the state of oblivion are trying to avoid something else, some other pain they have dealing in the real world. i doubt it was sleep deprivation, primarily, which led limb to want to be put out for three days. >> out to the lines, kaye in kentucky, hi kaye. >> caller: hello, nancy. how are you? >> i'm good dear. what's your question? >> caller: my question is about michael jackson as a parent himself. for seven years, he was on drugs, never tried to kick the habit. why didn't he want to be around for his own children? we know debbie rowe is not

ranking high in the parent division here, but he didn't either. >> to ian hallprin, author of "unmasked the final years of michael jackson" joining us tonight in a live prime time exclusive, ian, what can you tell us? >> well, michael was a doting parent and the fact of the matter is, no matter who the biological parent is, it doesn't matter. michael jackson did everything for these children. they will always only refer to one person as their real parent, that's michael jackson. he traveled all around the world with them after the -- after he was acquitted in 2005. he did everything for those children. and debbie rowe, i hope she's watching this tonight, nancy, because debbie rowe should be ashamed of herself. anyone -- i'm a father. any parent who could demand money to go away and give up their child, they, too, should be held accountable. i find this disgusting. i hope the media, the world

holds her accountable and also the jackson family. i don't think they are suitable guardians for these children. nancy, we have a major problem here tonight. we have to find -- and i hope the state of california steps in immediately and takes proper action and finds a proper guardian for these children asap. because these children are going to wind up in the wrong hands. joe jackson wants to exploit the children, like he did michael jackson, and we are not going to have a good situation here. that's where we should focus now. on the children, their welfare and also i urge the authorities to bring the doctors to justice. ♪ ♪ i believe in miracles and a miracle has happened tonight ♪

new revelations concerning michael jackson, his sister latoya making comments to a couple of british tabloids saying she believes michael jackson, her brother, was murdered and his death a superior. >> how is michael jackson worth

more dead than he is alive if if he completes the 50 shows we're talking ability half a billion dollars people could make off these shows. i don't understand how michael is worth more dead than alive since they only insured for 30 shows. >> if michael jackson had lived to begin his upcoming london shows this man says he likely would not have finished them. >> i knew he wasn't ready to handle them. i knew it was something he could not do. he also knew that. the reason i thought he couldn't handle it is easy. first of all i saw the shape michael was in physically. michael weighed looked like to me 110, 115 pounds. he was 5'10". >> rowe told me jackson did not want to work that hard and did not want to go ahead with a gruelling concert schedule. he said the singer told him he agreed to do ten shows but that the promoter, aeg, sold out 50. >> to elle, our chief editorial producer, what can you tell me

about jackson's family getting nearly a quarter million dollars after an interview with father joe jackson? >> right. well tv newser is reporting that abc paid $200,000 to license about ten minutes of video of joe and catherine jackson. they paid this to a production company. this was a documentary that was supposed to air soon. now abc claims that the licensing of the video had nothing to do with the sit down exclusive they got with joe jackson. >> abc claims what? >> that the licensing of the video is completely separate from the interview they got. >> put elle back up. elle, when you're saying licensing of video. >> right. >> i'm a lawyer, i know what it means to license something. but don't they give that video to abc to run on one of their shows and then they get nearly a quarter million dollars for the interview, but abc and the jacksons are saying we didn't get paid for the interview? >> well, there's no comment from the jacksons about it but abc is

saying, right, they did not get paid for the interview. >> okay. . you know what, they can say whatever they want to, but what you're telling me as reported in newser is he sits down for an interview, father joe jackson, they give him some video and he gets paid nearly a quarter million dollars, right? >> that's what tv newser is reporting. >> okay. also, i want to go back to ian hallprin author of "unmasked the final years of michael jackson." now ian, you say none of the molestations ever happened, right? >> yes. originally i started out, i was furious after the 2005 acquittal and i wanted to nail jackson. i wanted to prove the world that he is, in fact, a child molester. i thought this was another case in california of another o.j. simpson getting off with high priced lawyers. >> you changed your mind. >> i interviewed thousands of people, got access to thousands of documents. i conclude unwavering today,

michael jackson never molested any children and he's been the victim of extortion attempts and fraudulent attempts to get money out of him. >> here's my question. how is it -- i imagine you've got an explanation for this, how is it that the boy jordi chandler could describe disfiguring skin markings on jackson's buttocks and under his pens. >> nancy, you have to read the book. it's all in the book, nancy. those -- that testimony by jordi chandler was false, proven false, and i outlined that all in the book. what i'm saying tonight very clearly is, michael jackson was the victim of extortion attempts, fraudulent attempts to accuse him of something he never did. he was acquitted and, nancy, i'll tell you one thing, if you could give me one shred of proof that michael jackson ever molested children i'll change the conclusion to the book and credit you.

>> i'm not redoing the child but i know of multiple children that said, testified that he molested them. but i am not retrying the case. he's dead. >> nancy, that's right. >> enough. no ian. >> backtrack for a second into i'm not backtracking because we're going to break. >> there's not one shred of proof he ever molested anyone. >> thank you, ian. i'm not retrying the case since he was acquitted. he's dead. the criminal cases are over. right now, we have a criminal case that is very much alive. and we want justice. take a listen. >> breaking news. out of the florida panhandle. we've learned two more people have been arrested in the killings of a gulf coast couple inside their home. >> gary lamont sumner pulled over in a routine traffic stop two counties away now charged with murder. wayne thomas coldiron and leonard patrick gonzalez jr. have also been charged with murder. according to arrest warrants patrick gonzalez sr. was the get

away driver in the red van. >> we are working on a number of six to eight, we believe the number to be effectively seven, there may be an eighth suspect. >> still trying to figure out what a motive is. could it be robbery? that's one of the motives. but police say there's probably something else behind this too. >> surveillance cameras show two groups of men dressed like ninjas bursting into the billings' home. two men come from the wooded area behind the house and three men rush in through the front door. a few minutes later, both parents mom and dad, shot dead in their own bedroom. up to three children are believed to have seen the attack. >> it leads me to believe this was a very well planned and methodical operation. >> this looks like a death penalty case. two people who have been shot down in cold blood in front of their own children. >> to t.j. hart, news director wsky 97.3, what's the latest? >> latest right now is that they're still looking for a possible eighth person involved

in this couple's slaying and of course the family members are doing the best they can to keep the children, you know, pretty much sheltered from this as much as possible. >> to sergeant scott haynes, sheriff officer, santa rosa county, he is there at the sheriff's office. sergeant haynes, what do you make of it? >> things like this are very odd anywhere, let alone in a town the side of beau la, up until a year ago had one traffic light in it. you don't see things like this. it's very spectacular when you look at the method that these people did this home invasion and murdered these two individuals. it's extremely shocking and we've never seen anything like that around here. >> to sergeant ted roy, from es scam beya sheriff's office, investigating the murder, is it true, sergeant roy, that a safe was taken out of the home and that there is evidence that this

was all practiced? i mean imagine looking out your kitchen window and seeing a see group of men dressed in ninja outfits coming across your lawn. >> it is true about the safe. there was a safe stolen. as of right now, i can't tell you if we recovered it yet. i'm not investigating the case. i'm the public information officer. what's your second question, nancy? >> my question was, do you have reason to believe it was rehearsed? >> we do. several of the individuals that we have in custody have said they practiced up to 30 days prior to this. >> to mike vaughn, the assistant public offender and spokesperson for leonard gonzalez sr.'s defense. thank you for being with us. you're the spokesperson for his defence. what is his defense? >> well, it's too early to talk about his defence. we were just appointed very recently in as far as what's

going to happen on the case or what his position is. we have talked to him. we have to not discuss at this point in time our plans. >> that is a motive. a motive. we believe that there were other motives we have yet to confirm. we are working on numerous motives.

easiest, clearest thing to say is the time and motive in this case is robbery. home invasion, robbery. they did take items that you would normally expect to be taken in a robbery. >> money, story? >> well -- a safe. >> to clark goldman, our producer on the story. clark, what can you tell me about the alleged ring leader running a martial arts studio? i guess that explains the ninja outfits. >> exactly right, nancy. the ring leader, gonzalez jr., the father was involved, he trained children and battered women how to protect themselves from violence. in fact, he has six kids of his

own. now he had a hearing this afternoon in court. he appealed for no bond to be on his own recognizant. you had a $1 million bond, i'm taking that away. >> good to know. to sherry in illinois, hi, sherry. >> caller: hi, nancy, thanks for taking my call. your children are so beautiful. >> i'm blessed. thank you. >> caller: a quick comment/question. this horrific act happened so quickly. my was to you and your panel is, how did these people know where the safe was that they took out of the house without being in there before? safes usually don't have a sign on them saying, here i am, take this? >> to t.j. hart with wsky, how do we believe they know where the safe was? >> that is one thing not revealed yet. one person did work at that home at one time. one of the seven suspects. we don't know if he had access to inside. >> that explains a lot.

everyone, let's stop and remember army special samuel stone, 20, ft. orchard, washington. killed iraq. graduate of national army national guard. carpenter. loved reading, fishing, hunting, leaves behind parents nancy and steven. one sister, two brothers. samuel stone, american hero. thank you to our guests but especially to you for being with us. i'll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp eastern, and until then, good night, friend. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com

jooim i'm jane velez-mitchell, next on "issues." headline, cash cow, claiming deb bow row sells jacko's kids to his mom for $4 million. this letter, late this afternoon, saying absolutely not and demanding an immediate reinteraction. the new york post said it's standing by its story. so what's the truth? deal or no deal? there are so many amazing twists and turns we will get to it. this evening and tell you whether or not a deal is in the works for michael jackson's kids. meantime, stunning new developments in a double murder out of florida, a beloved couple caring for special need kids gunned down. seven people now under arrest and their backgrounds are astou astounding. stay right there.