♪ >> hello, and welcocome to the "journal" on dw-tv. i am shane fankhauser herb. >> and i am brent goff with the business news. >> g-20 leaders and a tense summit in seoul with an agreement that is light on substance. reports suggest opposition leader in burma may soon be freed from house arrest. >> into ireland, it will ask for a eurozone bailout. bond yields fall for the first time in two weeks. ♪ >> hello, and welcome.

the end of the contentious summit in seoul, g-20 leaders vowed to avoid currency manipulation and protectionism. but deep differences between china and the u.s. remain on currencies and trade. the summit produced little substance, the leading economies, including germany, agreed to discuss guidelines to manage trade next year chancellor angela merkel gave her support as well tuesday basil 3 everyman's of banking reform which would tax banks to create a fund for financial bailouts. >> g-20 leaders smiled for the media after lengthy talks some described as having divisions. divisions emerged over the influence of currency exchange rate for international trade. the german chancellor said countries were trying to cooperate but warned that papered over conflict could re- emerge. >> i would like to emphasize that the issue of free trade remains a crucial importance. protectionism could

significantly damage lasting worldwide economic growth. >> in the end, leaders could only agree to draw up guidelines to help identify trade imbalance is affecting world growth. but there was no consensus on what to do it countries are found to be benefiting from an artificially weak currency. the united states had to drop calls for a cap on exports. >> countries with large deficits must work to reduce them, as we are doing in the united states, where we are on track to cut our deficit in half by 2013, and more i am prepared to make tough decisions to achieve that goal. likewise, countries with large surpluses must shift away from unhealthy dependence on exports and take steps to boost domestic demand. >> the summit can boast two key reform programs do not stabilize the world economy. first, banks will be obliged to put more of their own capitals in for a rainy day. it is hoped this will guard

against irresponsible risk taking and the need for government bailout. second, the leaders agreed on a major overhaul of the international monetary fund. it will give a bigger share to china and other emerging economies such as india and brazil. >> in light of the g-20 countries, if it will also be participating in the asia- pacific economic cooperation forum, which is getting under way saturday in japan. it will focus on lang the groundwork for a free-trade area. -- it will focus on laying the groundwork for free trade areas. the u.s. and china. and then fastest growing ones such as and asia, chile, and thailand. regional matters will also be on the agenda, including a dispute between china and japan over islands in the east china sea. bernie's op -- the burmese opposition leader could soon be released from house arrest on saturday when her detention term expires. she's been detained for 15 and the last 21 years.

the nobel peace laureate in her national league for democracy were barred from running in elections five days ago. burma oppose the first since 1990. supported by the ruling pontiff is expected to win the elections which been widely criticized for neither being free nor fair. >> news of suu kyi's possible release spread quickly. hundreds of supporters outside her party's headquarters, some wearing t-shirts saying we stand by you and there was intense anticipation. by evening, hopes faded that the nobel laureate would emerge from house arrest on friday. >> there is no law to hold her for another day. her detention expires on saturday, and she will be released. >> for most -- for much of the past 21 years, suu kyi has been a prisoner in her home, heavily

guarded. when her party won elections by a landslide in 1990, there were mass celebrations. but the generals refused to hand over control. confine your house arrest, suu kyi continued to mobilize her supporters. for them, she remains an icon on of the struggle for democracy. many hoped her release will mark the start of a new chapter. >> here in germany, speculation is mounting that the finance minister may resign. it has been several weeks that he was in the hospital earlier this year. his chief spokesman on the right of the screen stepped down earlier in the week. now a german newspaper is reporting that there will be a cabinet reshuffle. but the chancellor's spokesman denied any such plans. let's get the latest on this. we have our colleague here. this incident has really caused a storm here in germany. how much damage has been done?

>> i think it was a display of nastiness that anger is quite a lot of people. he publicly humiliated and mocked his press spokesperson. it definitely stepped out of line in doing that. but i think that is not the kind of thing a minister would normally resign over. >> is a personal thing or a professional thing? >> i think the problem was that he did not apologize. he waited two days before st. perhaps he overreacted. he still has not officially apologized. the man has a lot of basic sympathy if you could draw on from the public. because he is ill. he is paralyzed from the waist down. he has been in a wheelchair since an assassination attempt 20 years ago. people understand he is under pressure because of his job. they understand about his health. i think a few colleges quickly, the matter could have been smoothed over, but it did not. >> and we believe that the

chancellor is reluctant to let him go. >> yes. well, i suppose he is probably the most experienced member of the cabinet. at 67, he is a very good brain. he is a financial expert. difficult to replace. but i think she will wait until he himself decides that he has to go because of his health. it is a question of time. we have known that for a while. this incident only speed that up with this discussion in public about whether he is up to the job. a depression. >> as always, thank you for that analysis. two other news, the death toll in haiti's cholera epidemic has climbed to 800. according to an american medical expert monitoring the spread of the the disease. if the u.s. out of there is concern the opri did reach the united states, but as a possibility of transmission to the mainland remains low. dominican republic is on high alert. in port-au-prince, hospitals are being overwhelmed by the arrival of a suspected cholera patients.

>> residents of this small fishing village south of port- au-prince have taken their livelihoods from the water for generations. but now fear rise to the villages were cut the cholera outbreak spreads. and nobody is buying these fish for fear the water they lie in my decontaminated. >> there are rumors that nobody should be selling fish. what am i supposed to do? i have six children. but will the government do for the people is selfish? my children are sick. i have no money and nothing to give them. >> many are choosing to go hungry. the same time, the number of cholera cases in the capital of port-au-prince doubles by the day. hospitals and clinics are filled to capacity. and still, health care riders must deal with a constant flow of new cases. the u.n. is asking for urgent donations, hoping to raise 160 four million dollars to combat the epidemic. -- 160 four million dollars to combat the epidemic.

>> was talk about ireland. >> it felt like the entire world is worried again that ireland will not be able to pay its debt. friday was the first day in two weeks that the risk premium for irish bonds did not rise. ireland helped calm the market on friday by denying rumors it will seek a g-20 bailout. and a new bloomberg poll shows that a large majority of economists now believe that ireland is headed for bankruptcy. >> ireland has rejected as senseless claims that it plans to turn to the eu cap in hand. but the river bill -- the rumor mills is dublin is in talks to receive emergency funding already. you politicians are trying to calm the markets. >> i will not comment on any further speculation. we're sure that the courageous and hands-on work of the irish government will inspire the confidence that it deserves.

>> questor well said holders of irish bonds were not have to shoulder any sovereign debt default costs. he plans to ask bondholders to contribute to a bailout would only apply to freshly acquired bonds. this may, the eu set up a 750 billion euros emergency fund. ireland would be entitled to tap into this fund should face a liquidity crisis. >> fears about the future of ireland said european shares down for most of the week. the blue-chip stocks and the dax marked the biggest weekly loss since september. the mood of bleecker friday on speculation that china may soon increase interest rates to tame inflation. we have a wrap up the day's trading action from the frankfurt stock exchange. >> the questions about ireland dominated trading here. no doubt, there were lots of import news and messages from all around the world, but the euro debt crisis right here at home in your land was once occupied the traders' minds most

of all. it provided for a dampened the mood. when there was speculation that perhaps there was some 80 billion euros ready to be injected for ireland on a european level, that caused the share prices to recover. but the mood did not really improve all that much because the next question is, if ireland as take advantage of the rescue package, the european one, will purchase will be the next one? what will happen then? this is a lot of that uncertainty that will carry over into the next week. >> that is true. but i get a quick look at how markets ended the week. in frankfurt, the dax ended with some very modest gains, nothing to write home about. the euro stoxx 50 ended about 0.3% down on the session. across the land to come to the dow jones had concerns over highest interests rates in china. the dow jones lower. and the euro benefiting from all this. the dollar weaker, the bureau

stronger. $1.3696. at the g-20 summit, germany gave a firm and no to any caps on trade exports. it is no wonder germany's economy is growing and is depending on orders from abroad. gdp grew in the third quarter by 0.7%. that was a slowdown compared to the 2.3% in the spring. that was the strongest quarterly expansion in two decades. economists forecast gdp will continue to expand as demand for exports and domestic consumer spending both remain robust. >> there's still uncertainty surrounding the safety of the engines that the airbus jumbo passenger jet a380 has following the emergency landing of a qantas of jack last week in singapore. eads reported earnings in the first nine months of the year plummeted. >> airbus he' latest near disaster has just come july. in august, screams and the

cockpit of an airbus a380 went blank in mid flight -- screens went blank. for a short while, there was no way of maneuvering the plane. an electrical defect was to blame for the failure and a global said the warning has been issued. the manufacturer has plenty of problems. deliveries of the super jumbo a380 be delayed after last week's engine failure. that might mean the recall of all affected engines. the parent company has remained tight-lipped about the costs of such an action. so far, 39 a380 planes are in service. another 380 airplanes are on order. replacing an engine would cost 17 million euros. that is especially worrying for the engine manufacturer, rolls royce. it would have to bear most of the cost of the replacements, after confirming that an oil fire in one of its engines led to last week's accord is a landing. >> back over to shane.

>> things. the former israeli prime minister, ariel sharon, has been moved from a hospital to his own. the 82-year-old is then spent in a coma for nearly five years after suffering a massive star. there has been no change in his condition. if the move is part of a general medical practice to care for chronic patients at home. >> millions of muslims have begun converging on the saudi arabian city of mecca for the annual pilgrimage. more than two million worshippers took part in the first friday prayers at the grand mosque before the holiday officially gets underway on monday. the saudi government has put security forces on high alert, amid fears of an attack by al qaeda. it is the fifth pillar of islam and every able-bodied muslim is expected to perform it once in their lifetimes. rumors of germany's governing coalition are calling for tighter said the regulations on toys in the european union, but they want the government to

press the tighter eu rules on substances suspected of damaging genetic makeup or causing cancer and infertility. germany's top consumer watchdogs as 80% of the children's toys recently tested posed health risks to children. >> the eu label ce is a bill of health for toys. the german experts say it is misleading. they complain about dangerous small parts, highly flammable stuffed animals, and above all, heavy metals and plastics that can cause cancer in children. most of the tories raising concern are imported from asia. -- most of the him toys raising concern are imported from asia. >> they do not meet the meted -- the needed said the requirements. >> parliamentary parties of germany's governing coalition are demanding stricter conditions for european toy labels. >> insiders say ce stands for

china's exports, and the level is printed on everything with no concern for standards. >> a new european guidelines on toy safety are due to be introduced in 2013, but some german politicians believe they do not go far enough. >> formula one racing now, and sebastian vettel will need to finish in the top two of the abu dhabi grand prix on sunday if he is to become the sport's youngest champion. it was hamilton who clocked the fastest time on friday pose a practice session for the season's last race. but that leaves the burden with a slim chance. the current points leader is third in his furry. and sebastian vettel's teammate was fourth fastest. the question is, who is going to be winning the big race on sunday? we will have a tip in a moment

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programs. quick access to your region. all broadcast * at a glance. clear and concise. " tailored to your needs on dwworld.de. the fulldw program the-tv. >> welcome back. sunday is the final in subsiding race of the formula one season in abu dhabi. alonso is leaving the driver standings. -- is a leading the standings. close on his heels is sebastian vettel. it is down to the wire. german finance will be closely following sebastian vettel, the youngest driver ever to secure a position to win a grand prix. but if he wins the biggest prize, he will have to-the dreams of his australian teammate, mark webber. >> german driver sebastian vettel is dreaming of an arabian

nights tell with a happy ending in abu dhabi. the 23-year-old has the chance to fulfill a childhood ambition and become the youngest ever driver champion for formula one. he was only four went spectators got the first glimpse of his speed and skill on the go-kart track in his hometown. he never lost that early momentum. sebastian vettel made his formula one debut three years ago. one year later, he got his first grand prix success. and maybe now, the title. but there is a catch. he needs to win the abu dhabi race again like last year, and the current leader, alonso, has to finish in fifth place. >> last year, we did very well here, and it should be the same again this year. >> the team colleague is also in

it for a shot at the title. he just needs to win the race. the question is, but will there be a team order for sebastian vettel gillette webber pass. their remaining tight-lipped about the strategy. -- they are remaining tight- lipped about the strategy. >> we will back both drivers eagerly, but it will the, you know, very anxious to see how it works out. different scenarios have the drivers of winning the championship. ultimately, they rely on each other as well. so it is going to be a fascinating weekend in abu dhabi. >> two-time world champion, fernanda 0 alonso is in the best position going into the race. he is experienced and has a comfortable lead. but everyone at ferrari is familiar with the technological pitfalls that can turn winners and losers. >> it goes to the last meter

because everyone will be worried about everything. it will be a very long race in abu dhabi. >> if lanzo manages to clinch the title at his first year in furry, he will become a hero in italy. -- if he manages to clinch the title at furry, he will be a hero. >> will have more in a moment. first, a look at the comeback by schumacher. he was once called the king of formula one racing. he came out of retirement for the new season and hopes were high that he would once again take the title he has already won seven times. but so far, schumacher has failed to shine. he says he's unhappy with the situation. >> schumacher is stumped. they're raising legend would never have dreamt he could drop so far behind when he returned to formula one racing. the laid-back euphoria with

which he started the season is gone. he is being used to promote a whole product line, but it is not going exactly as planned. >> we're not where we wanted to be. of course we expected to be fighting for the championship this year. but we have had to accept that we cannot do that with this car. >> as far as schumacher is concerned, the car is the reason his competitors are leaving him so far behind on the racetrack. but there are other explanations. >> for him to come back this year in a way as bad luck. this year, i think there's a better group of drivers in formula one than i can remember. >> sebastian vettel, webber, alonso, hamilton, a new generation of racing drivers regularly stealing the show.

>> i was happy when i came back. i could see that he was ahead of me. i thought, wow, that schumacher ahead. and if you push really hard, you can catch him. you feel quite honored to be in a position. it is cool when you are raising them and pass them. it feels even better. >> schumacher has even been overtaken by his teammate. rumors are that schumacher was ready to throw in the towel, but he is already working on the car for next year. he does not want to give up. >> but it is a three-year plan. i would only have signed for a year from a sure i would manage it in one year. >> she marker will start next season with a better car. -- schumacher will start next season with a better car. some think he has a title chance. >> i do not know if in the long term it will be the best thing for him. he is going through tough time at the moment. i the only time will tell.

it depends on how much he personally can take. by not winning. because he has been so used to winning. >> it is a new challenge for the seven times world champion. he has had setbacks but cannot lose his drive. >> joining us now for some lowdown on this formula and one race is jefferson. one of the most exciting races ever, you think? >> you could say that. i cannot get any closer. it all comes down to the very last race of the season. and you have not two, not three, but four drivers it theoretically could win it. i think that is not accidental this year. it is down to a rules change to the put in at the start of this season. they made it worth the drivers while to win races. last season, if you want to raise, you get 10 points, the second guy got eight. this season, it is 25 vs 18.

it is giving drivers incentives to push for the big win in each of the individual races. now we have a barn burner to conclude this season. >> there were actually three people in this race. tell us about the mortars and why they matter. >> -- tell us about team orders and won the matter. >> the simple explanation is one driver being nominated the lead driver for their team. for instance, driver number two could be ahead in the race, and he lets his teammates passed. that is not actually legal and formula one, but it goes on all the time. that has been controversial. it is going to probably play a role in this race for the following reason. alonso is clearly the number one driver. his teammate will be doing everything in his power to help his number one driver. the other team, red bull, they have two guys who could win the overall title. webber and sebastian vettel.

rebels as they do not believe in team orders in the should both go for the win. they might change that depending on how it goes. no one knows. you would think that would be an advantage for alonso. but it may not be because he does not really know because concentrate on. you cannot say that this guy is his main rival. so i think it will be a fascinating race on sunday. >> who is going to win? >> i wish i call that the octopus. but unfortunately he has passed on. it is difficult to predict right now. the woods and watch what happens in qualifieying on saturday. if one of the drivers gets the pole position, i think he is the favor. in picking webber. >> pole position is very important. >> watch on saturday as well. that has been our "in depth" for today. stay with us for the latest news

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>> hinojosa: her studies in identity, inequality, and exclusion challenge how we see race in america. princeton professor, author, and political analyst melissa harris-lacewell. i'm maria hinojosa, this is one on one. melissa harris-lacewell, it's so good to have you on the show! >> it is incredibly wonderful to be here. >> hinojosa: so your book, barbershops, bibles, bet, is kind of a very important book in terms of understanding african- american political thought and formation in this country, but

you have said that you have moved on from that book. >> ( laughing ) yeah. >> hinojosa: that you love what you did there, but that you kind of have moved to a place where you're looking at things now more from the perspective of an african-american feminist. so who are audience in... you know, you don't hear a lot of talk on mainstream television about african-american feminism and feminists. >> no. you know, it's so interesting to hear people respond to that first book, 2004. you know, i started that book as a dissertation, right? it was sort of a set of a set of explorations, of ideas-- me trying to figure out a lot of how i thought the world worked in terms of race and politics-- but very much informed not only by my academic scholarship, but by, you know, a particular formulation that came from my life experiences. so you know, i'm the child of a sort of freedom fighting african-american first generation college professor, and in many ways, it was my

father's voice, my father's experiences that helped to frame my understanding about what race in america is. now, coming into adulthood and into true adult scholarship and into thinking of myself as... >> hinojosa: because that was baby scholarship? >> yeah, well, i mean, it was... >> hinojosa: ( laughing ) >> ...i think it, you know, that early stuff is still... when people claim to be writing objectively, i really believe all professors are always writing books about themselves, if you look carefully enough. so for me, as i started working at the university of chicago-- i spent seven years there as an assistant professor... >> hinojosa: heady place. >> an amazing, intense, exhausting place. but i was very lucky to have these amazing colleagues-- michael dawson and cathy cohen. and particularly cathy cohen who is an african-american woman, she's a lesbian, she's a feminist, and every day, she asked me questions that were much harder than any questions i'd ever been asked before around not just race in politics, but race, gender,

sexual identity, class. she and my students and others around me really pushed me to think in different ways, so that... >> hinojosa: so what was one of those questions where you thought you had it all pat, and then all of a sudden she poses a question to you and you're stumped? what kind of a question? >> so i mean, this is a silly example, but i'd written an introduction that in part included a reference to the cosby show, and saying that "in the 1980s, so many of us who were growing up related to one of the characters in the cosby show." you either thought of yourself as denise or vanessa or rudy. and she says, "you know, melissa, if you're black and queer, you didn't actually relate to any of them." you know, if you're black and lesbian or black and gay, then your experience of the cosby show is still one that marginalized your experience as a black person. i went, "oh, well, yeah; i hadn't really thought about that." in other words, always asking me not only to think about how my personal experience was

reflective of broader racial ideas, but how my personal experience was also privileged. how i missed all sorts of other identities by looking through a single sort of racialized lense. >> hinojosa: but you were... all of your work, at least up until that point, had been kind of looking at the world through this prism of "the other"... >> mm-hmm. >> hinojosa: ...right? even though your mom is white and your dad is african-american, you identify as an african-american woman, but you've always had this kind of prism of looking at things through "the other," and it was almost as if they're saying, "there's a whole other 'otherness' that you need to understand." >> that's right-- secondary marginalization. and so for me, it wasn't that i wasn't a black feminist, it's that i didn't quite know what that meant for my research, and so over those years, as i developed as a teacher and as a researcher, i discovered that for me, black feminism is simply asking the same question over and over again-- of myself and of my students and of my work. and that question is: "what

truths are missing here?" so even if you're telling something that's mostly true, there's always some other truth that is missing, some other story that's not being told, some other question that's not being asked. and so it becomes not just about making sure that women's voices are there or making sure that not only heteronormative but also queer experiences are there-- it's about asking every, single time, "who's story isn't being told? what truth isn't being revealed?" and it's... i find it very challenging, and i'm certainly not up to it all the time, and none of us can write... >> hinojosa: ( laughing ) that's a challenge! >> ...the perfect work, but that's the challenge, yeah. >> hinojosa: so what happens to you as an african-american woman our country-- we'll get to president obama in a minute-- but michelle. i mean, that notion that michelle obama, at one point, was one of the most disliked african-american women out there... >> mm-hmm. >> hinojosa: ...because

apparently, she may have had a moment of questioning herself, her identity, her relationship to the country, and now michelle obama is a star-- a bigger star, even, than barack obama. ( laughing ) what's going... >> well again, i spent seven years in hyde park, so i'm not that surprised to discover that michelle obama might... >> hinojosa: okay, hyde park, south side of chicago where barack obama and his family lived up until they moved to the white house. it's where you lived for seven years. it's where i actually spent, you know, 20 years of my life growing up. >> that's right, that's right. >> hinojosa: strange little place, but hyde park and michelle obama because... >> so michelle obama was working at the university of chicago during my years there. she was a fixture in the neighborhood. barack obama was my state senator. he was my senator. he was my neighbor just around the corner at a condominium complex. you know, i'd see him running at the... actually, he'd lap me running at the lake, because i run very, very slowly. it's much more like a walk with my arms bent.

so in many ways, i think those of us who weren't intimate friends of the obamas but were sort of just in the orbit often saw michelle as at least equally the star if not more the star. she has a kind of graciousness and a bigness of her personality that never... it never overwhelms the people with whom she's in the room, but it's there. you want to be with her. you want to be near her. i always found barack obama slightly more off-putting than michelle. michelle was attractive in a deep way. so the most surprising thing for me was this woman with whom i related so closely as a mother, as a professional woman, as an african-american, that she could be reviled was very painful to me during the election. that new yorker cover that represented her as some sort of outsider; as some sort of american-hating terrorist, even if it was satirical... >> hinojosa: she was carrying a

submachine gun, right? >> yes, yes. >> hinojosa: and that's our first lady. >> that's right. she was not... she not yet our first lady, but it was such a bazaar representation, i mean... >> hinojosa: what did you... you know, when you say it was painful for you, tell me what that looks like. you know, people have this idea, "well, you know, she's a princeton professor, she's an author, she's published," you know? "eh, pain." >> right. ( laughing ) that's right. >> hinojosa: what did that feel like, when... you know, deep inside, what did that feel like? >> well, so i think it's probably best expressed by du bois himself who talks about the notion of "double consciousness"-- to be black and to be american; to have the two warring selves in one dark body. and i think that's almost such a normal part of being black in america. to love your country, to be of your country, to want nothing but the best for your country, and simultaneously to feel rejected by your nation, to feel unrecognized by your nation. that misrecognition of michelle, that fact that people could look at her and see something so dramatically different suggested

that who knows what people saw when i walked through the world-- or when my daughter who's seven years old walks through the world? do they also see us as little budding, frightening militants who hate our nation? it's... it's just a sense of wanting to be seen for who you are and then experiencing the sense that if this woman is not seen, you probably aren't very well recognized, either. >> hinojosa: and that means feeling, essentially, okay, but you know, like unloved... >> yeah. >> hinojosa: ...in your own country. it's deep. >> it is, and it... you know, it's... it doesn't mean that i don't have all of these privileges of being a princeton professor, of you know, owning a home-- and in fact, really no one cares how you feel in a very important way-- but what i do think is critical is the extent to which that sense of double consciousness leads many african- americans, and not just african-americans but many sort of "outsiders within," to feel as though we are on the margins of our own national story.

in the context, for example, of hurricane katrina and the aftermath, we know that black and white americans were both very upset about what happened, but white americans primarily saw what happened as a kind of bureaucratic failure-- a failure of the government to respond. african-americans for the most part saw the failures after hurricane katrina as racialized. they believed that their country had not come for them because they were black. now, whether that's true or not is less important than the fact that you have whole populations of citizens... >> hinojosa: who could actually... who could actually feel that way. >> ...who believed that their country would allow them to starve and die on television simply because of their race. that is the thing that needs healing. and it was difficult to watch that kind of rejection of michelle. >> hinojosa: so now, where michelle is kind of the... you know, we are... and you sometimes write, you say, "you know, when i'm having a bad day, i think about michelle, and boy, it's got to be worse for her!" but i'm thinking about, "well, how's michelle doing today?

what is she doing?" you know, i'm really glad she's got a lot of support in that household-- because she does, lucky her; we all wish we did-- but you know, how is she handling it? and i do often think, "it's got to be rough." >> yup. >> hinojosa: it's got to be rough for her. >> you know, i'll say that... so the acceptance-- the coming to love and find michelle obama as iconic-- in one part helps to heal that anxiety i was talking about, but if we go back to cathy cohen's push, it's also to say, "okay, so the acceptance of michelle obama still ends up marginalizing other folks." so my mother, who's retired and lives in the home with me and helps raise my daughter, loves the obama family mostly because mama robinson is part of the obama family, and she was like, "yes, they have a grammy, too," right? >> hinojosa: who's living with them, yes! >> who's living with them; who's helping. she was like, "i could give her all kinds of advice." that said... and so she goes, "we're just like the obamas." and then i say, "well, mom, no we're not, because i'm a single parent. so we're just like the obamas, but we're not."

so there's this way that as wonderful as it is-- this acceptance of the obama girls, this acceptance of michelle-- it still has the impact of marginalizing, for example, the fact that a majority of african-american children are being raised by... in households like mine, where you may have intergenerational women, but where you don't have a present father. it is still true that, for example, gay and lesbian families don't have the same kind of social recognition. so if you're a michelle obama but you're in a lesbian household, does the acceptance of the kind of heteronormative, you know, traditional picture of the obamas, does that, you know, kind of continue on and lead to a broader acceptance? i don't know. and i'm certainly, you know, a little distressed that at the same time that we have michelle obama, we have precious. >> hinojosa: and you're concerned about it because... i mean, that movie-- i haven't seen the movie, i read the book when it came out a long time ago-- is so incredibly painful. do you... what's the issue there

for you? are you uncomfortable with the fact that it's so out there? are you uncomfortable with the fact that the conversations that are happening after the movie... we don't know what those conversations are like? what... >> well, i believe in the relative autonomy of art, so i think grotesque is fine; i think that over the top is fine; pushing, you know, the edges on a piece of fiction. what does concern me is the sense that there is a kind of... i mean, the mother in that film and in that book is so extraordinarily horrible, and she also represents a sort of remembrance of this 1980s welfare queen who abused the state as well as abusing her children. so her resurgence, her reinterpretation-- although i think mo'nique does an amazing job as an artist performing her-- i do think there's something about sort of america's need to simultaneously have the obamas and to have this grotesque image of a black mother; of a poor, single, abusive black mother sitting

next to each other. and it's okay; it's part of the tension... >> hinojosa: but the fact that it's always got to be kind of at the same time. >> i do worry about that. >> hinojosa: you... your next book is called for colored girls who... >> ...who've considered politics when being strong wasn't enough. >> hinojosa: and you write about the sadness and the loneliness that exists for african-american women in politics. it's a very specific kind of topic. it's not like a lot of people are walking around thinking, "hmm, i wonder how african-american women who get involved in the political system, whether or not they're feeling sad." >> yeah, well again, remember what i said: i think professors are always writing books about themselves. >> hinojosa: so does that mean that you want to run for office? >> oh, gosh, no, although, you know, my partner is in fact running for office, and so i am... >> hinojosa: in the city of new orleans. >> in the city of new orleans he's running for mayor, and so i'm, you know, intimately involved in a campaign in a way that i never have been before. >> hinojosa: but you're also a big critic. you're a big political critic. this is what you do when you're on the cable news shows talking.

you are... and i find it very interesting that you're like, "yup, and i'm going to marry a man who's trying to run for mayor in new orleans" of all places! >> ( laughing ) >> hinojosa: that you would kind of believe... i mean, you have a profound belief in the electoral system, then... >> i do... >> hinojosa: ...in straight party politics, even though you very openly call yourself a person on the left. >> yeah, i'm definitely a lefty, i'm definitely a progressive, but i'm also someone who, when i teach the declaration of independence, i stand up on the table. i stand on the desk because those lines by the slaveholding thomas jefferson, and yet he doesn't write a slaveholding document, right? he writes that it is self evident that all humans are created equal "and endowed by their creator with certain inalianable rights, and among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." so i believe that our ideals can be bigger than the limitations of who we are practicing our politics. so as much as i am a critic and i will stay a critic-- including of my dear james' administration

if he is to win... >> hinojosa: oh, i'm going to see some sparks flying there! >> ( laughing ) but that's... i think that's part of how we love our country. we love it in part by representing, again, this question: "what truths are missing?" for me, this new book about black womens' emotions in the context of politics is, in part, a book about trying to answer that question. african-american women are often called the "backbone" of the black community, and of course that is important, because they are both in the back, and although sturdy for everyone else, i worry about how black women's political work is too often on behalf of everyone else, not frequently enough on behalf of themselves. >> hinojosa: and so what... what should be the primary struggle of african-american women in politics now? what should it be? >> well, i mean... so again, people have to set their own agenda, but i do wish that we would be equally concerned with the future of our daughters as we are with this particular

construct of the endangered black male. a lot of african-american women that i speak to talk about losing black men, the loss of black male patriarchy, and although i'm of course concerned about our sons and about their future, i also think that in doing that, we miss the victimization and the marginalization of black women. we talk about crime and incarceration as though it's just a black man's problem when black women are the fastest-growing population of newly incarcerated people. we don't talk about hiv/aids, and its impact in particularly young, african-american women's lives. the leading cause of death for african-american women under the age of 35-- hiv/aids infections. so these sorts of blindnesses to the very experiences that women are themselves having at the moment that they're having it-- because they're so engaged in politics on behalf of everyone else-- i think is the problem. we have to be sure we are on our own agenda. >> hinojosa: you have a really

fascinating life story, and when you read it, you're almost like, "how did that happen?" so your dad's family can trace their roots back to slavery. >> yes. >> hinojosa: your mom was raised as a mormon... >> yes. >> hinojosa: ...which is a religion that, up until the year 1979, did not allow any african-american members of that church. so growing up, how does this happen? and actually, is it so strange? i mean, actually, is that kind of stuff happening a lot and we just don't necessarily see it? >> i mean, it's part of what was fun about watching obama run is he kept telling his story, and i was like, "oh, man; you've got nothing on me!" >> hinojosa: ( laughing ) >> "you should hear my story!" but that's true. my mother's people were mormon pioneers who pushed a handcart across the american west, settled in utah and in the west, and my mother went to brigham young university while my father was contemporaneous with stokely carmichael at howard university. and the two of them met, of course, in graduate school,

which is the place where these sorts of things happen. >> hinojosa: oh, for graduate school! >> oh, for graduate school! so and i'm the youngest of five children in an interracial family where some of my siblings have two black parents and some of my siblings have two white parents. and we grew up in the american south in virginia my parents raised this family, and so... in the context, also, of divorce. so it was quite a challenge, and yet what i'll tell you is that the next generation of kids-- my kids, my sister's kids-- they all know each other and love each other, and they are latino and they are white and they are black, and we spend family vacations together, and we have each and every one of us learned from the other. so my white sister who marries a latino man and has latino children and raises them in california is affected by having had black siblings. and my african-american siblings are impacted by having had an interracial little sister. and those things are part of what, you know, really is our american story.

>> hinojosa: well, so is there-- and this term is thrown around a lot, "post racial" america-- so is it ultimately going to happen or take baby steps forward because of the fact that we elected a man who is both african-american and white, but as a black man? or is it going to happen because of these kind of family relationships, where it's like, well, it's great that obama's there, but really what's going to change is the fact that in so much of the united states a "traditional" notion of what a family is-- whether it's, you know, heterosexual or whether it's a mixed couple-- it's all changing? >> well, i see the election of barack obama as the culmination of racial changes in america, not the inauguration of racial changes in america. our ability to elect him president-- our ability to form a multiracial coalition during an economic downturn that brings in an african-american president-- is because of the struggles and work and change

that had occurred over those past 40 years. it was in part because white voters had african-american grandchildren and latino nieces. and i mean, heck, the bush family is more complicated, i think, than we like to tell, right? >> hinojosa: ( laughing ) >> so in part, it happens because those family formations had already occurred. it's not that by being president, barack changes, you know, where we are in america. so part of it is... are those kinds of, you know, long-term, secular changes. but the other part of it is will. it won't just happen because time passes. we have to decide that we believe racism and racial inequality to be incommensurate with our self-identity as americans. and see, for most of our history, racism, imperialism, is not only in line with, it is constitutive of being an american. to be an american is to be a conqueror-- to go west over people who already exist. what we have to do is say, "no, no, no. to be american is to shed that

sort of imperialist notion; to shed our understanding of ourselves as enslavers; to embrace a new kind of american conception." and so that is about will, and so it's not just time and the making new, little, brown babies. >> hinojosa: it's a consciousness. >> it's also about consciousness. >> hinojosa: so what happens in terms of the consciousness of african-americans and latinos as we figure out now as the latino population becomes-- and i really dislike this term-- the "largest minority"... >> ( laughing ) yeah, right! >> hinojosa: ...because that's a term... i don't use that term with my family-- "minority," out the window. what do you see african-americans and latinos? to me this is one of the crucial next relationships that need to be worked out. >> yeah. >> hinojosa: what do you see? >> well, so i see many challenges. you know, one of the challenges that african-american populations will have to realize is that for all of the disadvantages that african-americans have faced and continue to face, we have, also, certain privileges and advantages relative to the electoral political realm.

there simply are more black mayors; there simply are more black representatives in the u.s. house; there... depending on how you measure the senate, there have been more black senators, and now there's been a black president. which means that we will have to not always think of ourselves as the outsiders, but sometimes as the insiders who are controlling the access, and we'll have to necessarily shed out own privileges in ways that we have often asked white americans to do. >> hinojosa: do you think that there is that kind of conscious understanding of "we have privilege and we have to share"? >> oh, no, because i think at this point, the focus group is still always white americans who have just vastly more resources and privileges, that it feels as though what we're doing is simply competing. you know, that there's just one piece of pie for all the blacks and browns, and all the blacks and browns must compete for that piece of pie. and what we have to recognize is, one, that the pie, like love, can grow. it is expansive; we can... >> hinojosa: oh, i lov "the pie, like love, can grow." ( laughing ) >> ( laughing ) well, it can grow! there's not some sort of limit

on what's possible, and so we can... we can, in fact, i think, set a new standard for how political coalitions will form. i think the other thing is to be more relaxed. you know, coalitions need not form up to be perfectly and always sustainable. we can form momentary coalitions around a particular candidate; we can get together around some political issues and not as others. it is okay to both be competitors and in solidarity. >> hinojosa: but you've got a segment of the population right now that is really, at least in some cases, pointing a picture towards the latino immigrant as the source of all of the problems that we are all facing in this country. and especially if you are a low-skilled african-american worker, this person-- this undocumented, usually mexican or other latino immigrant-- is your enemy. >> i mean, this is... again, my beloved city of new orleans-- in the days following katrina, these questions of work and the

capacity particularly for manual labor, for low skilled labor, and for rebuilding the city brought up exactly these anxieties around undocumented workers, and the easiness of sort of resting on citizenship to say, "well, i'm an american here, i'm black, i'm an american, i've been here, i am a citizen, you are not, and therefore i deserve to be in this public space, and you don't." but to do that is to miss that black citizenship has always been contingent and second class and that precisely those sorts of arguments have been used against african-americans. so it is a two-way street, but again, i'll say the point is to recognize that as full sort of participants in the public sphere, that it is okay to both disagree and to have solidarity. that in a democracy, the point is simply to not always be a loser in a winner take all society. it is okay to lose sometimes and to win sometimes; it's just that it can't be that your identity alone defines you as always a

loser in the political realm. >> hinojosa: thank you for sharing all that. melissa harris-lacewell, thank you so much. >> it was great to be here. >> hinojosa: thank you. continue the conversation at wgbh.org/oneonone. captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org 4