02/25/16 02/25/16 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica, this is democracy now! >> this man, i like this guy. >> i have from white plains. we have a problem in this country. it is called muslims. we know our current president is one. you know he is not even an american. have training camps where they want to kill us. when can we get rid of them? amy: of three straight victories, frontrunner donald trump heads into tonight's final republican debate ahead of next week's super tuesday primary, we look at a new report by the southern poverty law center called, "the year in hate and

extremism." it's cover features donald trump in front of a microphone. the nestle government continues to take a bite out of apple, apple ceo tim cook says the fbi's request to unlock the iphone of one of the san theadino shooters is software equivalent of cancer. >> this case is about the future. what is at stake here and can the government compel apple to write software if we believe it would make hundreds of millions of customers vulnerable around the world, including u.s.? we will speak with barry eisler who works in covert operations, now rights and alert. we speak with anna therese day in an exclusive interview, one of four u.s. journalist who were detained by the u.s. backed state of bahrain.

she of her camera crew were in bahrain during protest marking the anniversary of the kingdom's february 2 111 uprising. >> of course we are delighted and relieved and grateful to be out of bahrain custody, but it could not be a more stark reminder of the privileges we have operating as western journalists in these countries while our bahraini colleagues suffer and rot in jail. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. at least seven people have died as more than 50 tornadoes swept across parts of the south and eastern united states over the last two days. the extreme weather destroyed hundreds of homes and forced the closure of schools and government offices. at least four people have died in virginia, including a two-year-old boy. virginia governor terry mcauliffe has declared a state of emergency. scientists have linked an increase in the intensity and deadliness of tornadoes to climate change.

new government documents show the number of private contractors hired by the pentagon in iraq has increased eightfold over the past year. there are currently more than private contractors working for 2000 the pentagon in iraq, up from only 250 private contractors last year. this comes as the pentagon has also increased the number of u.s. troops in iraq, up to 3700 soldiers. a new report by two israeli human rights groups accuses the israeli shin bet security agency of abusing and torturing dozens of palestinian prisoners at the shikma interrogation facility. the report issued by the groups b'tselem and hamoked, concluded palestinian users are exposed to extreme heat or cold, deprived of sleep, denied sufficient food . saying -- "the combination of conditions both in and outside the interrogation room constitutes abuse and inhuman, degrading treatment, at times even amounting to torture."

this comes as two u.s.-based groups have taken out a full-page ad in the "los angeles times" urging oscar nominees to skip a trip to israel, which is being offered as part of an awards gift bag. the gift bag is being handed out by a marketing firm and is not affiliated with the academy of motion picture arts and sciences. organizers say they are calling on oscar-nominated directors and actors to skip the 10-day free trip because of israel's continued occupation of palestinian territories. the trip is partially funded by the israeli government. in news from the campaign trail, the five remaining republican presidential candidates, real estate billionaire donald trump, texas senator ted cruz, florida senator marco rubio, neurosurgeon ben carson, and ohio governor john kasich, will face off in houston for the last debate before super tuesday. donald trump has won three of the four primaries and caucuses to date. on tuesday, 11 states and the territory american samoa will

hold primary contests. meanwhile, a black lives matter activist interrupted democratic presidential candidate hillary clinton during a private fundraiser event wednesday night in charleston, south carolina. during the event, ashley williams held a banner reading, "we have to bring them to heel," a reference to controversial statements clinton made in 1996 about some youth, whom she called "super-predators." williams then confronted clinton, saying, "i am not a super predator." >> i am not a super predator. apologize to black people for mass incarceration? >> there are a lot of issues in this campaign -- >> i know you called blacks super predators in 1994. please explain it to us. you owe it to us, and apology. >> if you would give me a chance

to talk. evernow what? nobody has asked me before. you're the first person asked the and i'm happy to address this but you are the first person to ask me. back to the issue. amy: that was black lives matter activist ashley williams, confronting hillary clinton at a private fundraiser on wednesday night. she was then escorted away. williams says a friend contributed $500 so she could attend the private event. president obama is reportedly considering nevada republican governor brian sandoval as a potential supreme court nominee following the death of justice antonin scalia. this comes as republicans continue to say they will not consider any nominations put forward by president obama. the turkish government has halted the construction of a new copper mine amid massive protests by residents who fear the mine would destroy the local environment. last week protesters blocked a , road to prevent construction trucks from accessing the mine site.

on wednesday, the turkish prime minister said the construction of the mine was on hold pending a court decision. a new united nations report says all sides in the libyan conflict are likely guilty of war crimes, including torture, rape and the execution of prisoners. this comes as the italian government has quietly begun allowing the u.s. military to use an air base on sicily to launch drones for military operations in libya and across north africa. u.s. officials say the use of the base is only for defensive operations, although it is seeking permission to also use the base for offensive operations, such as the strike last friday, which killed about 50 people, including two serbian hostages. bolivian president evo morales has acknowledged defeat in a referendum that would have allowed him a fourth term. morales' current term ends in 2020. the referendum would have allowed him to remain in power until 2025. on wednesday, resident oscar solis celebrated the results of the referendum. >> we are very happy for this

day of victory. we think the bolivian people because we have said no to corruption, no to the traffic of influences, note to the lies. the people don't want our state political constitution to change. the people want new leaders. amy: in mexico, president enrique peña nieto has visited the city of iguala for the first time since 43 students disappeared from the city after being attacked by local police more than one year ago. during the visit, president pena nieto avoided meeting with the families of the disappeared students, and he made only passing reference to their disappearance during a military ceremony wednesday. the visit comes only days after a team of independent investigators held a news conference criticizing for continuing to block the recording to the student's disappearance. investigator claudia paz y paz said the team was looking into the link between the students' disappearance with drug trafficking routes between iguala and chicago. >> for us, it is fundamental to

deep in the line of investigation of the transfer of heroin from iguala to chicago. it is advanced that we believe it is necessary to continue with all of the tasks that we have proposed within this line to clarify the events. amy:he is the former attorney general of guatemala. and in south korea, organizers held a "ghost rally" to protest crackdowns on freedom of speech and the right to assembly. on wednesday, members of amnesty international korea projected holographic images of protesters holding signs and carrying flowers onto a screen in a public square in central seoul. it was the first holographic protest in south korea. police are reportedly trying to decide whether the ghost rally viated the law, and if so who , to punish. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from

around the country and around the world. tonight, four republican presidential contenders will face off in houston during the final debate ahead of next week's super tuesday primary, when delegates in texas and 10 other states, along with american samoa, will be at stake. this comes as billionaire businessman donald trump easily won the nevada caucus tuesday night, capturing 46% of the vote in his third consecutive victory. trump thanked supporters during a victory speech in nevada. >> so we won the available goals, we won with young, we the old, we won with the educated, we won with the poorly educated. i love the uneducated. you know what i really am happy about because i've been saying a prolonged time, 46% with the hispanics list of 46%. number one with hispanics.

i am really happy about that. >> trump! bemeen: donald trump will one of five candidates who face off in tonight's debate. donald trump is featured in a new report just published by the southern poverty law center called "the year in hate and , extremism." its cover includes an image of trump in front of a microphone. the report details how the number of hate groups rose 14% last year, bringing the total number of hate groups in the u.s. to nearly 900. it found the number of klu klux klan groups more than doubled. it also documented 34 anti-muslim hate groups, and 48 anti-lgbtq hate groups. amy: the southern poverty law center points to the presidential election cycle as one of the primary reasons for the rising number of hate groups across the u.s., saying last year was marked by a level of hate speech in mainstream

politics not seen in decades. it notes -- "donald trump's demonizing statements about latinos and muslims have electrified the radical right, leading to glowing endorsements from white nationalist leaders such as jared taylor and former klansman david duke. white supremacist forums are awash with electoral joy, having dubbed trump their glorious leader. the investigation discovery network will premiere a series titled, "hate in america" based on the work of the southern poverty law center this monday, february 29. well, for more, we're joined now by the center's president, richard cohen. welcome back to democracy now! it is great to have you in our studio, on our 20 the anniversary. talk about the report. the picture right here with the major face on the cover, donald trump in front of a microphone. >> i'm not sure mr. trump would object to being center stage. he never seems to. .nd it is been an unusual time

usually in the white suppressed world, the attitude is -- the system is credibly corrupt. this time, as you said, people are very excited about trump. they call him the glorious leader. it is all about immigration. the raincoat who says that? >> people like jerry taylor. is a longtime white nationalist. most recently he came into the public mind because he served as the spokesperson for the council of conservative citizens. that was the hate group whose kool-aid dylann roof drank when he was radicalized. onhas been a real fixture the white supremacist scene and a very influential one. nermeen: could you talk about some of the main findings of the report? >> first, we saw number of increase of hate groups going from about 800 to 900. we also saw a similar increase of 14% to about 1000 of these

radical antigovernment groups, the people who believe there are fema camp so waiting is, that people are trying to make us into the new world order. secondly, we saw a really incredible level of violence last year. what was the massacre in charleston most well-known, but really, scores of events, some quite deadly. and lastly, the mainstreaming of hate in a political campaign and by pundits on the airwaves. amy: what about the media's role, richard? >> the media amplifies the hate that is out there. every time donald trump starts talking about rapists from mexico and whatnot, it is blasted all over the air. it courses our society. it makes it almost acceptable to talk that way. nermeen: and you say in the report that the radical right has shifted its principal base to the internet.

why is that important? if yoused to be the case wanted to get your fill of hate, you would go to a klan rally or cross burning. nowadays you can do it from your home and it is easier and you have the benefit of anonymity. we have seen during president obama's administration, a tremendous increase in the number of persons who were online haters. storm front, the most important online form for hate members, has grown by 100% since obama has been in office. these are 300,000 people who don't just visit millions -- millions visit, but 300,000 people who have signed up for posting privileges so they can spew their venom daily. amy: you talk about terrorist plots, and radical proliferating. we're not talking about isis. explain exactly what we're talking about. >> we did a report and it showed

there was a terrorist attack were domestic incident, domestic terrorism about once every 34 days over the last five years. some of these attacks are well-known, like the massacre in charleston. amy: at the emmanuel church. >> the killings in planned parenthood. i don't think people get a sense -- amy: in colorado springs. >> of how common these things are. nermeen: some have criticized the methodology used in the splc report. vanderbilt university political science professor carol swain has argued that the splc is too all-encompassing, saying they -- "paint with a very broad brush and in the process they tend to sweep up people that are politically conservative. i think they do it in a very harmful way and they abuse their power as an organization." she goes on to say -- "these are individuals that are

conservatives, they're just traditional conservatives, but because of their position on lgbt issues the southern poverty law center finds ways to malign these individuals or their organizations." richard cohen, your response? >> our methodology is well known. we call groups hate groups when they vilify entire groups of people because of their immutable characteristics. focus on the family is very conservative christian organization, and we thoroughly don't call them a hate group. we would call groups that spread demonizing lies about the lgbt community, lies such as pedophilia is a problem for the gay community or american family association saying gay people brought us the holocaust and like rabbits. when we say things like that, i think you deserve the moniker of a hate group.

beenen: rp says there's 14% increase in hate groups in 2015. the report also indicates that is probably an underestimation. could you explain? >> are methods of detecting hate groups are not full proof and we certainly -- there is obvioly an undercount. it does not take into account the hundreds of thousands of people who are not formally affiliated with hate groups, but have hate in their hearts. it is just one indicator of the level of rage, the level of vitriol that exists in the country. amy: last year donald trump , faced criticism after a town hall in new hampshire when during a q&a one of his supporters stood up and said president obama is a muslim and not even an american, and asked when the united states could get rid of muslims. >> ok, this man. i like this guy. >>-white plains. amen. we have a problem in this

country. it is called muslims. we know our current president is one. you know he is not even american. >> we need the question. >> but anyway, we have training want toowing were they kill us. that is my question. when can we get rid of them? >> we're going to be looking at a lot of different things. a lot of people are saying that and saying that bad things are happening. we're one to be looking at that a plenty of other things. amy: your response to what donald trump said in his meeting -- townhall? >> i'm not surprised by this supporter who stood up. over 60% of the people who support from believe president obama is a secret muslim and was not one in this country. none of that surprises me. what we're hearing on the campaign trail, what is leading to the increase in the number of secrets in our country is the changing demographics of our country. it is changing rapidly. i think many white people feel like the tide is turning against

them. so we have a reaction to that. we see the reaction, the vilification of muslims. we see the reaction in the vilification of hispanics, a generation ago it was the southern strategy. now it is different people are targeted. amy: how does oregon fit into this? the standoff that ended with the death of the spokesperson and the others in jail? >> i think what really fits into it is what happened on cliven bundy's ranch. he refuses to pay his grazing fees, does not pay fines. they point guns at federal officials. and nothing happens. as a result, the antigovernment patriot organization group grows tremendously and are embolden. then they show up in oregon and take up that -- over that compound. the arrested cliven bundy, but they could have arrested him the day after the standoff in nevada. i think it was the failure of the federal officials to move more quickly originally that led

to the explosion and antigovernment groups and led to the situation in oregon. nermeen: what are some of the other factors? the report talks about how many americans are now antigovernment. what do you think accounts for this growth in suspicion of the government in addition to what you pointed out? do you think having the first, for example, african american president has contributed to that? absolutelythat is right. we assume this tremendous increase in the number of antigovernment groups during president obama's tenure. there was a big increase during the time of bill clinton and it went down during which bush plus presidency, and now shut up again under president obama's tenure. there is this changing demographics makes people less trustful of the efficacy of collective action. kind of a well-known social logical fact. of course, the vehicle of collective action in our country, perhaps the most

important vehicle, is the government itself. people have lost confidence in institutions. amy: and the collapse of the economy for many, not for all. >> white working class people, their prospects are not nearly as they were generation ago. ofre's a tremendous amount angst and anger. amy: on monday, investigation discovery will air a new documentary series called, "hate in america: klan on trial." it recounts the story of michael donald, the victim of brutal alabama, in the early 1980's. the splc took the case and helped bring down the united klans of america. this is the trailer for the series. murder hatred leads to -- >> why did they do that? >> something needs to be done. >> i would like to bring the united klan to justice. >> the heroes who overcame the hate. >> the woman who beat the klan. >> and found a way to fight for justice.

onte in america, the klan trial." amy: as we wrap up, richard cohen, what are you hoping will come out of this series you are doing? >> we're trying to shine a light on the reality of hate in america. some people don't turn their backs, people don't become apathetic, and people decide or try to build bridges across the racial divide, crosby ethnic divide. -- across the they divide. we're a better country than what makes america great is not building walls, the building bridges. amy: when donald trump retweets of what the premises, what is the problem when he says, i don't know the background, i just like what they said. >> one of the things he said was #whitegenocide. i don't know how you can claim ignorance when the hashtag is #whitegenocide. having to do with what people

under attack, people like dylann roof and other killers who have bought into that will stop and of striking out -- it is crazy to say he did not know what that meant. amy: richard cohen, thank you for being with us, just released the annual report "the year in , hate and extremism." the cover features donald trump in front of a microphone. the id network, investigation discovery, will be premiering a series titled, "hate in america," based on the work of the southern poverty law center on monday, february 29, at 8:00 p.m. eastern. fbi triesme back, the to take a bite out of apple. we will talk with a former covert cia operative who is now a thriller writer. his latest book is, "because i view." "the god's i stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. we turn now to the ongoing dispute over privacy and encryption between the fbi and the computer giant apple. in an interview last night on abc, apple ceo tim cook explained why his company is resisting a court order to help

unlock the iphone of one of the san bernardino attackers. in december, syed rizwan farook and his wi killed 14 people and injured 22 others. the two attackers were killed in a shootout with police. cook said what the u.s. government was asking apple to do was the "software equivalent of cancer." mythis case is not about phone. this case is about the future. what is at stake here is, can the government can help apple to write software that we believe would make hundreds of millions of customers vulnerable around the world, including -- the only way we know is to write a piece of software we view as the software equivalent of cancer. we think it is bad news to write. we would never write it. we have never written it. that is what is at stake here. amy: the fbi says apple is overstating the security risk to its devices, and argues the

litigation is limited. in an open letter earlier this week, fbi director james comey wrote -- "the particular legal issue is actually quite narrow. we don't want to break anyone's encryption or set a master key loose on the land." apple phone systems have a function that automatically erases the access key and renders the phone permanently inaccessible after 10 failed attempts. to talk more about the case, we're joined by barry eisler, who has written about government surveillance -- in fictional form. he is also a former cia agent. eisler is the author of several books, most recently, "the god's eye view." it is great to have you with us. about what the government is doing and the pushback of apple. like tim cook metaphor. it discusses the someone hitting back and was strictly this way. you would expect the fbi to say what it is saying, does only

about one phone. this is the kind of thing the government always does and i am reminded the time the cia acknowledged it had made torture tapes. 15 months later, they acknowledged it was 92. in this case, the government says it is going to be about only one phone and then they said, action, we're talking about 12. if you talk to any encryption or security expert, they will tell you what the fbi's asking for is impossible. you cannot create a back door for one phone without making all phones vulnerable. that is one important issue. there's another one i think that is not adequately understood. there is julian sanchez, a guy followed closely because he knows a lot about these things that works with the cato institute, put it, this just isn't about encryption, it is about conscription. i wish people would understand this a little better. it is unprecedented for the government to be telling a private company what products they can create, what features it has to include in those products. as tim cook pointed out, where does this?

what if the government said, we won a feature on the iphone that enables the fbi to turn on the iphone camera, to turn on the microphone anytime we want, without also be ok? i hope this isn't going to happen. it is sort of odd have to be championing the world's richest corporation in its fight with the government. amy: they are asking the apple to write a program, which would then create a backdoor. >> exactly. and it won't be unique to this one phone. it would be something the government could use against any phone. even if you think the u.s. government, it's ok for the government to be able to break the encryption of anybody's phone, even if you trust the us government and think the u.s. government has never liked anyone, never abused its powers, if you believe anything like that, what backdoor is accessible to the u.s. government is also excel -- accessible to whatever is the american enemy does your. could be the chinese government,

russia, iran. not just eight actors, but also criminal groups and hackers. for ability and a phone is not accessible to just one actor. and but he killed 14 people they just want access to see if there's other plans. i mean, who knows what would be? >> this is another thing the government is good at, they try to find the most attractive fact pattern it can to use as the thin edge of a wedge that it can then use in other less obvious fact patterns. i see this again and again. people don't remember that well, so-calledadilla, the dirty bomber, he was accused of trying to create a radiological bomb and detonate it in chicago and a lot of people were going to die. to keep us safe from that kind of thing, the government arrested him, held him on a navy ship, no due process, no charges, no trial, no access to a lawyer. it was unprecedented, but there

are careful to choose for them what was an attractive fact pattern before doing something so unprecedented. they picked a scary looking guy and accused him of doing scary things. you will did not protest they way they would have if they had chosen someone a little bit different. same thing here. they're not doing this in the name of, i don't know, preventing someone from shoplifting or something like that, they've chosen a very attractive fact pattern so they can sell the talking points you're just parroting witches, come on, this is just to keep us safe from the scary people who want to kill us all. and did kill a lot of people in san bernardino. nermeen: to what extent do the got accounts for public opinion? a recent piece at your poll found 51% of americans think apple should comply with the fbi and unlock the iphone of one of the perpetrators of the attacks, and only 38% said the fbi should not and the rest had no opinion.

>> which is not a bad response to anyone who thinks apple is doing this as some sort of publicity stunt. for the moment, anyway, more people think apple should comply than think it should not. i think the fact that so many people, that 30%, think it is a really bad idea for apple to be forced to do this, is in part a tribute to the educational value of this note revelations and all the journalism that has been doped on them. i'm pretty sure, pretty sure if it had not been for snowden's revelations, the public would be focusing entirely on the keep us safe from the terrorist aspect of this whole thing, and not on the, this is going to destroy privacy. amy: apple has made the icloud available. it is not like they have not done that. there been many requests of these different phone manufacturers to get access to the icloud. the government cannot just get access to it, that to get permission, so they're making a distinction between the actual physical phone, apparently they

turned off the icloud at some point so it is what has remained on that phone since the point they turned it off. >> so the idea here is that some of your data is not accessible even by the company that creed of the product. it is on your local device. and no one else should have access to it. but you. apple has complied with the government and the government's request to turn over data to which it has access. people might like that, they might not. my own feeling is, look him as long as it is pursuant to a warrant and it is out in the open, i can live with it. the notion that now apple is going to crack encryption that its users have come to rely on to keep their data private is an entirely new thing. nermeen: i want to turn to comments made by bill gates, the cofounder of microsoft. he was asked about the ongoing dispute between apple and the fbi, and said it was important to strike a balance between privacy and government access. gates was speaking to bloomberg.

>> the extreme view the government always gets everything, nobody supports that, having the government be blind, people to support that. i do believe that with the right safeguards, there are cases where the government on our behalf, like stopping terrorism which could get worse in the future, that that is valuable. but striking that balance, clearly, the government has taken information historically and used it in ways that we did not expect, going all away back, say, to the fbi under j edgar hoover. i am hoping now we can have the discussion. i do believe there are safeguards were the government should not have to be completely blind. was bill gates speaking to bloomberg news. your response? >> it is interesting. he is so close to a pivoting. he talks about to edgar hoover, maybe knows about cointel pro.

he acknowledges the government has abused powers it has been given in the past. you think is going in a different direction, then he comes up with this platitude which iswe have to strike a balance. who doesn't think we shouldn't strike a balance? it is meaningless. there's no one who would say, "i don't think we need a balance i just think it is one of the her." maybe it is not a coincidence that microsoft is a fitting company and apple's premier one. amy: 80 technologies -- wikileaks has said that 80 tech companies in the past have cooperated with the nsa, the natial secured agency, including microsoft. >>o mu of snowden's revelations were abouts very thing. and thfa that the public knows about corporate cooperation with the government now is in part, i think, what has emboldened apple to push back. if we did not know about these things, i would expect that apple would be quite does quietly cooperating. but they realize now that there's a significant

constituency among your customers that want robust privacy features in apple products and to please those customers, apple realizes in this public battle with the fbi, it cannot justoll over and serve the fbi, otherwise it might turn into the next microsoft. nermeen: let's turn to nsa whistleblower edward snowden. in a 2013 interview with the guardian just after he revealed his identity, snowden explained why he risked his career to leak the documents. >> i think the public is owed an explanation of the motivations behind the people who make these disclosures that are outside of the democratic model. when you are subverting the power of government, that is a fundamentally dangerous thing to democracy. and if you do that in secret consistently, as the government does when it wants to benefit from a secret action that it took, it will kind of give its officials a mandate to go, hey, tell the press about this thing and that thing so the public is on our side.

but they rarely, if ever, do that when an abuse occurs. that falls to an individual citizen -- to individual citizens, but they're typically maligned. it becomes a thing of, these people against a country, against the government. but i am not. i am no different from anyone else. i don't have special skills. i am just another guy who sits there day to day in the office, watches what is happening and goes, this is something that is not our place to decide. the public needs to decide whether these programs and policies are right or wrong. i'm willing to go on the record to defend the authenticity of them and say, i did not change these. i did not modify the story. this is the truth. this is what is happening. you should decide whether we need to be doing this. nermeen: that was edward snowden speaking in 2013. barry eisler, you begin your book with edward snowden. could you talk about that decision to talk about edward snowden, and also, the title of

your book is "the god's eye view." >> like all my fiction, but especially this one, it is grounded in things happening in the world. when i first had the idea about this book, by the way, at a notion for pretty far reaching surveillance program and i thought it would make a good basis for a novel. my concern was that what i had in mind was going to be too far-reaching. because my brand has a lot to do with realism, i thought people might say, come on, barry, the government isn't really doing that. while i was working on my previous book, just thinking about the next one, i was in tokyo doing research june 2013, is when glenn greenwald and laura poitras first broke stories with the guardian based on snowden's revelations. i was immediately electrified and last, oh, my god, i was not going nearly far enough in what i had imagined. amy: what is interesting, you

are a fiction writer, but your background is cia in covert operations. lauragin this book with poitras and glenn greenwald meeting with snowden in hong kong, complete catastrophe for the intelligence agency here, welcome up in the middle of the night, what do we do? and the discussion of taking them all up, including you and mccaskill from the guardian who was with them will stop taking them out. in you do have a background reality, which is in covert operations. me if i'vee asking ever heard the government give in order to kill a journalist, the answer is no. and i do know increasingly the government equates journalism with terrorism. explicitly. and if we're using certain tools and tactics against trorists, then it makes sense those things are going to migrate to other enemies of the state, right? in fact, i think when you think about terrorist groups like isis and then power centers in

countries like america, a group like isis is nothing but upside to any political establishment figure who wants to increase his or her budget or up fear among the public so the politician can gain more power and profits for corporations in the war machine. really nothing but upside. but dissident groups, civil rights activist, represent a lot of downside and this is in journalists, most of all, who are relying on whistleblowers and real leaks to carry out their journalism. so when i mentioned how is the government going to respond to this kind of thing i'm thinking, how does the government respond to -- what sort of tools has it developed and deployed against the austin sybil enemies of the government and hausa going to deploy them against real enemies? amy: what about you and the cia? do much.'t people say, yeah, right.

i was there for barely three years and was mostly training will stop it was a super interesting experience. i am glad i had it. and it definitely informed everything i write about and hopefully, makes the sort of spy craft of counter surveillance, toveillance can also tradecraft and mentality of spies, that sort of thing, that i depict and my novels. hopefully, the experience i had with the cia makes that as realistic as possible, but i wish i could say on democracy now! that i was involved in numerous coups and assassinations. it would make for a really cool segment. alas, was mostly training. nermeen: you said you like sometimes it pays to cover up the commission of a serious crime by confessing to a lesser one. >> yes. this funny how often i see that sort of thing played out and national headlines. there are things they say at the cia that are set early in just,

but only partly. so another one is it is better to seek forgiveness than ask permission. i see the government doing this sort of thing constantly. yeah, so, some of these things -- another one is deny everything, it meant nothing, make counter accusations. you will see politicians doing all the time. view," whatd's eye is it? this is a fiction book? >> well, i've an 18 page bibliography at the end of the book because i want people to know if you don't follow these things closely, you might have the reaction was talking about earlier which is, read the book and say, that was a fun, entertaining thriller, but can the government really do these things? is it really doing these things? reviews have an gratifying for me because people do respond to

the book the way i would hope they would respond to fiction, edge of their seats. and then they say, can to the bibliography and realized, oh, my god, all of these things are real. i speculated a little bit about gods i would be deployed, but all of the technologies i describe in the book, and some will make your hair stand up, they are real. can you hack into a car? can you turn a microphone on, not just on a phone, but on all of these personal assistive devices that are getting deployed in people's homes? baby cameras, close circuit television. heart devices, pacemakers. these sorts of things. in my very first book which i started writing in 1993 was published in 2002, "a clean kill in tokyo," my assassin shorted out a guy's pacemaker wirelessly. at the time, there's no

bluetooth, i was using infrared but it was wireless. i checked with harvard cardiac pacemaker specialist by i lived with in college and said, could you do this? he said, i guess so, why would you want to? now they know i am a novelist. you can do this, so much so that dick cheney is memoirs acknowledged he had his heart dr. turn off the wireless feature on his pacemaker because of concerns that somebody might turn to turn it off -- try to turn it off. i wouldn't say terrorists, but probably a lot of people a one-time another considered raising the button on that. nermeen: i want to ask about something you said earlier that the government increasingly equate journalism with terrorism. how did you learn that? >> just by observing. i remember when david maranda heathrow, i at guess this was about two years ago will stop amy: glenn greenwald's partner.

>> right. i wondered, why is the government doing this? it's not like yes the only copy of whatever it is they're looking for, so why do something like that? arealized, this is basically deny and disrupt operation. why does the government want terrorists to know it is into their cell phones, that it can track you by your cell phone use and probably put in a drone strike based on that information? we know that goes on, whether it is a so-called signature struck with a donor your identity or where they do. why do they do that? is it to make terrorists unable to communicate? it is to make it more difficult for them to communicate, to make plotting whatever their china plot slower and harder and -- trying to plot slower and harder. i thought, why detained this guy? amy: under the terrorism act. >> thank you.

in cooperation with the american government. so they're not going to stop journalists from communicating by this, but it is a kind of signal. they know for the most sensitive things that journalists are working on, journalists don't trust their cell phones and using human couriers. you let them know even human couriers are not going to be safe for you. deny and disrupt. amy: i want to ask a question our colleague jeremy scahill asked you last night in a q&a you had here in new york. it is about something the clinton campaign is trying to make a big deal, something bernie sanders said decades ago, calling the cia a dangerous institution that has got to go. he said this in 1974. now he is not saying that today. these days. he talks about more oversight for the agency. person in covert operations at the cia, do you share his view more, the one he expresses today, more oversight,

or the one he expressed 40 years ago, do away with the cia? >> i would say, first, people need to understand standards is not an outlier in calling for the abolishment of the cia. president truman said he would get rid of the agency, john f. kennedy famously said he would shatter the organization -- shatter the organization to a thousand pieces and scattered to the wind. daniel moynihan said, we're not getting our moneys worth, this is doing more hard than good. there a lot of prominent people who have been in the position to weigh the costs and benefits of the cia's existence and have come out thinking that unbalanced national security would be improved if we just did not have the cia. that is a perfectly defensible and respectable position. that is one thing. the other thing is, look, at a minimum if i were advising centers today i would say, you have got to to touch the covert action arm from the intelligence gathering and analysis arm.

these are two things that inherently don't function well together. just as the nsa is tasked on the one hand destroying encryption and on the other hand is another part of the organization that i tasked ostensibly with improving encryption, it is like putting a humidifier and a dehumidifier in the room and sang to battle it out. you're not going to get good results. the covert military arm of the agency really should be put in the military, should not be in a position to interfere with the objectivity of intelligence analysis that our policymakers rely on. amy: barry eisler, i would like you to stay afterwards to continue this conversation. he is a new york times best selling author and former cia agent, author of "the god's eye , view." we will continue the conversation and post it on democracynow.org. when we come back, we're going to talk to ag analyst who is just -- talk to a journalist who was detained in bahrain.

this is her first interview since. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: we end today's show with an exclusive interview with one of four u.s. journalists who were detained in the gulf state of bahrain, and released sunday after an international outcry. anna therese day and her camera crew were in bahrain during protests marking the anniversary of the kingdom's february 2011 uprising. bahraini authorities accused the group of falsely representing themselves as tourists, and claimed one of them participated in an attack on police.

they were taken into custody and charged with illegal assembly with the intent to commit a crime. during their interrogation, they were initially denied an attorney and prevented from speaking with family members. amy: human rights first said the arrest of the journalists is part of a continuing crackdown on dissent in bahrain. this comes as the group renews its call for the release of bahraini opposition leader ibrahim sharif, who was sentenced to a year in jail wednesday for a 2015 speech in which he called for change. the bahraini government has fought to suppress opposition protesters and journalists since the uprising in 2011 that was crushed by martial law and u.s.-backed forces from saudi arabia. bahrain is a close ally of the united states, and is home to the navy's fifth fleet, which is responsible for all naval forces in the gulf. well, we are glad to be joined by anna therese day, one of the journalists just released from detention in bahrain. it is great to have you with us. talk about when you went to

bahrain and what happened. >> we went for the five-year anniversary of the uprising, which was february 14. one thing that is interesting about bahrain, while it is often overlooked, it had one of the highest percentages of its population that participated in the arab spring uprising. we were excited to get back there. i reported there in 2011. we wanted to follow-up on the reports of human rights violations continuing. again, human rights violations they continue right next to america -- one of america's most important military presence in the world. amy: what happened? >> we entered on tourist visas. amy: white tourist visas? >> we were entering undercover. we knew we would be meeting primarily with figures that face enormous threats inside the country and we made that decision to liberally, understanding the potential consequences and we decided that we absolutely felt the story was worth the risk. we entered on tourist abuses

undercover, met with opposition and activists and protesters. you can drive down the highway in bahrain and it seems like a glistening gulf kingdom. if you look off the highway comic as the clouds of black smoke in these neighborhoods that have been court owned all. stephen into the neighborhoods, the trouble entering them the first few days because they been totally sealed off from the main highways. to enter the neighborhoods, you have to climb over barbed wire and concrete barriers.

the residents have enormous trouble getting in and out. inside because there been so many midnight raids on these people's neighborhoods and communities, young people have started putting up their own barricades to prevent the police from continuing these midnight roundups. amy: what exactly happened to you? >> we were inside reporting and one of our sound engineers was up with one of our camera ops. fled, theprotesters police were able to grab our sound engineer. then we immediately called them. we said, is at a police station now, we have his passport and we're worried about that, but this neighborhood was a little war zone. it was totally sealed off. if we walked over to the police station, we would be arrested as well. the embassy said they would intervene. they also advised us to stay the

neighborhood for the night because they are very well aware of the crackdown on these neighborhoods and that we would -- that they're essentially is an occupation. we were planning on staying inside. we continued to do some reporting. went on,as the evening we were concerned about our colleague. we were concerned about the material and the safety of people we had shot will stop protestersstarted -- started taking pictures of us and tweeting because they were so excited that foreign journalists and we realized that could endanger the people we were staying with inside, so we wanted to leave so the nighttime raids on these tablets would not turn into an aggressive search for the foreign journalists. nermeen: u.n. five years after the protests began. what did you learn from the people you're able to speak to in those three days? you said bahrain for the largest proportion of the population participating in the protests. what happened in the intervening five years? >> the government has succeeded in creating an oppressive

culture of fear. the protesters them although they are not able to make it to the main thoroughfares, there are still protesting in their neighborhoods. just to describe the scene a little better for you guys come on the 14th the police occupy the neighborhood so aggressively that the people could not even fully congregate. the whole day was spent people trying to come to mosques and main areas where they could congregate and the police busting through these areas, arresting people, rounding people up. the rooftops of these tablets were filled with family members of grandmothers, grandfathers, parents shouting from the rooftops. the police are coming from that way, shouting directions down to the young people trying to protest. another important thing we noticed was the protesters would run from the police, they were brought into strangers homes. we were brought into other people's homes -- grandmothers were giving us water and trying

to feed us. it really felt like a neighborhood effort to continue to resist this police occupation. amy: how long re-held for? >> 48 hours. amy: how did you get out? >> embassy intervention. we were prevented from calling our embassy repeatedly. we were isolated. amy: interrogated? >> yes. amy: we will do part two and post it on democracynow.org. anna therese day for independent journalist who has lived in reported in the middle east for five years, focusing on how u.s. foreign policy affects young people in the region. she was just recently detained by the bahraini government with her camera crew and we will continue the conversation at democracynow.org. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

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