we're. well, talk about what now after president trump announced he's ending the stimulus relief talks and efforts to put money into people's hands. he's going to put that off until after the election, he says. we'll talk about r r r r r r violate crime. let's begin with dr. george rutherford. good to see you again. >> afternoon. >> hope you've been well. i want to start with the

president's treatment and recovery at the white house. his doctor said he has had no symptoms since returning to the white house from walter reed. is that reassuring? >> yes, it's reassuring. you say he's about day six of his symptoms -- symptoms start last thursday -- day sevenish is when people continue to get well or get very bad very quickly. so we have today, tomorrow, those are all kind of moments of truth. so things are going well. they're going well. that's good news. >> and is there usually with these patients, covid patients just one cycle or are there multiple cycles, multiple ups and downs? >> there are a lot of ups and downs in any clinical illness but this precipitous crash that goes on around day seven historically has gone up.

most people do pretty well for a while and then get much worse. most people get much worse. do well for a while and then get much worse. >> these days are critical. i want to get your assessment. everybody on social media had opinions on how the president seemed when he stood on the steps of the white house after taking off his mask. how did he look to you? we have the video pulled up. here he is walking out to the balcony. he removes his mask. a lot was said about his boirksd his muscular usage, the way he seemed to be breathing, did it look normal or did it look labored? did you notice anything? >> he looked like he was short of breath to me, and somewhat short of breathing. you can take anyone, have them in the hospital for three days and as they walk up stairs that high, you'd be huffing and puffing to get to the top.

it was labored breathing. >> do you consider that reflective of anything, possible lung damage or can't tell from that? >> it's part of the recovery process. it could be ongoing and getting worse or it could be getting gradually b. fit gets worse it's going to get precipitously worse. it gets better, it will gradually get better. as a 74-year-old, you don't snap back from things like this. >> it's been reported that he wanted to go to the oval office today. >> already been on oxygen and decks zmoechblt i'd recommend he be in the hospital. but i think he needs to be -- i think he needs to be in a place where he's not going to be ex pending excess amounts of energy

and you have all this infection control problem as well. don't want to have to have large parts of the white house contaminated every time he uses it. you want to contain that as well. >> especially with about 30 cases at this point and count people in his oar wit. the white house has decided not to trace the contacts of people who were at that rose garden nomination of judge amy coney barrett. i think that was september 26th. we know eight people who were there already have tested positive. you're the architecturearchitech you never know. there could be another whole chain of transmission that you've missed. somebody had it who came in the door. right, and transmitted it. if that's, in fact, the event. that person may easily have

transmitted it to other people outthe rose garden. imagine, fringes, if it were one, if it were another elected official in the congress or something, there are important things to know here. the thought that it's sort of supposition that it's a random person who went home and stayed home and didn't transmit to anyone else, which is what kind of underlies this, i don't think is particularly the correct way to approach it. >> i want to ask you soblt breaking news. the administration just agreed to the guidelines for investigate covid vaccine what does that mean for the time line and for the public's confidence? >> it should push the public's confidence up by quite bit. my understanding of what was proposed by fda was that they would not approve any new

vaccine that had -- where the last person to receive in it the trials had not been followed for a full 60 days. that seems to be quite prudent, and it boosts my confidence that we're not going to discover major side effects going forward. side effects are rare and these trials, even with 30,000 people in them, aren't big enough to find rare side effects. >> is 60 days the standard, the norm, or is that even expedited? >> it's -- i don't -- it's a new rule, if that's what you're asking. >> yes. >> people aren't in a rush to move these forward. imagine if you're a vaccine company, it's all liability, liability, like to v liability, liability. >> the president tweeted that covid-19 is far less looet hahl than the flu in most

populations. i'm sure you saw that. is that accurate? >> unfortunately, it's not. this is substantially more lethal. we may -- in a real bad influenza year we have tons of thousands of deaths from flu. with this disease it's more than 200,000 in six months. this is more lethal and it's something we need to take very, very seriously. >> ok. i want to ask some viewer questions that they're posing on instagram. "is the white house officially required to report positive covid cases"? do you know? >> yes, they do. to whom they report them, i'm not sure. i assume they would report them to the cdc, at least the washington health department. there's no executive branch exemption. >> here's another question from

a viewer. what helps your immunity? if you haven't gotten it yet, is there anything you can do to help your immunity? what helps your immunity is not to get it, ok. that's a-number one on the list. that means wearing masks, socially distancing yourself from others and be careful when you go into indoor environments. the other thing that i would say is that the way you boost your immunity is gets vaccinated the first opportunities you have. >> what about -- >> aside from that, not really. sorry. >> all right. no. that's quite ok. my next question has to do with the video back at the white house. he said i may be immune now i don't know. what do we know so far about if you get it once and you recover, are you immune? >> it would seem that -- well, there is probably a little fast for him to develop the kinds of

antibodies that we want people to develop called neutralizing antibodies. we have some interesting observation around neutralizing antibodies. there was a big commercial fishing vessel in seattle that went to sea that had an outbreak of covid on it. they tested people before they went to sea. all three people who had neutralizing antibody beforehand, none of them got sick. something like 104 of the other 1917 did. the that was a statistically significant difference. they the end to be protected in situations like that. hounks they roy ne. a typical natural required antibody response will lame after three or four months. whether it will come back if you're reexposed, the answer is probably in most people but we really don't know.

there are clear cases of reinfection. somebody getting infected a second time those are usually -- usually of the five. they've been somewhere between three and five months after your initial infection. >> all right. so perhaps not a free pass for life. we have about 30 seconds. i want to get a report card for the bay area right now, a snapshot of how we're doing here containing covid in the bay area. >> i think we're doing -- you know, obviously, everything could be better but i think we're doing quite well. we have -- we're sort of right tier right now. we'll have to see. but so far, so good. >> that is reassuring. thank you so much. always great flerng you.

take good care. >> my pleasure. >> when we come back we'll talk about the stimulus relief bill that's just been put on hold by the president. we ...this one's for you. you inspired us to make your

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in this election year you've heard a lot about an violent crimes. but san francisco is seeing a drop in violent crime. thank you so much for joining us. >> thanks for having me. >> professor abrams you've been

tracking crime trends this year. what are the key findings nationwide? with j we . >> well, when the pandemic hit in march and april, it had a big effect on crime, we saw a tremendous drop in all kinds of crimes, about 20% violet crimes. at that time homicides and shootings didn't drop like the other types of crime but they were pretty neutral. there were a couple other exceptions that went up, actually, so commercial burglaries rose when the pandemic hit as people started spending all their time another home and simultaneously home burglaries dropped because homes became less attractive targets as well. auto theft increased in a lot of

cities as people weren't driving in to work as much and were leaving their cars on the street for longer periods of time although that varied from city to city. jai want to focus in more specifically on violent crimes. the president and some republicans blended squarely on protest or a pullback of police. are those contributing factors are do democrats point to other things, poverty or perhaps less social service available? let's not try to be partisan. that's hour goal. but what are the factors? >> right. trying to figure out these days. i come at it from an economic standpoint. that's what my training is. i think we should be as nonpartisan as possible on these issues and just try to get the facts straight. so i mentioned most crimes dropped with the pandemic but

homicides and shootings stayed flat. as the summer began, they're rising substantially. they're still way up above averages for the last few years. you're asking why. >> yeah. >> everyone's trying to figure out ychwhy. there are a lot of theories. i don't think any of them is proven yet. the difficulty in proven the theories is explaining why homicides and shootings are up so much while the other crimes even over the summer are still down. >> right. >> ok. so that's the challenge. let nell you some theories and why i'm not convinced by any of them yet. one is that it's linked to protests, responding to the floild killing at the end of may. and again, the timing doesn't work quite right but it's pretty fairly close in time for those. it would have to explain why we don't see a rise in other types

of crime. we saw a spike in burglaries, looting right after those protests but not other types of crime, other types of violent crimes. the other thing related to that has to do with police response to those protests and to the social unrest that we saw over the summer. there's definitely changes in policing in a number of cities in the spring as a pandemic hit and some less serious crimes were deemphasized. there was also change in policing in june when this was going on as well. so it's possible that has something in it that i'll tell you my leading theory at this point is that the people involved with homicides and shootings are i think less likely to be deterred by stay at home orders, by risk of

coronavirus, if you're potentially shooting or potentially a target of someone with a fire arm, those are going to be more concerning to you than the risk of catching the disease. and my best guess is changes in policing, changes in the number of people on the street, change the incentives for these people and made it more likely that they were going to go out and be willing to risk kind of committing or -- committing these types of crime in public. >> we only have about 30 seconds but i've got to show graphics for san francisco we kind of buck the trend. here, we're seeing a decrease in both violent crime and other types of crimes. would you tell us if you think it's our policies in san francisco or what other factors might be driving this? >> san francisco, you know, i was actually due to fly out

there days before everything got canceled, days after everything got canceled. so it was -- one thing that was unusual it was one of the first cities to be hit and react. but i'm not sure whether it's the early reaction. i think the precautions taken in san francisco probably shifted it especially early on in the pandemic. i don't know if that applies still in the summer, whether the local responses are going to be responsible for that difference. >> well, since we're theorizing a little bit professor abrams, i'm going to venture that we're good people here in the city of san francisco and we welcome you to make a visit when you're able to do so and it's safe to do so. so thank you very much for giving us some of your insight into the pandemic and crime. take care. >> thanks. >> we're going to take a short break. jackie

big story developing. this afternoon the president called off talks on a pandemic package. one thread is asking for $2.4 trillion to bail off poorly run high crime democrat states, money that's in no way related to covid-19. we made an offer of $6 trillion and she's not dealing in good faith. i'm look to the future of our country. i've instructed my people to stop negotiating. immediately after i win we'll pass a major stimulus bill that focuses on hard working americans and small billings. jackie spear's district includes part of san francisco county. representative, thanks for joining us today. >> great to be with you. >> the gop and democrats have been negotiating for months for a new package to put money in americans' hands amid the pandemic. is it truly over now?

>> i do think it is over now. i think that the president has become more delusional, frankly, if he thinks that a stimulus package after november 3rd is going to be any better than the stimulus package. this was providing economic stimulus to every american. extension of the $600 per week for those who are unemployed. new ppp program for small businesses, money for schools, for testing, money for states and local governments who have been the hands-on persons who have been implementing all of these various strategies to try and protect americans. so it is -- it was a comprehensive package. you had jerome powell, the head of the fed saying today unless you do something that provides

real stimulus, we're going to have a covid problem in terms of the economy for the foreseeable future. >> well, we saw after this announcement was made, the dow, the markets took a dive, and that is the reaction. but the president says he wants the senate republicans to really focus on the confirmation hearings for his supreme court nominee, amy coney barrett, and you and other house democratic women actually took action to make your feelings known this past weekend. tell me about that. >> so we walked a letter over to the majority leader's office, which was locked, by the way, and they were shut down for the day and in that letter, underscored why the senate should wait until after the election, the american people have a right to have a say in who's the next supreme court justice is. it's little troubling to note that the last three supreme

court justices have -- or three of the last supreme court justices have been selected by presidents who did not win the popular vote. so you have the last two, both justice kavanagh and gorsuch and when president bush was in office, so if, in fact, they are supposed to be representative of the american people and their interests, that is not the case. it continues to be a lifetime appointment. i think we need to look at the office of supreme court justice differently moving forward. it's become a political body and that is very regrettable. >> well, i mean there's been talks of stomach amendments. it also hinges on what happens the next few weeks. we'll see. but i want to ask you this. going back to the president endsing the stimulus talks, many analysts believe that passing such a bill could potentially be

beneficial for both parties, if you will, a bipartisan effort there. is there any insight into the president's motivation to take that action today, i guess? i know house speaker pelosi held a call with house democrats. what are your insight and what do you see? what are your thoughts on that? >> it's important to point out that the president of the united states has not talked to the third highest ranking person in government, nancy pelosi, since last october. they have not had a conversation. it has been secretary mnuchin who's been doing the negotiations and was successful in early march and april in getting the first cares packages passed. i think the president has become so fixated on becoming a leader, which to him translates into an autocrat that he thinks that he can just shut things down. it would absolutely benefit him.

it would absolutely benefit the democrats. it would benefit the american people and that's what we're here supposed to be doing. to focus on the supreme court justice, when you have so many americans who are unemployed, so many americans who are having trouble putting food on the table and keeping a roof over their heads, it is absolutely malfeasance of office not to be negotiating in good faith in a package that will benefit so many americans. >> all right. representative jackie spear, a large task ahead but thank you for taking a the time to chat with us today we made usaa insurance for this season. and the veterans that never quit on their team. when being a fan gets tough, and stretching your budget gets even tougher... ...our agents put in the time and legwork for you, ...so saving on auto insurance is easy. because saving a little extra goes a long way.

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thank you for joining us on today's interactive show getting tonight, breaking news as we come on the air. the outbreak at the white house widening tonight. and now the coronavirus reaching the pentagon. the joint chiefs of staff, america's top military leaders, all but one now in quarantine after being exposed to the virus. a coast guard admiral was infected. he recently attended a white house event. also tonight, abc news now confirming a military aide responsible for carrying the so-called nuclear football has tested positive. a presidential valet testing positive, too. more than 20 connected to the president and the white house now testing positive. and the surreal images inside the press briefing room. workers cleaning in full hazmat gear. president trump at the white house, recovering. his doctors giving very little information. and tonight, the president tweeting, no stimulus, no